While the original copyright holders are free to not release future versions under the GPL
This is only true if their is not a stitch of anyone else's code - in which case they ('they' being the original authors) would need concurance from *all* the contributors...
Unix is nothing new to them, they just haven't had much success selling it.
That is because cluefull people, those who also choose and buy *nix machines - Dont BUY Dell
Dell boxes are absolute trash, we had the corporate-MBA-monkeys choose Dell for us, and had the joy of returning over 15% of our machines with parts DOA.
They rape money from REAL tech companies like Compaq, HP and IBM by undercutting their destkop prices, while doing little outside of assembly and 'brand managment' - give me a break... does this surprise anyone?
Dell is to Computers as McBlondalds is to Fine Cuisine.
"The Internet has become indispensable to our national security and economic well-being," said Ron Dick, head of the National Infrastructure Protection Centre, an arm of the FBI. "Worms like Code Red pose a distinct threat to the Internet."
You think things are bad for hackers now, wait until all the clueless masses start seeing the Internet as a battlefield - you only have to say 'National Security' in America to get the public inspired to goto war, whatever the cost... god help us.
"hacked by Chinese" oh brother - might as well say "hacked by the godless communist hordes out to destroy the american way of life and enslave you! Defend America from the Red Menace!"
What laws will the Plutocrats pass now in order to defend the Internet from life outside their precious economy. I am personally not that alarmed with trojans or worms. The world can live without the internet - our desire to have zero random variations in all things (our lawns, our parks, our workplaces the internet), removing all acts of fancy/folly and chaos (in a good sense) has shaded our eyes from the important goals. So what if the Internet shuts down for a few days?
Frankly, the world needs a little random excitement... Much in life is arbitrary, a game if you will, lets not get to serious about all this, try and think about this in a more situationist manner.
No, my statement was one of disgust. I am not questioning the actions of EFF. Why does it take *money* to have your voice in public policy? The sad part, overwhelming numbers of 'cluefull' people (those 'understand' the DMCA) are flately against it. I do not see any popular citizens coming out to supppor the DMCA... so, for clarity; Washington (and Ottawa in my case) is inhabited by slimy Plutocrats && it makes me sick. I do my part to change that... I suggest you do also.
Simply put, the EFF needs money... if it is to give large enough bribes to the Plutocrats who inhabit your public offices.
*THIS* is what all the anit-capialists in Seattle, Washington, Prague, Quebec, Genova and the rest are talking about - make no mistake, this is simply another 'aspect' of the problems people are protesting. Protesters themselves, those without the proper technical information, are in-line with the ideals behind the Free Softare Movement, and Source as Free Speech.
Next time (www.protest.net) a Capitalist-Summit of some type comes to *your* region - GO AND CARRY A SIGN!
And $20M in annual revenues after ten years of existence is no one's idea of "greatly profitable."
Unless you are a dollar-owning slavedriver who has no interest in *HEALHTY* sustainable businesses which provide jobs and stability to those who operate it. If you are the kind of rabid-with-greed capitalist that demands quick and massive returns on the otherhand...
I'm just not sure why people are continuing to assert the validity of a model that has almost universally failed, and nowhere succeeded.
I think the point is this: No one cares to make a profit here. We care to make good software and provide freedom to others. The FSF and GNU/Linux is a resounding accomplishment and sucess. What dont you understand? Saying "..but no one is making a profit.." is a non-sequitor. It is testement to (once-again) that For-Profit endevours are not self-justifiying... the world needs less "For Profits" and more GNU/Linux-like shows of public will.
Why is this concept seem to be so foreign to you? Where do you live...?
"Another model that is perhaps more applicable here is this whole idea of four categories of people: the radicals, idealists, realists and opportunists. Everybody is an idealist. Everybody has this idea that things should be better and that's really a non-ideological thing. The fear is that those idealists will become radicals and start questioning the roots of the system, start questioning the power structure. People in power don't like that. You have to turn these idealists into realists, because once they're realists, they can accept the compromises that opportunists make; those being the politicians. Jaggi Singh, Canadian Political Activist 2001
The point of Cisco and MS saying 'you dont understand economic issues' is an attempt at them forcing you to accept their basic precepts, to change your assumptions - change your goals also. I believe that the OS community is boiling from a broader anti-capitalist, anti-corporate-rule momentum building worldwide, the *idea* that *people* should participate in software development as peers, to be given respect and opportunity to participate is fundemental to the Free Software world.
