IMHO people are too fond of conspiracy theories and the likes... If they knew it wouldn't work they'd have fixed it...
Sure they know there was a risk, I'm sure... but that's like goin out yelling TOYOTA KNEW THIS ACCIDENT WOULD HAPPEN!&#@$#! when there's a car accident.
I was joking Or maybe you're trolling. God only knows.
Well I'm not God. But i know. The simple answer is, after your first post (parent to my first reply), I simply did not see the joke. Not very strange if I may say so, since your post carried a big resemblance to your first post.
As to the state of Amiga, comparing an A500 is nothing to a modern computer... but if Amiga makes a comeback I doubt it'll be with an A500. Good luck to them, and I wont pass any more comment until I see what they actually have to come up with compared against other computers of today.
Well who's gonna make it then? Or are you saying everyone holding on to their old Amiga 500s should just go out and give them away? No... if there was some reason to make a whole damn bunch of computers just to give them away, someone would have already. Sorry, the world doesn't work that way...
The Amiga was just another old (but nice) OS gone stale. The only way I want to see Amiga come back is if the GPL the lot and any nice bits can be put in Linux
Oh... and I thought Amigas were computers. Doh to me. Maybe we can put the disk drive under the GPL. Or the keyboard.
And include the good parts in Linux! Yeah... I'll download the new kernel and you'll send me an updated amiga keyboard ok?
Well, that kinda depends on how they make it, doesnt it? I beleive it would be possible to make an RPG (especially with the entire Star Wars universe to pick in making enviroments) with sufficient space to make diff. "colonies".
I mean, that way, all the 12-yo-brats (and their 35-yo companions) could keep somewhere, and a bit more "serious" people could keep on their own [planet|space station|whatever]. If they keep it in mind... it *could* work.
Yay! We have CD's and DVDs... oh all I wanted was to spend all that research to find yet another write-once media. and it's 10 GB on a roll of tape.
Like... even if this is actually true, it's so obviously pointless... MurderSlaughter-Arnold II, now available on scotch tape (encrypted and region encoded to your exact coordinates of course).
Well, that should be no problem. The GPL is a license that covers the original work and all derivate works from it.
A patch is always derivate, it's in its nature. Even if the patch itself contain 100% original code, what would the patch be if it wasnt for a program (derived from it)...? It wouldn't be a patch. The line is pretty clear. Anything that patches a GPLed program is a derivate work from that GPLed program and thus falls under the GPL itself. If the patch doesn't patch a GPLed program, and isn't derivate from one, then it isn't a patch anyway.
Which raises the intriguing possibility that the original author is incapacitated or dead, so the process could run forever on some forgotten server in Microsoft's basement...
Uh, no. Microsoft's servers dont run forever. The process would be dead in a few months...
Ok. So what? Then it's the DVD-ROM device that contains the copy protection then. I don't see how CSS does. Also, if the DVD-ROM drives wont let you read the key, it isn't possible to view any DVD movie on your computer, since (even with a decoder card) you could not possibly get the key to decode the data. Care to explain how this fits together?
When you copy using consumer DVD-ROM you DO NOT have a perfect copy of the DVD disk, you do not have the keys that are required to decrypt the DVD.
Um, when did DVD-ROM come into question? It's perfectly possible to copy all the data on a DVD disc onto some device. The DVD-ROMs that exist today are entirely unusable if nothing else just due to their price: the copy is more expensive than another bought copy of the original. Fact is though, I can copy the data on a DVD disc, keys and all.
The copy protection in this case, that you have missed, is the DVD-ROM. That's right... the DVD-ROM contains the copy protection, in the form of the pre-burned keyspace. I can't copy a CD onto a normal CD either, I need a CD-R for it. Just because the end media isn't suitable, doesnt mean the source media contains copy protection. The end media does.
All I am saying is that we should lock up people who are bent on "violent overthrow". I'm sure laws exist on the books prohibiting "plotting armed insurrection". As long as an ideology doesn't advocate violence as the primary means to an end, I believe such people should have the "freedom to" do whatever they wish.
