I agree it should be the first consideration, but the people who want the implementation are MBAs that care more about getting people's money, return on investments and how something looks rather than how secure it is.
<sarcasm>Why pay money up front for security you might never need? It's better to wait until something does happen, like millions of credit card nubmers are stolen, and give the money to the PR people to clean up the mess. It's way cheaper if the gamble pays off.</sarcasm>
In terms of getting exposure, I like Neil's stance on the issue. I read Sandman because a friend of mine pirated it and gave me a copy. I read the first three volumes. Then one day when I was in a comic store with some friends I saw the series and bought the whole thing because I had already read some of it, and liked what I had read. I would have never bought any of them and never heard of Neil Gaiman if it hadn't been because a friend of mine pirated his books. Since then I've bought a few other series written and co-written by Neil.
I haven't seen it in years, but the movie Screamers, based off Second Variety, wasn't bad as I remember. I'll have to pull out my VCR this weekend and see if it still works or see if it's on Netflix.
You can try and spin it anyway you like, but the fact was it was an advertised feature. I bought my Console on launch day, If it wasn't an advertised feature then I wouldn't have known about it and it wouldn't have been the deciding factor in choosing the PS3 over the XBox 360.
Also Other OS was removed in version 3.21 of the firmware, so you're still wrong.
173w ago - Update: Sony's Geoff Levand has now confirmed, to quote: "SCE is committed to continue the support for previously sold models that have the 'Install Other OS' feature and that this feature will not be disabled in future firmware releases."
199w ago - Today Sony's Satoshi Hashimoto, in an interview with Impress Watch, confirmed that Sony will not be removing the OtherOS and Linux functionality in old (non-Slim) PlayStation 3 consoles.
1) I didn't bring it up. I was pointing out the fact that Sony did in fact lie. They said they wouldn't remove the Other OS, then they did.
2) I paid $800, not because it could run Linux, but because it could also run Linux.
This is just one of many things Sony did with the PS3 to screw over customers and it's important to make sure people don't forget. Especially now where Sony stands to get back on top, not because they've done something great, but because they aren't as bad as their competitor. When people are thinking about their options to buy a PS4, XBone, Wii U or a PC I want them thinking about the type of company they're buying from, how they treat their customers and how some of the things these companies have gotten away with are affecting them now and will affect them in the future.
As an example, Class action over the Other OS removal, ruling was in Sony's favor although stated by the judge it was unethical. Because of the president it's now "unethical", but ok for any other company to do the same. It's ok to sell any product with a feature then just not support it, or altogether remove it later.
Also because of the Other OS removal now companies are including "no class action" clauses in their ToS, another huge hit to consumer rights. That's on Sony, and it's up to everyone to make sure people know what they're supporting when they give their money to a company like Sony or Microsoft.
First Sony said a couple of months before the Other OS removal they wouldn't be removing it. Then on an April 1st release they removed it. Everyone just thought it was a joke until it was too late for a lot of people. Sony made it MANDATORY because you either had to update and lose the Other OS feature, or you couldn't use the console to connect to PSN (meaning you lost access to any games you bought online), play newer bluRays or newer games. Either way, doing the update or not, you lost something you bought the console to do.
As I've said probably a dozen times in the last few weeks. My console was updated, not by me, when I had some people over to watch a RENTED movie. The movie required a BluRay update, which updated the console.
Sony was not up front about removing the Other OS, they lied about it profusely and tried to trick, and ultimately forced, PS3 owners to update. Linux was an awesome feature to have on my PS3 and I did a lot of stuff with it, but anyone that didn't update is now stuck with an overpriced ($800 when I bought mine), under powered, locked down Linux machine.
From what I've heard Facebook also allows some feminist groups to post comments calling for the castration of men on their site, so I'd say they were just being equal opportunity by allowing comments from the other side. My opinion is if you don't like it don't read it, but it seems censorship and making sure no one can read it is a much better choice.
Yeah, lucky for me I only have to go every other year to make sure our software solutions are still functioning properly on the ships and to see where improvements can be made. I was sea sick my first time out to Georges Banks for three days until I knocked myself out by smacking my head on the ceiling jumping out of bed to get sick. Haven't been sea sick since, getting land sick after I get off the ship is a whole other kettle o'fish.
