Not all Linux software is Free Software. Things like StarOffice or whatever might be considered as essential elements in this sort of move on the part of a large company-- somewhere in there I'd guess there is going to be one piece of licensed code. They might also obtain some custom code from a Linux development shop that they have the source for, but is not free in any sense of the word. Plus the cost to customize and burn "official" install CDs for the enterprise is not free of some cost.
Thanks to SpamAssassin I don't actually see most of my UCE any more.:D
What I still get in my mailbox that SA doesn't tag is stuff I supposedly opted-in for (probably by missing a checkbox on a web-site registration) or know I opted in for. With only one exception I've had really good luck getting off these sorts of lists, and the exception was primarily a technical fault, once real people got involved the problem was solved.
Reputable internet companies seem to know that spam is the best way to lose customers. What appears to be getting sent directly to the bitbucket is all stuff that's sent to harvested addresses.
The new bugs and security holes (and hardware requirements) are more trouble then they are worth. How is this different from the old bugs, security holes, and constant hardware upgrading before? Good luck with your plan to stay in the Stone Age.
In this case "stealing" the biometric is simple. Aim a video camera at the subject. Unless we are now doing high-level topographical scans of all persons arrested, the only good data available would seem to be mug shots or stuff from surveillance cams. Hence your improvised mask example becomes very possible.
Why do you need to do magic in Sims? Although it might be kinda cool to have a Medieval Sims (and even moreso, similar time-period-based expansion packs for SimCity)... I can already do magic in Final Fantasy Tactics (a game my daughter loves, btw: she spends hours shopping, er, equipping her party), Myth, and every other computer known to humankind.
Re:with things like this happening
on
Spy v. Spy
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· Score: 1
Oh, it wasn't my intent to point fingers at anyone specific. I doubt the Kompany would either. Just listing a few binary-only, not-always-included-with-the-distro-but-popular pieces of software. Presumably if more people get into Linux because the price is right, we'll see more and more proprietary software-- bringing with it a risk that it will do more than users bargained for.
Re:with things like this happening
on
Spy v. Spy
·
· Score: 2, Insightful
Agreed, it's one of the reasons I use Debian and avoid 3rd party software for which I don't get the source code. What I'm talking about is when people download the CodeWeaver CrossOver plugin, and the Flash plugin, and the RealPlayer, and stuff from the Kompany, and whatever other proprietary stuff gets written on or ported to Linux. And it all gets installed by root, even if it never gets run as root. Which means that at a user-level, the software has the potential for the problems we're seeing with Windows software.
I don't see a single application as a reason to avoid Apple. Maybe if someone else like Opera or Netscape wants to make a free, high-quality browser available to Apple to put on all new Macs, then Apple will change. As it is, the quality of IE for Mac serves as a good advertisement for Microsoft and not so much as a crippling of the platform. This is a non-issue.
Re:with things like this happening
on
Spy v. Spy
·
· Score: 4, Interesting
And as soon as more and more average users start using Linux, we'll see all sorts of fun stuff getting thrown into RPMs and.deb files and this problem will just follow. The only thing that will prevent it is the fairly high sense of ethics that most free software developers bring to their work (which is part of why I like free software so much myself).
do you really think Dell or Gateway is going to get some "Backbone". I didn't say "get some", I said "had some". Past tense. As in they've made their beds, let them lay in them.
the stockholder would probably sue the CEO for not maximizing profits. For all the talk I hear about "they're just doing their legal duty to the shareholders" on Slashdot, how many real court cases do you see where the Board is held liable when a company fails? None. Except in cases of plain fraud and obvious illegal behavior. Shareholders buy stock, they vote their proxies, and they take their chances. That's how the game works. Don't like it? Buy bonds. This is a lame argument and I'm tired of hearing it.
So yes, I realize this is a problem now. I'm glad the Gateway guy was willing to testify. But really, if you consumers aren't going to do something real about it, what difference does it make? Microsoft used to be a rinky-dink little firm that couldn't monopolize its way out of a paper bag. In less than 25 years they did this, how? Giving people the software they asked for.
