This sounds alot like what has happened in the past with Paladium and WoC. Though im sure I will piss off some diehard ccg players and d&d geeks, face it their business if not dying is surely shrinking. Rather than embrace the technologies that are making them irrelevent they have chosen to mostly ignore them and instead bolster attempts to "protect" what they have to the point of turning away their audience.
If it was my film i'd swap some of the characters around..throw in a semi rediculous sub plot and call it satire.
Last year one of my relatives gave everyone a plug and play game called Buzztime for christmas, its fun but disconnecting the existing consoles to plug it in to play one game is a bit of a pain. This sounds alot more spontaneous. Having access to Live means the game can be updated easily. Its proably not going to attract many of the traditional gamers but for the new casual gamers its sounds like a great way for the family to game together. I'ts gimmicky but I can see the controllers being used for other Licensed versions of popular games. Family Feud, Jeopardy, Who Wants To Be A Millionaire and tons of others could be easily ported and play almost identically to the way it does on the TV shows. I think there will be a big market for it.
I'd rather see a presentation of real stuff that is coming out in the short term than a dog and pony show full of high hopes and maybes. Remember last years Ridge Racer and Gran Turismo hoopla from Sony or how about Nintendo's demo with Mario 128 and the realistic Zelda several years ago. Selling based on hype 2-3 years off isnt a way to expand your user base if anything it's saying "hold off on buying now...the good stuff is coming down the pipe in a couple years so wait for the price drops".
Are we talking about the same game? The one where the guy gets executed for apparently no reason at all only they just knock him out so some insane movie director can make snuff films by having the killer slaughter a town? I played about 30 minutes of it, I wouldnt ban it, but it was crap. I really recommend you see more movies if thats in the top 3 storylines for you.
Yep I have the Dreamcast version as well as Radiant Silvergun for my Saturn. Oddly enough im really not that into shooters usually, but those were just mesmerizing.
I have very fond memories of excite bike but was scared off by reviews, but then I did mention one of my current favorites was an absolute bomb review wise. I think I may have to pick that one up this weekend.:)
You hit the nail square on the head with that one. Sony's arrogance has cost them and their aim was way off for an ever expanding market. In my house we own a Wii and Ps2 and a 360, none of the kids have even mentioned a ps3 other than my son who asked why it was expensive. Gamers are getting older, the Atari generation has grown up. Nintendo has it right on the game and price side but is lacking on the online side, though there is time to catch up on that.
I wasn't aware that graphic murder was an art form. I'm curious as to who they believe will buy this? Usually over the top violent games appeal to angst ridden teens more than any other segment and removing that from the equation leaves either the fractional market that is "hardcore" buy anything controversial adults, the overly curious (who will most likely rent) and maybe the already psychologically disturbed (which will just lead to the next Jack Thompson lawsuit). I could be wrong but I would guess that most "grown-ups" wont buy this game.
AO does not mean the game is banned, it means that it has to carry an Adults Only rating. Several businesses such as Wal-Mart and Target refuse to carry AO titles, they also refuse to carry Adult Films and Porno Mags as well but those genres continue to thrive. If the game is good enough to stand on its own merit then it should be able to find an audience even if it ended up as a Gamestop exclusive. The bigger hurdle is that Sony and Nintendo refuse to carry AO titles, they are the ones being the nanny here not the ESRB.
The sad thing is that Rockstar and Take Two knew this from the beginning and set out to make a game as over the top as possible. They seem to relish in their position as the bad boys of gaming seeing that the only game they have published that was not mired in controversy was that Table Tennis game that completely flopped. This is another way to grab headlines and get some press, don't feel sorry for them. In the end the game will probably have a few cut scenes removed that they never intended to publish anyway and the game will get an "M".
Don't be a jackass, you managed to twist what I said and still proved my point. Madden and the like tend to appeal to the wider audience which is mostly the casual ones...the ones that by Licensed movie games, GTA whatever and the bigger blockbuster titles. The gamers I am referring to are the ones that figure one copy of Madden is enough since not much changes with it from year to year. Final Fantasy is a good example, the last one I picked up was Final Fantasy 9, but its popular but most argue that it lives off reputation now more than anything new or groundbreaking. I just spoke from example, most people I know that are really into sports games enough to buy Madden year after year are pretty much only into sports games, its almost like a niche of its own. I did not call anyone a looser or insult them, I just expressed that most that are not considered "casual" gamers tend to look for more diversity in their gaming experience. If you felt singled out as one of the sports games fans with only sports games in your game collection I humbly apologize.
