First of all, you're making a strawman of environmentalists -- I've never heard anyone seriously complain that a slow-moving wind turbine might decapitate a passing bald eagle.
He might be making a strawman, but he's not outright lying as you are.
First, the acoustic noise from wind turbines is known to cause the offspring of avians to be generally fucked up: sometimes they'll die before hatching, sometimes they'll be unfunctional, etc.
Second, you're out of your mind when you say that wind turbines are not "slow-moving". Industrial wind turbines rotate at roughly 12 - 30 meters a second. Do your math, that's quite a bit over, say, 30 or 40MPH which would be what I'd guess would be the highest speed a bird of that size might be expected to survive if clipped.
I'm sick and tired of people thinking all these 'green' energy solutions are a cure-all. Sure, they're better than other solutions, but they have disadvantages as well. Most people don't realize it, but wind turbines make living within a couple miles of a turbine pretty shitty. They're ugly, on the horizon constantly, create a lot of noise, etc. And they're very expensive and only last a short period of time before needing replacement - 30 years, I believe. The cost of removing them is also very expensive and detrimental to the environment, as they are composed of cement.
Electric cars are NOT efficient due to the extensive infrastructure required to make and transport the energy. Not only that, but the batteries still need ot be recycled when it's all said and done, and any 'renewable' electricity resources such as wind power are not as renewable as people would like to think, as there is quite a bit of maintanance required.
I've not seen a single windows workstation that runs IE that isn't infected by a worm, spyware, or some other thing, in years. I just don't think it's possible.
I'd like to see the mean instead of the average. That is, I'd like to see how evenly that $155 per purchase is distributed amongst those that make purchases via spam.
I'd be willing to guess that they included all the scams (such as those of Nigerian type) into those figures, and the actual reality is quite different than reported.
Not only that, but what about the 'average made per impression'? Seems pretty ineffective. Seems like you'd piss people off more than anything.
Of course, there's nothing like an objective study, now is there?
Does it not seem at least a little bit ironic to any of you that the "halloween" documents always get sent to the same chap? What reason does anyone have to send the documents to ESR, and not someone else, such as slashdot, groklaw or RMS, even?
Could it not be possible that ESR has simply fabricated them, at least part of the time?
Wonderful! First we'll see this in Elementals, and then eventually this technology will be scaled up so that our soldiers can be full-blown battlemech warriors, as such a setup better suits itself to scaring the shit out of people.
Wow... looks like Asimov's vision of walking, talking home assistants isn't that far off. This robot appears to be fairly similar to what Asimov envisioned in I, Robot (I think it was I, Robot; have a hard time keeping his books differentiated in my mind)
The reason acceptance is realtively minimal is, quite simply, FreeSWAN is a bitch to set up and get working properly.
The configuration is complex, the initial knowledge required to do it is high, and the documentation explaining how FreeSWAN works is negligible - at best. If the documentation had been enough to shake a stick at, then maybe - maybe - we'd have seen significant adoption of it. But it's not.
Too bad I don't have more time. I've been meaning to tackle FreeSWAN and write up some useable documentation for it, too.
Whomever they sue should do this: fire the hot potato right back into SCO's face. Filing a suit now without any factual backing (ie, closure on the IBM case followed by a court ruling upholing SCO's furthre claims about Linux ownership) is nothing short of fraud and a frivilous lawsuit.
Anyone that were to get sued by SCO for this could simply return SCO's notice and alert the attorney general of their state - at least, that's what a small-type shop would do. Hopefully SCO will be that stupid, and the shop that smart.
Ok, then. If he's not calling them plaugerists, then what the hell is he doing? I certainly see his move as - at least! - a big wad of virtual nastyness in the face.
If this is respect, then goddamn, I don't want it.
They don't need to give it away for free to make it open source (or even partially open source).
