Sorry, but... Boot disks? Every version of windows (Yes MICROSOFT WINDOWS) boot disks are soo widely distributed, who the hell needs a free version?
Engineers? FSKING CHR$+, what engineer in their right mind hasn't found a way to use GUI for their apps now day? I work with Chemical and Mechanical Engineers EVERY DAY, and NONE of them would ever care if there was a FREE version of DOS now. You think because they are into science that they don't have cool GUI apps now? What decade are you in?
That died in the EARLY 90's. No company on the planet will get an Engineer to buy their software if it's still command line DOS! They will do UNIX, or Windows GUI, but NOT DOS!
Distribution? for old DOS games? Your kidding? 1) who still is entertained by that? 2) who doesn't have a fsking CDRW to put something BIGGER than a floppy on a disk that can already emulate DOS? (Win or Linux, both can do DOS emulation!)
Emulation..... Uh... Heard of DOSemu?
This is just more/. pimping of other OSDN tripe... It's very cute, granted, but don't try to tell me it's usefull...
I actually read iol.co.za about every other day, not sure why... I guess I just always wanted to visit South Africa, so I look at their news a lot. I have never seen it so slow, guess that post that spawned the "Is South Africa a Third World Country" debate a week ago here seems to show maybe, just maybe they are? Biggest news sited downed by the slashdot effect....
So, anyone able to see if it's bandwidth between US/Europe and Africa, or just their server?
Damn... That should be modded WAY up IMHO, linux based, run off CD, cheap, THAT is a cool little thing.... I'm tempted to try to get/modify the CD they use to play with... But I'm even more tempted to order one!
IMHO, someone needs to build a little box like this for about $400-$500 with Gigibit over copper (like linksys eg1064 or something) and decent video (like 32M 4xAGP VooDoo or something)....
Until that happens, there's no reason I see for not just building a box from parts myself...
Funny to see Netstumbler being pimped on SlashDot... I would have thought you guys would only mod up something for Linux like WaveStumbler or AirSnort.
And no mandatory mention of clusters used for War Driving yet?
"there are stll many applications that use punchcards...many companies still use them, with slight modifications like the airlines that print a magnetic strip on them"
Well, ain't that cute, they both are paper, and contain data, so they must be primitive, basic, and completely outdated, huh?
It's just some ironic hahaha stuff when you realize that the USPS is one of the bigest Linux based systems in the US.
Nothing wrong with the ad, just the post office must nothave delivered your sence of humor or irony yet (I'm still waiting for my ability to spell, I think it's definatly lost in the mail, so...).
What happened though? Netscape SUCKS in windows now, IE is way faster, smoother, and less quirky. ICQ is not AIM compatable chat client, and AIM is integrated into Netscape (unless your a UberHacker). Unless your in Linux, then you do NOT get an AIM client in the first releases to chat with your Windows friends, you get a IRC client (oooo... defragment the chat by one company having SOME power to help guide compatibility??? NO... can't do that... we need to compete against OURSELFS to see what devisions we want to keep, and who we can afford to lay off!!!).
WinAMP? Can I choke now and vomit please? xmms was cool, winamp is bastardized with crap ads, and became popular via download with Netscape (can you say MicroSoft style product dumping like IE in Windows to own a market segment?) Didn't ever stand on it's own merit, cause it never had a chance, there were 100's of mp3 players/rippers, and a few MORE popular on TECHNICAL merit until they dumped WinAmp in with Netscape.
Come on... AOL is like a kiss of death. They are a $$$ centric buisness. They PUSH technology VERY well, get more people "connected" but that's it. Millions of people owe a big thank you to AOL for "hooking them up" but once you know what your doing you see them for what they are.... a money grubbing buisness than has ZERO interest in developing technology. How long did they push NS4 before 6/Mozilla based browser, to do what? To save $$$ that Mozilla needed for development, all the while starving Mozilla to stagnate for a year or more while they pimped out Netscape 4 for all it was worth, AND still used IE base for thier own ISP AOL software?
