To put it more succinctly, your old monkey brain is fooling you. Humans are remarkably peaceful creature who get more peaceful with time, your old monkey brain just canÃ(TM)t grasp that.
Rational argument has no place on the Internet. Don't make me bash your head in.
No it's not. These notaries don't sign anything and don't guarantee anything.
I think it is the same thing. The notaries are simply 'certificate authority - lite'.
They are providing exactly the same service (a level of identity trust) as CAs. The mechanics are different, no signing certs, but the role is the same.
I'm imagining that the lines running into the neighborhood will be able to accommodate the houses that haven't signed up yet, at a future date.
Ya, that's a good point I'll see if I can find out what the plan is for that.
As for capacity, the trunk line has something like 400 fiber pairs in it and each home will get its own pair running all the way back to the datacentre. So there is no sharing of bandwidth until you reach the actual ISP network switches. At that point it will be up to the ISPs to decide how much Internet bandwidth they need to serve their connected clients.
Rights of way really are a big problem. The situation is also highly variable from town to town because it is a municipal government responsibility. There are federal rules forcing the municipalities to allow the phone/cable/gas companies access but no global rule requiring easy access for things like customer owner fiber. If the power or phone company 'owns' the rights of way or the poles they could be a big problem. Some municipalities require 'fair/open' access to the poles/rightsofway which would be the best situation.
As for 'being your own isp', that's not quite what I had in mind, let me explain further. The model for the pilot project here in Ottawa is that the customer owns the line from their house to the interconnect point (a carrier neutral datacentre/meet-me room). In that datacentre multiple ISPs would operate switches and routers with which to provide Internet (and perhaps other) services to anyone with a line to the datacentre. The customer would never have to actually touch anything or configure anything beyond the usual setup of their own firewall or PC. It would be very easy to switch your ISP any time you wanted, or to not connect to an ISP at all.
It does cost something like $50,000 to run a fiber line, and if you are only building a point-to-point system it is very cost prohibitive. However! If you run a line through a residential neighbourhood the incremental cost of connecting each building along the route is not very high. A point-to-point line that would cost $50,000 might only cost $200,000 if you connect 200 houses along its route. Thus the $1000 per household number. If every home signs up the cost is actually fantastically low. It could be as low as $500/household. Sadly we cannot hope for 100% uptake. 10-20% is more realistic and makes it much more expensive per household. These are the rough numbers for the Ottawa pilot project. The whole thing should cost between $200,000 and $250,000 and could reach 400 houses. If everyone wanted to participate it would be very cheap for each house. An informal poll showed 30% of households would participate. If that happens it will cost about $2100 each.
If it costs me $2,000 to hook into a $45 a month service that is no better then Time Warner's $60 a month service
True, but that's not how the numbers work out.
I think it is fair to say that about $25 dollars of any DSL or cable service is going to the physical system. (I would love to see more data on this, anyone who knows please speak up. Bell canada charges independent ISPs $27 to use their DSL system) That leaves $5 to $35 for IP service. That makes sense if you look at the wholesale price of bandwidth. Bandwidth equivalent to what a dsl line can provide would cost $5-15 retail, not $45. For $45/month I could sell you a 50/50mbit service with a monthly limit of 3,000GB (no torrent filtering, no deep packet inspection, no bullshit, and 5ms ping times instead of 30)
A fiber line will last at least 20 years, theoretically it could last 40. The physical line will not become obsolete as the copper systems have/will. Even today a single strand can carry 160Gb/s per wavelength. You would only ever have to upgrade the gear at either end. The majority of your $2000 goes to labour for running the fiber line.
Ultimately it comes down to this: Rent or own. Fiber is no more expensive to build than the copper systems. So the question is, if you plan on having Internet service for the rest of your life, do you want to rent it or own it? If you have the money to make long term investments then it will be a good deal. Even if it takes 10 years to pay for itself and lasts 20 you will be saving money.
Waterboarding might not be a walk in the park, but it's been applied to three people who were known to be high-level terrorists. We got information from them.
Your government operates a network of secret over-seas prisons for the purpose of interrogating detainees.
Your government built gitmo on a parcel of occupied territory in a foreign country for the express purpose of bypassing your laws.
Your government delivers detainees to third parties like Syria for the purpose of interrogations.
