The problem, I think, comes from the "only" you're quoting. When one's interests are such that one only keeps friends who share that interest, that is often considered unhealthy.
Yes, but the problem then becomes, "what kind of robots?" Initially, one might think, "tank" or "cyborg", but without good weapons (the laser sword comes to mind), they suck.
You know, that quote is far less poignant and powerful when it's used to talk about DVD editing rather than the systematic killing of millions of Jews, Roma, homosexuals, and Slavs.
Ah, but the problem is, what if there are so few jobs that the employee can't really quit? Should the employee grin and take the abuse, or are there basic protections that the employee should enjoy?
To post an email message intended to insult and provoke. 2. vi. To speak incessantly and/or rabidly on some relatively uninteresting subject or with a patently ridiculous attitude. 3. vt. Either of senses 1 or 2, directed with hostility at a particular person or people.
Let us consider a response intended to insult and provoke:
I still think that position that video games do not require skill is an absurd postion to take.
That would fit the definition of flame. Because of that, my post was therefore a troll.
troll v. To utter a posting on USENET designed to attract stupid responses or flames
I certainly got the latter, didn't I? And it's actually a fairly good troll: a post attacking video games on Slashdot, a geek forum, is a good way to attract attention. I'd say it's a decent one.
I've played a lot of modern games. I went to a Halo party last night, I play Battlefield 1942, I'm big into fighting games and there are few that can last a round with me in Street Fighter 2, never mind beating me (I'm still human, of course, and lose occasionally). But you know why? Practice. I've played the Turbo edition pretty regularly since I was 13. Practicing does the following:
- it gives me near-perfect timing - it lets me know what people are likely to do (I don't play the CPU anymore, because I know pretty much what it'll do)
I've played video games for a long time. I'm twenty one, and I first played on my friend's Famicom when I was six or seven. I have a Nintendo, a Super Nintendo, a PSX, a PS2, two gameboys (original and colour). But I don't consider skill at video games a skill in that something like an instrument or a martial art is a skill. The general skills applicable to video games can be learnt in a year or two of lots of playing, and with obsessive playing, one can pretty much master a game in six to eight months. Video games have artificial constraints which one can only work around. With a real skill, your constraints are typically internal, and with practice, you might be able to lessen or even eliminate them. With video games, practice just means you're working within the same constraints.
Music and martial arts, on the other hand, are a different story entirely. There's some reflex involved, certainly. "Body memory" as I like to call it. I can throw a front snap kick and do basic kata decently because of mindless, repetitive practice. Hand me a flute, and I'll automatically hold it correctly, as there's a number of keys which one could theoretically press, but doesn't. But if I play an instrument or practice a martial art for ten years (think about this: ten years!), does that make me skilled? Hell no! Both require a lifetime of committment. I can't think of any game off the top of my head that would require a lifetime of committment to truly master. I've played the flute for ten years, and the horn for about seven. With the horn, I'm close to the level where I might be able to be an alternate player in the local symphony. If I play the horn for the next twenty years, I'll probably spend that time refining how I use my breath, as well as the positioning and use of my hand in tone-bending! These are subtle things - these are far more than reflex. Unlike the constraints of video games, these constaints can be bettered over time.
Games are a simple domain. I don't believe skill at video games is truly a skill. It's partway there, sure, but most of the people who want to consider it a skill are slugs who sit at home, playing video games, and want to justify their existence. Is it reflexes and coordination? Sure. Is it much more than that? Not really.
It's amazingly arbitrary to consider something 'not a skill' just because it involves a computer.
You may not agree with my argument, but I feel it's a valid argument none the less. And please don't try to imply that I'm some sort of luddite. I'm a graduate student doing computer science. I think that in time, games could become a skill. Certainly they could. But not right now - they're still simple systems, even the best of games. I think that some sort of realistic VR-type game in twenty or thirty years would almost certainly be considered a skill.
Slashdot Mirror
The problem, I think, comes from the "only" you're quoting. When one's interests are such that one only keeps friends who share that interest, that is often considered unhealthy.
Yes yes, but what's that in Libraries of Congress?
Sadly, the HURD is barely useable. In the extreme case (SCO actually has a case and wins), I think I'd prefer NetBSD to HURD.
I don't know. Maybe that's why he sniggered. ;)
Kleene star. Back to your algorithms class, whelp.
SuSE 8.0 for the last year, except for work, where my main development machine runs NetBSD 1.6_RC2.
But then, you're just an AC.
When you say "literally scar", I don't think you quite understand what that means. Looking at goatse.cx won't leave scar tissue all over your body.
Yes, but the problem then becomes, "what kind of robots?" Initially, one might think, "tank" or "cyborg", but without good weapons (the laser sword comes to mind), they suck.
Best pick up the Flybot or Mcycle.