There are a lot of ways they could get more market share than charging the same amount as MS for a product that has no market name. Almost anything could be better. Here are some ideas:
- sell it for less than MS Office, and give it to schools and individuals at no cost, only charging for commercial use. - 'support' based model - then they wouldn't be concerned about a "new version" and churning out more of the same, which won't win market share, but on the fixing of bugs and adding of wanted features. then users could pay an annual license fee (if they want) in addition to a minimal base cost for the package, and they'd get all the updates, as well as say on what features should see the most attention. - have a 'free' version and a commercial version - simply find a new market for their word processors that isn't completely saturated, ie, Linux and Macs.
Quite simply, Corel could make a lot of money by marketing to the right people and not trying to use a price scheme that only works in monopolistic environments. They're a sad, sad case of horrid and incompetent management.
Too bad employees can't sue management for negligence of responsibilities.
It's science fantasy. If it were science fiction, it wouldn't blatantly ignore things like physics (sound and inertia in space, etc.).
What SW is (at least the original Trilogy) is a good space fantasy epic. Lucas never intended for it to be hard sci-fi, and nobody serious or intelligent would ever compare it to such.
Huh. I don't see how you can say that RedHat and Debian are in the same boat, when they're not even in the same ocean.
As far as who would use such a distribution that offers nothing new to the table, the answer is: Damned near everyone that currently wants to use Debian in work environments but is not allowed to due to the simple fact that the Suits want some sort of Quality Assurance through proxy of a company such as RedHat, or in this case, Progeny. Admins will like this because they'll no longer have to run RedHat to get support, and they'll finally get to use Debian tools as they've been dreaming of for years.
Re: Phantom, that's really not true. We can make some basic assumptions based off of the past philosophy of Ian, his work with Debian, and even with Progeny. We know what he has been trying to move towards. Even still, that's not important: What's important is that there would be a commercial alternative for business other than RedHat that has mettle.
There are thousands of fanboys waking up (or getting ready for bed:P) across America right now that are reading this, and all of them are thinking, "Well, this or that distro already does it!" You've all missed the point.
Has it occured to you that his writing isn't directed towards those of us that already use Linux? Could it be that the founder of Debian would possibly want to make a little money on his toils and ventures by selling his ideas to Suits and PHBs?
No, that couldn't be. Could it?
Yes. (And no, I'm not saying this is a bad thing.)
Stop thinking the world revolves around you (us) and your (our) zealotrous love of your distro. (Particularly you gentoovian freaks with your distcc clusters!:P) Seriously, though. Linux is linux; let's not make a fuss. It's just nice to see a movement away from the techniques of the past - RPM, in particular, which doesn't make custom rollouts terribly easy.
Joe Sixpack never shared his toys with us in grade school (sports balls, frogs), high school (cheerleaders), and college (coeds, frats). What makes you so insistant on saying we should share our toys - and go through so much effort to make them useable by him? He certainly didn't try to give us tact, fashion sense, muscles, or coordination so as to allow us to play with his toys in the past.
Furthermore, if everyone is using Linux, then there'll be less need for administrators. You don't want that.
They're plebeian. I know that's kind of a harsh thing to say, but it's true. Did Goddard make sure that his family all knew how liquid fuel rockets worked? No, of course not. It would be useless knowledge.
I'm an experienced Linux admin of 5 years, and I've set up cups a couple times. I find the KDE (I'm guessing that's what he used, as the dialog sounds similar) printer setup dialog to be a pain in the ass as well. It's poorly designed, overly involved, and quite simply, shit.
Frankly, it's easier to just use lpadmin to add a printer.
ESR needs to get a clue. It's evident by his initial environment description that he's quite out of it in terms of what "Aunt Tillie" will be doing with her computer.
Aunt Tillie will not have multiple systems, let alone have a small personal LAN. She will have a boxed Gateway or Dell that comes preocnfigured with a printer. If she needs anything more done than plugging in cables, she will call you, her dear nephiew/niece, to come "fix her printer" for her.
