Modularization. I don't care what other peoples' palmtops can do. I want modules. Bluetooth. Storage. WiFi. TriCorder. I want the modules small and hard to break. I want them easy to install. I don't want to wait for drivers. I want open specs and the ability to hack.
OK, I'll bite. I built a whitebox 6 months ago Athlon XP 512 megs of ram, geforce Ti4200 128 megs ram, wireless from linksys Nvidia Nforce mobo with 400 fsb. WinXP pro
I start up the computer--new. Outlook doesn't work. Fine that's a Office Suite problem. I can't share my wireless network if I'm hooked up to a router. I have to plug in my cable modem directly to the router because win xp doesn't understand spoofed addresses and MUST have 192.168.0.1 on it's main connection in order to share internet.
Problem two. I swapped out my video card for a all in wonder. I actually had to call microsoft to continue using my own software. BTW MS Office harrassed me to about it too.
Problem 3--anytime I go to bandwidth intensive applications on my windows box, my USB mouse stops working.
Problem 4-- windows can't do three things at the same time. Upon bootup, I can't load my wireless drivers, access the internet or open a web browser at the same time. Infact, I can't do anything without the screen freezing up for about five minutes after my computer starts.
Problem 5 -- internet explorer--need i say more? I'm used to tabbed browsing. I'm used to automatic pop up blocking. I've not had a site take over my computer for quite a long while with firefox/mozilla.
Problem 6--dvd authoring takes about twice as long on the windows box.
You might say that the combination of hardware and software I have is the problem. I would counter that i purchased all products that were made for windows xp. I should not have problems if I want them all to work together.
More info. ON this same box, seperate harddrive I run 3 flavors of linux (testing purposes) all three--suse, fedora and gentoo run without a hitch. all the hardware. from initrd to gdm, only about thirty seconds.
Dell doesn't offer OOo. They do offer the works suite (which will get you similar funtionality). They also offer WinDVD blah blah. So they can simulate an iLife package. I did some research. For your buck, HP probably has the best software package w/its systems. Apple a close second, and Dell third. Gateway doesn't come close. Dell also has wordperfect producttivity suite, but they don't offer a PIM like outlook or iCal. You just can't compare them. I've office x for the mac and i still use mail, ical and isync. It's just simpler and better (my opinion of course).
The free software analogy isn't too good. There is no quality photo suite that works out of the box and supported like iphoto (gphoto) dvd authoring for linux? None free. Cybermedia offers one. Not cheap. I can get all this software for my Mac free too. So I just don't understand your argument. Are we talking about what comes with the computer, or what I can get with a 50/month broadband connection?
BTW. I was listening to the GOP Convention/Campaign IT director on the radio today. Uses a powerbook and open office. Says that it works just fine. (he just got finished telling everyone that for practical reasons the department of homeland security used windows even though it was less secure, but that those like him with technical skills might prefer open office).
I think you misunderstand me. The facts in the argument are, if not verifiable, reasonable accurate. The flaw in your argument is in the context. For instance. If I say boy, it's ninety degrees outside to day, and you counter oh yeah, well if you weren't wearing pants then you wouldn't feel so hot, then obviously you've taken the original argument out of it's intended context in order to prove a point. It's a common mistake that many (i myself) make from time to time. If we want to argue about less features, then fine. If we want to argue about something else other than the price of the iMac compared to a $300 dollar system, fine. I'm not. You must argue in the context given you. If not, it's not an arguement, it's simply two people stating opinions about incongrous topics.
For instance--how efficient would it be to compare a Camary and a Tempo? The comparision would be surface level at best. Comparision connotes parities within two products.
>>A 1300 dollar computer will last you about three years tops.
This is a non event. I was referring to black box PC. I'm talking about a system that requires everyday use. I can make a computer last forever If I use it for two hours every month. If I use a Dell everyday for 3 years, I'll be in a world of hurt. I've proof on my desktop now. The USB ports are falling out. The fan is hideously noisy, the agp slot has a short. This is after almost four years of consistent use. My iBook, other than the known flaw, is still as quiet as ever, plus, as I've noted before is being replaced as we speak. Oh, yeah. about the same price in computer dollars as my Dell and Ibook (2000 dollars in 2001 for my Dell 1499 in late 2001 for my ibook)
Why are we even having this discussion? It seems that we more or less agree? Only on/. can you argue with someone who agrees with you.
A simple comparison you take two similar things and look at both similarities and dissimilarities. The more similarities you have, the more refined your comparision must be.
I could say . ..apples taste better than rocks. I'd be right, but not very helpful.
I could say . . . apples taste better than oranges. OK, both fruits both sweet--I could compare them and get away with it. But if I say . . . Granny Smith apples taste better than Macintosh apples, then I have a granular comparision and have to start comparing texture, color, sweetness, etc. Obviouly the last comparison gives more relavant information although all three comaprisons were right.
It's not a free G4. I empathise with you. I paid for Apple care. I asked for insurance against defects beyond the warranty, and got it. It's not much of a treat they gave me but what I deserve because of what I paid. I like the fact that they didn't squirel out of it, and I appreciate their courtesy regarding it, but I have to say that I didn't expect less.
A couple of things. I asked politely if there was any policy regarding returns. Then I asked if there was any way that they could possibly return it. They asked me how long I had been without my ibook due to inoperability and repair time. I told them the time and then told them that it wasn't significant to me. I'm sure that their managers have discretion so maybe you should talk to them again. I can't guarantee that anything good will happen. I just had a nice experience with them.