Sorry to blow your bubble but every system everywhere prohibits that. Yes you think the current system is good, so you don't want it violently overthrown. But if the US was now in dictatorial hands, I'm pretty sure you'd want it to be violently overthrown, and see it as fully justified. Just because you think it's a good ideology doesnt make violent overthrowing of it any better, or worse, than with any other ideology
Sure, you can copy the bytes of a DVD without a decoder, but they aren't useable in that fashion.
Isn't copying == making copies anymore?
YES the DVD copy is usable, exactly as usable as the original. It is, afterall, a copy. You still need a decoder to play it. In what way has CSS protected against this making of a totally usable copy? CSS is an access protection system.
Sure, you can copy the bytes of a CD without a CD player, but they aren't usable that way either. What would you do? Spin the CD really fast and sing along? Copying has nothing to do with whether or not you can use the copy, copying has to do with making a (yeah thats right!) COPY! Wow, whatta thought. A copy means, in this case, another DVD disc with the same data as the first.
it's astounding to me that you could even construe what i said to imply what you *assume* i said.
That's called sarcasm. I was trying to point out that the US is the best place to look if you wanna find out how bribes can be allowed in public, on a grand scale.
on your second point, if you don't believe that every single country in europe or asia hasn't got a case of the bribery blues, i really suggest you visit there and try to start a business.
Here's another american thing I've seen alot, the assumtion that everyone is an american too. I dont need to visit, I live in Europe thank you very much.
every chinese immigrant i met in college bought their way out of china. EVERY SINGLE ONE. i have first hand experience with business in europe, and i can guarantee you there are many laws formed through the veil of nationalism that are simply based on bribery.
When did china relocate into Europe? Stop talking about china, the US was spying on european countries. Want me to spell that?
every time you propagate another myth that every american is a bigoted, greedy bastard, puts you right back into the most dangerous of situations. ignorant stereotyping. haven't we learned that this isn't really a wise move by now?
I haven't said anything at all about all americans.. actually I've just pointed out that american companies are buying laws and politicans pretty much out in the open. Did you bother to read my post?
Now listen: Please do not call me an idiot for saying that China is not in Europe. Please do not back up a claim about European countries with examples from China. Thank you.
Re:Well, well. The Clintonistas are enraged.
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Or, in other words: We tried government and it burned children to death in Waco. It has failed. We will now try something else.
Sorry but you sound like a caveman here.
- Me try boat. Boat no work. Boat hit iceberg and sink. Me try something else. - Me try car. Car run off road. Me hurt. Car no good idea. Me try something else. - Me try airplane. Airplane crash. Me try something else. - Me sit at home doing nothing. Nothing works. Ooooogh.
The real, actual, fact, that has so properly been demonstated to you here, is: Without the government, the rich people will make themselves the new government. Humans want power. If you dont like it, try your non-government-society with aliens or cows or something.
- Me no like Clinton. Government not work. Me not trust anyone who say government might work. Me refuse to listen. Me smart. Oooggghh.
Interesting for sure, yes... But I thought we were talking European countries being the "victims" here? I don't care if China has alot of bribes everywhere, that isn't a legitimate reason for the US to spy on European countries.
Oh... so what you're saying is that bribery is only okay if done (in public view) for high officials with lots of money from big companies, but it's not cultural?
Great.
Really, thats... nice.
I don't know many other countries where companies have openly bought their own laws just like that...
Also, looking at your 1) we could also say people hate MS just for being successfull, and I could use that argument to knock down whatever you may say. There are alot of things I like about America, and alot of things I dislike. Saying that all the things I dislike are just because the US is successful is just plain stupid, unless you plan to back it up with something more tan that.
Nobody's holding you in this country...Find the first flight out if you want out so bad.
