Sorry, but American rocketry, and the American space program, was built by imported Germans.
Actually it would be more accurate to say that American rocketry and the American space program was kick started by imported Germans.
The "germans" had more experience in actual implementation of rocket engines, rocket flight control, etc. then anyone else at the time so the US leveraged that experience. We had plenty of theoretical knowledge in this space at the time in the US and had started to implement based on the knowledge but the powers that be decided to leverage experience over develop our own fully.
Actually the bullet points you put up don't fully hold in this context. Think of it this way, a book is a book right?
Well... what if your school only gave you Shakespeare to read would that not be limiting your exposure to the broader literary world and hence not serving the students education.
With computers you have differing paradigms of user interface, different application spaces, capabilities, etc. Being single source can be limiting in a fashion as would only providing Shakespeare (not as grievous of an issue of course but...).
Yes but do you know for the fact that a given dual-link output on the 6800 will correctly fall back to being single-link when a single-link only device is connected?
I cannot find conformation of that in any docs, ideally it should but...
oops... I read your "single dual-link" as "single-link" in your statement "A single dual-link DVI-I port can drive any DVI-I monitor, so the answer to the grandparent is Yes, as long as you get the ADC -> DVI adapter.".
A single dual-link DVI-I port can drive any DVI-I monitor, so the answer to the grandparent is Yes, as long as you get the ADC -> DVI adapter.
Actually this isn't true or we wouldn't have dual-link for example. It depends on the resolution and refresh rate, basically the bandwidth needs of the display.
Also... DVI-I = connector carrying both a digital and analog signal DVI-D = connector carrying just a digital signal DVI-A = connector carrying just analog (extra to DVI specification)
For the digital aspect of DVI connections you can have either single-link or dual-link (supported by either DVI-I or DVI-D connectors, at least fully connected ones). So don't confuse DVI-D as implying dual-link, it just implies a digital only connector.
Apple's new displays use DVI-D connectors (at least that is what I recall seeing) with the 20" and 23" screens using single-link and the 30" using dual-link. The older displays used ADC connectors (basically single-link DVI with pin out for usb and display power). Apple's DVI to ADC converter has a DVI-D connector on it (looked at the one under my desk). Apple doesn't provide a ADC to DVI converter but third parties do (also ones for ADC->VGA).
DVI -> ADC converter converts a DVI output to an ADC output (what you need to drive an ADC only monitor if you adapter doesn't sport ADC)
ADC -> DVI converter converts a ADC output to a DVI output
I am not sure if the adapter in question sports DVI-I or DVI-D outputs (traditionally I believe adapters have DVI-I, at least high end ones). You can plug a DVI-D cable into either a DVI-D or DVI-I output. Also having DVI-I outputs allows the easy split out of VGA if needed.
Nope I was trying to answer if the dual-link DVI-D connection on the adapter can be used to drive a single-link DVI-D expecting display. I believe he is asking if he can use the 6800 dual-link adapter to drive displays other then a 30" display.
It would require that the adapter understand that the connected display is single-link and hence not do the even/odd splitting. I don't know if the adapter supports that or not. Pin out wise it should work if the adapter does the right thing.
Yeah but whose fault is it if we keep voting these folks into (or back into) their seats.:-(
The electorate needs to more universally realize that we have to allow congress to make decisions that potentially adversely affect them [electorate] because it is more important for the country as a whole. We should be voting folks out if they don't do the right things for the country as a whole first and locally second not the other ways around (at least in my opinion).
We also need to boot folks that don't want to compromise and work more with each other across party lines... voting blindly along party lines (as appear to happen all to often) serves no purpose since the "right" path often lies at the cross roads between the party platforms.
Humm not fully sure... dual-link works by sending even and odd pixels for a given color channel down two different links. Single link transmits even and odd pixels over a single link.
Basically DVI defines 6 signal pairs for pixel data, in single-link 3 of the 6 are used, one for each color channel (RGB). In dual-link even pixels go down one bank of 3 while odds go down the other bank of 3.
From what I can see the channel definition for connections is the same for single-link and dual-link. So in theory it could work if the adapter could toggle between sending just even pixels to sending even and odd pixels on the first set of links.
