If his main problem was gnome-ppp (yea, I know the main problem really was documentation), the linux GUI isn't so bad. I can also say that gnome-ppp wasn't that easy to use, as you had to make the scripts yourself. The fact that you have a gui editor didn't help. Is there a way to have it automaticly generate those scripts.
Redhat PPP was simple. Just run "netcfg" as root. Give it domain name servers, phone number, username, password, and tell it what port your modem is on. It is almost as easy to use as a ppp configurator reasonably could be. And I am pretty sure VAResearch comes with redhat.
These DE's would improve linux's usability. It is simple for them to add an app to the menu (if it is done automaticly). They get a nice file manager, with D&D. And configuration of the desktop's appearence is easy as well. Though I agree the improvement isn't much above a WM with a lot of support tools (like a simple WindowMaker with WMconf), it's something.
Gnome, as of 1.0.5 (gnome-core) defaults to the KDE menu being in/usr/share/apps. Very odd, as that is also the location of gnomes apps in the RPMS, and I doubt many people have kde installed in/usr.
If you compile gnome-core from source, configure it like "./configure --with-kde-datadir=/opt/share" (I think thats the flag, something like that.)
This is an honest question: where do you get DTP stuff for linux. Also, illistration software (I don't really need an answer for this, tgif seems good, though I am not professional enough to judge it with commercial competitors)
After using linux for a little while, that cruddy little system of doing right clicks, menu, cut, right menu.... on and on, gets anoying when in windows. Use linux for a while, and you will almost forget it.
Also, the keyboard shortcuts can do cut and paste. Like I can right click a mail URL from netscape, and copy it in balsa with "SHIFT+INS". I use balsa, a gnome app, to show that it is pretty consistent with most X apps. If the app isn't consistent with that, and it's a big deal to you, don't use it. (however, netscape used to crash when when using "SHIFT+INS". Lets see if works with the 4.51 version after I click submit).
By anybody who doesn't know what the gimp is, or its printing problems, this relates only to people who need to make magazines, brouchers, etc. It should be fine for making images to print out for a report or the like.
That is why you shouldn't say gimp in a reply to "wheres photoshop." Still, gimp would be good to artsy people who want to make digital art, web pages, games, lots of stuff that just doesn't need to be printed. Its not a toy just becuase you can't do whatever you want with it. I hear that toy remark sometimes, not from this guy though.
How do I know to click the right mouse button. Plus, most can do it by clicking 2 the left+right buttons together (yea, I know this is a mac article, but the people with linux on a mac must do something like that).
Well, at least you had like the first version of GLQuake if I remember.
The Comparison (KDE vs GNOME)
on
CDE vs Gnome
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· Score: 1
What does it matter what slashdot puts on. Even the gnome sight linked to that mingco article, the most scaving of the ones you pointed out (the predawnia says its biased, so forget that).
GNOME really can be stable, and I would bet it is stable on most peoples machines. I have heard just as many stories about KDE being worse that windows 95 as far as crashing. Try it out, it must have worked well on some peoples machines (like mine).
The only reall thing you gave said gave KDE an edge in functionality was KOffice and the object model that KDE plans to use in it. KOffice is probably not usable (or it would be released, right?). Some would think the actuall desktop envirement of gnome is more functional (minus the web browser featured in KFM). Becuase of the multiple panels for example.
Please don't laugh, but I think that GNOME apps look more elegent and clean looking that KDE apps. Really, they don't have a lot of clutter, and the icons a very consistent (reused, whatever). GTK and E have some nice looking (though many times very ugly) themes, but they aren't gnome.
On the speed issue, you might be right, just maybe as I don't use KDE 1.1 alot. Though as for memory, typing free in gnome, and then in kde reveals the truth. I leave it up to you to test yourself.
Toolkit features, most apps that I use have printing support, so it doesn't matter to me as a user. I guess you mean that any QT window can be made into postscript, without having to use something like the gnome canvas. And I haven't tried programming in QT or KDE, so wouldn't know. (useless paragraph, just so I hit every point). Ask again for what gnome apps I use if you care.
The first few problems are with E. Try using e-conf to change it around, which I ran to change it to include the features you talk about. I run with icewm, and I can move windows to other desktops, see whats happening in other desktops with the gnome-pager, yada yada.
Make links by dragging files or directories with the middle mouse button (or use the left+right button which I have to do). Ohh yea, the balsa on the balsa web site is old, get the version from the gnome sources directory on the gnome ftp mirrors.
Is there a file format spec available? Or how about plug-ins? At least 3DS (and most other big 3D programs) have that. Without it, Blender looses a lot (no need to explain?).
