Slashdot Mirror
Detailed Reviews of Mac OS X "Tiger" Preview
An anonymous reader writes "AppleInsider has been publishing some very detailed articles on Apple's new Mac OS X 10.4 'Tiger' operating system, which include numerous screenshots of the system. So far the publication has discussed overall installation and Spotlight search technology, Safari with RSS, a new Mail revision with
Smart Mailbox technology, and a websearch enabled Mac OS X Help application."
It seems like most of these features were explained at Jobs' keynote address at WWDC. The automatic knowledgebase search in Help was new tho. Can't wait until I get my hands on my developer copy.
So now they have a broweser thats guaranteed to give you repetitive stress syndrome? How is THAT a good thing?
"Have you ever thought about just turning off the TV, sitting down with your kids, and hitting them?"
Well, no matter how smart my mailbox is, my mail is still stupid.
I'm tired of people trying to convince me that my breasts need to be larger, when clearly that would only make my penis look smaller.
OS X 10.5 will be shipping in 6 months.
Get it right!!!
Do we know when the complete version is expected to hit the shelves?
It looks like Apple caught on quickly to the Gmail label paradigm shift away from folders and has put "smart folders" into Mail 2.0 for 10.4.
IMHO labels and smart folders are long overdue for mail. They've been usefull in iTunes for months and just make good sense data that does not belong in only one bin.
Here is apple's own "Preview". It contains tons of screenshots and a webcast from WWDC.
http://www.apple.com/macosx/tiger/
- what is the definition of simultanagnosia?! I've been meaning to look it up!
Just one of those pot-kettle-black things, I guess: ...websearch enabled Mac OS X Help application.
You mean like Office2003? And even OfficeXP, I think.
I'm just sayin'...
-bZj
.sig
Seems to me we've been goin' on about Lorghorn many moons longer than people have been going on about MacOS X.4.
From the appleinsider link:
Interestingly, sources noted that while the Tiger Finder interface contains no noticeable changes from Panther, Spotlight uses its own sleek window interface design, which is only accessible from windows that are spawned from Spotlight searches. The interface features windows with a smooth, grey-colored titlebar, with sharp webpage-like table results on one side, and an html-style control bar on the other. Details of these new webpage-like Mac OS X windows were first report by sources in an earlier report, though sources described them as Mac OS Finder windows.
If you look at the screen shots you will notice weirdly blue colored bars, but just in that one application. Honestly I thought Macs were supposed to have a consistent UI. If I wanted a mish mash of colors and widgets I would just get a Windows PC.
“Common sense is not so common.” — Voltaire
...and it's not that spectacular. The search service is cool, but nothing else is all that different. It's really disappointing actually.
That would suk if its only available on DVD. I have been running Panther for a few months and am quite happy with it, but I would like the opiton of upgrading to Tiger. I would have to buy an external drive since I only have a CD-RW on my Flatscreen iMac. Same for everyone else (except the director who has a DVD drive he never uses) in my all Apple office.
These summaries and screenshots have been around for weeks. Why is Slashdot putting them on the front page now?
BLING BLING. Meet the architecture that's changing everything.
Finally, a correct use of the word 'literally':
Apple's new "Spotlight" search technology is by far Tiger's most dominant feature, and it can be accessed from almost every corner of the system, literally.
A blue-colored Spotlight search button appears in the upper-right-hand corner of the Mac OS menubar, and remains accessible at that point from any Mac OS X application. Selecting the Spotlight icon reveals a search field that will expand to display results in real-time.
I can't wait till I can afford the next OS X update!!!
:)
6 year cycle at 2 upgrades a year would only cost $1,200
Why would you pay premium for a closed source operating system and handicapped hardware (one button mouse)?
It's cheaper than XP, it's mostly open (it's not Free, but that doesn't bother me), and my three-button+wheel mouse works just fine, thanks.
Oh, and by the way - 1994 just called. They want their FUD back.
Lost: Sig, white with black letters. No collar. Reward if found!
It works under the 'everything is a database' premise for email, with 'smart filters', multiple views, multiple email integration, everything controlled via CSS and much, much more.
It's free as in beer, too.
RinkRat
Is Tiger usable as a daily OS, currently?
No, Safari 2.0 currently does not work with HTTPS sites. Many common apps, including FireFox crash upon execution. Additionally, there seem to be some pretty serious filesystem bugs which can trash your entire hard disk (not just your Tiger partition).
Do I need a DVD drive? My pirated copy of the Tiger DVD crashes upon boot up.
No, you don't need a DVD drive. Visit the following URL for good installation steps:
Install steps
He also has a Tiger FAQ here:
Tiger FAQ
Do you need Panther to use the Tiger upgrade or will any version of OS X work? Are the hardware requirements, both minimal and recommended, the same as Panther?
"I hate to advocate drugs, alcohol, violence or insanity but they've always worked for me" - HST
I've been using "VFolders" in evolution for at least two years or so now. I wouldn't be surprised if outlook has had such a feature for a long time. Although Google is responsible for inventing a whole slew of tech, smart folders is not one of them.
So go suck Bill's dick already.
Whoa Deja Vu! Must be a glitch in the Matrix...
You could've checked your awesome cut and paste commenting a bit more closely before posting. Oh, by the way, Dell sucks.
Cougar, Lynx, and Leopard. No clue what order they will use, but those seem to be the names for their future releases (through 10.7).
Lion is conspicuously absent.
Integrate Keynote and LaTeX
Since I don't email illiterate people, I'd like my mail program run spell check and grammer check on incoming mail. If it isn't at high school level then it's automatically binned.
-Adam
Exactly! And why would vFolders be considered the "correct" nomenclature? Is it because Linux had them already? Who cares?!
actually as of a few months ago they had a few other cats trademarked for OS name use.... offhand i think puma, lynx and cougar maybe? i may be wrong on the names, but i know there are a few more in the name pool..... even if theya re never used, they were trademarked for use as a name for an operating system...
yes, i know lynx in the unix shell web browser thingy..... but it can still be trademarked for OS use (i think?). whatever the list consisted of, it was found because Apple trademarked the names.
