The difference is that Slashdot is a 'community' (Or we'll say so for the purpose of this argument) and the WAVE is something different entirely. The reasons for having AC's on slashdot are well documented ( although I'm getting damn sick of 99% of them) so I'll tell you why the anonymity in WAVE is bad.
Accountability.
Accusations are going to be made, and they will be taken seriously. These accusations will affect someone's life, and they need to be made and handled responsibly. There should be penalties, and/or safeguards in the event of abuse of the system. It doesn't look like there are any. Ac's don't really affect anything, accountability is sort of a moot point. Any real accusations made by an AC are going to be discredited or ignored unless they can provide some serious non-refutable proof.
"Nor were they impresed by my repeated arguments that every repressive political system in the 20th century -- Nazism, Communism, Fascism, Apartheid -- featured anonymous reporting -- especially by children -- as a cornerstone tool in their efforts to subjugate dissidents. "
I personally think that this is extremely important. Kids don't know any better, for the most part, and make for very effective snitches. They just don't have the ability to make this kind of judgment about their peers. While we're not exactly talking about 'political dissidents', we are talking about a country where free speech is ostensibly a right recognized and protected by the government, and the adoption, by State Governments to put this kind of tool into Public Schools. The point I'm trying so very hard to make is that the parallels aren't that hard to draw, and the more people who do, the worse it looks. I hope that this turns into the P.R. nightmare that it should be.
The WAVE program is using plain-old down-home fear mongering to sell a product. It's not trying to 'protect our children' (A stated motive that should set EVERYONE'S bullshit detectors off).
1) Ralph Reed is being bashed. 2) This is being reported because Ralph Reed is a BIG name in lobbyists, with enormous name regognition. 3) "people who believe in anything not made of silicon" are not by default christian.
http://rootshell.com/docs/berferd_cheswick.ps.gz I'd recommend reading the above for a good write up of this sort of situation. I think it illustrates some of the difficulties in keeping up this charade quite nicely. Notice that the author knows his stuff extremely well, and remeber that when you start thinking about doing this yourself.
John Grisham to finish "lost" Faulkner novel. "I'm sure Bill would have wanted this work finished, and we think Mr. Grisham is the man with the Integrity to do it." Said Faulkners descendants in a prepared statement. "We are also making a killing of the merchandising.", they added.
Microsoft Corp, to release "Directors Cut" of UNIX(tm). Working from notes left by the late Ken Thompson and Dennis Ritchie, Microsoft plans to release UNIX2000, which they say will more closely reflect the legendary programmers original vision. "Petty office politics and a restrictive moral climate never permitted UNIX(tm) to become the stunning work of art that was envisioned by it's creators. We here at Microsoft corp. are dedicated to realizing that vision" said Microsoft pres. Steve Ballmer. UNIX2000 should hit shelves in early '05.
I'm going to recommend Stanislaw Lem's ""Imaginary Magnitude" to anyone who's interested in this sort of thing. Golem XVI (or XIV? I can't remember) shows up throughout the whole book, and is featured prominently in the final section. Basically, in a line of increasingly intelligent military supercomputers, Golem is the last one who will deign to talk to humans, and even that is difficult, not only because it is so much more intelligent than any one person could ever be, but because it's kind of intelligence is so fundamentally different from ours. At one point in this book, one of the more advanced computers has the insight that the idea that a number is equal to itself is a pretty shaky foundation for mathematics, but no one really can understand the implications, except other computers.
I was a little concerned when I noticed who the nominees for 'Favorite Slashdot Poster' were. Only one (boredatwork) was a 'real' slashdot poster. The others are very public personalities who just happen to have slashdot accounts. Name recognition plays a big part, just like any popularity contest. My opinion is that there are at least 10 slashdot posters who are more deserving of the award, whose aliases just aren't very memorable. I find myself recognizing posters by their signatures, for example.
..And if we're going to nominate 'personalities' where the fsck is Alan Cox? His posts have all the qualities I look for in a significant contributor to this community. First and foremost; terseness, but he's well informed and interesting as well.
Compare this to Tom "I know what I want. It's not that, that or that. Come to think of it, I know what you want too" Christianson, and Bruce "Everything I know I learned in 8th grade debate class" Perens.
-nme!
PS Yes, I am a bitch.
Re:Resent those comments! (not represent)
on
A Profile of Coders
·
· Score: 3
Being a sysadmin involves a different kind of madness than being a coder. My day consists of repeatedly being bothered. Seems like the coders' day consists of working on a project, which would probably be easier to get wrapped up in.
-nme!