I dont think Mundie understands that alot of people (myself) dont give a *DAMN* about his-kind-of economics - it is not a matter of accepting the 'real world' - I actively advocate changing how exactly the 'real world' works... Allot of Free Software Advocates are using their abilities, in their common area of interaction (the computer world), to act out some political change. The Free Software world is not isolated and alone here, It really is a piece of a larger puzzle.
Now, again, this is my opinion and perspective. There are likely allot of people who disagree - but I believe even those who dont agree politically can see how this would be..
will be basically the stereotypical US view of "what is good for kids"
The following will be immediately approved:
disney.kids
pepsi.kids
nike.kids
rep ublican.kids
democrat.kids
toys-r-us.kids
barbi e.kids
nsync.kids
makeup.kids
shopping.kids
ww wf.kids
The following, if administered in the US, will not:
socialist.kids
communist.kids
consumerism. kids
greenpeace.kids
sweatshop.kids
I would not want any of *my* children to be exposed to the first list, the second list is what my children should spend their time learning about...*
*outside of republican/democrat.kids - balanced arguments are necessary, what *.kids will become is a wasteland of Consumerism and Advertising...
Maybe if they declared *.kids a 'Trademark' or 'Copyright' free place, only for altruists and people intending on educating or entertaining, without any nefarious marketing ploys; "How many KoKa-Kola(TM)brand Soda Cans does Johnny have?"
Ok - you had me until that. You do understand that it is Government Propaganda (McCartyism) that has led you to *not* understand what Communism is about. Communism has nothing to do with brainwashing - I would argue Capitalism actually *brainwashes* via advertising and marketing... the proof is in the Unbridled Consumption that occurs in the American Masses..... and their arent Evil, Godless, Commies(TM) are they?
Americans confuse Fascism with Communism - one is an economic system, the other a method of government...
that could be integrated to gcc and other standard gnu tools.
I have been thinking about this for a while. Where is the GUIDE ((Grand Unified Integrated Development Environment) cute eh?) for GNU/Linux? What I would *love* to see is a project, GPLed, that implements an 'open' IDE for development in a language, toolkit, compiler neutral manner. This 'IDE' would accept any language, class, library, toolkit, compiler as long as the developers of the afore mentioned implemented a 'plug-in definition' (or some other 3rd party did the def of her favourite essential 'item'). It should also use make or somesuch for auto-building.
The GUIDE would allow you to 'import' a new language. The language would have been sufficiently described in one of these 'plug-in definitions (an XML document(?)) that would describe a style guide (maybe) but at least provide some highlighting, auto-magic tooltip-type-pop-up describing the function/object (params, methods etc). The GUIDE would also allow you to import a toolkit. A 'plug-in definition' of those widgets would provide their params/methods/variables allowing you to do some drag-and-drop GUI development with these new 'widgets'. A 'plug-in definition' would allow you to install additional libraries/objects from other 'add-on' projects (like the plethora that exist for Perl for instance).
GUIDE would allow modular framework to do GUI assisted coding - so I dont have to re-learn, download a IDE for ever language, and do development in a million applications... and re-learn(re-configure to taste) each and every language's IDE.
Besides - would the GNU/Linux community (essentially computer-capable people) want such a 'thing'? I know allot of people probably do their coding in vi (myself) or emacs, but wouldnt allot like to see such a thing?
I myself am not an uber-coder, so starting a project like this solo is a little silly, anyone know of a project *like* this?
to invest into a product that won't give them good returns
See again, your stuck in a rut... why are we only researching medicing that provieds a 'good return'? WTF is our motivation again? oh yeaah, its HEALHTY PEOPLE, when we have an idea on how to make PEOPLE HEALTHY we should INVESTIGATE. BigPharm only investigates what makes profit..