The deeper answer is that the Mac UI is designed so you don't need to be a geek to understand it. Joe Sixpack knows what smart means but not what virtual means, let alone know that the v in vFolders stands for virtual.
BTW, I've never heard the term vFolders before so I suspect it doesn't have that much mindshare. It looks like a Linux thing.
Where are the free software projects investigating next generation UI concepts? Is Linux too wedded to the old ways of doing things to compete with commercial vendors like Apple? It seems to me that the Linux UI community has been very busy trying to emulate the functionality of yesterday's commercial desktops, when it should be pioneering new approaches and UI innovations, thus leap-frogging Apple and others.
"Kitten"
dinner: it's what's for beer
The original name of this feature was "Views" (from Lotus Notes).
So... just out of interest, did you try it? Can you describe what happened, please? :)
I always save my last mod point to mod up a good troll. You people are too serious.
Lots of people talk about how the Windows version of iTunes is a trojan horse idea, i.e., it gives Windows users a taste of the usability and flexibility of software designed by Apple, and so inspires them to switch. Looks like Apple's been using iTunes as more than a switching device, though - they've been training their user base. Everything's going to be smart in the Tiger, and it won't matter where the files are - just what you want to use, when you want to use it. iTunes is already like this - I can say I want all the movie music by John Williams, in addition to including all the classical titles he ripped off, and it will give it to me in a playlist. So, no massive shift for Mac users or Windows users who have iTunes - they already know exactly how to speed through and take advantage of this UI. Smart.
Shold have known better than to joke about Apple. The mods here who like apple don't appear have much of a sense of humor.
You should have saved the comment for the next piece of KDE software named Kxxx. Long rants about how OSS sucks at naming software always get modded +5 Informative.
If you wanna get rich, you know that payback is a bitch
"Oh, and by the way - 1994 just called. They want their FUD back."
Great line! I laughed out loud when I read it!
It takes a moment of background story, but this does relate...During the 4th of July celebrations (which for some reason, came on the 3rd of July this year) my sweetie and I joined my best friend and his wife and kids in the park to watch the fireworks. Being the "Evil Uncle" of his son, Gabe, I managed to convince him the previous year that we celebrate July 4th each year to commemorate our fending off the aliens attack on Earth. This year, he and I spoke further on the issue...
GABE: "So, we fought off the Aliens with their own technology?
ME: "Why...ah, yes, as a matter of fact, we did."
GABE: "So aliens have laptops too?"
ME: "Yes, well, sort of. Actually, no..."
GABE: "Arrrgh!"
ME: "See, they captured an alien ship back in the 50's and reverse-engineered the operating system."
GABE: "Hmmm...And they used it to blow up the aliens?"
ME: "Not quite. See, it takes money to fund these sorts of top-secret government wossnames. So what they did was eventually market the operating system in the private sector, as a competing OS. However, since it was the government that gave out the OS in the first place, they decided to keep it close to home, in federally funded areas... like Schools."
GABE: "You mean..." his eyes went wide "Apple Computers are made by aliens? Oh no!"
ME: "No, Apple Computers are made by Apple. However, their OS was originally hacked from an alien spaceship. That's why they never managed to produce clones like the PCs."
GABE: "And we made the aliens blow up with an Apple computer?"
ME: "No, we just used their technology to remove their shields, so that our weapons could blow them up."
GABE: "Did we use alien weapons?"
ME: "Nope, just good old fashioned American-made missiles and stuff."
GABE: "Good," he nods sagely. "Cause next time, we might not be so lucky."
ME: "Indeed. And THAT'S why we celebrate the 4th of July, every year."
MY FIANCE: "Just for the record, Sweetie, our kids are never going to be home-schooled by you."
-The Libra
"Please be patient--The future will begin momentarily."
I just wanted to note that Tiger has a lot of very cool stuff under the hood that is taking place that will be a boon for developers and by extension customers (of course this stuff is still currently under NDA).
It will be a great OS release... one that I feel will become a must have for every Macintosh user (with supported hardware). At least I hope it will be a must have because I really want to use some of he features that will exist to help speed the development and richness of applications.
You know, that's a really smart idea! Of course it would need a few tweaks- Maybe calculate the percentage of mistakes and trash it above a certain value (for the friends who make the occasional spelling mistake).
The best part is, if spammers start using spell-check and correcting their mail before sending (changing V1@gr@ to Viagra) it will be caught by the spam filters instead! It's a win-win situation, less spam and correct spelling...
Urge to post... fading... fading... RISING!... fading... fading... gone.
is a "smarter" spam filter in mail. The current spam filter works relatively well in identifying spam, the only problem I have with it is it does tend to have too many false positives for my taste.
The filter as it stands right now is pretty basic, it would be nice if they could(as an option of course) put in a Baysein filter in mail. Hopefully that would stop a lot of the false positives I get currently.
Smart is not descritive at all. Folders aren't smart, sorry... no AI yet.
Leandro Guimarães Faria Corcete DUTRA
DA, DBA, SysAdmin, Data Modeller
GNU Project, Debian GNU/Lin
It's cheaper than XP
This one is not entirelycorrect, if you want to stay up to date. The yearly upgrade cycle so far made OSX quite more expensive than XP if you started with the first released version on both. And if you're talking OEM, XP might be actually cheaper now.
Granted, if the software would be the only difference, OSX would have XP beat hands down. However, if you're out to buy a cheap and reasonably fast computer, Apple is not exactly in the top 10 choices (emphasis on both cheap and fast).
Adapting the old saying: cheap, fast, cool - pick two.
Ok more screenshots of the features shown in Apple's broadcast, nice for end users I guess, but what about some details for developers?