But as was the case with many of failed but highly rated games out there (like Iko, Ikaruga, Psychonauts, Rez, etc) the "hardcore" gamers were the only ones that bought them. Sequels do sell if done well, but while you can blame the existence of things like Halo2 and Resident Evil whatever on the "hardcore" segment you can just as easily blame the casual segment for the lack of Ico, Beyond Good and Evil or World at War sequels.
Your reading a bit too much into that...I don't concider myself a "hardcore" gamer by that definition. Your defining fanboy's, IMHO a "hardcore" gamer is one who likes depth, replay value, storyline, a different experience and overall fun. I want Oblivions, ICOs, Halos, Ikarugas, Guitar Heros, etc. What I dont want is 50 versions of the same old thing.
The article made the point that game complexity was going away in favor of more Brain Age, Tetris and Nintendogs. The Wii is great example right now, I have one and like it alot, my kids play every day on it but after Zelda and Wii Sports I havent found much more to entertain me enough to play without the kids. We own Wario, Rayman, Mario Party and Wii play and to me they might as well have been named Wii Sports 2,3,4 and 5 there is little diversity.
Oh wow...cant believe I fogot that one. Anyway 3 decently selling FPS console games in 3 console generations doesnt exactly count for much of a glut IMHO.
Wow i've never heard of Sports games being labled as "hardcore" most gamers concider sports games to be the lamest genre in videogames sure madden sells, but look at the audience it sells to and most of those seem to console owners that have nothing but the previous years madden and a handful of other sports games. Beyond Halo, has their ever been a top selling FPS on a console? I know there are alot of them but most of the ones I have seen end up in the bargain bin after a couple months.
Gamers carried the console manufacturers before the "casual" gaming boom and will be the ones who carry it afterwards. There are have been numerous casual gaming era's before and though they make for interesting blips in the manufacturers and developers bottom line, they don't last. Anyone remember the early 80's? The biggest contributor to the great video game crash of 83 was the over abundance of crap in the marketplace. Abandoning the "hardcore" gamer market which has higher expectations, demands more complexity and can not be fooled by licensing deals and pretty graphics sounds like a great idea in the short term but in the long term will only lead to disaster for the industry again. There is a place for casual gaming, and a great opportunity to introduce the non- initiated to gaming, but it's just that an introduction.
While its nice for him to admit that EA is contributing to the glut of shovelware, his "solution" concerns me. I for one would rather have a game that is so long I give up and never finish than pay that same $50-$60 for a game that is too easy and lasts an hour and a half. Yes there is a huge market for casual gaming but thats a very fickle audience one that will just as easily abandon it as soon as the next thing hits. The actual gamer is a smaller niche but was able to carry consoles and PC's before the current casual gaming bubble and will be the market that carries them after the bubble bursts, so its best not to abandon them completely.
Nielsen has been loosing importance since the advent of cable tv. Its been a long slow decline into irrelevency, this is just another attemt to find relevancy. The method of "rating" shows just how out of touch they are. I really dont think Google has anything to worry about.
Both have their place. I admit to hitting up the blogs when I just want to find out what is going on, but if something hold my interest I will normally dig and find real articles about the story. I can see why Journalists are concerned though, many times I will find a story with the amount of detail I need and then see it on the more "reputable" sites days later. There has to be a happy medium, unfortunately many of the more traditional outlets havent figured out a good way to do that.
Friday, The Cat Who Walked Through Walls, Stranger In A Strange Land, The Moon Is A Harsh Mistress, Citizen of the Galaxy and Methuselah's Children are all fantastic starters for someone just discovering Heinlein. If you want Heinlein at his weirdest check out All You Zombies.
Most of Heinlein's works take place in a future that doesnt seem too far out of reach. Granted most of it was written in an era where people believed in the possibility of life in our own solar system so there are lots of Martians, Venusians, etc but once you get past that the stories stand up remarkably well. He was much more into characterization than scientific gobbledy gook which helps keep it from being too dated.
