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The Internet is America-centric, But for How Long
joshamania writes "There's an article on Yahoo entitled "Why the Net doesn't belong to America." The article references some good examples of "side-stepping" government regulation on the Internet. " This is gonna become much more important in upcoming years. What will it mean, and how will it affect all of us?
Maybe the continued success of the internet will show the government that they should just stay the hell out of it.... but I doubt it.
What do will it mean, and how will it effect all of us?
It do will mean we all do will stop do speaking English. Just like you do did demonstrate.
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Linux MAPI Server!
http://www.openone.com/software/MailOne/
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Great grammer...
This was a fairly informative article, and it brought up a good point. How are they going to regulate information and services which are illegal in some areas and legal in others? There are quite a few ways that this whole thing could go, this isnt the first time that a new medium has had trouble on a global scale. I think that the most likely course of action to be taken, is that individual nations will have to work together when governing Internet relations. Joel is right, I can't see a single orginization on Earth that could effectively govern the Internet. But it could (possibly) work if the Internet-capable nations of the world worked together, instead of for themselves, as the author pointed out. Sharkey
www.badassmofo.com
The rest of the world is too stupid
The information infrastructure of the European countries is far better developed than in most regions of the US. The major cities in US have great cable, but in Europe, 90% of the population, no matter where they live, will be able to connect through an xDSL connection within 1-2 years.
In my country, Denmark, all telephone centrals are digital, but I think only about 40% of US' telephone centrals are the same.
Anders Ebbesen
Countries with stricter porn laws, for example, will need to code computers to recognize the naked human (animal?) form, and ban such images/sites.
This is equally likely to happen as changing the laws...
EOM
Is the Government hurting business by trying to regulate the internet (which seems pretty impossible), or should they be able to have export controls over encryption, or online gambling in the US. Seems like any regulations that they do make are going to be darn hard to enforce, so should they even bother...
void theoremProver(){
print "this product is correct"
}
Apart from economic reasons, I think one major reason why the internet is so "Americanized" is due to language. Our forefathers probably never thought of this when they invented English, but it turned out that English is highly "digital friendly." Foreign sites such as Chinese or Japanese are always at a disadvantage in terms of growth, due to the way their language is written out. Until that is resolved through technology, I predict the internet will continue to serve up mostly American (and British) content. It's a pity.
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JavaScript tutorials scripts
So do we 'own' democracy the same way we 'own' the internet?
======================. http://www.nsacom.net | ======================'
Most citizens of non us countries hate the US to varying degrees, this is just another facet of that. The one good thing about US imperialism,
as opposed to say, British, is free speech. At least the internet isn't being censored by the government within our borders.
ICQ#2584116
-- d'arcy poirot
hey rob, why don't you go back to the 6th grade and learn proper sentence structure. i swear, a news service and the editors can't even "speak" in correct sentences.
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This Post has been brought to you by the letter "E".
We don't need you. We don't need your legislated morality. We don't need your MPAA/RIAA stormtroopers. Take your DMCA and shove it right up you ass.
A quick thought....
Because an American invented the telephone, does that mean that we own the telephones in England? Do we own all the world's radios? The software (that Americans, you say, made) that runs the internet was _purchased_. The infrastructure of the internet in other countries is not owned by the US. The ideas behind it may have originated in the US, but the US in no way owns the internet, any more than we own telephone communication.
And you say that the US produces 99% of the hardware running the internet. This is completely untrue. I challenge you to find even one part of the computer you're sitting in front of that was made in the US.
So there.
Jim
>Only trouble is, a number of Australian porn
/. article before, but Canada has no restrictions regarding content on Internet sites, as stated in this document. Wanna set up a porn server? Try Toronto...
>sites have neatly sidestepped the regulations
>by having their sites hosted on U.S. servers.
Interesting point. I don't know if it was mentioned in a
Right now some countries are complaining about how english-centric the web is. We will be seeing more of spanish ( http://www.Quepasa.com ), Chinese, Japenese, German ( http://www.suse.de ), and the like.
Maybe this will provide the stimulis that the Europeans have on learning more than one language. With them is has always been the proximity of the different countries and lanquages. Now it is being brought right to our computer screen.
Of course they can't tax people until they can track what they're doing, hence the control freak laws, the anti-crypto attitude, etc.
this isn't some stupid product, this is for some people a major change in the world. and as more and more countries start to have a bigger presence on the internet, they will begin making large contributions whether they know it or not. there will be larger amounts of server set up in other countries, fatter pipes, etc. and the whole thing will spread, and the traffic will flow there to.
anyhow, there's no reason for americans to be such uptight. the idea is to share information, right? it's hard to do that if we don't share access to the information, or if we discourage people from enjoying it and then making their own additions to this place.
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"don't smoke, don't drink, don't fuck
at least i can fucking think"
Minor Threat
While various counties cooperating across international boundaries sounds like a good concept, this is a fairly rudimentary analysis of the problem. Just as regional variations of public decency exist in the US they exist in even greater abundance across the globe. Are the standards that apply in San Francisco going to fly in China?? Most likely not. Porn is only the tip of this iceburg. The prevalance of filtering software compounds this problem. (Latin = cum for example.) The solution is not as simple as saying everyone play nice.
I'm not sure if this guy meant to be funny, but it does seem he leans a bit towards believing what he wrote.
I live in America and I enjoy it when I see people bash our country. We have free speech and our share of loud mouth biggots who are offended when someone disagrees with them. When some nut exercises his free speech and manages to offend just about everyone, he unwittingly generates interesting discussion.
One only needs to disprove his theory by grepping source code in our software for email addresses. If one thinks America dominates the internet, why are most author's email addresses non-US?
The US doesn't "own" the net as a whole, but US corporations own whopping big portions of it. And as long as that is the case, the net will be pretty US-Centric. And with inertia being what it is, this is not likely to change. Today, "getting on the net" in any kind of global manner means conforming to the current net culture. And current net culture is pretty damn US-centric, with some European culture thrown in for spice.
We probably will see some more "local" subsets of the internet based on local languages. But I suspect that most of these will remain just that, local subsets, while the main streets of the internet will remain pretty much like they are now.
Really, this is only one little piece of the cultural changes that are going on in the world. As the world shrinks, cultures get jammed together. And as they get jammed together, they tend to borrow from and/or absorb each other. This is really what the "Invasive American Culture" really is. And it isn't just a matter American culture swamping others. American culture itself is aquiring foreign elements. As "The Economist" noted last year, the two hot things among the eight-year-old set were a Japanese cartoon and a British book.
The cake is a pie
Jurisdictions will then have to compete to provide the level of protection that consumers actually want for their transactions and that the businesses want from lawsuits. The jurisdictions that can come up with the right amount of protection for the right price will attract the businesses. And businesses can actually set up servers in multiple locations and allow customers to select the level of legal protection they want.
The net will not be what we demand, but what we make it. Build it well.
So do we 'own' democracy the same way we 'own' the internet?
The internet is a thing, and democracy is an idea. Since we never patented the idea of democracy, it's free for the taking. And we should be encouraged to note that England and France both observed our idea of democracy and tried to reverse-engineer it for their own use. Of course their implementations leave a great deal to be desired, but there's room to hope. After being defeated in the Revolutionary War, the British turned around and tried to imitate the system that defeated them by adding a Congress (called "Parliament") to their government, and a president (called a "Prime Minister") to their government. Maybe they're not as dumb as they look. They saw that royalism had failed them, and by 1850 they had a crude approximation of our form of government up and running. They're almost as good at copying our ideas as the Japanese are.
However, the mere fact that our democracy has attracted knockoff artists is no reason for us not to take full credit for it. It's ours. We invented it when nobody (certainly not in England or France) had ever thought of it before, and we implemented it when nobody thought it would work. We can be proud of what we've done, though unfortunately we aren't able to charge royalties for it (if you think that's not reasonable, stop and think about the incredible benefits democracy brings in terms of prosperity -- England and France are socialist countries, but if they didn't have crude forms of democracy in place they'd be much, much poorer than they are. They've profited by our system, and they should certainly pay what they owe to the people who brought them those benefits).
The internet is another matter. It's not only an idea, but an implementation of that idea. We own the software and the hardware. It's ours. Period. End of story.
Next?
I'm sorry, is this (very tiny speck of fluff) a piece of your brain?
But the telephone was invented by a Canuck, Alexander Graham Bell.
As were many other awesome inventions, including of course Poutine (those crazy frogs).
"I build my canopy of steel.. it fulfills my sense of real.. a chrome protection" - Catherine Wheel
... but:
YHBT. YHL. HAND.
Denmark is a tiny speck. When you can say that all of Europe is all digital (much more comparable to size/pop of US), then your stetement will mean something. Also, we had phone switches installed decades before much of EU, whil you guys were still doing IP over yodeling for long distance comm.
The software (that Americans, you say, made) that runs the internet was _purchased_.
.fi .au .de .se... in the source code.
What software do you run? Windows? Ha!
Most people run Linux and BSD for the internet. Notice all the
Umm it was a Scotman (Alexander Graham Bell) that invented the telephone...
this isn't some stupid product, this is for some people a major change in the world.
Indeed. Therefore they should pay us all the more for it. I've had it up to here with the US handing out goodies to the whole world and then getting insulted for our trouble. Our sneaker plants in the Philipines are the greatest boon that economy has ever seen. You owe us for that too, pal. As regards the Internet, we can and should name our own price.
the idea is to share information, right?
Meaningless babble. The idea is a mutually voluntary exchange of value between equals -- otherwise known as the Free Market. Pay up or fuck off, that's the way I see it.
Content filtering is hard. With text, how do you recognize the difference between the real thing and a discussion on filtering that contains the phrases used for filtering? With images, how do you tell the difference between naked people being pornographic and a medical site with pictures of various medical conditions. Articles on skin cancer will get filtered out.
The net will not be what we demand, but what we make it. Build it well.
If one thinks America dominates the internet, why are most author's email addresses non-US?
Because with "open sores" software, any lazy imbecile on the dole in England or Germany can go to the CVS repository, grab the code, and pepper it with fake foreign email addresses.
Which they have done.
99% of the addresses you mention are fake. Bank on it.
Except that I'll probably have to have 20% naked Canadian chicks to meet that domestic content rule. Anyone wanna see Celine Dion naked?
What do you expect from a site where the majority of users would flunk a second-grade English test... he's just catering to the massess...
MORE THAN MORE THAN MORE THAN MORE THAN
Yeeeeah.
Please suck my balls.
Thank you.
be something that people could surf in,
kind of like water. But utility companies
sell water as a commodity, and governments
own harbors and seaports and resevoirs.
But rain effects all of us. I wonder
how many people take their surfboards
into international waters.
Maybe spam=rain in the extended analogy.
Everybody has to put up with rain.
Or maybe the net in some places will become
cause Montezuma's revenge.
A greater man that I once said,
"Water, water everywhere, but
not a drop to drink"
Amazing magic tricks
Or Taco? I don't see how I could be a sellout without making any money off my site.
Linus has been almost 100% assimilated now. He lives here. He works here. He's even mostly lost his Swedish accent. All of you Euros will eventually submit to us. We 0\/\/n j00. And if you don't submit, we'll bomb you (Iraq, Serbia, Somolia).
Say you have a document that contains "questionable" material and is therefore blocked from your sight, due to a cromulent school administration or parent etc. Would it be possible to, through a mirrorsite or something, to e.g. babelfish the offending document and download it in translation, and then return it to its original language?
This seems like a way to thwart censorware and pr0n blockers. Is there something I'm missing or is this a possible home remedy to censorware?
As translation programs get better you're sure to have less lexicon errors and idiomatic strangeness, and you could get documents from english to german to english mit nur ein bischen of error. Purple monkey farmhouse.
Just wondering. Flame away.
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I know what you're getting from Yahoo and Doubleclick under the table. This sort of shameless, two-faced behavior disgusts me.
for a country thats less than 300 years old, youve got a pretty high opinion of yourselves... maybe thats the reason most of the rest of the world hates Americans...
We've accomplished more in the past 224 years of free democracy than the rest of the world accomplished in the past five thousand years. We have literally transformed this planet from a mess of squabbling petty agricultural dictatorships into a place where human beings can live decent lives. Other countries see this and they resent our success. That resentment congeals very easily into hatred when we refuse to bow and scrape to their supposedly "superior" (read: "decadent and degenerate") "cultures".
We have a high opinion of ourselves because we have created more wealth and opportunity in 224 years than was created in all of history preceding our independence. We have a high opinion of ourselves because we are the greatest nation that ever existed on this Earth.
99% of the addresses you mention are fake. Bank on it.
And Microsoft and other American capitalist software companies wrote all its code and never stole any of it.