Does Apple solve the problems for international users? Or must we wait until KDE has perfected it and Apple starts losing international users? I want to share my shareware with people who's language I cannot speak or write. No I'm not a paying Apple Developer, so that are things a nerd like me wants to know.
Dennis SCP
Apple also continues to improve Safari's compliance with web standards, fixing a number of Cascading Style Sheet (CSS) and rendering bugs and supporting more of the recently approved CSS 2 standard.
For all the talk of "web standards", CSS is actually a recommendation, not a standard. Tim Berners-Lee makes it very clear that the W3C was founded to produce recommendations and not to be a standards body in his book, Weaving The Web.
Furthermore, the CSS 2 recommendation was approved over six years ago, and the CSS 2.1 specification has not yet been approved as a recommendation (it's still in candidate recommendation stage).
I take it you're a straight guy. How would you feel if your girlfriend was twisting your arm and insisting that you two have a threesome with that "hot, gorgeous bi-guy" she just met?
What I want to know is, how does Apple provide "instant" answers to searches?
Are they maintaining frequently-updated indices?
Will it be a constant drag on system performance, as with MS's old Fast Find, or their current full text indexing?
Will all 10 Mac OSX applications support Spotlight?
.sigs are for post^Hers.
There's only one upgrade a year, if that. The last upgrade was in late 2003 and the new upgrade is in early to mid 2005.
Six year cycle at one upgrade a year is $774. However, during that time you're likely to buy at least one new Mac, which would eliminate the need for one of the upgrades.
If you're really keeping your computer for six years, that's a solid testimony to the quality of the Mac platform. You really need a new PC for every new major version upgrade since the system requirements change so radically. It's torture running Windows XP on a low-end machine designed for 2000. I bought a used two year old 400mhz PowerBook G4 about a week ago and am very impressed by how well it runs in Panther. It was a slowpoke in the version of MacOS X available at the time, but now it's a more than acceptable performer for most things I need to do with it.
The reality is that the Mac platform's pretty cost-effective if you want to keep your machine running well. The horrors of dealing with Windows virus attacks easily make up for the price difference between Mac and PC.
D
Probably because iTunes uses Smart Playlists. "vFolder" is pretty uninspiring. Is it a "fifth generation" folder? Is it shaped like a 'V'? Will it be used in litigation? Is it associated with a verb, or action? Is it an assistant to a real Folder? Will it bring Victory? Does it does it refer to the designer's first experience of love, rolling around in a meadow, surrounded by violets?
I love it when marketing drones (or programmers) think adding "Smart" to reflect new technology is valid. The mail technology described isn't "smart".
"Smart" would be a filtering system that recognizes senders based on last name, and realize that people named "Smith" are probably in my family. "Smart" would automatically recognize messages about the Bernoulli account after a few back and forths and organize them by sender and time (kind of like how I have my filing cabinets). When it matches a personal assistant, it's "smart".
Some interesting GUI changes in that Spotlight window the pop-up selectors are noticeably different than the rather bulky and ugly default can-change-them-on-webpages-with-CSS-for-your-life ones currently in Panther/Safari
The buttons and the bright blue title bar actually looks a little like Win XP . . . ack!
I really do hope Apple moves away from the watery-gooey aqua buttons.
They also need to find a better solution from those empty-white-ditch graphics they tack onto windows that don't have scrollbars. Gross.
I hear what you are saying. Now see if you can find a non-geek friend and ask them what virtual means. They'll probably say "It's something to do with virtual reality isn't it? 3D graphics and all that." The word "smart" is more suggestive of what the folders do than a word a person doesn't understand.
See what I mean?
Help! Help! I'm being repressed!
I think smart just means it obeys instruction. Like smart weapons.
I don't think Apple would use Lynx
Lynx already is a text based browser.
http://lynx.browser.org/
Nothing would happen because he doesn't have a girlfriend. Hello, this is Slasdot!
I'm guessing it's because we can *relate* to them.
"Oh, you like pussy? What a coincidence! We should eat out sometime - perhaps my wife!"
Please do not pretend to be a girl on the Slashdot. It gets the nerds all hot and bothered.
Let's see here. The yearly upgrade cycle of Mac OS versus the every-other-year upgrade cycle of Windows. Granted, the next windows (desktop) version won't be out for a while now, but Tiger is in 2005, when Panther was 2003.
Windows retail is pretty dang expense (for the full NON-oem version). Likewise, the hardware requirements seem to go up quite nicely with each Windows release. Panther runs pretty well on hardware thats a few years old already (so long as its a G4 or later G3).
Don't get me wrong, if you want to constantly upgrade with either system, it's going to cost you a pretty penny. But why upgrde so often? Jaguar is still supported now, and Panther will still be supported when Tiger comes out.
But I agree that Mac OS needs to slow down a little. While they throw a LOT of stuff in each revision, it gets pretty pricey.
vFolders isn't a linux thing. It's an XEmacs VMail thing. It was a concept popularized with Linux via the Evolution mail client which borrowed heavily from the earlier work of VMail and it's approaches.
What is the difference as far as the user is concerned between setting up filters and folders in Mail and having Smart Folders?
Won't the end result be the same from an end users point of view? The difference is kind of academic: the emails are not really copied into the Smart Folder as they might be in a traditional filter/folder set up. Who cares? So Smart Folders save me a few KB of harddrive space in duplicated emails.
I can appreciate the technology behind Smart Folder (indexing and so on), I think having system-wide search of email is good, but at the end of the day I don't see how this cool tech will have any real effect on how I read and organize email in Mail.
What I would like to see is the ability to group or cluster emails quickly by sender (or month or whatever). This is the feature I miss most from Outlook. Again, I think Apple could borrow the interface for this from iTunes. Think of the Miller Column (or Browse) interface in iTunes, but instead of Genre>Artist>Album you would have Account>Sender>Month (or something). Or they could use those little arrow link buttons from the iTunes Music Store that allow you to filter by artist or ablum with one click.
