Why bother? Get them grounded in something that won't be obsolete with the next language fad. You know, real science, real knowledge, something that will help them build their analytical and judgement skills.
Such a foundation of programming based on logic, rather than a specific language? I don't approach any program based on how to best write it in one language. I approach programming as what are the operations I need to convert the given inputs to the necessary outputs. Then I'll look at what the language supports for data structures and other methods to simplify development. I've written programs in c like languages for years and I always have to look up specific implementations because I don't memorize languages, I figure out the best abstract constructs and then look up how to implement those.
Real programming is not impacted by what language it works, just like real science doesn't care what language you speak.
I don't understand why you were voted down, but this. They need a solid background before starting programming.
Why do they need this before they start programming? Why can't programming be an opportunity to learn these other things? Have the students program something fun or useful and then integrate the math and logic lessons in with the programming. They'll likely retain it much better if it's taught as part of a larger useful project rather than just through a series of lectures.
Fully agree with this. The way programming is usually taught does require a solid background in logic and math. But a programming language could teach this, instead of requiring it as a prerequisite.
I've thought of making an abstract language based on something like the warcraft resource gathering. First teach the students to call a basic function like "cut and gather nearby wood". The program will automatically move the character to the nearest tree, cut it down and bring it to the base. Then add repetition, "cut and gather nearby wood 10 times". Then perhaps conditions, "cut and gather nearby wood if gathered less than 20".
This above only teaches general concepts but from there we could move to more specific concepts. Start breaking down these generic functions down. "cut and gather nearby wood" is broken down to teach the student how the program finds the nearest tree, how it cuts down the tree, how it picks up and returns the wood, etc.
I feel like a lot of programming teaches too much from the bottom up. "Here is the most basic, low level, operation in programming. Let's figure out how to make a complex program out of it." Instead I feel like programmers would benefit from starting programming from the high level. How out outline a program without regard for the language you implement it in, then you implement it. With this approach you don't even need full understanding of the language, you can get very far on a brand new language with a simple reference manual.
I had a number of files on copy.com when I found out deleting the parent of my local folder for copy.com, before disconnecting it, blew away all of the files stored online. And given I wasn't the owner of the account I had no access to undelete. Fortunately the most vital stuff was also backed up elsewhere but was not particularly thrilled, taught me that one local backup + online backup may not always be sufficient when the online version auto updates.
It wasn't found in the search area so your conclusion is it isn't there?
Granted ocean searches are hard so it could still be there and this is more a gripe against the title, rather than the article is about images of possible airplane debris in a new location.
A high school student working at a below living wage is doing a job that could be done by an adult at a living wage. Same for every other example. By paying these people less, you give the companies an incentive to use them instead, reducing the job pool for adults and driving down wages for everyone.
If the job isn't important enough for you to pay them a living wage for, then the job isn't important enough to society for it to be done.
So no such thing as an entry job meant for people to learn how to work so they can move onto real jobs? And we seem to have convinced businesses hat if the job isn't important enough to pay a living wage, it isn't important enough to hire a human.
OOP in an non OOP environment works just fine. The main issue is most with OOP learn the basic concepts and apply them with too broad of a brush. Just because an object makes sense in the current context, doesn't mean it is the best method of data encapsulation or that inheritance really makes sense in the given program.
And developing for the full program life cycle isn't just a problem with new developers. In most jobs I've worked in, management doesn't care to give time for proper code architecture. Everything is just shoehorned together as quickly as possible with minimal time for developers to do things right. Management never wants the program written so it works good once complete, it just wants the latest feature added as quickly as possible.
There are a lot of people who confuse university with a job training program
No top tier tech company accepts many new engineers without these credentials. Like it or not, it is a training program.
College doesn't train you to work but how to learn, completing college is simply an indicator to industry that you are most likely trainable. I learned plenty of basic theory in college but most everything that matters in my job did not come from college but from learning on the job. The best thing my college could do is make me understand what they taught me was not the end of my learning but just the beginning.