It's a earmark of the DEATH of Red Hat. If AOL buys Red Hat, 100's of new users may TRY Linux, but people who REALLY USE "Red Hat Linux" will see stagnation in development and probaly migrate to Mandrake (a much more cutting edge Linux OS that they can feel comfrotable with because of it's similarities to Red Hat).
Yea, AOL is good for Linux... Whatever... Can I get some of what your on???
Realistically speaking, general-purpose options hit all but one in a hundred installations. Actually, I'd be willing to bet that i386 optimization is perfectly good for that amount of people. Throw in i686/athlon optimization, and add a high-stability/high-performance split, and you've down to something like one in a thousand.
I believe you lost perspective. We are talking about optimized distributions, more so than mainstream. YOU have just discribed RedHat and Mandrake. It's been done. This thread is more in tune with taking that to the next level. More optimized, more specific, on FTP servers around the world (disk space is cheap, why not store optimized builds for EVERYTHING? Answer, bandwidth ISN'T cheap!).
So, your 100% right for a buisness model, your two ideas have been PROVEN to be the best buisness model for a Linux Distribution, by the consumer market. Now, let's get back to planning Mar's explorer teams... when we do that, 1% go to Mars, but 10% experiance zero gravity (as opposed to the 0.1% now)... Evolution man... evolution....;-)
No offence I hope, and, BTW, we are NOT going to Mars here...;-) But, we have X, what should Y be? I say Y should be hardware independant, and not feed the x86 legacy hardware MISTAKE. Let's make the software more hardware INDEPENDANT, and THAT will allow better hardware to have a little bit more of a fighting chance.
I also had a very similar idea, only less stuff installed... more an install on demand thing.
Basically, I may be alone here, but I like installing the minimum install of Debian or FreeBSD from floppies, tweaking my compiler options, and then rebuilding everything, then add packages _ONLY AS NEEDED_ from source, with tweaked compiler options.
I started playing with an idea to implement it as a distribution, and it would start with the nessessity to create a "catalog" of best compiler and compiler flags for each type of hardware. Then, mirrors of pristine source, followed by user contributed mirrors of machine specific binary packages.
I agree with the whole "it's better to be optimized for the hardware" thing. Why not get a 10% to 25% boost in preformance WITHOUT SPENDING 50% for faster hardware? Just recompile ONCE, cause your going to run the application hundreds of times!
But I still hate big install images. I don't NEED a frigging 7 CD set of crap I'll never run! I need bandwidth, to get the dozen or too applications I want, now, up to date, and optimized.
Look, China as few legal fears, just fears of being cut out of MS circulation and sales.
When they can can find a way to HIJACK XP software (in other words, reverse engineer a way around the MS piracy safeguards), they will shit on MS just enought to keep the salesmen comming back and in case something new comes along...
Look, China is like your average Linux user. They love free software, and will use it as often as they can... BUT, they also know the world is MS centric, and they know then need MS compatibility to be "conductive" with world buisness.
Like the average Linux user, China will ALWAYS BE a "dual boot" user. They are not going to go ALL LINUX (or any OSS), becuase they don't want to ever get "disconnected" from the world. If they can HiJack it, they won't pay for it. But new XP licence schemes have FORCED them into a MS deal.
c
They are cleve (like a Linux User) and when Linux (or any OSS project) promises COMPLETE compatibility, they will abandon MS. And we all know that will never happen, because MS constantly perpetuates thier own internal standads (.doc format) rather than insisting that their software become more "standard" and use XML, RTF, etc...
China isn't going to excommunicate itself from the world. PERIOD. They will do what they need to do, and hate it every step of the way, just like every Linux dual boot guy out there...
And not to be a flame, but is it really that important? No
What exactly is the real implications of this besides the obvious??
Well, the real reason is likely that Hallmark probably made a decision that it would be cheaper to buy the patent rights than to fight the patent with lawyers.
Something that exists in the market or as a publicly announced idea (in clear, detailed writing, published somewhere) can be patented, but the patent can be challanged easily and declared worthless.
