When I said setup was a breeze I really meant setup was a breeze.
Apart from being very clearly laid out, the Ubuntu installer is easy to follow and takes you through the installation process fairly painlessly.
Now of course someone who's never used a computer before is not going to install an operating system. That is just plain silly.
The point is that even someone moderately knowledgable (I'm not talking guru here) should be able to set up Ubuntu. Anyone who can answer yes no questions can set it up. Most of the time the defaults are correct anyway.
On a related note would you give your mother a Windows XP disc and expect her to install it. I certainly wouldn't. The difference is with Windows is most of the time it's pre-installed by the manufacturer.
Not to nit-pick... but it was actually my girlfriend's grandmother. Something tells me that you read "I installed Ubuntu", "grandmother" and "Is Ubuntu ready for the desktop? You bet your ass it is." and ignored everything else.
I haven't seen YaST so I can't comment on how easy it is to use, but Ubuntu has the apt-get front end Synaptic, which allows the user to browse through the list of available software for Ubuntu and download and install/uninstall it with the click of a mouse.
Although I'm not a n00b (far from it in fact - I'm a Linux sysadmin for a web-hosting company) I for one don't actually use the command line for apt-get on Ubuntu as I find Synaptic so easy. In fact, since I started using Ubuntu at home I don't use the command line for much of anything.
I will have to check out SuSE though, because everyone keeps raving about how great it is. I guess where there's smoke there's fire. I would recommend anyone who hasn't tried it to fire up the Ubuntu Hoary live CD. You may be impressed.
I installed Ubuntu on my gf's grandmother's laptop, a Toshiba Tecra A2. Setup was a breeze. It detected everything right down to the wireless eth card.
I also stuck a "My Documents" shortcut on the Desktop so the other Windows people woulnd't get lost and in addition made it boot straight into her profile with no password.
That was a few weeks ago, and I saw her the other day quite happily looking at photos of the grandkids and playing a mpeg clip with mplayer. Keep in mind she's 80 odd and has never used a computer before. She wanted to play some games also, so I stuck shortcuts on the desktop to Solitaire and minesweeper.
After using Ubuntu, my gf's dad now wants it on his computer because he says "Windows XP is too hard to use" and he "really likes it how everything makes sense on Ubuntu". Hmmm a logical desktop OS where everything Just Works(tm) is the exact reason I use Ubuntu on my desktop.
Is Ubuntu ready for the desktop? You bet your ass it is.
PS If anyone's interested you can read the blog entry here
I wrote a PHP program that tracks my gf's and I's finances with a Postgresql database backend.
It's up to about 600 records now and although I wouldn't say it's mission critical it certainly is vital.
I have to say I'm extremely impressed with pgsql. It's easy to use and consistent in what it does. I have no complaints whatsoever. What I like most (although I'm not sure this is exclusive to pgsql) is the fact that I can at any time get a plain text dump of everything in the database in a format that makes sense. If the worst comes to the absolute worst, I can always mess around with awk and write a script which can convert a pg dump to another format. It gives me piece of mind that my data can always be read.
I've heard that ms sql users are not so fortunate - ie no plain text dumps. Correct me if I'm wrong.
Kudos to the pgsql team for such a fine product and keep up the good work!
Could it have been the tin-whiskers phenomena? I could imagine a tin-whisker growing out, shorting across two critical circuits and there you have it, one dark satellite.
I got asked by a customer recently how come satellites can stay up there for 20+ years without failure and their PC can blow a power supply after 3 months of use. I said "Your power supply didn't cost 3 million dollars."
It also looks like they've fixed a long standing gripe of mine - namely the fact that creating Samba shares under Gnome is (was(?)) a pain in the neck.
I cannot wait to get my hands on 2.10. Does anyone know if Ubuntu Hoary is going to use it?
If this preview is anything to go by, the UI offered by Gnome as it matures and its feature set becomes complete will be a serious contender gainst the other major GUI's (namely KDE, Windows and Aqua).
Kudos to the Gnome team and keep up the great work.