Am I missing some of the potential of Smart Folders here? Or is Mail not making any great leap forward.
While dashboard might or might not be a konfabulator clone, it does it MUCH better than konfabulator could ever do it.
One of the nasties of using konfabulator aside from the hideous amount of prossesor usage it seems to take and its tendancy to kill your system if your not online and using a widget that grabs online feeds, is the fact that well, every interface is different between widgets and sometimes they either dont work, or are hard to move around or close. The new version of Konfabulator fixed some of this, but its still bad. Apple has changed this, by not only making the moduals easy to close or move, and forcing them to keep simular preference interfaces, they also added the expose powered hide feature.
Honestly I dont hate Konfabulator and wish it well, I think its creator is a ass as to the fact that he doesnt care about the fact that both Apple and Microsoft did it first and he was just reimplementing a old idea.... beleiving the PR all the media outlets put out about it being this amazing app, but he did create it and i think more importantly he renewed interest in a feature a lot of us didnt use back in the OS 6/7 Win98 days.... Here is hoping the modual makers can bring their work to Dashboard with minimal fuss.... cause honestly those are the people who made konfabulator shine, not the guy who made it.
"Slashdot, where telling the truth is overrated but lying is insightful."
I am a straight guy and if my girlfriend suggested having a threesome with another guy, I would not want to join in. But I would offer to videotape her and the guy. Lighten up!
I always save my last mod point to mod up a good troll. You people are too serious.
Personally, I can't wait for the Thundercats version... Thundercats Ho!!!
It is for us DEVELOPERS. So we can DEVELOP. Sorta' like the development systems I work on here - blue wires, etc. yet it allows me to DEVELOP.
Oh, BTW, did I mention it was a DEVELOPERS release?
IANAL, but I've seen actors play them on TV
can vouch for this, my G3 systems ( a b/w and a iBookSE) work GREAT with panther and the fastest one is a 466mhz with a 66mhz buss
"Slashdot, where telling the truth is overrated but lying is insightful."
I should preface my comments with this -- I'm new to OS X (IT/developer working in creative environment), so my experience with Safari may not be totally up to snuff. Correct me if I terribly skew off track with comments about Safari.
;-)
That said, I'm wondering if Apple has improved Safari to be more compatible with websites. And if not, why not before doing this RSS application?
When I do testing of websites with Mozilla 1.x and FireBird 0.9 on my PC, I run into some "damn you Internet Explorer"-specific pages that limit the features that I see with these alternative browsers. However, when I use Safari (which I thought was loosely based on the Mozilla project's browser engine), I see even more rendering problems than in the other two browsers.
Do I just need to spend more time with Safari, or are there still major issues with how it renders some pages and code? And if the latter is true, was it wise for Apple to add another Safari-esque feature with this RSS application when they need to fix some rendering issues with what could be a really sweet browser?
It's sad, but on many pages that work fine in Mozilla 1.x and FireBird 0.9 on a PC, I have to send designers who want to see their work BACK to IE for Mac so that the pages properly render what they designed. Of course, my code could just really suck too.
IronChefMorimoto
Figures you're from Brazil
BTW, Virginia tech found Apple to be the cheapest fastest option when measured against other PCs. What do you know, a cheap, fast, cool supercomputer!
As a comparison, while I like 10.3, I'm still not quite sure why I had to pay a full-OS price for it, compared to 10.2. Just like every other Apple fan, I'll probably empty my wallet for the newest OS, but it's disappointing me more and more each time when it turns out I'm paying for minor tweaks and add-ons.
Sigh. You didn't. Happy now? You paid the upgrade price. The real price is US$499, but the upgrade is $129 to anyone with another MacOS license. And they'll take your word for it. And, since MacOS licenses can transfer with hardware, there's a license sold for every single Mac in existance (and then some). So when you bought your Mac, you got a license - which entitled you to the upgrade price.
As for the timespan - what, you want less frequent innovation? Er, sure - this won't be on sale for another 10 months or so yet. Happier?
You're special forces then? That's great! I just love your olympics!
1) Tiger won't be out until spring 2005.
2) Safari 1.3 and Xcode 1.5 will make it to Panther, and Panther will receive at least one more point release (10.3.5). Safari 2.0 and Xcode 2.0 will be Tiger-only, however, as they make use of updated frameworks.
3) If you don't see why you need to upgrade, then just don't - 10.3 will continue to work fine and they will continue to supply you with security fixes.
Doh! It was meant to be funny! If Macs wern't so exspensive I might have one but for now its F\OSS software for stability and performance.
Avontech | Play dirty! They started it!
Since in Notes your mail is just another database, you can fairly easily add new views that key off of particular fields for their selection criteria.
This is the one good feature among all the others that make it crappy for mail.
For example, if I receive e-mail that contains at least one e-mail address containing mycompany.com, then I want the mailer, upon selecting Reply, to auto-set the From header to my work e-mail address rather than my home e-mail address. (All my e-mail routes my my home Linux server and is split into mailbox files by procmail.)
Anybody know of a GUI mail client with rules like Pine's? (Oh, and it has to be able to support IMAP over SSL and SMTP AUTH too.)
If you reply, do so only to what I explicitly wrote. If I didn't write it, don't assume or infer it.
emacs is already a text editor.
I don't think Apple would use Safari
Internet Safari is already a web browser.
I don't think Apple would use iTools
iTools is already a Suite of server applications for macs.
I don't think Apple would use Apple
Apple is already a record label.
I don't think Apple would use System 9
System 9 is already a the name of an OS by Microware.
Anymore out there ;)
"I'm a Genius!"*
*Not an actual Genius
$499? Where did you get that number from? :P Certainly not from apple.com.
:)
Methinks someone is ripping you off.
$129 is the cost of OS X. There is no upgrade price.