What's more, most detect such things on install just fine. There's not much of a chance she'd not have her stuff set up physically prior to installing the software, if she ever felt so bold to try Linux.
The only people claiming that Linux is ready for the desktop of mere mortals - or will be anytime soon - need to get out more and meet some common folk. Computers in general aren't really ready for common folk, but they're lucradive enough for companies to sell them, and cool enough to make commoners want them anyway.
- permissions and security implimentation ( I could bitch about this all day) - the registry (make it not break) - the "User" account (or the undocumented APIs), so someone that is running as it can actually run the system properly without getting errors.
That's honestly all I'm hoping for out of Longhorn. I know it's going to be a bloated piece of shit, but hopefully it'll be a bit more manageable.
Definately. I noticed the same thing with Windows 98 and 95; I have no MacOS experience, but I hear it's not as common.
My experience has been that Windows requires a fresh install roughly every 6 months to a year, and MS actually supports that officially (I believe), somewhere on their site.
However, I've also noticed that security updates, patches, and the like make windows increasingly dodgy and run slower. Windows releases seem to be at their stablest roughly 1 year after initial release, before they start concentrating on just security releases and put their man power towards the next release. Even the security patches seem to make the systems slower and less stable, requiring more attention and more frequent reinstalls.
It's less noticeable with 2k and newer, but damn. It was a nightmare with 95/98. I don't know how I ever put up with reinstalling every couple months.
Hrm, those are some valid points; not having much MacOS experience, i didn't take them into consideration. You could probably add "needs to be consistently reinstalled as it breaks itself and runs slowly" to the list.
(Keep in mind that I was trying to be as neutral as possible in my assessment, and, if anything, generous to Windows. There's too much knee-jerk Windows hate around here. Not that it's not valid. Just saying.:P)
My comment about Windows gaming was mainly due to the plethora of games available, not about actual game performance or stability or anything.
I said network integration sucks because it does. Sure, in small situations, it works, most of the time. However, with simply plugging in and going, I've seen a lot of scenarios where certain machines can't be seen. And then, of course, there's the 20 machine limit for Win2k machines. SMB/CIFS just sucks. Browse master negotiation, etc. is just a pain, and rarely works properly.
When I first read the slashdot writeup, I thought, "So, the Roman Catholic Church is taking a political stance againce Microsoft. This should be interesting."
I guess it's because I was just reading about Gibson's The Passion (which the Vatican seems to like, despite it being horrifically violent), and seeing this happen would be really quite funny.:P
You mean, "good in a different way", in that sort of, "needed only by 1% of 1% of the 1% that actually need an MTA of their own" way?
Sendmail, of all things, should not come as the default MTA on most distributions; argueably, somedistros shouldn't even come with sendmail. It's the most bloated, most difficult to configure, and least secure Unix MTA currently available; qmail is even preferable, if you can wade through the configuration.
Er, no, WinXP isn't a good OS. It's a nice GUI, yes. It's also a decent standalone desktop system, and (at least comparably) wonderful for games.
However, it's a shitty OS. It integrates on networks poorly. The underlying implimentation of their permission scheme is screwed up the wazoo. Locking a machine down for the desktop(let's say comparable to a -default- RedHat desktop install) takes a LOT of work and requires a lot of research to figure out how to do in the first place. It has a browser built into the core function of the OS, ffs! (or so they claim - and it is indeed a pain in the ass to rip it out). The list goes on, and on, and on as to why WinXP (or any other windows) is not a good operating system.
Say it's good for mom and pop to hack away email to their kids; say it's good for your porn and games; don't lie and say it's a good OS. (Even still, those things are only true if you don't use Outlook/IE, but it'll suffice for those tasks with about an hour's worth of updating and restarting).
Slashdot Mirror
First of all, you're making a strawman of environmentalists -- I've never heard anyone seriously complain that a slow-moving wind turbine might decapitate a passing bald eagle.