I was at the Centennial celebration yesterday. Some great authors are on hand signing books and discussing Heinlein's influence. Still no word on a Stranger In A Strange Land movie. The atmosphere there was kind of like a Star Trek convention without the freaks. I managed to get Spider Robinson to sign my first edition Callhoon's Crosstime Saloon. And Alan Steele Signed my Ace edition Orbital Decay as well as a Editors Proof of All-American Alien Boy. That alone was worth the price of admission for me. Robin Wayne-Bailey, James Gunn and David Gerrold were attending as well but were not signing while I was there.
BTW for Heinlein fans I really recommend Spider and Allen for those that like Heinlein's early stuff the influence is obvious in their writing. Both deal more with what if near future better than most anyone else in the genre.
For those that are more into the deeper novel era of Heinlein's writings Robin Wayne Bailey and James Gunn are both good choices.
BTW the surprise guest speaker is Ray Bradbury unfortunately its via satellite due to health reasons like Arthur C Clarke's presentation. Both are happening today.
If your so desperate to see a movie that you will watch a crappy copy of something someone took with a camcorder complete with the Mystery Science Theatre 3000 audience view in the bottom of the screen then just pay for $7 or wait for the DVD like everyone else. I have a friend that does this and is always asking if I want to watch some crap movie I wouldnt have paid to see, then claims he is doing it because he is anti-mpaa. If your really anti-mpaa then you wont bother to see it at all, just the fact that someone wastes an hour downloading a poor quality bootleg proves that it has some value to them. Its hard to fight increasing restrictions on fair use when bozos like this continue to make the MPAA's point for them.
Oh ok I get it now...you mean like with the Sony laptop batteries where the problem was denied and blamed on the consumer for years until people actually got hurt...got it.
This happens with every company its not like its a MS centric thing. Regardless of the problems its still the best options as far as doing anything much beyond looking prett at the moment. The 3 years extension also gives some piece of mind. My only point was that there isnt much more they can do at this point, the console is out there, they have admitted there is a problem, they are offering to fix it on their dime. Do you realize how costly this is? The dragging it out and "investigating" that was done was for the same reasons sony drug its heels on the laptop battery problem, you have to find a solution before you can offer to fix and you have to find out what was wrong to prevent the fix from having the same problems.
How can admitting a problem, offering to fix and offering a warranty extension longer than any other console hurt their good will? If anything I believe it will get some that were on the fence about the 360 to buy one now.
Why buy a 360? A great library of games far better than the competition and a price that far lower (please dont argue the symantecs of a bluray player that most of us dont care about, im not buying the hd-addon for the 360 either).
so far most games just look better. Look at the EA sports offerings this year, the 360 versions look sharper and run at 60 frames a second, the ps3 versions run at 30. Supposedly that due to the learning curve of programming to the cel processor. Fanboys will argue that once they figure that out games wil blow the competition away, but every console has eeked out better graphics and performance over the course of its life, another year of figuring out the cel is another year or tweaking with the 360's processors as well.
What about the time a person with PTSD spent thinking about the events that caused the PTSD to start with. I might see this working if its administered immediately after a traumatic event but PTSD sometimes isnt diagnosed until much later sometimes years. What happens to all the time after, if you cant remember what happened to cause your meltdown, but remember being in the psych ward years later? Just sounds like trading one sort of trama for another.
Which other game has cranked out clones, sequels and spinoff's like Pong has. Heck this year Rockstar got into the game with Table Tennis and pong is an essential part of Wii Play. Sure its simple but its basically what started it all and its simplicity is still being borrowed from today.
If they really wanted to make an impact and get advertising dollars, why not have sponsors for the nickle and dime downloads they offer in marketplace, things like backgounds, skins, etc. Cars for Forza sponsored by the car companies, new outfits for Hitman maybe as absurd as a burger king uniform. Everyone likes free and sponsored content would allow more people would see it and pay attention to it than an icon next to someone elses achievements. Seriously who over the age of 18 really gives a flip about achievements anyway? Do people actually take the time to browse other peoples achievements? Assuming 10% (thats probably very generous) do how many actually take time to read them? So who exactly are they advertising to?
