I don't mean it as an ad hominem. I am concerned that your brain isn't making normal logical connection. have you under the care of a phychiatrist? If not, I suggest getting a consultation.
you are insane. I gave a lot of specific and reasoned feedback on your points, and you brushed everything aside to repeat the same things you said originally. I'm disappointed, because it could have been an interesting discussion.
I think the difference here is video vs. audio. there are a lot of systems so you can put videocameras in your home. it seems that they all omit audio, and this is why.
methinks you're being a bit uncharitable. Here's some riposte:
1. Apple created the encryption to thwart legal warrants.
LIE, Apples encryption was intended to protect consumers, not thwart law enforcement.
you're mischaracterizing. he's arguing that because ios7 already protected customers while providing LEO access via warrant, the net effect of ios8 is the customer gets the same protection and legal warrants are blocked. This is his thesis for the post, which he goes on to support. you can agree or disagree. it's not fair to call it a lie. He never says that apple's aim is to thwart legal warrants.
2. Under the new operating system, however, Apple has devised a way to defeat lawful search warrants.
LIE, Apples encryption does not defeat warrants. Apples encryption removes them as a middle man, but does not defeat the exercise of a warrant in any way shape or form.
again, mischaracterizing. The ios8 encryption thwarts warrants served on apple. LEOs are still free to serve a warrant on the individual target. he says this in the post.
“Unlike our competitors,” Apple’s new privacy policy boasts, “Apple cannot bypass your passcode and therefore cannot access this data.” LIE, Apple is not the only company developing and advertising user controlled encryption.
can you provide support here? what other competitors are saying that they cannot unlock phone encryption for LEOs? link? also, it looks like you're trying to be a little sneaky about a company that is "developing" something vs apple that has already implemented it.
M-1. Warrants will go nowhere, as “it’s not technically feasible for [Apple] to respond to government warrants for the extraction of this data from devices in their possession running iOS 8.”
Misleading. As stated above Apple removes itself as a middle man but does not make execution of warrants impossible.
this makes no sense. you're right that LEO can still serve warrants on the user. Can you elaborate if you are trying to say something else?
M-2. Anyone with any iPhone can download the new warrant-thwarting operating system for free, and it comes automatically with the new iPhone 6.
Misleading. Anyone with a supported Apple device can download and install any upgrade. Apple adding encryption did not change a well established practice.
you're just being nit picky here. what tim said is true. he's hammering home that this encryption change is available to every 4s, 5, 5s, 6 user for free right now. this is as opposed to android, where if something is released in the newest operating system it will likely never trickle down to most older phones.
so, are we good? I look forward to your continued thoughts!
+1 agreed. it's probably better this way. if govt wants access to my phone they can serve me a warrant to take the phone and a warrant for me to give over the pwd. it's like an old fashioned safe. it's not like safe makers built in backdoors into their safes.
For anybody interested, if you want to have an informed opinion of the topic you should read these articles from WaPo (Volokh Conspiracy) and Cato: Orin Kerr, how iOS 8 thwarts lawful warrants, and has some goods and some bads. Series of three articles: [part 1][part 2][part 3].
Cato institute take: link.
the only thing that Kerr doesn't address is the snowden stuff, and how that may justify enhanced apple protections. apparently he thinks this is still too "tinfoil hat" for a deep consideration. whatever.
i read the k/s page, and i know a bit about environmental issues. but I'm not exactly sure where the pollution issue is, or what we'd be testing.
i guess you can test your groundwater for diesel oil contamination. this could be a problem in places that use ground wells for drinking water and have 100 yo houses with underground storage tanks for diesel or heating oil. but in CA this wouldn't apply because our water comes from an aquaduct and is presumably monitored at the wellhead.
i guess if you're freaking out about fracking you could test your tap water. although my understanding is you'd be more at risk for benzene and similar chemicals that may not show up here.
i guess if you live near an old gross polluter you could test to see if its leaking out, but thats just paranoia.
point is, what's the intended market for these thigns? I named some hypotheticals, but hopefully somebody more informed has done a bit of analysis about specific areas of risk that this thing could address.