Some of us have no way to legally see it, so torrents are the only option.
I've got ways to see it but paying for HBO is just annoying so I don't bother (to pay, or see it). I gave up after the fourth season or somewhere near there.
Want to try to sue for specific performance on that 15% pay cut? I bet you really don't, given the chances and amount of any potential win.
Yeah, I threatened them, they threatened to send their lawyers after me for breach of the noncompete. I found working elsewhere for a year, then coming back to be cheaper. I've been working for the same customer they said I could work for going on seven years now after the year away.
Well one side of my previous contract basically said if I've walked past the type of work while working for them, I can't perform the work for someone else. The other side said there would be no changes to pay without a discussion involving both myself and my employer. A few days after I started they cut everyone's paycheck 15% across the board. When I left to work for a different division of the customer with someone else, guess which part of the contract was all anyone looked at?
Yeah but support it ourselves requires paying someone to support it. This requires more tax money. Keeping an old version of windows and not paying for upgrades is still cheaper, until the bottom falls out anyway.
Slashdot Mirror
Why bother? Get them grounded in something that won't be obsolete with the next language fad. You know, real science, real knowledge, something that will help them build their analytical and judgement skills.
Such a foundation of programming based on logic, rather than a specific language? I don't approach any program based on how to best write it in one language. I approach programming as what are the operations I need to convert the given inputs to the necessary outputs. Then I'll look at what the language supports for data structures and other methods to simplify development. I've written programs in c like languages for years and I always have to look up specific implementations because I don't memorize languages, I figure out the best abstract constructs and then look up how to implement those.
Real programming is not impacted by what language it works, just like real science doesn't care what language you speak.
I don't understand why you were voted down, but this. They need a solid background before starting programming.
Why do they need this before they start programming? Why can't programming be an opportunity to learn these other things? Have the students program something fun or useful and then integrate the math and logic lessons in with the programming. They'll likely retain it much better if it's taught as part of a larger useful project rather than just through a series of lectures.
Fully agree with this. The way programming is usually taught does require a solid background in logic and math. But a programming language could teach this, instead of requiring it as a prerequisite.
I've thought of making an abstract language based on something like the warcraft resource gathering. First teach the students to call a basic function like "cut and gather nearby wood". The program will automatically move the character to the nearest tree, cut it down and bring it to the base. Then add repetition, "cut and gather nearby wood 10 times". Then perhaps conditions, "cut and gather nearby wood if gathered less than 20".
This above only teaches general concepts but from there we could move to more specific concepts. Start breaking down these generic functions down. "cut and gather nearby wood" is broken down to teach the student how the program finds the nearest tree, how it cuts down the tree, how it picks up and returns the wood, etc.
I feel like a lot of programming teaches too much from the bottom up. "Here is the most basic, low level, operation in programming. Let's figure out how to make a complex program out of it." Instead I feel like programmers would benefit from starting programming from the high level. How out outline a program without regard for the language you implement it in, then you implement it. With this approach you don't even need full understanding of the language, you can get very far on a brand new language with a simple reference manual.
I had a number of files on copy.com when I found out deleting the parent of my local folder for copy.com, before disconnecting it, blew away all of the files stored online. And given I wasn't the owner of the account I had no access to undelete. Fortunately the most vital stuff was also backed up elsewhere but was not particularly thrilled, taught me that one local backup + online backup may not always be sufficient when the online version auto updates.
It wasn't found in the search area so your conclusion is it isn't there?
Granted ocean searches are hard so it could still be there and this is more a gripe against the title, rather than the article is about images of possible airplane debris in a new location.
I agree, those who forget the past... at the same time, violence isn't a good answer either.
A high school student working at a below living wage is doing a job that could be done by an adult at a living wage. Same for every other example. By paying these people less, you give the companies an incentive to use them instead, reducing the job pool for adults and driving down wages for everyone.
