It's like the firebrigade trying to save your house with flamethrowers.
If you have flamethrowers big enough, this will work, since they use up all the oxygen and the fire in the house will go out. If you have observed some Steven Segal movies, you've seen the same trick on the oil drilling stuff, that's the easiest way to put something out, remove the oxygen.
I suppose you should use something that burns at really low temperatures in that flamethrower, otherwise when the natural oxygen from the environment returns, it will lit up again due to the high temperature. Otherwise, the idea works and works rather well. On paper and in theory.
However for removing the virus scanner, if you bundle this with installing an unix or linux instead of win, the effect will be better.
WTF? An OS installation from restore CDs? Can you tell me where to get vista restore CDs? (or linux ones for that matter?)
that was exactly his point, some laptops (even mine) do not boot regular cd-s that try to turn on acpi&accompanied_crap by default. i need acpi=off to boot any linux installation cd and to choose the disabled acpi version freebsd from the start menu to get the freebsd up. windows cd-s fail, so the only way to "get back" the windows into the machine, is to use the original "restore cd"-s, which also contain windows xp.
since there is obviously no restore cd for vista yet, choosing a laptop as a target machine was a stupid move. and probably you can't tell windows to acpi=off at boot time either. the article author should have tried a normal pc for the start and not jig off with laptops. the naive choice of hardware was accompanied with his naive thought that anything in the pre-beta should be stable in any way.
this problem doesn't apply to exotic laptops only. i have an asus laptop here, the article author had a thinkpad, these are very common machines. operating system has to contain fixes how to overcome some faults of the hardware or firmware shipped with the laptop and pre-betas obviously have more generic things and bugs to sort out than a buggy dsdt of a thinkpad.
you didn't give the db a 'date', but a string. the api itself is flawed if the language can't differ strings and dates (because they are different types and dates can have special effects a'la runtime translation to other timezones etc.)
the mysql `standard` until 5.x was to have crappy unescaped parameters all over the place, let's hope this will improve now. i'm running my own wrappers anyway which emulate the DBI or java.sql like syntax and db specific escaping, so i couldn't care less.
even more, is it just me or did they really take a dual core processor and made singlethreaded benchmarks on it and claimed the results with a proud smile in the face ?
if they'd run 2 quake4's at the same time on the machine, the results would be interesting, but all these benchmarks are just quite worthless from the real life point of view. it is nearly identical cpu with just 2 cores of the logic, why do you expect it to differ in any way (most of the single threaded benchmarks are head-to-head, showing off perhaps 1% difference in performance, which clearly shows that the second core was slapping it's sexy hip while the first one was running it's pants off).
somebody must have mispelled "book commercial" as "presentation".
there's nothing really new in that presentation, most of slashdotters know this stuff already, the only thing that we didn't know as of yet is that you can mispell "book commercial" in such an interesting way.
you can "troll" or "flamebait" my post, but this is the way that it is.
if intel ships a cpu that is _really_ faster than fx and not just in some cumbersome benchmarks, amd will just drop the price.
turion x2 is cheaper than intel's according dual core mobile chip, sempron is cheaper than celeron. and if you haven't checked yet what xeon's cost , go check it out man, you'd be surprised how cheap amd's processors are that have the same performance.
nothing to do with fanboy-ing, i just compare the prices of equal products. some people here are obviously intel fanboys.
hmm, you better scan your machine for spyware and malicious stuff man, my amd turion laptop only turns on the fan when the moon and sun are in a 34.3721 degree angle from earth...
the hype is great, but what exactly does that cpu cost that beats amd ? only twice as much ? wow...
the power for the buck has always been in amd's pocket
users who decide the power usage of a processor by browsing websites and listening to the fan, have always been a joke in the cpu builders corner
apple would have raised the price for the ipod if that would have happened in august (to cover the obvious spendings on patent and lawyer relation), it wouldn't have made that many sales. now creative just waited for them to slam up the bigger profit and are grabbing it now
nothing to do with lawyers or (the absence of) their balls. this is just regular maths and common sense. creative seems to have it.
At first when i saw the title "Women..." I thought i mispelled the url of slashdot, but when i saw that this is in the science section everything became clear.