Slashdot just has an "anti-software-patent" stance in general.... And as Slashdot is somewhat of a "hype it up and get people to gripe" type of journalism, they don't bother to tell you why the patent is meaningless or worthless.
Tumbleweed just got lucky, that's all. For an instant (long enough to get a check written) Hallmark took the patent seriously, and paid for the right to use it. It's very likely that the patent could (or will) be challenged in the near future anyway.
Try it on Red Hat first... It's been a while since I have, but I unselected EVERY package during the installation and still ended up with over 1G of stuff installed. That's been a while (6.0?), but it really was a sad experiance.
Prove GNU spirit is good for something!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
if not, I will admit to being one that pushed the idea, and end up leaning on EFF, so donations there (Free me only after all of Elcomsoft are in Russia!
I still say we do it, long term, 3-4 day, maybe 2-4 week full content, powerful mirror of best images.
Prove GNU spirit is good for something!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
if not, I will admit to being one that pushed the idea, and end up leaning on EFF, so donations there (Free me only after all of Elcomsoft are in Russia!
Could have swore the parent was 5, now going down...
Sad world when./ politics kills a bad idea based on people hating me....
hate me, fine, I will not post or step in again, I promise. Someone else can mirror and set things up, I swear I will step aside, just PLEASE stop mod'ing the post down, just let it happen... I'm sure someone will step up and mirror and script....
OK, I wanted to help out... I went to #windowmaker on effnet and #windowmaker on openprojects. I told them about the story, I said I have a cool idea. I admit I pimped points. The post went from a 1 to a 4. I was like happy in the thought we could do some good.
Then I made the mistake to take it too far. I went to #e, and said "sorry to intrude, if you think it's cool, read and mod up. But I want to see if we can get mirrors going."
#e $#*$)@*#()!@ bastards (as usual) said "your pimping points) and instantly moded this story and the parent down because "It's uncool to pipm points."
I say F*#$()#@*!() them... I just TOLD people about the story on #windowmaker, it was thier choice to mod it up for the merit of the story. #e mod'ed it to ZERO after that just to try to prove a point that "Pimping point's is uncool".
Our nation has been attacked, all I was trying to do was find a way to spread the word. PERIOD.
Granted I got 2-3 points from friends who agreed.... But... To trash a topic for just spite is f#*!)!) lame.
OK, I blew 3 points on this thread modding, then decided to post because this might be more important?
Here's what the dihard SlashDot'ers NEED to do (if you agree mod this up!)
Go Give Blood
Start a system of mirrors.
mirror as much shit as you can find, photos, media clips, etc...
Someone write a simple script that any UNIX'er can use (tarball probably, rpm and deb them later) to stick on the mirrors W/ instructions for the newbies... I suggest a high speed site be listed IN THE README to the script that has the primary IP/URL to mirror, that we DO NOT make public unless you run the script!!!
Post them mirrors...
those running the mirrors update hourly off the IP/URL from the README in the script.
come up with better ideas.
Find someone to sort the primary source into good images, good text, good video, etc... maybe a 1 to 5 star rating? We could come up with a MOD system, but f- that for now, let's just find SOMEONE to do it and start it up!
I am about to mirror some of what I found, sometime somewhere soon, TBA.... I hope we can band together to pull off a media spread fast and informative.
Comment on Trademarks and Copywrights: Screw them, this is too important. DO NOT white out sources, GIVE FULL CREDIT IF YOU CAN!!! But, we want the news spread clear and fast, with as much detail as we can. So, give credit, and if they don't make the credits for the photos or media clear enough in the content, it's THIER FAULT for not taking credit... Let's just mirror shit so we don't choke down the major news sites and the best photos we can find.
PS: Send donations to EFF, I'm going to need them if it works......
Hairbrained idea, mod up if you think it's good (please). Here's what the dihard SlashDot'ers NEED to do (if you agree mod this up!)
Go Give Blood
Start a system of mirrors.
mirror as much shit as you can find, photos, media clips, etc...