<SARCASM>YAY! Let's all stop trying to make things better or critizise what's wrong, let's just all move somewhere else!</SARCASM>
Oh now please! Really... I'm so damn tired of this "if you dont like it move somewhere else" attitude. What if you find something you really dont like with your country? Would you shut up and just move without a word? Or would you complain about it? Maybe you have something keeping you in your country? Family? Friends? Come on... if we all just shuffle around like bees each time something is wrong and keep our mouths shut to not voice our oppinions and annoy people who cant take someone with a different oppinion in their country, how do you expect anything to be good in the end?
The goverments of most other countrys are corrupt beyond even the wildest imagination [...]
How naive... you think the US government is less corrupt? Even after all this recent bs about DMCA and UCITA and allllll that? Sorry, now, I'll be back in a few days when I've finished laughing.
Re:You still don't get it.
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So tell me... how will a person that cannot work for some reason gain his/her part of this infinite wealth?
I find it very hard to beleive that simply if we dump the governments of the world we'll all be able to just stroll along eating ice cream. You need more than that to back such a claim up.
Re:You still don't get it.
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needed-but-not-profitable areas
A meaningless contradiction in terms. If something is needed, people will pay for it. If they're not willing to pay for it, obviously they don't need it very much.
You're assuming noone lacks money. If you have any good reason for the fact that noone will lack the money to get what they need, then I'll consider that. Everything else you say makes good sense.
Re:No, no, no. You almost sound like a Liberal :)
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No, no, of course not. That's absurd. If there's profit in it, and if there's no government to enforce monopolies, then there will always be competition. That's a basic law of economics.
Under normal circumstances yes. Technology and inventions, coupled up with that same profit in it, if there's a possibility to make such a technology that noone will be able to copy it but yet many people want it (which is surely possible in some fields), a corportation will hold a monopoly... Also, in a truly "free" market, what prevents Huge Big Company from buying newsmalljuststarted and iwannacompetewithyou and shut them down?
In fact, it is theoretically and practically impossible for any form of coercion, monopoly, or involuntary servitude (taxes) to exist in the absence of a government. Anything the government supposedly does for you, could be done more cheaply and efficiently by private enterprise. Governments are pure parasites. They have an infinite appetite, and no useful function.
Well, I think governments are needed, or we'll lose order and alot of needed-but-not-profitable areas would go. But... governments are the worst kind of innefficiensies i've ever seen... Nothing's as good at buying less for more money than a government. Thats where I think the true problem is. Could be done more efficiently and cheaply yes, but that's assuming everyone has the money to pay for it.
Re:TMTOWTDI -- competition is good
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100 years ago, electric cars and steam cars were more promising than internal combustion. Good thing they didn't decide right off the bat which to pursue.
Maybe if they had, the gigantic oil companies of today wouldnt buy up any new inventions for electric cars to prevent electric cars from becoming better/popular... regardless of enviroment etc... An electric car can actually be much more efficient than a combustion-engine-car, because it can feed the engine any amount of power it needs... only problem is battery technology.
Yes, it's good to go both ways... if you keep going at it both ways. Competition is good...
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You missed the point that the US has a very high percentage of people behind bars, and there's still a high crimerate.
It's kinda ironic that you take being a gay and wanting to marry into an example of why the american "free" way of life is good...
Your stupidity exposes itself. Back boy. Back to the fantasy world. Go on. Reallity could seriously hurt your opinion of yourself.
Sure they know there was a risk, I'm sure... but that's like goin out yelling TOYOTA KNEW THIS ACCIDENT WOULD HAPPEN!&#@$#! when there's a car accident.
Pretty much pointless.
Well I'm not God. But i know. The simple answer is, after your first post (parent to my first reply), I simply did not see the joke. Not very strange if I may say so, since your post carried a big resemblance to your first post.
As to the state of Amiga, comparing an A500 is nothing to a modern computer... but if Amiga makes a comeback I doubt it'll be with an A500. Good luck to them, and I wont pass any more comment until I see what they actually have to come up with compared against other computers of today.