It takes a slashdotter to perform such researches anyway, everyone else can just get laid.
a) sometimes you have to attend to conference calls on skype or any other conference enabled voip service, because your project partners are very found of that application and they make you use it if you want to stay in the project
b) phonecalls outside the place you are to a foreign place can have more than 10 times different charge rates to the destination that you call to. even here inside the european union, i call my homecountry via skype, because it's far too expensive to make a normal phone call. if i'd talk for 100 minutes, it would be cheaper for me to fly over there to tell the stuff.
if you are a regular slashdotter and you don't have anybody to call, this may not be a problem for you, but if you talk average 500 minutes per month on the phone outside your country, voip owns and regular phone calls just suck. multiply this by the amount of the workers that you have working on international projects and see what you get.
i second that, buffer overflows are waiting for you everywhere. decoding an mpeg-4 stream is quite complicated and an easy glitch means that anything can pop up in the memory just about anywhere.
what's even more tempting, if you manage to hack the original file distributed by WB, you'll get virus out to the users at a blasting speed and since nobody encodes it over again as it's done in the illegal movies world, there's no chance to not to be infected. and since they are forced to use the same buggy player for playback, there's no chance for them to escape it that way either.
how are they planning to do this technically anyway, last time i checked the security model of bittorrent was non-existant. if the data will still be fetched from peer hosts as it's done now, the security of the whole thing is a bliss. see the docs of bittorrent's protocol if you find this hard to believe and try to figure out some ways to exploit it. there are possibilities for that.
my bittorrent is fixed to report an upload ratio 10 times bigger than it really is, to the servers. this means around 4 extra characters into a file in the python client "10*(original value)".
so you are missing the security updates for 3 years on the kernel. way to go dude:D
i second the first reply to your comment. you have to update your gcc from time to time, just to go along with new stuff. this means you are not able to build modules for your old kernel anymore that would be compatible with it. kindof you can fork off the old gcc just for the kernel thing, this will work for a while but probably not forever.
imho many of the builtin items of the kernels (that were specified as (Y), not modules, but are still modules by design and don't make the kernel hardly depend on them) should be reloadable. if i start up the machine from an ide disk and i get an update for the ide/ata channel driver, i should be able to update it without restarting the whole machine, just freeze the associated processes, unhook driver, attach new one, reattach hooks. ofcourse this adds overhead and some complexity, but booting a machine that shouldn't be stopped can be very expensive sometimes.
it depended on the machine you had. my ide/ata interface was broken 3 times in the 2.4.x series... but at least alan was a good fellow and fixed it quickly with the -ac patches;)
i started to use linux quite late, on the 2.2 series... and the 2.4 seemed rather unstable at times. 2.6... the dev. model has changed so much that there isn't really a possibility for a comparision here
i miss -ac series, i miss the stability and i welcome my new freebsd overlord for now, after all it's a choice of a tool that lets you do the work. everyone should pick what they like. if you want to be rock stable, look at 2.2, if you want to bleed the edge and the stability out of it, sit on the latest 2.6, if you are tired of all that mess, you can try freebsd aswell.
ps. tannenbaum, where is your post about how microkernels would prevent all of this ?
Re:wanted: auto variable complete and intellisense
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Vim 7 Released
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a microkernel can indeed be secure enough so that the system doesn't have to reboot for years, with a monolithic kernel and over a million lines of code, this is just a wet dream.
infact, the microkernel if written well enough, can take a lot of updates, including updates to disk drivers or graphics drivers and stuff without restarting the whole system, so far the monolithic kernels have run flat on this feature.
i would give away a few percentages of performance if the system will become more stable and will need less reboots. even bsd and linux boxes need to reboot every once in a while when some kind of new security thing is brought up or a critical fix has been issued, not all drivers can be reloaded even if they are only as modules (probably some hooks go way to deep in the kernel).
