Gentoo [gentoo.org] makes you compile your own kernel (or at least it is highly encouraged) and they've made it about as easy as it gets, which is still pretty darn hard, but not unmanageable (they have a GUI).
Yeah, I agree. Gentoo definately has something to do with 2.7. *cough* *rolls eyes*
There's only so much simplification you can do before the whole thing become useless---this is the kernel we're talking about. The most useful layer of user-friendliness I can envision is presenting the user with some simple choices of CPU and what role they want the kernel to play, like desktop, server, media appliance, and whatever else your twisted [twistedmatrix.com] mind can dream up.
That's a terrible idea. Modules already provide away for the distributions to cater to virtually any hardware setup without losing performance for being the "jack of all trades." At any given time, no driver is loaded that doesn't need to be. A desktop kernel might need to support ten different sound cards. If it had any sense, it would build them as modules...but wait! Distros already build all the drivers as modules.
If compiling a kernel is too hard for you, then I think Gentoo is as well.
I think that the "make menuconfig" system should better explain about kernel modules. I had a deuce of a time figuring out what key to press to get the LNE100TX ethernet card enabled, but once I found out, it was just one key.
Every single selection in the "make menuconfig" system is invoked with a keypress...and almost every single help section includes a blurb about modules and where to go for information.
I've read your other posts. You don't care about Bayesian filters. You don't speak Python or Ruby. You're a fraud.
Although I disagree with gnu.org on many positions (as well as Jehova's Witnesses), I think it's not only okay to try and convince others of your position in a peaceful manner, it's important to as well.
The idea is that if enough people become aware of how bad software patents are, they can use their right as consumers to choose, and make an impression on the companies who are trying to win their favor.
Democracy works a lot better when people educate themselves about things, and I think that the parent was just trying to "spread the word," so to speak.
Companies are out to make money--good. They provide jobs and health plans and backyards. It's nice. Sometimes, companies are going to try and use their power to screw the little guy. Some want the Government to stop them, but then the government will only do the same thing. So it's up to the little guy to get off his ass and read a little bit.
Re:What does this mean for Sodipodi?
on
GIMP goes SVG
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· Score: 1
This is a case where both parties are sinking cash into big government programs that are wasting taxpayers dollars. We need strong businesses and individuals to come forward and work towards a bigger goal than funneling tax tollars through beaurocratic super-networks.
Well, on the other hand we do have a strong libertarian minded audience. The Patriot Act gives the government power to strip citizenship based on the Attourney General's whims, and hold secret trials where one can't face the accuser. Honestly, a healthy bit of skepticism is important, and if the government signs a law that sucks, I at least am concerned with any kind of technology that can be used in scary ways given the fact that this kind of McCarthyism actually is going on.
Maybe this is that eight-year old Trekkie in me, but I really believe we need another space race. Our overall progress in space during the first thirty years of the Cold War greatly overshadows anything since that time, and I wholly reject this apprehension towards more people going into space after tragic accidents. My condolences, of course, to the friends of family of those who've died in a space suit.
Let's see if we can dump some of that massive defense budget and sink that cash into a more active space program. Let's see if we can get to the moon. We already know we can blow up the world pretty good. We don't need to prove that we can, and if the situation actually arose where we needed to unleash our arsenal, then the world would be screwed anyways.
I bet I sound like a naive, idealistic fool...sue me.
Yeah, and also on that line, maybe if politicians earned more money they would stop smuggling drugs in and laundering profits through Swiss bank accounts.
I myself don't use Debian, but I respect it as probably the most stable, strong distribution in the pack. I prefer Crux since it offers a highly optimized, minimalistic install (the ISO is really small), as well as a slackware-style tar.gz package system with a ports tree. Much better than Gentoo, I might add.
A Debian zealot? It's been a while since I've seen your kind around here...
I was really waiting for a Gentoo zealot to pop out and say "all I have to do in Gentoo is type 'emerge update' and my whole excellent portage system is updated! Yay!"
I think the kernel has gotten smarter; i.e. it won't reserve cpu time for the mouse/keyboard until the system is already at high loads and the user is trying to do stuff.
At any rate, the amount of resources needed to maintain usability are nothing compared to huge networks of threaded jobs.
Not entirely...just some. If you put his quote in your.sig, you're basically just saying "I'm an idiot." We're still laughing, but instead of laughing with Rusty Russell, we're laughing at the parent.
Hey, he brought it upon himself.
Interactive Performance
on
Towards Linux 2.6
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· Score: 4, Insightful
Interactive performance With the new scheduler, the user should not see the system taking longer to respond to things like mouse clicks or key taps, even under very high loads.