Well who's gonna make it then? Or are you saying everyone holding on to their old Amiga 500s should just go out and give them away? No... if there was some reason to make a whole damn bunch of computers just to give them away, someone would have already. Sorry, the world doesn't work that way...
Oh... and I thought Amigas were computers. Doh to me. Maybe we can put the disk drive under the GPL. Or the keyboard.
And include the good parts in Linux! Yeah... I'll download the new kernel and you'll send me an updated amiga keyboard ok?
I mean, that way, all the 12-yo-brats (and their 35-yo companions) could keep somewhere, and a bit more "serious" people could keep on their own [planet|space station|whatever]. If they keep it in mind... it *could* work.
Like... even if this is actually true, it's so obviously pointless... MurderSlaughter-Arnold II, now available on scotch tape (encrypted and region encoded to your exact coordinates of course).
Gimme a break...
A patch is always derivate, it's in its nature. Even if the patch itself contain 100% original code, what would the patch be if it wasnt for a program (derived from it)...? It wouldn't be a patch. The line is pretty clear. Anything that patches a GPLed program is a derivate work from that GPLed program and thus falls under the GPL itself. If the patch doesn't patch a GPLed program, and isn't derivate from one, then it isn't a patch anyway.
Uh, no. Microsoft's servers dont run forever. The process would be dead in a few months...
Ok. So what? Then it's the DVD-ROM device that contains the copy protection then. I don't see how CSS does. Also, if the DVD-ROM drives wont let you read the key, it isn't possible to view any DVD movie on your computer, since (even with a decoder card) you could not possibly get the key to decode the data. Care to explain how this fits together?
Um, when did DVD-ROM come into question? It's perfectly possible to copy all the data on a DVD disc onto some device. The DVD-ROMs that exist today are entirely unusable if nothing else just due to their price: the copy is more expensive than another bought copy of the original. Fact is though, I can copy the data on a DVD disc, keys and all.
The copy protection in this case, that you have missed, is the DVD-ROM. That's right... the DVD-ROM contains the copy protection, in the form of the pre-burned keyspace. I can't copy a CD onto a normal CD either, I need a CD-R for it. Just because the end media isn't suitable, doesnt mean the source media contains copy protection. The end media does.
Sorry to blow your bubble but every system everywhere prohibits that. Yes you think the current system is good, so you don't want it violently overthrown. But if the US was now in dictatorial hands, I'm pretty sure you'd want it to be violently overthrown, and see it as fully justified. Just because you think it's a good ideology doesnt make violent overthrowing of it any better, or worse, than with any other ideology
Isn't copying == making copies anymore?
YES the DVD copy is usable, exactly as usable as the original. It is, afterall, a copy. You still need a decoder to play it. In what way has CSS protected against this making of a totally usable copy? CSS is an access protection system.
Sure, you can copy the bytes of a CD without a CD player, but they aren't usable that way either. What would you do? Spin the CD really fast and sing along? Copying has nothing to do with whether or not you can use the copy, copying has to do with making a (yeah thats right!) COPY! Wow, whatta thought. A copy means, in this case, another DVD disc with the same data as the first.
That's called sarcasm. I was trying to point out that the US is the best place to look if you wanna find out how bribes can be allowed in public, on a grand scale.
on your second point, if you don't believe that every single country in europe or asia hasn't got a case of the bribery blues, i really suggest you visit there and try to start a business.
Here's another american thing I've seen alot, the assumtion that everyone is an american too. I dont need to visit, I live in Europe thank you very much.
every chinese immigrant i met in college bought their way out of china. EVERY SINGLE ONE. i have first hand experience with business in europe, and i can guarantee you there are many laws formed through the veil of nationalism that are simply based on bribery.
When did china relocate into Europe? Stop talking about china, the US was spying on european countries. Want me to spell that?
every time you propagate another myth that every american is a bigoted, greedy bastard, puts you right back into the most dangerous of situations. ignorant stereotyping. haven't we learned that this isn't really a wise move by now?