however, until we have a nice usable microkernel system around, i'll stick with linux and freebsd, we can't just run our servers and desktops on hurd or minix out of the blue:)
Bumpers protect you against little cars and wild animals, not against jeeps that start with the car body at 2ft high, you can have all the bumpers all over the car, but if a jeep collides into you from the side, it will just cut off your head. And that is the same with current security schemas in computers;)
I just loved the end of the speech "ok and that's the end of it";)
Sounded like somebody whispered to him "get off that stage __NOW__"
Nice speech though, he attacked right into the right problem, the one between the seat and the keyboard. Everything else is just minor.
should turn into a paranoid android now and check what files the binary plugin from sun for java, and the plugin for flash from macromedia actually are doing on my system;)
for the dvd drive, the cost you can scratch from the list, it doesn't cost a dime in these days. however you are right on size and weight, anything smaller than a laptop should not have it. maybe we'll see fully flash disk based notebooks in the near future ? would be really nice.
i was disappointed when i saw the measures of a device. 30x17cm , this is like... erm... almost as big as my laptop, and at the same time if you compare the features and compatibility with other stuff out there (inc. dvd's:p) , the tablet thingy doesn't stand a chance.
if i'd want something portable i'd still go for ipaq, if i want something more it's much safer to go for a laptop, at least it's a safe choice (you know what you get).
ps. i never watch dvd-s on their own, i always rip them at first into the machine and then watch from there, the spinning sound of the modern optical devices just drives you crazy and ruins the film/music.
------- the bastard sold me the laptop without capital letters...
i agree, the pictures in article are in no way something that we can call normal glasses.
the man looks like a 5 feet superfly with enormous goggles.
but now imagine, going to bed with your wife when she is 50, then wearing the glasses and looking at some good old german 'romance' movie wouldn't be that bad at all... at least none can complain about your `performance`, which otherwise would be disabled due to visual conflicts.
Slashdot Mirror
It's like the firebrigade trying to save your house with flamethrowers.
If you have flamethrowers big enough, this will work, since they use up all the oxygen and the fire in the house will go out. If you have observed some Steven Segal movies, you've seen the same trick on the oil drilling stuff, that's the easiest way to put something out, remove the oxygen.
I suppose you should use something that burns at really low temperatures in that flamethrower, otherwise when the natural oxygen from the environment returns, it will lit up again due to the high temperature. Otherwise, the idea works and works rather well. On paper and in theory.
However for removing the virus scanner, if you bundle this with installing an unix or linux instead of win, the effect will be better.
WTF? An OS installation from restore CDs? Can you tell me where to get vista restore CDs? (or linux ones for that matter?)
that was exactly his point, some laptops (even mine) do not boot regular cd-s that try to turn on acpi&accompanied_crap by default. i need acpi=off to boot any linux installation cd and to choose the disabled acpi version freebsd from the start menu to get the freebsd up. windows cd-s fail, so the only way to "get back" the windows into the machine, is to use the original "restore cd"-s, which also contain windows xp.
since there is obviously no restore cd for vista yet, choosing a laptop as a target machine was a stupid move. and probably you can't tell windows to acpi=off at boot time either. the article author should have tried a normal pc for the start and not jig off with laptops. the naive choice of hardware was accompanied with his naive thought that anything in the pre-beta should be stable in any way.
this problem doesn't apply to exotic laptops only. i have an asus laptop here, the article author had a thinkpad, these are very common machines. operating system has to contain fixes how to overcome some faults of the hardware or firmware shipped with the laptop and pre-betas obviously have more generic things and bugs to sort out than a buggy dsdt of a thinkpad.
you didn't give the db a 'date', but a string. the api itself is flawed if the language can't differ strings and dates (because they are different types and dates can have special effects a'la runtime translation to other timezones etc.)
the mysql `standard` until 5.x was to have crappy unescaped parameters all over the place, let's hope this will improve now. i'm running my own wrappers anyway which emulate the DBI or java.sql like syntax and db specific escaping, so i couldn't care less.
even more, is it just me or did they really take a dual core processor and made singlethreaded benchmarks on it and claimed the results with a proud smile in the face ?
if they'd run 2 quake4's at the same time on the machine, the results would be interesting, but all these benchmarks are just quite worthless from the real life point of view. it is nearly identical cpu with just 2 cores of the logic, why do you expect it to differ in any way (most of the single threaded benchmarks are head-to-head, showing off perhaps 1% difference in performance, which clearly shows that the second core was slapping it's sexy hip while the first one was running it's pants off).