Yep, I agree. I just brought up the docking station, because then I'd have the whole development environment setup (mostly for the dual monitors) at the places I primarily do my hardcore development (Home and work). But a Bluetooth keyboard would be sufficient in a pinch where I might be in a hotel room. It'd be really hard to make that work on a ship at sea, too much rocking. There are tethers for chairs in the galley, my last trip out I saw a guy (and his supper) slide clear across the room, chair and all, because he didn't tie himself off. So I doubt propping up a tablet would work. Like you said though using it as a straight tablet at that point would be fine. It's not always that bad at sea, but where there's a storm or really high waves, the fewer things you need to catch when the ship rolls the better. You often need at least one hand to hold on to something.
You forgot the classic, "he raped two women while on conference is some foreign country, who conveniently wait to report it until the height of a scandal where he internationally discredits the US government."
That's just what you'd expect someone to say. Next step will be to accuse him of treason and put him to death before he can damage the country further while continuing to discredit him to make the issues he's brought to light irrelevant.
Tablets and phones are a docking station away from being full fledged computers to do work on. My Galaxy Note II is more powerful that the computer I had 10 years ago for gaming, less the video card. With something like Ubuntu for Andriod, or if MS didn't F up Windows 8 so bad, I could just drop it into a docking station at home or pick it up and take it to work and have a fully usable computer with a keyboard, mouse, LAN connection and multiple monitors, with the added bonus that while traveling or at sea I could use a tablet interface for minor editing, simple bug fixes when I have an wifi connection available or playing casual games in between.
I know what you mean. I'm a little P.O'ed at how bad the offerings from MS are, and how bad Sony treats their customers, but there's lots of other choices out there and that's a good thing. I hate to be all tin foil hat, but I kind of think it might be related to this new social advertising method of reputation management I've been reading about. Some firm hired by MS specifically go out and shrill/bully/intimidate people on message boards to give the impression that the following for MS product is large and the product is going to be huge or that people who think it's crap are stupid and don't know what they're talking about.
Kind of like how when Windows 8 was just coming into consumer preview you couldn't read an article on slashdot, or any other tech forum, where half the comments weren't claiming "I've used Win8 since the developers preview and it's so awesome it walks on water like Jesus!!!11!!". Now that Windows 8 is in the wild and we all know how bad it is, all those comments have dried up with only the occasional "I like windows 8, it's not bad, but Metro sucks". I hate to pick on MS specifically for this, I'm sure all large companies do it (Apple, Google, Sony, et al.). Windows 8 is just the first product I've seen the technique used in such force for that it has to be what was going on.
Part of the reason I like indi developers and open source products is you can be reasonably sure they're not spending huge budgets on trying to convince people their product is king. Indi games and open source products have to stand on their own without huge advertising budgets. If it's a good product it gets adopted and advertised by word of mouth. The same can't be said for products from large corporations that have a ton of money to throw at convincing people otherwise rather than just doing what their clients want and fixing the problems.
I think the fact that Dell is essentially creating a "Console PC" says a lot about how bad the PS4 and XBone consoles offerings are for this generation. Bad enough that other PC companies are going to try and mussel in on the action.
Normally I'd let comments like this slide, but I'm getting really tired of all the Windows 8 garbage that's being spread around here. You can get docks for Android phones and there is a Ubuntu for Android as someone pointed out to me yesterday. So I can use my Note II as an Ubuntu computer, which is what I use at home and get lots of work done on.
Most of/. posters are technically inclined people that have seen/used Windows 8 and from what I've read most agree Metro is garbage and the worst thing to happen to desktops ever. IMHO, you can take your toy interface and find some 5 year olds to use it that don't have real work to do.
Agreed, I only own one movie. I was waiting for prices to drop before investing in a collection. On further consideration, espically since new movies may not work on older players, it'll never be worth it. Forced obsolescences seems to be built in.
I think we'd have to take a closer look at their marketing tactics to really see if that's true. I agree they were taking a loss on the console, but I'm pretty sure what they make up on for PSN advertising and data mining would make up for that. Not to mention the console was really what sold BluRay over Microsoft's HD DVD format. So selling the PS3 at a loss helped them win the format war and now they get a decent cut of bluRay Disk or player sales.
Not sure if disc-enforced updates apply to this one or not.
They did, that's how my PS3 was updated.
