First off, you are right that I did NOT speak about Americas increase in Coal exports TO CHINA. It is something that I am opposed to. In addition, it is CHINA'S consumption, not ours.
So If China exports coal, it's China's fault. But if America exports coal, it's also China's fault. Typical WindBourne logic.
China isn't even in the top 5 export destinations for American coal in 2017. It was actually less than 3.5% of your coal exports. So more bullshit from you.
Secondly. pretty funny that you picked an article from EIA about China, which was based on 2015 numbers. The prediction was that coal usage would fall in China.
The article was from September 2017 and the prediction was accurate. If you can find a more recent one show us.
Your own link shows China increased only 0.4% in coal use and
However, as a portion of total energy consumption, coal usage fell 1.6 percentage points to 60.4 percent last year, while clean energy, including natural gas and renewables, rose 1.3 percentage points to 20.8 percent from 2016, the communique showed.
That indicates the country remains on track to fulfil its promise to decarbonise its economy and reduce air pollution, as it vowed to cut the coal portion to below 58 percent of total energy consumption by 2020.
So it rose 0.4% in one year and is expected to stay flat or drop according to both articles. The opposite of your unsubstantiated claim. And why did you lie earlier and say that China's coal use increased over 5% in 2017?
It slowed down a bit relative to their GDP, but once their GDP growth rate picked up, so did the coal.
Again more lies from you, your own link says
Carbon intensity, the level of carbon emissions per unit of economic growth, dropped by 5.1 percent in 2017 compared to a year ago.
Carbon intensity got 5% better ! In one year !!
Why do you lie and say it was worse?
But the real use of that coal increase, are the EVs that are flowing in. Because China will not quit build new coal plants and instead focus solely on building wind/solar/hydro until they have their nuclear power plants going, then it will be more coal they will use.
You are just making this up, all projectionsshow coal stabilising and/or dropping. You haven't shown any credible evidence that this isn't the case. You still fail to admit that China is replacing less efficient coal plants with newer more efficient ones as has been shown to you repeatedly.
You could read the article and find out that what you are saying is complete bullshit. Of course it won't be off grid. Block-chain is just the excuse to turn it back on, block-chain won't be using all the power.
Not in a lot of cases. For example it's better for farmers if they don't let the US back in. Because if the US isn't in, all the other countries will have a price advantage over American farmers.
No. The reason for going with emissions/$, is that neither you nor I decide the co2. Gov and businesses do.
Really? The government forces you to eat steak, drive an SUV, Turn your heating and cooling way up high? Don't make me laugh.
Look until tesla, how many EVs were there in.the world? None of consequences. Heck Prius started after Tesla started their r&D to build out EVs. GM built EV1 to appease California, but Exon killed it. Had it not been for Tesla, we would have no EVs.
China has more electric cars than the US, and also has double the market share % of new electric car sales, and also faster growth of that market share %..
Likewise, it has taken businesses and gov to push solar and wind. You and I did not create the market.
China is massively into solar and wind. Everyone knows this.
So, it comes down to decisions by businesses and gov, not ppl.
Complete bullshit. People choose what they want to do, what they want to consume. How they want to live. What lifestyle they lead.
The only way to push them is via emissions/GDP. They only care about the almighty buck. So, by normalizing on gdp and dropping emissions limit yearly, this forces all gov/businesses to change.
You live in a democracy and are free to spend your money how you like. If you want government to force people and businesses to use less CO2, vote for a government that will make those changes. Have a carbon tax if you like. Seems like a sensible way to put a price on polluting. But people will have to want it, America isn't a dictatorship. People choose not governments. Similarly businesses only do what the government allows them to do (again people) or what will sell in the marketplace, again people choosing to purchase/participate.
As it is, China's emissions are disastrous and America's sux as well. In POF, most of Europe sux as well.
All 3 regions are higher than the world average so I kind of agree here. More needs to be done. But it's unfair to place all of the burden on China where they are a much bigger country and are still climbing up the development ladder. You are still giving rich countries a free pass just because they got rich first. I will still argue only per capita makes sense, as all the things people do add up to the total. More people will do more things, travel, spend, waste, live.
But even if you think per GDP is a useful measure, China is already improving, and improving faster than America or the EU because their economy is growing much faster than the CO2 is increasing. Also America is much worse than Europe even on a per GDP measure. Why is that? Governments, businesses, or people making the difference? Even with America's tiny improvements it will take decades to reach European levels. China may even race you there by then.