I'm so over australia. You would think it is a place of independence and freedom, where everybody is like Steve Irwin and crocodile dundee. In fact, it's just another nanny state with totalitarian aspirations. Makes me appreciate the second amendment more and more.
also, consider that apple automatically backs up phones and this isn't even visible when it's happened (no notice box or anything). I'm not sure if its default or not. so celbs may have thought it was local, not in the cloud.
look, it's a generational thing. the younger generation snaps naked selfies. you probably would too if you were a girl that age. dont be so quick to judge.
I'm not convinced this is a "you're holding it wrong" moment. I've seen lots of videos online of people trying to bend the phone as hard as they can and getting no give.
I just hope that with the iphone 7 apple makes a regular size one. otherwise I'll be keeping my 5s for a long time. big phones are for teenagers who can't afford an iphone.
dude, if you have a really long, really thin piece of aluminum and you flex it really hard it might bend. news at 11. what do people expect. it's like blaming apple if the screen cracks when you drop it on concrete or asphalt. hint: don't do that.
I don't know anything about the iOS8 issue. I assume there may have been an effect on 1 or 2 phones, but likely something else was going on. so they pulled it, are checking their ducks, and will release it. nothing to see here.
in the meaintime, I'm left with my iphone 5 because I'm not going to upgrade to one of those novelty large toy phones.
Lol I was just thinking earlier today how google hacked my browser to install unwanted files (ad cookies) on my computer. I'm pretty sure this is the textbook definition of malware. This is the $22m fine referred to in the summary
Slashdot Mirror
but how could companies justify plowing in a whole bunch of cash if they don't have assurances in place that the cash will be recouped?
iowa customers are an iowa company? that doesn't even make sense. unless they only sell to corporate clients incorporated within the state.
My stratege is to not wear pants. Problem solved!
I don't mean it as an ad hominem. I am concerned that your brain isn't making normal logical connection. have you under the care of a phychiatrist? If not, I suggest getting a consultation.
you are insane. I gave a lot of specific and reasoned feedback on your points, and you brushed everything aside to repeat the same things you said originally. I'm disappointed, because it could have been an interesting discussion.
I think the difference here is video vs. audio. there are a lot of systems so you can put videocameras in your home. it seems that they all omit audio, and this is why.
1. Apple created the encryption to thwart legal warrants.
LIE, Apples encryption was intended to protect consumers, not thwart law enforcement.
you're mischaracterizing. he's arguing that because ios7 already protected customers while providing LEO access via warrant, the net effect of ios8 is the customer gets the same protection and legal warrants are blocked. This is his thesis for the post, which he goes on to support. you can agree or disagree. it's not fair to call it a lie. He never says that apple's aim is to thwart legal warrants.
2. Under the new operating system, however, Apple has devised a way to defeat lawful search warrants.
LIE, Apples encryption does not defeat warrants. Apples encryption removes them as a middle man, but does not defeat the exercise of a warrant in any way shape or form.
again, mischaracterizing. The ios8 encryption thwarts warrants served on apple. LEOs are still free to serve a warrant on the individual target. he says this in the post.
“Unlike our competitors,” Apple’s new privacy policy boasts, “Apple cannot bypass your passcode and therefore cannot access this data.”
LIE, Apple is not the only company developing and advertising user controlled encryption.
can you provide support here? what other competitors are saying that they cannot unlock phone encryption for LEOs? link? also, it looks like you're trying to be a little sneaky about a company that is "developing" something vs apple that has already implemented it.
M-1. Warrants will go nowhere, as “it’s not technically feasible for [Apple] to respond to government warrants for the extraction of this data from devices in their possession running iOS 8.”
Misleading. As stated above Apple removes itself as a middle man but does not make execution of warrants impossible.
this makes no sense. you're right that LEO can still serve warrants on the user. Can you elaborate if you are trying to say something else?
