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Party Is Over For Dirt-Cheap Solar Panels, Says China Executive (reuters.com)
The president of a top-10 maker of solar panels said the global solar power industry is about to lose a major competitive windfall as prices of Chinese-made solar panels begin to recover after a collapse last year. "The party is definitely over," said Eric Luo, president of China's GCL System Integration Technology Co. Reuters reports: Solar panel prices tumbled around 30 percent last year after China, the world's largest producer, cut subsidies to shrink its bloated solar industry, pushing smaller manufacturers to the brink of collapse. To raise cash and stay afloat, manufacturers cleared inventory and diverted sales offshore, sending prices into a downward spiral - offering up a windfall for solar power generators and investors in solar farms.
Luo, speaking to Reuters at the World Economic Forum in the Swiss ski resort of Davos this week, said GCL's vertically integrated business model cushioned it from the downturn in prices as its solar farms benefited from cheaper panels. The pain will mostly be felt by smaller Chinese producers, which lack international supply chains, triggering industry consolidation or forcing them to close, he added. Luo said solar panel prices were already stabilizing and he expected them to rebound by 10 to 15 percent as the Chinese industry consolidates over the next year or two. Luo also said that China was getting to the point where the solar industry could operate without any form of subsidy. Northwest China, where the sun is more plentiful and land is less expensive, has already reached that point, he said.
Luo, speaking to Reuters at the World Economic Forum in the Swiss ski resort of Davos this week, said GCL's vertically integrated business model cushioned it from the downturn in prices as its solar farms benefited from cheaper panels. The pain will mostly be felt by smaller Chinese producers, which lack international supply chains, triggering industry consolidation or forcing them to close, he added. Luo said solar panel prices were already stabilizing and he expected them to rebound by 10 to 15 percent as the Chinese industry consolidates over the next year or two. Luo also said that China was getting to the point where the solar industry could operate without any form of subsidy. Northwest China, where the sun is more plentiful and land is less expensive, has already reached that point, he said.
And they generate anywhere with sunlight so that's not really a super big issue derp.
She actually talks about using direct solar heating to replace an immersion heater for heating a cup of water.
Yeah deer no worries, have your tea ready in a trice, let me just sight the Fresnel Lens on the sun and the water will be hot in a jiffy.
Then she complains nuclear doesn't have a sufficient energy profit and we should directly generate and employ motive power from intermittent sources. Yeah be real nice having a band saw directly powered by the wind or hooked up to a Stirling Engine in a concentrating collector.
The good news is there are now at least 23 companies making solar panels in the USA, and their prices are becoming more competitive. It'll get even better once the dumb trade war is over.
You are welcome on my lawn.
The sun is still free, and there are more companies making solar panels in the USA and Canada than ever. Some of their prices are competitive with China, too. One US company is about to open a big plant in Mexico.
Your vibe doesn't have to be harshed.
You are welcome on my lawn.
Good. More jobs for us then.
SJW: Someone who has run out of real oppression, and has to fake it.
Is the APK host file app thingy compatible with solar panels too?
I say this on behalf of several people when i say "huh?"
Indeed. I have lived my dreams in fields that I loved until I started working in them. I have done many jobs and I have always been miserable eventually. I just want to be left alone and get on with life, I hate this life we have no choice in being part of.
Tell that to the people running the machines in the mine in Kiruna.
This only had a major effect on big commercial users like solar farms. Residential customers will be buying panels from domestic or Japanese/Korean brands most likely, complete with long warranty periods.
const int one = 65536; (Silvermoon, Texture.cs)
SJW, n: "Someone I don't like, and by the way I'm a fuckwit" - AC
I modded you up on accident so am posting to undo mod
Corruption is convincing someone that the selfless ideal is the same as their selfish ideal.
Parabolic heliostat leading to a large thermal mass via waveguide with a mirrored hatch through which cup can be interposed into beam path. Direct heat when sunny, indirect via heat exchanger at other times. Also suitable for kinetic output with turbine (stirling a poor choice for high power).
Direct motive energy from wind to perform non time critical tasks. Flywheel in evacuated enclosure with magnetic bearings to extend availability.
Argument from incredulity rejected. Engineering knowledge and imagination impugned.
Next.
That's even funnier than the crazy woman.
you talk like the choice between renewable and non renewable is price.
I mean, sure, that might work just a little bit longer, but sooner or later perhaps people might wake up and realise that paying less FOR A BIT is probably not a great plan when things go completely to shit when you could have just paid a bit more from the start.
the problem with the world is in fact, everyone wants everything as cheap as possible. Its a flawed philosophy because it assumes resources are infinite.