If the job isn't important enough for you to pay them a living wage for, then the job isn't important enough to society for it to be done.
So no such thing as an entry job meant for people to learn how to work so they can move onto real jobs? And we seem to have convinced businesses hat if the job isn't important enough to pay a living wage, it isn't important enough to hire a human.
They got a warrant... What is supposed to happen if the government is investigating criminal activity?
Sounds good. Next time a masked man robs a bank, why don't the city police get a search warrant to search everyone's homes for the stolen money?
The Trump administration is collecting the names of these people so he can finally prove there were actually 1,3 million people at his inauguration.
1.3 million protesters?
At least sometimes now, when the justice department trounces on our rights, we hear about it.
Interesting article on bit coins.
They've finally decided to make a coin for the American unit of currency commonly called a "bit"?
Meh, I make a living trading bits for coin.
Sigh, mental auto-correct. 28 years of thinking the words bit and coin should always be separate.
Interesting article on bit coins. Now what about this battery free phone?
OOP in an non OOP environment works just fine. The main issue is most with OOP learn the basic concepts and apply them with too broad of a brush. Just because an object makes sense in the current context, doesn't mean it is the best method of data encapsulation or that inheritance really makes sense in the given program.
And developing for the full program life cycle isn't just a problem with new developers. In most jobs I've worked in, management doesn't care to give time for proper code architecture. Everything is just shoehorned together as quickly as possible with minimal time for developers to do things right. Management never wants the program written so it works good once complete, it just wants the latest feature added as quickly as possible.
There are a lot of people who confuse university with a job training program
No top tier tech company accepts many new engineers without these credentials. Like it or not, it is a training program.
College doesn't train you to work but how to learn, completing college is simply an indicator to industry that you are most likely trainable. I learned plenty of basic theory in college but most everything that matters in my job did not come from college but from learning on the job. The best thing my college could do is make me understand what they taught me was not the end of my learning but just the beginning.
Some of us have no way to legally see it, so torrents are the only option.
I've got ways to see it but paying for HBO is just annoying so I don't bother (to pay, or see it). I gave up after the fourth season or somewhere near there.
Sorry for growing up in the wrong hemisphere but I'm just confused by the American usage of the word 'trolley'.
It just looks like a 'mini-bus' to me.
Don't worry, this Michigander is also confused by the usage. We would just call it a bus.
Ever see a "severability" clause?
Want to try to sue for specific performance on that 15% pay cut? I bet you really don't, given the chances and amount of any potential win.
Yeah, I threatened them, they threatened to send their lawyers after me for breach of the noncompete. I found working elsewhere for a year, then coming back to be cheaper. I've been working for the same customer they said I could work for going on seven years now after the year away.
Well one side of my previous contract basically said if I've walked past the type of work while working for them, I can't perform the work for someone else. The other side said there would be no changes to pay without a discussion involving both myself and my employer. A few days after I started they cut everyone's paycheck 15% across the board. When I left to work for a different division of the customer with someone else, guess which part of the contract was all anyone looked at?
2% off every transaction? https://www.fidelity.com/cash-...
paying a monthly bill to Microsoft for Windows? Feels funky to me. Very funky...
$2 a month? I could live with that, more, not so much.
Also a bit older event in a different part of the country: http://www.mlive.com/news/inde...
Should have said rapid underpopulation of the human race, wont help Earth much...
- Going to Mars will somehow alleviate overpopulation on Earth
Going to Mars is meant to prevent rapid underpopulation of Earth the next time a major disaster occurs, it wont do anything for overpopulation.
And wouldn't that be just terrible. God knows how our culture could possibly survive allowing a few young girls come here.
I know some young male programmers that would likely turn into babbling idiots. This could seriously lower productivity.
Yeah but support it ourselves requires paying someone to support it. This requires more tax money. Keeping an old version of windows and not paying for upgrades is still cheaper, until the bottom falls out anyway.