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This sounds alot like what has happened in the past with Paladium and WoC. Though im sure I will piss off some diehard ccg players and d&d geeks, face it their business if not dying is surely shrinking. Rather than embrace the technologies that are making them irrelevent they have chosen to mostly ignore them and instead bolster attempts to "protect" what they have to the point of turning away their audience.
If it was my film i'd swap some of the characters around..throw in a semi rediculous sub plot and call it satire.
Last year one of my relatives gave everyone a plug and play game called Buzztime for christmas, its fun but disconnecting the existing consoles to plug it in to play one game is a bit of a pain. This sounds alot more spontaneous. Having access to Live means the game can be updated easily. Its proably not going to attract many of the traditional gamers but for the new casual gamers its sounds like a great way for the family to game together. I'ts gimmicky but I can see the controllers being used for other Licensed versions of popular games. Family Feud, Jeopardy, Who Wants To Be A Millionaire and tons of others could be easily ported and play almost identically to the way it does on the TV shows. I think there will be a big market for it.
I'd rather see a presentation of real stuff that is coming out in the short term than a dog and pony show full of high hopes and maybes. Remember last years Ridge Racer and Gran Turismo hoopla from Sony or how about Nintendo's demo with Mario 128 and the realistic Zelda several years ago. Selling based on hype 2-3 years off isnt a way to expand your user base if anything it's saying "hold off on buying now...the good stuff is coming down the pipe in a couple years so wait for the price drops".
Are we talking about the same game? The one where the guy gets executed for apparently no reason at all only they just knock him out so some insane movie director can make snuff films by having the killer slaughter a town? I played about 30 minutes of it, I wouldnt ban it, but it was crap. I really recommend you see more movies if thats in the top 3 storylines for you.
Yep I have the Dreamcast version as well as Radiant Silvergun for my Saturn. Oddly enough im really not that into shooters usually, but those were just mesmerizing.
I have very fond memories of excite bike but was scared off by reviews, but then I did mention one of my current favorites was an absolute bomb review wise. I think I may have to pick that one up this weekend. :)
You hit the nail square on the head with that one. Sony's arrogance has cost them and their aim was way off for an ever expanding market. In my house we own a Wii and Ps2 and a 360, none of the kids have even mentioned a ps3 other than my son who asked why it was expensive. Gamers are getting older, the Atari generation has grown up. Nintendo has it right on the game and price side but is lacking on the online side, though there is time to catch up on that.
I wasn't aware that graphic murder was an art form. I'm curious as to who they believe will buy this? Usually over the top violent games appeal to angst ridden teens more than any other segment and removing that from the equation leaves either the fractional market that is "hardcore" buy anything controversial adults, the overly curious (who will most likely rent) and maybe the already psychologically disturbed (which will just lead to the next Jack Thompson lawsuit). I could be wrong but I would guess that most "grown-ups" wont buy this game.
AO does not mean the game is banned, it means that it has to carry an Adults Only rating. Several businesses such as Wal-Mart and Target refuse to carry AO titles, they also refuse to carry Adult Films and Porno Mags as well but those genres continue to thrive. If the game is good enough to stand on its own merit then it should be able to find an audience even if it ended up as a Gamestop exclusive. The bigger hurdle is that Sony and Nintendo refuse to carry AO titles, they are the ones being the nanny here not the ESRB.
The sad thing is that Rockstar and Take Two knew this from the beginning and set out to make a game as over the top as possible. They seem to relish in their position as the bad boys of gaming seeing that the only game they have published that was not mired in controversy was that Table Tennis game that completely flopped. This is another way to grab headlines and get some press, don't feel sorry for them. In the end the game will probably have a few cut scenes removed that they never intended to publish anyway and the game will get an "M".
Don't be a jackass, you managed to twist what I said and still proved my point. Madden and the like tend to appeal to the wider audience which is mostly the casual ones...the ones that by Licensed movie games, GTA whatever and the bigger blockbuster titles. The gamers I am referring to are the ones that figure one copy of Madden is enough since not much changes with it from year to year. Final Fantasy is a good example, the last one I picked up was Final Fantasy 9, but its popular but most argue that it lives off reputation now more than anything new or groundbreaking. I just spoke from example, most people I know that are really into sports games enough to buy Madden year after year are pretty much only into sports games, its almost like a niche of its own. I did not call anyone a looser or insult them, I just expressed that most that are not considered "casual" gamers tend to look for more diversity in their gaming experience. If you felt singled out as one of the sports games fans with only sports games in your game collection I humbly apologize.