Do yourselves a favour. Every time you think about buying "the cheaper" option, do a bit of research and work out why its cheaper. Maybe consider "total cost" as a better evaluation.
Yes, because we're running out of roofs and unused fields...
Ezekiel 23:20
Apparently they might actually be quite happy with solar in summer. It might allow them to do maintenance on any thermal generation equipment they have over there.
Ezekiel 23:20
But they *are* cheap and getting cheaper still. It's called "technological progress", and it happens to solar and wind generation equipment just like it happened to the efficiency and power-to-weight ratio of steam engines in the past, for example. These fluctuations mentioned in the article, which already happened in the past anyway, are irrelevant for the big picture.
Ezekiel 23:20
Solar for the patsies, coal for China. China is building as much coal generating capacity as US has in its entirety ... the few PV projects are only value signalling.
Without subsidy levelized cost for solar has to be cheaper than fuel cost for coal plants they have any way. That's less than a $0.01 per kWh, solar is getting close but it's still at least a decade off barring some technological leap AFAICS.
I didn't mod either of you because I ran out of mod points so I couldn't waste a mod point commenting to unmod a mod. mod.
She claims EROEI on PV is 3:1. Sure, in 1987 maybe. Current panels have "harmonized EROIs between 8.7 and 34.2".
>That's less than a $0.01 per kWh
Huh? "CN: Usage Price: Electricity for Industry: 35 kV & Above" from https://www.ceicdata.com/en/china/electricity-price
0.870 RMB/kWh = 13 cents USD/kWh
The US price for industrial power is lower across the board:
https://blsstrategies.com/docs/news/News_181.pdf
20 year solar PPAs are being signed for delivery this year at 1.4 cents/kWh. More realistic numbers for China are between 4 and 6 cents. That is precisely why China announced they were no longer offering any support on PV installs. Yet in spite of removing those incentives, current predictions are for ~45 GWp of installs this year in China alone.
It's not hard to see why: PV can be installed incrementally, one panel at a time. Therefore you can easily ramp up and down with supply-n-demand, labor availability, access to cash, etc. Wind and natural gas are next in line in scalability, the former ~1.5MW per install and the later around 200 kW in most cases. But for something like a reactor, it's 1 GW or nothing. This really skews the financing side toward the renewables.
Sunlight appears to be the most equitably distributed primary power source on the whole planet. Even the worst regions don't seem to be more than 4x or so worse than the best region on the planet (a part of Chile, I suspect?). Any other source, such as wind, coal deposits, oil deposits, uranium ore etc. have vastly higher geographic differences (although admittedly, for some, such as uranium, this might not impact their practicality).
Ezekiel 23:20
The problem with renewable energy is not so much the price to do so but the cost of not running non renewable energy. Power plants are built on the basis that there is going to be a return on investment. Truth is they get paid both to produce and not to produce in order to return that investment.
Taking Ireland as an example, i work in this market, demand can vary between around 3000 MW to 6000MW typically on a daily basis, Sometimes demand can reach higher or lower. So at minimum demand there is at least 3000MW of generation capacity that is off or running at minimum load. This idle generation is paid a capacity payment. When you introduce Wind you have a variable source, the maximum wind generation to date was just short of 4000 MW on a low it can reach as low as 200MW So you need enough standby generation to cover those low days and they are going to get paid if they run or not.
Environmentally it's better to run using renewable energy but you still have to pay the non renewable energy producers anyway. If you didn't then you might not cover peak demand and then we could be sitting in the dark. It's not that hard to destabilize the grid.
It's kind of interesting what tesla is doing in Australia they have huge battery packs which are charged by the wind farms and able to supply the grid at a moments notice. This helps a lot.
Blarney Quality Restaurant, Plants
China pretty much has cornered production on solar panels.
Now they'll start ratcheting up the pricing.
Chas - The one, the only.
THANK GOD!!!
They have the coal plants any way, as well as the personnel to man it.
The _levelized_ cost of solar has to compete against the _fuel_ cost of coal.
Solar for the patsies, coal for China. China is building as much coal generating capacity as US has in its entirety ... the few PV projects are only value signalling.
Without subsidy levelized cost for solar has to be cheaper than fuel cost for coal plants they have any way. That's less than a $0.01 per kWh, solar is getting close but it's still at least a decade off barring some technological leap AFAICS.
Exactly.
https://www.forbes.com/sites/j...