A valid, if somewhat flawed argument. You can't take out features when talking about features. You can't say that A Ford Tempo is better than a Toyota Camary. You'd have to compare a Ford Tempo with a Toyota Corolla. Outside the context of having an equivalent Black Box, the iMac delivers more value. I would have to beg to differ on your Pricing ratio. If I purchase a PC for 200 dollars, it will be worth absolutley nothing (resale value) within one year, and nothing of use within one year. I agree, if more time than that, bonus. I will agree that a 400-600 dollar PC will last two years. However, after two years, you will sell it for about 100 dollars, if you don't part it out. A 1300 dollar computer will last you about three years tops. Those are the breaks. After four years, it's value decreases significantly. After four years, your Apple will still be half its value, and still be able to run new software made for modern systems. That 200 won't get you much anyway. You'll have to pay extra for an professionaly supported office suite, you won't get dvd playback or a photo suite. These are standard options--not extra features that people don't use on their computers at home. I won't get into fault tolerance, energy consumption, processing accuracy error checking disk integrity heat dissipaiton, noise reduction. There is no comparision. I'm not saying apple is perfect. I've said as much in subsequent posts. I'm simply saying that the new iMac is an exceptional value compared with today's computers with comparable features.
There is also no practical difference between a Porche and a Subaru on a road with a speed limit of 65. That doesn't mean that if I could get the Porche for a small percentage more than the Subaru I wouldn't take the porche.
My tech support experiences with Dell have been mixed. I've had both qualified and incompetent tech support persons on the other end of the phone. My experience with Apple has been mediocre. I asked for a replacement when the logic board happened a second time and the agent on the line was a complete jerk (he kept on saying 'ok this is what we can do for you', prefacing the fact that he was going to do absolutely nothing for me). When it came down to it I liked Apple's better. Both my computers (Dell and Apple) had significant problems with the motherboard, both replaced them quickly, (Dell had a couple of problems with it's hard drive). When push came to shove, my computer was dying and it was still under warranty. Dell was not willing to do anything and stalled until the warranty wore out. I paid 2000 for the computer and a top of the line support option. It wasn't worth it. For a litmus test I showed the new imac to my wife (she doesn't care one way the other about Macs, in fact out of all our PCs at home, she uses a whitebox the most, but she saw that and said that she'd like one (less clutter, more style and at an affordable price). This all comes down to my final impression of Apple. When the chips were down, Apple pulled through and kept their word. When the chips were down on my Dell, I was ignored and sacrificed to keep their bottom line. I made my decision to stop buying Dells then. I still recommend them as the least expensive option out of the Big 3 but I caveat with the fact that if their computer gets broken, their service is less than mediocre at best.
So are you going to discuss the meat of the comment or just talk about semantics. I meant that any of the main 3 PC manufacturers around today. We'll not discuss whitebox manufacturers because--1. there are too many 2. the majority cannot offer the same amount of support (probably Alienware would be one exception) White boxes just don't have the infrastructure to handle the kind of repair program that is efficient and cost effective. I speak from experience.
It's as inexpensive as a IBM clone and worth more in value.
As an aside, this weekend I called apple care to get my logic board on my G3 Ibook replaced for the third time. I wasn't pleased, and I asked for a new one. Guess what? They're shipping a new Ibook G4 1gz for me. That's service. Barring the fact that the hard ware was faulty, they really came through on this one. That's why I buy apple.
Pvt. England is the one being arraigned in a military court to see if she will face a court marshall for her role in the Abu Grhaib prison inmate abuse.
There is a United White College Fund. It's called Alumni. It's called Daughters of the American Revolution. It's called the Masons. Oh, those aren't programs to help whites? Just because it isn't in the charters doesn't mean that 99.9 percent of those programs go to white recipients.
It's not racist to own up to mistakes of the past. I'm not talking about reparations, I'm talking about starting out on even footing. The truth is anyone who whines about being white middle class male has got some pretty big blinders on. If you can't make money being from a white middle class family and you're a male, then something's wrong with you.
More white middle class males go to college than any other group period.
More white middle class males make six figure salaries than any other group period.
If you're a white middle class male, you aren't likely to get pulled over for driving a fancy car or a car with out of state plates.
If you're name is Phillip or Jonathan and not Rahsaan or Jamaal, your name will not be ignored in a list of applications.
If you have an American accent (read white mid western) you already have someone on the other end of the phone who believes you.
I'm not saying that things are so much better than they were even twenty years ago for minorities in this country. I'm not even saying that anyone owes anyone else anything. It's just time to own up to realities that the white male in america is far from being endangered . Just ask any state legislature. Just ask the united states senate. Just ask any CEO. Who is in charge?
Don't panic anytime others want a piece of the prosperity that was unjustly denied for so long. That includes Blacks, Women, Gays, Latinos, Disabled persons and so on. Where I'm from we don't say 'I screwed up, get over it' We say 'I made a mistake, what can I do to make it better?'
That doesn't mean money. That means when Jamaal wants an interview, treat him the same as Walter. When Sally gets assertive about that top broker position at Smith and Barney, she's not an ice queen or a bitch, she's competition. That means that a latino or a black shouldn't have to dress up in sunday best to go shopping just to reduce the chance of being survielled or to increase the chance of being waited on. It means all those things. It means when someone says or does something demeaning to another person that we don't quietly turn away or excuse their behavior. We can understand them, we can empathise with their frustration and feelings, but we can't let them get away with thinking that hatred or discrimination is socially acceptable.
On one point I think we can agree. No need to defend gangters. There are other worthwhile causes to support that don't involve feeling sorry for people who commit drive-bys and gang rapes.
