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Can Facebook Keep Large-Scale Misinformation From the Free World? (sfgate.com)

You can have a disaster-free Election Day in the social media age, writes New York Times columnist Kevin Roose, "but it turns out that it takes constant vigilance from law enforcement agencies, academic researchers and digital security experts for months on end." It takes an ad hoc "war room" at Facebook headquarters with dozens of staff members working round-the-clock shifts. It takes hordes of journalists and fact checkers willing to police the service for false news stories and hoaxes so that they can be contained before spreading to millions. And even if you avoid major problems from bad actors domestically, you might still need to disclose, as Facebook did late Tuesday night, that you kicked off yet another group of what appeared to be Kremlin-linked trolls...

Most days, digging up large-scale misinformation on Facebook was as easy as finding baby photos or birthday greetings... Facebook was generally responsive to these problems after they were publicly called out. But its scale means that even people who work there are often in the dark... Other days, combing through Facebook falsehoods has felt like watching a nation poison itself in slow motion. A recent study by the Oxford Internet Institute, a department at the University of Oxford, found that 25 percent of all election-related content shared on Facebook and Twitter during the midterm election season could be classified as "junk news"...

Facebook has framed its struggle as an "arms race" between itself and the bad actors trying to exploit its services. But that mischaracterizes the nature of the problem. This is not two sovereign countries locked in battle, or an intelligence agency trying to stop a nefarious foreign plot. This is a rich and successful corporation that built a giant machine to convert attention into advertising revenue, made billions of dollars by letting that machine run with limited oversight, and is now frantically trying to clean up the mess that has resulted... It's worth asking, over the long term, why a single American company is in the position of protecting free and fair elections all over the world.

Despite whatever progress has been made, the article complains that "It took sustained pressure from lawmakers, regulators, researchers, journalists, employees, investors and users to force the company to pay more attention to misinformation and threats of election interference. Facebook has shown, time and again, that it behaves responsibly only when placed under a well-lit microscope.

"So as our collective attention fades from the midterms, it seems certain that outsiders will need to continue to hold the company accountable, and push it to do more to safeguard its users -- in every country, during every election season -- from a flood of lies and manipulation."

34 of 189 comments (clear)

  1. Thin end of the wedge by vakuona · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Once we appoint Facebook as gatekeeper of truth, a "Ministry of Truth" as it were, who gets to ensure that that Facebook determines the truth correctly and in a non-partisan way, and doesn't inadvertently or otherwise misinform its users from a position of privilege.

    1. Re:Thin end of the wedge by jd · · Score: 4, Interesting

      That's simple. The fundamental rule has always been that facts are universal, opinion is personal. Virtually every respectable media outlet has a version of that doctrine.

      You can say what you like, think what you like, feel what you like, but you can choose only these. You cannot choose a different set of facts.

      No, that doesn't stop you writing fantasy or fiction. As the late, great Terry Nation once said, if on your world rocks can talk, then that is fact. On that world, rocks talk.

      It does not stop caricatures. Britain has incredibly strong libel laws, but TW3, Spitting Image and HIGNFY are not just applauded by those they put down, the famous and powerful were/are integral to them.

      All it stops is malicious, twisted Misty Mountains nastiness. Gollum! That doesn't take a Ministry of Truth, any Bagginses will do.

      --
      It's a small world and it smells funny; I'd buy another if it wasn't for the money; Take back what I paid (SoM)
    2. Re:Thin end of the wedge by stevew · · Score: 3, Interesting

      Not my experience through this last election cycle. Just saw a friend who was black-listed from posting because she chose to forward something from a "Secretary of State for CA" FB page. I read the post at it's source - NOTHING there that was either controversial or even partisan (and Partisan SHOULD BE OKAY!) Thought Police are ALREADY HERE!

      --
      Have you compiled your kernel today??
    3. Re:Thin end of the wedge by religionofpeas · · Score: 2

      The fundamental rule has always been that facts are universal, opinion is personal.

      Great start. Now how do we figure out whether something posted as fact was truthful ?

    4. Re: Thin end of the wedge by jd · · Score: 2

      You imagine they're policed because they don't say what you want them to say. Sure, go ahead, create your own social network. Won't make the inaccurate any more honest. Won't help break down barriers. But if that's what you want to do, go for it.

      --
      It's a small world and it smells funny; I'd buy another if it wasn't for the money; Take back what I paid (SoM)
    5. Re: Thin end of the wedge by jd · · Score: 4, Informative

      The BBC was interviewing this interesting guy, Dr David Kelly, who said there weren't. The Guardian was running articles on CIA attempted coups launched via the weapons inspector teams. The Independent was skeptical of the claims, as weapons inspectors had found nothing and President Bush was making shrill claims he couldn't back.