Who says? By all accounts, the Net is having enormous success across countless areas of human endeavor - in business, education, communication, etc. Sure, the hodge-podge of differing MO's can be frustrating to deal with, but it pales in comparison to the benefits that are being realized.
Just another "the Internet is a globalizing force that will bring down the barriers... (blah blah blah)" article. Nothing new or interesting here as far as I can see... sorry!
Stop by my site where I write about ERP systems & more
For christ sake, can't people learn to at least properly edit a post around here? Isn't that what the preview button is for? Or doesn't Taco think he needs to edit his story postings? I could write better than this in grade three.
..."
"What do will it mean, and how will it affect all of us?"
This was taken from the front page a couple of minutes ago, before HE CHANGED IT. Maybe if he edited BEFORE HE POSTED, he wouldn't have to change the main post after words. And not even an update along the lines of:
"Update by CT: My grammar sucks, the story should have read:
Pr0n K1ng
Ah well, off to download more AMERICAN pr0n.
Oh well, back to dowloading pr0n...
Pr0n K1ng
Funny, after watching the slow-as-molasses action regarding the new TLD's over the past couple years, I've often thought of them as ICANN't.
Constitutionally Correct
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America only owns most of the internet used by Americans - ask a Frenchman, Japanese, Korean, Arab who owns their internet and they'll give you a different answer.
It's like saying Russia owns the sky because there are more there than anywhere else
It looks so because most sites from other countries that are non english are ignored. Ignored in search engines, ignored by readers. Another problem is domain naming. Most US based people believe that every site has to have a .com at the end, or its some type of a screwed thing. try to explain to someone that canoe.ca site is a valid site? I seen webboards that complained that I was spamming and not using my real email because it was @*.ca . Another trend that is bad, is domain squatting. Many sites haveto resort to .geographical sites (how many are there in the form of onet.com.pl ?) Internet is US based because US people are used to have it available to them at any time. Many Euro countries charge internet by telephone impulse (per minute) so its pretty expensive. Links inbetween Euro ISPs on the other hand are not as much saturated as between US ISPs and Co-Lo.. Another problem is that US has not many backbones linking to EU and ViceVersa.. Thats were US feels that EU has big lag on their servers, and is therefore backwards in technology. I dunno but could it be that all links from US are so slow becase Echelon cant handle any more bandwidth? Just look into how much software and how many sites that are worthwhile are usefull.. And how much portal crap you have from US? What percentage of Spam is US based? Now who is using internet how it should be and who is polluting it? Does polluting Internet with crap make sure the only way to be visible? I hope that US clears up their act and stops polluting internet with their SPAM and Portals crap, and behave as any other civilized country.
Just because the various governments of the United States cannot regulate every single aspect of the Internet does not mean the Internet will become less American. There is more to America than it's federal, state, and local governments. The largest infrastructure companies are all America-based and owned predominantly by American investors. The vast majority of "internet" companies are American ventures. Even the ones that aren't based in America and employing Americans are still more an reflection of imported American cultures and values than their native ones. Europe is full of exhortations to become more like America in order to be competitive. Even if the future Internet is run by companies based in Europe or somewhere else it will only be because they have traded in their European ideals for American ones. The Net is and will remain for the indefinite future "American".
Capitalist companies write their own code, because they have no need to lick the "open sores" of the unemployable incompetents and college kids who make up the "free beer movement" as you call it.
Microsoft is obviously not going to incorporate "freely available" bugs when they have 15,000 of the best programming professionals on Earth working for them on site.
What is this going to mean for the languages spoken on the Internet? Is English going to remain the lingua franca?
From the article:
and the first international gathering of Net industry groups is earmarked to take place in Australia this December.
Are they going to allow reps from the adult industry, considering the meeting is in Australia? Like it or not, 'Adult' web pages are a huge part of the net.
The net interprets censorship as damage and routes around it. -- John Gilmore
what country did he live in when he "invented" the telephone? I thought so
The telephone was invented by Maucci (sp?), an italian, years before alexander Grahm Bell supposedly invented it. You'd have known this if you'd watched Godfather, part 3.
Must point out that at least per capita, the US is not the most connected country. Sweden surpasses all other countries both in percentage connected to the internet, and in number of wireless appliances.
And as for the rest of your supposed "knowledge" of history, you can forget about it!
This is great! Check it:
http://xlem.hypermart.net
Heh. :)
Anyway, my original point was that all the content rules simply don't apply, as decreed by the CRTC (our version of the FCC) recently. The link on my original post has the full press release. Interestingly, the CRTC doesn't consider transmissions on the Internet as broadcasting. I wonder how this will apply to legal decisions in the future...
It's all a damn good thing, too, since I sure don't wanna see that broomstick Dion naked. She needs to eat more.
Like all of the tiny number of foreigners competent in technical fields, Bell came here to the US where he would be fairly compensated for his innovations. He didn't want to see his work "nationalized" (read: stolen) by a hopelessly corrupt European government, and he certainly didn't want to be thrown in prison for disturbing the social order of fiefdoms and the repressive Catholic Church which still ruled in Europe until the Second World War, when it was forcibly removed by American altruists (to the wild cheers and joy of the long-brutalized European population).
Your comment is funny, but it illustrates a very real point. Language barriers are increasingly become a factor on the net because we are encountering people with whom we don't fluently share a common language more frequently. There are several consequence to this. The obvious one is the question of actually communicating with the people we do business with, or want to. Conveying our intentions clearly takes effort. The common vocabulary and context isn't reliably there.
But that leads to other, less obvious consequences. With large transactions, business to business, it is worthwhile to have lawyers on both sides review contracts. There will be an understanding. The contract will specify the remedies if there are disputes. Those will be spelled out in detail at least as great as the contracts for similar transactions that don't cross borders and mix languages.
For large numbers of smaller transactions, the cost of individually reviewing each contract in a number of languages would be prohibitive. That means that there will be some hassles when even well-meaning people have misunderstandings. Furthermore, the customer and the vendor aren't generally the only participants. There will be banks involved transferring funds and billing credit cards. The transaction has to pass muster in a language they can accept.
What about disputes? The merchandise I received wasn't what I expected, or it was damaged in shipping. That isn't a far-fetched scenario. I get things from Western Europe fairly regularly. Magazines get opened, boxes get crushed. So far nothing I've paid for has been damaged more severely than a crease. I've been lucky so far. But how are those disputes going to be handled? Will there be customer service reps available in a variety of languages?
The net will not be what we demand, but what we make it. Build it well.
Umm it was a Scotman (Alexander Graham Bell) that invented the telephone...
In Brantford, Ontario, Canada....
I thought that was funny until I read the subject. It's a small person who slams a person's mother, even smaller though, who does anonymously..
Every schoolchild knows that Bell, like the much greater genius Thomas Edison, did his work in the state of New Jersey in the USA.
Your pathetic attempt to lie your way into our good graces does not impress me. Even if you could honestly claim Bell as your own, he's only one inventor compared to the many, many thousands who were born and lived on American soil, and the dozens of foreigners who came here to perfect their visions.
you just have no sense of humor. If you thought it was funny, it was funny. You can't change your mind just because you thought the object of the joke was misplaced.
You are the kind of person who hears a song, and then upon finding out it is a band you don't like, change your mind. In other words, you are a dick.
Someone said Esperanto, but it's obvious that's going nowhere fast.
I'm trying to teach myself to set people on fire with my mind... Is it hot in here?
404 File Not Found.
Please visit the CyberCities Home Page for Updated Links.
Ummm....that is why Windows 95 sucks? Don't get me wrong, I'm not a huge Windows 95 fan, but it seems to me that your URL is at fault. Not the operating system. I don't doubt your displeasure with Microsoft and your refusal to accept their operating systems, but there is a better way to demonstrate their flaws than this, surely? A misconfigured website can't be the way. Even my female collie would realize this. So....what's the actual....*point* of this URL? Is there a point? What is the point!. I've been thinking about it for quite a while and I don't think that even my female collie would try and figure out the purpoise of such a URL. Please, do enlighten me. I do apologize profusely if I've offended you, but I am somewhat puzzled. I'm sure that I typed in the URL correctly. It sent me around some Cybercities/ku/ site and then ended up with this error message:
404 File Not Found.
Please visit the CyberCities Home Page for Updated Links.
I'm still waiting to see the problem with Windows 95....I ah, ah....heh heh. What's it again? Sorry - heh. Not very much point to that, I'm afraid. I like Anti-Gates sites as much as the next guy, but this is ridiculous. It doesn't work. Check the link! Contact your administrator! anything!
It's been ten minutes since I started writing this post. I've just tried the link again. I wanted to ensure it wasn't a fault on my part, or that the site had some temporary problem. The same thing happens. Same thing. Missing File. I'll contact the administrator of Cybercities and complain about it personally.
-Mark Villopillil.
no sig
The idea of democracy was invented in ancient times.
Wrong. The idea of democracy came out of the barrel of a gun at the battle of Bunker Hill, as you would know if your socialized "school" had taught you anything of worth. Brave Americans died to create it, all so whining cowards like you could hide behind it while spreading your filth.
the Constitution . . . makes America a Republic where the idea of pure democratic rule is toned down by giving all citizens certain basic rights which protect them from the People's "democratic" will.
Again, wrong. The Constitution is here to protect our rights in case the government is illegally hijacked by psychotic criminals like Bill Clinton.
The idea of free trade, by the way, was invented by a Scott, Adam Smith. American economic policy is largely based on ideas first described in Smith's "The Wealth of Nations."
Wrong, wrong, wrong. Smith wrote his work after observing the American economy in its early years of phenomenal growth.
He's just a wine-sipping, cheese-nibbling effete Eurotrash pseudo-intellectual trying desperately (and dishonestly) to share credit for our great achievements.
People like that are helpless weaklings who survive only because all the world trembles in fright at the thought of attacking nations (like Europe) who pay tribute to the USA.
> Because an American invented the telephone
Bullshit. Alexander Graham Bell was born
in Edinburgh, Scotland.
Oh, fuck it. Yes, Americans invented everything.
Everything that was ever of any use to anyone
was invented in the United States of America,
the world's first democracy, the greatest country
on earth. And, of course, it's only ever *one*
person who "invents" something, there are never
other factors in the development of technology.
I can't believe so many people are so petty and
ignorant as to believe the "U.S. kicks ass" tripe.
There's a fine line between pride in your society
or country and blind, ignorant patriotism. It
is, frankly, very ugly and very embarassing.
We just recognize out way of life is better than everyone else's so we bomb anyone who thinks otherwise. What's wrong with that?
The Vietnamese? They wear funny hats. Iraq? They won't give us all their oil. Guatemala? They don't speak English. Yugoslavia? Ah, they're not wearing Nike shoes, dammit. France? Oops, the cats out of the bag.
There's a fine line between pride in your society or country and blind, ignorant patriotism. It is, frankly, very ugly and very embarassing.
Thank God the UK has no jingoists.
Hey, im just a dumb european, and yes you are right! We never invented a single thing, we stole all the good stuff from other cultures and even from ourselves. We stole it from the romans who stole it from the greeks who stole it from the egyptians who stole it from the sumerians who stole it from...
Since we're very good at stealing (8000 years of practice) you yanks don't stand a chance. You even make up idiotic stuff like intelectual (difficult word) property. HA! We have eaten alive about 5 little cultures who tried that!
The way you are proud of your little toy inventions shows us of superior culture how immature your "American Way" really is.
Oh yes, before i forget! We europeans are always very polite, so here comes:
THANK YOU FOR THE INTERNET, YOU MAY LEAVE NOW!
I guess Nortel, Alcatel, Marconi, Nokia, Ericsson, Telelogic, Newbridge, AFC, ADC, AG Com, Cienna Siemmens, BT, Hitachi, (shall I go on) are American now? Please note first, even "American" companies like IBM, Cicso, Lucent, Compaq, etc are International entities, often making more money overseas (see Compaq in Latin America, Cisco in East Africa). Second, that their owners (=shareholders) are not solely American. Third, that The Internet pipes owe as much to hundreds of telcos (AT&T included, but so too BT, Deutche Tel, etc) and they they all capitalized the 'net.
I'm well aware of the difference between "affect" and "effect". Read my quote of him again (don't read his originally--it's been changed).
BTW, to all the other people who have mentioned that despite my humor this is a serious topic: Yes. I know. That's what makes my post so funny.
--
Linux MAPI Server!
http://www.openone.com/software/MailOne/
(Exchange Migration HOWTO coming soon)
...he says while sitting on his potty wrapped up in his super-sized American Flag. Amerika über alles!
While you're there, ponder this: the "American Internet" was born out of paranoia, not love of freedom. Ever spent a moment considering what line of business DARPA is in? On the other hand, the Web--what most people subconsciously mean by "Internet"--was born in Europe, out of the need to share information. Not out of fear of the Soviets. Just something to think about there, Mr. Apple Pie...