You sound like you might be familiar to a Parliamentary election. United states has an electoral college which was quite practical for its time. That way each state by itself could (through the will of it's people) voice its opinion regarding its favorite canditate. It is a compromise between pure democracy and representative democracy, which traditionally is always the case in the US. In a parliamentary democracy, you have the first round--they might be candidates or parties which win either a simple majority (fifty percent plus one) or a plurality (more votes than any other candidate) go to a second round. The second round is used form coalitions to shore up support from the other factions (therefore, theoretically forming a stronger more moderate and compromising legislature) and supporting a Prime Minister who is favored by the majority. In a parlimentary election, the person or party who wins in the first round of elections is not guaranteed to win the Prime Ministry in the second round. Although some countries have resolved this paradox by granting electoral power to the legislative body, and the party that has the most popular votes gets the most seats in the legislative/electoral body and so can chose the P.M of their choice.
In America, it's different. We've evolved into a two party system, which some theorize is more stable because the coalitions don't break apart over crisis and the leadership and government cannot be dissolved by parliament, but only by the electorate (except in extreme cases like criminal wrong doing) With less factions, there is also less chance of paralysis do to infighting (although a hefty part of our government is set up to paralyze the powers) Elections are handled by a general populace election. In EACH STATE not NATIONALLY the canditate must win a plurality of votes (more than any other candidate). If the candidate wins the popular vote IN THAT STATE then he can send his (or the party's) hand picked delegates (the electoral college) to chose him IN THAT STATE as the president. The person wins the most votes from the electoral college (the number go delegates to the e.c from each state is determined by population) wins the election. Therefore, Al Gore might have won more votes, but did not win more states and so lost the election. Very complicated. most Americans have a hard time explaining it to you.
It is also possible that the electoral college can chose some one other than the person who won the plurality of votes in the state. Eg. If Ross Perot ran for Florida but did not win the state, George Bush Sr. Delegates could theoretically vote for Ross Perot anyway: the delegates are not (theoretically) automatons although traditionally they have consistently voted according to the will of the people).
There is only one thing that is holding back ebook from being adopted, and that is the fact that they aren't being introduced as an incentive. An ebook is an afterthought for most people, an unacceptable alternative to a real book.
If publishers started to give out a CD that had their book on it (the publishing proofs would be best) along a purchased book (along with a nominal fee of a couple dollars tacked on to the price of the book or even free) people would equate an ebook with a purchase and with a real product equal to a book. That way they'd have both a hard copy and a copy that was transferrable to a harddrive or a portable device.
I haven't seen this happen (excepting technical manuals) in the publishing business. That would really give me (and I think many others) an incentive to try out ebooks and get hooked on them. Then they can start selling them seperately if they see any profit in them.
You are so right. We're using the same technology that Princess Lea used to secret a message to Ben Kenobi and Death Star plans inside R2D2. What did she use? 210mm diameter, 21mm diameter hole, 2.1mm thick
Whether you actually think it was a long time ago, or you are into relativistic time our past or our future is dominated by the CD/DVD format.
I apologize for the rudeness. I agree. Name calling reveals my low character. Sorry bout that.
Luddite I am not--as evinced by my treo 180 ( a luddite would say that a cellphone should only be used as a cellphone)
My opinion stands--a website is broken if it takes too long to load on a 56k modem. Browsing is adequate on a 28k modem. You'd be surprised how much bottleneck is in the browser and not the connection. Processor and memory quality have much to do with it too.
Since you are a long time hobbyist, you must remember when you could get all the content you needed off the bbs system. My contention is this--has the quality of the content improved drastically enough to merit paying twice as much for what is essentially text? Since I'm not allowed to stream movies or play games or download massive files on the system -- i'm relegated to doing things I can do on 56k--that is listen to the radio and read. The reasons i purchased broadband are these. I don't think they are inconsistent with others who are on the web 1. play bandwidth intensive games 2. stream video and music 3. download software like operating systems and productivity programs 4. video conference
So . . . what of these things can I do on the 'broadband' that verizon is offering in this program? The question is not about them not providing bandwidth. The question is about them selling and marketing more bandwidth and then preventing use of bandwidth intensive applications
If I buy a yacht, I want to go sailing. I don't want it to sit in the harbor collecting mold. If I buy broadband, I want to use broadband applications, not be limited to the same applications that I could have used with my 56k line.
on the contrary -- web browsing and email reading has become so efficient that I could surf the web on my treo 180 (you know the one with the 33mhz proc) and read my email from a eudora email client. if you need more than a standard computer to surf the web and more than a 28.8 modem, your computer is in terrible shape.
I can even watch flash presentation with 56k. the small programs that I "need" to surf the web (java, flash etc) can either be avoided (note web content is not java-flash dependent, web candy is) or downloaded over time if absolutely crucial, not worth the money for a one-time download. That I would pay up to five times more for a broadband connection to surf and check mail is an insult to a consumer.
To further your broken analogy, how about paying billions of dollars for a new freeway only to find out that it's good for nothing except riding bicycles. Later to find out that the contractors tricked you into funding its overhyped construction by not divulging the details of it's limited use.
You've bought into the marketroids hook line and sinker. By the way I've got this awsome Dell I want to get rid of dual 3.2 ee pentium proc 1 gig of ram windows xp professional edition, gigabit ethernet ati radeon 9800 --only $5000 dollars. you can surf the web with it anytime.
Don't worry. If it catches on at all, other companies will gladly pay licensing fee for the patent and then have to eat the cost as more and more people make projectors that use the 'black' screen. That's the way patents are supposed to work--that way those that do the work get paid and others can benefit from the work for a price.