What is bigger, M$ research or Apple research? seems that apple can integrate better and faster new stuff that M$?....perhaps M$ research is too busy making patents.
Of course, all the "new" stuff is just evolutionary and nothing revolutionary....
AC
Well, for one there really isn't any precidence for the way Apple is implementing smart folders. BeOS had something like this, but I'm not sure if the feature was as powerful. The "smart folders" name is derived from the iTunes "smart playlists". So since they are inventing this feature, they can call it whatever they want. Perhaps they should call them "fuck you troll" folders.
Personally, I'm tired of Steve Jobs and his crack team of Apple Uzi-brandishing S.W.A.T.-Ninjas crash through my bedroom window in the middle of the night, round up my children, tie up my wife and then force me at gunpoint to upgrade OS X every year.
Ok, so I'm not married and don't have kids.
But my point still stands.
Yeah yeah graphics, search, safari... Can we PLEASE Finally fix the HUGE bug where you can't print from Adobe (or any other app that uses PICT rather than PDF) to Linux CUPS queues? Its been in the dev tree since before the last relase...
Contrary to all rules of CUPS when Apple ported it to OSX they decided to add client side filters which means when you send a job to a shared queue hosted on a linux box, the local printbox hangs and the linux box either bounces the job or prints garbage.
For details go here
Please!?!
If you don't like it, keep 10.2. This isn't a forced upgrade. Besides Quartz Extreme, there haven't been any earth shattering interface changes since 10.1, and only a few increases since 10.2. Shit, I still compile with compatibility to version 10.0, just in case somebody's still running that three year old OS. Most commercial software is 10.1+ (though many free and shareware tools assume you have 10.2).
New machines get the newest OS. Everybody else can buy it as an upgrade if they like. Where's the problem here? If you aren't willing to pay $130 for a fully 64 bit version of the MacOS with a few extra features, don't pay it.
Hey freaks: now you're ju
"iTunes doesn't use the right mouse button"
Incorrect. Right click is enabled for everything that it is in OS X, which includes clickable items such as playlists and songs. Whitespace is not clickable.
"iTunes requires you use the menu to perform simple tasks like adding a new playlist"
Incorrect. The "+" button at the bottom of the playlist pane adds new playlists. If you're talking about adding smart playlists, hold down shift while clicking. This feature is itentical to OS X iTunes except you hold down Option in OS X.
"It also wouldn't work with my iPod until I allowed it to delete every song on my iPod"
Probably because you:
A) Were using an OS X iPod on a PC or vice versa. Duh, they're formatted differently.
B) Switched the management styles. Duh, iTunes can't track stuff when it doesn't know where it came from.
Otherwise, that's preposterous.
"iTunes becomes non-responsive for long periods of time when used with my iPod"
Sorry your computer can't keep up with the data transfer rates. Perhaps you should consider reinstalling windows or updating your I/O drivers, because the 15 people I know that use iTunes for windows don't have any of the complaints that you do. If you're using USB 2.0, I'm not surprised you're having problems.
Incidentally, if you're willing to wait 6 months after the release of a new Apple OS, you can usually get it for half price. You can get the previous release for even less (just saw 10.2 for $20). Or get four of your friends together and buy a "family" license (5 licenses with one DVD for $250 or so).
This is quite a contrast to Windows -- the Windows 2000 Upgrade is still in the $190 range 4 years later.
Hey freaks: now you're ju
And then you'd need Steve Ballmer to be your cheerleader.
All employees must wash hands before seeking equitable relief.
Wheither XP is more expensive than OSX is up to debate because it varies depending upon the situation. XP home is around, what $99? If you want better conictivitiy, XP pro is $199. Next upgrade is due a long time from now. Most of the time people are expected to have antivirus on a Windows machine: that's $50+ each year. An upgrade in windows can actually require an upgrade in the hardware as well.
Mac OSX costs $125. For a 5 computer licence it's $199. Upgrades happen once per year, but you are not REQUIRED neccesarily to get them. Each upgrade of OSX (thus far) has made speed improvments on the same hardware - if you're okay with the speed now, then an upgrade will only make things better. Of course the hardware is usually[1] more expensive as well.
Which is actually cheaper? As I said, that depends.
[1] An iBook often works out to be cheaper than an equivelant PC laptop.
Er, that was my point. There is no non-upgrade price. Everyone is upgrading already. But one could reasonably posit that it would be more than the upgrade price, hence my $499. Sorry for not using enough emoticons and faux-html to be clear :)
You're special forces then? That's great! I just love your olympics!
It appears from this photo of the install screen that the current system requirements for Tiger are:
G3, G4 or G5 processor
a DVD Drive
builtin Firewire
128 MB Ram
2 GB disk space
People who work seriously with text documents for a living. If your entire "work" and "school" consists of a "handful" of documents, then powerful searching is not for you.
All employees must wash hands before seeking equitable relief.
Can I have your girlfriend's phone number please?
Mother is the best bet and don't let Satan draw you too fast.
Well, one reason is it has a similar code base as *nix platforms which is important to me. I have many OSS tools normally found on *nix running on my PowerBook G4 and even have a KDE GUI running if I want it even though I have a duel boot with Linux on it. Plus you get to vote with your money; that is, give it to Apple instead of Microsoft. And Apple doesn't appear to be out to eliminate OSS which I like. Those are reasons enough for me.
Note the GUI API's are closed in Apple not the underlying kernel.I have been using Tiger on my 800Mhz Titanium Powerbook since WWDC, and I must point out that Spotlight does not thrash the hard drive. Not being a programmer, I'm not sure how Apple accomplished this, but Spotlight gives instantaneous results without slowing the system down.
Cole's Axiom: The sum of the intelligence on the planet is a constant. The population is growing.
Good job proposing to the first girl who didn't run away when you talked to her. [...] Sure beats growing some balls and being a man.