Newer bluRay movies require system updates. I wasn't in the room when my wife or cousin put the rented bluRay movie in so I don't know if it had to go out to download the update or if it just ran off the disk. I had turned off the wireless on my PS3 so I don't know if someone reconnected it for the update or if it just came on the disk. So it's Keep the Other OS feature and forget about everything else you bought the console to do or ditch the Other OS feature.
More reasons, as if we needed them, to pirate movies. Even paying to rent them can have negative effects on your hardware, the pirated version of the movie we watched wouldn't have forced an update to my console.
I've seen that before, I imagine that's where the idea in my head came from. Thanks for point it out.
I only skimmed the site and I can't seem to find any place to actually get it, but when I have some time I have an older HTC Desire Z I'd love to try this out on. I'd also have to figure out where to get the docking station, which I did look for awhile back, but couldn't find anything at a reasonable price point.
I specifically declined all attempts to update the system over the network until I had some people over for movies. I was making snacks and my cousin or wife (neither will fess up to it) put the movie we rented in. It said the console required and update and they said ok. By the time I showed up it was too late to do anything about it.
Their whole poking fun at MS and the XO is kind of funny at the moment, but it's really just an attempted to gain back some of the early adopters they alienated with the Other OS removal. If they hadn't removed the Other OS feature I bought and paid for with my PS3, I'd probably be all in on buy a PS4. I hate to sound conceded, but my recommendations when the PS3 first came out was responsible for at least a dozen console sales, I'm sure other early adopter tech geeks can say the same thing. As it stands now I'll make sure everyone I know, knows Sony is an under handed entity that can't be trusted from one day to the next to follow up on something they said the would or wouldn't do. After all it was only weeks before the April 1st update that removed of the Other OS they said they wouldn't consider removing it.
Point being once they have your money, they don't really care how they screw you over, but they'll find a way.
Slashdot Mirror
XBone Eighty, now with only 80% of the Bone.
I agree it should be the first consideration, but the people who want the implementation are MBAs that care more about getting people's money, return on investments and how something looks rather than how secure it is.
<sarcasm>Why pay money up front for security you might never need? It's better to wait until something does happen, like millions of credit card nubmers are stolen, and give the money to the PR people to clean up the mess. It's way cheaper if the gamble pays off.</sarcasm>
Yes, I agree.
In terms of getting exposure, I like Neil's stance on the issue. I read Sandman because a friend of mine pirated it and gave me a copy. I read the first three volumes. Then one day when I was in a comic store with some friends I saw the series and bought the whole thing because I had already read some of it, and liked what I had read. I would have never bought any of them and never heard of Neil Gaiman if it hadn't been because a friend of mine pirated his books. Since then I've bought a few other series written and co-written by Neil.
Neil Gaiman would disagree with you.
I haven't seen it in years, but the movie Screamers, based off Second Variety, wasn't bad as I remember. I'll have to pull out my VCR this weekend and see if it still works or see if it's on Netflix.
You can try and spin it anyway you like, but the fact was it was an advertised feature. I bought my Console on launch day, If it wasn't an advertised feature then I wouldn't have known about it and it wouldn't have been the deciding factor in choosing the PS3 over the XBox 360.
Also Other OS was removed in version 3.21 of the firmware, so you're still wrong.
173w ago - Update: Sony's Geoff Levand has now confirmed, to quote: "SCE is committed to continue the support for previously sold models that have the 'Install Other OS' feature and that this feature will not be disabled in future firmware releases."
Read more: http://www.ps3news.com/playstation-3-psn-news/rumor-sony-to-remove-otheros-in-next-ps3-firmware-update/#ixzz2WUNHPlbf
199w ago - Today Sony's Satoshi Hashimoto, in an interview with Impress Watch, confirmed that Sony will not be removing the OtherOS and Linux functionality in old (non-Slim) PlayStation 3 consoles.
Read more: http://www.ps3news.com/PS3-Linux/ps3-otheros-linux-to-remain-in-old-ps3s-no-security-hole/#ixzz2WUNsxnTI
1) I didn't bring it up. I was pointing out the fact that Sony did in fact lie. They said they wouldn't remove the Other OS, then they did.
2) I paid $800, not because it could run Linux, but because it could also run Linux.