But as was the case with many of failed but highly rated games out there (like Iko, Ikaruga, Psychonauts, Rez, etc) the "hardcore" gamers were the only ones that bought them. Sequels do sell if done well, but while you can blame the existence of things like Halo2 and Resident Evil whatever on the "hardcore" segment you can just as easily blame the casual segment for the lack of Ico, Beyond Good and Evil or World at War sequels.
Your reading a bit too much into that...I don't concider myself a "hardcore" gamer by that definition. Your defining fanboy's, IMHO a "hardcore" gamer is one who likes depth, replay value, storyline, a different experience and overall fun. I want Oblivions, ICOs, Halos, Ikarugas, Guitar Heros, etc. What I dont want is 50 versions of the same old thing.
The article made the point that game complexity was going away in favor of more Brain Age, Tetris and Nintendogs. The Wii is great example right now, I have one and like it alot, my kids play every day on it but after Zelda and Wii Sports I havent found much more to entertain me enough to play without the kids. We own Wario, Rayman, Mario Party and Wii play and to me they might as well have been named Wii Sports 2,3,4 and 5 there is little diversity.
Oh wow...cant believe I fogot that one. Anyway 3 decently selling FPS console games in 3 console generations doesnt exactly count for much of a glut IMHO.
Wow i've never heard of Sports games being labled as "hardcore" most gamers concider sports games to be the lamest genre in videogames sure madden sells, but look at the audience it sells to and most of those seem to console owners that have nothing but the previous years madden and a handful of other sports games. Beyond Halo, has their ever been a top selling FPS on a console? I know there are alot of them but most of the ones I have seen end up in the bargain bin after a couple months.
Gamers carried the console manufacturers before the "casual" gaming boom and will be the ones who carry it afterwards. There are have been numerous casual gaming era's before and though they make for interesting blips in the manufacturers and developers bottom line, they don't last. Anyone remember the early 80's? The biggest contributor to the great video game crash of 83 was the over abundance of crap in the marketplace. Abandoning the "hardcore" gamer market which has higher expectations, demands more complexity and can not be fooled by licensing deals and pretty graphics sounds like a great idea in the short term but in the long term will only lead to disaster for the industry again. There is a place for casual gaming, and a great opportunity to introduce the non- initiated to gaming, but it's just that an introduction.
While its nice for him to admit that EA is contributing to the glut of shovelware, his "solution" concerns me. I for one would rather have a game that is so long I give up and never finish than pay that same $50-$60 for a game that is too easy and lasts an hour and a half. Yes there is a huge market for casual gaming but thats a very fickle audience one that will just as easily abandon it as soon as the next thing hits. The actual gamer is a smaller niche but was able to carry consoles and PC's before the current casual gaming bubble and will be the market that carries them after the bubble bursts, so its best not to abandon them completely.
Nielsen has been loosing importance since the advent of cable tv. Its been a long slow decline into irrelevency, this is just another attemt to find relevancy. The method of "rating" shows just how out of touch they are. I really dont think Google has anything to worry about.
Both have their place. I admit to hitting up the blogs when I just want to find out what is going on, but if something hold my interest I will normally dig and find real articles about the story. I can see why Journalists are concerned though, many times I will find a story with the amount of detail I need and then see it on the more "reputable" sites days later. There has to be a happy medium, unfortunately many of the more traditional outlets havent figured out a good way to do that.
Friday, The Cat Who Walked Through Walls, Stranger In A Strange Land, The Moon Is A Harsh Mistress, Citizen of the Galaxy and Methuselah's Children are all fantastic starters for someone just discovering Heinlein. If you want Heinlein at his weirdest check out All You Zombies.
Most of Heinlein's works take place in a future that doesnt seem too far out of reach. Granted most of it was written in an era where people believed in the possibility of life in our own solar system so there are lots of Martians, Venusians, etc but once you get past that the stories stand up remarkably well. He was much more into characterization than scientific gobbledy gook which helps keep it from being too dated.