I haven't said anything at all about all americans.. actually I've just pointed out that american companies are buying laws and politicans pretty much out in the open. Did you bother to read my post?
Now listen:
Please do not call me an idiot for saying that China is not in Europe. Please do not back up a claim about European countries with examples from China. Thank you.
Sorry but you sound like a caveman here.
- Me try boat. Boat no work. Boat hit iceberg and sink. Me try something else.
- Me try car. Car run off road. Me hurt. Car no good idea. Me try something else.
- Me try airplane. Airplane crash. Me try something else.
- Me sit at home doing nothing. Nothing works. Ooooogh.
The real, actual, fact, that has so properly been demonstated to you here, is: Without the government, the rich people will make themselves the new government. Humans want power. If you dont like it, try your non-government-society with aliens or cows or something.
- Me no like Clinton. Government not work. Me not trust anyone who say government might work. Me refuse to listen. Me smart. Oooggghh.
Interesting for sure, yes... But I thought we were talking European countries being the "victims" here? I don't care if China has alot of bribes everywhere, that isn't a legitimate reason for the US to spy on European countries.
Great.
Really, thats... nice.
I don't know many other countries where companies have openly bought their own laws just like that...
Also, looking at your 1) we could also say people hate MS just for being successfull, and I could use that argument to knock down whatever you may say. There are alot of things I like about America, and alot of things I dislike. Saying that all the things I dislike are just because the US is successful is just plain stupid, unless you plan to back it up with something more tan that.
<SARCASM>YAY! Let's all stop trying to make things better or critizise what's wrong, let's just all move somewhere else!</SARCASM>
Oh now please! Really... I'm so damn tired of this "if you dont like it move somewhere else" attitude. What if you find something you really dont like with your country? Would you shut up and just move without a word? Or would you complain about it? Maybe you have something keeping you in your country? Family? Friends? Come on... if we all just shuffle around like bees each time something is wrong and keep our mouths shut to not voice our oppinions and annoy people who cant take someone with a different oppinion in their country, how do you expect anything to be good in the end?
How naive... you think the US government is less corrupt? Even after all this recent bs about DMCA and UCITA and allllll that? Sorry, now, I'll be back in a few days when I've finished laughing.
I find it very hard to beleive that simply if we dump the governments of the world we'll all be able to just stroll along eating ice cream. You need more than that to back such a claim up.
A meaningless contradiction in terms. If something is needed, people will pay for it. If they're not willing to pay for it, obviously they don't need it very much.
You're assuming noone lacks money. If you have any good reason for the fact that noone will lack the money to get what they need, then I'll consider that. Everything else you say makes good sense.
Under normal circumstances yes. Technology and inventions, coupled up with that same profit in it, if there's a possibility to make such a technology that noone will be able to copy it but yet many people want it (which is surely possible in some fields), a corportation will hold a monopoly... Also, in a truly "free" market, what prevents Huge Big Company from buying newsmalljuststarted and iwannacompetewithyou and shut them down?
In fact, it is theoretically and practically impossible for any form of coercion, monopoly, or involuntary servitude (taxes) to exist in the absence of a government. Anything the government supposedly does for you, could be done more cheaply and efficiently by private enterprise. Governments are pure parasites. They have an infinite appetite, and no useful function.
Well, I think governments are needed, or we'll lose order and alot of needed-but-not-profitable areas would go. But... governments are the worst kind of innefficiensies i've ever seen... Nothing's as good at buying less for more money than a government. Thats where I think the true problem is. Could be done more efficiently and cheaply yes, but that's assuming everyone has the money to pay for it.
Maybe if they had, the gigantic oil companies of today wouldnt buy up any new inventions for electric cars to prevent electric cars from becoming better/popular... regardless of enviroment etc... An electric car can actually be much more efficient than a combustion-engine-car, because it can feed the engine any amount of power it needs... only problem is battery technology.
Yes, it's good to go both ways... if you keep going at it both ways. Competition is good...