Patents aren't the same in computer land. In computerland a patent is a weapon with which to kill your competition with fees prevent them from building on the tools you created either by prohibitive cost of entry or though litigation. Because software is 'easy' to manufacture with little cost of entry economies of scale make it economically 'iffy' for companies who might sell at most a few thousand licenses.
With hardware manufacturing, economies of scale allow those that own the patents to charge percentages of cents or cents on the dollar for their innovation and still make a profit. Patents are a reality that work when applied properly. I happen to like patents. I happen not to like patent mills or patent abuse.
Happened to me once. My brother in law worked for a Large Multinational Bank and he new that I liked old computer junk. So he gave me a bunch of old 2/3/486 computers that were surplused from his job. They gave them to him because they didn't know how to get rid of them. Here was the catch . . . they didn't even format the things
So I had their FedEx programs, account numbers, their in-house banking programs and a sweet little windows 3.1 interface. Needless to say I disposed of the information properly. But I told my brother in law. He said "Oh, really" and just forgot about it. Go figure.
It is far too easy for those who would take advantage of sensitive information to exploit it for their own gain. They are quite fortunate someone like me got their hard drives and not someone bent on robbing them blind.
I theoretically agree with what people say about fuel subsidy. It is a greed motivated practice that is not perpetuated in the public interest. I ask you this question--would you be the generation willing to sacrifice your lifestyle to make it happen?
some things that will happen because of high food prices: higher cost of food and essential services. higher cost for information technology--including internet higher cost for clothing, heating houses, etc. ..
these things will not go up on small margins--they will go up by magnitudes. It's a double whammy--increase the cost of fuel, the cost of doing business, rises, infrastructure cost rises etc. . . and the demand for less fuel intensive activities go up, so will the cost of these activities (etc telecommuting urban housing organic farming clean water, etc)
so you have a economic crisis larger than ever felt in the world. those who live in poverty will include the middle class because the things that make middle class will not exist (cheap housing, cheap food, cheap transport, expendable income, free time) there will be those that control the fuel and then those who are destitute. the truth is the only smart way to get rid of dependence on oil is to find a substitue for oil that can be put into the economy and then distributed freely to everyone. guess how it's going to happen? FUEL SUBSIDIES! think that hydrogen/sun/wind/water companies will be any less eager to maintain their government mandated cash cow? I think the phrase is 'damned if you do, dammned if you don't'. there will never be any true progress toward fuel reform, because there will never be any real talk about how to manage the crisis that pulling our fuel safety net out from under the world will cost. there is no polititian with the courage to implement this change and there is no generation willing to sacrifice to make it happen. Isn't it ironic? the only way to change the world is through self-sacrifice. . . something that we have deprecated over the years to negligible significance. Oh well. Live and never learn.
Well not to get into an argument of words but "all but surpassed" is correct. What it is saying is that Open Source Desktop has equaled the quality and usability of the Proprietary Desktop and is close but not quite surpassing it. "Sur" meaning "Over" and "Pass" . . . well you get the meaning. To put into words that geeks understand, opensource desktops have acheived windows and are *approaching* windows *plus* one.
It did happen just as I said it. Yes, apple does have responsibility. They were charging me for an item that they knew I never received. Yes, mnba did cancel the order as part of their fraud department. Yes it was as difficult to work with either of them. No, it was not fedex's fault. As far as I can tell, MBNA called Apple to tell them to stop the order without first verifying with me that it was a legit order. NEither of them contacted me by telephone ot confirm the order. I obviously don't know all the details. I don't know how they logisitcally did it. I'm not privy to their procedures. All I know is that MBNA initiated a return and then proceeded to charge me interest on something that they themselves returned to apple. All I know is that no one knew where the package was and that apple knew that it wasn't in my possession but still insisted on charging it to my account. The only one who can come out clean here (besides me I only ordered a product that was never sent to me) is fedex unless we've gotten to the point that we blame the messenger (or the delivery guy) for following orders. The order was on time and properly traced up to the point that MBNA caused the order to be returned. So does that clear it up for you?
I purchased a G5 through Apple last year at Christmas time. I customized it and all, blah blah blah. Because I had moved to a new state in the meantime, MBNA cancelled the order and had it shipped back to apple the day it was supposed to arrive It just suddenly appeared on the tracking information that the package was to be returned. After fighting wiht MBNA for about an hour, I finally decided to just let them win and sever my relationship with them. I'd just go and get a Mac in a couple of months instead of getting it on credit. The problem was NO ONE KNEW WHERE THE PACKAGE WAS. Not fedex, not MBNA, not Apple, and they refused to credit my account until they found out where it was. Nevermind that I wasn't the one who returned it, they were holding me liable for a product that I never received. Apple and MNBA were particularly nasty about it saying that they could do nothing. They kept claiming that they would not charge me for something that I never received, but when I asked them to credit my account, they were still adamant about not crediting it to my account. For a full month, NO ONE KNEW WHERE THE 3000 USD computer was. Apple still refused to credit my account even though they couldn't find the computer. MBNA was STILL CHARGING ME INTEREST telling me not to worry everything was all right. Needless to say I no longer want a G5 and I no longer want to do business with MBNA. I learned an important lesson that day. Even potentially loayal customers do not have a chance in this environment. I went back to building my own PC, where at least I have less risk of losing money and I control my own tech support. It may be more work, but I don't have to beg Corporations to be reasonable each time I have a legitimate grievance with them.
Thanks for the heads up! I just called and cancelled myself. The great thing was I didn't have any money in that account so they were unsuccessful trying to take money out!
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Modularization. I don't care what other peoples' palmtops can do. I want modules. Bluetooth. Storage. WiFi. TriCorder. I want the modules small and hard to break. I want them easy to install. I don't want to wait for drivers. I want open specs and the ability to hack.
