I'm now 100% secure in saying the moderating system is complete bullshit. I express an honest dissenting opinion about the community and it gets labeled flamebait and therefore is censored because it loses exposure. My comment was never intended or toned as a comment intended on starting a flame war. I don't insult anyone or any single thing, I commented on the group as a whole. If you fucking disagree with what I say, post a reply (not anonymously like a coward) and make it worth my time to read it. Don't regurgitate Apple bullshit in my face and accept me to believe it. Don't use moderation to express your disagreement, to censor me and then hide behind it.
Not an anti-Apple troll, I'm trying to shine an objective light in a dark subjective room. I agree that the timing is very suspicious and it might actually hurt Tiger Direct if they get a settlement. it would make sense for Tiger Direct to wait until Tiger is well past it's initial stride. A more solid dollar amount can be written. No matter how depicable I think the timing is, a judge should still hear the case. I think that, shouldn't another rational thinking person believe along those same lines? I was sick of everyone siding with Apple like they are perfect and everyone else is so imperfect and the constant fucking appreciation for a company is sickening. I like the car manufacturer that made my car, I love driving it above any other car but I don't think they cannot do no wrong.
There's so much fucking adulation you apple fanboys have with Apple. Apple is the white knight in pinstripe armor and they cannot do any wrong? So what if Tiger Direct purposely waited until the day before to file, it's their choice. As long as they are within the statute of limitations, they are free to bring charges whenever they want. You people are so brainwashed by how awesome Apple is that you simply cannot fathom Apple doing anything wrong. You rationalize anything that can be misconstrued as being detrimental to Apples image and ferociously attack anyone that tries to say otherwise. Luckily a judge will hear the case, one that isn't so incredibly biased like you people are. Give it a rest.
I'm reserving my judgement until Longhorn is on the shelves as to how it'll actually turn out. No use in wild speculation this far from the release date.
Other countries deny extraditions if the person the United States wants extradited is convicted of a capital crime and will be killed. Another country doesn't want to hand over a captured bird into the hands of it's executioner. Sometimes the DA will agree not to kill the prisoner, as long as they come back and face the punishment for life in prison or something.
Just wait until tomorrow where there will be at least an article that Tiger actually arrives, maybe some more reactionary articles later to something else. I'm kind of amazed this much hoopla is thrown for an upgrade. With Tiger, OS X remains basically the same. A couple things are changed or are faster and everyone here treats it as the second coming. I'm many times more interested in how Longhorn ends up because it's supposed to be a bigger change from XP than Tiger is from Jaguar. It's supposed to be as big of a change as Windows 95.
Is this more of a result of Tiger being first to market? Most of those things listed have already been in both OS's for a long time, save for 64-bit support. Head start or not, there's still a significant cost to change platforms between Microsoft and Apple and I'm not just talking about the often-complained-about price of Apple systems. There's learning curves to deal with, support when things go wrong (Yes, I know it's hard news to take, OS X isn't perfect) and more.
I'm interested in seeing what Microsoft ends up with after the time spent on Longhorn. Microsoft touted Longhorn to be the biggest jump in operability since Windows 95. Nobody can deny that Longhorn will be a bigger jump than Tiger will be to Apple fanboys. I just hope Apple fanboys will get off the "Microsoft is copying us" chip on their shoulder and interpret whatever they feel Microsoft copies from them as endorsements for their first decisions.
That's the thing, fresh college grads expect to make the crazy money right out of college, but the market simply cannot support that concept. I'm going to graduate in 2 weeks and I have no expectations about making a job in my field (computer engineering) at the average starting salary for grads ($52k). I expect to enter into a ladder-style career. Yeah, I may get a crap job that I'm overqualified for, but I can get the experience the job gives me, then I can shoot for the moon and get the great job later after I've spent some time in the working world.
On a more grand scale, this phenomena is why the US is outsourcing and it's not even bound to college grads either. Teenagers these days want to make the easy cash or not even try and jobs go unfulfilled. Employers can't afford to pay the kind of money these people want so they find someone who will work for the money, enter foreigners that have a lower cost of living. There's just no honor in the afterschool McDonalds job anymore.
Rape someone and get off better than a file-swapper?
What a dumb premise...
I guess you and your parent left out that little bit about registering as a sex offender. What do you think your chances are finding employment if your potential employer finds out your past? Would you rather choose your past as being convicted and a short stint in a prison for stealing a movie, or being convicted and after a short stint in a prison and registering in every state you eventually live in as a sex offender?