He might be making a strawman, but he's not outright lying as you are.
First, the acoustic noise from wind turbines is known to cause the offspring of avians to be generally fucked up: sometimes they'll die before hatching, sometimes they'll be unfunctional, etc.
Second, you're out of your mind when you say that wind turbines are not "slow-moving". Industrial wind turbines rotate at roughly 12 - 30 meters a second. Do your math, that's quite a bit over, say, 30 or 40MPH which would be what I'd guess would be the highest speed a bird of that size might be expected to survive if clipped.
I'm sick and tired of people thinking all these 'green' energy solutions are a cure-all. Sure, they're better than other solutions, but they have disadvantages as well. Most people don't realize it, but wind turbines make living within a couple miles of a turbine pretty shitty. They're ugly, on the horizon constantly, create a lot of noise, etc. And they're very expensive and only last a short period of time before needing replacement - 30 years, I believe. The cost of removing them is also very expensive and detrimental to the environment, as they are composed of cement.
Electric cars are NOT efficient due to the extensive infrastructure required to make and transport the energy. Not only that, but the batteries still need ot be recycled when it's all said and done, and any 'renewable' electricity resources such as wind power are not as renewable as people would like to think, as there is quite a bit of maintanance required.
only 1 in 20?
I've not seen a single windows workstation that runs IE that isn't infected by a worm, spyware, or some other thing, in years. I just don't think it's possible.
They should redo their study.
I'd like to see the mean instead of the average. That is, I'd like to see how evenly that $155 per purchase is distributed amongst those that make purchases via spam.
I'd be willing to guess that they included all the scams (such as those of Nigerian type) into those figures, and the actual reality is quite different than reported.
Not only that, but what about the 'average made per impression'? Seems pretty ineffective. Seems like you'd piss people off more than anything.
Of course, there's nothing like an objective study, now is there?
Does it not seem at least a little bit ironic to any of you that the "halloween" documents always get sent to the same chap? What reason does anyone have to send the documents to ESR, and not someone else, such as slashdot, groklaw or RMS, even?
Could it not be possible that ESR has simply fabricated them, at least part of the time?
Wonderful! First we'll see this in Elementals, and then eventually this technology will be scaled up so that our soldiers can be full-blown battlemech warriors, as such a setup better suits itself to scaring the shit out of people.
Wow... looks like Asimov's vision of walking, talking home assistants isn't that far off. This robot appears to be fairly similar to what Asimov envisioned in I, Robot (I think it was I, Robot; have a hard time keeping his books differentiated in my mind)
^ He's first.
The reason acceptance is realtively minimal is, quite simply, FreeSWAN is a bitch to set up and get working properly.
The configuration is complex, the initial knowledge required to do it is high, and the documentation explaining how FreeSWAN works is negligible - at best. If the documentation had been enough to shake a stick at, then maybe - maybe - we'd have seen significant adoption of it. But it's not.
Too bad I don't have more time. I've been meaning to tackle FreeSWAN and write up some useable documentation for it, too.
Whomever they sue should do this: fire the hot potato right back into SCO's face. Filing a suit now without any factual backing (ie, closure on the IBM case followed by a court ruling upholing SCO's furthre claims about Linux ownership) is nothing short of fraud and a frivilous lawsuit.
Anyone that were to get sued by SCO for this could simply return SCO's notice and alert the attorney general of their state - at least, that's what a small-type shop would do. Hopefully SCO will be that stupid, and the shop that smart.
Every time SCO threatens a Linux user, God kills a lawyer.
Ok, then. If he's not calling them plaugerists, then what the hell is he doing? I certainly see his move as - at least! - a big wad of virtual nastyness in the face.
If this is respect, then goddamn, I don't want it.
They don't need to give it away for free to make it open source (or even partially open source).
There are a lot of ways they could get more market share than charging the same amount as MS for a product that has no market name. Almost anything could be better. Here are some ideas:
- sell it for less than MS Office, and give it to schools and individuals at no cost, only charging for commercial use.