Uwe Wolfgang Radu
What do you call someone who speaks three languages? Trilingual.
What do you call someone who speaks two languages? Bilingual.
What do you call someone who speaks one language? American. (badumpbump)
But, for whatever reason, almost everyone puts up with it. I'm American. I can speak American English fluently. I know snippets of Russian from high school. That's it. When I travel, I can almost always find someone to accomodate me. Quite often on newsgroups, mailing lists, bulletin boards, etc you find messages from [obviously] foreign users posting in broken English. I doubt that there are many Americans posting in broken German on c't's discussion threads.
Why are we allowed this "privledge"? I'm not going to project why that might be (mainly so as not to start a flame war), but it seems as though it is destined to stay this way (Americans, much to my embarassment, certainly aren't getting any smarter). The point isn't that Americans use more bandwidth or that a larger percentage of Americans are online. The point is that the Internet is set up and goverened pretty much however Americans (not that I mean to imply via popular vote) chose/choose.
I think it's pretty lame, myself. I don't like being the big, stupid bully.
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Send your friends messages of love at fuck-you.org
deux.
So do we 'own' democracy the same way we 'own' the internet?
/. owns the Net.
No, I own democracy (TM)(R)(C). I patented it last year. Al Gore owns the Internet.
Will in Seattle
This guy is absolutely right. People should collectively kiss our asses. We make all the cool stuff... except possibly for the Japanese. They are pretty damn cool too (PSX2, anime, etc.)
Non Americans are jealous of Americans, especially the disgusting French. They jump at the opportunity to come here.
stop the lies, homo
when I hit the word "e-business" Christ, it's even more annoying than "Information Superhighway".
"Never wrestle with a pig. You both get dirty and the pig likes it."
Yes the Web is US-centric, and will likely remian so until (among other things) the US-based TLD's are removed, or at least forced to append a .us to their names, effectively pushing them up a notch.
.mil. There is some cross-over in the .edu domain, but a number of the other will definetly have to be changed.
AIR, the Russian parliament is also called the whitehouse, so why does whitehouse.gov point to 1600 Pennsylvania Ave? Same with
Oh well, just one more in the list of things that need to be fixed with 'net. Put it up on the chalkboard.
--sugarman--
> > So do we 'own' democracy the same way we 'own' the internet?
>
> England and France both observed our idea of
> democracy and tried to reverse-engineer it for
> their own use. Of course their implementations
> leave a great deal to be desired
If this _really_ what you were taught in school? I doubt it. Sounds to me like Microsoft explaining it has created the Internet, component programming and symbolic links.
Before making such absurd claims, please learn a bit about the roots of democracy, will you? Learn about what happened in Switzerland in the 13th century. Then learn about the English revolution and Cromwell. Then, the most important, learn about the 18th century and the Enlightenment, learn about who were the inspirators of Franklin, Jefferson and Washington.
Learn about Rousseau, Voltaire, Diderot and Paine. Learn about the American and the French revolution, and the birth of both republics. And then realize how absurd your ethnocentric "reverse-engineering" blabla is.
Until then, shut up and stay humble. It's a shame that an American like you doesn't even know the basic history of his own country.
Among other points :
> England and France are socialist countries, but
> if they didn't have crude forms of democracy in
> place they'd be much, much poorer than they are.
>
Never, never forget that, for all the smoke and bluster, US has way more many poors than France and continental Europe in general.
English was no more "forced" on the world than TCP/IP was "forced" onto the world. The Internet started in America. Thus, things were made English-and-American-centric. When non-Americans cared to join, it was easier for those people to join, rather than the ENITRE FRIGGIN' NET to change.
Does it mean that attempts to make the Internet more global are bad? Of course not. But claiming that English-centric codes were 'forced' on people just because they followed the path of least resistance is kind of silly. It's like claiming that the Japanese are 'forcing' me to learn Japanese should I care to go to Japan.
That said, English is a better choice for economy compared to, say, Chinese. Compare 26 characters, plus punctuation, to thousands of discrete characters. It's not a concern now, but once it was.
--
These are *MY* opinions.
These are *MY* opinions.
They will not be *YOUR* opinions until the Orbital Mind Control Lasers are operati
how did ya know i was a homo? you cruisin for a peice of ass? go away troll. ya bother me.
stop the ignornace, american scum
If you don't use the American language, the ASCII based net is a harsh place (I say American, because ASCII even lacks the UK currency symbol). No accented characters, to say nothing of languages with non-Roman characters. And the major search engines, mail servers, etc. all use ASCII. How do I search for "-{® " on the net? You probably couldn't even see that on your browser.Software houses... that means YOU, MR. PROGRAMMER , READING THIS RIGHT NOW IN THE YEAR 2000!... are STILL not using unicode in your programs. What's your excuse for using a character set that effectively locks out or hampers the non American net user? That memory/disk/CPUpower/net-bandwidth constraint shit doesn't fly anymore. The net is US centric because it continues to cling desperately to the 7-bit ASCII character set.
Must point out that at least per capita, the US is not the most connected country. Sweden surpasses all other countries both in percentage connected to the internet, and in number of wireless appliances.
I think Finland's catching up in the WAP metrics to Sweden, as is Norway.
But in terms of bandwidth, the US eats Sweden for lunch. When you add up the growth in DSL and Cable Modems and the number of sites located here, Sweden doesn't even show up on the map. Some of the nearby growth, such as Mexico, is so that spammers and sex sites can get around US restrictions, and thus is more due to the US market than anything else.
Will in Seattle
"English is the lingua franca of the world"
Familiarity with the meaning and origin of the phrase "lingua franca" renders the above hilarious.
I see even classic Slashdot is now pretty much unusable on dial up anymore.
Oh my god, what a load of rubbish you guys have been writting. I'd agree with some of what been said, but as usual, the Americans is this list are being high and mighty. The students that are coming out of American schools are becoming thicker by the year, and the so called democracy is driven by money. No where else in world do you need millions to run for a political position. And because of this, your policians have biased views based upons their sponsers. No country that I've been to has citizens that take no responsiblity for their own actions (I'm dying of cancer from smoking, its the tobacco companies fault - yeah right. People getting killed by guns, blame the gun manufactures, why didn't I think of that). These things make America the joke of the world. Thing is it doesn't need to be like that. It true that the technolgy of the last 10 years had been driven from the States (Linux excluded). But it should be stressed that alot of this is from non-American born employees. However, there is a fundamental problem with the American society that needs to be faced up to. Face up to that, and you'll have a real democracy.
I think the important heart of the argument is this: America is the source of a substatianly large portion of all ideas over the past century - it's been the most successful of all memetic cultural beasts because of its strong support of pluralism. Is the Internet ours? Maybe - maybe not. But it's interesting to think what would have happened had the work started somewhere else - would the network ever have been opened to the public? Would it be as rampantly commercial? I don't know - but I don't think it would be on either count. The world acts like it hates us - and to a degree, the charges against us are correct. But we should remember that Europe, for all its strong culture, history, and intelligence, is for the most part a very, very biased society. Racial purity is not that taboo a concept beneath the surface there, and as far as cultural pluralism... well, the forces coming to a head in Austria may be being censured, but their ideas are only unpopular because they are government sponsored. The common people very much echo those ideas in their hearts, and I feel very safe in saying that though the ECU is rising, it will be a long time before anyone in Europe sees themselves as anything but a member of their nationality. The internet right now is the beginning of a cultural revolution - one that will encourage pluralism, individualism, and give free speech to anyone.. no matter what a government tries to do. In a sense, no matter how much it changes, America will always remain the owners of the Internet.. maybe not the physical America of the future, but this technology has managed only to spread our ideas and concepts further and more quickly than any means before. The spirit of America, the spirit that overrode the Nazis and Nippon, will spill into every place and every person - whether they acknowledge it or not.
Is that the international nature of the internet is going to force countries to get their acts together, recognize technology, talk to and deal with eachother, and try to get things working. No country wants to have its carefully crafted laws broken, but the internet makes it so that breaking a law is as easy as moving your box to a country where the laws are different. Some sort of national consensus will have to be reached, and I can't imagine the more open countries letting go of their freedoms. In the end, I think that this will force international law into a more open and more freedom-friendly state. It won't be perfect, because governments never are, but it will be a hell of a lot better than it is now.
If you're american and you want to make a difference now, learn another language, and make use of the parts of the net you normally pass over. Until I'm confident Babelfish doesn't mangle my words, and until it does Japanese, I will keep studying.
Hello hello, awaken from your dreamy state! Nobody gives a crap about Canada or Mexico. They may as well just roll over and become our 51st and 52nd states. Well, not that we'd WANT either of them...
What's your excuse for using a character set that effectively locks out or hampers the non American net user?
The fact that only a tiny, tiny percentage of non-American users can afford to buy our products. These countries have destoyed themselves with socialism to the point where they don't even have enough to eat. Will they then buy books from Amazon? Don't make me laugh! Business goes where the paying customers are. For very simple socioeconomic reasons, 99.9% of them are in the USA. Have you seen the statistics about the percentage of the world's resources used by Americans? 80%, pal. That's because we can afford to pay for it. You can't. Fix your economy or shut the hell up.
but pat robertson is not from this planet, xtian fuckhead.
Umm it was a Scotman (Alexander Graham Bell) that invented the telephone... In Brantford, Ontario, Canada.... Yeah but still a Scotsman tho...
Why should we care about those dirty peasants in places like France and Japan scratching a meager living from the exhausted soil? They mean nothing to us. American school children learn nothing about foreign countries beause there is nothing about them that is worth knowing. They have no arts, no sciences, no culture, no technology. They adhere to crude, pagan religions -- or to none at all.
They're a joke. Don't bother me with this bullshit.
a) The main reason much of the world speaks english as a second and often first language is
:) and btw i like
...".. Just look at the variety
the fact that until some 50 years ago British
Empire owned a multitude of colonies everywhere
and therefore English was their offical language
for quite a while. At the same time them brits
being so important to world trade - their language
also became a common trade language. Aided by the
fact that english is very concise/precise as
opposed to many others - it is and will stay a
universal standard. But Americans got their
language domination ready made.
b) As to whitehouse issue, Russian parlament
is "belyi dom" which can be translated as a
whitehouse, but so can it be translated into
"bait lavan" , "casa blanka"
the latter most..:) As long as domain name
systems exists as it is (primitive single language
mapping of names into addresses) nothing can
solve real problems in it and changing suffixes
won't help either. What will help is a global
directory system where things are found as
per multiple names and attributes. That will also
help stop childish games of "whos the real Joe".
c) Internet as of now is divided in little
national nets with their own rules and lifes.
Russian net is vastly separate both connectionwise
and in terms of society from US which in terms
separate from European (and more subdivided into
other countries) and so on.
Their "e-commerce" (damn the word) is different
too with each country having their own products,
own companies on the web, own payments etc.
Just like you are not likely to order pizza from
Japan by phone being in New York, there is no
reason to do that just because you can access
pizza-hut.jp. I am sure you can call them too...
The internet is yet another tool that allows some
collaboration among countries and cultures but not
more then those cultures would *like* to
collaborate.
d) Cultures do not like to collaborate. Show me
one nation/country that *likes* any other
nation/country? Likes as in "those nice/good
bulgarians/indians/samoas/whatever" as opposed to
"damn
of directly hateful US posts for details. People
(in order to protect themselves) have to belong
to some "society/group" etc and the easiest/most
natural way to belong and differentiate from
others is hate. It is basic reaction that
evolution gave us for our own good.
Internet is not about to change that...
With this, i wish you all good luck and if you
succeed in making world a better place i will
come and visit.
I, as an American, love it when you 'peans get mad ! give me some more little person !!!!
We own 80% of the world's resources, and we will do as we please. This is called "freedom", and you are only jealous because you lack it yourself.
We haven't had a USA vs Europe bashing article in quite some time !!!
Thanks slashdot !!!
Hates people who have stupid little sigs
When you try something new, people in Europe have a good laugh at you, especially when you fail; and when you succeed they are so piss-jealous that they feel that they have the right to take it away from you, by any means, including sky-rocketing taxes.
There is something in European culture that wants to prevent you from succeeding in your plans; and it is all-pervasive across the people and the land. It sucks so hard: Can you heard the deep sucking sound of it?
You wish! If you truely believe that you have freedom in the US I feel sorry for you. You guys may have created democracy, but you've also shown how it can be corrupted.
Citizens in US apparently consider US = American... hellooo...
Well, yeah. What are supposed to call ourselves, Statesians? Unionists? (Oh yeah, try to get THAT one to go off in the ex-Confederate South) USies? Between-Cananda-and-Mexico-dwellers? Obnoxious? (Oh wait, that's what everyone else calls us.) Ummm... We could try pronouncing the Spanish E.E.U.U. for "eeewwwww".