Since when are these OEM contracts the taxpayers' (and therefore the government's) problem? If these OEMs couldn't figure out what they were risking by giving favor to a single vendor, tough on them-- where's the shareholder lawsuits alleging harm for such incompetent negligence? There ain't none. Why? Because no one has shown how this harms consumers.
Anyway don't most people love Microsoft software, even in the face of good alternatives like Mac OS and Linux (and previously stuff like OS/2-Warp/AmigaOS/BeOS/etc)? So if an OEM doesn't like it, let them get out of the Microsoft game. If any serious hardware maker spent some time fine-tuning a Linux distro for their hardware and a set of standard peripherals they could be selling top of the line systems quickly, with no allegiance to Redmond required. If people don't want such Linux systems, then I guess the OEMs are stuck. Maybe the OEMs should have had some foresight. It's not like this happened slowly, we're talking about a story less than 25 years in the making.
If it can be shown that MS broke some actual laws, fine. So far, the evidence seems to favor an interpretation that they played really really hardball with OEMs. In fact, this testimony shores that up. And that's not my problem. That's just business.
Maybe if a few of the top PC-maker execs had some sort of backbone, this would have never happened. Of course, they're just giving th consumers what they wanted right? Glad I've never bought anything that wasn't either a used machine (as in "sans OS") or made by Apple. Next computer will either be a new Mac or completely home-built.
They might if the story was newsworthy. Remember 9/11 coverage? Same 60 minutes of destruction played out non-stop for a few days running, analyzed every possible which way. You see the same thing all the time. While I agree that Slashdot lacks a certain professionalism about this stuff, they probably have a lot of trouble keeping up with "thousands of submissions". If someone who can front-page a story misses a day, they have 30 potential stories they might screw up and accidentally front-page again.
FWIW, I think/. should simply be choosier about publishing anything, rather than Rob's goal of having some 30 new stories every day. Ten top notch submissions, where a Slashdot writer actually investigates the article for more than 10 seconds would be worth a lot more to me than 30 mindless links. It might also be cool if they batched them, rather than forcing constant reloads all day to see if anything new pops up. Like a morning edition and an evening edition.
Oh I know. It's just annoying that they change whether I want them to or not. I could have two files in the exact same format in a folder that would open two different apps when double-clicked. I suppose that's what drag-select-and-drop are for, and that's something that Mac OS is great for. But it would be better if I had more control over it. Oh well, that's why that machine is a dual-booter and why I'd buy a newer Mac to run OS X if I could afford it.
Not. I'll admit the way Windows uses file extensions is vastly inferior to the way Mac uses it file structure (although the hard limit of filename length is big pain, did they fix that in OS X). But compare to the Unix/Linux way, where files are files-- then the extensions are merely a convention to remind the user which file is a picture and which file is a WP document and which file is an application. Frankly, I don't like the file ownership stuff that happens with Mac OS (again, maybe they've changed this), where your files get too chummy with one application or another, and then change loyalties based on which application they slept with last.
Postal mail is unlikely to be an effective communication means with your senator at this time. One word: Anthrax.
You'd be a lot better off calling them on the phone or using one of their blasted web forms to send an email. And don't bother using the email address on the form without using the form. They will probably just reject that.
As to who is wasting whose time, how about if they stop wasting *my* time writing all these bad laws that I then have to sift through and write them letters about? FWIW, I agree that you should keep your letter short and to the point. Don't spend a lot of time on it. My experiences with even snail mail communications is that they are not read very carefully and you will get, at best, a pretty stock reply back. That is, if they have something on hand about your concern they will not carefully craft a reply. Several times I've written and gotten what appeared to be a complete non-sequitor back from the official-- like they picked up a key phrase and sent back a response to that, whether it addressed my concerns or not.
Ironic that someone spouting off about "appeals to false authority" uses an analogy that stands bright as a different sort of logical fallacy.
In fact, sounds like you have some BS libertarian/republican axe to grind on the whole public/private anything debate and just found the opening you needed to swerve the discussion away from free software and onto your own pet cause list.
As for a moral right to your creation? None that I'm aware of, and that's not the argument being made. Logical fallacy number two. Sheesh.