Given these facts (this is not speculation, these are all verifiable facts) the idea that only 3 people have been subjected to torture by your government is so improbable that your assertion to that effect smacks of willful ignorance.
...they believe George Bush is the epitome of evil. Oh please. You are responsible for and have a measure of control over your own government. THAT is why you spend your time and effort criticizing him, not china.
Criticize china all you want but you're just pissing in the wind. It is your responsibility to police your own representatives.
There is lots of evil in the world. george bush is not the most evil but he is the evil that is ostensibly under your control.
No, that is a thousandth of a meter. Mille, million, milliard thousand, million, billion I don't know why they use the same prefix for those three... makes no sense to me.
Ya, but if we were using multicast then the entire thing would have been broadcast by a single rack of computers in China for a few grand.
This way a dozen different companies, each with their own geo-blocked market spent millions on farms of servers and megawatts of power. Not to mention all the time and money spent trying to make it harder to watch using DRM.
Akamai does the exact same thing. Limelight is nothing special. The technique is the same. Any CDN worth its salt will have boxes colocated with major ISPs -- the more, the better.
I agree. But just for clarity; the difference is that limelight operates a large fibre network feeding all of its caching servers. Akamai only uses caches.
No, the ISPs are not extorting money from limelight.
Limelight went out and built their own high-capacity network and connected it to as many other networks as they could. That is the Internet. That is how it is supposed to work.
There is a company out of the Uk called INUK TV that is/has deployed a multicast IPTV system. They can only serve University students because only the research/education fibre networks multicast enabled. I hear it works but i haven't seen it operating.
Slashdot Mirror
She's ok, i'd let her have sex with me.
mmmmm, furries.
Some scientists is original found human, uh, poo that is 14,300 years old.
Did you run that 'sentence' back and forth through an online translator or something?
I'll take 1000 of your infinite lifespan data storage devices please.
well, if you're putting it through the washer regularly you might actually want gold because it won't rust.
I stand corrected.
There a many, many things to love about Quebec.
The business and government environments are NOT among them.
nitpick: Regarding Canada's retail tax rate... it was 7% and has been reduced to 6%. The 5% rate is what is promised if we re-elect bush-junior.
who's special?
You're special!
Umm, no 'poop' sherlock.
Politics == writing laws. %90+ politicians have training in law. who'd a thunk it?
that's what *she* said.
You win this thread.
Why do so many people think that nature is peaceful?
Because we usually pacify it before taking a stroll and all the scary predators run away from us.
I can see why that could lead to a false impression.
To put it more succinctly, your old monkey brain is fooling you. Humans are remarkably peaceful creature who get more peaceful with time, your old monkey brain just canÃ(TM)t grasp that.
Rational argument has no place on the Internet.
Don't make me bash your head in.
No it's not. These notaries don't sign anything and don't guarantee anything.
I think it is the same thing.
The notaries are simply 'certificate authority - lite'.
They are providing exactly the same service (a level of identity trust) as CAs. The mechanics are different, no signing certs, but the role is the same.
I'm imagining that the lines running into the neighborhood will be able to accommodate the houses that haven't signed up yet, at a future date.
Ya, that's a good point I'll see if I can find out what the plan is for that.
As for capacity, the trunk line has something like 400 fiber pairs in it and each home will get its own pair running all the way back to the datacentre.
So there is no sharing of bandwidth until you reach the actual ISP network switches. At that point it will be up to the ISPs to decide how much Internet bandwidth they need to serve their connected clients.
It's called capitalism.
Iranian oil companies will continue to sell at market rates because they can.
Rights of way really are a big problem.
The situation is also highly variable from town to town because it is a municipal government responsibility.
There are federal rules forcing the municipalities to allow the phone/cable/gas companies access but no global rule requiring easy access for things like customer owner fiber. If the power or phone company 'owns' the rights of way or the poles they could be a big problem.
Some municipalities require 'fair/open' access to the poles/rightsofway which would be the best situation.
As for 'being your own isp', that's not quite what I had in mind, let me explain further. The model for the pilot project here in Ottawa is that the customer owns the line from their house to the interconnect point (a carrier neutral datacentre/meet-me room).
In that datacentre multiple ISPs would operate switches and routers with which to provide Internet (and perhaps other) services to anyone with a line to the datacentre.
The customer would never have to actually touch anything or configure anything beyond the usual setup of their own firewall or PC.