Seriously, though, that whole "you think you're the only Americans?" business is a pet peeve of mine. We call ourselves Americans because we don't have a better name for ourselves. Since it is a name for the group of people that compose the dwellers of the U.S.A., and that is the group that we most commonly associate that name with, then, yes, we by default do assume that "Americans" just means us.
You have a point though about everyone stereotyping Europe for the actions of a country or two (especially when we have the facts wrong about that country in question). After all, what do you call an obnoxious person who insists on only speaking one language? I mean, we can't blame you all for the French. <grin>
If it's for-profit but free, you're not the customer -- you're the product (e.g., the Slashdot Beta's "audience").
The internet is not a thing. The internet is also an idea.
Why are we even bothering with such content free editorials anyway? No-one claims that the US owns phone-service, or movies, or HTML. An editorial claiming to debunk the idea that the US owns the internet is attacking a strawman.
The way an intelligent person would phrase the question is "Can the US govt (at all levels, federal, state and municipal) control what its citizens do on the internet?" Obviously sure, in some sense---I mean in theory the federal govt can ban all browsers except some limited browser it endorces, and then go door to door checking out who's using what. But this is clearly BS. The real issue is how will the battle play out between those who want to do various things on the internet (view porn, gamble, play MP3s, advertise/look for info about white supremacy) and those who want to stop them.
One can divide this into at least two categories:
(a) are there technological "solutions"?
(b) are there "legal" solutions (by which is meant simply declaring something illegal, along with concommitant issues of how you actually police this).
I don't know enough to comment strongly on either of these. I DO know enough to explain what the hell the issue is, which is more than the author of the editorial, or most of the people commenting in this thread.
It's kinda too bad that the US didn't cultivate some manners or modesty along with the "wealth and opportunity".
It's obvious that the morality of the strong (us) will differ from the morality of the weak (you). The morality of the weak is all about crippling the strong and trying to steal the fruits of their work. The morality of the strong is all about power. We were born to rule. We will continue to rule. This is our assigned role. Your assigned role is that of a slave, and if you had any courage or brains you would accept it and be thankful that you've been given even that much.
And all this from the country where they ban evolution...
The teaching of exploded pseudoscientific hypotheses like evolution and heliocentrism has been de-emphasized in some (unfortunately not all -- yet!) of our schools. If this strikes you as a bad thing, I can almost feel pity for your inability to see through the transparent lies you were fed in your socialist indoctrination centers. Note that I say "almost": The morality of the weak advocates pity, but the morality of the strong rejects it.
The Internet and all else that is good -- all progress, all technology -- was created by the morality of the strong. This is why it all belongs to the United States of America.
i, the original poster, and also an american. and who served in the air force, love it when pinheads assume anyone who criticizes mindless american nationalism is not american. bring it on, asshole.
But really, unless a porn site or any other business puts their address on the page, how do you know if it's Australian or American or whatever?
I see even classic Slashdot is now pretty much unusable on dial up anymore.
As an american i have to agree with you. The thought that America is all good is wrong. The thought that everything we have made has not been done before is also wrong. Oh well let the ignorant stay ignorant and the rest of us can move on.
Sure we created it, but I don't think we own it any more. Any country that has access owns their own little part. I would imagine the French see the internet a bit differently than us because they start out with FRENCH search engines and FRENCH ISP web pages.
The internet is a connection of networks. The only reason the US seems to "own" the net is because we still have the largest number of sites and pages. Once the net grows some more I'm willing to bet you'll see other "centers" as some sort of critical mass is achieved for a certain country/language. No idea how the regulation across borders would work though. More treaties?
BTW, I find it humourous how much the arguing here sounds like Open source verses closed source. US owns vs The World (tm). US owns sounds so closed source (It's ours dammmit!!) verses "It's for everyone"
And yes I'm 'merican
Never understimate the power of human stupidity -Lazarus Long
Never understimate the power of human stupidity -Lazarus Long
Us trolls never do
I agree with you.
The Internet, just like grits, should always be america-centric. Now if I can only figure out how to pur them both down my pants.....thank you.
I write as anonymous coward because I don't recall my password at the moment, but I am Patrick of the USA and proud US veteran. It seems either the same "anonymous coward" is repeatedly posting his garbage history of how the US invented democracy, etc, OR a group of alumni from the same idiotic private fundamentalist christian school are posting what they were "learnt" in sckoo. Democracy was "invented" by the ancient Greeks, who practiced raw, direct, democracy. The US has (thankfully) a Republic-type democracy which, with the aid of the Constitution and Bill of Rights, helps protect people from the "dictatorship of the majority". The Constitution and Bill of Rights helps establish minority protections so that a bunch of ignorant, dullard citizens can't trample all over minorities with a simple majority rules vote. As for the anti-Catholocism and bullcrap about the Catholic Church ruling Britain until we Americans saved them...what planet are you from? The British government has been tied to Protestantism for a good long time, from well before our USA even existed. In spite of this (by American standards) horror of mixing religion into politics, the Brits manage, in many cases, to have a more democratic society than we do. You put a religion in some sort of control here and it wouldn't work out as nicely as it does in GB. You would have Pat Robertson's, Jerry Falwell's, and other nutbar, ignorant dorks controlling things, telling you what you can and can't do, what you can and can't believe, etc. The French may have admired our Revolution to the point of it encouraging them to do something similar but they developed their democracy on their own too. The US DID invent/create the internet. More specifically, the US military drove it. It has since long left their hands and expanded well beyond the boundaries or control of the US. The anonymous coward who keeps posting nonsensical "history" for all to see simply displays the problems inherent in home schooling or relying on fundamentalist religious private schools for a child's "education". People of the US and world, the nonsense spouted by the anonymous coward of ridiculous history is exactly what the Republican Party supports and wan't taught in schools. A bizarre history that never happened and a morality that never existed in American history. On behalf of NORMAL, properly educated Americans across the USA, I give the finger to the rabid anonymous coward of the fabricated world and American history.
> I challenge you to find even one part of the > computer you're sitting in front of that was > made in the US. Windows. The other parts work as they're supposed to. :)
is not america-centric either. She'll do anyone. Now that is grits funny....thank you.
Al Gore invented the internet, dumbass.
you were in the us air force? that only means you're expendable
Gee, and all these years I thought Turing was British.
America owns 90% of the sites on the net and produces 99% of the software and hardware that runs it.
Isn't 98% of that content just bad free porn sites? ;-)
Anyway, Mr. 80m^H^H^H Anonymous Coward, do you have any comments about the huge numbers of warez sites outside the US? ;-)
---
Very interesting read.
.us top level domain name. This would impact all commercial, government, non-profit and military organizations. You will also see sweeping state level legislation requiring all servers and user accounts to have a second level domain name with the state ID Someone in California will have an address of joeuser@aol.ca.us, even though AOL is not based in California (I think they are based in Texas?)
I think that you will soon (within 5 years) see legislation passed on the federal level requiring all servers residing on USA soil to use the
Once that is in place, broad legislation will be enacted to regulate everything from taxes, gambling, warez and pron distribution. All US based servers will be required to conform to a self rating system. Sites that are found to be improperly rated will get the owner punished. There will be no anonymously hosted US based web servers.
Once that is in place, Government Identification will be used for email addresses, regardless of ISP used. Your mail will follow you regardless of how you connect to the internet. Impersonation will be punishable. Anonymous browsing will be eliminated. Your government ID will be required for access to the internet.
This will come to pass under the guise of International commerce regulation, and then under the guise of Interstate commerce regulation (both of which are the US federal government's responsibility spelled out in the Constitution) Then the States will use the Regulation of Intrastate commerce regulation clauses written into each state compact or constitution.
not that we'd join, mate. just not fond of gun toting, illiterate, bad beer drinkin, wife beating, rednecks i guess.
My concern is that the border-disregarding nature of the internet will so frustrate separate governments that they solve the problem by consolidating.
Problem collecting sales tax on Oregan business's shipment to Louisiana resident? Wipe out all state sales taxes and replace with national sales tax. Might as well do away with state governments and make them all federal provinves while we're at it.
Selling to France instead of Louisiana? If it's physical it has to go through customs.
It's not physical? Better institute global telecommunications law enforcement authority.
There's a slippery slope ahead.
I see even classic Slashdot is now pretty much unusable on dial up anymore.
heehee. yeah, don't i know it! but i got to play with kewl toyz.
I agree with you.
Well, isn't that special. Since I'm a troll, wouldn't that make you . . . an idiot? Yep, sure would
Lets see jim. My ram was made by micron (maybe use maybe not they have plants in italy and us) Athlon processor (check made in texas) lots of stuff made in tawian. and lots of software made in redmond washington
The boat left and you weren't on it, you missed the fscking boat, and so did the author of that article!
It doesn't matter who started it, or where it started, or whos got the damn patent, the point is that it's a valuable tool. A tool that can help the great minds of the *world* communicate on a level in which there has been NO EQUAL! Furthermore - these great minds would form a system of education that can and WILL reach every person on the planet. Realize the POTENTIAL. How many Ben Franklins have never had a fucking chance!? How many Newtons never learned to write!? This is our chance to find every Einstein, Twain, Confusious, Wolfgang, and Plato - and nurture them with great thought.
You - who have been handed everything, has no concept of sharing. Whats worse is you don't seem to see how this selfishness hurts you. It is that mentality that has drown the potential of humanity in a sickly pool of ignorance and selfishness to this very day.
damn you - Step aside and let us PASS!
(NOTE: When i say _OUR_ chance - I mean HUMANS)
-V
You missed the part where I said they were only competitive nowadays because they have adopted "American" norms and business practices. Being American is more than just being based in America. Even if Cisco makes more money overseas than they do domestically their mind set and culture is STILL American. They are STILL an American company. And they STILL build an American Internet.
Note that value is largely a matter of taste here. I'm not simply talking about value from trade. I'll never make a dime off my knowledge of french, but I think the value it would add to a trip there is far greater than the cost of maintaining my level in French
Europeans will place different values and costs of learning each others language depending on difficulty and frequency of contact, but it is not a matter of simply saying "I know 5 languages so I'm better than you".
In Miami, if you want to do business you have to speak Spanish. Americans down there learn Spanish without being "made" to. It really comes down to free market economics, and the market for languages is no difference. People will learn a a language if the value perceived exceeds the costs. (Including the cost of having people laugh hysterically when you make certain mistakes)
For another example, I have had a number of people tell me - don't learn Chinese - enough people speak english, and if you go over there (in this context, Hong Kong) it is easy to trade for the Chinese you need by hiring an interpreter. I guess what it comes down to is the cost of learning chinese (for me) is considerably greater than the cost of a Chinese to learn english. Ergo it is economical (for me, in my situation) to trade rather than invest time to learn.
As far as the internet is concerned, and I hope this paragraph brings me back on topic 8), I definitely value being able to look around French sites to keep up my knowledge of the language, and having access to French markets, particularly for books and music. What does this have to do with the price of tea in China? I guess to say that there will be more language collisions. Which will survive? Will many languages borrow more from English? These are questions for the sociolinguists, I guess. < /end ramble >
---
You were a moderator with 5 points. You should have read the moderator guidelines before you did any moderating
First off the continental US is at least as large if not larger than Europe (not counting Russia). Not to mention the fact that the US population is much more dispersed than the European population and that would limit DSL right off. With so many people living away from the telecom's central office it is no wonder why DSL won't take off in most of the US. However don't discount cable by any means because cable companies are working hard to upgrade their infrastructures. I live in a fairly rural area of Virginia and we are supposed to be getting cable internet access 6 monthes to a year from now because we live in a neighborhood near a medium-sized ski resort. The biggest issue the US will have to face is rural and small town (50,000) users' innability to get affordable broadband access.
Isn't 98% of that content just bad free porn sites?
WRONG. Many of them are quite good. If you're unwilling too keep looking until you find what you want, then obviously the American virtues of hard work and persistence are unfamiliar to you.
Anyway, Mr. 80m^H^H^H Anonymous Coward,
No comment
. . . do you have any comments about the huge numbers of warez sites outside the US?
I'm glad you mentioned that. It's a widely known fact that virtually all warez sites are hosted by European socialists attempting to undermine the software boom economy of the United States. Fortunately, they will never win, though by using the Internet to undermine the economic underpinnings of that selfsame Internet, they demonstrate an admirable grasp of Marx's dictum (or was it Lenin's?) that "the capitalist will sell you the rope you hang him with". What Marx (or Lenin) failed to grasp was the fact that the rich, nutritious diet of Capitalism is such that our necks grow strong, and we are unhangable by ordinary means. The warez strategy is doomed to failure for this reason.