I seriously doubt everyone but religous prudes believe that these laws stop people having sex. It perhaps makes them regret it later when their girlfriends crazy parents come along and press charges but it doesn't stop shit.
I live in the state of Virginia where the age of consent is 18. I've known some people that were 18 and had a 17 year old boyfriend/girlfriend that although they are less than a year apart, by law, they still would be comitting a crime. The law either scared them into stopping having sex for that period of time where or just went ahead and just kept it under wraps and sometimes the parents find out and then get restraining orders and whatnot. If anything, it makes people under the age of 18 to take a second and think about it. With something as serious as sex, taking a second and taking sex seriously, you should either want to fully commit or change your mind.
I can tell you right now that as soon as children start going through puberty they are going to be interested in sex.
When I went through puberty, sure I was interested in sex but that doesn't mean I knew what was best for me sexually. What's better, not to have any really enforced laws and let the depravity of people like pedophiles go relatively unpunished, or have laws that punish the sexual abusers?
Don't even get me started about contributing members of society, as soon as you start paying taxes (15 in your country IIRC) you should have the right to get a leg up.
15 and paying taxes? Is that from sales tax on plastic beach toys? From what I hear, you only start paying income tax (a substantial amount of money) whenever you earn above a certain amount of money, not based on age. I agree that you should have a leg up when you pay taxes, but if you earn enough money to pay income tax then you should be responsible enough to be having sex legally.
To summerize, those laws do nothing to stop people from having sex and those who believe they do are fooling themselves. If anything they would stop girls telling their mothers that the condom broke and they need a morning after pill.
I think the laws seperate the people that respect the laws and those who don't. Your explanation of your society where you live sounds nice but your laws are written in accordance with the behavior of your society. In America, we are still relatively a big salad bowl (not a melting pot because people are still different and distinct, we aren't melted together yet) and this is the laws we came up with to govern the people of our society. Who's to say your laws (or even values) would work with our people and vice versa. I think you should pare your argument to that point because it is an important distinction.
... 17, in many, many, countries this is exceeding the age of consent so its either saying that american girls are typically more innocent then the rest of the world, or the people running the show in your country are a bunch of prudes.
... or the fact that our (American) society expects people under the age of consent not to be having sex. We aren't trying to be prudes or whatever warped reality you think we have, it's the level of society we've built for ourselves. In America, we all agree that girls and boys that are 15 years old should not be having sex, rather they should be having a full childhood. Once they mature as contributing members of society, then they inherit the freedom to be with who they want to be with (granted it's not with an underage individual, of course). Americans, both as children and adults see 15 year old girls and boys as children that go to school, participate in extracurricular activities and play sports, not exploring their sexual potential. When one particular American sees the latter, we punish those people and very few people (outside of NAMBLA and related organizations) disagree.
It's fine if in Slovakia or whatever country you actually reside in (if it's different from where your email account is hosted) that your laws have a different age of consent because that's the society that has developed and I respect that. I'm asking, on behalf of the United States, for the same of respect for our laws in this regards.
Hard drives are so cheap that you can just destroy the hard drive with a drill press. Afterall, they say construction workers that demolish buildings have the highest job satisfaction, you can get your own taste of that.
I was wondering why the guy in MD has to have them but I'll ask you too...
Why?
Do you crave the cloying adulation people give you when you dazzle them with rarely-seen currency? Do you also pass around $.50 coins too?
I don't know what's worse, some poor Best Buy employee not up to date on his currency or people like you that just have to have $2 and nothing else. $1 and $5 are for the peons, it's $2 bills or nothing, eh? If loved ones give you fullscreen DVD's, do you feign enthusiasm and then later toss the perfectly good movie in the trash because it's widescreen or nothing, right?
In the end it comes down to what do I dislike more, a cashier less than completely aware of all United States currency denominations or individuals such as yourself that inconvenience yourself and the bank you inconvenience just so perfect strangers can have one of your lucky special elite $2 bills. I can spend 5 seconds with the cashier and let him in on the secret, I don't know how long it would take to fix the latter.
I'm also very upset over this. I've always said that if they ported Red Orchestra to HL2 and gave the DoD dev team some competition, then the dev team will get off their collective asses and release it. Then they have the nerve to do a Beta test of DoD:S just to jerk us around even more to tease us. Now we are supposed to be happy and content that we can stare at immoveable screenshots.