Do you understand the clear and distinct different motives here?
do I have a problem with this. Nope, none whatsoever. Because, if the big pharmaceutical companies can't protect their product then they won't manufacture it. And if they don't, who will? Who else can afford the R&D? It may be that by giving up my rights to this research I will help to provide a cure or prevention for diabetes. I'm happy with that.
Big Pharm spends *by far* more on advertising than Research. See here. Also, to as a side-note, please see here to understand that free-market capitalism in the health care industry doesnt make sense; to note "Canada insured 100 percent of its citizens for $2,250 per person in l998 while the United States expended $4,270 per person insuring only 84 percent of our citizens.", not only that, its cruel and disgusting to hold people's health ransom for money...
De-Regulating the health care industry is more about stable profit for big-pharm than anything else.. Canada and Britain's citizens would do well to understand what 'American Style' health care really means. Fewer healthy people, higher cost, profiteering at the expense of your health (literally).
What does this have to do with R&D & Patents? Patents are weapons used by the Health Care Industry to kill people for money. The 'R & D' they do is to make money. Neither thing has 'beans' to do with Healthy People. The R&D should be done by doctors with alot less attachment to profit motives, which by nature, make for an *UNHEALTHY* "Health Industry"..
"So how do you motivate people to make others healthy when your only incentive is profit" would be a better question.
No, your wrong. Research will go back to the 'public domain' or 'common knowledge' area and be done at University - supported by all.
When a 'new better' method is founded, the 'good parts' of capitalism will empower anyone who cares to, to try and make that thing better, faster and cheaper. If you allow hole realms of knowledge (like ranking pages based upon their a href's) you will enable a company to operate *contrary* to what a 'free market' would provide. You cannot have both numerous and broad monopolies and free markets. This is ridiculous and counter productive.
Note: I myself favour a controlled and planned economy, capitalism enables terrible choices which do not align with healthy sustainable futures (like pollution, consumerism, exploitation of labour and whatnot) - *B*U*T* if the Plutocrats who run the G8 are going to run this capitalism game, they at least have to do it right by not enshrining businesses as all-powerfull-gods-of-knowledge... but I digress.
Free Software reverse engineering effort that has been wildly successful.
Samba.
Free Software hackers worked on Lesstif forever without having something that actually worked
When you compare one application against another, and they happen to work differently, one is not 'useless' because it is not exactly like the other - when you set the standard you are the only one that will ever *really* be the one that works "correctly".
The US is not breaking the ABM treaty. Either party is legally allowed to withdraw after giving 6 months' notice. IMHO, the US government is doing exactly what it's supposed to--take all necessary steps to ensure the safety of its citizens from foreign powers. If the foreign powers don't like it, that's too bad, because they won't be able to do much about it.
Thats a lovely thought. Screw the rest of you - 'were saving ourselves!'. The present ABM treaty has helped us assure some peace for the last 30 years. Why are you proposing to change that? Further, when dealing with international matters like these, if they are *really* important to the people of America, why wouldnt they also be important to people everywhere? If you can argue that they are important for people (as opposed to imperialistic plutocrats and the military-industrial complex) than why wouldnt America, as a memeber of the UN (or some other complete and inclusive agency) ask to have this system built and deployed the whole world over? Why not, if this system can really do good - protect people from nuts with nukes - offer to also protect China, Russia, Africa, Cuba and the rest? If this was a 'defensive' and 'honest' idea - this would be the tact.... but not surprisingly, this isnt the method being employed. The snip from your post above illustrates the offensive tone that this son-of-star-wars idea is being rammed through... and make no mistake, America is acting contrary to the wishes of *EVERYONE* else on the planet - except maybe Isreal;)
Slashdot Mirror
While the original copyright holders are free to not release future versions under the GPL
This is only true if their is not a stitch of anyone else's code - in which case they ('they' being the original authors) would need concurance from *all* the contributors...
Unix is nothing new to them, they just haven't had much success selling it.
That is because cluefull people, those who also choose and buy *nix machines - Dont BUY Dell
Dell boxes are absolute trash, we had the corporate-MBA-monkeys choose Dell for us, and had the joy of returning over 15% of our machines with parts DOA.
They rape money from REAL tech companies like Compaq, HP and IBM by undercutting their destkop prices, while doing little outside of assembly and 'brand managment' - give me a break... does this surprise anyone?