M-2. Anyone with any iPhone can download the new warrant-thwarting operating system for free, and it comes automatically with the new iPhone 6.
Misleading. Anyone with a supported Apple device can download and install any upgrade. Apple adding encryption did not change a well established practice.
you're just being nit picky here. what tim said is true. he's hammering home that this encryption change is available to every 4s, 5, 5s, 6 user for free right now. this is as opposed to android, where if something is released in the newest operating system it will likely never trickle down to most older phones.
so, are we good? I look forward to your continued thoughts!
Parcelcopter? I prefer roflcopters.
+1 agreed. it's probably better this way. if govt wants access to my phone they can serve me a warrant to take the phone and a warrant for me to give over the pwd. it's like an old fashioned safe. it's not like safe makers built in backdoors into their safes.
what was the offending line? which article was it from?
For anybody interested, if you want to have an informed opinion of the topic you should read these articles from WaPo (Volokh Conspiracy) and Cato:
Orin Kerr, how iOS 8 thwarts lawful warrants, and has some goods and some bads. Series of three articles: [part 1] [part 2] [part 3].
Cato institute take: link.
the only thing that Kerr doesn't address is the snowden stuff, and how that may justify enhanced apple protections. apparently he thinks this is still too "tinfoil hat" for a deep consideration. whatever.
i read the k/s page, and i know a bit about environmental issues. but I'm not exactly sure where the pollution issue is, or what we'd be testing.
i guess you can test your groundwater for diesel oil contamination. this could be a problem in places that use ground wells for drinking water and have 100 yo houses with underground storage tanks for diesel or heating oil. but in CA this wouldn't apply because our water comes from an aquaduct and is presumably monitored at the wellhead.
i guess if you're freaking out about fracking you could test your tap water. although my understanding is you'd be more at risk for benzene and similar chemicals that may not show up here.
i guess if you live near an old gross polluter you could test to see if its leaking out, but thats just paranoia.
point is, what's the intended market for these thigns? I named some hypotheticals, but hopefully somebody more informed has done a bit of analysis about specific areas of risk that this thing could address.
well what's the reasoning for removing pools? to sideline rogue skinnydippers?
The goal is to "catch" people before they commit a crime
I'm pretty sure i read about that somewhere else...
This is a troll, right? Maybe I don't get the reference.
That's not a knife...
I'm so over australia. You would think it is a place of independence and freedom, where everybody is like Steve Irwin and crocodile dundee. In fact, it's just another nanny state with totalitarian aspirations. Makes me appreciate the second amendment more and more.
Dude have a laugh. Life's too short.
I don't see how this can be practical to have a device so humans can walk like rats.
also, consider that apple automatically backs up phones and this isn't even visible when it's happened (no notice box or anything). I'm not sure if its default or not. so celbs may have thought it was local, not in the cloud.
look, it's a generational thing. the younger generation snaps naked selfies. you probably would too if you were a girl that age. dont be so quick to judge.
I'm not convinced this is a "you're holding it wrong" moment. I've seen lots of videos online of people trying to bend the phone as hard as they can and getting no give.
I just hope that with the iphone 7 apple makes a regular size one. otherwise I'll be keeping my 5s for a long time. big phones are for teenagers who can't afford an iphone.
dude, if you have a really long, really thin piece of aluminum and you flex it really hard it might bend. news at 11. what do people expect. it's like blaming apple if the screen cracks when you drop it on concrete or asphalt. hint: don't do that.
I don't know anything about the iOS8 issue. I assume there may have been an effect on 1 or 2 phones, but likely something else was going on. so they pulled it, are checking their ducks, and will release it. nothing to see here.
in the meaintime, I'm left with my iphone 5 because I'm not going to upgrade to one of those novelty large toy phones.
true but then every time you connect to a wifi network you infect it with Chinese malware. just sayin.
Lol I was just thinking earlier today how google hacked my browser to install unwanted files (ad cookies) on my computer. I'm pretty sure this is the textbook definition of malware. This is the $22m fine referred to in the summary