I'm sorry, but I love the US. I was born here, and I actually work to defend it. Still, it is not America, and this is just a matter of basic definition and therefore education. Knowing where you are helps you understand your surroundings. Hey, if you have a problem with this, just blame the damned Canadians in North America. You see how this info helps!!!
I hate to fall on the side of jingosim here...but...
Free society + capitalism = 99 % of all innovation in the 20thC by Americans and naturalized immigrants.
WE DO IDEAS THE OLD FASHIONED WAY.
WE ALLOW THEM.
Now as for all this MPAA, DMCA, UCITA, richies buying off the Roman Imperial Senate--ahem--err--lobbyists influencing Congress, you can take that particular piece of American Pie and shove it into the nearest subduction zone.
Everybody better wake the hell up. Congress and the Executive have exactly this much interest in the people: ZERO.
Republicans: negative (symbol for infinity negative?)
Democrats: 0.0000321
DOJ: Zero. Already rolling over to take it in the heinie from the Notorious Byll G.
ATF: Would you come out of your house if they knocked?
FBI: Bwahaahaaha! Let's see, their best catches have been due to:
A: A grieving brother, shamed into action
B: An alert Oklahoma cop.
Can't seem to find one little prick in a North Carolina Forest though...
The Supreme Court: the only surviving hope. A Republican admin...one appointment...forget Miranda, forget Roe v Wade, FORGET EVERYTHING.
DROP YOUR FREAKING STARBUCKS, TURN OFF ZDTV, AND FIGHT THIS TREND!
jeez.
And I don't want to hear some whiny punk in France bitch either. "Oh, America, all zee websites in zee Anglish, non non non..." Probably be too busy enjoying 8 weeks paid vacation and a 35 hr work week to get off your ass and INNOVATE.
HACK IT. COPY IT. PASS IT ON.
If the state fades away...we live as animals.
BECOME THE STATE.
L'etat c'est moi.
And you know how much I hate to use French...
It belongs to nobody and everybody. More or less you can access it when ever you want to and nobody can stop you and on the other side of the coin so can everyone else. More or less you can do whatever you want to and nobody can stop you and on the other side of the coin so can everyone else. Nobody can limit the content of anything anywhere on the Internet. When they try it just gets worse (DeCSS, Napster, gnutella). Natioal/Govermental/Geographical issues are becomming more irelevent to the Internet every day.
A tool that can help the great minds of the *world* communicate on a level in which there has been NO EQUAL!
Bullshit. There are virtually no great (or even good) minds outside the US. Those few who do appear, will find a way to get to the US if they're smart enough to deserve to be here.
these great minds would form a system of education that can and WILL reach every person on the planet.
And paid for "voluntarily" (by armed coercion a.k.a. confiscatory taxation) by my tax dollars, is that it? You people are all the same. Whoever pays for it, it's still a waste of time, for the reasons given above.
How many Ben Franklins have never had a fucking chance!? How many Newtons never learned to write!?
That's meaningless. People of that caliber make their own chances, by emigrating to the US. Lesser minds in foreign countries will only be tormented by unfulfillable expecations if we educate them more than they deserve. Since they have no hope and will never have any hope, it's kinder to leave them in ignorance.
You - who have been handed everything, has no concept of sharing.
Bullshit. I have earned everything I have. I may not have earned it personally, but my people, my nation earned it, and therefore it is mine as well. Nobody handed us anything at all, ever.
you don't seem to see how this selfishness hurts you.
Selfishness is a virtue. This is the morality of the strong. "Sharing" is the morality of the weak, who can prosper only by tricking the strong into sharing with them. I will not be tricked.
It's kinda ironic that you take being a gay and wanting to marry into an example of why the american "free" way of life is good...
You misread; he gave that as an example of where America "loses".
"National borders aren't even speed bumps on the Information Superhighway" - Tim May
First, after reading the article and then through the posts - gotta love a full-blown flame fest on /. (made MY Friday aft - I was thinking about the international air-traffic control system. IIRC, isn't Enlish the standard for all international flights? So, the 'net seems to be a bit like that. Now, there certainly ain't the safety factor, but there is some similarity.
/.!!!!!
Also, being a US citizen, I find it quite ironic that the US, being made up of folks from just about every other country in the world, is so isolationist and short-sighted when it comes to dealing with international issues like the 'net and regulation, etc.
Thirdly, for all those flamers and trolls out there spouting ultra-nationalist stuff, I was married to a lovely girl from Venezuela - she is, alas, the current ex-Mrs. Mackga (sniff) - I found it quite refreshing and educational being married to someone who's world-view did not center on the US. It's a big, varied planet out there, and the folks in the US have, for the most part, no clue just how diverse. EOS (end of sermon).
Once again, this thread has put a smile on my face and started my weekend off with a good chuckle or two. Thanks
"shop smart:shop s-mart" ash
Thank you, thank you, thank you, everyone!
I've not laughed so much in a long time. I'm
not sure who is trolling and who is not, but it sure is funny.
Australia, AFAIK, is not a continent. It is a country. It is part of the continent of Oceania. (I'm not kidding, look it up)
I thought Antartica was a continent too? Can someone clear that up?
Is the internet abbreviation for California really ".ca"? Most people recognize this as this suffix for Canadian domains. Shouldn't we be using unique identifiers? Obviously, the two should never conflict, since any domain with ".ca" (California) in it should be immediately followed by ".us".
What is the official internet abbreviation for California?
> we should remember that Europe, for all its strong culture, history, and intelligence, is for the most part a very, very biased society . . .
unlike the good old US of A.
But I am glad that the US is willing to play soldier boy for capitalism. After all I enjoy the benefits of the unsustainable consumption that this protects. And what better country to grow a crop of mindless soldier droids in?
The thing is, the US has a lot more "rural" areas than Europe does, and so this problem of having to support the rural areas even though it is not profitable is actually worse in the US than in Europe. In practice, what ends up happening is that the urban utility costs are a bit higher than they would otherwise need to be, in order to subsidise the rural areas that are operating at a loss. It's expensive to provide service when there's only about 1 house per 20 telephone poles.
That's also one of the main reasons US network technology is a bit behind the times. It's terribly expensive to replace all those old wires with something better.
It's the same story with public transportation. many Europeans chide the US for having an almost non-existant public transit system, but they forget that our cities aren't as dense. In the few places where they are, such as New York, there is quite a bit more public transit than in the rest of the country, and people prefer not to drive themselves. But it is very inefficient to run busses or trains out to suburbs for commuters unless they are all going to the same place (which of course, they aren't).
Don't label something "offtopic" unless you know the topic well enough to tell what's on topic.
First, let me say that this is another nice 'gloom and doom' article from the National Enquirer of computer news, ZDNet.
Ok, now that THAT'S off my chest... some of this can be 'countered' by self policing. Ebay and AIM are two examples of self-policing, albeit that the risks can be low. Other 'commercial' sites are also using the third party 'e-biz' rating system for their ecommerce site. As more of this type of thing becomes common, the international e-commerce risks will be reduced, as long as you know what to look for...
Remember, the first time someone bought things from the back of a van, only to find out later it was stolen, or fake, was a lesson learned, and now it's a fairly well known warning...
Also keep in mind that ANY shopping is a risk, especially 'remote' credit card transactions. Heck, sitting in a restaurant and giving the waiter your credit card for payment is a risk. The best you can hope for is to minimize your risks, but you'll never be able to eliminate them.
But hey, I could rationalize myself out of a paper bag if I wanted to..
-- You can't idiot-proof anything, because they're always coming out with better idiots.
Sure, you can get a good hookup in a "remote" location up in the mountains, but just how "remote" is that, really? How many kilometers away is the nearest sizable city (population over 100,000). How far away is the nearest major city over 1 million?
Don't label something "offtopic" unless you know the topic well enough to tell what's on topic.
France? Oops, the cats out of the bag.
Damn good, damn good. Thank you
I'm a troll, too. the only difference is I troll trollers. you've been had, bitch !!!
thank you
No Oceania is just a group of a bunch of islands (not including Autralia), and it is not a Continent.
Is that the best you can do? You are an idiot.
Have a nice day
I hate to be a voice of reason, but...
:)
:)
:)
"all I hear from you is 'Gov't is great...they'll take care of us !!'"
What's wrong with expecting the government to support the citizenry? While the socialist concept of an all-powerful government that would fairly and justly look after and take care of its population is ridiculous, the concept that a society without government would work is equally foolish and utopian.
Go for the middle ground, alright?
"What an idiot you are. Why do you think Denmark is inconsequential in the world? You people have no incentive to excel. You'll always have nice gov't to bail your lazy asses out."
Umm... by lazy do you mean that they have Spare Time (TM), or do you mean that they're "dem damn unemployed bums mooching off of taxpayer money"? I hate to break it to you, but A: Free time is a good thing, and B: Unemployment is a luxury, really. An expensive luxury. The government has to help out those who are forced into unemployment through the actions of a capricious and amoral global economy ("Hello, Nike factories in Vietnam! Hello, bio-engineers designing fruits and vegetables that don't produce seeds, forcing farmers to buy year after year!"). If the government doesn't help out, then what's the point?
"Let me ask you a question. What happens when gov't becomes not so nice? Let's go back to Germany in 1936. Do you think Jews were happy, in 1945, that they couldn't buy arms to protect themselves in 1936? Do you think the Nazi gov't efffectively ran the country?"
Gee, I hate to sound like Haider, but yeah, they ran it very effectively. Of course, it relied on manipulating and hurting parts of the population (propanga and blaming the Jews and the communists), which is a terrible thing.
But do you seriously think that letting the Jews have guns back in the thirties would've helped? They were a small part of the population... it'd be like the Navaho (sp?) nation revolting against the US. Send in the army, and that's it.
"Throughout history, we have seen what happens when people afford the gov't too much power. The role of gov't should be to stay out of the way of its citizens, ensuring at the same time very basic protections for its citizens."
Stay out of the way of its citizens _and_ ensure basic protection? It's mighty hard to do both at once...
"Keep living in your fairy land, my blind friend. The US system is not perfect but I ask you this? Why is it the US, a relative small % of the world's population, has dominated the world in every facet for the last 100 years? It is because our system rewards people who have intelligence, drive and ambition. We suck these people from the rest of the world because your country and others reward everyone regardless of their contribution."
No, it's because the US was the only major economic power left standing after WWII. It took until the seventies for Europe to catch up to what it was capable of before the war.
"We suck these people from the rest of the world because your country and others reward everyone regardless of their contribution." Interesting statement... personally, I think that the US "sucks" people because the USA is insanely rich. Other countries reward based on contribution (hell, the supposedly egalitarian USSR rewarded on the basis of contribution) as well, so that can't be it... it must be the money
"Keep up the good work, Denmark and others. The US will keep laughing all the way to the bank"
Uh, okay, whatever. Have fun with your money, then
----
Thaeus
----
http://matthewgoodband.com/manifesto/14.html
(I really like the bit about the bunnies
----
The US Census dept reckons that around 13.8% of Americans live below the poverty line. The poverty line is defined as the 3*(annual cost of a nutrionally adequate diet). A large fraction of people in poverty are people who (IMHO) put themselves there, namely young unmarried mothers.
(37% of the poor living in female headed households, and this is the most rapidly growing segment of the poor). If you then ask what the effect of government aid is (via food stamps, medical insurance, rent aid etc) this number reduces to 10.8%.
One can view this in two ways. One is to say that the state is inhumane in punishing people who want to have children. Or you can say that for a variety of reasons (over-population, inability of one parent to do as much for the kids as two parents) the state has an interest in discouraging single-parent families. Before treating this as a cut-and-dry case, remember that this is no different from other choices that govts make. European govts tax gasoline heavily, and regard the US as immoral for doing so little to discourage gasoline usage. But if the goal is to discourage gasoline usage, why is dissuading people from having kids (which will ultimately have the same effect) so much worse an idea.
Or to put it slightly differently, does everyone have the RIGHT to have kids (and even as many kids as they like) with the state paying for them? Some would say yes, but why? After all, I don't want kids (I had a vasectomy in my 20's) and I don't expect the state to pay for me to do what I want with my life---why should a woman who wants to be a full-time mother get a better deal than me who wants to be a full-time stay-at-home reader? People (especially young people) choose to have kids as a single mother, and a consequence of that choice, in the US, is that they then close a whole lot of doors and condemn themselves to a few years of poverty. The only real way around this is either to educate these people to make better choices, or to take their choices from them. More so than they might want to admit, part of what separates Europe from the US is that the second option is followed.
Another aspect of these statistics is that they do not capture the extent to which poverty is more dynamic than in Europe. While there is a core of permanent poverty, many of those in the poverty statistics will stay there a few years then move on to better things. Thus it is easy to pain the situation as bleaker than it is.