Heliene Solar is based in Ontario and manufactures its panels in Miinnesota.
https://www.heliene.com/
You are welcome on my lawn.
At some point the buyer will go for a solution with mirrors and molten salt. instead.
A PV farm is lick and stick, routine maintenance and panel cleaning aside. A molten salt concentrator array needs all the same kinds of maintenance, and more besides, and if it goes wrong it can also be a serious problem. It's got more moving parts, liquids, etc. and all that has to be inspected on a regular basis.
"You're right," Fisheye says. "I should have set it on 'whip' or 'chop.'"
All those subsidies/dumping that China does to steal Western manufacturing is coming home. Solar City is going to have a heyday. They are ramping up production of efficient panels as well as their tiles. Hopefully, the rest of Western solar panels makers will do ok. Also, hopefully trump/europe will impose same same tariffs on any vehicles manufactured by Chinese companies that will attempt to dump on the west
I prefer the "u" in honour as it seems to be missing these days.
Disposal costs, government subsidies etc.
That's misrepresenting what she was saying. Simply it is easier to harvest heat from solar rather than electrical energy and it's far more efficient than generating electricity and then using it to heat water.
No that's verbatim what she said, she literally said to use solar thermal to replace a $2 immersion heater. She also literally said to use windmills for direct manufacturing.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?...
Not someone's tourist trap
IIRC, the last time I investigated solar most of the cost was installation, not materials.
I think we've pushed this "anyone can grow up to be president" thing too far.
At one point in the future, you will overbuild the generation capacity and control load by intermittently synthesizing ammonia to replace fossil fuels used for the same purpose today. Just the current global consumption of ammonia would necessitate several hundred GW of extra average generation, so there's plenty of room for load management.
Ezekiel 23:20
No, he said 100% of the sloar panels are "rebranded Chinese garbage".
Heliene Solar is a Canadian company that makes its panels in the USA.
You are welcome on my lawn.
This was simply dumping to dstroy competitors
Funded by China
Maurice W. Hilarius Voice: (778) 347-9907
No, they have externalized costs that they already consider to be greater than any savings.
And the coal cost is higher than PV. The only reason China uses any coal is for total capacity.
This story is about the domestic prices in China, not international market prices.
Wait, you thought outdoor lighting was the main source of electrical demand?!?! LOL
Than thinking people don't use power at night.
At one point in the future, you will overbuild the generation capacity and control load by intermittently synthesizing ammonia to replace fossil fuels used for the same purpose today. Just the current global consumption of ammonia would necessitate several hundred GW of extra average generation, so there's plenty of room for load management.
There is no way that will ever be economically efficient. Syn fuels are great but not a panacea. They have 2 basic inputs to make them: heat and fuel-stock. The fuel-stock is easier but still you need a lot of it and hopefully we can use plant material instead of coal. The real problem is that the heat needs to be consistent and of a specific temperature (at least 500C to be efficient) and getting that from electricity is very hard/inefficient/expensive. To make it efficient you really need nuclear (specifically MSRs running between 500-700C). Also, you need to make the fuel for cheaper than its currently available from the ground. You just can't do this without a very large source of consistent heat that you can only make economically from fossil fuels or nuclear. Also, for fun, the fuel market is just as big as electricity when measured in units of energy. Remind me again how we do that with solar or wind?
"Those that start by burning books, will end by burning men."
Setting aside the fallacies in some of your reasoning, what does *anything* of that have to do with ammonia? Ammonia is mostly used for agriculture, then for other chemical purposes. Just the agricultural use alone can take advantage of any generation surpluses.
Ezekiel 23:20
Coming from the man who said
Wait, you thought outdoor lighting was the main source of electrical demand?!?! LOL
Yeah all that lighting is because that's the only thing going on, and that's exactly what I was saying / sarcasm
Except when you already know that that is the lowest load part of the day, then it shows that you're merely intellectually dishonest; you don't have an excuse, like the stupid guys do. You're just pure flamebait.
What's your excuse ? Pretending that people don't use power at night or that a solar thermal system at your home for heating teais anything other than ridiculous
Face it, you aren't thinking about this. You're a zealot that reacts badly whenever it's pointed out the emperor has no clothes.
Re "And the coal cost is higher than PV."
Not with the real cost of solar in China to China for solar vs coal.
If coal was more expensive than solar in China then coal would not be considered.
Coal is still been considered now in 2019 so it is still cheaper energy than a new large solar project.
Domestic spying is now "Benign Information Gathering"
The USA is not China. Coal and solar production have fixed costs in China.