This is just one of many things Sony did with the PS3 to screw over customers and it's important to make sure people don't forget. Especially now where Sony stands to get back on top, not because they've done something great, but because they aren't as bad as their competitor. When people are thinking about their options to buy a PS4, XBone, Wii U or a PC I want them thinking about the type of company they're buying from, how they treat their customers and how some of the things these companies have gotten away with are affecting them now and will affect them in the future.
As an example, Class action over the Other OS removal, ruling was in Sony's favor although stated by the judge it was unethical. Because of the president it's now "unethical", but ok for any other company to do the same. It's ok to sell any product with a feature then just not support it, or altogether remove it later.
Also because of the Other OS removal now companies are including "no class action" clauses in their ToS, another huge hit to consumer rights. That's on Sony, and it's up to everyone to make sure people know what they're supporting when they give their money to a company like Sony or Microsoft.
What planet have you been living on?
First Sony said a couple of months before the Other OS removal they wouldn't be removing it. Then on an April 1st release they removed it. Everyone just thought it was a joke until it was too late for a lot of people. Sony made it MANDATORY because you either had to update and lose the Other OS feature, or you couldn't use the console to connect to PSN (meaning you lost access to any games you bought online), play newer bluRays or newer games. Either way, doing the update or not, you lost something you bought the console to do.
As I've said probably a dozen times in the last few weeks. My console was updated, not by me, when I had some people over to watch a RENTED movie. The movie required a BluRay update, which updated the console.
Sony was not up front about removing the Other OS, they lied about it profusely and tried to trick, and ultimately forced, PS3 owners to update. Linux was an awesome feature to have on my PS3 and I did a lot of stuff with it, but anyone that didn't update is now stuck with an overpriced ($800 when I bought mine), under powered, locked down Linux machine.
Or ads for hemroid cream
From what I've heard Facebook also allows some feminist groups to post comments calling for the castration of men on their site, so I'd say they were just being equal opportunity by allowing comments from the other side. My opinion is if you don't like it don't read it, but it seems censorship and making sure no one can read it is a much better choice.
*facepalm*
Yeah, lucky for me I only have to go every other year to make sure our software solutions are still functioning properly on the ships and to see where improvements can be made. I was sea sick my first time out to Georges Banks for three days until I knocked myself out by smacking my head on the ceiling jumping out of bed to get sick. Haven't been sea sick since, getting land sick after I get off the ship is a whole other kettle o'fish.
Yep, I agree. I just brought up the docking station, because then I'd have the whole development environment setup (mostly for the dual monitors) at the places I primarily do my hardcore development (Home and work). But a Bluetooth keyboard would be sufficient in a pinch where I might be in a hotel room. It'd be really hard to make that work on a ship at sea, too much rocking. There are tethers for chairs in the galley, my last trip out I saw a guy (and his supper) slide clear across the room, chair and all, because he didn't tie himself off. So I doubt propping up a tablet would work. Like you said though using it as a straight tablet at that point would be fine. It's not always that bad at sea, but where there's a storm or really high waves, the fewer things you need to catch when the ship rolls the better. You often need at least one hand to hold on to something.
You forgot the classic, "he raped two women while on conference is some foreign country, who conveniently wait to report it until the height of a scandal where he internationally discredits the US government."
....
3, 2, 1
That's just what you'd expect someone to say. Next step will be to accuse him of treason and put him to death before he can damage the country further while continuing to discredit him to make the issues he's brought to light irrelevant.
Nothing to see here people move along.
I have to agree with this.
Tablets and phones are a docking station away from being full fledged computers to do work on. My Galaxy Note II is more powerful that the computer I had 10 years ago for gaming, less the video card. With something like Ubuntu for Andriod, or if MS didn't F up Windows 8 so bad, I could just drop it into a docking station at home or pick it up and take it to work and have a fully usable computer with a keyboard, mouse, LAN connection and multiple monitors, with the added bonus that while traveling or at sea I could use a tablet interface for minor editing, simple bug fixes when I have an wifi connection available or playing casual games in between.
I know what you mean. I'm a little P.O'ed at how bad the offerings from MS are, and how bad Sony treats their customers, but there's lots of other choices out there and that's a good thing. I hate to be all tin foil hat, but I kind of think it might be related to this new social advertising method of reputation management I've been reading about. Some firm hired by MS specifically go out and shrill/bully/intimidate people on message boards to give the impression that the following for MS product is large and the product is going to be huge or that people who think it's crap are stupid and don't know what they're talking about.