It would be very easy to switch your ISP any time you wanted, or to not connect to an ISP at all.
It does cost something like $50,000 to run a fiber line, and if you are only building a point-to-point system it is very cost prohibitive.
However! If you run a line through a residential neighbourhood the incremental cost of connecting each building along the route is not very high.
A point-to-point line that would cost $50,000 might only cost $200,000 if you connect 200 houses along its route. Thus the $1000 per household number.
If every home signs up the cost is actually fantastically low. It could be as low as $500/household.
Sadly we cannot hope for 100% uptake. 10-20% is more realistic and makes it much more expensive per household.
These are the rough numbers for the Ottawa pilot project. The whole thing should cost between $200,000 and $250,000 and could reach 400 houses. If everyone wanted to participate it would be very cheap for each house. An informal poll showed 30% of households would participate. If that happens it will cost about $2100 each.
If it costs me $2,000 to hook into a $45 a month service that is no better then Time Warner's $60 a month service
True, but that's not how the numbers work out.
I think it is fair to say that about $25 dollars of any DSL or cable service is going to the physical system.
(I would love to see more data on this, anyone who knows please speak up. Bell canada charges independent ISPs $27 to use their DSL system)
That leaves $5 to $35 for IP service. That makes sense if you look at the wholesale price of bandwidth.
Bandwidth equivalent to what a dsl line can provide would cost $5-15 retail, not $45. For $45/month I could sell you a 50/50mbit service with a monthly limit of 3,000GB
(no torrent filtering, no deep packet inspection, no bullshit, and 5ms ping times instead of 30)
A fiber line will last at least 20 years, theoretically it could last 40.
The physical line will not become obsolete as the copper systems have/will. Even today a single strand can carry 160Gb/s per wavelength. You would only ever have to upgrade the gear at either end. The majority of your $2000 goes to labour for running the fiber line.
Ultimately it comes down to this: Rent or own.
Fiber is no more expensive to build than the copper systems.
So the question is, if you plan on having Internet service for the rest of your life, do you want to rent it or own it?
If you have the money to make long term investments then it will be a good deal.
Even if it takes 10 years to pay for itself and lasts 20 you will be saving money.
or to achieve an even smaller risk of conspiracy: Two or more people of different, publicly known affiliations.
If you want to avoid a conspiracy then just let one person do it by themselves.
Waterboarding might not be a walk in the park, but it's been applied to three people who were known to be high-level terrorists. We got information from them.
Your government operates a network of secret over-seas prisons for the purpose of interrogating detainees.
Your government built gitmo on a parcel of occupied territory in a foreign country for the express purpose of bypassing your laws.
Your government delivers detainees to third parties like Syria for the purpose of interrogations.
Given these facts (this is not speculation, these are all verifiable facts) the idea that only 3 people have been subjected to torture by your government is so improbable that your assertion to that effect smacks of willful ignorance.
Oh please. You are responsible for and have a measure of control over your own government.
THAT is why you spend your time and effort criticizing him, not china.
Criticize china all you want but you're just pissing in the wind.
It is your responsibility to police your own representatives.
There is lots of evil in the world.
george bush is not the most evil but he is the evil that is ostensibly under your control.
Not to mention the benefits to competition.
When the last-mile is no longer owned by monopolies we may get decent competition.
No, that is a thousandth of a meter.
Mille, million, milliard
thousand, million, billion
I don't know why they use the same prefix for those three... makes no sense to me.
Ya, but if we were using multicast then the entire thing would have been broadcast by a single rack of computers in China for a few grand.
This way a dozen different companies, each with their own geo-blocked market spent millions on farms of servers and megawatts of power.
Not to mention all the time and money spent trying to make it harder to watch using DRM.
Akamai does the exact same thing. Limelight is nothing special. The technique is the same. Any CDN worth its salt will have boxes colocated with major ISPs -- the more, the better.
I agree.
But just for clarity; the difference is that limelight operates a large fibre network feeding all of its caching servers.
Akamai only uses caches.
No, the ISPs are not extorting money from limelight.
Limelight went out and built their own high-capacity network and connected it to as many other networks as they could.
That is the Internet.
That is how it is supposed to work.
There is a company out of the Uk called INUK TV that is/has deployed a multicast IPTV system.
They can only serve University students because only the research/education fibre networks multicast enabled.
I hear it works but i haven't seen it operating.