It sounds like a lighthearded exaggeration to me, but then again I think rationally. If you stopped for a second past the knee jerk reaction and thought, the point you should have interpreted was that "product X takes Y time using a traditional distribution method, however product X takes Y - Z time using an established content delivery system."
They were talking about the Steam software delivery method. If there was no Steam, it would take 6 years to do it all. Traditional game distribution involves sending the product for manufacturing, box it, get the regular stores to shelve it and handle all the overhead of handling online gaming for the expansion would be very involved. With Steam, they can just put an option in Steam to buy it online, that's it.
This article text on Slashdot has the highest Anti-Microsoft slant as I've seen in a long time. Not only is Microsoft chastised with using a rather open submission style that happens to be very similar to Wikipedia, a facility Slashdot readers cling to for dear life as a champion of free thought, but a laundry list of rights that Microsoft assumes when you contribute is displayed in a way to render potential contributors with a strong feeling of vulnerability. Let Microsoft do what they want and if you want to contribute, do so. If you don't like Microsofts' project, then ignore it and go on your way. Afterall, actions (and inactions) speak louder than words. Save everyones time and don't make little pitiful stabs at Microsoft when they can't possibly defend themselves in this arena tailored to encourage only those thoughts which agree with yours (the average Slashdot regular) that often aren't neccessarily fair. So censor me and give me my negative moderation because I don't conform to the Slashdot norm, reinforce my point.
Back in the 1990's when the Playstation 1 came out, the disc swap was pretty mainstream.
I talked to people that definitely aren't computer savvy as far as underground hacks that at least knew about and some that did the swap trick. The proliferation of this swap trick was helped by the fact anyone could copy the disc on a CD recorder and then swap it to play the copy, no soldering skills needed, you don't even need to void the unit by opening it. Granted it's not a high tech hack, but it's a hack nonetheless.
Why don't we rewind time and tell Microsoft "don't sue spammers/phishers because we just want to see how much spam we'd get" and then compare? The point is that you can't qualitatively determine how successful Microsoft is. If there's one company that has the capital to chase spammers/phishers and one that's in their best interest, it's Microsoft. They're doing more about it than you are so stop being a moron.
those folk who become Hybrid car enthusiasts who will geek out over a totally silent car
I'm talking about serious enthusiasts, not the "I've got hybrid technology just because it's fashionable". These people aren't serious enthusiasts, not to the depth I'm speaking of. To put the point sharply, these are the people that buy Mac's, they want form before function.
As the price of oil rises and the cost of alternatives drops, we'll reach a point where it's no longer fiscally better to go with gasoline. This statement alone proves you don't fully get real automobiles so just stop talking to me. Just buy your Honda hybrids and stay out of the fast lane because I'll take my german V6 and be happy for the rest of my life. It might not be economically feasible for people like you but real enthusiasts that get that special feeling when the vehicle comes to life, we're willing to pay past the current gas prices to reach it again.
Smartass anti-american comments aside, I wouldn't buy a grass burning car because you can't replace the exciting sound when I turn my ignition key and get the low car shaking feeling. I can't hear that the car is working, I can only feel it. I just don't think the current hybrids or some weird idealistic grass powered car can do any better. You'll be hard pressed to get any serious car enthusiast to switch from a gas combustion engine to some alternative fuel car. It may cost me more and more into the future but that cost pales in comparison to the exhilation when you throttle a real live gas combustion engine and feel the car twist. You take your grass car and be happy you've saved %0.00001 of the environment (after production of the car) and I'll be happy at the excitement a gas combustion engine gives me and the real car enthusiasts.
Here they do that too, I'm saying how far back in production they start, beginning at deciding what they want (MOSFET's included) and then the dimentions of the chip, arrangement of pins and then until the chip is actually made. So, to summarize, my school is just as good as your school, probably better because you don't go to it.
Some people say Industrial Engineering but that Engineering discipline isn't as widespread as the Electrical/Computer, Civil, Mechanical Engineering disciplines. If you want to get into fabrication, you should look into Electrical Engineering if you cannot find a discipline closer to manufacturing. For example, my school has an option to take fabrication classes under the Electrical/Computer engineering program where you design and then build a custom IC. You pick the size, how many pins and then put whatever electronic components (resistors, capacitors, inductors, or maybe logic gates) and then actually fabricate your device within a semester.