Thank god someone has some basic comprehension skills as this was, in fact, my point.
For those that didn't get it the first time, I'll explain it to you:
The flash animation is entitled "Convert to Linux in 12 Easy Steps". The title is meant to convey that the animation is an instructional one.
As the animation progresses, the viewer is shown a series of "steps", all of which purport to give the viewer some instruction in the conversion from Windows to Linux. The animation, however, is in fact, a parody of Linux, which plays on the notion that Linux is harder to use than Windows. Such examples as (paraphrasing) "dismantle the registry and place it into 28,000 files" and "turn on the Windows 3.1 desktop for the square window effect" are typical; thus the animation lampoons the useability of Linux whilst implying that Windows has a better user interface.
Now, in my post I simply said the flash animation was stupid and unfunny. I never said (god forbid) that Windows sucks, or that Linux was better or that [insert favourite OS here] was crappier than [insert other OS here] or anything remotely personally offensive to you.
To the AC's (NOT this parent): As an aside, I usually don't bother replying to AC's but I felt I should point out that you all missed the point entirely.
I mean, when you try to download an ISO of a distro does a big red dialog box jump up and say "I'm sorry, Slashdot user number xxxxx has prevented you from downloading this file."?
Come on, if you want to use Linux, get off your ass and use it. Don't whine about Slashdot users "preventing" you from using it because that's crap. IMHO I think it's probably apathy on your part that stops you from using Linux.
There are three types of Windows users: Those that use it because they like it, have seen the alternative and still think Windows is cool (no problem with this - that's their choice). Those that don't know any different (we should try to show them something different to see if they want to switch) and those that think Windows sucks but they use it anyway and keep looking at Linux saying "I know it's better but I can't be bothered."
Isn't Windows proprietary? OMG, if Microsoft goes bust, does that mean that the 50 gazillion Windows users out there won't have access to their systems? Of course not, because the Windows OS has very good industry support. The same goes for Apple. There are enough machines out there that if Apple goes under, quite a few people will be able to deal with your problem; as opposed to the SimPC which if it sells 100 units and goes bust, has absolutely no industry support backing up whatever custom never-heard-of-it-OS is installed. Even better if it has a custom filesystem that no-one knows about. I wouldn't let my grandparents' data be entrusted to a custom piece of software.
A custom piece of software or hardware becomes a standard when enough people are using it. Remember, Windows was a custom, little-known piece of software with no industry support behind it at one point too. If Microsoft had folded at a point when a few people were using FAT (a proprietary file system at the time - now a standard due to high usage) and some of those people experienced software errors that meant they couldn't boot their OS's, it would mean loss of data. Period.
In my experience this is precisely what elderly people want to do with their PC's.
I think a configured Mac mini with it's stable, easy to use operating system hooked up to a DSL router (ie it holds the connection for you - not the computer) is probably just as easy to use and has more of the stuff that grandparents actually want to do.
As a side note, the proprietry OS scares me. What happens when the company goes under and there's something wrong that prevents the OS from loading (like hardware failure). Say bye-bye to the last 5 years of photos and letters from the grandkids.
Neh I don't care about an Offtopic mod. I've got karma to burn. But I would like to help you out some.
I read that you have a decent machine, so any distro will run fine on it. Can I ask why Mandrake? The reason I ask is because I used to be a Mandrake person. For details, check my blog entry
I know, it's very verbose. In a nutshell I declare Ubuntu the coolest distro ever. Don't let the name throw you off. It's a serious distro with some serious cash and brainy people behind it.
Furthermore - you can order the CD's at no cost to yourself. Yep - they ship them to you for free. So can that 56K download and order the CD's instead.
Mine rocked up about 3 months after I ordered them, but I hear that that was because of the demand for the CD's. It might be quicker now. OTOH If you want to pay for the shipping I'll be happy to throw one of my CD's in the post for ya. Drop me a line on my webpage if you're interested.