Any takers?
OK, I'll bite. I built a whitebox 6 months ago Athlon XP 512 megs of ram, geforce Ti4200 128 megs ram, wireless from linksys Nvidia Nforce mobo with 400 fsb. WinXP pro
I start up the computer--new. Outlook doesn't work. Fine that's a Office Suite problem. I can't share my wireless network if I'm hooked up to a router. I have to plug in my cable modem directly to the router because win xp doesn't understand spoofed addresses and MUST have 192.168.0.1 on it's main connection in order to share internet.
Problem two. I swapped out my video card for a all in wonder. I actually had to call microsoft to continue using my own software. BTW MS Office harrassed me to about it too.
Problem 3--anytime I go to bandwidth intensive applications on my windows box, my USB mouse stops working.
Problem 4-- windows can't do three things at the same time. Upon bootup, I can't load my wireless drivers, access the internet or open a web browser at the same time. Infact, I can't do anything without the screen freezing up for about five minutes after my computer starts.
Problem 5 -- internet explorer--need i say more?
I'm used to tabbed browsing. I'm used to automatic pop up blocking. I've not had a site take over my computer for quite a long while with firefox/mozilla.
Problem 6--dvd authoring takes about twice as long on the windows box.
You might say that the combination of hardware and software I have is the problem. I would counter that i purchased all products that were made for windows xp. I should not have problems if I want them all to work together.
More info. ON this same box, seperate harddrive I run 3 flavors of linux (testing purposes) all three--suse, fedora and gentoo run without a hitch. all the hardware. from initrd to gdm, only about thirty seconds.
Don't fool yourself. WIndows is a nightmare.
Dell doesn't offer OOo. They do offer the works suite (which will get you similar funtionality). They also offer WinDVD blah blah. So they can simulate an iLife package. I did some research. For your buck, HP probably has the best software package w/its systems. Apple a close second, and Dell third. Gateway doesn't come close. Dell also has wordperfect producttivity suite, but they don't offer a PIM like outlook or iCal. You just can't compare them. I've office x for the mac and i still use mail, ical and isync. It's just simpler and better (my opinion of course).
The free software analogy isn't too good. There is no quality photo suite that works out of the box and supported like iphoto (gphoto) dvd authoring for linux? None free. Cybermedia offers one. Not cheap. I can get all this software for my Mac free too. So I just don't understand your argument. Are we talking about what comes with the computer, or what I can get with a 50/month broadband connection?
BTW. I was listening to the GOP Convention/Campaign IT director on the radio today. Uses a powerbook and open office. Says that it works just fine. (he just got finished telling everyone that for practical reasons the department of homeland security used windows even though it was less secure, but that those like him with technical skills might prefer open office).
I think you misunderstand me. The facts in the argument are, if not verifiable, reasonable accurate. The flaw in your argument is in the context. For instance. If I say boy, it's ninety degrees outside to day, and you counter oh yeah, well if you weren't wearing pants then you wouldn't feel so hot, then obviously you've taken the original argument out of it's intended context in order to prove a point. It's a common mistake that many (i myself) make from time to time. If we want to argue about less features, then fine. If we want to argue about something else other than the price of the iMac compared to a $300 dollar system, fine. I'm not. You must argue in the context given you. If not, it's not an arguement, it's simply two people stating opinions about incongrous topics.
/. can you argue with someone who agrees with you.
.apples taste better than rocks. I'd be right, but not very helpful.
For instance--how efficient would it be to compare a Camary and a Tempo? The comparision would be surface level at best. Comparision connotes parities within two products.
>>A 1300 dollar computer will last you about three years tops.
This is a non event. I was referring to black box PC. I'm talking about a system that requires everyday use. I can make a computer last forever If I use it for two hours every month. If I use a Dell everyday for 3 years, I'll be in a world of hurt. I've proof on my desktop now. The USB ports are falling out. The fan is hideously noisy, the agp slot has a short. This is after almost four years of consistent use. My iBook, other than the known flaw, is still as quiet as ever, plus, as I've noted before is being replaced as we speak. Oh, yeah. about the same price in computer dollars as my Dell and Ibook (2000 dollars in 2001 for my Dell 1499 in late 2001 for my ibook)
Why are we even having this discussion? It seems that we more or less agree? Only on
A simple comparison you take two similar things and look at both similarities and dissimilarities. The more similarities you have, the more refined your comparision must be.
I could say . .
I could say . . . apples taste better than oranges. OK, both fruits both sweet--I could compare them and get away with it.
But if I say . . . Granny Smith apples taste better than Macintosh apples, then I have a granular comparision and have to start comparing texture, color, sweetness, etc.
Obviouly the last comparison gives more relavant information although all three comaprisons were right.
It's not a free G4. I empathise with you. I paid for Apple care. I asked for insurance against defects beyond the warranty, and got it. It's not much of a treat they gave me but what I deserve because of what I paid. I like the fact that they didn't squirel out of it, and I appreciate their courtesy regarding it, but I have to say that I didn't expect less.
A couple of things. I asked politely if there was any policy regarding returns. Then I asked if there was any way that they could possibly return it. They asked me how long I had been without my ibook due to inoperability and repair time. I told them the time and then told them that it wasn't significant to me. I'm sure that their managers have discretion so maybe you should talk to them again. I can't guarantee that anything good will happen. I just had a nice experience with them.