Slashdot Mirror
I'm now 100% secure in saying the moderating system is complete bullshit. I express an honest dissenting opinion about the community and it gets labeled flamebait and therefore is censored because it loses exposure. My comment was never intended or toned as a comment intended on starting a flame war. I don't insult anyone or any single thing, I commented on the group as a whole. If you fucking disagree with what I say, post a reply (not anonymously like a coward) and make it worth my time to read it. Don't regurgitate Apple bullshit in my face and accept me to believe it. Don't use moderation to express your disagreement, to censor me and then hide behind it.
Not an anti-Apple troll, I'm trying to shine an objective light in a dark subjective room. I agree that the timing is very suspicious and it might actually hurt Tiger Direct if they get a settlement. it would make sense for Tiger Direct to wait until Tiger is well past it's initial stride. A more solid dollar amount can be written. No matter how depicable I think the timing is, a judge should still hear the case. I think that, shouldn't another rational thinking person believe along those same lines? I was sick of everyone siding with Apple like they are perfect and everyone else is so imperfect and the constant fucking appreciation for a company is sickening. I like the car manufacturer that made my car, I love driving it above any other car but I don't think they cannot do no wrong.
There's so much fucking adulation you apple fanboys have with Apple. Apple is the white knight in pinstripe armor and they cannot do any wrong? So what if Tiger Direct purposely waited until the day before to file, it's their choice. As long as they are within the statute of limitations, they are free to bring charges whenever they want. You people are so brainwashed by how awesome Apple is that you simply cannot fathom Apple doing anything wrong. You rationalize anything that can be misconstrued as being detrimental to Apples image and ferociously attack anyone that tries to say otherwise. Luckily a judge will hear the case, one that isn't so incredibly biased like you people are. Give it a rest.
I'm reserving my judgement until Longhorn is on the shelves as to how it'll actually turn out. No use in wild speculation this far from the release date.
Other countries deny extraditions if the person the United States wants extradited is convicted of a capital crime and will be killed. Another country doesn't want to hand over a captured bird into the hands of it's executioner. Sometimes the DA will agree not to kill the prisoner, as long as they come back and face the punishment for life in prison or something.
Just wait until tomorrow where there will be at least an article that Tiger actually arrives, maybe some more reactionary articles later to something else. I'm kind of amazed this much hoopla is thrown for an upgrade. With Tiger, OS X remains basically the same. A couple things are changed or are faster and everyone here treats it as the second coming. I'm many times more interested in how Longhorn ends up because it's supposed to be a bigger change from XP than Tiger is from Jaguar. It's supposed to be as big of a change as Windows 95.
just give me this phone and I'll be happy.
Is this more of a result of Tiger being first to market? Most of those things listed have already been in both OS's for a long time, save for 64-bit support. Head start or not, there's still a significant cost to change platforms between Microsoft and Apple and I'm not just talking about the often-complained-about price of Apple systems. There's learning curves to deal with, support when things go wrong (Yes, I know it's hard news to take, OS X isn't perfect) and more.
I'm interested in seeing what Microsoft ends up with after the time spent on Longhorn. Microsoft touted Longhorn to be the biggest jump in operability since Windows 95. Nobody can deny that Longhorn will be a bigger jump than Tiger will be to Apple fanboys. I just hope Apple fanboys will get off the "Microsoft is copying us" chip on their shoulder and interpret whatever they feel Microsoft copies from them as endorsements for their first decisions.
That's the thing, fresh college grads expect to make the crazy money right out of college, but the market simply cannot support that concept. I'm going to graduate in 2 weeks and I have no expectations about making a job in my field (computer engineering) at the average starting salary for grads ($52k). I expect to enter into a ladder-style career. Yeah, I may get a crap job that I'm overqualified for, but I can get the experience the job gives me, then I can shoot for the moon and get the great job later after I've spent some time in the working world.
On a more grand scale, this phenomena is why the US is outsourcing and it's not even bound to college grads either. Teenagers these days want to make the easy cash or not even try and jobs go unfulfilled. Employers can't afford to pay the kind of money these people want so they find someone who will work for the money, enter foreigners that have a lower cost of living. There's just no honor in the afterschool McDonalds job anymore.
Rape someone and get off better than a file-swapper?
What a dumb premise...
I guess you and your parent left out that little bit about registering as a sex offender. What do you think your chances are finding employment if your potential employer finds out your past? Would you rather choose your past as being convicted and a short stint in a prison for stealing a movie, or being convicted and after a short stint in a prison and registering in every state you eventually live in as a sex offender?