Coal can still be considered vs a new large solar project.
China wants the lowest cost of energy 24/7. So no factory has to pay more for energy at any time of the day/night.
A supported solar project with all its costs still allows coal to be cheaper.
Communists want low cost power to drive jobs and exports.
Coal power just keeps the energy going 24/7 at a fixed price.
Domestic spying is now "Benign Information Gathering"
The problem with renewable energy is not so much the price to do so but the cost of not running non renewable energy.
... you need enough standby generation to cover those low days and they are going to get paid if they run or not.
THIS. I'd upvote you to 6 but I don't have any points, never mind cascading points.
All these guys with renewables forget they're not 100% dependable and unless you want to be in the dark you need a backup source ready to go within seconds, not construction years. And 10x overproduction is great, but at night none of the solar banks are busy. I want an average load-out with peaks, but I've got variable input that ranges from 0-200%. NOT the same thing.
It's kind of interesting what tesla is doing in Australia
THAT. Besides pushing trains or water uphill or spinning wheels or compressing air, that's the only innovation I've heard in a long time. And they're doing it with millisecond quantity, not just supporting a hospital or single neighborhood. (30,000 homes for an hour.)
Informative AND pretty pictures: One, Two, Three, Four, Five.
If the universe is someone's simulation -- does that mean the stars are just stuck pixels?
"Harmonized", as in after you cook the numbers starting from ideal conditions and applying some BS reasoning?
No, as in, when confronted with data from various sources, you try to correct for the methodological differences to put the results in a meta-study on equal footing.
It is highly doubtful that solar is viable without relying on fossil energy
*This* is an actual example of "BS reasoning", seeing as manufacturing of solar equipment is primarily electricity-intensive.
and EROI also ignores materials inputs, associated mining, and eventual disposal
Of course it doesn't, why would it do that? Cradle-to-grave analysis is a thing nowadays.
Ezekiel 23:20
Coal is "being considered in 2019"? You mean they stopped cancelling tens of gigawatts worth of coal projects?
Ezekiel 23:20
If it takes more than 10 years to break even, those solar cells will not sell at all. The price will always depend on the cost of electricity.
I've never got how "4x worse" make any mathematical sense without a reference.
If some other region was say 10% away from the best then 4x as much would be 40% away and sure that work.
4x worse than the best one though? What?
You're not the only one who say it like that but it seem completely retarded, why not say 1/4 as good or 3/4 less instead?
Well the point was really that 1) it's above the polar circle so in the winter there are no daylight whatsoever for some time and kinda more importantly though of course not making it impossible 2) the latest(?) level they are mining at is at 1.3+ km depth so not much sun light is getting there ..
Then again I wouldn't need any with my brilliant mind inside there.
https://weather-and-climate.co...
Yeah 6 months without rain in one of the wettest countries on earth
https://weather-and-climate.co...
Gotta say though I love your ability to look at satellite imagery of your country lit up like a christmas tree and claim nobody is using power
Every new power generation project will be considered as a real cost.
The lowest cost energy project that can power a factory to make exports 24/7 wins Communist party backing.
A coal, solar project would be considered.
Coal projects can still win on price so they get given approval. No more just doing solar to show solar is getting used more.
Domestic spying is now "Benign Information Gathering"
If some other region was say 10% away from the best then 4x as much would be 40% away and sure that work.
I don't understand that part at all.
You're not the only one who say it like that but it seem completely retarded, why not say 1/4 as good or 3/4 less instead?
Because it's an equivalent, and in my mother tongue your suggestions would be completely retarded.
Ezekiel 23:20
I never said nobody is using power.
I said in Germany night load, aka base load is around 40%.
And in Thailand it is lower.
So shove your satellite images where no one sees them, as you are obviously to dumb to draw conclusions from them :P
Cost free eBook I read (by iBook/Kobo/Amazon/ObookO/Gutenberg etc.): "The Green Odyssey" by Philip Jose Farmer.
Most people in Thailand don't need power at night
Must have been that other Angel'o'sphere
So many of you around.
Thailand is a big country.
So you picked a small part of a large country that isn't representative of the whole and accused me of making a dumbass of myself ?
Well you may be right, I did think that the fact life goes on after sunset would have been enough to make even the biggest idiot think twice. I had no idea I could be so wrong.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/...