Yet another aspect is that the statistics do not cover wealth rather than income. Simply because the US is so rich in material goods, even the poor can buy material goods second hand at ridiculously cheap prices (ask any European students who've been to the US and tried to buy a car or visited a Goodwill store). This again changes the nature of the situation. Unfortunately I can't find the relevant stats on the web and my book on this is at home.
As for federal spending, 25% goes to defence.
26% goes to social security, 15% to health care, 11% to education. This does not include per-state funds which will contribute a whole lot more to education and health. Thus it is simply not true to claim that the US spends more on defence than on social services.
2...insightful...to 1...troll...ouch... (cut...cut...cut) (sounds of shredded Constitution droppiing to the floor...) heh...heh...oh, well...
Most non-American posters whine about the size if Americas ego. In my opinion our ego isn't big at all. Our actual accomplishments far exceed what we brag about. Many complain that Americans have no sense of the other person(in this case person being country). Most only speak one language, don't know much about world history, and for the most part don't care. Why is this? Perhaps we should attempt to go to the cause of the problem instead of focusing on the effects.
The first question to ask is: What makes the world go around? The answer: Economics. Face the facts, the economic center of the world is America. America controls the vast majority of the economy. In recent times the world has seen many smaller countries economies decline, while the US economy has remained strong. The reason? For the most part America is pretty much self-sustaining. As an example: The son of a real estate broker, I can appreciate the value of agriculture. Most of the food in the world is produced in the US, more specifically California (We just have everything here don't we :-)). So, when Europe becomes the center of economics, I will gladly learn French, German, Italian or any other language necessary (Already speak Spanish).
The next thing which forces the world to be world to be America-centric is our level of technological achievment. Our laisse-faire economic system has led to many great break throughs. Are technological presence in all fields has allowed America to be on the cutting edge. As older technologies become obsolete people migrate to the new. This forces the world to focus on America. As e-commerce becomes more popular and as the net culture branches out the net will become less America-centric. But, at the cost of using the same ideals and pricipals that has made the world America-centric.
Wigs
--The less a statesman amounts to, the more he loves the flag. -- Kin Hubbard
Just say NO to crappy Slashdot posts!
.....
....waiting
... what? i dont get a reward for saying "NO"?
Science Fiction writers often proposed in
the future a global worldly organization ruling
the entire Earth.
As we see, with amount of countries rather more
increasing in the past years than diminishing,
probably the human nature and the desire for
power, even in a smaller space, makes this idea
of the writers to fail.
But, with global Internet everywhere, a true
central ruling organization of the entire
Internet must appear. It should be, for its own
good be more interested and focused on the
prosperity of the Internet as a whole and not
lobbying interests of specific countries, since
Internet has already wiped many of borders.
Then, if such organization gains momentum and power
because more of our everyday life becomes wired to
the data communications it may start forcing the
governments of the countries going the organization's
way and turning into the ruling organ the science
fiction writers dreamed of.
Now, what we need iz our own Zaphod Beeblebrox.
-- "If you had fallen into a shit pit during a battle, lick yourself off and move on." - Jaroslav Hasek
Size isn't everything, it's also how you use it. But, fine, if you think that person is too small to slam her satisfactorily, then do it yourself.
As for anonymously, are you suggesting that he wear a mask as he slams her? I am getting an interesting image of some masked dude with a tiny tool, frantically and energetically slamming someone's mom against the headboard. Bang! Bang! Bang! The headboard knocks against the wall. Suddenly GeoCajun loudly knocks on the wall and shouts, "Hey, keep it down in there!"
I realize the noise can be a little disturbing, but it doesn't last long. Just turn up your TV until they're finished. Or perhaps you've got another reason to be upset about it. GeoCajun, you don't have a crush on her, do you? Did your eyes light up when I suggested that you slam her yourself?
Hey, you know what? You've got "cajun" in your name. That reminds me of Louisiana, and that reminds me of France. This is anti-France day on Slashdot. You better not be french. You ain't a frenchy, are you, GeoCajun? Wait a minute ... GeoCajun? That's not some code name for an operation for you frenchy fucks to take over the whole world and rape all our moms, is it? Listen, frenchy, you keep your tool away from me and Taco's moms.
You know, frenchy, with your comments about other guys being "small" and your agenda to take over and rape everyone's mom, I wonder if you have certain .. uh .. issues. You don't have a small one too, do you? Maybe that's why you didn't take up the challenge to slam her yourself. Were you afraid that we would all be watching, and then laugh at your little tool? Is that why you made the suggestion about getting to wear a mask?
Frenchy, you are one sick dude. Get help.
You are incorrect, and correct.
From britannica.com :
"Oceania has traditionally been divided into four parts: Australasia (Australia and New Zealand), Melanesia, Micronesia, and Polynesia"
Australia IS part of Oceania (you are incorrect), and Oceania is not a continent (you are correct).
According to Britannica there are seven continents, sometimes six if you lump Europe and Asia into Eurasia.
The continents are :
Asia, Europe, Africa, North America, South America, Antartica, Australia
a smiley face ?!? oh, i get it. the smiley face represents that you're above the fray, huh? it's like when someone is getting reamed in an argument and he gives that cheesy ass grin and acts like he hasn't been hurt.
if that's the best you can do, you're a pathetic bastard. I'll spare you the faggot emoticons.
I'm probaly in the minority here because I don't care where is the center of the internet, but I have to agree, english is a digital friendly language, so I'm content using it on the net, even though it's only my third language.
Let's not forget that only 25% of the world's population speaks English. Basically, if you don't have a multilingual website then you don't "get" the Internet. In a year or two English speakers will be swamped by all of the other languages on the net, primarily Spanish. Get used to it. Right now towerofbabel.com is the world's best kept secret. It will only be a year or two before it finally gets the attention it deserves. Gold rush? You ain't seen nothing yet.
My name is Carlos Montoya. You share files of my music. Prepare to die.
I'm saddened but not surprised to see yet another piece whose implicit assumption is that the internet is all about (and only about) buying and selling things. At this point, enough people believe it that it will probably become true. Call me elitist scum if you will, but I often yearn for the days when seeing a URL in an advertisement was an exception rather than the rule, not to mention the days before HTML entirely.
Maybe then the flaw in the american national character is assigning a price to everything.
Lots of people in continental Europe still learn Latin, lots of Irish people still learn Irish, not spoken outside a small island on the western fringe of Europe, despite the fact that English is their first language (thanks to repeated british invasions over the centuries). They certainly don't do this for monetary profit. They just feel it's part of their cultural heritage, even if the language is practically dead. Can you conceive of doing something simply for the love of it?
...the US will stay on top simply because everybody here wants to. We are also impatient and jealous so if there is something faster out there, we want it now.
In the wireless communication area, the US lags behind aproximately 5 years... Add to that that wireless communication are going to be the next big thing, and the picture changed dramatically...
According to the National Post last week, every school in Canada is already connected to the internet. Not bad, eh?
I'm stilling looking for a way to get connected to that national network that is 60 times faster than Al Gore's Internet 2.
I lived in Denver for three years. I spent many hours on international phonecalls. AT&T effectively charged my an extra 30 secs a phone call as they billed by the minute. My monthly US West phone bill was more than my quarterly phone bill from British Telecom. Somehow US West is a worse telephone company than BT. BT provided free standard features such as the equivalent of *69, for which US West charged 75c a go.
Let's throw in some geography shall we? Most of americans geographic knowledge consists of pointing out US on the map. IF we are lucky... Some can't even handle that. Ask your average american Joe to point out, lets say... Germany?
What's the percentage of the people actually succeding with this? Pretty low, I can assure you...
Bravo! Nice to see an American who doesn't have time for mindless nationalism (of whatever nation). Unfortunately, the yahoos out there often give the impression that *all* Americans are that way.
And while we are identifying our national origins, just for the record I am Canadian, and proud to be so. I also served in our Armed Forces (such as they are - good but waaaaay too small and underequiped.). I can't stand mindless support of any nation by any citizen - even if they are Canadian. Our government does stupid things, so does yours. Our culture has its disreputable elements - so does yours. Some of our laws suck, and so do yours. Any everyone elses.
I personally think the time is coming when we need to stop thinking nationally and start thinking globally.
"The first time I got drunk, I got married. The second time I bought a chimpanzee, after that I stayed sober" Arian Seid
"Lots of people in continental Europe still learn Latin, lots of Irish people still learn Irish, not spoken outside a small island on the western fringe of Europe, despite the fact that English is their first language (thanks to repeated british invasions over the centuries). They certainly don't do this for monetary profit. They just feel it's part of their cultural heritage, even if the language is practically dead. Can you conceive of doing something simply for the love of it?"
Countries, cultures and people are welcome to do any damn stupid thing they like. But they are not then entitled to whine about the consequences.
If a country wants to waste time teaching its kids to speak Irish rather than something useful like teaching them more math, they must accept the 1% or whatever this will chop off their GDP growth. If countries want to wallow in their uniqueness, they must accept that this is going to persuade all sorts of lunatics that this uniqueness gives them carte blanche to bomb and kill anyone different from them. (Cf IRA, ETA, India vs Pakistan etc).
Jesus, are you having a bad day or something? Lighten up!
Look, I wrote the troll that started this thread, with about 120 responses the last time I checked. At this point I don't have a whole hell of a lot to prove, y'know?
I'm reeeealllly sorry if I hurt your feelings, but if you'd posted something interesting enough for me to work with ("i agree" is not much), I'd probably have played along, and everybody would have had a lot more fun.
Try harder next time. And until then, relax. People take this shit too seriously.
--80md
I find the current situation of the internet (no one in charge) to be absolutely tremendous, and I'm counting on the combined incompetence of the world's bureaucrats to keep it that way.
Really, what are the current harms?
No taxation -- ooh, ouch, please stop!
Too much porn/gambling/fraud -- like international standards are really going to cure this, and like it's worth having our free speech go away along with them?
Too little consumer/privacy protection -- laws and regulations will do much less good here than tools, security, open standards (to ensure tools don't hide nasty surprises), and disclosure (remember the free speech bit?)
The article ends with a comment about an international conference to deal with this: "let's hope it starts something."
Let's not.
"You can't get something for nothing." - my grandfather, on the stock market and Reaganomics.
Jeff
Jeff
have any of you guys out side of America ever been in a General chat room and some ones sia d'oh lets do this on sunday at 10am' and youve siad what time zone are you in and they say 'oh EST'
after lenght discusions on how hte world is round with these ppl and why we have GMT all i ever get back is 'EST you f*ing find out whaat it is' they seem to refuse to even look up wht GMT there in..
You have 5 Moderator Points!
Which Helpless Linux zealot/MS basher do you want to mod down today?
Far out; I didn't realize Rush Limbaugh read /. Pretty cool.
"How many light bulbs does it take to change a person?" --BMcC-->
I seem to recall Konrad Hilbers (CEO AOL Europe) saying something like this at the ISP2000:
"The relationship between Europe and America is no longer a copy-and-paste one"
Meaning that apparently, we (the Europeans)'ve been copying America excessively.
So much for 2000 years of cultural history...
www.e.magazine.dk
www.e.magazine.dk
> would the UK be a democratic state without such values?
Yes, it would. Not a very good one, but still democratic. Generally their government has much more power in doing things for the so-called 'common good', like arresting writers who heavily critize the military, for example. Except for the Scandanavian countries, mainland Europe is much the same (Germany's censors are heinous *shudder*).
ICQ#2584116
-- d'arcy poirot
By all means, pass us. If you think you can get up the speed. America doesn't set the speed limit for the world. There are lots of things that the US hasn't done yet. Despite what your facist dictator will tell you, it's a free world out there.
You - who have been handed everything, has no concept of sharing. Whats worse is you don't seem to see how this selfishness hurts you.
Sharing, so that's what you call taxes over there. And no, I don't see how this selfishness hurts me. For those that are in a generous mood, we have a thing called charity. We value these things called choices. See our government actually lets us choose where our money will go.
Wigs
--Whatever happened to Preparations A through G?
I saw a funny string of commercials the other day...
:)
first one: "Online gambling is bad, you'll end up broke"
second one: "Here's a new game from the michigan lottery..."
I think mainly they're concerned that they'll lose suck^H^H^H^Hcustomers.
Yes, You're right, fuck that stupid homeless bum on the corner, why doesn't he do it like the rich, invest in microsoft or amazon, then he'd get rich too. What ? He has no money to invest ? Oh. But he just needed to work, just one year as a system-analyst or software-engineer and he could save, say, 50k, and then invest that ! What ? There wasn't anybody to pay for his education ? He doesn't own a computer (or a table to put it on) to teach himself ? Can't get a well payd job ? Hmm... anyhow, it must be his own fault ! He made a mistake ! The poor deserve what they got (i.e. nothing). How else could I sleep at night ?