Someone write a simple script that any UNIX'er can use (tarball probably, rpm and deb them later) to stick on the mirrors W/ instructions for the newbies... I suggest a high speed site be listed IN THE README to the script that has the primary IP/URL to mirror, that we DO NOT make public unless you run the script!!!
Post them mirrors...
those running the mirrors update hourly off the IP/URL from the README in the script.
come up with better ideas.
Find someone to sort the primary source into good images, good text, good video, etc... maybe a 1 to 5 star rating? We could come up with a MOD system, but f- that for now, let's just find SOMEONE to do it and start it up!
I am about to mirror some of what I found, sometime somewhere soon, TBA.... I hope we can band together to pull off a media spread fast and informative.
Comment on Trademarks and Copywrights: Screw them, this is too important. DO NOT white out sources, GIVE FULL CREDIT IF YOU CAN!!! But, we want the news spread clear and fast, with as much detail as we can. So, give credit, and if they don't make the credits for the photos or media clear enough in the content, it's THIER FAULT for not taking credit... Let's just mirror shit so we don't choke down the major news sites and the best photos we can find.
Slashdot Mirror
Engineers? FSKING CHR$+, what engineer in their right mind hasn't found a way to use GUI for their apps now day? I work with Chemical and Mechanical Engineers EVERY DAY, and NONE of them would ever care if there was a FREE version of DOS now. You think because they are into science that they don't have cool GUI apps now? What decade are you in?
That died in the EARLY 90's. No company on the planet will get an Engineer to buy their software if it's still command line DOS! They will do UNIX, or Windows GUI, but NOT DOS!
Distribution? for old DOS games? Your kidding? 1) who still is entertained by that? 2) who doesn't have a fsking CDRW to put something BIGGER than a floppy on a disk that can already emulate DOS? (Win or Linux, both can do DOS emulation!)
Emulation..... Uh... Heard of DOSemu?
This is just more /. pimping of other OSDN tripe... It's very cute, granted, but don't try to tell me it's usefull...
Because it's in my bookmarks... ;-P That IS why... Now, as for why the paper is in my bookmarks... I don't remember...
So, anyone able to see if it's bandwidth between US/Europe and Africa, or just their server?
Damn... That should be modded WAY up IMHO, linux based, run off CD, cheap, THAT is a cool little thing.... I'm tempted to try to get/modify the CD they use to play with... But I'm even more tempted to order one!
Until that happens, there's no reason I see for not just building a box from parts myself...
And no mandatory mention of clusters used for War Driving yet?
Come on SlashDotters, I'm disappointed.....
Well, ain't that cute, they both are paper, and contain data, so they must be primitive, basic, and completely outdated, huh?
Yes, they have a right to place an ad... Duh...
It's just some ironic hahaha stuff when you realize that the USPS is one of the bigest Linux based systems in the US.
Nothing wrong with the ad, just the post office must nothave delivered your sence of humor or irony yet (I'm still waiting for my ability to spell, I think it's definatly lost in the mail, so...).
WinAMP? Can I choke now and vomit please? xmms was cool, winamp is bastardized with crap ads, and became popular via download with Netscape (can you say MicroSoft style product dumping like IE in Windows to own a market segment?) Didn't ever stand on it's own merit, cause it never had a chance, there were 100's of mp3 players/rippers, and a few MORE popular on TECHNICAL merit until they dumped WinAmp in with Netscape.
Come on... AOL is like a kiss of death. They are a $$$ centric buisness. They PUSH technology VERY well, get more people "connected" but that's it. Millions of people owe a big thank you to AOL for "hooking them up" but once you know what your doing you see them for what they are.... a money grubbing buisness than has ZERO interest in developing technology. How long did they push NS4 before 6/Mozilla based browser, to do what? To save $$$ that Mozilla needed for development, all the while starving Mozilla to stagnate for a year or more while they pimped out Netscape 4 for all it was worth, AND still used IE base for thier own ISP AOL software?
It's a earmark of the DEATH of Red Hat. If AOL buys Red Hat, 100's of new users may TRY Linux, but people who REALLY USE "Red Hat Linux" will see stagnation in development and probaly migrate to Mandrake (a much more cutting edge Linux OS that they can feel comfrotable with because of it's similarities to Red Hat).