Kind of like how when Windows 8 was just coming into consumer preview you couldn't read an article on slashdot, or any other tech forum, where half the comments weren't claiming "I've used Win8 since the developers preview and it's so awesome it walks on water like Jesus!!!11!!". Now that Windows 8 is in the wild and we all know how bad it is, all those comments have dried up with only the occasional "I like windows 8, it's not bad, but Metro sucks". I hate to pick on MS specifically for this, I'm sure all large companies do it (Apple, Google, Sony, et al.). Windows 8 is just the first product I've seen the technique used in such force for that it has to be what was going on.
Part of the reason I like indi developers and open source products is you can be reasonably sure they're not spending huge budgets on trying to convince people their product is king. Indi games and open source products have to stand on their own without huge advertising budgets. If it's a good product it gets adopted and advertised by word of mouth. The same can't be said for products from large corporations that have a ton of money to throw at convincing people otherwise rather than just doing what their clients want and fixing the problems.
I think the fact that Dell is essentially creating a "Console PC" says a lot about how bad the PS4 and XBone consoles offerings are for this generation. Bad enough that other PC companies are going to try and mussel in on the action.
Normally I'd let comments like this slide, but I'm getting really tired of all the Windows 8 garbage that's being spread around here. You can get docks for Android phones and there is a Ubuntu for Android as someone pointed out to me yesterday. So I can use my Note II as an Ubuntu computer, which is what I use at home and get lots of work done on.
/. posters are technically inclined people that have seen/used Windows 8 and from what I've read most agree Metro is garbage and the worst thing to happen to desktops ever. IMHO, you can take your toy interface and find some 5 year olds to use it that don't have real work to do.
Most of
Agreed, I only own one movie. I was waiting for prices to drop before investing in a collection. On further consideration, espically since new movies may not work on older players, it'll never be worth it. Forced obsolescences seems to be built in.
I think we'd have to take a closer look at their marketing tactics to really see if that's true. I agree they were taking a loss on the console, but I'm pretty sure what they make up on for PSN advertising and data mining would make up for that. Not to mention the console was really what sold BluRay over Microsoft's HD DVD format. So selling the PS3 at a loss helped them win the format war and now they get a decent cut of bluRay Disk or player sales.
Not sure if disc-enforced updates apply to this one or not.
They did, that's how my PS3 was updated.
Newer bluRay movies require system updates. I wasn't in the room when my wife or cousin put the rented bluRay movie in so I don't know if it had to go out to download the update or if it just ran off the disk. I had turned off the wireless on my PS3 so I don't know if someone reconnected it for the update or if it just came on the disk. So it's Keep the Other OS feature and forget about everything else you bought the console to do or ditch the Other OS feature.
More reasons, as if we needed them, to pirate movies. Even paying to rent them can have negative effects on your hardware, the pirated version of the movie we watched wouldn't have forced an update to my console.
I've seen that before, I imagine that's where the idea in my head came from. Thanks for point it out.
I only skimmed the site and I can't seem to find any place to actually get it, but when I have some time I have an older HTC Desire Z I'd love to try this out on. I'd also have to figure out where to get the docking station, which I did look for awhile back, but couldn't find anything at a reasonable price point.
My PS3 was updated by a rented bluRay movie.
I specifically declined all attempts to update the system over the network until I had some people over for movies. I was making snacks and my cousin or wife (neither will fess up to it) put the movie we rented in. It said the console required and update and they said ok. By the time I showed up it was too late to do anything about it.
Their whole poking fun at MS and the XO is kind of funny at the moment, but it's really just an attempted to gain back some of the early adopters they alienated with the Other OS removal. If they hadn't removed the Other OS feature I bought and paid for with my PS3, I'd probably be all in on buy a PS4. I hate to sound conceded, but my recommendations when the PS3 first came out was responsible for at least a dozen console sales, I'm sure other early adopter tech geeks can say the same thing. As it stands now I'll make sure everyone I know, knows Sony is an under handed entity that can't be trusted from one day to the next to follow up on something they said the would or wouldn't do. After all it was only weeks before the April 1st update that removed of the Other OS they said they wouldn't consider removing it.
Point being once they have your money, they don't really care how they screw you over, but they'll find a way.