Europe's and America's are headed in.the right direction, but we need to get all nations on the same track.
America is too slow to be meaningful over any relevant timeframe, China is predicted to be leveling off and decreasing soon too.
New coal plants need to be stopped, except to replace an old one. For example, china replacing an old one, with a new one that has full pollution controls AND will only burn the same amount of coal, or less, is great. But that is not what china is doing, and therein lies the problems.
This is exactly what China is doing. China's coal plants are the most efficient in the world. China's capacity is going up but a lot of that capacity will ne
Funnier than that, the idea is that they will buy a Samsung made in Korea instead of an Iphone only assembled in China from parts Made in Korea anyway.
Hundreds of dollars in Korean parts assembled in China for 20 bucks and then China gets the blame for hundreds of dollars of imports when all the money went to Apple and Samsung anyway.
China have already skipped plastic and gone straight to mobile payments. Stick 'China mobile payments' in your favorite search engine and see for yourself. Even beggars/buskers in the street prefer mobile payments.
China also has massive numbers of cameras taking pictures of cars on just about every road you could imagine. And they have lots of cars.
Society already limits it via education. People in educated countries realise it's too expensive to have too many kids so they don't. Even in China, they removed the policy but not as many people as they had anticipated had the second child. It's too expensive and most people are smart enough to realise.
It's not the earnings but the wealth that makes you rich, or a 1%er. And that is far from enough. You'd need around US$ 770,000 in net worth. So your 220,000 house with a mortgage, wouldn't even come close.
So whats the problem troll? Why should you be allowed to cook and keep warm but not China? They have 4 times the people to feed and keep warm, and consume crap.
But they do it much more efficiently than you do, and only use twice the CO2 and not four times.
Yes it cares about total emissions and not lines on a map. Cut China into 4 countries if you like. North China, East China, South China and West China. Nothing else needs to change, same people same pollution. Each new China though is now only producing half the level of the US. So how much are you going ask America to cut, now that it's the most polluting country?
Any way you look at it, Each person in America emit far more than a Chinese person. More than just about everyone in the world in fact.
You're focusing on coal which is prety much irrelevant. It's going down already as you have been repeatedly shown. Even now you are still claiming China is one of the worst, but they are twice as clean as the US and a few other western countries (you're right, it's not just America). If the US is producing twice as much, they have much more slack to cut than China. Energy isn't even the biggest producer of CO2 in the US anymore, thats transport, and it's increasing.
Per capita is not a perfect measure, but it's a much better one than GDP. China's emissions / $ GDP are also falling fast, so I've no idea why you are telling them to do that. They already are.
Seems you just hate coal, and China. You should be applauding them for doing so much more than the US with much less money. They are unlikely to ever reach the per capita emissions that America is at. China's coal use is just temporary, no one sensible thinks China will just use more and more coal forever until they run out of coal.
You still fail to explain why China should be cutting faster and more than America when America is over twice as polluting? Facts are facts, China has over a billion more people than the US.
China has 4 times the population, but only twice the CO2. Even if China went further than your prediction and doubled it's coal use, it would still be less polluting per person than America.
But the fact is China's coal use has alreadypeaked.
It peaked a few years ago, and the coal that is being used now is also being used much more efficiently.
The point is you could turn OFF the same amount of people in China, and it would have even less than half the impact on the environment.
You could turn OFF India and then somehow turn it OFF again, thats 2 billion plus people turned OFF, and it would still have less impact than turning OFF America.
Seems the only people who don't care about per-capita emissions, are people from high per-capita emission countries...
Why do you suppose that is?
Do you expect all countries to have the same emissions irregardless of size?
Is it really realistic to expect China to have a lower level of CO2 than America, when they have over a billion more people?
How is the sticker made? What if you lick the sticker, do you get tongue cancer? Now all those stickers will have to have their own stickers too.
Stickers all the way down.
Slashdot Mirror
First off, you are right that I did NOT speak about Americas increase in Coal exports TO CHINA. It is something that I am opposed to. In addition, it is CHINA'S consumption, not ours.
So If China exports coal, it's China's fault. But if America exports coal, it's also China's fault. Typical WindBourne logic.
China isn't even in the top 5 export destinations for American coal in 2017. It was actually less than 3.5% of your coal exports. So more bullshit from you.
Secondly. pretty funny that you picked an article from EIA about China, which was based on 2015 numbers. The prediction was that coal usage would fall in China.
The article was from September 2017 and the prediction was accurate. If you can find a more recent one show us.