Thailand's climate is influenced by monsoon winds that have a seasonal character (the southwest and northeast monsoon).[52]:2 The southwest monsoon, which starts from May until October is characterized by movement of warm, moist air from the Indian Ocean to Thailand, causing abundant rain over most of the country.[52]:2 The northeast monsoon, starting from October until February brings cold and dry air from China over most of Thailand.[52]:2 In southern Thailand, the northeast monsoon brings mild weather and abundant rainfall on the eastern coast of that region.[52]:2 Most of Thailand has a "tropical wet and dry or savanna climate" type (Köppen's Tropical savanna climate).[53] The south and the eastern tip of the east have a tropical monsoon climate.
Thailand is divided into three seasons.[52]:2 The first is the rainy or southwest monsoon season (mid–May to mid–October) which prevails over most of the country.[52]:2 This season is characterized by abundant rain with August and September being the wettest period of the year.[52]:2 This can occasionally lead to floods.[52]:4 In addition to rainfall caused by the southwest monsoon, the Intertropical Convergence Zone (ITCZ) and tropical cyclones also contribute to producing heavy rainfall during the rainy season.[52]:2 Nonetheless, dry spells commonly occur for 1 to 2 weeks from June to early July.[52]:4 This is due to the northward movement of the Intertropical Convergence Zone to southern China.[52]:4 Winter or the northeast monsoon starts from mid–October until mid–February.[52]:2 Most of Thailand experiences dry weather during this season with mild temperatures.[52]:2:4 The exception is the southern parts of Thailand where it receives abundant rainfall, particularly during October to November.[52]:2 Summer or the pre–monsoon season runs from mid–February until mid–May and is characterized by warmer weather.[52]:3
The same way you are at quarter past midnight your time engaging in argument on an electrically powered computer, but in the dark of course for you.
https://www.statravel.co.nz/th...
https://www.weatheronline.co.u...
You might want to try positive affirmations though tell yourself your smart.
It just might work better than saying stupid things
All the shops are closed ... and at midnight (I was actually sleeping at midnight already) 90% of the Thai in rural Thailand are sleeping
When the majority of the Thai population is urban.
So while your factory is shut down the night clubs in Bangkok are going full bore.
But then again keep on replying on your magic computer that doesn't use power, with all the other people who aren't in bed by 8:00 pm ?
Around 20:00 most people in my town are in bed .
LOL do you go around tucking them in
So while your factory is shut down the night clubs in Bangkok are going full bore.
And in comparision to a factory, how much power does a night club use?
LOL do you go around tucking them in
Unfortunately not, my GF/wife does not allow me.
However when we come home from the super market (which closes at 20:00) we pass many many houses.
What is wrong with you? Is your telepathy failing you? You live on the other side of the planet and believe to know more than one who is living at the place you are scrying? Perhaps you should seek mental help instead of googleing weather sites you don't comprehend.
Hint: north to south Thailand is about 2000km long ... east to west about 1100km ... the weather or climate at my place is not the "average" of Thailand. Every region has its specific own climate ... and outside of towns people go up around 6:00 or 5:30 even and go to bed around 20:00 or 22:00
And the sleeping patterns have only a little part to do with energy consumption. If you ever had dug into energy production/consumption you knew that.
Cost free eBook I read (by iBook/Kobo/Amazon/ObookO/Gutenberg etc.): "The Green Odyssey" by Philip Jose Farmer.
My telepathy ?
I'm not the guy claiming to know the habits, of everyone in the town where I live let alone the entire country.
I am also not the guy who thinks the area where I live represents the entire world
Most of all I am not the guy, who somehow thinks solar isn't an intermittent power source that isn't available more often that it is.
Oh and because I am kind I will answer and earlier question of yours. You wanted to know why you kept coming back to this thread ? It's because you are so horribly wrong on the big question. Hell you were even more wrong than the guy who proposed the vacuum flywheels and parabolic trackers to replace a two dollar immersion heater that would still work better. His stuff was possible if completely impractical. You have an insane need to deny reality
That isn't telepathy that's observation as you have done it in every post you have made here.
Why is your mother tongue illogical and wrong? What language is it?
It's no more illogical or wrong than English. You know, Englsh, the language that raped the Latin alphabet?
Ezekiel 23:20
I am also not the guy who thinks the area where I live represents the entire world
Yes you are.
I pointed out to some GP post that *here* we have since about 5 month sunshine from 6:30 to 18:00 *every day* except 3 or 4.
So his brain dead idea about intermittent sunshine is bollocks.
You jumped in with the the stupid idea that people/countries use at night the same amount of power as they do at day, they don't.
And that is true FOR EVERYWHERE ON THE WORLD.