You have a decent point, but I think inducing this company to act right will start first with persuasive communication of a more carrot-than-stick variety, rather than calling for an immediate boycott and vilifying the corporation. And mostly, I care about tilly's well being. Tilly's non-code contributions to the Perl community are already considerable, and no company can take away the countless Perl Monks that he's helped through some Perl tough spot or the nascent programmers who he's coached on some tricky thought pattern required to understand a concept. It is mostly out of gratitude to him that I would urge caution in going after this company, because of the repercussions it could have on him.
Um, if he helps you boycott this company he will be fired. Since he needs his job, I think this would be the worst thing that can happen. It's unfortunate, but tilly did sign the contract of his own volition. We need to support tilly who is a tremendous asset to the Perl community, not attack the company.
I'm willing to bet something like a "Department of Obfuscation" to make their apps more Windows-reliant to counter the GPL's general desire of universal compatability.
What the hell are you talking about? "GPL's general desire of universal compatibility"??
The GPL is a free software license. The program featured in this article is proprietary. The GPL says and does nothing to promote universal compatibility. Sure the FSF may support portability, but that is hardly the real issue underlying the GPL. Finally, while this may be a great program, because it is not free software, I am not sure I see the point. If I wanted to run proprietary software why would I run Linux at all? (Hint: Macintosh).
I agree. There are many over-the-hill white guys who are totally clueless about tech issues and computer use. Although I do doubt that members of Congress are heavier offenders in this than other demographics. They are, for the most part, wealthy men-- the biggest buyers of tech toys. Also, if you look at Congress, it may be heavily white and heavily male, but there are significant numbers of minorities and women, especially in the House where districting plays a larger role the electoral politics. In fact, when it comes to laws like this one passed in PA, I'd guess the women and non-whites were just as adamant about it as any men.
I also agree with your basic premise that Congress (and apparently State Legislatures, too) are passing some pretty bad laws. But I doubt the PA law was passed as a result of entertainment industry lobbying. More likely it was passed as a result of the "concerned mommy" lobby-- the Tipper Gores of the world. "Since we don't like what you're doing, we'll do our best to pass laws to protect everyone else from you."
And frankly, as long as these people keep getting elected, the only people you can really blame are voters and non-voters, the former for electing the wrong people, the latter for not helping out at all. The day corporations actually get a place in line at the polls is the day the system falls over. Until then, that we have the leaders we have is a conscious decision made by millions of Americans time and time again.
Quoth the AC: How about a feature that let us completely block out people whose entire contribution to a thread are spelling and grammer flames?
We already have that. You register a login, then you mark me as a foe, then you assign foes a large negative modifier, then you can ignore me all you want. BTW, you spelled "grammar" wrong. If you all want to look like morons, be my guest. But given the general attitude around here about how dumb non-techies are, I think the community should be held to some sort of standard when it comes to simple things like spelling. In programming every character counts-- there is no room for "misspelled" words. Why not have the same care when it comes to your writing? You do realize that there are numerous resources out there to help you get the spellings correct, don't you? Here's an idea: before you use English again, pick up a dictionary and RTFM.
Spare us the prejudice. AFAIK, most tech companies are heavily populated by over the hill white guys. In fact, with a couple of exceptions, all of the most notable persons in the tech industry are over the hill white guys. Not to diminish the contributions of non-whites and non-males, but I think it's safe to say your generalization is a bunch of crock.
if the law enforcement officials KNOW a site is child porn then wouldn't they be much better off going after the site itself rather than alerting the site owners by putting them on a hunted list?
Pretty hard to do that from Pennsylvania if the web site is hosted in the Netherlands. This law isn't so much designed to punish providers but to "protect" Pennsylvanians.
Personally I don't see how this law is useful in that censorware has repeatedly been shown to be completely ineffective. Laws like this only create an illusion of real progress. Like music trading and warez, the pr0n world (acceptable adult stuff or completely unacceptable child stuff) seems to be a hydra: cut off one head and two more grow in its place. The target here is so fluid that there's no way to ever actually hit it.
Operations like "Candyman" are a much better use of government time and money, and they seem to hit the real problem folks, the ones sharing this stuff back out to the world. Put them out of business and your timid/leeches, your curious, and your just plain clueless won't have this stuff in the first place. The only real concern with effective stings is how much crime did the FBI have to encourage/commit themselves to prove their credibility in that circle.