Congress in notorious for misspending funds so I fully support having less funds for them to work with (tax cuts) and for that to force them to be responsible (well at least one can dream). To bad dot com tax revenue stream was a figment of folks imagination and that spending was not adjusted or spending increases even slowed much to make up for the difference, of course this compounded by the related recession, tax cuts, 9/11, etc.
The 30" monitors from Apple have a resolution that cannot be fed by a single-link DVI connection. So they use dual-link DVI. Both single-link and dual-link are part of the DVI 1.0 standard, nothing Apple specific about them.
The difference between single-link and dual-link is how many of the pins in the connector is used for transmitting data, in a nut shell 12 pins for the former and 24 pins for the later.
Apple is using DVI-D (digital only) DVI connectors with a dual-link pin out for the 30" display. So one dual-link DVI-D connection is capable of driving one 30" display. The 6800 adapter used for these displays provides two dual-link DVI-D outputs, so one adapter can drive two 30" displays.
Apple's margins on goods sold averaged about 27.8%, which is rather good for this industry. They spent 125 million on R&D and 354 on general operations, administrative and selling. That is what eats the remaining gross margins.
In general companies have some degree in freedom when it comes to operating expenses and companies that are trying to innovate and market will spend a lot of their profits doing just that.
So seeing low profit in comparison to revenue doesn't have to be a bad things nor is it in this case given the R&D budget (at this quarters rate Apple is spending 500 million a year on R&D), etc.
On the side note, the whole Mars thing seems bunk, when was the last time anybody even heard any other information about it? Maybe there'll be some more talk about Mars (talk is cheap) until November elections.
Why not read the report that was recently released (the report was the first step in the planning/feasibility validation of the directed goal)...
Weird. You sure you have enough RAM in your system?
For me app to app switch is fast and doesn't bog down like it could in Mac OS 9 if one of the applications was busy working on something.
Also with Safari things load and display faster then what I experience under Mac OS 9 or when using IE on Mac OS X.
In regards to running enough apps... on Mac OS 9 you only need to run one application that doesn't do cooperative scheduling very well and everything is screwed (IE is one example when facing any type of network delay).
Panther is, aggravatingly, still not nearly as responsive as OS 9 on the same hardware. They still have some way to go. I hope Tiger finally closes this gap.
Do you ever run more then one application at a time?
Mac OS X is far more responsive and efficient then Mac OS 9 under any amount of load.
For example look at the PowerPC architecture. It was designed from the get go to support 64b capable instructions with 32b subset of that. So with a 64b PPC chip no emulation mode exists and you can run 64b/32b code side by side (of course the OS needs to set bits to adjust expected control register behavior, overflow for 64b is different then 32b, etc. but no expensive mode switch is involved).
You see no penalty when running 32b code on a 64b PPC. In fact running a 32b (addressing wise) application could actually be faster then running a 64b (addressing wise) application on 64b capable PPC. This can happen because of the reduced size of pointer in the data stream, allow improved L1 & L2 cache hits for data, as well as a smaller data set. Also note one can use 64b math without the need for 64b addressing.
Of course if you want to leverage 64b math capabilities when running on a 64b capable processor then you need to compile with those options so your code switches to using 64b math instructions, etc.
Wow... you do realize that the "scorching heat" is cause by hitting the atmosphere which they are purposely using to slow down the shuttle, you need to bleed off the orbiting velocity. You the atmosphere is an efficient way of doing that and one that allow bleeding off of orbital velocity without exceeding acceleration limits of the space craft or the humans in it.
Now one could cary more fuel or generate such fuel on orbit (various method and theories for that) and use propulsion to counter act orbital velocity so the craft could descend out of orbit. Of course to do that enough propulsion needs to be used to negate the orbital velocity, if you want to keep "scorching heat" away, before the space craft is pulled into the atmosphere by gravity. The deceleration required to this is an issue and one that cannot be managed like one can do with heat using heat shielding, etc.
Humans and space craft can only handle so much acceleration before they are damaged.
Anyway Mr. AC what is your idea? And why do you think folks don't think about this stuff?