- 'support' based model - then they wouldn't be concerned about a "new version" and churning out more of the same, which won't win market share, but on the fixing of bugs and adding of wanted features. then users could pay an annual license fee (if they want) in addition to a minimal base cost for the package, and they'd get all the updates, as well as say on what features should see the most attention.
- have a 'free' version and a commercial version
- simply find a new market for their word processors that isn't completely saturated, ie, Linux and Macs.
Quite simply, Corel could make a lot of money by marketing to the right people and not trying to use a price scheme that only works in monopolistic environments. They're a sad, sad case of horrid and incompetent management.
Too bad employees can't sue management for negligence of responsibilities.
Hrm, all of those links appear to be quite dead.
.mov that's actually hosted by that site is only 74 bytes.
And the
Um, Star Wars isn't Science Fiction.
It's science fantasy. If it were science fiction, it wouldn't blatantly ignore things like physics (sound and inertia in space, etc.).
What SW is (at least the original Trilogy) is a good space fantasy epic. Lucas never intended for it to be hard sci-fi, and nobody serious or intelligent would ever compare it to such.
Huh. I don't see how you can say that RedHat and Debian are in the same boat, when they're not even in the same ocean.
As far as who would use such a distribution that offers nothing new to the table, the answer is: Damned near everyone that currently wants to use Debian in work environments but is not allowed to due to the simple fact that the Suits want some sort of Quality Assurance through proxy of a company such as RedHat, or in this case, Progeny. Admins will like this because they'll no longer have to run RedHat to get support, and they'll finally get to use Debian tools as they've been dreaming of for years.
Re: Phantom, that's really not true. We can make some basic assumptions based off of the past philosophy of Ian, his work with Debian, and even with Progeny. We know what he has been trying to move towards. Even still, that's not important: What's important is that there would be a commercial alternative for business other than RedHat that has mettle.
There are thousands of fanboys waking up (or getting ready for bed :P) across America right now that are reading this, and all of them are thinking, "Well, this or that distro already does it!" You've all missed the point.
:P) Seriously, though. Linux is linux; let's not make a fuss. It's just nice to see a movement away from the techniques of the past - RPM, in particular, which doesn't make custom rollouts terribly easy.
Has it occured to you that his writing isn't directed towards those of us that already use Linux? Could it be that the founder of Debian would possibly want to make a little money on his toils and ventures by selling his ideas to Suits and PHBs?
No, that couldn't be. Could it?
Yes. (And no, I'm not saying this is a bad thing.)
Stop thinking the world revolves around you (us) and your (our) zealotrous love of your distro. (Particularly you gentoovian freaks with your distcc clusters!
Joe Sixpack never shared his toys with us in grade school (sports balls, frogs), high school (cheerleaders), and college (coeds, frats). What makes you so insistant on saying we should share our toys - and go through so much effort to make them useable by him? He certainly didn't try to give us tact, fashion sense, muscles, or coordination so as to allow us to play with his toys in the past.
Furthermore, if everyone is using Linux, then there'll be less need for administrators. You don't want that.
They're plebeian. I know that's kind of a harsh thing to say, but it's true. Did Goddard make sure that his family all knew how liquid fuel rockets worked? No, of course not. It would be useless knowledge.
It's not even that.
I'm an experienced Linux admin of 5 years, and I've set up cups a couple times. I find the KDE (I'm guessing that's what he used, as the dialog sounds similar) printer setup dialog to be a pain in the ass as well. It's poorly designed, overly involved, and quite simply, shit.
Frankly, it's easier to just use lpadmin to add a printer.
ESR needs to get a clue. It's evident by his initial environment description that he's quite out of it in terms of what "Aunt Tillie" will be doing with her computer.
Aunt Tillie will not have multiple systems, let alone have a small personal LAN. She will have a boxed Gateway or Dell that comes preocnfigured with a printer. If she needs anything more done than plugging in cables, she will call you, her dear nephiew/niece, to come "fix her printer" for her.