Anyway, just my 2 cents. Ubuntu is the best desktop OS for PC's I've seen. Period. Put it this way, I just installed it on my girlfriend's grandmother's laptop, and she likes it. That should tell you something.
If it's really mission critical, I'd say go with Woody, but we run Sarge (which is nearing graduation to stable status) on our web and email servers at work and we have found it to be just as reliable and stable as Woody is.
Just for reference, I work for a web hosting company, and when servers go down, we start losing real dollars. For anything but nuclear control/space launch, I'd recommend Debian Sarge. Give it a go on an old box and have a play. I doubt you'll be disappointed.
I switched about 8 months ago and haven't looked back (I used to be a Red Hat then Mandrake person).
The best bit for you though - regular security updates from a trusted source. The Debian Project are nutcases when it comes to security, and they follow up every issue. Wanna update your box? apt-get update, apt-get upgrade. You're Done. It's safe and easy and trouble free.
Not to start a holy war, but we have 2 RHEL boxes also (some of our vendor specific software requires RH) that give us no end of grief. I'd like to drop those boxes if I could but I can't.
Anyway just a suggestion - Debian for servers rocketh muchly.
What if your intention was to feel good about doing something nice for someone else? Wouldn't this be a selfish act in itself? I mean, you don't help an old lady across the street because she needs helping. You do it because you want to feel good about yourself. You want to feel like you've made a difference. You want to know in yourself that you are a good person, and in helping someone else, you are, in effect, self-serving.
My point is that in every "selfless" act, there is always a selfish reason. The extent of that selfish reason varies, (in helping an old lady across the street) from "I'm average joe I want to feel good about myself" to "I'm a professional hitman and this gets me closer to my mark".
Either way, (unless you're the assassin of course) the old lady still gets across the street safely, and you get to feel good about yourself. Win-Win.
The biggest benefit I see for this is that by opening their portfolio, the innovations they spearheaded are built upon by an army of thousands. Now that IBM are turning into a service company (which is evidenced by their sale of the PC division - they will concentrate on selling service with their big iron (good move IMHO)), the innovations they have already invested in will continue to reap them rewards because their "style" of computing is already compatible with whatever the FOSS community will bring to the table. Cool innovations for FOSS and rewards for IBM. Win-Win situation!
Sorry dude, already done:) If you want to read a fantastic book that describes just that scenario, I suggest "Ragnarok" (I'm almost certain that that's the name of it - but I can't find any info on google)
It basically revolves around a group of environmental scientists who plant a nuclear bomb in a fissure under Iceland and threaten to detonate it if their demands aren't met. The explosion in the fissure would cause a global disaster.
I couldn't put it down, and it is done in a very realistic way. If you're lucky enough to come across it, read it. You won't be disappointed.
When (yes when) humans colonize Mars and non-engineer/scientific humans are living there I wonder what they will do with the man made stuff from long ago that will be sitting there inert.
I have a couple of theories as to what the human race will do with this stuff:
a) Cordon off the area around the rovers and heat shields etc. as a "heritage park" for people to visit and think about the events of the past
b) Take the stuff and stick it in a museum on earth
c) As above but create the museum on Mars
d) Melt it down and recycle it
e) Revive the electronics and re-purpose the robots etc.
Slashdot Mirror
When I said setup was a breeze I really meant setup was a breeze.
Apart from being very clearly laid out, the Ubuntu installer is easy to follow and takes you through the installation process fairly painlessly.
Now of course someone who's never used a computer before is not going to install an operating system. That is just plain silly.
The point is that even someone moderately knowledgable (I'm not talking guru here) should be able to set up Ubuntu. Anyone who can answer yes no questions can set it up. Most of the time the defaults are correct anyway.
On a related note would you give your mother a Windows XP disc and expect her to install it. I certainly wouldn't. The difference is with Windows is most of the time it's pre-installed by the manufacturer.
Not to nit-pick... but it was actually my girlfriend's grandmother. Something tells me that you read "I installed Ubuntu", "grandmother" and "Is Ubuntu ready for the desktop? You bet your ass it is." and ignored everything else.