Slashdot Mirror
Not all Linux software is Free Software. Things like StarOffice or whatever might be considered as essential elements in this sort of move on the part of a large company-- somewhere in there I'd guess there is going to be one piece of licensed code. They might also obtain some custom code from a Linux development shop that they have the source for, but is not free in any sense of the word. Plus the cost to customize and burn "official" install CDs for the enterprise is not free of some cost.
Um, I think you just fell for one of the funnier trolls of the day.
Thanks to SpamAssassin I don't actually see most of my UCE any more. :D
What I still get in my mailbox that SA doesn't tag is stuff I supposedly opted-in for (probably by missing a checkbox on a web-site registration) or know I opted in for. With only one exception I've had really good luck getting off these sorts of lists, and the exception was primarily a technical fault, once real people got involved the problem was solved.
Reputable internet companies seem to know that spam is the best way to lose customers. What appears to be getting sent directly to the bitbucket is all stuff that's sent to harvested addresses.
The new bugs and security holes (and hardware requirements) are more trouble then they are worth. How is this different from the old bugs, security holes, and constant hardware upgrading before? Good luck with your plan to stay in the Stone Age.
In this case "stealing" the biometric is simple. Aim a video camera at the subject. Unless we are now doing high-level topographical scans of all persons arrested, the only good data available would seem to be mug shots or stuff from surveillance cams. Hence your improvised mask example becomes very possible.
argh "...computer RPG known..." that is.
Why do you need to do magic in Sims? Although it might be kinda cool to have a Medieval Sims (and even moreso, similar time-period-based expansion packs for SimCity)... I can already do magic in Final Fantasy Tactics (a game my daughter loves, btw: she spends hours shopping, er, equipping her party), Myth, and every other computer known to humankind.
Oh, it wasn't my intent to point fingers at anyone specific. I doubt the Kompany would either. Just listing a few binary-only, not-always-included-with-the-distro-but-popular pieces of software. Presumably if more people get into Linux because the price is right, we'll see more and more proprietary software-- bringing with it a risk that it will do more than users bargained for.
Agreed, it's one of the reasons I use Debian and avoid 3rd party software for which I don't get the source code. What I'm talking about is when people download the CodeWeaver CrossOver plugin, and the Flash plugin, and the RealPlayer, and stuff from the Kompany, and whatever other proprietary stuff gets written on or ported to Linux. And it all gets installed by root, even if it never gets run as root. Which means that at a user-level, the software has the potential for the problems we're seeing with Windows software.
I don't see a single application as a reason to avoid Apple. Maybe if someone else like Opera or Netscape wants to make a free, high-quality browser available to Apple to put on all new Macs, then Apple will change. As it is, the quality of IE for Mac serves as a good advertisement for Microsoft and not so much as a crippling of the platform. This is a non-issue.
And as soon as more and more average users start using Linux, we'll see all sorts of fun stuff getting thrown into RPMs and .deb files and this problem will just follow. The only thing that will prevent it is the fairly high sense of ethics that most free software developers bring to their work (which is part of why I like free software so much myself).
do you really think Dell or Gateway is going to get some "Backbone". I didn't say "get some", I said "had some". Past tense. As in they've made their beds, let them lay in them.
the stockholder would probably sue the CEO for not maximizing profits. For all the talk I hear about "they're just doing their legal duty to the shareholders" on Slashdot, how many real court cases do you see where the Board is held liable when a company fails? None. Except in cases of plain fraud and obvious illegal behavior. Shareholders buy stock, they vote their proxies, and they take their chances. That's how the game works. Don't like it? Buy bonds. This is a lame argument and I'm tired of hearing it.
So yes, I realize this is a problem now. I'm glad the Gateway guy was willing to testify. But really, if you consumers aren't going to do something real about it, what difference does it make? Microsoft used to be a rinky-dink little firm that couldn't monopolize its way out of a paper bag. In less than 25 years they did this, how? Giving people the software they asked for.
Since when are these OEM contracts the taxpayers' (and therefore the government's) problem? If these OEMs couldn't figure out what they were risking by giving favor to a single vendor, tough on them-- where's the shareholder lawsuits alleging harm for such incompetent negligence? There ain't none. Why? Because no one has shown how this harms consumers.