So... being lonely is manly? Why, you must be the manliest person who ever lived!
No, I don't want less *frequent* innovation... what I want is *more* innovation in general.
Keeping a break-neck pace with innovation and releasing things that are significant (and possibly revolutionary) every few (3-5) years is awesome.
Adding a few widgets, and making a few (mostly) minor tweaks and charging $129 every two years is crappy. I could possibly see paying $129 for a combination of the features of 10.2 *and* 10.3 at *once*, but not $248 for the combination of the features separately.
And I don't view my post as flamebait. I am an Apple fan. I show my brand loyalty with my purchases (17" PB, 40GB iPod, service plans, and accessories for both, not to mention the OS upgrades.) I am a serious Apple customer trying to understand what real value we're getting for $130 every two years.
I'm not opposed to innovation or upgrades, but I'd like to see something for my money.
I am not a developer but was wondering. Using Mail, would it be possible to have a script that could be used to post information to iCal. For instance: address would be your iCal, subject line (or CC line) would be title of particular calendar; and then of course there is the date and time. I say this because it seems not only logical, but because the interface is easier for many reasons, one being that we use E mail so often. What do you think?
Anyone seen my jagged little pill?
Uhhh... *right*. That is exactly my point. I compose a number of documents (Excel, Word, etc.) for work and school, and they are kept in folders labeled as such.
But the bulk of my documents are things like music, photos, and email, all of which have programs which handle organizing them just fine.
My question was not whether this could be useful to *anyone*, my question was how many users out there have that many random documents (containing 'text', mind you) that would take advantage of this feature, and is this number of users a large enough group to require such focus placed on a new feature? Are you one of those people? What kind of searches would you perform? (I really want to know, because I could never think of needing such a feature myself.)
I haven't seen Tiger but I've been a Mac programming hobbyist since the late 80s, and I have doubts that Spotlight will succeed. Unless the API is really, really easy to use, I think Spotlight will end up in the same bin as AppleScript: a few applications will support it really well, but most applications won't support it at all. Are there any registered developers here who can comment on Spotlight's ease-of-use from a programming standpoint?
irb(main):001:0>
OS X 10.9 Ocelot
Reboot your imac and hold down the T key just after the chime. You'll get a grey screen with the firewire logo on it; your system is now an external firewire hard drive.
Plug it into any other system with a dvd reader. Run the installer on that system, installing onto the "disk" that is your imac.
Unmount the imac, and hit its power button to turn it off.
Boot the imac, and enjoy tiger.
could that be because they received "volume" (promotional) discounts, or because they bought their systems 2 weeks before the Opteron was made available?
Off-topic, sorry, but I just thought it might be worth pointing out that you're probably confusing two different people called John Williams. One is Australian, a classical guitarist, recorded several albums of mostly classical music and formed the band "Sky" along with Herbie Flowers, Tristan Fry, Francis Monkman and Kevin Peek. The other is American, a jazz pianist, for a while the conductor of the Boston Pops, and most famously the composer of over 75 film scores.
My four-year-old iBook (9.2.2) is even more stable, reboots needed months apart rather than weeks or days.
Macs are more cost-effective in the long term, partly because the hardware and OS don't need upgrading as frequently, and partly because you don't have spend half your time installing patches and fighting viruses and worms...
You must think in Russian.
when you find out how confused my spammers are, that they are sending me blank mails
You only have to risked death to get a little action... for most people on /. might be a fair trade!!!
I've noticed that MacOS 10 is much stabler than many people think, as long as you understand what happens when a process runs out of memory, and make sure that does not occur.
The lack of pre-emptive multi-tasking is a bit of a drag, but of course on your hardware it might not be that much of an issue.
Have you tried MacOS X yet?
D
Did it myself with 2 girls on two different occasions. That cured me of that particular fantasy... Its just not as exciting, my hands were everywhere and no where at once, and they seemed more into each other than me (which was exciting at first but got borring really soon).
Everyone wants what they can't have, and having 2 women seems better than one (in theory). In practice, two women is two times the headache! Thats why I'm faithfull to my GF, I'd just die from nagging*2
of plans about OS X HeathCliff edition out there !?!
Why would you pay premium for a closed source operating system
Because you like it better?
and handicapped hardware (one button mouse)?
How can this be an issue? What does a 3 button mouse cost these days, 20 bucks? You just plug it in and (like so much with Apple) it "just works."
Then I missed something. They look just like Ximian Evolution's vFolders to me.
Leandro Guimarães Faria Corcete DUTRA
DA, DBA, SysAdmin, Data Modeller
GNU Project, Debian GNU/Lin
IIRC, the only discount they received is the long-standing educational discount available to any school. Many vendors turned in a bid including Dell and Apple on cost and performance.
That's why we have menus of commands. Nothing smart here.
Quite different, once locked a smart bomb will self-guide and follow.
Leandro Guimarães Faria Corcete DUTRA
DA, DBA, SysAdmin, Data Modeller
GNU Project, Debian GNU/Lin
This sort of bitching gets really old really fast. Panther was released in October of 2003, that was almost eight months ago. Tiger is only being previewed now, it won't even be released until 2005. You've still got at least six months to save your pennies for Tiger. That is of course assuming you do indeed upgrade.
There's no Apple militia that is going to break your door down and force you to buy and install Tiger, just like no one forced you into buying Panther. Jaguar had a slew of new features over 10.1 and 10.0 (Puma and Cheetah) that developers are just barely taking full advantage of now. As such there's going to be a lot of software that is only going to require Jaguar in order to run. Most of Apple's apps even still support Jaguar. While this won't be the case forever it is the case currently which means upgrading from Jaguar wasn't really necessary for most people.
Tiger has a lot of new features that don't have shiny icons and those will be utilized in Tiger-only applications. You can keep Panther until your primary applications move to be Tiger-only or you can just switch to applications that are Panther friendly. Honestly if you don't see a reason to shell out the $129 for Tiger you don't have to. Plenty of people today get by just fine running Jaguar.