PS--Know your Sysadmin! http://www.stokely.com/lighter.side/sysadm.field.g uide.html
A lot of us don't know about the great canned food panic of '99(Irresposible speculation, of course, blah blah blah) because we were holed up in beeping data centers, Running Xclock and drinking sparkling apple cider that came in a gift basket from CDW.
I'm a sysadmin at a financial (definitely not one of the largest in the nation) and was directly responsible for "simulated environment" testing. Basically, we copied the accounts database and ran every concievable transaction on it for 5 dates in 2000 (thank you, CUNA). The problems we dicovered were just plain BUGS. We had to use a Beta copy of our vendors Y2K-compliant release, and it was gross. We only found one valid Y2k problem with the database software tha runs our system.
Does your FI do its own software? There's no way I'll ever be able to find out what sort of problems ( if any) were fixed before we got the beta release, and your post piqued my curiosity.
I'm going to take issue with the assertation that the gatherings in large cities were displays of hope, faith in technology, defiance, or optimism.
I'll go with 'Apathy'. I wonder how many people in Times Square (or people who did not stock up at all) were betting on 'someone else' taking care of the problem(s)?
-nme!
PS-- a good point I heard mentioned on NPR was that the Y2K meme showed us that 1) We still don't trust technology 2) The world is extremely connected by that technology. (Sure, maybe you and I knew that, but after tracking midnight as it made it's way across the world, everyone else knows it too.)
Regarding the following incident, as reported by the Crypt News letter (http://sun.soci.niu.edu/~crypt/)
Were you accurately represented? Claims like this one are a little, um 'out there'. What's the skinny on this?
thanks
-nme!
December 20, 1999: In this transcript from ABC World News Tonight entitled "Computer Hackers Could Target Military," news reader Connie Chung stated:
"Computer experts have been worried for some time about a flood of viruses designed to disrupt the nation's computer systems over the new year. The systems may be at far greater risk than most people believe."
Chung continued: "ABC's Kevin Newman has been granted access to a group of elite hackers who usually operate in secret."
Yes, so secret, the well-known group -- The L0pht -- has a website, has appeared in the New York Times Magazine, has appeared before Congress, has appeared . . . well, you get the idea. For a secret group, they sure appear in the media a lot.
The purpose of the interview seemed to be aimed at convincing the viewing audience that "the L0pht" were the masters of the world.
Senator Fred Thompson appeared, acting as "the L0pht's" unpaid press agent: "I'm informed that you think that within thirty minutes the seven of you could make the Internet unusable for the entire nation. Is that correct?"
UNIDENTIFIED [L0pht] HACKER #1: "That's correct. It would definitely take a few days for people to figure out what was going on."
[Sound of Crypt Newsletter channel changer-switching to WWF pro wrestling, where the phonies and bluster are more entertaining.]
**On the other hand, maybe you could accept organized religion on the basis of your experience with Pentecostals. After all, I would hardly call most Pentecostal churches "organized" *grin* ***
No, it was very organized, we had softball leagues and everything. *rimshot*
-nme!
PS but seriously, thanks for sharing your opinion, which I found to be very interesting. peace out.
PS I (Personally) really liked David Lee Roth, but the specific example of an evil Van Halen song was 'Best of Both Worlds' (on 5150, right?), so it looks like I'll be seeing you in hell. What a way to go.
The problem with christians, as it were, is that the people who most people think of as 'christians' are the ones who go around proclaiming it loudly. These are usually the people who are clinging to belief as a sort of life-raft for their identity and are not so concerned with the validity of those beliefs, as long as they feel like they belong. The same thing seems to apply to Wiccans, Packer Fans, etc.
What I'm saying is: I can understand how you'd be annoyed by all this.
disclaimer: When I was young, I went to a Pentacostal Bible camp where they told me that I was going to hell for liking Van Halen (Pre- Sammy, of course) and that homosexuals weren't real people. My subsequent views of organized religion take all of that into account. Also, I didn't proofread, I'm not slamming any group in particular and it's all just my opinion, man.
Slashdot Mirror
Good point.
The difference is that Slashdot is a 'community' (Or we'll say so for the purpose of this argument) and the WAVE is something different entirely. The reasons for having AC's on slashdot are well documented ( although I'm getting damn sick of 99% of them) so I'll tell you why the anonymity in WAVE is bad.
Accountability.
Accusations are going to be made, and they will be taken seriously. These accusations will affect someone's life, and they need to be made and handled responsibly. There should be penalties, and/or safeguards in the event of abuse of the system. It doesn't look like there are any.
Ac's don't really affect anything, accountability is sort of a moot point. Any real accusations made by an AC are going to be discredited or ignored unless they can provide some serious non-refutable proof.
Anyhow, that's the way I see it.
-nme!