I seriously doubt everyone but religous prudes believe that these laws stop people having sex. It perhaps makes them regret it later when their girlfriends crazy parents come along and press charges but it doesn't stop shit.
I live in the state of Virginia where the age of consent is 18. I've known some people that were 18 and had a 17 year old boyfriend/girlfriend that although they are less than a year apart, by law, they still would be comitting a crime. The law either scared them into stopping having sex for that period of time where or just went ahead and just kept it under wraps and sometimes the parents find out and then get restraining orders and whatnot. If anything, it makes people under the age of 18 to take a second and think about it. With something as serious as sex, taking a second and taking sex seriously, you should either want to fully commit or change your mind.
I can tell you right now that as soon as children start going through puberty they are going to be interested in sex.
When I went through puberty, sure I was interested in sex but that doesn't mean I knew what was best for me sexually. What's better, not to have any really enforced laws and let the depravity of people like pedophiles go relatively unpunished, or have laws that punish the sexual abusers?
Don't even get me started about contributing members of society, as soon as you start paying taxes (15 in your country IIRC) you should have the right to get a leg up.
15 and paying taxes? Is that from sales tax on plastic beach toys? From what I hear, you only start paying income tax (a substantial amount of money) whenever you earn above a certain amount of money, not based on age. I agree that you should have a leg up when you pay taxes, but if you earn enough money to pay income tax then you should be responsible enough to be having sex legally.
To summerize, those laws do nothing to stop people from having sex and those who believe they do are fooling themselves. If anything they would stop girls telling their mothers that the condom broke and they need a morning after pill.
I think the laws seperate the people that respect the laws and those who don't. Your explanation of your society where you live sounds nice but your laws are written in accordance with the behavior of your society. In America, we are still relatively a big salad bowl (not a melting pot because people are still different and distinct, we aren't melted together yet) and this is the laws we came up with to govern the people of our society. Who's to say your laws (or even values) would work with our people and vice versa. I think you should pare your argument to that point because it is an important distinction.
... 17, in many, many, countries this is exceeding the age of consent so its either saying that american girls are typically more innocent then the rest of the world, or the people running the show in your country are a bunch of prudes.
... or the fact that our (American) society expects people under the age of consent not to be having sex. We aren't trying to be prudes or whatever warped reality you think we have, it's the level of society we've built for ourselves. In America, we all agree that girls and boys that are 15 years old should not be having sex, rather they should be having a full childhood. Once they mature as contributing members of society, then they inherit the freedom to be with who they want to be with (granted it's not with an underage individual, of course). Americans, both as children and adults see 15 year old girls and boys as children that go to school, participate in extracurricular activities and play sports, not exploring their sexual potential. When one particular American sees the latter, we punish those people and very few people (outside of NAMBLA and related organizations) disagree.
It's fine if in Slovakia or whatever country you actually reside in (if it's different from where your email account is hosted) that your laws have a different age of consent because that's the society that has developed and I respect that. I'm asking, on behalf of the United States, for the same of respect for our laws in this regards.
Hard drives are so cheap that you can just destroy the hard drive with a drill press. Afterall, they say construction workers that demolish buildings have the highest job satisfaction, you can get your own taste of that.
I was wondering why the guy in MD has to have them but I'll ask you too...
Why?
Do you crave the cloying adulation people give you when you dazzle them with rarely-seen currency? Do you also pass around $.50 coins too?
I don't know what's worse, some poor Best Buy employee not up to date on his currency or people like you that just have to have $2 and nothing else. $1 and $5 are for the peons, it's $2 bills or nothing, eh? If loved ones give you fullscreen DVD's, do you feign enthusiasm and then later toss the perfectly good movie in the trash because it's widescreen or nothing, right?
In the end it comes down to what do I dislike more, a cashier less than completely aware of all United States currency denominations or individuals such as yourself that inconvenience yourself and the bank you inconvenience just so perfect strangers can have one of your lucky special elite $2 bills. I can spend 5 seconds with the cashier and let him in on the secret, I don't know how long it would take to fix the latter.
I'm also very upset over this. I've always said that if they ported Red Orchestra to HL2 and gave the DoD dev team some competition, then the dev team will get off their collective asses and release it. Then they have the nerve to do a Beta test of DoD:S just to jerk us around even more to tease us. Now we are supposed to be happy and content that we can stare at immoveable screenshots.