I was at the Centennial celebration yesterday. Some great authors are on hand signing books and discussing Heinlein's influence. Still no word on a Stranger In A Strange Land movie. The atmosphere there was kind of like a Star Trek convention without the freaks. I managed to get Spider Robinson to sign my first edition Callhoon's Crosstime Saloon. And Alan Steele Signed my Ace edition Orbital Decay as well as a Editors Proof of All-American Alien Boy. That alone was worth the price of admission for me. Robin Wayne-Bailey, James Gunn and David Gerrold were attending as well but were not signing while I was there.
BTW for Heinlein fans I really recommend Spider and Allen for those that like Heinlein's early stuff the influence is obvious in their writing. Both deal more with what if near future better than most anyone else in the genre.
For those that are more into the deeper novel era of Heinlein's writings Robin Wayne Bailey and James Gunn are both good choices.
BTW the surprise guest speaker is Ray Bradbury unfortunately its via satellite due to health reasons like Arthur C Clarke's presentation. Both are happening today.
If your so desperate to see a movie that you will watch a crappy copy of something someone took with a camcorder complete with the Mystery Science Theatre 3000 audience view in the bottom of the screen then just pay for $7 or wait for the DVD like everyone else. I have a friend that does this and is always asking if I want to watch some crap movie I wouldnt have paid to see, then claims he is doing it because he is anti-mpaa. If your really anti-mpaa then you wont bother to see it at all, just the fact that someone wastes an hour downloading a poor quality bootleg proves that it has some value to them. Its hard to fight increasing restrictions on fair use when bozos like this continue to make the MPAA's point for them.
Oh ok I get it now...you mean like with the Sony laptop batteries where the problem was denied and blamed on the consumer for years until people actually got hurt...got it.
This happens with every company its not like its a MS centric thing. Regardless of the problems its still the best options as far as doing anything much beyond looking prett at the moment. The 3 years extension also gives some piece of mind. My only point was that there isnt much more they can do at this point, the console is out there, they have admitted there is a problem, they are offering to fix it on their dime. Do you realize how costly this is? The dragging it out and "investigating" that was done was for the same reasons sony drug its heels on the laptop battery problem, you have to find a solution before you can offer to fix and you have to find out what was wrong to prevent the fix from having the same problems.
How can admitting a problem, offering to fix and offering a warranty extension longer than any other console hurt their good will? If anything I believe it will get some that were on the fence about the 360 to buy one now.
Why buy a 360? A great library of games far better than the competition and a price that far lower (please dont argue the symantecs of a bluray player that most of us dont care about, im not buying the hd-addon for the 360 either).
so far most games just look better. Look at the EA sports offerings this year, the 360 versions look sharper and run at 60 frames a second, the ps3 versions run at 30. Supposedly that due to the learning curve of programming to the cel processor. Fanboys will argue that once they figure that out games wil blow the competition away, but every console has eeked out better graphics and performance over the course of its life, another year of figuring out the cel is another year or tweaking with the 360's processors as well.
What about the time a person with PTSD spent thinking about the events that caused the PTSD to start with. I might see this working if its administered immediately after a traumatic event but PTSD sometimes isnt diagnosed until much later sometimes years. What happens to all the time after, if you cant remember what happened to cause your meltdown, but remember being in the psych ward years later? Just sounds like trading one sort of trama for another.
Which other game has cranked out clones, sequels and spinoff's like Pong has. Heck this year Rockstar got into the game with Table Tennis and pong is an essential part of Wii Play. Sure its simple but its basically what started it all and its simplicity is still being borrowed from today.
If they really wanted to make an impact and get advertising dollars, why not have sponsors for the nickle and dime downloads they offer in marketplace, things like backgounds, skins, etc. Cars for Forza sponsored by the car companies, new outfits for Hitman maybe as absurd as a burger king uniform. Everyone likes free and sponsored content would allow more people would see it and pay attention to it than an icon next to someone elses achievements. Seriously who over the age of 18 really gives a flip about achievements anyway? Do people actually take the time to browse other peoples achievements? Assuming 10% (thats probably very generous) do how many actually take time to read them? So who exactly are they advertising to?
http://www.gamesindustry.biz/content_page.php?aid= 26340
Seems paying for exclusivity is ok but only if you call it "collaboration"