      Most of the media covered the Plame affair, with clear and open coverage of the fact that no yellowcake had been bought or shipped to Iraq.

      I'd say most of the free media were very, very doubtful of the claims.

      --
      It's a small world and it smells funny; I'd buy another if it wasn't for the money; Take back what I paid (SoM)
    6. Re:Thin end of the wedge by jedidiah · · Score: 2

      > That's simple. The fundamental rule has always been that facts are universal, opinion is personal. Virtually every respectable media outlet has a version of that doctrine.

      You are living in a fantasy land there bub.

      The media tells blatant lies about easily verifiable facts. They also mislead by hiding information that interferes with their "narrative" while promoting information that supports their narrative.

      If you've ever had personal knowledge of an event or any technical subject, then you have inevitably seen this.

      It's also pretty easy to fact check the media against different sources. Sometimes you can even fact check an outlet against itself sometimes even in the same article.

      The real problem isn't "misinformation". The real problem is that the cat has been let out of the bag and far to many have had their "red pill" moment already.

      There's no going back really.

      --
      A Pirate and a Puritan look the same on a balance sheet.
  2. Pathetic by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Insightful

    So fucking pathetic. This shit is as old as communicat. Dis/info is nothing, people should exert effort to understand what is going on. Otherwise we trade one propaganda for another.

    The modern world is toddler level. Not by our choice but by corps and the loudest screechers?

    1. Re:Pathetic by Anne+Thwacks · · Score: 2
      You seem to forget:
      • Half of all people are of below average intelligence - that is the half that are on Facepalm
      • Americans have the right to tell lies, and feel obliged to do so when ever the opportunity arises
      --
      Sent from my ASR33 using ASCII
    2. Re: Pathetic by iggymanz · · Score: 2

      If you are seeking truth on social media your IQ doesn't matter and you are functionally a moron

    3. Re: Pathetic by jd · · Score: 2

      I dunno, Genevieve von Petzinger has a very nice channel on mesolithic rock art.

      --
      It's a small world and it smells funny; I'd buy another if it wasn't for the money; Take back what I paid (SoM)
    4. Re:Pathetic by knorthern+knight · · Score: 2

      > Half of all people are of below average intelligence

      And 90% seem to be ignorant of the difference between median and mean (average).

      --

      I'm not repeating myself
      I'm an X window user; I'm an ex-Windows user
  3. Information Overload by mentil · · Score: 2

    Misinformation is everywhere. It's easy to misremember something, and then a few hops away it turns into something quite different from the original idea. And that's the most innocuous instance. Charlatans preaching bullshit, or easily-disproven nonsense, get far more traction than I'd think possible. E.g. young-earth creationism.
    Too many ideas and claims are thrown at people all day every day for someone to fact-check every single one. It's known that repetition leads to belief, so someone might forget if they researched something that they believe, or if they just heard it from a few sources a few times. The Internet is a great source of second-hand information but there are tons of people who only know how to click links and don't know how to e.g. search wikipedia for an article on a certain topic.

    --
    Corruption is convincing someone that the selfless ideal is the same as their selfish ideal.
  4. Betteridge again by klingens · · Score: 2, Insightful

    As always, the answer is "HELL FSCKING NO!"

    The US not only spends about ten times more on weapons than anyone else, leads a magnitude more of wars than anyone else, the US also has the biggest public relations aka propaganda budget with a similar leading number. No one spends as much money as the US on ads, both the private sector and the public.

    The US government has the biggest spin machine by far world wide, that goes both for public and private, no distinction The US produces more lies, more propaganda, more spin than any other country in the world.

    So why would one the US' biggest ad companies like facebook filter these lies^Wads they make their livelihood with?

    Oh, you mean filter the doubleplusungood information that the mainstream narrative doesn't like? Yes those they can will filter with the best AI money can buy.
    However, since AI is actually no AI but pretty much shit, there will still be many unwelcome single postings going through through the cracks, similar like spammers get through mailfilters. This ensures a constant low intensity craze that every politician can point to when they don't like a particular result. "We didn't lose cause our program was bad and the candidate behaved worse than Darth Vader, no, those evilmongers over there are to blame and no one else. Kill them!"

    Which is why a half a million dollar media campaign from a troll company who wanted to produce account followers, supposedly has derailed an election where the candidates alone spend directly more than two billion dollars, and the wider public spent more like 20 billions. Including untold millions from foreign, mostly allied, countries.
    Those are probably the half million dollars with the most impact in all of human history.