It seems that every time this kind of thread comes along, there is a US vs Rest of the World flame war.
/.ers are from. I saw Canadians posters, UK posters, French, Aussies, Germans... arguing in an indescriptible mess, but who knows what the proportion of them is? I was told that in 2004, Europe will be more present on the Internet than US, but what is the state now on /.? Oh, and by the way, for US-has-created-everything posters: the WWW was created in Geneva.
Remembers me the "Best way to have an extra day off on Thanksgiving" poll in dilbert.com were most people said thinks like: "Hey dude, you know there is no Thanksgiving outside America?"
This is the better example of an US-centered www (much more better than language stuff). Also there are the american date formats (remember Pi day?), the registration forms (wich state are u in? Oh sorry you may be in the rest of the world), the ignorance of the metric system, the name format (some people only have a familly name, others have three or composed names, and any US form will still ask for 1 first name, 1 middle initial and 1 last name, else you're doomed)...
All of these are details, but they show that Americans care mostly about themselves do not consider non-American people.
I do not think that Americains are acting on purpose, but they should think a little before speaking for everyone else. The best advice i can give for everyone here is to go in foreign countries, and to spend some time to find out what is common in mankind, and what is only American/ Anglo-Saxon/ Western culture. You should me amazed by what you can discover.
It should also be interesting to know were the
Are you proposing than America should likewise adopt a communist system of government as exists in Denmark and other European nations? Does not freedom also get repressed in places where the government "takes care of its people?." Are you still required to show "papers" in Denmark when travelling from place to place, and submit all internet content to government approval? I do not understand how such places maintain an economy with no incentive for the individual to achieve more. Here in America anyone can become a millionaire if he or she works hard enough. In Europe that's less likely, even if there are a few individuals here and there with the initiative to make something of themselves. The govenrment will take most of that in taxes. When people are punished for being succesfull, why bother? Here in America we place value on self interest, not a false sense of commmunity as in communist Europe which still retains some of its feudal or medieveal aspects. Everyone has his place in society determined by birth and social class in Europe. Here in America one's place is determined by his "net worth". What are you worth? That's the important question. It can be measured in dollars and cents. We have no nobility and peasantry here in America. Only winners and losers. Winning is all that counts!
Or did you forget to click "Post Anonymously"?
If it's sincere, I want to congratulate you on being one of the most perfect examples of a brainwashed, jingoistic halfwit that I've ever seen. Do you really believe that all countries other than the US are ruled by "fascist dictators"? Seriously? Whoa, that is so cool. I live in Cambridge (MA, not UK), so I never get to meet people like you. The people I know are all at least moderately well-informed about the world, right? Mainly because we've actually visited parts of it outside the Bible Belt, and met people who grew up in those scary far-away places. Most of us can read'n'write, too. So it's a real honor to meet a genuine, 100% dyed-in-the-wool anthropoid American nativist moron.
I really want to thank you for posting. You made my day. I frequently troll as an idiot like you, and my work can only benefit from observing a live specimen in the wild. Please, don't hesitate to flame me! I'll enjoy the show.
ok, I have a few moments in between games so I'll indulge you.
congrats on your troll. are you happy? do you feel good about yourself? go ahead, call mom over and show her the results of carrying you in her womb for 9 months. I'll wait.
All done? good.
Now as far as trolls go, yours was what I could entry-level. the number of responses have more to do with the USA vs Europe thing. I troll but usually on a more sophisticated level. Rather than throwing out obvious troll fodder, I back my trolls up with facts. You see, I'm an actually an educated individual. I suspect that you are what we like to call "self-taught". It shows.
Remember this about trolls, young grasshopper -- once you've nibbled at the bait....you're all mine.
*PLONK!*
hate to say it, but i've never bought the premise that the internet is "anything-centric".
sure, a lot of people were here first, mostly white american males, but there is absolutely no barrier to entry unless (for whatever reason) you can't operate a computer, or you lack the necessary resources to access one.
in either exclusionary case, it is not the fault of the internet that you are excluded.
face it, a black senegalese one-armed lesbian midget, complete with clitoral piercing, eye patch and kung-fu grip, can access the internet about as well as anyone else.
and all this crap about what country invented what/when...grow a dick (i'm a fine one to talk!) countries invent all kinds of things as time passes. the USA gained a massive benefit of land and resources after the virtual extermination of the native inhabitants -- a couple hundred years ago. given that, it's natural the USA would make great advances, as other countries have in the past, given the same set of circumstances.
but can the USA produce cars of as high a quality as Japan or Germany? i've driven a mercedes...wow. you can drive for hours and just step out of it like you only drove a few minutes. Does the USA give it's people medical care at the level of the other "first world" countries? Do we treat our people as anything other than "expensive cattle" to be used as nothing more than a means to drastically enrich the pockets of about 5% of the USA's citizens?
of all the things invented by europeans, but has yet to be discovered by the USA, is a basic respect and care for your neighbors and fellow citizens. how much "technological advance" is that worth?
Treatment, not tyranny. End the drug war and free our American POWs.
See my user info for links.
This happens because those-god-damn-jews keep doing the things that made them those-god-damn-jews, While the moronic-trailer-trash-ghetto-niggers insist on repeating the mistakes that made them moronic-trailer-trash-ghetto-niggers.
Do I get extra points for omitting the *'s???
Keaton, in Gung Ho!, although the title character doesn't appear in the movie. ;)
(I figured a cultural joke would be best placed in a cultural thread, if you don't get it...sorry)
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as far as trolls go, yours was what I could entry-level
If so, you're stuck in a pretty crude view of trolling. Trolls are like chess problems or sonnets. There are strict rules, and the art lies in observing the rules while still creating something genuinely original. The post must be plausible to most readers as somebody's sincere opinion, but under the following constraints: The facts must be substantially wrong. The logic must be entirely fallacious, and it shouldn't proceed from the supposed facts (even if they were accurate). Finally, the conclusion should be insupportable in terms of the rest of the argument (even if that weren't bullshit). The whole should be extremely funny to anybody who sees through it, but if you've done the above properly that should come with the territory (anybody who doesn't get a laugh out of broken logic is an idiot). The whole thing should be internally inconsistent and thoroughly indefensible in every conceivable way -- yet people must believe that it's entirely serious. You have to improvise amusingly and irrationally on themes brought up by people who respond. I prefer a style where the troller's posts get weirder and weirder as the audience gets more involved and less inclined to suspend disbelief. When you get to the point where you can tell somebody you're in contact with aliens, and they still don't call you out as a troll, you're there.
I troll but usually on a more sophisticated level.
If your behavior passes for "sophistication" where you come from, I'll lend you fifty bucks for a bus ticket. I'm not kidding. Hell, I'll give you fifty bucks. I do have a heart here.
I back my trolls up with facts.
"I agree with you", was your "troll", right? Yeah! That's just a regular fact-o-rama, that one!
You see, I'm an actually an educated individual.
Heh. You know what they say about people who call themselves "gentlemen", right? Since you're such an educated individual and all . .
I suspect that you are what we like to call "self-taught". It shows.
You have no idea how painfully insecure you look right now.
once you've nibbled at the bait....you're all mine.
Don't be an idiot. Are you responding to my troll, or I to yours? Get over it, you're ridiculous.
Over here in Australia, we have to pay to send data to the US, and then we have to pay to receive it.
America pays nothing to send data to Australia, and then pays nothing to receive data from Australia.
This is hardly equitable, and will continue as long as the Internet is centred on America. What incentive do they have to pay for any international transit?
Absolutely, but they don't infringe on our free speech rights, just other ones ;)
ICQ#2584116
-- d'arcy poirot
I can see good and bad things in America, but I have to admit that we ape America in many ways in Europe. Belive or not, America-bashing is one of them. I've learnt it here.
Could you point us towards some evidence for you claims about Australian crime rates? And if you suggest something from the NRA or their Australian equivalent, I for one will laugh in your face (or should that be fart? Something disrespectful, anyway). You might want to try the Australian Beaureau of Statistics - they tend to have that sort of information redily available.
Until you provide some evidence, I intend to keep on supporting the gun-control laws in this country, on the grounds that guns are too dangerous to be readily available - it should be difficult to get hold of a gun, for whatever reason you feel you need it. That should at least make it a little bit harder for depressed teenagers to top themselves, or for pissed off spouses to knock off their better halves, or any of the other common gun crimes. Armed robbery isn't that common, you know - possibly because we have a culture where the idea of using guns is considered a tad, shall we say, extreme . . . I rather like this culture, by the way, so telling me it's pathetic is going to go down like a lead balloon, as will telling me that it's not free, that I'm being repressed by my government (the ones that I voted against, by the way - when was the last time you voted?), or any of the other common arguments. I'm as free as you are, in pretty much the same way that any license that meets the OSD is free - past a certain point, the extras don't matter. Your freedom to bear arms is one of those extras, that just aren't important to me, so my lack of freedom in that respect doesn't count as an impingement of my freedoms, nor should it.
Well, that was going to be a nice short disposal of you rather stupid post . . . Ah well, it's always nice to rant about something like this . . .
himi
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My very own DeCSS mirror.
IANA is sanctioned by congress. One day IANA could renig you darn foreigners IP address and bye bye!
Naw, only the uneducated and socially indoctrinated moronic boobs (which are in every country). That's why you only see unintelligent, often emotional nationalistic outbursts from such people. They feel a certain way because they were taught to think that way, but they can't clearly elucidate because their basis of knowledge is mostly based upon bull shit they are fed throughout their lives in the countries they live in. You often notice its on a primitive adversarial level such as that in rooting for a team in sports or unskeptical nationalistic feelings toward war in being unable to even question the actions of their country.
nationalistic ideals and building routers have nothing to do with each other. Otherwise, I could say things like nortel building the canadian internet around the world. Your assertion that they are building the "american internet" around the world is putting a pretty large value on being "american". Especially for multinational companies, this is mostly irrelevant.
to you and the few other 'peans (as it were), who can add a bit more perspective for those of us in the U.S. who are looking for it. It's something we are NOT exposed to on a regular basis (actually I think the 'Net is about the only place you'll find it). We live in a bubble here, a big nice one, but a bubble nonetheless.
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It's a bit scary discovering an American who actually has a brain attached to the fingers that do all that typing . . . It makes it so much harder for me to loath "all those bloody yanks" . . . ;-)
Seriously though, is the US _really_ that insular? Or is it just that the ones with no brain are the ones that don't stop to think before saying/doing things, and hence tend to be loudest? Enquiring minds want to know . . .
himi
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My very own DeCSS mirror.
now I truly feel sorry for you. you really have put a lot of effort and thought into trolling. my God, why? Has your life been reduced to that at what I presume is a young age? You need God in your life. Only He can save you.
Be at peace young man.
I'm sorry if I sound rude but who decided that the Internet is america centric? the people at yahoo? They're american, Commander Taco who posted this article is american, I really don't think americans are In a position to jugde if the internet is america centric. Now i live in Iceland wich is pretty close to the united states (in geography Iceland is a part of the american continet but we're politicly in europe) even for such a short distance, I can definetly feel that the internet is far from america centric, for me it's more like iceland-centric, and people from other countries would probably say the same. p.s. I pray for the day when americans discover that they are not the center of the universe.
"i refuse to waste time on you 'peans."
You don't seem to know the difference between Australia and Europe . . . That is a real achievement, as far as stupidity/ignorance goes . . .
Have you ever wondered why the rest of the world thinks the US is full of dumb fucks? Try reading your own post . . .
himi
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My very own DeCSS mirror.
The big economic powers are behind the Internet. It's not owned by any one nation. The infrastructure is owned by each country it passes through. The US was simply the nation lucky enough to be behind the development and the initial push. Hence the lingua franca English. I'm not going to deride anyone's english skills -- except the morons who speak it as their native tongue and can't spell or form whole sentences -- in any communication. Ich spreche ein bisschen Deutch from my three years in high school, but there's a lot I don't remember. It's ironic to think that the US military was originally behind this tool of global freedom. That and the 'God given right' to freedom, liberty, free speech, free beer, etc. can rub the wrong way sometimes. This again is a cultural thing. Other nations don't value freedom any less, but their strengths it seems lies more in a feeling of community. All nations need indiviual rights *and* community responsibilities. Any country that fails this test will be routed around.
The party's over
'Nuff said. You people really need to brush up on your English.
You know, that is a really broken argument. For a start, the US didn't invent everything in the world, by such a long margin that it's not even funny. The US didn't even invent all the networking technology out there - ISDN was developed (IIRC) by a European company, as an example that I can think of right now.
Secondly, you seem to be looking at the world from a very US centered position, so that you end up either ignoring or literally not seeing all the stuff that _isn't_ about the US - you heard lots of American music while you were in France, but you probably didn't even listen to anything that wasn't American, or very strongly influenced by American music. Likewise with the news, and with the movies you watched, and so forth.