somebody must have mispelled "book commercial" as "presentation".
there's nothing really new in that presentation, most of slashdotters know this stuff already, the only thing that we didn't know as of yet is that you can mispell "book commercial" in such an interesting way.
you can "troll" or "flamebait" my post, but this is the way that it is.
the hype article can write what it wants to.
if intel ships a cpu that is _really_ faster than fx and not just in some cumbersome benchmarks, amd will just drop the price.
turion x2 is cheaper than intel's according dual core mobile chip, sempron is cheaper than celeron. and if you haven't checked yet what xeon's cost , go check it out man, you'd be surprised how cheap amd's processors are that have the same performance.
nothing to do with fanboy-ing, i just compare the prices of equal products. some people here are obviously intel fanboys.
hmm, you better scan your machine for spyware and malicious stuff man, my amd turion laptop only turns on the fan when the moon and sun are in a 34.3721 degree angle from earth ...
...
the hype is great, but what exactly does that cpu cost that beats amd ? only twice as much ? wow
the power for the buck has always been in amd's pocket
users who decide the power usage of a processor by browsing websites and listening to the fan, have always been a joke in the cpu builders corner
i can send you a microsoft doc file which describes how minor this flaw is and how bad opensource can be, give me your mail addy
why the hell is the parent marked as flamebait ?
most of his facts are true, unlike the ones that the US government is telling you.
erm, no :)
apple would have raised the price for the ipod if that would have happened in august (to cover the obvious spendings on patent and lawyer relation), it wouldn't have made that many sales. now creative just waited for them to slam up the bigger profit and are grabbing it now
nothing to do with lawyers or (the absence of) their balls. this is just regular maths and common sense. creative seems to have it.
only for united states and canada, as noted by many comments below.
...
could someone include that into the headline please ?
the european telecom leaders started to get heart-attacks 5 seconds ago
At first when i saw the title "Women ..." I thought i mispelled the url of slashdot, but when i saw that this is in the science section everything became clear.
It takes a slashdotter to perform such researches anyway, everyone else can just get laid.
to give you a quick examples
a) sometimes you have to attend to conference calls on skype or any other conference enabled voip service, because your project partners are very found of that application and they make you use it if you want to stay in the project
b) phonecalls outside the place you are to a foreign place can have more than 10 times different charge rates to the destination that you call to. even here inside the european union, i call my homecountry via skype, because it's far too expensive to make a normal phone call. if i'd talk for 100 minutes, it would be cheaper for me to fly over there to tell the stuff.
if you are a regular slashdotter and you don't have anybody to call, this may not be a problem for you, but if you talk average 500 minutes per month on the phone outside your country, voip owns and regular phone calls just suck. multiply this by the amount of the workers that you have working on international projects and see what you get.
we don't care, we don't have to, we are a telecom company
;)
ps. i still don't think they could cut my tunneled voip
i second that, buffer overflows are waiting for you everywhere. decoding an mpeg-4 stream is quite complicated and an easy glitch means that anything can pop up in the memory just about anywhere.
what's even more tempting, if you manage to hack the original file distributed by WB, you'll get virus out to the users at a blasting speed and since nobody encodes it over again as it's done in the illegal movies world, there's no chance to not to be infected. and since they are forced to use the same buggy player for playback, there's no chance for them to escape it that way either.
how are they planning to do this technically anyway, last time i checked the security model of bittorrent was non-existant. if the data will still be fetched from peer hosts as it's done now, the security of the whole thing is a bliss. see the docs of bittorrent's protocol if you find this hard to believe and try to figure out some ways to exploit it. there are possibilities for that.
my bittorrent is fixed to report an upload ratio 10 times bigger than it really is, to the servers. this means around 4 extra characters into a file in the python client "10*(original value)".
cracks against playing in one machine coming in 3...2...1...
so you are missing the security updates for 3 years on the kernel. way to go dude :D
i second the first reply to your comment. you have to update your gcc from time to time, just to go along with new stuff. this means you are not able to build modules for your old kernel anymore that would be compatible with it. kindof you can fork off the old gcc just for the kernel thing, this will work for a while but probably not forever.