  5. It's all "social media", not only facebook by fbobraga · · Score: 4, Interesting

    Here, on Brazil elections, the main "guilty" was WhatsApp... Twitter helped too, besides facebook

  6. Only Democrat/Progressive Misinformation Allowed by Jarwulf · · Score: 3, Insightful

    No more of that cheap Ruskie misinformation and FAKE NEWS. Only 100% pure cornfed American misinformation err I mean TruthTM allowed. As determined by a cartel of self appointed completely unbiased neutral Bay Area Silicon Valley megacorporations and East Coast far left media conglomerates. Not only will they control everything you see they will also control everything you can say and do by threatening to cut you off from their increasingly mandatory monopoly for any reason they feel like. But don't worry, the government is not involved. officially so you have no right to complain according to liberals....Ahhh America...land of the Free...

  7. Re:Of course they can - here's how: by fbobraga · · Score: 3, Insightful

    1. Shut the company down.

    ... and other popular social media platform will rise. I think only a heavy liability for this companies, by helping the spread of "fake news", can solve this question: attack their wallets, so their will inhibit this practices :P

  8. Simple, clearly label all advertising as adverts a by wiretrip · · Score: 2

    It is the only way their current business model will survive.

  9. It's called censorship by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Interesting

    What next, someone censoring which books get publshed? There is a fine line between "misinformation" and information which makes some people uncomfortable. Facebook should stay out of the censorship business. One person's "minsinformation" is another person's truth.

    1. Re:It's called censorship by mangastudent · · Score: 2

      What next, someone censoring which books get publshed?

      That's the sort of thing Citizens United was all about. In that case, a movie was suppressed, and Obama's Deputy Solicitor General argued that it extended to books under McCain-Feingold, the 2002 "Bipartisan Campaign Reform Act" where politicians agreed no one should be able to say nasty things about them.

      The scary thing: this blatant Federal suppression, "Congress shall make no law", of core political speech was blocked by only 5 Supreme Court justices, our right to gather together to influence the political process hangs by a thread.

      And in the new on-line public square, it's rapidly disappearing. Cue the "It's not censorship when private companies do it!" lolbertarians or those posing as them.

  10. Can Facebook Keep Misinformation From the World? by anonieuweling · · Score: 2, Insightful

    Fakebook's purpose is to censor all it can.
    This means that what remains after censorship is propaganda.

  11. You mean other than what they spread ? by Crashmarik · · Score: 2

    I have as yet to see any of the mainstream media take any kind of action to remedy deliberate misinformation or lack of reporting on their part

    Remember when Chris Cuomo Told The World It Was Illegal To Read Wikileaks
    https://www.realclearpolitics....

    Or just how much coverage have they given to the screw job the DNC gave the Sanders campaign.

    Or the latest we find out James Comey who lead the FBI investigation into Hillary's email was using GMail to handle classified documents. Many of which still can't be published in anything close to a readable state due to the need to redact.

  12. who's responsible? by chittychitty!! · · Score: 2

    Does Facebook have the responsibility of ensuring we are only exposed to "real" news? No. You can blame them for providing tools that make it easier to spread fake news, but that's what printing presses were a few hundred years ago. No, it is YOUR responsibility to think critically about the things you read (and share). The big problem really is that the schools have not been able to teach enough of you to do so.

    1. Re:who's responsible? by lenski · · Score: 2

      My responsibility is to choose between attending to or to discounting "information" provided by a given source, based on a reasonable estimation of credibility of that source. That would be true for friends on Facebook, news organizations, or propaganda outlets supported by nation-states or non-state assholes.

      Facebook's responsibility is to ensure that I have that sourcing information. I believe that in some cases organizations (like Facebook, Twitter, etc.) have access to credible knowledge that particular sources have a near-perfect record of waging information warfare, and lose the privilege of access to the ears and eyes of readers until they straighten up. The assholes spreading disinformation and propaganda are well-funded and consistently successful in lying about who they are or w.hose interests they represent.

      Anyone advocating for a process that prevents people from knowing the source of information supports the lying and misinformation business.

      It is theoretically and practically impossible to teach the magical ability for someone to determine the interests of sources when the source's identities and interests are hidden.

  13. Re: Only Democrat/Progressive Misinformation Allow by Jarwulf · · Score: 2

    If SSM cakes are a fundamental human right that must be provided by every cake shop in America than I think its reasonable to require a huge global monopoly to provide an increasingly mandatory communications platform when they were funded and helped in large part by billions in public money and infrastructure. I also assume you are for net neutrality which in this case its exactly the same thing except the communications platform monopoly is simply the second gatekeeper to the internet instead of the first.

  14. It's All About The Bottom Line by ytene · · Score: 3, Insightful

    This is all about profit, plain and simple.

    There are numerous steps that Facebook could take that would allow them to positively identify every single registered user. This would reduce the potential for fake content, because anyone found to be posting the same would be identifiable, would lose their accounts and would not be able to re-activate them.