Dell is to Computers as McBlondalds is to Fine Cuisine.
What kind of shite is that pal? Get down off the high-horse, the rest of the world dosnt have misguided opinion of America as Americans do.
Your statement is fucking ridiculous.
Robust
Synergy
Think-outside-the-box
Current- state
Pro-active
Throw them out of your office.
with no colors
And the colour of this box has exactly *what* bearing on its function?
When did we descend into this ridiculous consumer hell?
"The Internet has become indispensable to our national security and economic well-being," said Ron Dick, head of the National Infrastructure Protection Centre, an arm of the FBI. "Worms like Code Red pose a distinct threat to the Internet."
You think things are bad for hackers now, wait until all the clueless masses start seeing the Internet as a battlefield - you only have to say 'National Security' in America to get the public inspired to goto war, whatever the cost... god help us.
"hacked by Chinese" oh brother - might as well say "hacked by the godless communist hordes out to destroy the american way of life and enslave you! Defend America from the Red Menace!"
What laws will the Plutocrats pass now in order to defend the Internet from life outside their precious economy. I am personally not that alarmed with trojans or worms. The world can live without the internet - our desire to have zero random variations in all things (our lawns, our parks, our workplaces the internet), removing all acts of fancy/folly and chaos (in a good sense) has shaded our eyes from the important goals. So what if the Internet shuts down for a few days?
Frankly, the world needs a little random excitement... Much in life is arbitrary, a game if you will, lets not get to serious about all this, try and think about this in a more situationist manner.
No, my statement was one of disgust. I am not questioning the actions of EFF. Why does it take *money* to have your voice in public policy? The sad part, overwhelming numbers of 'cluefull' people (those 'understand' the DMCA) are flately against it. I do not see any popular citizens coming out to supppor the DMCA... so, for clarity; Washington (and Ottawa in my case) is inhabited by slimy Plutocrats && it makes me sick. I do my part to change that... I suggest you do also.
Simply put, the EFF needs money ... if it is to give large enough bribes to the Plutocrats who inhabit your public offices.
*THIS* is what all the anit-capialists in Seattle, Washington, Prague, Quebec, Genova and the rest are talking about - make no mistake, this is simply another 'aspect' of the problems people are protesting. Protesters themselves, those without the proper technical information, are in-line with the ideals behind the Free Softare Movement, and Source as Free Speech.
Next time (www.protest.net) a Capitalist-Summit of some type comes to *your* region - GO AND CARRY A SIGN!
ok - who knows where we can find a copy of the video of lucy when she popped her top at that baseball game..?
/. pr0n, i dont know what is... and dont bother trying to sneak a goatse link - we all know better.
If this isnt the perfect opportunity for a little
Unix Power Tools
an audience full of people with laptops and 802.11b cards, deliberately and maliciously fixing bugs at him.
That image made my day. Thank you. I also agree completely... i guess its time to get organized and start that app I had been thinking about...
And $20M in annual revenues after ten years of existence is no one's idea of "greatly profitable."
Unless you are a dollar-owning slavedriver who has no interest in *HEALHTY* sustainable businesses which provide jobs and stability to those who operate it. If you are the kind of rabid-with-greed capitalist that demands quick and massive returns on the otherhand...
I'm just not sure why people are continuing to assert the validity of a model that has almost universally failed, and nowhere succeeded.
I think the point is this: No one cares to make a profit here. We care to make good software and provide freedom to others. The FSF and GNU/Linux is a resounding accomplishment and sucess. What dont you understand? Saying "..but no one is making a profit.." is a non-sequitor. It is testement to (once-again) that For-Profit endevours are not self-justifiying... the world needs less "For Profits" and more GNU/Linux-like shows of public will.
Why is this concept seem to be so foreign to you? Where do you live...?