A valid, if somewhat flawed argument. You can't take out features when talking about features. You can't say that A Ford Tempo is better than a Toyota Camary. You'd have to compare a Ford Tempo with a Toyota Corolla. Outside the context of having an equivalent Black Box, the iMac delivers more value. I would have to beg to differ on your Pricing ratio. If I purchase a PC for 200 dollars, it will be worth absolutley nothing (resale value) within one year, and nothing of use within one year. I agree, if more time than that, bonus. I will agree that a 400-600 dollar PC will last two years. However, after two years, you will sell it for about 100 dollars, if you don't part it out. A 1300 dollar computer will last you about three years tops. Those are the breaks. After four years, it's value decreases significantly. After four years, your Apple will still be half its value, and still be able to run new software made for modern systems. That 200 won't get you much anyway. You'll have to pay extra for an professionaly supported office suite, you won't get dvd playback or a photo suite. These are standard options--not extra features that people don't use on their computers at home. I won't get into fault tolerance, energy consumption, processing accuracy error checking disk integrity heat dissipaiton, noise reduction. There is no comparision. I'm not saying apple is perfect. I've said as much in subsequent posts. I'm simply saying that the new iMac is an exceptional value compared with today's computers with comparable features.
There is also no practical difference between a Porche and a Subaru on a road with a speed limit of 65. That doesn't mean that if I could get the Porche for a small percentage more than the Subaru I wouldn't take the porche.
:)
(ok, maybe i wouldn't)
My tech support experiences with Dell have been mixed. I've had both qualified and incompetent tech support persons on the other end of the phone. My experience with Apple has been mediocre. I asked for a replacement when the logic board happened a second time and the agent on the line was a complete jerk (he kept on saying 'ok this is what we can do for you', prefacing the fact that he was going to do absolutely nothing for me). When it came down to it I liked Apple's better. Both my computers (Dell and Apple) had significant problems with the motherboard, both replaced them quickly, (Dell had a couple of problems with it's hard drive). When push came to shove, my computer was dying and it was still under warranty. Dell was not willing to do anything and stalled until the warranty wore out. I paid 2000 for the computer and a top of the line support option. It wasn't worth it. For a litmus test I showed the new imac to my wife (she doesn't care one way the other about Macs, in fact out of all our PCs at home, she uses a whitebox the most, but she saw that and said that she'd like one (less clutter, more style and at an affordable price). This all comes down to my final impression of Apple. When the chips were down, Apple pulled through and kept their word. When the chips were down on my Dell, I was ignored and sacrificed to keep their bottom line. I made my decision to stop buying Dells then. I still recommend them as the least expensive option out of the Big 3 but I caveat with the fact that if their computer gets broken, their service is less than mediocre at best.
So are you going to discuss the meat of the comment or just talk about semantics. I meant that any of the main 3 PC manufacturers around today. We'll not discuss whitebox manufacturers because--1. there are too many 2. the majority cannot offer the same amount of support (probably Alienware would be one exception) White boxes just don't have the infrastructure to handle the kind of repair program that is efficient and cost effective. I speak from experience.
It's as inexpensive as a IBM clone and worth more in value.
As an aside, this weekend I called apple care to get my logic board on my G3 Ibook replaced for the third time. I wasn't pleased, and I asked for a new one. Guess what? They're shipping a new Ibook G4 1gz for me. That's service. Barring the fact that the hard ware was faulty, they really came through on this one. That's why I buy apple.
Pvt. England is the one being arraigned in a military court to see if she will face a court marshall for her role in the Abu Grhaib prison inmate abuse.
There is a United White College Fund. It's called Alumni. It's called Daughters of the American Revolution. It's called the Masons. Oh, those aren't programs to help whites? Just because it isn't in the charters doesn't mean that 99.9 percent of those programs go to white recipients.
It's not racist to own up to mistakes of the past. I'm not talking about reparations, I'm talking about starting out on even footing. The truth is anyone who whines about being white middle class male has got some pretty big blinders on. If you can't make money being from a white middle class family and you're a male, then something's wrong with you.
More white middle class males go to college than any other group period.
More white middle class males make six figure salaries than any other group period.
If you're a white middle class male, you aren't likely to get pulled over for driving a fancy car or a car with out of state plates.
If you're name is Phillip or Jonathan and not Rahsaan or Jamaal, your name will not be ignored in a list of applications.
If you have an American accent (read white mid western) you already have someone on the other end of the phone who believes you.
I'm not saying that things are so much better than they were even twenty years ago for minorities in this country. I'm not even saying that anyone owes anyone else anything. It's just time to own up to realities that the white male in america is far from being endangered . Just ask any state legislature. Just ask the united states senate. Just ask any CEO. Who is in charge?
Don't panic anytime others want a piece of the prosperity that was unjustly denied for so long. That includes Blacks, Women, Gays, Latinos, Disabled persons and so on. Where I'm from we don't say 'I screwed up, get over it' We say 'I made a mistake, what can I do to make it better?'
That doesn't mean money. That means when Jamaal wants an interview, treat him the same as Walter. When Sally gets assertive about that top broker position at Smith and Barney, she's not an ice queen or a bitch, she's competition. That means that a latino or a black shouldn't have to dress up in sunday best to go shopping just to reduce the chance of being survielled or to increase the chance of being waited on. It means all those things. It means when someone says or does something demeaning to another person that we don't quietly turn away or excuse their behavior. We can understand them, we can empathise with their frustration and feelings, but we can't let them get away with thinking that hatred or discrimination is socially acceptable.
On one point I think we can agree. No need to defend gangters. There are other worthwhile causes to support that don't involve feeling sorry for people who commit drive-bys and gang rapes.