    The problem is that not only might this discourage people from creating an account, but it would also introduce an operational cost for Facebook themselves, since they would have to pay people to review such content and make decisions about revoking access.

    But it is possible, all of it.

    In fact, this is an excellent example of the reason that there needs to be a tighter form of regulation around companies like Facebook, because - as this example clearly shows - unless there is a legal obligation for Facebook to do something, they won't - because it will dent their profits. Going even further, strengthening the requirement for Facebook (and similar organisations) to establish the identity of users doesn't really have a material impact on the free speech of those users. Facebook wouldn't be telling those people what to write or not write. Instead, they would be making their users accountable for their actions.

    Which, on reflection, seems entirely reasonable.

    No, I don't have a Facebook account. Never have. Never will.

  15. Re: Of course they can - here's how: by iggymanz · · Score: 2, Insightful

    That is not the problem. People who form their opinions and beliefs from social media are the problem. That form of stupidity is on the rise.

  16. You hate news you don't like by jd · · Score: 2

    Join the club, but don't blame a free press for it and don't blame sides selectively. Blame all who are guilty or none.

    You say votes are being found days after, in South Carolina they found hundreds stuffed behind office furniture in Republican administrative buildings, plus a box found behind a fire escape, in 2000. Curiously, you only go for the side you don't like.

    Sure, you'll get the sympathy of those on your side. You're a tribe and tribes don't give a shit about facts. The left have done the same in the past, maybe they're doing it now. Curiously, I have no sympathy for the one-sided being on the wrong side. I reject lawbreaking by any side, but I've no sympathy for thieves who get broken into. Be fair, be honest or be abused by someone. If karma's a birch, if you reap what you sow, that's your issue. Not mine.

    And, yes, truth is facts. Indeed, the only truth is facts. Everything else is subjective opinion.

    --
    It's a small world and it smells funny; I'd buy another if it wasn't for the money; Take back what I paid (SoM)
  17. Re:Marshall McLuhan by jd · · Score: 2

    I would have to disagree.

    Education, real education, increases ability, freedom and resilience against the effects of age and cynicism.

    Entertainment does none of that.

    Education rewires the brain, entertainment exploits it.

    Education can be found anywhere, but particularly in the novel situation. Entertainment can only be found in the familiar.

    Real education is rare. Entertainment is common.

    --
    It's a small world and it smells funny; I'd buy another if it wasn't for the money; Take back what I paid (SoM)
  18. Perennial Question by sycodon · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Who decides what is fake and what is their agenda?

    --
    When Fascism comes to America, it will call itself Anti-Fascism, and tell you to give up your guns.
  19. Re:Can Facebook Keep Misinformation From the World by AmiMoJo · · Score: 2, Insightful

    Worrying that nonsense like this gets modded "+5 insightful".

    A recent documentary on Channel 4 showed that Facebook is very reluctant to censor anything, often allowing really extreme material to remain up. That's because such material is profitable, and Facebook's main goal is to make money.

    The fake news and propaganda is making Facebook lose money because people don't want to go there and don't trust them any more. Plus Zuck got hauled in front of Congress which has bad optics, so they are doing something about it. Granted, it's mostly marketing.

    So the claim that their purpose is censorship is clearly, demonstrably bullshit. It's part of a conspiracy theory that maintains that all the real news is censored, and everything you see is fake and what the shadowy all powerful leftist censors want you to see.

    --
    const int one = 65536; (Silvermoon, Texture.cs)
    SJW, n: "Someone I don't like, and by the way I'm a fuckwit" - AC
  20. Re:Facts are facts, they don't change with the wea by Raenex · · Score: 3, Insightful

    Facts are immutable.

    There is no dispassionate dispenser of "facts". Facts can be reported out of context. Some facts can be omitted, while others amplified. What are considered "facts" one day can be found to be falsehoods the next. And facts can be spun together to paint a misleading or partisan narrative.

    If you think that facts favour the left, question why you're on the right.

    If you think "facts" favor the left, then question your own bias.

  21. Does it really matter? by ma1wrbu5tr · · Score: 2, Interesting

    Claiming that "misinformation" and "junk news" on social media has any widespread impact on how a majority of people vote is a red herring (and on HRC's very long list of "reasons" why she lost). Most of the people I know that vote in every election cycle don't even use social media. Old people vote much more frequently than young ones. This is an undeniable and time proven fact. Old people also use social media at almost unquantifiably small rates.

    --
    Why can't we go back to using jumpers to configure slot adapter cards? Why? I say!
  22. Re:And if they started filtering.. by jedidiah · · Score: 2

    > Conservative snowflakes would howl with protest that their "alternative facts" are being censored.

    If you don't howl with protest when ANYONE is censored then you have no business calling yourself a liberal.

    --
    A Pirate and a Puritan look the same on a balance sheet.