"Nor were they impresed by my repeated arguments that every repressive political system in the 20th century -- Nazism, Communism, Fascism, Apartheid -- featured anonymous reporting -- especially by children -- as a cornerstone tool in their efforts to subjugate dissidents. "
I personally think that this is extremely important. Kids don't know any better, for the most part, and make for very effective snitches. They just don't have the ability to make this kind of judgment about their peers. While we're not exactly talking about 'political dissidents', we are talking about a country where free speech is ostensibly a right recognized and protected by the government, and the adoption, by State Governments to put this kind of tool into Public Schools. The point I'm trying so very hard to make is that the parallels aren't that hard to draw, and the more people who do, the worse it looks. I hope that this turns into the P.R. nightmare that it should be.
The WAVE program is using plain-old down-home fear mongering to sell a product. It's not trying to 'protect our children' (A stated motive that should set EVERYONE'S bullshit detectors off).
this is too long of a post.
-nme!
No shit, sherlock. Should we all thank you for your ground-breaking research?
I just thought it was worded well.
-nme!
I've always wondered if they made it to Iscandar. I still get parts of the theme song stuck in my head.
-nme!
I'm sorry, but I think that's hilarious.
'flamebait' indeed.
-nme!
Thanks for posting when I have no moderation points, you jerk.
Committee for the preservation of capitalism? I bet they have an interesting definition of "Capitalism".
-nme!
1) Ralph Reed is being bashed.
2) This is being reported because Ralph Reed is a BIG name in lobbyists, with enormous name regognition.
3) "people who believe in anything not made of silicon" are not by default christian.
I appear to have been trolled.
-nme!
I think that you're confusing Rex Reed with Rex Harrison.
Just you wait 'enry 'iggins.
-nme!
http://rootshell.com/docs/berferd_cheswick.ps.gz
I'd recommend reading the above for a good write up of this sort of situation. I think it illustrates some of the difficulties in keeping up this charade quite nicely.
Notice that the author knows his stuff extremely well, and remeber that when you start thinking about doing this yourself.
-nme!
Is this a service to protect "the children" or is it an opportunity to make some money?
*sigh*. Atleast Pinkerton had the decency to wait a year before milking a tragedy for cash.
-nme!
John Grisham to finish "lost" Faulkner novel.
"I'm sure Bill would have wanted this work finished, and we think Mr. Grisham is the man with the Integrity to do it." Said Faulkners descendants in a prepared statement. "We are also making a killing of the merchandising.", they added.
Microsoft Corp, to release "Directors Cut" of UNIX(tm).
Working from notes left by the late Ken Thompson and Dennis Ritchie, Microsoft plans to release UNIX2000, which they say will more closely reflect the legendary programmers original vision. "Petty office politics and a restrictive moral climate never permitted UNIX(tm) to become the stunning work of art that was envisioned by it's creators. We here at Microsoft corp. are dedicated to realizing that vision" said Microsoft pres. Steve Ballmer. UNIX2000 should hit shelves in early '05.
screaming in horror,
-nme
I'm going to recommend Stanislaw Lem's ""Imaginary Magnitude" to anyone who's interested in this sort of thing. Golem XVI (or XIV? I can't remember) shows up throughout the whole book, and is featured prominently in the final section. Basically, in a line of increasingly intelligent military supercomputers, Golem is the last one who will deign to talk to humans, and even that is difficult, not only because it is so much more intelligent than any one person could ever be, but because it's kind of intelligence is so fundamentally different from ours. At one point in this book, one of the more advanced computers has the insight that the idea that a number is equal to itself is a pretty shaky foundation for mathematics, but no one really can understand the implications, except other computers.
-nme!
You wouldn't know who played, even if I told you. (Me last night: "The Tennesse WHO? The ST. Louis WHAT?? Are you sure this isn't a soccer game?")
A very out-of-the-loop
-nme!
I was a little concerned when I noticed who the nominees for 'Favorite Slashdot Poster' were. Only one (boredatwork) was a 'real' slashdot poster. The others are very public personalities who just happen to have slashdot accounts. Name recognition plays a big part, just like any popularity contest. My opinion is that there are at least 10 slashdot posters who are more deserving of the award, whose aliases just aren't very memorable. I find myself recognizing posters by their signatures, for example.
..And if we're going to nominate 'personalities' where the fsck is Alan Cox? His posts have all the qualities I look for in a significant contributor to this community. First and foremost; terseness, but he's well informed and interesting as well.
Compare this to Tom "I know what I want. It's not that, that or that. Come to think of it, I know what you want too" Christianson, and Bruce "Everything I know I learned in 8th grade debate class" Perens.
-nme!
PS Yes, I am a bitch.
Being a sysadmin involves a different kind of madness than being a coder.