FYI, Quartz doesn't need any changing... it has always been resolution independent, it has always had the concept of user space and device space for drawing that allows for this resolution independence. For more information on Quartz 2D, etc. review the documentation.
Any element that isn't bitmap based (Quartz 2D paths, text, etc.) can be display at an arbitrary resolution (this is how printing currently works under Mac OS X). Regarding what appears to be bitmap elements, well I cannot comment further in regards to Tiger.
As for the NDA please follow it... in a way you did agree to it during the act of installing it (read the license that you clicked through in the installer). Just like folks want the GPL, etc. to be respected respect Apple's license/NDA.
Oops I meant to state in my prior post that any developers with a seed key should download the draft Tiger developer documentation from the ADC website. It covers lots of things talked about at WWDC that cannot be talked about in public.
Look under "Reference Library" in the downloads sections for the "Tiger Documentation" package. Note this doesn't clobber your currently install developer documentation and to view the docs you do NOT need Tiger installed. Also note that this document set is later then one provided on the Tiger preview DVD (but it is a sub-set of the total documentation, I would expect revised releases of this documentation set as we get close to Tigers release date).
I just wanted to note that Tiger has a lot of very cool stuff under the hood that is taking place that will be a boon for developers and by extension customers (of course this stuff is still currently under NDA).
It will be a great OS release... one that I feel will become a must have for every Macintosh user (with supported hardware). At least I hope it will be a must have because I really want to use some of he features that will exist to help speed the development and richness of applications.
These are screen shots from a developer release of an OS that will not be release until some time in 2005 (Apple is targeting first half of 05). So what you see may have no reflection on the final look of things nor show a complete implementation of any particular look.
Slashdot Mirror
I am more worried if it is paba free or not.
Sorry, but American rocketry, and the American space program, was built by imported Germans.
Actually it would be more accurate to say that American rocketry and the American space program was kick started by imported Germans.
The "germans" had more experience in actual implementation of rocket engines, rocket flight control, etc. then anyone else at the time so the US leveraged that experience. We had plenty of theoretical knowledge in this space at the time in the US and had started to implement based on the knowledge but the powers that be decided to leverage experience over develop our own fully.
Actually the bullet points you put up don't fully hold in this context. Think of it this way, a book is a book right?
Well... what if your school only gave you Shakespeare to read would that not be limiting your exposure to the broader literary world and hence not serving the students education.
With computers you have differing paradigms of user interface, different application spaces, capabilities, etc. Being single source can be limiting in a fashion as would only providing Shakespeare (not as grievous of an issue of course but...).
You do know about Apple's eMac right? (also the iBook)
Looks like Apple currently will sell schools a pack of 8 eMacs for under 5,000 dollars (aka under $625 a unit).
Obviously Dell and others do similar discounts but the prices that schools see are not really that different between main stream manufactures.
Yes but do you know for the fact that a given dual-link output on the 6800 will correctly fall back to being single-link when a single-link only device is connected?
I cannot find conformation of that in any docs, ideally it should but...
It was Taco Bell in the original US release. In a few non-US releases I guess they changed it to Pizza Hut.
oops... I read your "single dual-link" as "single-link" in your statement "A single dual-link DVI-I port can drive any DVI-I monitor, so the answer to the grandparent is Yes, as long as you get the ADC -> DVI adapter.".
A single dual-link DVI-I port can drive any DVI-I monitor, so the answer to the grandparent is Yes, as long as you get the ADC -> DVI adapter.
Actually this isn't true or we wouldn't have dual-link for example. It depends on the resolution and refresh rate, basically the bandwidth needs of the display.
Also...
DVI-I = connector carrying both a digital and analog signal
DVI-D = connector carrying just a digital signal
DVI-A = connector carrying just analog (extra to DVI specification)
For the digital aspect of DVI connections you can have either single-link or dual-link (supported by either DVI-I or DVI-D connectors, at least fully connected ones). So don't confuse DVI-D as implying dual-link, it just implies a digital only connector.
Apple's new displays use DVI-D connectors (at least that is what I recall seeing) with the 20" and 23" screens using single-link and the 30" using dual-link. The older displays used ADC connectors (basically single-link DVI with pin out for usb and display power). Apple's DVI to ADC converter has a DVI-D connector on it (looked at the one under my desk). Apple doesn't provide a ADC to DVI converter but third parties do (also ones for ADC->VGA).