I'm a loner Dottie, a Rebel.
Wow smart mail boxes (Virtual Folders) never seen those before.. no never I don't think that evolution has had them for more than 4 years now what an amazing innovation!
On a more serious note spotlight looks good and seems to work well sure beats ms find anyway.
Spoon not. Fork, or fork not. There is no spoon.
No, on both counts. Quotes were taken from Dell and other PC companies as well as Apple. Apple quoted list price and still beat the other quotes. And 2 other Big Mac super computers have been ordered for other organisations since.
Every time I get a new boyfriend, it won't take long before he's asking if I'd be willing to try a threesome with "some hot bi-girl he just met".
And yet if some sheepish computer dork tried to ask you out, you'd call him a nice guy and say no way. If you go out with assholes, you get the asshole treatment. There's not a whole lot to figure out here.
And no, I'm not posting this as some sheepish computer dork who's afraid of women. I'm posting this as someone who's tired of people complaining about their lot in life when they create the situations. It's not too hard to find a guy who at least pretends to care about you, ya know. If every guy you go out with has the same problem, perhaps it's time to start looking at other types of guys?
If you get nervous, just remember that there are a few billion other people who don't really give a damn.
It's also in the mail client included with Office. I think most of us have experienced smart folders.
There are no trails. There are no trees out here.
Next will be OS X Kenya. It won't have Norwegian localization, however.
English is easier said than done.
Frameworks are, or should be, the answer. No-one IMHO should be implementing apps from scratch, they should be building on a framework. It's worth adding support for features such as Applescript and Spotlight to frameworks, since the features are then leveraged to every app that builds on the framework, and a framework should make this adoption easy for developers. Of course if you don't use a framework then you'll have a lot of work on your hands, which is why that approach is not very clever. On OS X you have lots of choice too - Cocoa is the most obvious, but Carbon is almost a framework now - requiring minimal wrapper classes to make it into a true framework. It's an idea whose time has not only come, but is now the only really sensible way to go.
No shit, where in my post did I say it wasn't for developers? I actually got that it was a developer release from the name "Developer Preview" and "World-Wide Developer Conference", that it was presented at, pretty nifty eh?
You'll note that my post is about Tiger questions people will probably ask and your reply has nothing to do with my post.
I'm still wondering about that ... does anyone have a quote on what the upgrade to XServer is costing them? Because the original comparison was rather unfair - G5 were desktop machines, compared to usually more expensive workstation setups (the main contender people cite is Opteron, which should really be pitted against XServer - for one thing, the ECC memory makes a difference in price w.r.t. the original G5). So, after all thei upgrades are in place, I'd be curious how their final costs compare with alternate (and equivalent) setups. Mind you, I'm not saying Power970 isn't a nice processor - AltiVec appears to be quite nice for some types of number crunching, so (as usual) price does not tell the whole story.
... then w2k would also be a fair comparison - and you should be able to find cheap enough versions of it. nah, it doesn't make much sense to push this on, which os is cheaper depends too much on what exactly it is you plan on doing with it. General arguments are bound to have counter-examples.
And with windows
I don't think Apple would use System 9
System 9 is already a the name of an OS by Microware.
Actually they didn't. System 7 was the last "System", after that it was Mac OS 8 and 9.
How to solve most of our problems: 1.Lots of nuclear plants. 2.Cure aging.
If you're somewhat less-than-scrupulous, Apple system disks don't require serial numbers... If you can swing a burned copy from someone, it will work just fine.
If you can wait six months or so to upgrade (which might not be a bad idea, let others work out the kinks first) you can also get OSX disks on ebay for a substantial discount. I bought a Panther DVD for $25 last April.
until I can download a normal unix app like mysqlcc, and just do this:
./configure
make
make install
and it all just work, without fink, etc?
Sig: I stole this sig.
Yeah, unlike other users, developers don't give a damn if their disks get trashed or if they can't load a browser to look at documentation, for example. After all, they're DEVELOPERS. Did I mention DEVELOPERS don't need consistent disks and application software? Geeeeeeeeezzzzzzzz.
In your flamebait, you forgot to mention that you need 20 minutes to copy 17MB in Phanter.
I'm holding out for Mac OS XXX "Pussy"
Sorry.
I wonder when Apple is going to run out of feline names. Maybe Mac OS X 10.6 will be called, in its full honestly, "Pussy."
I'm a dedicated Mac OS X user. Just check my user-agent: Safari.
I once had a signature.
. . . variously applied to leopards, cougars, and even jaguars"
really?
and which one of those comes in an all-black variety?
So, is there some logical reason you can't just ignore the in-between updates and upgrade every 5 years? It sounds like that's what you want, and I can't see what's stopping you. However, if Apple did only release new versions every few years, the people who want more frequent updates would be SOL. So, Apple is most likely doing The Right Thing here.
;)
And, hey, there's always P2P if you gotta have the new feature and can't afford the upgrade!
I, for one, welcome our new Steve-Jobs-led Uzi-brandishing S.W.A.T.-Ninja overlords!
I have a duel boot with Linux
A DUEL boot? Cool! Do OS X and Linux use swords, or pistols at 40 paces, to decide which will boot the machine?
Hey kids, there's only 5 days left 'til Yak Shaving Day!
Leopards and jaguars. Why do you ask? KeS
That's fine for desktops. My iMac has a 5 button MS mouse attached. I keep the round one button mouse in a drawer and pull it out whenever anyone starts preaching about the famous Apple design esthetic. Flipping through a Mac magazine the other day I noticed that even third party mice made for the Mac have more than one button.
My gripe is with the laptops. Since Apple knows that most people just toss the one button mouse in favor of a real mouse why not just include two buttons, especially on the laptops?
Maybe she wants to get away from you?