Yea, AOL is good for Linux... Whatever... Can I get some of what your on???
sorry, some idiot was bound to ask, so I figured I would be today's idiot!
I believe you lost perspective. We are talking about optimized distributions, more so than mainstream. YOU have just discribed RedHat and Mandrake. It's been done. This thread is more in tune with taking that to the next level. More optimized, more specific, on FTP servers around the world (disk space is cheap, why not store optimized builds for EVERYTHING? Answer, bandwidth ISN'T cheap!).
So, your 100% right for a buisness model, your two ideas have been PROVEN to be the best buisness model for a Linux Distribution, by the consumer market. Now, let's get back to planning Mar's explorer teams... when we do that, 1% go to Mars, but 10% experiance zero gravity (as opposed to the 0.1% now)... Evolution man... evolution.... ;-)
No offence I hope, and, BTW, we are NOT going to Mars here... ;-) But, we have X, what should Y be? I say Y should be hardware independant, and not feed the x86 legacy hardware MISTAKE. Let's make the software more hardware INDEPENDANT, and THAT will allow better hardware to have a little bit more of a fighting chance.
Yea sure, there were a number of people working on BUILD, but have drifted off... I probably could put in a little time myself. rob@current.nu
Basically, I may be alone here, but I like installing the minimum install of Debian or FreeBSD from floppies, tweaking my compiler options, and then rebuilding everything, then add packages _ONLY AS NEEDED_ from source, with tweaked compiler options.
I started playing with an idea to implement it as a distribution, and it would start with the nessessity to create a "catalog" of best compiler and compiler flags for each type of hardware. Then, mirrors of pristine source, followed by user contributed mirrors of machine specific binary packages.
I agree with the whole "it's better to be optimized for the hardware" thing. Why not get a 10% to 25% boost in preformance WITHOUT SPENDING 50% for faster hardware? Just recompile ONCE, cause your going to run the application hundreds of times!
But I still hate big install images. I don't NEED a frigging 7 CD set of crap I'll never run! I need bandwidth, to get the dozen or too applications I want, now, up to date, and optimized.
If your interested in seeing the stuff I started think about, have a look. It's pretty dead (due to lack of time), but... it's at http://cvs.sourceforge.net/cgi-bin/viewcvs.cgi/~ch eckout~/build/BUILD/Docs/build-draft.html?rev=HEAD &content-type=text/html [sourceforge.net]
Sound's similar?
I don't care if it's a 1.6GHz box with a 80G drive, I'd rather have the space for my files than for 100's of apps I'll never use.
PS: Worst net traffic day in a year, or just me?
Read SourceForge Forum on it to see why...
As iF...
Look, China as few legal fears, just fears of being cut out of MS circulation and sales.
When they can can find a way to HIJACK XP software (in other words, reverse engineer a way around the MS piracy safeguards), they will shit on MS just enought to keep the salesmen comming back and in case something new comes along...
Look, China is like your average Linux user. They love free software, and will use it as often as they can... BUT, they also know the world is MS centric, and they know then need MS compatibility to be "conductive" with world buisness.
Like the average Linux user, China will ALWAYS BE a "dual boot" user. They are not going to go ALL LINUX (or any OSS), becuase they don't want to ever get "disconnected" from the world. If they can HiJack it, they won't pay for it. But new XP licence schemes have FORCED them into a MS deal.
c
They are cleve (like a Linux User) and when Linux (or any OSS project) promises COMPLETE compatibility, they will abandon MS. And we all know that will never happen, because MS constantly perpetuates thier own internal standads (.doc format) rather than insisting that their software become more "standard" and use XML, RTF, etc...
China isn't going to excommunicate itself from the world. PERIOD. They will do what they need to do, and hate it every step of the way, just like every Linux dual boot guy out there...
No
What exactly is the real implications of this besides the obvious??
Well, the real reason is likely that Hallmark probably made a decision that it would be cheaper to buy the patent rights than to fight the patent with lawyers.