"Another model that is perhaps more applicable here is this whole idea of four categories of people: the radicals, idealists, realists and opportunists. Everybody is an idealist. Everybody has this idea that things should be better and that's really a non-ideological thing. The fear is that those idealists will become radicals and start questioning the roots of the system, start questioning the power structure. People in power don't like that. You have to turn these idealists into realists, because once they're realists, they can accept the compromises that opportunists make; those being the politicians. Jaggi Singh, Canadian Political Activist 2001
The point of Cisco and MS saying 'you dont understand economic issues' is an attempt at them forcing you to accept their basic precepts, to change your assumptions - change your goals also. I believe that the OS community is boiling from a broader anti-capitalist, anti-corporate-rule momentum building worldwide, the *idea* that *people* should participate in software development as peers, to be given respect and opportunity to participate is fundemental to the Free Software world.
I dont think Mundie understands that alot of people (myself) dont give a *DAMN* about his-kind-of economics - it is not a matter of accepting the 'real world' - I actively advocate changing how exactly the 'real world' works... Allot of Free Software Advocates are using their abilities, in their common area of interaction (the computer world), to act out some political change. The Free Software world is not isolated and alone here, It really is a piece of a larger puzzle.
Now, again, this is my opinion and perspective. There are likely allot of people who disagree - but I believe even those who dont agree politically can see how this would be..
The following will be immediately approved:
disney.kids
pepsi.kids
nike.kids
rep ublican.kids
democrat.kids
toys-r-us.kids
barbi e.kids
nsync.kids
makeup.kids
shopping.kids
ww wf.kids
The following, if administered in the US, will not:
socialist.kids
communist.kids
consumerism. kids
greenpeace.kids
sweatshop.kids
I would not want any of *my* children to be exposed to the first list, the second list is what my children should spend their time learning about...*
*outside of republican/democrat.kids - balanced arguments are necessary, what *.kids will become is a wasteland of Consumerism and Advertising...
Maybe if they declared *.kids a 'Trademark' or 'Copyright' free place, only for altruists and people intending on educating or entertaining, without any nefarious marketing ploys; "How many KoKa-Kola(TM)brand Soda Cans does Johnny have?"
feel-good communist propaganda
Ok - you had me until that. You do understand that it is Government Propaganda (McCartyism) that has led you to *not* understand what Communism is about. Communism has nothing to do with brainwashing - I would argue Capitalism actually *brainwashes* via advertising and marketing... the proof is in the Unbridled Consumption that occurs in the American Masses..... and their arent Evil, Godless, Commies(TM) are they?
Americans confuse Fascism with Communism - one is an economic system, the other a method of government...
that could be integrated to gcc and other standard gnu tools.
I have been thinking about this for a while. Where is the GUIDE ((Grand Unified Integrated Development Environment) cute eh?) for GNU/Linux? What I would *love* to see is a project, GPLed, that implements an 'open' IDE for development in a language, toolkit, compiler neutral manner. This 'IDE' would accept any language, class, library, toolkit, compiler as long as the developers of the afore mentioned implemented a 'plug-in definition' (or some other 3rd party did the def of her favourite essential 'item'). It should also use make or somesuch for auto-building.
The GUIDE would allow you to 'import' a new language. The language would have been sufficiently described in one of these 'plug-in definitions (an XML document(?)) that would describe a style guide (maybe) but at least provide some highlighting, auto-magic tooltip-type-pop-up describing the function/object (params, methods etc). The GUIDE would also allow you to import a toolkit. A 'plug-in definition' of those widgets would provide their params/methods/variables allowing you to do some drag-and-drop GUI development with these new 'widgets'. A 'plug-in definition' would allow you to install additional libraries/objects from other 'add-on' projects (like the plethora that exist for Perl for instance).
GUIDE would allow modular framework to do GUI assisted coding - so I dont have to re-learn, download a IDE for ever language, and do development in a million applications... and re-learn(re-configure to taste) each and every language's IDE.
Besides - would the GNU/Linux community (essentially computer-capable people) want such a 'thing'? I know allot of people probably do their coding in vi (myself) or emacs, but wouldnt allot like to see such a thing?
I myself am not an uber-coder, so starting a project like this solo is a little silly, anyone know of a project *like* this?
...Any other ideas?
from the article above:
prevent the circumvention of technologies used to protect copyright material; and,
Gaia help us.
to invest into a product that won't give them good returns
See again, your stuck in a rut... why are we only researching medicing that provieds a 'good return'? WTF is our motivation again? oh yeaah, its HEALHTY PEOPLE, when we have an idea on how to make PEOPLE HEALTHY we should INVESTIGATE. BigPharm only investigates what makes profit..