Anyway don't most people love Microsoft software, even in the face of good alternatives like Mac OS and Linux (and previously stuff like OS/2-Warp/AmigaOS/BeOS/etc)? So if an OEM doesn't like it, let them get out of the Microsoft game. If any serious hardware maker spent some time fine-tuning a Linux distro for their hardware and a set of standard peripherals they could be selling top of the line systems quickly, with no allegiance to Redmond required. If people don't want such Linux systems, then I guess the OEMs are stuck. Maybe the OEMs should have had some foresight. It's not like this happened slowly, we're talking about a story less than 25 years in the making.
If it can be shown that MS broke some actual laws, fine. So far, the evidence seems to favor an interpretation that they played really really hardball with OEMs. In fact, this testimony shores that up. And that's not my problem. That's just business.
Maybe if a few of the top PC-maker execs had some sort of backbone, this would have never happened. Of course, they're just giving th consumers what they wanted right? Glad I've never bought anything that wasn't either a used machine (as in "sans OS") or made by Apple. Next computer will either be a new Mac or completely home-built.
They might if the story was newsworthy. Remember 9/11 coverage? Same 60 minutes of destruction played out non-stop for a few days running, analyzed every possible which way. You see the same thing all the time. While I agree that Slashdot lacks a certain professionalism about this stuff, they probably have a lot of trouble keeping up with "thousands of submissions". If someone who can front-page a story misses a day, they have 30 potential stories they might screw up and accidentally front-page again.
/. should simply be choosier about publishing anything, rather than Rob's goal of having some 30 new stories every day. Ten top notch submissions, where a Slashdot writer actually investigates the article for more than 10 seconds would be worth a lot more to me than 30 mindless links. It might also be cool if they batched them, rather than forcing constant reloads all day to see if anything new pops up. Like a morning edition and an evening edition.
FWIW, I think
Oh I know. It's just annoying that they change whether I want them to or not. I could have two files in the exact same format in a folder that would open two different apps when double-clicked. I suppose that's what drag-select-and-drop are for, and that's something that Mac OS is great for. But it would be better if I had more control over it. Oh well, that's why that machine is a dual-booter and why I'd buy a newer Mac to run OS X if I could afford it.
Not. I'll admit the way Windows uses file extensions is vastly inferior to the way Mac uses it file structure (although the hard limit of filename length is big pain, did they fix that in OS X). But compare to the Unix/Linux way, where files are files-- then the extensions are merely a convention to remind the user which file is a picture and which file is a WP document and which file is an application. Frankly, I don't like the file ownership stuff that happens with Mac OS (again, maybe they've changed this), where your files get too chummy with one application or another, and then change loyalties based on which application they slept with last.
Postal mail is unlikely to be an effective communication means with your senator at this time. One word: Anthrax.
You'd be a lot better off calling them on the phone or using one of their blasted web forms to send an email. And don't bother using the email address on the form without using the form. They will probably just reject that.
As to who is wasting whose time, how about if they stop wasting *my* time writing all these bad laws that I then have to sift through and write them letters about? FWIW, I agree that you should keep your letter short and to the point. Don't spend a lot of time on it. My experiences with even snail mail communications is that they are not read very carefully and you will get, at best, a pretty stock reply back. That is, if they have something on hand about your concern they will not carefully craft a reply. Several times I've written and gotten what appeared to be a complete non-sequitor back from the official-- like they picked up a key phrase and sent back a response to that, whether it addressed my concerns or not.
Ironic that someone spouting off about "appeals to false authority" uses an analogy that stands bright as a different sort of logical fallacy.
In fact, sounds like you have some BS libertarian/republican axe to grind on the whole public/private anything debate and just found the opening you needed to swerve the discussion away from free software and onto your own pet cause list.
As for a moral right to your creation? None that I'm aware of, and that's not the argument being made. Logical fallacy number two. Sheesh.