You know, that quote is far less poignant and powerful when it's used to talk about DVD editing rather than the systematic killing of millions of Jews, Roma, homosexuals, and Slavs.
Truly. I've been using SuSE 8.0 for almost a year now, and have had *zero* problems with it what-so-ever.
You forget simple things. I can still do long division - but barely.
Ah, but the problem is, what if there are so few jobs that the employee can't really quit? Should the employee grin and take the abuse, or are there basic protections that the employee should enjoy?
I prefer a pint of Guinness, myself. Guiness...is that like Fudd? ;)
Where in eastern Canada, and to which school are you going? I'm from Saskatchewan, myself.
It wasn't a line of defense. It had nothing to do with my argument. I'm just doing my part to correct the rampant illiteracy on the internet.
Have fun at university. I'm assuming computer science, but are you doing something else entirely?
First, that's "you're", and "amateur".
Next, here's part of the definition of flame:
To post an email message intended to insult and provoke. 2. vi. To speak incessantly and/or rabidly on some relatively uninteresting subject or with a patently ridiculous attitude. 3. vt. Either of senses 1 or 2, directed with hostility at a particular person or people.
Let us consider a response intended to insult and provoke:
I still think that position that video games do not require skill is an absurd postion to take.
That would fit the definition of flame. Because of that, my post was therefore a troll.
Finally, I own a hardcopy, but it's at home.
YHBT. YHL. HAND.
huh?
From the Jargon File:
troll v. To utter a posting on USENET designed to attract stupid responses or flames
I certainly got the latter, didn't I? And it's actually a fairly good troll: a post attacking video games on Slashdot, a geek forum, is a good way to attract attention. I'd say it's a decent one.
(granted, this isn't Usenet, but the idea holds)
I can't see how an rational person could honestly think that being good a video games is not a 'developed talent or ability'.
You haven't considered the possibility that you've been trolled, have you?
I've played a lot of modern games. I went to a Halo party last night, I play Battlefield 1942, I'm big into fighting games and there are few that can last a round with me in Street Fighter 2, never mind beating me (I'm still human, of course, and lose occasionally). But you know why? Practice. I've played the Turbo edition pretty regularly since I was 13. Practicing does the following:
- it gives me near-perfect timing
- it lets me know what people are likely to do (I don't play the CPU anymore, because I know pretty much what it'll do)
I've played video games for a long time. I'm twenty one, and I first played on my friend's Famicom when I was six or seven. I have a Nintendo, a Super Nintendo, a PSX, a PS2, two gameboys (original and colour). But I don't consider skill at video games a skill in that something like an instrument or a martial art is a skill. The general skills applicable to video games can be learnt in a year or two of lots of playing, and with obsessive playing, one can pretty much master a game in six to eight months. Video games have artificial constraints which one can only work around. With a real skill, your constraints are typically internal, and with practice, you might be able to lessen or even eliminate them. With video games, practice just means you're working within the same constraints.
Music and martial arts, on the other hand, are a different story entirely. There's some reflex involved, certainly. "Body memory" as I like to call it. I can throw a front snap kick and do basic kata decently because of mindless, repetitive practice. Hand me a flute, and I'll automatically hold it correctly, as there's a number of keys which one could theoretically press, but doesn't. But if I play an instrument or practice a martial art for ten years (think about this: ten years!), does that make me skilled? Hell no! Both require a lifetime of committment. I can't think of any game off the top of my head that would require a lifetime of committment to truly master. I've played the flute for ten years, and the horn for about seven. With the horn, I'm close to the level where I might be able to be an alternate player in the local symphony. If I play the horn for the next twenty years, I'll probably spend that time refining how I use my breath, as well as the positioning and use of my hand in tone-bending! These are subtle things - these are far more than reflex. Unlike the constraints of video games, these constaints can be bettered over time.
Games are a simple domain. I don't believe skill at video games is truly a skill. It's partway there, sure, but most of the people who want to consider it a skill are slugs who sit at home, playing video games, and want to justify their existence. Is it reflexes and coordination? Sure. Is it much more than that? Not really.
It's amazingly arbitrary to consider something 'not a skill' just because it involves a computer.
You may not agree with my argument, but I feel it's a valid argument none the less. And please don't try to imply that I'm some sort of luddite. I'm a graduate student doing computer science. I think that in time, games could become a skill. Certainly they could. But not right now - they're still simple systems, even the best of games. I think that some sort of realistic VR-type game in twenty or thirty years would almost certainly be considered a skill.
Skill at video games is mostly reaction speed, and knowledge of how to exploit the game's constraints. Is that skill? Well yes, but barely.
I learned alot from MS.
You're not an editor, are you?
You mean spam like this?
Well, I guess it takes one to know one.
Wow, you really put me in my place!
"your" useless statement, not "you're", monkey.
PERHAPS you SHOULD stop talking LIKE zippy the PINHEAD.