It sounds like a lighthearded exaggeration to me, but then again I think rationally. If you stopped for a second past the knee jerk reaction and thought, the point you should have interpreted was that "product X takes Y time using a traditional distribution method, however product X takes Y - Z time using an established content delivery system."
They were talking about the Steam software delivery method. If there was no Steam, it would take 6 years to do it all. Traditional game distribution involves sending the product for manufacturing, box it, get the regular stores to shelve it and handle all the overhead of handling online gaming for the expansion would be very involved. With Steam, they can just put an option in Steam to buy it online, that's it.
This article text on Slashdot has the highest Anti-Microsoft slant as I've seen in a long time. Not only is Microsoft chastised with using a rather open submission style that happens to be very similar to Wikipedia, a facility Slashdot readers cling to for dear life as a champion of free thought, but a laundry list of rights that Microsoft assumes when you contribute is displayed in a way to render potential contributors with a strong feeling of vulnerability. Let Microsoft do what they want and if you want to contribute, do so. If you don't like Microsofts' project, then ignore it and go on your way. Afterall, actions (and inactions) speak louder than words. Save everyones time and don't make little pitiful stabs at Microsoft when they can't possibly defend themselves in this arena tailored to encourage only those thoughts which agree with yours (the average Slashdot regular) that often aren't neccessarily fair. So censor me and give me my negative moderation because I don't conform to the Slashdot norm, reinforce my point.
Back in the 1990's when the Playstation 1 came out, the disc swap was pretty mainstream.
I talked to people that definitely aren't computer savvy as far as underground hacks that at least knew about and some that did the swap trick. The proliferation of this swap trick was helped by the fact anyone could copy the disc on a CD recorder and then swap it to play the copy, no soldering skills needed, you don't even need to void the unit by opening it. Granted it's not a high tech hack, but it's a hack nonetheless.
Why don't we rewind time and tell Microsoft "don't sue spammers/phishers because we just want to see how much spam we'd get" and then compare? The point is that you can't qualitatively determine how successful Microsoft is. If there's one company that has the capital to chase spammers/phishers and one that's in their best interest, it's Microsoft. They're doing more about it than you are so stop being a moron.
those folk who become Hybrid car enthusiasts
who will geek out over a totally silent car
I'm talking about serious enthusiasts, not the "I've got hybrid technology just because it's fashionable". These people aren't serious enthusiasts, not to the depth I'm speaking of. To put the point sharply, these are the people that buy Mac's, they want form before function.
As the price of oil rises and the cost of alternatives drops, we'll reach a point where it's no longer fiscally better to go with gasoline.
This statement alone proves you don't fully get real automobiles so just stop talking to me. Just buy your Honda hybrids and stay out of the fast lane because I'll take my german V6 and be happy for the rest of my life. It might not be economically feasible for people like you but real enthusiasts that get that special feeling when the vehicle comes to life, we're willing to pay past the current gas prices to reach it again.
Smartass anti-american comments aside, I wouldn't buy a grass burning car because you can't replace the exciting sound when I turn my ignition key and get the low car shaking feeling. I can't hear that the car is working, I can only feel it. I just don't think the current hybrids or some weird idealistic grass powered car can do any better. You'll be hard pressed to get any serious car enthusiast to switch from a gas combustion engine to some alternative fuel car. It may cost me more and more into the future but that cost pales in comparison to the exhilation when you throttle a real live gas combustion engine and feel the car twist. You take your grass car and be happy you've saved %0.00001 of the environment (after production of the car) and I'll be happy at the excitement a gas combustion engine gives me and the real car enthusiasts.
In the movie Fight Club? scroll down and you'll see it
Here they do that too, I'm saying how far back in production they start, beginning at deciding what they want (MOSFET's included) and then the dimentions of the chip, arrangement of pins and then until the chip is actually made. So, to summarize, my school is just as good as your school, probably better because you don't go to it.
Some people say Industrial Engineering but that Engineering discipline isn't as widespread as the Electrical/Computer, Civil, Mechanical Engineering disciplines. If you want to get into fabrication, you should look into Electrical Engineering if you cannot find a discipline closer to manufacturing. For example, my school has an option to take fabrication classes under the Electrical/Computer engineering program where you design and then build a custom IC. You pick the size, how many pins and then put whatever electronic components (resistors, capacitors, inductors, or maybe logic gates) and then actually fabricate your device within a semester.