Cost free eBook I read (by iBook/Kobo/Amazon/ObookO/Gutenberg etc.): "The Green Odyssey" by Philip Jose Farmer.
I pointed out to some GP post that *here* we have since about 5 month sunshine from 6:30 to 18:00 *every day* except 3 or 4.
Yes that 18:00 to 6:30 doesn't count for you ?
Oh and now are people in bed by 6:00 PM ? Not using the AC, or the Heater, The Television, The Stove , Charging The Electric Car.
Oh wait, not only are those things you that you need constant power sources for, they are things that trying to use solar directly for won't work at all. They are all electric.
Dude, you don't need to argue with me, you need to see a priest and get a religion you actually realize you have.
The point is not what the PEOPLE do but what the COUNTRY does, and as industry and business is closed, the power consumption is roughy half at night.
How dumb are you?
Cost free eBook I read (by iBook/Kobo/Amazon/ObookO/Gutenberg etc.): "The Green Odyssey" by Philip Jose Farmer.
The point is not what the PEOPLE do but what the COUNTRY does , and as industry and business is closed, the power consumption is roughy half at night.
How dumb are you?
O"rlly ? Tell me oh enlightened wizard of electricity is 2/3rds (the correct answer by the way) greater or less than zero ? And just where does that 2/3rds come from when your non intermittent power source isn't there ? Oh and lets not talk about the months when it isn't clear and the days are shorter.
Once again go see a priest. Get a religion you will at least understand you have instead of one that has you thinking you have none. That way you will at least stop bringing shame on yourself and your family.
At night I don't need solar power, plain and simple ... unless I produce > 50% of my power by solar and can store the excess power ... wich is unlikely.
Go google what a "load curve" is ...
You probably the dumbest hobby electrics expert on the internet.
Cost free eBook I read (by iBook/Kobo/Amazon/ObookO/Gutenberg etc.): "The Green Odyssey" by Philip Jose Farmer.
At night I don't need solar power, plain and simple ... unless I produce > 50% of my power by solar and can store the excess power ... wich is unlikely.
And you don't need it in winter when the days are shorter and you need more to heat your home, and you don't need it in the rainy season aka the monsoon season in your country, and you don't need at night when you are in the hospital and your factory doesn't need it all day every day.
But really you are right you never need solar, because every country in the world has built their power grids around always available dispatchable power not intermittent sources. Go figure.
Get thee to a nunnery
We talked about Thailand, especially the place where I live, Isan.
So: no we don't have in winter significantly shorter days. The rainy season has most of the time extremely fixed time periods during wich it is raining. So if it rains today from 16:00 till 18:30, it will do "the same" tomorrow.
because every country in the world has built their power grids around always available dispatchable power not intermittent sources. ... perhaps you missed the news.
No, they have not.
Examples:
UK, Denmark, Iceland and Germany
Modern grids are completely the opposite you claim. They are constructed around intermittent sources, because those you can't control ... pretty dumb of you. Probably you wanted to say something like that but are full with hate that you by accident reversed your words.
So, did you meanwhile google the "load profile" of your "control area" of "your grid"? You know during which time of the day you have peaks and what the difference between peak load and base load is, in rough percentages?
Bother me again, when you have figured those basics.
Ah, regarding your previous post (not relevant for the difference between peak and base load): here no one has AC. Does not make sense. The only days where AC would be helpful are perhaps 30 - 45 days when we switch from hot season to rainy season. The hot season is not hot enough, not humid enough, and the cold season/dry season is: fucking cold at night, and nearly never tops 31C around 13:00 .... Stoves ... at night? Yeah, Thai people eat all the time, that is true. But they don't cook all night. And not on electric stoves anyway.
If you want to argue about electricity: get a clue, stop dreaming. Or better stop it ... you don't look like one who is interested in getting a clue.
Cost free eBook I read (by iBook/Kobo/Amazon/ObookO/Gutenberg etc.): "The Green Odyssey" by Philip Jose Farmer.
We talked about Thailand, especially the place where I live, Isan.
No you specifically talked about that. I talked about the world in general
UK, Denmark, Iceland and Germany ... perhaps you missed the news.
UK gets 21 % of it's power from nuclear
http://www.world-nuclear.org/i...
Iceland gets most of it's power from geothermal. (Not solar Not intermittent and Dispatchable)
Denmark and Germany import electricity from other countries and still have the highest electric rates in Europe likely the world at 41 cents per KWH last I looked.
Not even bothering to read the rest of your rant
You're a religious maniac and you don't even understand it. Get thee to a nunnery