Something that exists in the market or as a publicly announced idea (in clear, detailed writing, published somewhere) can be patented, but the patent can be challanged easily and declared worthless.
Slashdot just has an "anti-software-patent" stance in general.... And as Slashdot is somewhat of a "hype it up and get people to gripe" type of journalism, they don't bother to tell you why the patent is meaningless or worthless.
Tumbleweed just got lucky, that's all. For an instant (long enough to get a check written) Hallmark took the patent seriously, and paid for the right to use it. It's very likely that the patent could (or will) be challenged in the near future anyway.
http://cvs.sourceforge.net/cgi-bin/viewcvs.cgi/~ch eckout~/build/BUILD/Docs/build-draft.html?rev=HEAD &content-type=text/html
Sound's similar?
If it just had an integrated cell phone.... with caller id... sync'ed into a mysql database... with...
Try it on Red Hat first... It's been a while since I have, but I unselected EVERY package during the installation and still ended up with over 1G of stuff installed. That's been a while (6.0?), but it really was a sad experiance.
For small install, I'd go debian not Slackware.
I still say we do it, long term, 3-4 day, maybe 2-4 week full content, powerful mirror of best images.
My Mirror of some stuff is at http://www.current.nu/
EFF god help me...
Prove GNU spirit is good for something!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
if not, I will admit to being one that pushed the idea, and end up leaning on EFF, so donations there (Free me only after all of Elcomsoft are in Russia!
I still say we do it, long term, 3-4 day, maybe 2-4 week full content, powerful mirror of best images.
Prove GNU spirit is good for something!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
if not, I will admit to being one that pushed the idea, and end up leaning on EFF, so donations there (Free me only after all of Elcomsoft are in Russia!
Sad world when
hate me, fine, I will not post or step in again, I promise. Someone else can mirror and set things up, I swear I will step aside, just PLEASE stop mod'ing the post down, just let it happen... I'm sure someone will step up and mirror and script....
Then I made the mistake to take it too far. I went to #e, and said "sorry to intrude, if you think it's cool, read and mod up. But I want to see if we can get mirrors going."
#e $#*$)@*#()!@ bastards (as usual) said "your pimping points) and instantly moded this story and the parent down because "It's uncool to pipm points."
I say F*#$()#@*!() them... I just TOLD people about the story on #windowmaker, it was thier choice to mod it up for the merit of the story. #e mod'ed it to ZERO after that just to try to prove a point that "Pimping point's is uncool".
Our nation has been attacked, all I was trying to do was find a way to spread the word. PERIOD.
Granted I got 2-3 points from friends who agreed.... But... To trash a topic for just spite is f#*!)!) lame.
Here's what the dihard SlashDot'ers NEED to do (if you agree mod this up!)
I am about to mirror some of what I found, sometime somewhere soon, TBA.... I hope we can band together to pull off a media spread fast and informative.
Comment on Trademarks and Copywrights: Screw them, this is too important. DO NOT white out sources, GIVE FULL CREDIT IF YOU CAN!!! But, we want the news spread clear and fast, with as much detail as we can. So, give credit, and if they don't make the credits for the photos or media clear enough in the content, it's THIER FAULT for not taking credit... Let's just mirror shit so we don't choke down the major news sites and the best photos we can find.
PS: Send donations to EFF, I'm going to need them if it works......
Hairbrained idea, mod up if you think it's good (please). Here's what the dihard SlashDot'ers NEED to do (if you agree mod this up!)
I am about to mirror some of what I found, sometime somewhere soon, TBA.... I hope we can band together to pull off a media spread fast and informative.
Comment on Trademarks and Copywrights: Screw them, this is too important. DO NOT white out sources, GIVE FULL CREDIT IF YOU CAN!!! But, we want the news spread clear and fast, with as much detail as we can. So, give credit, and if they don't make the credits for the photos or media clear enough in the content, it's THIER FAULT for not taking credit... Let's just mirror shit so we don't choke down the major news sites and the best photos we can find.