DVI -> ADC converter converts a DVI output to an ADC output (what you need to drive an ADC only monitor if you adapter doesn't sport ADC)
ADC -> DVI converter converts a ADC output to a DVI output
I am not sure if the adapter in question sports DVI-I or DVI-D outputs (traditionally I believe adapters have DVI-I, at least high end ones). You can plug a DVI-D cable into either a DVI-D or DVI-I output. Also having DVI-I outputs allows the easy split out of VGA if needed.
Nope I was trying to answer if the dual-link DVI-D connection on the adapter can be used to drive a single-link DVI-D expecting display. I believe he is asking if he can use the 6800 dual-link adapter to drive displays other then a 30" display.
It would require that the adapter understand that the connected display is single-link and hence not do the even/odd splitting. I don't know if the adapter supports that or not. Pin out wise it should work if the adapter does the right thing.
Yeah but whose fault is it if we keep voting these folks into (or back into) their seats. :-(
The electorate needs to more universally realize that we have to allow congress to make decisions that potentially adversely affect them [electorate] because it is more important for the country as a whole. We should be voting folks out if they don't do the right things for the country as a whole first and locally second not the other ways around (at least in my opinion).
We also need to boot folks that don't want to compromise and work more with each other across party lines... voting blindly along party lines (as appear to happen all to often) serves no purpose since the "right" path often lies at the cross roads between the party platforms.
Humm not fully sure... dual-link works by sending even and odd pixels for a given color channel down two different links. Single link transmits even and odd pixels over a single link.
Basically DVI defines 6 signal pairs for pixel data, in single-link 3 of the 6 are used, one for each color channel (RGB). In dual-link even pixels go down one bank of 3 while odds go down the other bank of 3.
From what I can see the channel definition for connections is the same for single-link and dual-link. So in theory it could work if the adapter could toggle between sending just even pixels to sending even and odd pixels on the first set of links.
..across the whole of the US budget. Time to do the right thing for the country not for their congressional seat.
Greenspan Warns on Spending, Tax Decisions
Congress in notorious for misspending funds so I fully support having less funds for them to work with (tax cuts) and for that to force them to be responsible (well at least one can dream). To bad dot com tax revenue stream was a figment of folks imagination and that spending was not adjusted or spending increases even slowed much to make up for the difference, of course this compounded by the related recession, tax cuts, 9/11, etc.
The 30" monitors from Apple have a resolution that cannot be fed by a single-link DVI connection. So they use dual-link DVI. Both single-link and dual-link are part of the DVI 1.0 standard, nothing Apple specific about them.
The difference between single-link and dual-link is how many of the pins in the connector is used for transmitting data, in a nut shell 12 pins for the former and 24 pins for the later.
Apple is using DVI-D (digital only) DVI connectors with a dual-link pin out for the 30" display. So one dual-link DVI-D connection is capable of driving one 30" display. The 6800 adapter used for these displays provides two dual-link DVI-D outputs, so one adapter can drive two 30" displays.
As a reference...
DVI connector type summary
DVI 1.0 specification (PDF)
They don't and they never have.
CPU = unit = complete system in their finical lingo.
Apple's margins on goods sold averaged about 27.8%, which is rather good for this industry. They spent 125 million on R&D and 354 on general operations, administrative and selling. That is what eats the remaining gross margins.
In general companies have some degree in freedom when it comes to operating expenses and companies that are trying to innovate and market will spend a lot of their profits doing just that.
So seeing low profit in comparison to revenue doesn't have to be a bad things nor is it in this case given the R&D budget (at this quarters rate Apple is spending 500 million a year on R&D), etc.
Not sure if you are being funny or not but...
They are talking about units, as in complete systems, not as in the processors.
Look over this pdf document for more information.
Basically they shipped around 876,000 units which is as they said is the best shipment volume in a few years for a given quarter.
On the side note, the whole Mars thing seems bunk, when was the last time anybody even heard any other information about it? Maybe there'll be some more talk about Mars (talk is cheap) until November elections.