But, it does not. It continues to grow.
Your own link shows China increased only 0.4% in coal use and
However, as a portion of total energy consumption, coal usage fell 1.6 percentage points to 60.4 percent last year, while clean energy, including natural gas and renewables, rose 1.3 percentage points to 20.8 percent from 2016, the communique showed. That indicates the country remains on track to fulfil its promise to decarbonise its economy and reduce air pollution, as it vowed to cut the coal portion to below 58 percent of total energy consumption by 2020.
So it rose 0.4% in one year and is expected to stay flat or drop according to both articles. The opposite of your unsubstantiated claim. And why did you lie earlier and say that China's coal use increased over 5% in 2017?
It slowed down a bit relative to their GDP, but once their GDP growth rate picked up, so did the coal.
Again more lies from you, your own link says
Carbon intensity, the level of carbon emissions per unit of economic growth, dropped by 5.1 percent in 2017 compared to a year ago.
Carbon intensity got 5% better ! In one year !!
Why do you lie and say it was worse?
But the real use of that coal increase, are the EVs that are flowing in. Because China will not quit build new coal plants and instead focus solely on building wind/solar/hydro until they have their nuclear power plants going, then it will be more coal they will use.
You are just making this up, all projectionsshow coal stabilising and/or dropping. You haven't shown any credible evidence that this isn't the case. You still fail to admit that China is replacing less efficient coal plants with newer more efficient ones as has been shown to you repeatedly.
China is building 700 new coal plants in China and around the globe, of the 1600 new ones going up. They are pushing it even in places like Kenya China is builing it with Chinese workers, steel, etc, and 'loaning' money, BUT, in return, Kenya must not only pay for the power plant, but must also buy the coal from China.
Again America exports coal to China = China's fault. China exports coal to Kenya = China's fault. Are you starting to realise how stupid you look?
You really think that this will cut down the CO2 in the future? Nope. This is how you make things WORSE.
Did you even read your link?
Experts say one annual increase
Israel.
Those 2 trolls from China combined would use less CO2 than you do as an American.
You could read the article and find out that what you are saying is complete bullshit. Of course it won't be off grid. Block-chain is just the excuse to turn it back on, block-chain won't be using all the power.
Not in a lot of cases. For example it's better for farmers if they don't let the US back in. Because if the US isn't in, all the other countries will have a price advantage over American farmers.
No. The reason for going with emissions/$, is that neither you nor I decide the co2. Gov and businesses do.
Really? The government forces you to eat steak, drive an SUV, Turn your heating and cooling way up high? Don't make me laugh.
Look until tesla, how many EVs were there in.the world? None of consequences. Heck Prius started after Tesla started their r&D to build out EVs. GM built EV1 to appease California, but Exon killed it. Had it not been for Tesla, we would have no EVs.
China has more electric cars than the US, and also has double the market share % of new electric car sales, and also faster growth of that market share %..
Likewise, it has taken businesses and gov to push solar and wind. You and I did not create the market.
China is massively into solar and wind. Everyone knows this.
So, it comes down to decisions by businesses and gov, not ppl.
Complete bullshit. People choose what they want to do, what they want to consume. How they want to live. What lifestyle they lead.
The only way to push them is via emissions /GDP. They only care about the almighty buck. So, by normalizing on gdp and dropping emissions limit yearly, this forces all gov/businesses to change.
You live in a democracy and are free to spend your money how you like. If you want government to force people and businesses to use less CO2, vote for a government that will make those changes. Have a carbon tax if you like. Seems like a sensible way to put a price on polluting. But people will have to want it, America isn't a dictatorship. People choose not governments. Similarly businesses only do what the government allows them to do (again people) or what will sell in the marketplace, again people choosing to purchase/participate.
As it is, China's emissions are disastrous and America's sux as well. In POF, most of Europe sux as well.
All 3 regions are higher than the world average so I kind of agree here. More needs to be done. But it's unfair to place all of the burden on China where they are a much bigger country and are still climbing up the development ladder. You are still giving rich countries a free pass just because they got rich first. I will still argue only per capita makes sense, as all the things people do add up to the total. More people will do more things, travel, spend, waste, live.
But even if you think per GDP is a useful measure, China is already improving, and improving faster than America or the EU because their economy is growing much faster than the CO2 is increasing. Also America is much worse than Europe even on a per GDP measure. Why is that? Governments, businesses, or people making the difference? Even with America's tiny improvements it will take decades to reach European levels. China may even race you there by then.