This is the bit that really gets on my nerves:
"I'm not oblivious to the fact that there are other people in the world. I'm just saying that America rules while everyone else drools. There are lots of things (not just the internet) that many people have. That doesn't mean that they aren't America-centric, or didn't come from America."
To paraphrase: "Yeah, I know there are other people out there, but I couldn't give a damn about them. They're not Americans, and hey, they use all this stuff that Americans came up with, and they listen to our music and watch our movies, so it doesn't make any difference, does it? America's just waaay better . . . "
Do you know how stupid that makes you sound? This kind of argument is the reason why most of the world loathes the US - the US seems to think that the world exists either for them to use/abuse/whatever, or that it's too unimportant for them to worry about. That's incredibly offensive for the rest of the world. It's like there's this really big chunk of the world that has it's head so far up it's arse that it doesn't even know that anything other than shit exists - and the rest of the world, because the US just happens to be big enough and rich enough to get away with it, has got to keep on taking this shit. That's what Ozjimbob was talking about when he said you should think outside the square - he meant that you should get your head out of your arse and look around for a bit.
Of course, he was much more polite about it . . .
himi
I love ranting about the US - it's such a large target that you can't miss . . .
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My very own DeCSS mirror.
He was born in Scotland, emigrated to Canada, worked for a while in the US, died and is buried in Canada. BTW the rest of your post is a joke but what can you expect from the American educational system.
Regarding language the world or the net is not US-centric, it is English-centric. Most of the worlds English speakers are not American, which reveals an amusing US-centric touch to that accusation of US-centricness :-)
Anyway, the world is well on its way to become a one language zone. That language will be english. The lack of interest from native english speakers to learn other languages is entirely sensible. Why should they? To be polite to other nations? Nobody learns english to be polite!
In other regards the world is mercilessly anti american. The arcane US measurments "system" will be crushed by the metric system over the next few decades in a painful and pathetic process. And it will be for the same reason that english will take over as world language.
OK, if I haven't convinced you yet, surely this fact will be the killer. Wait for it. A little more. OK, here: I'm not a native english speaker myself!!
They don't have a communist government in Denmark. The rest of your comment - which shows you are aware of some realities - is mostly ignorant drivel.
The problem with the Internet is really related to the mean IQ of Wired-Planet-Earth.
It sounds very reasonable and logical to say that the internet must have one governing body, which governs based on the concerns of all countries accross the globe.
I would hope there was a governing body which said "NO" to censorship on the internet and Taxation. On the other hand, the United Nations can't even stop America from going to war. And when it really comes down to it, America is free to do what it wishes unless someone wishes to go and physically fight the most powerful Army in the world. An army which has dropped "The Bomb" Twice.
I doubt wars will be fought over Americas harmless attempts to ruin the lives of "Hackers", and "Deviants" (you and me) everyday. In fact, I bet with 1 standards association, the US Government would set all standards in a fair and democratic way; (and) profit by them hand over foot. Encryption standards would be made international, though standard encryption, or better is developed in foreign countries already. In return the US would charge royalties on MP3s transferred accross the globe. Not just locally.
At the moment, I believe the legal-loophole of Internationalization is the only way to save the internet, and keep it free for all to use and enjoy. If one government believes it can regulate a medium which is at its core the true essence of Human interaction and developement, then let them. I'll move my DECSS code somewhere else, under an assumed name.
Who knows, maybe if the US had a say in International Internet Law, it would come to its senses and be nice and fair to everyone.
Bahaha Right.
Ace
Are you still required to show "papers" in Denmark when travelling from place to place, and submit all internet content to government approval?
It didn't know your education was THIS bad!!!
The communists have NEVER ruled in Denmark, they are representated in the parlament with about 4 persons out of 179 members.
Geez, I have never shown any papers when travelling, and I have never been censored.
In contradiction to the US, we do not have an censoring at all! Want pornography? Walk down at the local gas station or supermarket. Want horror movies? Turn on the public owned TV-station, they sent "Nightmare on Elm Street" yesterday, a quarter past midnight. Naturally the uncensored version. Do you really believe Americans are the most "free" people?
Anders Ebbesen
For a number of reasons, your post is full of shit.
"The spirit of America, the spirit that overrode the Nazis and Nippon, will spill into every place and every person - whether they acknowledge it or not."
Wrong - what "overrode the Nazis and Nippon" was the fact that the US just happened to be a country with a total land mass larger than Europe, richer agriculturally and minerally, united, and very populous. It's the same reason that invading the USSR was suicidal - some countries are just too big to invade, and some countries are just too big and powerful to defeat in a conventional war. America's "spirit" had almost nothing to do with it's success in the second world war - in fact, it's entirely possible that the US wouldn't have gotten into the war if it hadn't been for Japan making the first move. So where was the American Spirit there?
"I think the important heart of the argument is this: America is the source of a substatianly large portion of all ideas over the past century - it's been the most successful of all memetic cultural beasts because of its strong support of pluralism."
Once again, you seem to be making the mistake of assuming that things caused by America's size and power are actually due to some wonderful thing fundamental to the US's nature - this is, of course, ridiculous. The US has the cultural clout it has because it can afford to produce an enormous amount of cultural product, and it is in a position where it can offer up that product to the rest of the world very easily. It's a lot harder for a popular Australian band to make it in the US than it is for an equivalently (in terms of percentages) popular American band to make it in Australia - the Australian band might sell fifty thousand albums here, where the American band might sell a million albums (the US population is about twenty times that of Australia). That size and economic power massively distorts the way that the US interacts with the rest of thw world, to the point where it can look like the US is somehow qualitatively different, as well as quantitatively.
"But we should remember that Europe, for all its strong culture, history, and intelligence, is for the most part a very, very biased society. Racial purity is not that taboo a concept beneath the surface there, and as far as cultural pluralism... well, the forces coming to a head in Austria may be being censured, but their ideas are only unpopular because they are government sponsored."
This from the home of the Ku Klux Klan? I think you're being just a tad selectively blind, here - there are stupid, bigoted people everywhere in the world, and the fact that some of them are getting considerable power in some parts of Europe doesn't mean that it's a problem unique to Europe. After all, aren't half of the Republican politicians in the US _really_ suspect in this sense?
On the flipside, you can also find as much support for pluralism and so forth in Europe or elsewhere as you can find in the US, and in fact many places are much stronger in their support than the US. Australia, for one, is more multicultural than the US, and more successful (AFAICT) at having multiple cultures living together with minimal tension.
And finally:
"In a sense, no matter how much it changes, America will always remain the owners of the Internet.. maybe not the physical America of the future, but this technology has managed only to spread our ideas and concepts further and more quickly than any means before."
"our" ideas? "our" concepts? I'm sorry, but you've got your head up your arse if you think that the ideas and concepts you are claiming as your own were not being circulated quite successfully without you. You didn't come up with them, and you haven't even perfected them. The only reason they sometimes appear to have originated with you is because you can make much more noise about things than anyone else can, so that you can drown out the other, quieter voices that were talking before.
America, please get your head out of your arse and take a look at the rest of the world - we've been doing all these wonderful things for ages, and yet whenever you start up, you make like it was your idea all along.
himi
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My very own DeCSS mirror.
I haven't travelled extensively, but I have been out of Australia - I've travelled in Indonesia a bit. So I can't really go one up on you there ;-(
However, I don't think I need any particular qualifications to say that you do _not_ come across as someone who has really thought about this sort of thing - you sound rather like someone who has just accepted the things that you learnt in the first ten years of your life, and not considered moving outside that box since. You say you've questioned non-Americans that you know (presumably both the ones at your university, and when you were travelling) - have you ever really sat down and talked to the ones who _didn't_ agree with most of what you said? Did you ever ask them why, and really pursue their reasoning? Or did you just have a good old yarn with the ones that agreed with you, while ignoring the ones that disagreed?
I should note that, like you, I'm not trying to be offensive here, I'm just trying to work out why you think that the rest of the world is second rate, and why you haven't considered that the rest of the world might simply be _different_. You seem to be making a value judgement in a case where they aren't either safe or, generally, warranted - how can you say that a different culture is "second-rate"? You might prefer one to another, but to say that one is better than the other is, to my mind, stupid.
And that's pretty much what pisses me off about the attitude that most Americans seem to have about the world - they either think that it's just completely unimportant, or they think that the US is just fundamentally better. And my response to that kind of reasoning tends to be "Fuck You", because there's very little that anyone can say to change the opinion of someone who thinks that way (believe me, I've tried).
Oh, about ISDN - it's as much a networking technology as ethernet, ATM, X25, wavelan, or any other link-layer technology - it's a bit-pipe, basically.
I suppose you could say that the whole point of my argument is just about identical to OzJimbob's - try thinking outside the square. It would probably help if you started with the premise that the US is _not_ just fundamentally better than the rest of the world, but you never know, you might derive that result from your research . . .
And as a final point, your original post seriously fucked me off by using that phrase "America rules while everyone else drools.", which could probably go down as one of the most offensive lines I've ever heard in an alegedly serious discussion. I'd really suggest you refrain from using it again, unless you're aiming for pissed off readers.
himi
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My very own DeCSS mirror.
An who the fuck are you to say that any other social system is poorer. Thats a load of bullshit. Even if "your" democracy seems better, that other counties, it is deffinitly not the role model of scocial systems out there.
If living for money, and assasinating people who think differnt is your idea of a good system. Put ur fucken head back in the hole.
The software on my computer is not ur's neither is the hardware. The internet is not urs, it's everyone's.
If you want to know what a real system is like, follow the link to my homepage.
But i susspect that unfortunatly you are far to narrow minded, stuck-up and fascist to be able to think that an idea like anarchism would work.
So keep thinking that you are superier to everyone else, maybe it is for the best, we would want you to realise the truth and have to start thinking for your self now would we?
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you really have put a lot of effort and thought into trolling. my God, why?
Same reason some people put a lot of effort and thought into chess problems: It's fun.
You need God in your life. Only He can save you.
That's obviously true. In a world where the Feminists have acquired nuclear weapons and the Liberals are herding decent, Bible-believing Christians into death camps, God is surely the only one who can save us.
Peace to you too.
I challenge you to find even one part of the computer you're sitting in front of that was made in the US.
This just reminded me of a quote: "Russian computers, American computers, it's all made in Taiwan anyway." (Peter Stormare in "Armageddon")
My bologna has a first name, it's H-O-M-E-R,
my bologna has a second name, it's H-O-M-E-R
More like: "They thought nothing about any of the population." After all, there is no reason to service the customer because there is no competition.
Spoken like a true Socialist. The GOVERNMENT ISNT PAYING FOR ANYTHING, YOU ARE!
Think of it this way: the government HAS NO MONEY except for the money they take from you.
"Do you consider it a problem that everyone, even those without a job, are able to have place to live, a television set and Internet access?"
Yes, that is a problem.
Why is that considered to be a GOOD thing? Sounds like a lousy system to me. I would much rather reward those that try to succeed.
I know a person who got asked his email address a second time (over the phone) after ending it with .edu Arun
I'm from Upstate NY - and have lived in america my whole life. you seem to have missed the boat too.
IMO that is about as stupid as you can have it. ... let's have the states decide for themselves what to teach and what not"....
"Oh, sure
If anything should be under federal control it's education, that way EVERYBODY gets an equal opportunity wrt education, not just everybody in X state(s) but every single body.
They are STILL an American company. And they STILL build an American Internet.
What!? You've got to be joking. Cisco build routers. How does a router affect the cultural dominances on the Internet?
I'd almost bet that your television is either Japanese, Korean or German... do you think your brand of television has an effect on your viewing habits?
The Internet has an American influence at the moment for two reasons... one, they got on the bandwagon first... early adopters etc... and two, Americans are they loudest people per capita anywhere in the world.
We, the rest of the world, have our own, better, system ... we just didn't want Americans on it ...
};-{>
It was not implied in my post that everything be done purely for monetary profit, but only that the value (and that depends on taste) exceeds the cost (not strictly monetary).
I certainly can't say that my love of Scheme is ever going to pay me big bucks. Hobbies are great, don't get me wrong, but there is not enough time for me to learn every language in the world! Cost does come into it.
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You were a moderator with 5 points. You should have read the moderator guidelines before you did any moderating
What planet do you live on?
Your Madeline Albright rushes across the globe at the first sign of a nation with an internal problem, wearing cowboy hats or boots - I'm not making that up. Watch the news reports, browse the net. She obviously sees herself as a cowboy out to right the world.
How many of your politicans have described America as the policeman of the world?
How many have denied the role?(Sure proof of it's verasity)
Policemen tend to enforce speed limits, while speeding themselves when they need to.
Concrete analysis...