I haven't seen YaST so I can't comment on how easy it is to use, but Ubuntu has the apt-get front end Synaptic, which allows the user to browse through the list of available software for Ubuntu and download and install/uninstall it with the click of a mouse.
Although I'm not a n00b (far from it in fact - I'm a Linux sysadmin for a web-hosting company) I for one don't actually use the command line for apt-get on Ubuntu as I find Synaptic so easy. In fact, since I started using Ubuntu at home I don't use the command line for much of anything.
I will have to check out SuSE though, because everyone keeps raving about how great it is. I guess where there's smoke there's fire. I would recommend anyone who hasn't tried it to fire up the Ubuntu Hoary live CD. You may be impressed.
Here Here.
I installed Ubuntu on my gf's grandmother's laptop, a Toshiba Tecra A2. Setup was a breeze. It detected everything right down to the wireless eth card.
I also stuck a "My Documents" shortcut on the Desktop so the other Windows people woulnd't get lost and in addition made it boot straight into her profile with no password.
That was a few weeks ago, and I saw her the other day quite happily looking at photos of the grandkids and playing a mpeg clip with mplayer. Keep in mind she's 80 odd and has never used a computer before. She wanted to play some games also, so I stuck shortcuts on the desktop to Solitaire and minesweeper.
After using Ubuntu, my gf's dad now wants it on his computer because he says "Windows XP is too hard to use" and he "really likes it how everything makes sense on Ubuntu". Hmmm a logical desktop OS where everything Just Works(tm) is the exact reason I use Ubuntu on my desktop.
Is Ubuntu ready for the desktop? You bet your ass it is.
PS If anyone's interested you can read the blog entry here
This AI and natural language thing gives ne deja-vue
Don't worry about that, it's just a glitch. It happens sometimes when the AI's change something.
I wrote a PHP program that tracks my gf's and I's finances with a Postgresql database backend.
It's up to about 600 records now and although I wouldn't say it's mission critical it certainly is vital.
I have to say I'm extremely impressed with pgsql. It's easy to use and consistent in what it does. I have no complaints whatsoever. What I like most (although I'm not sure this is exclusive to pgsql) is the fact that I can at any time get a plain text dump of everything in the database in a format that makes sense. If the worst comes to the absolute worst, I can always mess around with awk and write a script which can convert a pg dump to another format. It gives me piece of mind that my data can always be read.
I've heard that ms sql users are not so fortunate - ie no plain text dumps. Correct me if I'm wrong.
Kudos to the pgsql team for such a fine product and keep up the good work!
Could it have been the tin-whiskers phenomena? I could imagine a tin-whisker growing out, shorting across two critical circuits and there you have it, one dark satellite.
I got asked by a customer recently how come satellites can stay up there for 20+ years without failure and their PC can blow a power supply after 3 months of use. I said "Your power supply didn't cost 3 million dollars."
"Oh."
Those screenshots look HOT!
It also looks like they've fixed a long standing gripe of mine - namely the fact that creating Samba shares under Gnome is (was(?)) a pain in the neck.
I cannot wait to get my hands on 2.10. Does anyone know if Ubuntu Hoary is going to use it?
If this preview is anything to go by, the UI offered by Gnome as it matures and its feature set becomes complete will be a serious contender gainst the other major GUI's (namely KDE, Windows and Aqua).
Kudos to the Gnome team and keep up the great work.
Oh really? Oh okay, I've got one for you:
Knock Knock.
(you say who's there?)
Boo
(you say boo who?)
Don't cry, It's only a joke!
Why aren't you laughing? Man you should loosen the fuck up. jesus.
Oh that's right, it's not funny...
Thank god someone has some basic comprehension skills as this was, in fact, my point.
For those that didn't get it the first time, I'll explain it to you:
The flash animation is entitled "Convert to Linux in 12 Easy Steps". The title is meant to convey that the animation is an instructional one.
