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US Tells Germany To Stop Using Huawei Equipment Or Lose Some Intelligence Access (theverge.com)

Posted by BeauHD on from the do-it-or-face-the-consequences dept.

The Wall Street Journal is reporting that the United States has told Germany to drop Huawei from its future plans or risk losing access to some U.S. intelligence. The U.S. says the Chinese company's equipment could be used for espionage -- a concern that Huawei says is unfounded. "The Trump administration has been pressing allies to end their relationships with Huawei, but Germany, moving ahead with its plans, has not moved to ban the company from its networks," reports The Verge. From the report: According to the Journal, a letter sent from the U.S. Ambassador to Germany warns the country that the U.S. will stop sharing some secrets if it allows Huawei to work on its next-generation 5G infrastructure. The letter, according to the Journal, argues that network security can't be effectively managed by audits of equipment or software. While the U.S. plans to continue sharing intelligence with Germany regardless, the Journal reports, officials plan to curtail the scope of that information if Huawei equipment is used in German infrastructure.

11 of 417 comments (clear)

  1. Recommendations? by patrick.kursawe · · Score: 5, Insightful

    What else? Maybe Cisco? https://www.tomshardware.com/n...

    1. Re:Recommendations? by chill · · Score: 4, Informative

      Ericsson or Nokia would be my guess. Both are major telecom manufacturers with a heavy investment in 5G. Both are European companies.

      --
      Learning HOW to think is more important than learning WHAT to think.
  2. Why? by idji · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Why doesn't anyone talk about the NSA's known actions to install physical and software backdoors in American hardware, https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/..., and that Huawei has never been shown to do that?
    This looks like a Trump MAGA Tamtrum to protect Cisco, etc, and wage a useless trade ware.

    1. Re:Why? by _merlin · · Score: 4, Informative

      That story isn't credible, and no-one has produced a photograph of the chip.

  3. Re: Hello Chinese agent by freax · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Please don't save us and stay home. Spend your American tax dollars on bridges and education.

    Like we do.

    You need it.

  4. Of course! by bickerdyke · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Of course we should consider that Huawai may be forced to include backdoors.

    On the other hand, with Cisco, we know it.

    And if the US wants to start the blackmailing game, I'm sure they can call Cisco and make sure that their prices are.... compareable. Or if you have anything that may hint that Huawai indeed build in backdoors: Come up with some proof. Or at least an effing hint. Or clue. Or inkling... anything that is better than mere claim.

    I'd even go as far and say that we'd be willing to believe any actual evidence (better to be spied on by the US than China) but as long there isn't anything like that the only sensible way to go is to put any possible vendor through a strict security check.

    --
    bickerdyke
    1. Re:Of course! by bobbied · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Better the enemy you know than the one you don't.

      So, why do you think it's a good idea to pay China for equipment that likely has back doors, or the possibility to add them sometime in the future by a company that's owned by a hostile state? Cisco may have well documented security issues, but they are not owned and controlled by a country that is hostile. Huawai would be in position to put a back door into any of their equipment with a firmware update, even if they don't exist now. Why take that chance? And how would you be able to know if they did? I seriously doubt they'd let you build the code from source...

      Besides, Cisco and Huawai are not the only two choices here. There are more.

      The issue here is who is behind the company. Huawai is clearly state run, in a thinly veiled way. Clearly Huawai would do as the government requires, and if that was to hide backdoors in their firmware updates, you can bet they'd do it. Cisco? Not so much.

      --
      "File to fit, pound to insert, paint to match" - Aircraft Maintenance 101
    2. Re:Of course! by bickerdyke · · Score: 5, Interesting

      So, why do you think it's a good idea to pay China for equipment that likely has back doors,

      Again, that's a false premise. As of now, your question should be phrased: Why do you think it's a good idea to pay China for equipment that has no indication of backdoors or security issues except unfounded claims from someone backing a competing vendor?

      Huawai would be in position to put a back door into any of their equipment with a firmware update, even if they don't exist now. Why take that chance? And how would you be able to know if they did? I seriously doubt they'd let you build the code from source...

      They will if they want to sell it to Germany and if it is necessary to pass the security audit. And with no reliable information performing such an audit for ANY possible vendor is the only way to go.

      Clearly Huawai would do as the government requires, and if that was to hide backdoors in their firmware updates, you can bet they'd do it. Cisco? Not so much.

      Well, any american company also is no further than a NSL away from having to give the three letter agencies full access, too. So, again, Germany can't rely on anyone here and has to run their own strict security audit and include any possible vendor here.

      --
      bickerdyke
  5. Re:The other alternative is even dumber. by bobbied · · Score: 4, Insightful

    But we'll go with the batshit crazy stupid version you prefer, then: USA tells germany that if they move to 5G that the USA will stop sharing anything with them from their intel (though they will still demand that Germany hand over stuff to them, even if it is via a proxy state like the UK).

    And it's Germany's right to not share information with the USA if they don't find the relationship beneficial to them.

    Look, I get why the USA is saying this. It's not about pushing USA build equipment, it's about preserving security on the networks that carry the terabytes of secret information passing between the countries. The USA doesn't want one specific manufacturer's equipment in that network. I get why.

    --
    "File to fit, pound to insert, paint to match" - Aircraft Maintenance 101
  6. Re:It doesn't matter anymore by Freischutz · · Score: 4, Interesting

    And, of course, you have proof of this?

    The NSA project is called Tailored Access Operations: http://www.spiegel.de/internat...

    Cisco got so pissed about it they went to visit the president to complain: https://www.techdirt.com/artic...

    Warning of an erosion of confidence in the products of the U.S. technology industry, John Chambers, the CEO of networking giant Cisco Systems, has asked President Obama to intervene to curtail the surveillance activities of the National Security Agency.

  7. Re:The other alternative is even dumber. by XXongo · · Score: 4, Interesting

    it's about preserving security on the networks that carry the terabytes of secret information passing between the countries.

    By preserve security you of course mean maintain the US ability to slurp it all up.

    Um, you do have to realize that the Chinese government are not the good guys. Saying "well, what about NSA spying??" is a whataboutism argument. Yes, the NSA is a spy agency, but that doesn't mean that Chinese spying is something we shouldn't worry about.

    https://www.merriam-webster.com/words-at-play/whataboutism-origin-meaning