Been said, but this probably means Blender will not ever be going open source. To bad, as the first thing I would do if it was would be to look at the file format. Maybe others would add plug-in support.
By the way, does blender have plug-ins yet. It would help, as Blender is useless for making interactive 3D at the moment (ok games:).
I am impressed with your modeller, as it seems to have real animation support now. When could we expect a release. I am not a developer, just sortof a leach, but I know basic C++ (what you are using). I agree, whatever you do, don't start a new modeller, as there are tons out, that aren't getting anywere.
Do you think Redhat will include the version of qt that is open sourced in 6.0? I doubt it. As I see it, nothing is different for Redhat, so why would they include KDE now?
KDE I guess is striving to be instantly usable by any one comming from windows95. I can say this about GNOME too. I am prone to saying the hell with any desktop that makes me learn how to use a windowing system all over again.
It might just be gdm, unless they have just said the hell with that being their default desktop (which I doubt).
So Gnome has bugs...but why no 1.0.3 RPMs?
on
GNOME-steaders
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· Score: 1
Those gnome-rpms in starbucks are compiled against glib-2.1 (I guess you knew that). Well, I bet people have them on their redhat systems right now, using rpms they made from the SRPMS on redhat.
I think gnome needs a little system to accept RPMS from other people. I have made gnome 1.0.3 rpms, fixed specs, and all of that, but were to send them. This might be a real solution to most, as they don't have time to recompile stuff on there computer.
Are you sure that 95% can't install it. This guy didn't have any big problems, which goes for lot's of people. Really, some people can just install it with rpm -Uvh * (not me though). Comments directly proportional to quality? Gnome's release got well over 1000 comments here (mostly flames):
Well, I still think genesis one the hole 16bit thing. It wasn't a failure like the master system. Gamegear was fine, it just cost money. You could play street fighter on it, which automaticly made it good.
Get control-center-1.0.2, fixed that swalling thing (happens when you clicked stuff to fast). rpm -tb on the tarball worked fine. Gmc, well, they should set back it's version number, at least to 0.90.
I just can't beleive it. Even the gnome detracter will say gnome lasted 15 minutes. Mine last all day. Something must be wrong with your system. Ive never heard of this, even on slashdot.
Slashdot Mirror
If his main problem was gnome-ppp (yea, I know the main problem really was documentation), the linux GUI isn't so bad. I can also say that gnome-ppp wasn't that easy to use, as you had to make the scripts yourself. The fact that you have a gui editor didn't help. Is there a way to have it automaticly generate those scripts.
Redhat PPP was simple. Just run "netcfg" as root. Give it domain name servers, phone number, username, password, and tell it what port your modem is on. It is almost as easy to use as a ppp configurator reasonably could be. And I am pretty sure VAResearch comes with redhat.
These DE's would improve linux's usability. It is simple for them to add an app to the menu (if it is done automaticly). They get a nice file manager, with D&D. And configuration of the desktop's appearence is easy as well. Though I agree the improvement isn't much above a WM with a lot of support tools (like a simple WindowMaker with WMconf), it's something.
Gnome, as of 1.0.5 (gnome-core) defaults to the KDE menu being in /usr/share/apps. Very odd, as that is also the location of gnomes apps in the RPMS, and I doubt many people have kde installed in /usr.
If you compile gnome-core from source, configure it like "./configure --with-kde-datadir=/opt/share" (I think thats the flag, something like that.)
This is an honest question: where do you get DTP stuff for linux. Also, illistration software (I don't really need an answer for this, tgif seems good, though I am not professional enough to judge it with commercial competitors)
guess what happened.
However, the SHIFT,CTRL,INS,DEL combos work in gnome apps, emacs, rxvt, and probably more, I just don't use much else besides those.
After using linux for a little while, that cruddy little system of doing right clicks, menu, cut, right menu .... on and on, gets anoying when in windows. Use linux for a while, and you will almost forget it.
Also, the keyboard shortcuts can do cut and paste. Like I can right click a mail URL from netscape, and copy it in balsa with "SHIFT+INS". I use balsa, a gnome app, to show that it is pretty consistent with most X apps. If the app isn't consistent with that, and it's a big deal to you, don't use it. (however, netscape used to crash when when using "SHIFT+INS". Lets see if works with the 4.51 version after I click submit).
By anybody who doesn't know what the gimp is, or its printing problems, this relates only to people who need to make magazines, brouchers, etc. It should be fine for making images to print out for a report or the like.