Why not read the report that was recently released (the report was the first step in the planning/feasibility validation of the directed goal)...
moon to mars
Weird. You sure you have enough RAM in your system?
For me app to app switch is fast and doesn't bog down like it could in Mac OS 9 if one of the applications was busy working on something.
Also with Safari things load and display faster then what I experience under Mac OS 9 or when using IE on Mac OS X.
In regards to running enough apps... on Mac OS 9 you only need to run one application that doesn't do cooperative scheduling very well and everything is screwed (IE is one example when facing any type of network delay).
Panther is, aggravatingly, still not nearly as responsive as OS 9 on the same hardware. They still have some way to go. I hope Tiger finally closes this gap.
Do you ever run more then one application at a time?
Mac OS X is far more responsive and efficient then Mac OS 9 under any amount of load.
This isn't universally correct.
For example look at the PowerPC architecture. It was designed from the get go to support 64b capable instructions with 32b subset of that. So with a 64b PPC chip no emulation mode exists and you can run 64b/32b code side by side (of course the OS needs to set bits to adjust expected control register behavior, overflow for 64b is different then 32b, etc. but no expensive mode switch is involved).
You see no penalty when running 32b code on a 64b PPC. In fact running a 32b (addressing wise) application could actually be faster then running a 64b (addressing wise) application on 64b capable PPC. This can happen because of the reduced size of pointer in the data stream, allow improved L1 & L2 cache hits for data, as well as a smaller data set. Also note one can use 64b math without the need for 64b addressing.
Of course if you want to leverage 64b math capabilities when running on a 64b capable processor then you need to compile with those options so your code switches to using 64b math instructions, etc.
Wow... you do realize that the "scorching heat" is cause by hitting the atmosphere which they are purposely using to slow down the shuttle, you need to bleed off the orbiting velocity. You the atmosphere is an efficient way of doing that and one that allow bleeding off of orbital velocity without exceeding acceleration limits of the space craft or the humans in it.
Now one could cary more fuel or generate such fuel on orbit (various method and theories for that) and use propulsion to counter act orbital velocity so the craft could descend out of orbit. Of course to do that enough propulsion needs to be used to negate the orbital velocity, if you want to keep "scorching heat" away, before the space craft is pulled into the atmosphere by gravity. The deceleration required to this is an issue and one that cannot be managed like one can do with heat using heat shielding, etc.
Humans and space craft can only handle so much acceleration before they are damaged.
Anyway Mr. AC what is your idea? And why do you think folks don't think about this stuff?
FYI, Quartz doesn't need any changing... it has always been resolution independent, it has always had the concept of user space and device space for drawing that allows for this resolution independence. For more information on Quartz 2D, etc. review the documentation.
... in a way you did agree to it during the act of installing it (read the license that you clicked through in the installer). Just like folks want the GPL, etc. to be respected respect Apple's license/NDA.
Any element that isn't bitmap based (Quartz 2D paths, text, etc.) can be display at an arbitrary resolution (this is how printing currently works under Mac OS X). Regarding what appears to be bitmap elements, well I cannot comment further in regards to Tiger.
As for the NDA please follow it
Oops I meant to state in my prior post that any developers with a seed key should download the draft Tiger developer documentation from the ADC website. It covers lots of things talked about at WWDC that cannot be talked about in public.
Look under "Reference Library" in the downloads sections for the "Tiger Documentation" package. Note this doesn't clobber your currently install developer documentation and to view the docs you do NOT need Tiger installed. Also note that this document set is later then one provided on the Tiger preview DVD (but it is a sub-set of the total documentation, I would expect revised releases of this documentation set as we get close to Tigers release date).
I just wanted to note that Tiger has a lot of very cool stuff under the hood that is taking place that will be a boon for developers and by extension customers (of course this stuff is still currently under NDA).
It will be a great OS release... one that I feel will become a must have for every Macintosh user (with supported hardware). At least I hope it will be a must have because I really want to use some of he features that will exist to help speed the development and richness of applications.
These are screen shots from a developer release of an OS that will not be release until some time in 2005 (Apple is targeting first half of 05). So what you see may have no reflection on the final look of things nor show a complete implementation of any particular look.