My day consists of repeatedly being bothered. Seems like the coders' day consists of working on a project, which would probably be easier to get wrapped up in.
-nme!
PS--Know your Sysadmin! http://www.stokely.com/lighter.side/sysadm.field.
Aha!
A lot of us don't know about the great canned food panic of '99(Irresposible speculation, of course, blah blah blah) because we were holed up in beeping data centers, Running Xclock and drinking sparkling apple cider that came in a gift basket from CDW.
-nme!
Interesting.
I'm a sysadmin at a financial (definitely not one of the largest in the nation) and was directly responsible for "simulated environment" testing. Basically, we copied the accounts database and ran every concievable transaction on it for 5 dates in 2000 (thank you, CUNA). The problems we dicovered were just plain BUGS. We had to use a Beta copy of our vendors Y2K-compliant release, and it was gross. We only found one valid Y2k problem with the database software tha runs our system.
Does your FI do its own software? There's no way I'll ever be able to find out what sort of problems ( if any) were fixed before we got the beta release, and your post piqued my curiosity.
-nme!
I'm going to take issue with the assertation that the gatherings in large cities were displays of hope, faith in technology, defiance, or optimism.
I'll go with 'Apathy'. I wonder how many people in Times Square (or people who did not stock up at all) were betting on 'someone else' taking care of the problem(s)?
-nme!
PS-- a good point I heard mentioned on NPR was that the Y2K meme showed us that
1) We still don't trust technology
2) The world is extremely connected by that technology. (Sure, maybe you and I knew that, but after tracking midnight as it made it's way across the world, everyone else knows it too.)
Me too. Just me and my big-assed thermos of coffee. All night.
uck.
Happy New year, indeed.
-nme!
Regarding the following incident, as reported by the Crypt News letter (http://sun.soci.niu.edu/~crypt/)
Were you accurately represented? Claims like this one are a little, um 'out there'. What's the skinny on this?
thanks
-nme!
December 20, 1999: In this transcript from ABC World News Tonight entitled "Computer Hackers Could Target Military," news reader Connie Chung stated:
"Computer experts have been worried for some time about a flood of viruses designed to disrupt the nation's computer systems over the new year. The systems may be at far greater risk than most people believe."
Chung continued: "ABC's Kevin Newman has been granted access to a group of elite hackers who usually operate in secret."
Yes, so secret, the well-known group -- The L0pht -- has a website, has appeared in the New York Times Magazine, has appeared before Congress, has appeared . . . well, you get the idea. For a secret group, they sure appear in the media a lot.
The purpose of the interview seemed to be aimed at convincing the viewing audience that "the L0pht" were the masters of the world.
Senator Fred Thompson appeared, acting as "the L0pht's" unpaid press agent: "I'm informed that you think that within thirty minutes the seven of you could make the Internet unusable for the entire nation. Is that correct?"
UNIDENTIFIED [L0pht] HACKER #1: "That's correct. It would definitely take a few days for people to figure out what was going on."
[Sound of Crypt Newsletter channel changer-switching to WWF pro wrestling, where the phonies and bluster are more entertaining.]
This was a movie. It had some special effects, was based on a book and raised some issues. Robin Williams was in it.
C'mon, admit that all you've seen is the trailer.
*smirking*
-nme!
**On the other hand, maybe you could accept organized religion on the basis of your experience with Pentecostals. After all, I would hardly call most Pentecostal churches "organized" *grin* ***
No, it was very organized, we had softball leagues and everything. *rimshot*
-nme!
PS but seriously, thanks for sharing your opinion, which I found to be very interesting. peace out.
Will there be less flames there than here on /.?
-nme!
PS I (Personally) really liked David Lee Roth, but the specific example of an evil Van Halen song was 'Best of Both Worlds' (on 5150, right?), so it looks like I'll be seeing you in hell. What a way to go.
Excellent post. Thank you.
The problem with christians, as it were, is that the people who most people think of as 'christians' are the ones who go around proclaiming it loudly.
These are usually the people who are clinging to belief as a sort of life-raft for their identity and are not so concerned with the validity of those beliefs, as long as they feel like they belong.
The same thing seems to apply to Wiccans, Packer Fans, etc.
What I'm saying is: I can understand how you'd be annoyed by all this.
disclaimer: When I was young, I went to a Pentacostal Bible camp where they told me that I was going to hell for liking Van Halen (Pre- Sammy, of course) and that homosexuals weren't real people. My subsequent views of organized religion take all of that into account.
Also, I didn't proofread, I'm not slamming any group in particular and it's all just my opinion, man.
-nme!
That's not a very accurate description of what Amereican Movie is about.
Go here for a better idea.
-nme!