Do you understand the clear and distinct different motives here?
Pass an "australia-style" law forcing citizens to vote. That is a good firest-step...
do I have a problem with this. Nope, none whatsoever. Because, if the big pharmaceutical companies can't protect their product then they won't manufacture it. And if they don't, who will? Who else can afford the R&D? It may be that by giving up my rights to this research I will help to provide a cure or prevention for diabetes. I'm happy with that.
Big Pharm spends *by far* more on advertising than Research. See here. Also, to as a side-note, please see here to understand that free-market capitalism in the health care industry doesnt make sense; to note "Canada insured 100 percent of its citizens for $2,250 per person in l998 while the United States expended $4,270 per person insuring only 84 percent of our citizens.", not only that, its cruel and disgusting to hold people's health ransom for money...
De-Regulating the health care industry is more about stable profit for big-pharm than anything else.. Canada and Britain's citizens would do well to understand what 'American Style' health care really means. Fewer healthy people, higher cost, profiteering at the expense of your health (literally).
What does this have to do with R&D & Patents? Patents are weapons used by the Health Care Industry to kill people for money. The 'R & D' they do is to make money. Neither thing has 'beans' to do with Healthy People. The R&D should be done by doctors with alot less attachment to profit motives, which by nature, make for an *UNHEALTHY* "Health Industry"..
"So how do you motivate people to make others healthy when your only incentive is profit" would be a better question.
Funny, patents actually are good for innovation.
No, your wrong. Research will go back to the 'public domain' or 'common knowledge' area and be done at University - supported by all.
When a 'new better' method is founded, the 'good parts' of capitalism will empower anyone who cares to, to try and make that thing better, faster and cheaper. If you allow hole realms of knowledge (like ranking pages based upon their a href's) you will enable a company to operate *contrary* to what a 'free market' would provide. You cannot have both numerous and broad monopolies and free markets. This is ridiculous and counter productive.
Note: I myself favour a controlled and planned economy, capitalism enables terrible choices which do not align with healthy sustainable futures (like pollution, consumerism, exploitation of labour and whatnot) - *B*U*T* if the Plutocrats who run the G8 are going to run this capitalism game, they at least have to do it right by not enshrining businesses as all-powerfull-gods-of-knowledge... but I digress.
Free Software reverse engineering effort that has been wildly successful.
Samba.
Free Software hackers worked on Lesstif forever without having something that actually worked
When you compare one application against another, and they happen to work differently, one is not 'useless' because it is not exactly like the other - when you set the standard you are the only one that will ever *really* be the one that works "correctly".
Linux DA is the dominant software platform for the Consumer Electronics Industry.
Ummm What? Ive never heard of "Linux DA", how did it slip past and become *the* "dominant sw platform"?
Lies, Damn Lies and Marketing. I hate PR speak...
The US is not breaking the ABM treaty. Either party is legally allowed to withdraw after giving 6 months' notice. IMHO, the US government is doing exactly what it's supposed to--take all necessary steps to ensure the safety of its citizens from foreign powers. If the foreign powers don't like it, that's too bad, because they won't be able to do much about it.
;)
Thats a lovely thought. Screw the rest of you - 'were saving ourselves!'. The present ABM treaty has helped us assure some peace for the last 30 years. Why are you proposing to change that? Further, when dealing with international matters like these, if they are *really* important to the people of America, why wouldnt they also be important to people everywhere? If you can argue that they are important for people (as opposed to imperialistic plutocrats and the military-industrial complex) than why wouldnt America, as a memeber of the UN (or some other complete and inclusive agency) ask to have this system built and deployed the whole world over? Why not, if this system can really do good - protect people from nuts with nukes - offer to also protect China, Russia, Africa, Cuba and the rest? If this was a 'defensive' and 'honest' idea - this would be the tact.... but not surprisingly, this isnt the method being employed. The snip from your post above illustrates the offensive tone that this son-of-star-wars idea is being rammed through... and make no mistake, America is acting contrary to the wishes of *EVERYONE* else on the planet - except maybe Isreal