What's more, most detect such things on install just fine. There's not much of a chance she'd not have her stuff set up physically prior to installing the software, if she ever felt so bold to try Linux.
The only people claiming that Linux is ready for the desktop of mere mortals - or will be anytime soon - need to get out more and meet some common folk. Computers in general aren't really ready for common folk, but they're lucradive enough for companies to sell them, and cool enough to make commoners want them anyway.
I digress.
Er, no, they also need to overhaul:
- permissions and security implimentation ( I could bitch about this all day)
- the registry (make it not break)
- the "User" account (or the undocumented APIs), so someone that is running as it can actually run the system properly without getting errors.
That's honestly all I'm hoping for out of Longhorn. I know it's going to be a bloated piece of shit, but hopefully it'll be a bit more manageable.
Definately. I noticed the same thing with Windows 98 and 95; I have no MacOS experience, but I hear it's not as common.
My experience has been that Windows requires a fresh install roughly every 6 months to a year, and MS actually supports that officially (I believe), somewhere on their site.
However, I've also noticed that security updates, patches, and the like make windows increasingly dodgy and run slower. Windows releases seem to be at their stablest roughly 1 year after initial release, before they start concentrating on just security releases and put their man power towards the next release. Even the security patches seem to make the systems slower and less stable, requiring more attention and more frequent reinstalls.
It's less noticeable with 2k and newer, but damn. It was a nightmare with 95/98. I don't know how I ever put up with reinstalling every couple months.
Hrm, those are some valid points; not having much MacOS experience, i didn't take them into consideration. You could probably add "needs to be consistently reinstalled as it breaks itself and runs slowly" to the list.
:P)
(Keep in mind that I was trying to be as neutral as possible in my assessment, and, if anything, generous to Windows. There's too much knee-jerk Windows hate around here. Not that it's not valid. Just saying.
My comment about Windows gaming was mainly due to the plethora of games available, not about actual game performance or stability or anything.
I said network integration sucks because it does. Sure, in small situations, it works, most of the time. However, with simply plugging in and going, I've seen a lot of scenarios where certain machines can't be seen. And then, of course, there's the 20 machine limit for Win2k machines. SMB/CIFS just sucks. Browse master negotiation, etc. is just a pain, and rarely works properly.
When I first read the slashdot writeup, I thought, "So, the Roman Catholic Church is taking a political stance againce Microsoft. This should be interesting."
:P
I guess it's because I was just reading about Gibson's The Passion (which the Vatican seems to like, despite it being horrifically violent), and seeing this happen would be really quite funny.
You mean, "good in a different way", in that sort of, "needed only by 1% of 1% of the 1% that actually need an MTA of their own" way?
Sendmail, of all things, should not come as the default MTA on most distributions; argueably, somedistros shouldn't even come with sendmail. It's the most bloated, most difficult to configure, and least secure Unix MTA currently available; qmail is even preferable, if you can wade through the configuration.
Er, no, WinXP isn't a good OS. It's a nice GUI, yes. It's also a decent standalone desktop system, and (at least comparably) wonderful for games.
However, it's a shitty OS. It integrates on networks poorly. The underlying implimentation of their permission scheme is screwed up the wazoo. Locking a machine down for the desktop(let's say comparable to a -default- RedHat desktop install) takes a LOT of work and requires a lot of research to figure out how to do in the first place. It has a browser built into the core function of the OS, ffs! (or so they claim - and it is indeed a pain in the ass to rip it out). The list goes on, and on, and on as to why WinXP (or any other windows) is not a good operating system.
Say it's good for mom and pop to hack away email to their kids; say it's good for your porn and games; don't lie and say it's a good OS. (Even still, those things are only true if you don't use Outlook/IE, but it'll suffice for those tasks with about an hour's worth of updating and restarting).