You sound like you might be familiar to a Parliamentary election. United states has an electoral college which was quite practical for its time. That way each state by itself could (through the will of it's people) voice its opinion regarding its favorite canditate. It is a compromise between pure democracy and representative democracy, which traditionally is always the case in the US. In a parliamentary democracy, you have the first round--they might be candidates or parties which win either a simple majority (fifty percent plus one) or a plurality (more votes than any other candidate) go to a second round. The second round is used form coalitions to shore up support from the other factions (therefore, theoretically forming a stronger more moderate and compromising legislature) and supporting a Prime Minister who is favored by the majority. In a parlimentary election, the person or party who wins in the first round of elections is not guaranteed to win the Prime Ministry in the second round. Although some countries have resolved this paradox by granting electoral power to the legislative body, and the party that has the most popular votes gets the most seats in the legislative/electoral body and so can chose the P.M of their choice.
In America, it's different. We've evolved into a two party system, which some theorize is more stable because the coalitions don't break apart over crisis and the leadership and government cannot be dissolved by parliament, but only by the electorate (except in extreme cases like criminal wrong doing) With less factions, there is also less chance of paralysis do to infighting (although a hefty part of our government is set up to paralyze the powers) Elections are handled by a general populace election. In EACH STATE not NATIONALLY the canditate must win a plurality of votes (more than any other candidate). If the candidate wins the popular vote IN THAT STATE then he can send his (or the party's) hand picked delegates (the electoral college) to chose him IN THAT STATE as the president. The person wins the most votes from the electoral college (the number go delegates to the e.c from each state is determined by population) wins the election. Therefore, Al Gore might have won more votes, but did not win more states and so lost the election. Very complicated. most Americans have a hard time explaining it to you.
It is also possible that the electoral college can chose some one other than the person who won the plurality of votes in the state. Eg. If Ross Perot ran for Florida but did not win the state, George Bush Sr. Delegates could theoretically vote for Ross Perot anyway: the delegates are not (theoretically) automatons although traditionally they have consistently voted according to the will of the people).
There is only one thing that is holding back ebook from being adopted, and that is the fact that they aren't being introduced as an incentive. An ebook is an afterthought for most people, an unacceptable alternative to a real book.
If publishers started to give out a CD that had their book on it (the publishing proofs would be best) along a purchased book (along with a nominal fee of a couple dollars tacked on to the price of the book or even free) people would equate an ebook with a purchase and with a real product equal to a book. That way they'd have both a hard copy and a copy that was transferrable to a harddrive or a portable device.
I haven't seen this happen (excepting technical manuals) in the publishing business. That would really give me (and I think many others) an incentive to try out ebooks and get hooked on them. Then they can start selling them seperately if they see any profit in them.
You are so right. We're using the same technology that Princess Lea used to secret a message to Ben Kenobi and Death Star plans inside R2D2. What did she use? 210mm diameter, 21mm diameter hole, 2.1mm thick
Whether you actually think it was a long time ago, or you are into relativistic time our past or our future is dominated by the CD/DVD format.
I apologize for the rudeness. I agree. Name calling reveals my low character. Sorry bout that.
Luddite I am not--as evinced by my treo 180 ( a luddite would say that a cellphone should only be used as a cellphone)
My opinion stands--a website is broken if it takes too long to load on a 56k modem. Browsing is adequate on a 28k modem. You'd be surprised how much bottleneck is in the browser and not the connection. Processor and memory quality have much to do with it too.
Since you are a long time hobbyist, you must remember when you could get all the content you needed off the bbs system. My contention is this--has the quality of the content improved drastically enough to merit paying twice as much for what is essentially text? Since I'm not allowed to stream movies or play games or download massive files on the system -- i'm relegated to doing things I can do on 56k--that is listen to the radio and read.
The reasons i purchased broadband are these. I don't think they are inconsistent with others who are on the web
1. play bandwidth intensive games
2. stream video and music
3. download software like operating systems and productivity programs
4. video conference
So . . . what of these things can I do on the 'broadband' that verizon is offering in this program? The question is not about them not providing bandwidth. The question is about them selling and marketing more bandwidth and then preventing use of bandwidth intensive applications
If I buy a yacht, I want to go sailing. I don't want it to sit in the harbor collecting mold. If I buy broadband, I want to use broadband applications, not be limited to the same applications that I could have used with my 56k line.
on the contrary -- web browsing and email reading has become so efficient that I could surf the web on my treo 180 (you know the one with the 33mhz proc) and read my email from a eudora email client. if you need more than a standard computer to surf the web and more than a 28.8 modem, your computer is in terrible shape.
I can even watch flash presentation with 56k. the small programs that I "need" to surf the web (java, flash etc) can either be avoided (note web content is not java-flash dependent, web candy is) or downloaded over time if absolutely crucial, not worth the money for a one-time download. That I would pay up to five times more for a broadband connection to surf and check mail is an insult to a consumer.
To further your broken analogy, how about paying billions of dollars for a new freeway only to find out that it's good for nothing except riding bicycles. Later to find out that the contractors tricked you into funding its overhyped construction by not divulging the details of it's limited use.
You've bought into the marketroids hook line and sinker. By the way I've got this awsome Dell I want to get rid of dual 3.2 ee pentium proc 1 gig of ram windows xp professional edition, gigabit ethernet ati radeon 9800 --only $5000 dollars. you can surf the web with it anytime.
It doesn't rule out using the connection for general web browsing and email, which is probably all that 95% of their target market want anyway
you don't need broadband to surf the net or to read email.
Don't worry. If it catches on at all, other companies will gladly pay licensing fee for the patent and then have to eat the cost as more and more people make projectors that use the 'black' screen. That's the way patents are supposed to work--that way those that do the work get paid and others can benefit from the work for a price.