imho many of the builtin items of the kernels (that were specified as (Y), not modules, but are still modules by design and don't make the kernel hardly depend on them) should be reloadable. if i start up the machine from an ide disk and i get an update for the ide/ata channel driver, i should be able to update it without restarting the whole machine, just freeze the associated processes, unhook driver, attach new one, reattach hooks. ofcourse this adds overhead and some complexity, but booting a machine that shouldn't be stopped can be very expensive sometimes.
it depended on the machine you had. ... but at least alan was a good fellow and fixed it quickly with the -ac patches ;)
... and the 2.4 seemed rather unstable at times. ... the dev. model has changed so much that there isn't really a possibility for a comparision here
my ide/ata interface was broken 3 times in the 2.4.x series
i started to use linux quite late, on the 2.2 series
2.6
i miss -ac series, i miss the stability and i welcome my new freebsd overlord for now, after all it's a choice of a tool that lets you do the work. everyone should pick what they like. if you want to be rock stable, look at 2.2, if you want to bleed the edge and the stability out of it, sit on the latest 2.6, if you are tired of all that mess, you can try freebsd aswell.
ps. tannenbaum, where is your post about how microkernels would prevent all of this ?
ever tried to press control+n in vim ?
i have to agree on the rebooting thing.
:)
a microkernel can indeed be secure enough so that the system doesn't have to reboot for years, with a monolithic kernel and over a million lines of code, this is just a wet dream.
infact, the microkernel if written well enough, can take a lot of updates, including updates to disk drivers or graphics drivers and stuff without restarting the whole system, so far the monolithic kernels have run flat on this feature.
i would give away a few percentages of performance if the system will become more stable and will need less reboots. even bsd and linux boxes need to reboot every once in a while when some kind of new security thing is brought up or a critical fix has been issued, not all drivers can be reloaded even if they are only as modules (probably some hooks go way to deep in the kernel).
however, until we have a nice usable microkernel system around, i'll stick with linux and freebsd, we can't just run our servers and desktops on hurd or minix out of the blue
Bumpers protect you against little cars and wild animals, not against jeeps that start with the car body at 2ft high, you can have all the bumpers all over the car, but if a jeep collides into you from the side, it will just cut off your head. And that is the same with current security schemas in computers ;)
;)
;)
I just loved the end of the speech "ok and that's the end of it"
Sounded like somebody whispered to him "get off that stage __NOW__"
Nice speech though, he attacked right into the right problem, the one between the seat and the keyboard. Everything else is just minor.
should turn into a paranoid android now and check what files the binary plugin from sun for java, and the plugin for flash from macromedia actually are doing on my system
for the dvd drive, the cost you can scratch from the list, it doesn't cost a dime in these days. however you are right on size and weight, anything smaller than a laptop should not have it. maybe we'll see fully flash disk based notebooks in the near future ? would be really nice.
... erm ... almost as big as my laptop, and at the same time if you compare the features and compatibility with other stuff out there (inc. dvd's :p) , the tablet thingy doesn't stand a chance.
...
i was disappointed when i saw the measures of a device. 30x17cm , this is like
if i'd want something portable i'd still go for ipaq, if i want something more it's much safer to go for a laptop, at least it's a safe choice (you know what you get).
ps. i never watch dvd-s on their own, i always rip them at first into the machine and then watch from there, the spinning sound of the modern optical devices just drives you crazy and ruins the film/music.
-------
the bastard sold me the laptop without capital letters
afaik emule aren't so obviously pushing money out of the system.
:)
there's nothing for the riaa to get from here.
the bear that shared the shit had a different background on this
i agree, the pictures in article are in no way something that we can call normal glasses.
... at least none can complain about your `performance`, which otherwise would be disabled due to visual conflicts.
the man looks like a 5 feet superfly with enormous goggles.
but now imagine, going to bed with your wife when she is 50, then wearing the glasses and looking at some good old german 'romance' movie wouldn't be that bad at all
If it takes an entire developement cycle to simply improve the current version's bugs.
Why would you spend a cycle to _improve_ bugs instead of _fixing_ them ?
----
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