That is why you shouldn't say gimp in a reply to "wheres photoshop." Still, gimp would be good to artsy people who want to make digital art, web pages, games, lots of stuff that just doesn't need to be printed. Its not a toy just becuase you can't do whatever you want with it. I hear that toy remark sometimes, not from this guy though.
How do I know to click the right mouse button. Plus, most can do it by clicking 2 the left+right buttons together (yea, I know this is a mac article, but the people with linux on a mac must do something like that).
Well, at least you had like the first version of GLQuake if I remember.
What does it matter what slashdot puts on. Even the gnome sight linked to that mingco article, the most scaving of the ones you pointed out (the predawnia says its biased, so forget that).
GNOME really can be stable, and I would bet it is stable on most peoples machines. I have heard just as many stories about KDE being worse that windows 95 as far as crashing. Try it out, it must have worked well on some peoples machines (like mine).
The only reall thing you gave said gave KDE an edge in functionality was KOffice and the object model that KDE plans to use in it. KOffice is probably not usable (or it would be released, right?). Some would think the actuall desktop envirement of gnome is more functional (minus the web browser featured in KFM). Becuase of the multiple panels for example.
Please don't laugh, but I think that GNOME apps look more elegent and clean looking that KDE apps. Really, they don't have a lot of clutter, and the icons a very consistent (reused, whatever). GTK and E have some nice looking (though many times very ugly) themes, but they aren't gnome.
On the speed issue, you might be right, just maybe as I don't use KDE 1.1 alot. Though as for memory, typing free in gnome, and then in kde reveals the truth. I leave it up to you to test yourself.
Toolkit features, most apps that I use have printing support, so it doesn't matter to me as a user. I guess you mean that any QT window can be made into postscript, without having to use something like the gnome canvas. And I haven't tried programming in QT or KDE, so wouldn't know. (useless paragraph, just so I hit every point). Ask again for what gnome apps I use if you care.
The first few problems are with E. Try using e-conf to change it around, which I ran to change it to include the features you talk about. I run with icewm, and I can move windows to other desktops, see whats happening in other desktops with the gnome-pager, yada yada.
Make links by dragging files or directories with the middle mouse button (or use the left+right button which I have to do). Ohh yea, the balsa on the balsa web site is old, get the version from the gnome sources directory on the gnome ftp mirrors.
Is there a file format spec available? Or how about plug-ins? At least 3DS (and most other big 3D programs) have that. Without it, Blender looses a lot (no need to explain?).
Been said, but this probably means Blender will not ever be going open source. To bad, as the first thing I would do if it was would be to look at the file format. Maybe others would add plug-in support.
By the way, does blender have plug-ins yet. It would help, as Blender is useless for making interactive 3D at the moment (ok games:).
I am impressed with your modeller, as it seems to have real animation support now. When could we expect a release. I am not a developer, just sortof a leach, but I know basic C++ (what you are using).
I agree, whatever you do, don't start a new modeller, as there are tons out, that aren't getting anywere.
Do you think Redhat will include the version of qt that is open sourced in 6.0? I doubt it. As I see it, nothing is different for Redhat, so why would they include KDE now?
KDE I guess is striving to be instantly usable by any one comming from windows95. I can say this about GNOME too. I am prone to saying the hell with any desktop that makes me learn how to use a windowing system all over again.
It might just be gdm, unless they have just said the hell with that being their default desktop (which I doubt).
Those gnome-rpms in starbucks are compiled against glib-2.1 (I guess you knew that). Well, I bet people have them on their redhat systems right now, using rpms they made from the SRPMS on redhat.
I think gnome needs a little system to accept RPMS from other people. I have made gnome 1.0.3 rpms, fixed specs, and all of that, but were to send them. This might be a real solution to most, as they don't have time to recompile stuff on there computer.
Was KDE out of redhat becuase it Qt wasn't open source, or becuase it was incompatible with the GPL?
Tough shit:)
Are you sure that 95% can't install it. This guy didn't have any big problems, which goes for lot's of people. Really, some people can just install it with rpm -Uvh * (not me though).
Comments directly proportional to quality? Gnome's release got well over 1000 comments here (mostly flames):
Well, I still think genesis one the hole 16bit thing. It wasn't a failure like the master system. Gamegear was fine, it just cost money. You could play street fighter on it, which automaticly made it good.
Get control-center-1.0.2, fixed that swalling thing (happens when you clicked stuff to fast). rpm -tb on the tarball worked fine. Gmc, well, they should set back it's version number, at least to 0.90.
I just can't beleive it. Even the gnome detracter will say gnome lasted 15 minutes. Mine last all day. Something must be wrong with your system. Ive never heard of this, even on slashdot.