Patents aren't the same in computer land. In computerland a patent is a weapon with which to kill your competition with fees prevent them from building on the tools you created either by prohibitive cost of entry or though litigation. Because software is 'easy' to manufacture with little cost of entry economies of scale make it economically 'iffy' for companies who might sell at most a few thousand licenses.
With hardware manufacturing, economies of scale allow those that own the patents to charge percentages of cents or cents on the dollar for their innovation and still make a profit. Patents are a reality that work when applied properly. I happen to like patents. I happen not to like patent mills or patent abuse.
Happened to me once. My brother in law worked for a Large Multinational Bank and he new that I liked old computer junk. So he gave me a bunch of old 2/3/486 computers that were surplused from his job. They gave them to him because they didn't know how to get rid of them. Here was the catch . . . they didn't even format the things
So I had their FedEx programs, account numbers, their in-house banking programs and a sweet little windows 3.1 interface. Needless to say I disposed of the information properly. But I told my brother in law. He said "Oh, really" and just forgot about it. Go figure.
It is far too easy for those who would take advantage of sensitive information to exploit it for their own gain. They are quite fortunate someone like me got their hard drives and not someone bent on robbing them blind.
I theoretically agree with what people say about fuel subsidy. It is a greed motivated practice that is not perpetuated in the public interest. I ask you this question--would you be the generation willing to sacrifice your lifestyle to make it happen?
.
some things that will happen because of high food prices:
higher cost of food and essential services.
higher cost for information technology--including internet
higher cost for clothing, heating houses, etc. .
these things will not go up on small margins--they will go up by magnitudes. It's a double whammy--increase the cost of fuel, the cost of doing business, rises, infrastructure cost rises etc. . . and the demand for less fuel intensive activities go up, so will the cost of these activities (etc telecommuting urban housing organic farming clean water, etc)
so you have a economic crisis larger than ever felt in the world. those who live in poverty will include the middle class because the things that make middle class will not exist (cheap housing, cheap food, cheap transport, expendable income, free time) there will be those that control the fuel and then those who are destitute. the truth is the only smart way to get rid of dependence on oil is to find a substitue for oil that can be put into the economy and then distributed freely to everyone. guess how it's going to happen? FUEL SUBSIDIES! think that hydrogen/sun/wind/water companies will be any less eager to maintain their government mandated cash cow? I think the phrase is 'damned if you do, dammned if you don't'. there will never be any true progress toward fuel reform, because there will never be any real talk about how to manage the crisis that pulling our fuel safety net out from under the world will cost. there is no polititian with the courage to implement this change and there is no generation willing to sacrifice to make it happen. Isn't it ironic? the only way to change the world is through self-sacrifice. . . something that we have deprecated over the years to negligible significance. Oh well. Live and never learn.
Well not to get into an argument of words but "all but surpassed" is correct. What it is saying is that Open Source Desktop has equaled the quality and usability of the Proprietary Desktop and is close but not quite surpassing it. "Sur" meaning "Over" and "Pass" . . . well you get the meaning. To put into words that geeks understand, opensource desktops have acheived windows and are *approaching* windows *plus* one.
It did happen just as I said it. Yes, apple does have responsibility. They were charging me for an item that they knew I never received. Yes, mnba did cancel the order as part of their fraud department. Yes it was as difficult to work with either of them. No, it was not fedex's fault. As far as I can tell, MBNA called Apple to tell them to stop the order without first verifying with me that it was a legit order. NEither of them contacted me by telephone ot confirm the order. I obviously don't know all the details. I don't know how they logisitcally did it. I'm not privy to their procedures. All I know is that MBNA initiated a return and then proceeded to charge me interest on something that they themselves returned to apple. All I know is that no one knew where the package was and that apple knew that it wasn't in my possession but still insisted on charging it to my account. The only one who can come out clean here (besides me I only ordered a product that was never sent to me) is fedex unless we've gotten to the point that we blame the messenger (or the delivery guy) for following orders. The order was on time and properly traced up to the point that MBNA caused the order to be returned. So does that clear it up for you?
I purchased a G5 through Apple last year at Christmas time. I customized it and all, blah blah blah. Because I had moved to a new state in the meantime, MBNA cancelled the order and had it shipped back to apple the day it was supposed to arrive It just suddenly appeared on the tracking information that the package was to be returned. After fighting wiht MBNA for about an hour, I finally decided to just let them win and sever my relationship with them. I'd just go and get a Mac in a couple of months instead of getting it on credit. The problem was NO ONE KNEW WHERE THE PACKAGE WAS. Not fedex, not MBNA, not Apple, and they refused to credit my account until they found out where it was. Nevermind that I wasn't the one who returned it, they were holding me liable for a product that I never received. Apple and MNBA were particularly nasty about it saying that they could do nothing. They kept claiming that they would not charge me for something that I never received, but when I asked them to credit my account, they were still adamant about not crediting it to my account. For a full month, NO ONE KNEW WHERE THE 3000 USD computer was. Apple still refused to credit my account even though they couldn't find the computer. MBNA was STILL CHARGING ME INTEREST telling me not to worry everything was all right. Needless to say I no longer want a G5 and I no longer want to do business with MBNA. I learned an important lesson that day. Even potentially loayal customers do not have a chance in this environment. I went back to building my own PC, where at least I have less risk of losing money and I control my own tech support. It may be more work, but I don't have to beg Corporations to be reasonable each time I have a legitimate grievance with them.
Thanks for the heads up! I just called and cancelled myself. The great thing was I didn't have any money in that account so they were unsuccessful trying to take money out!
THIS ECONOMIC DOWNTURN IS GREAT!