Europe's and America's are headed in.the right direction, but we need to get all nations on the same track.
America is too slow to be meaningful over any relevant timeframe, China is predicted to be leveling off and decreasing soon too.
New coal plants need to be stopped, except to replace an old one. For example, china replacing an old one, with a new one that has full pollution controls AND will only burn the same amount of coal, or less, is great. But that is not what china is doing, and therein lies the problems.
This is exactly what China is doing. China's coal plants are the most efficient in the world. China's capacity is going up but a lot of that capacity will ne
So put your vegetables in the freezer.
Just be sure to wear your tinfoil hat when you microwave them afterwards.
Completely correct, South Korea, Taiwan and Japan etc(along with the US) make all the parts and make all the money, but China gets all the blame.
Funnier than that, the idea is that they will buy a Samsung made in Korea instead of an Iphone only assembled in China from parts Made in Korea anyway.
Hundreds of dollars in Korean parts assembled in China for 20 bucks and then China gets the blame for hundreds of dollars of imports when all the money went to Apple and Samsung anyway.
China have already skipped plastic and gone straight to mobile payments. Stick 'China mobile payments' in your favorite search engine and see for yourself. Even beggars/buskers in the street prefer mobile payments.
China also has massive numbers of cameras taking pictures of cars on just about every road you could imagine. And they have lots of cars.
They could make it like Pokémon Go.
Gotta Catch 'Em All
Society already limits it via education. People in educated countries realise it's too expensive to have too many kids so they don't. Even in China, they removed the policy but not as many people as they had anticipated had the second child. It's too expensive and most people are smart enough to realise.
And what is so wrong with One Child policy?
Apart from halving your countries population every generation...
Reality check, no you're not. You need $770k net worth to be in the top 1%.
It's not the earnings but the wealth that makes you rich, or a 1%er. And that is far from enough. You'd need around US$ 770,000 in net worth. So your 220,000 house with a mortgage, wouldn't even come close.
So whats the problem troll? Why should you be allowed to cook and keep warm but not China? They have 4 times the people to feed and keep warm, and consume crap.
But they do it much more efficiently than you do, and only use twice the CO2 and not four times.
Yes it cares about total emissions and not lines on a map. Cut China into 4 countries if you like. North China, East China, South China and West China. Nothing else needs to change, same people same pollution. Each new China though is now only producing half the level of the US. So how much are you going ask America to cut, now that it's the most polluting country?
Any way you look at it, Each person in America emit far more than a Chinese person. More than just about everyone in the world in fact.
You're focusing on coal which is prety much irrelevant. It's going down already as you have been repeatedly shown. Even now you are still claiming China is one of the worst, but they are twice as clean as the US and a few other western countries (you're right, it's not just America). If the US is producing twice as much, they have much more slack to cut than China. Energy isn't even the biggest producer of CO2 in the US anymore, thats transport, and it's increasing.
Per capita is not a perfect measure, but it's a much better one than GDP. China's emissions / $ GDP are also falling fast, so I've no idea why you are telling them to do that. They already are.
Seems you just hate coal, and China. You should be applauding them for doing so much more than the US with much less money. They are unlikely to ever reach the per capita emissions that America is at. China's coal use is just temporary, no one sensible thinks China will just use more and more coal forever until they run out of coal.
You still fail to explain why China should be cutting faster and more than America when America is over twice as polluting? Facts are facts, China has over a billion more people than the US.
China has 4 times the population, but only twice the CO2. Even if China went further than your prediction and doubled it's coal use, it would still be less polluting per person than America.
But the fact is China's coal use has already peaked.
It peaked a few years ago, and the coal that is being used now is also being used much more efficiently.
The point is you could turn OFF the same amount of people in China, and it would have even less than half the impact on the environment.
You could turn OFF India and then somehow turn it OFF again, thats 2 billion plus people turned OFF, and it would still have less impact than turning OFF America.
Seems the only people who don't care about per-capita emissions, are people from high per-capita emission countries...
Why do you suppose that is?
Do you expect all countries to have the same emissions irregardless of size?
Is it really realistic to expect China to have a lower level of CO2 than America, when they have over a billion more people?
Since you were too lazy to rtf article, I guess you will never know.
How is the sticker made? What if you lick the sticker, do you get tongue cancer? Now all those stickers will have to have their own stickers too.
Stickers all the way down.
Face id. Hope you didn't get banged up too much.
There's no warning against putting your dick in the cigarette lighter either*. Some things are just common sense.
* I haven't checked in California.