As the animation progresses, the viewer is shown a series of "steps", all of which purport to give the viewer some instruction in the conversion from Windows to Linux. The animation, however, is in fact, a parody of Linux, which plays on the notion that Linux is harder to use than Windows. Such examples as (paraphrasing) "dismantle the registry and place it into 28,000 files" and "turn on the Windows 3.1 desktop for the square window effect" are typical; thus the animation lampoons the useability of Linux whilst implying that Windows has a better user interface.
Now, in my post I simply said the flash animation was stupid and unfunny. I never said (god forbid) that Windows sucks, or that Linux was better or that [insert favourite OS here] was crappier than [insert other OS here] or anything remotely personally offensive to you.
To the AC's (NOT this parent): As an aside, I usually don't bother replying to AC's but I felt I should point out that you all missed the point entirely.
You're welcome.
People on Slashdot prevent you from using Linux??
I mean, when you try to download an ISO of a distro does a big red dialog box jump up and say "I'm sorry, Slashdot user number xxxxx has prevented you from downloading this file."?
Come on, if you want to use Linux, get off your ass and use it. Don't whine about Slashdot users "preventing" you from using it because that's crap. IMHO I think it's probably apathy on your part that stops you from using Linux.
There are three types of Windows users: Those that use it because they like it, have seen the alternative and still think Windows is cool (no problem with this - that's their choice). Those that don't know any different (we should try to show them something different to see if they want to switch) and those that think Windows sucks but they use it anyway and keep looking at Linux saying "I know it's better but I can't be bothered."
I wonder which category you fall into.
Seconded.
:(
I'll never have that 2 minutes of my life back. I've never laughed less at something that was supposed to be funny.
I could pick it apart frame by frame for its utter stupidness but that would waste more time.
What a waste of disk space
Care to elaborate?
Cool. Each CD includes both a Live CD and an Install CD in a funky cardboard case.
Isn't Windows proprietary? OMG, if Microsoft goes bust, does that mean that the 50 gazillion Windows users out there won't have access to their systems? Of course not, because the Windows OS has very good industry support. The same goes for Apple. There are enough machines out there that if Apple goes under, quite a few people will be able to deal with your problem; as opposed to the SimPC which if it sells 100 units and goes bust, has absolutely no industry support backing up whatever custom never-heard-of-it-OS is installed. Even better if it has a custom filesystem that no-one knows about. I wouldn't let my grandparents' data be entrusted to a custom piece of software.
A custom piece of software or hardware becomes a standard when enough people are using it. Remember, Windows was a custom, little-known piece of software with no industry support behind it at one point too. If Microsoft had folded at a point when a few people were using FAT (a proprietary file system at the time - now a standard due to high usage) and some of those people experienced software errors that meant they couldn't boot their OS's, it would mean loss of data. Period.
All well and good unless there is no way to get the system to boot from CD. I'd say they would have the BIOS on this thing locked up nice and tight.
I know that if you've got boot you've got root, I'm just saying that it will be a royal pain in the ass recovering info from such a custom system.
The unit can't burn CD's or do video editing.
In my experience this is precisely what elderly people want to do with their PC's.
I think a configured Mac mini with it's stable, easy to use operating system hooked up to a DSL router (ie it holds the connection for you - not the computer) is probably just as easy to use and has more of the stuff that grandparents actually want to do.
As a side note, the proprietry OS scares me. What happens when the company goes under and there's something wrong that prevents the OS from loading (like hardware failure). Say bye-bye to the last 5 years of photos and letters from the grandkids.
Neh I don't care about an Offtopic mod. I've got karma to burn. But I would like to help you out some.
I read that you have a decent machine, so any distro will run fine on it. Can I ask why Mandrake? The reason I ask is because I used to be a Mandrake person. For details, check my blog entry
I know, it's very verbose. In a nutshell I declare Ubuntu the coolest distro ever. Don't let the name throw you off. It's a serious distro with some serious cash and brainy people behind it.
Furthermore - you can order the CD's at no cost to yourself. Yep - they ship them to you for free. So can that 56K download and order the CD's instead.