Also, for applications that just use files, Spotlight will still be able to find these documents based on filename and other metadata. For my personal use, I predict that I will use Spotlight all the time for searching files, contacts, e-mails, and maybe songs/photos (which will all be supported since I just use the Apple applications for these tasks), and so whether or not 3rd-party apps support it will not be a big factor to me.
I don't know much about Automator, their new GUI-based batch system, but I'm guessing that it will be much more widely-used than AppleScript. You'd think there would be a way to write shims to let Automator talk to apps that have AppleScript bindings and leverage that capability for more users.
"Why do you ask?"
;-)
because i'm surprised.
they never told us about this on "Wild Kingdom".
I knew that the "Florida panther" == cougar, but thought that the black panther was sui generis.
i presume that the black jaguar is the panther found in S.A., but where's the black leopard?
And is the black leopard the same species as the spotted leopard, but just a different color? Ditto for jaguars?
And what about Himalayan/Siberian tigers?
Black jaguars are the same, but even more common; I believe they are the most common color variant among the big cats.
White phase (not albino) tigers are most common in Las Vegas ;), but do occur in India - I think I've also seen at least one white Siberian on some program. Again, they are born in mixed litters.
There have been very rare reports of white lions, black tigers, and black lions, in decreasing order of likelihood. I've never heard of a white leopard or jaguar that wasn't an albino.
All this is apocryphal, I'm not a biologist, just an avid reader who likes cats.
KeS
Since I'm doomed to be demodded for OT, I may as well be hanged for a sheep as a lamb.
No, I did not intend to say that lab puppies occur in leopard litters! It just came out that way. I meant that both yellow and black labs can be born in the same litter of puppies! Sheesh!
KeS
It's just funny, how the most of ./ missed an shouted to them revolution in OS'es.
e rv iew.shtml
General Purpose Computing on Graphics Processors
Ever heard of that? Integrated as OS abstraction layer?
Go, look:
http://www.cs.unc.edu/Events/Conferences/GP2/ov
http://www.apple.com/macosx/tiger/core.html
"Black panther is a common term for a melanistic phase leopard (there's your black leopard). They occur in litters mixed with regular leopards . . . Black jaguars are the same, but even more common"
? So for both jags & leopards, the black ones occur in whatever regions the "regular" ones do?
"Black jaguars are the same, but even more common; I believe they are the most common color variant among the big cats."
? Surely you're connoting that black ones are the most common *outliers*, not the most common color, right?
Their pictures don't resolve - in Apple's own Safari browser as per usual with this bunch. They save them in some funky Photoshop format. They should really get their act together - this always makes them look silly.
Purple folders in Mail? Then it's true, what they say about Mac users?
Mace Windu's gonna love this. The rest of us are gonna puke.
By the way, my five-button scroll-wheel mouse works great on my G4.
My gripe is with the laptops. Since Apple knows that most people just toss the one button mouse in favor of a real mouse why not just include two buttons, especially on the laptops?
To me, there is much less of an issue with a laptop trackpad, since it is attached to the keyboard, anyway. So there is little difference to me between having a second keypad button and pressing a modifier key on the keyboard. If I really want the convenience of a mouse, I'll plug one in. What I'd like to see is a scroll wheel next to the trackpad. There is software that emulates one on the edge of the pad, but I don't find that entirely satisfactory.
And while I use a three button mouse myself, every time I work with a new user, I'm convinced that Apple made the right decision in simplifying the mouse. Just the other day, I was trying to train a friend to use a 3 button mouse. She was constantly hitting the wrong button, bringing up menus that she didn't know how to deal with.
Yes, although for both there seems to be some areas where melanism is more or less common. But it can occur anywhere in the population.
? Surely you're connoting that black ones are the most common *outliers*, not the most common color, right?
Correct. I said "color variant", which I guess is somewhat ambiguous, it's used to represent both typical and atypical types. Black and white color patterns are always atypical in the big cats, but black jaguars are the most common of the atypicals.
KeS
I'm on a dual-USB ibook (G3, 500mhz, 640mb RAM) running Panther. 10.1 was unusable due to speed, so I waited until Panther. Hey, other than missing some of the nifty visual effects, it runs great. Never had a crash bring the system down. Throw it on the iBook. It works great.
They'd have to introduce an app called Lions first, so they can say 'we've got Lions, only in Kenya'.
--- "To iterate is human, to recurse divine." -- Robert Heller
If you're really keeping your computer for six years, that's a solid testimony to the quality of the Mac platform.
:D
Actually, I'm on my second Mac that will make it to six years. I got a IIsi when they first came out in 1990. This lasted until 1998, at which time it was definitely showing its age and had become a pain in the ass. The last straw was when I installed Netscape 4.0 and it felt as slow as molasses on a Sunday morning in December.
I then got a 7100, already four years old at the time, as a stand-in for a year until '99 when I saved up my $$ and plunked down for a 450Mhz G4 AGP in 9/99. That machine, from which I'm writing this, will be five years old in September, and unfortunately may have to make it another year or so before I can upgrade to G5 goodness. But, thanks to Panther, it runs fast and smooth and the only times I get annoyed with it are when I'm either a) trying to compile a really software project or b) trying to do something really complicated in Logic.
I suspect that a CPU upgrade is the only solution to the sluggishness. Disk, RAM, and video card upgrades only get you so far... Even when I do upgrade, though, I don't think I'll get rid of my current machine, it's still fast enough for most things. And perhaps it could also function as an Xgrid node for a little extra processing power for distributed compiles or somesuch?
I can say, without hesitation, Macs are built to last. Apple products in general. If you don't believe me, I have an Apple II+ (build c. 1979) in perfect working order I can show you some time.
thumpnugget (not signed in)
Which is ironic really, as it was Microware OS-9, not System 9 :-) I worked with it about 10 years ago, and was most suprised when I first came across Mac OS 9.
The ways of gods are mysteriously indistinguishable from chance.