You have a decent point, but I think inducing this company to act right will start first with persuasive communication of a more carrot-than-stick variety, rather than calling for an immediate boycott and vilifying the corporation. And mostly, I care about tilly's well being. Tilly's non-code contributions to the Perl community are already considerable, and no company can take away the countless Perl Monks that he's helped through some Perl tough spot or the nascent programmers who he's coached on some tricky thought pattern required to understand a concept. It is mostly out of gratitude to him that I would urge caution in going after this company, because of the repercussions it could have on him.
Um, if he helps you boycott this company he will be fired. Since he needs his job, I think this would be the worst thing that can happen. It's unfortunate, but tilly did sign the contract of his own volition. We need to support tilly who is a tremendous asset to the Perl community, not attack the company.
I'm willing to bet something like a "Department of Obfuscation" to make their apps more Windows-reliant to counter the GPL's general desire of universal compatability.
What the hell are you talking about? "GPL's general desire of universal compatibility"??
The GPL is a free software license. The program featured in this article is proprietary. The GPL says and does nothing to promote universal compatibility. Sure the FSF may support portability, but that is hardly the real issue underlying the GPL. Finally, while this may be a great program, because it is not free software, I am not sure I see the point. If I wanted to run proprietary software why would I run Linux at all? (Hint: Macintosh).
I agree. There are many over-the-hill white guys who are totally clueless about tech issues and computer use. Although I do doubt that members of Congress are heavier offenders in this than other demographics. They are, for the most part, wealthy men-- the biggest buyers of tech toys. Also, if you look at Congress, it may be heavily white and heavily male, but there are significant numbers of minorities and women, especially in the House where districting plays a larger role the electoral politics. In fact, when it comes to laws like this one passed in PA, I'd guess the women and non-whites were just as adamant about it as any men.
I also agree with your basic premise that Congress (and apparently State Legislatures, too) are passing some pretty bad laws. But I doubt the PA law was passed as a result of entertainment industry lobbying. More likely it was passed as a result of the "concerned mommy" lobby-- the Tipper Gores of the world. "Since we don't like what you're doing, we'll do our best to pass laws to protect everyone else from you."
And frankly, as long as these people keep getting elected, the only people you can really blame are voters and non-voters, the former for electing the wrong people, the latter for not helping out at all. The day corporations actually get a place in line at the polls is the day the system falls over. Until then, that we have the leaders we have is a conscious decision made by millions of Americans time and time again.
Quoth the AC: How about a feature that let us completely block out people whose entire contribution to a thread are spelling and grammer flames?
We already have that. You register a login, then you mark me as a foe, then you assign foes a large negative modifier, then you can ignore me all you want. BTW, you spelled "grammar" wrong. If you all want to look like morons, be my guest. But given the general attitude around here about how dumb non-techies are, I think the community should be held to some sort of standard when it comes to simple things like spelling. In programming every character counts-- there is no room for "misspelled" words. Why not have the same care when it comes to your writing? You do realize that there are numerous resources out there to help you get the spellings correct, don't you? Here's an idea: before you use English again, pick up a dictionary and RTFM.
Spare us the prejudice. AFAIK, most tech companies are heavily populated by over the hill white guys. In fact, with a couple of exceptions, all of the most notable persons in the tech industry are over the hill white guys. Not to diminish the contributions of non-whites and non-males, but I think it's safe to say your generalization is a bunch of crock.
if the law enforcement officials KNOW a site is child porn then wouldn't they be much better off going after the site itself rather than alerting the site owners by putting them on a hunted list?
Pretty hard to do that from Pennsylvania if the web site is hosted in the Netherlands. This law isn't so much designed to punish providers but to "protect" Pennsylvanians.
Personally I don't see how this law is useful in that censorware has repeatedly been shown to be completely ineffective. Laws like this only create an illusion of real progress. Like music trading and warez, the pr0n world (acceptable adult stuff or completely unacceptable child stuff) seems to be a hydra: cut off one head and two more grow in its place. The target here is so fluid that there's no way to ever actually hit it.
Operations like "Candyman" are a much better use of government time and money, and they seem to hit the real problem folks, the ones sharing this stuff back out to the world. Put them out of business and your timid/leeches, your curious, and your just plain clueless won't have this stuff in the first place. The only real concern with effective stings is how much crime did the FBI have to encourage/commit themselves to prove their credibility in that circle.