Mine rocked up about 3 months after I ordered them, but I hear that that was because of the demand for the CD's. It might be quicker now. OTOH If you want to pay for the shipping I'll be happy to throw one of my CD's in the post for ya. Drop me a line on my webpage if you're interested.
Anyway, just my 2 cents. Ubuntu is the best desktop OS for PC's I've seen. Period. Put it this way, I just installed it on my girlfriend's grandmother's laptop, and she likes it. That should tell you something.
Hopefully a helpful suggestion: try Debian Sarge.
If it's really mission critical, I'd say go with Woody, but we run Sarge (which is nearing graduation to stable status) on our web and email servers at work and we have found it to be just as reliable and stable as Woody is.
Just for reference, I work for a web hosting company, and when servers go down, we start losing real dollars. For anything but nuclear control/space launch, I'd recommend Debian Sarge. Give it a go on an old box and have a play. I doubt you'll be disappointed.
I switched about 8 months ago and haven't looked back (I used to be a Red Hat then Mandrake person).
The best bit for you though - regular security updates from a trusted source. The Debian Project are nutcases when it comes to security, and they follow up every issue. Wanna update your box? apt-get update, apt-get upgrade. You're Done. It's safe and easy and trouble free.
Not to start a holy war, but we have 2 RHEL boxes also (some of our vendor specific software requires RH) that give us no end of grief. I'd like to drop those boxes if I could but I can't.
Anyway just a suggestion - Debian for servers rocketh muchly.
What if your intention was to feel good about doing something nice for someone else? Wouldn't this be a selfish act in itself? I mean, you don't help an old lady across the street because she needs helping. You do it because you want to feel good about yourself. You want to feel like you've made a difference. You want to know in yourself that you are a good person, and in helping someone else, you are, in effect, self-serving.
My point is that in every "selfless" act, there is always a selfish reason. The extent of that selfish reason varies, (in helping an old lady across the street) from "I'm average joe I want to feel good about myself" to "I'm a professional hitman and this gets me closer to my mark".
Either way, (unless you're the assassin of course) the old lady still gets across the street safely, and you get to feel good about yourself. Win-Win.
Kudos to IBM. This is a great move.
The biggest benefit I see for this is that by opening their portfolio, the innovations they spearheaded are built upon by an army of thousands. Now that IBM are turning into a service company (which is evidenced by their sale of the PC division - they will concentrate on selling service with their big iron (good move IMHO)), the innovations they have already invested in will continue to reap them rewards because their "style" of computing is already compatible with whatever the FOSS community will bring to the table. Cool innovations for FOSS and rewards for IBM. Win-Win situation!
As we see in the movie "Spies Like Us" (Chevy Chase, Dan Aykroyd), all spy satellites have a little sign on them that says
"This is not a spy satellite"
Easy.
Yeah, watching Barney the Purple Dinosaur tends to make me a bit violent too...
Sorry dude, already done :) If you want to read a fantastic book that describes just that scenario, I suggest "Ragnarok" (I'm almost certain that that's the name of it - but I can't find any info on google)
It basically revolves around a group of environmental scientists who plant a nuclear bomb in a fissure under Iceland and threaten to detonate it if their demands aren't met. The explosion in the fissure would cause a global disaster.
I couldn't put it down, and it is done in a very realistic way. If you're lucky enough to come across it, read it. You won't be disappointed.
When (yes when) humans colonize Mars and non-engineer/scientific humans are living there I wonder what they will do with the man made stuff from long ago that will be sitting there inert.
I have a couple of theories as to what the human race will do with this stuff:
a) Cordon off the area around the rovers and heat shields etc. as a "heritage park" for people to visit and think about the events of the past
b) Take the stuff and stick it in a museum on earth
c) As above but create the museum on Mars
d) Melt it down and recycle it
e) Revive the electronics and re-purpose the robots etc.
f) Dump it in the nearest canyon as landfill
Any other suggestions?
But I reckon the motherboard is a bit sparse on features. I mean, come on, no SATA RAID :(