One of the biggest problems new users face expecting Linux to be "faster" than Windows, and booting up for the first time to a slow and klunky desktop with either Gnome or KDE. When things get real slow, having the mouse and keyboard unresponsive make the system feel really rough and unpolished. The more I think about this one the more I think 2.6 will start the next generation of distributions that are finally going to feel like an operating system as opposed to a midnight hack session.
Dude, they're not rewriting the whole thing again. E17 is a rewrite, and they're just replacing ebits with the new edje and writing a new window manager component.
The whole thing has been a rewrite, now they move on to the actual window manager and not the underpinnings and people think they've started a rewrite.
Truth is, there is way more to enlightenment than the actual window manager code.
GNU is not Linux is not GNU. Linux is the name. If you don't like Linux, use HURD. Again, you miss the point like everyone else: It's just a name. GNU/Linux is not going to solve the world's problems, nor is it even viably correct. You're rationalizing. Be happy that people are CHOOSING free software, much of which was created with GNU tools.
I am not a GNU or Linux zealot (though I use "GNU/Linux"). I have no problem calling my system "Linux"--after all, it is just a name. However, the thread is about something else. We all fortunate enough to have access to a bunch of free operating systems (in both senses of the word free), and we're sort of asking who should we give credit/thanks to?
You made two points in your original post, one of which I addressed. Your first is that other parts of the "operating system" are just as important as those branded GNU and as such deserve at least as much credit as GNU (I suspect that you thought I was an advocate of saying "GNU/Linux" because of this). Your second is that operating systems aren't only defined by software itself, but by the license, and having a GPL-based distro will inherently lead people to view and understand the GNU projects goals. I sort of agree with this, but didn't discuss it (hence I won't here).
Anyways, back to your first point, your hardware analogy was a bit off. 3000 people can be running RedHat on 3000 different hardware configurations. They don't need to give credit to their hardware vendors or Best Buy for their setup because they paid for it--we give credit to OSS/FSF projects because we a) didn't pay for them b) didn't pay for our bandwidth usage on their end, and c) have the rights listed in the licenses in the software itself, which in the case of the GPL is pretty generous.
And your point is?
The GNU tools are more important to the operating system than the others (besides Linux). Read my orignal post that you just blasted for my reasons.
The GNU tools take your computer running on the Linux kernel and not only give you the ability to interact with it but also give these "killer apps" like x and gnome the same ability.
Your desktop environment is just as important to you as the GNU tools, but those tools are fundamental to the desktop environment itself. You start with a kernel (Linux), build a toolchain with a c library and a command interpreter (GNU), then add a desktop. GNU does much more than that, but take a look at how to install linux by hand and you'll see that GNU is more than just proframs, it's a whole platform that you have to build off of to get a desktop. Linux+GNU=OS. Muy muy importante.
After reiser4, what filesystems are actually decent competition for it? It'd be nice for OSS to claim not only the best web server (apache), best kernel, and best filesystem.
To be fair, in a typical Linux set up, changing fonts is usually restricted to like programs; i.e. you change all GNOME applications at once, all KDE, etc.
If you run a homogenous GNOME or KDE setup, you get a much more unified system, and things are even simpler than Windows.
Once each desktop gets enough software for its respected platform, or different platforms get unified, expect big changes in the perceived difficulty of Linux.
Leave it up to distros to throw in all the software plus the kitchen sink and bundle it without thought of interpolation.
BTW, I don't think its hurt feelings (as you seem to suggest) that's driving jobs outside the states.
I was being wit{ty,less}. I meant that laws that make it more costly to do business should be scrutnized more, since when it gets to be too expensive to set up shop here, companies like Levi's, etc. will all leave (as many have already done).
If I steal as few as eight songs, how much should I be sued for? Let's assume a situation where there are eight songs from three artists, and four of the songs are on the same album (people like to download from similar artists). Hence, we have four albums sales we 'stole' from the RIAA. At 15$ a CD, that's 60$ in damages.
Actually, laws aren't always written for corporate profits. And some that are, are a good thing. Healthy corporations = healthy economy. If you continue to demonize them, then you'd better not pout when our economy erupts when they move overseas because they're not welcome here.
Slashdot Mirror
Yeah, I agree. Gentoo definately has something to do with 2.7. *cough* *rolls eyes*
There's only so much simplification you can do before the whole thing become useless---this is the kernel we're talking about. The most useful layer of user-friendliness I can envision is presenting the user with some simple choices of CPU and what role they want the kernel to play, like desktop, server, media appliance, and whatever else your twisted [twistedmatrix.com] mind can dream up.
That's a terrible idea. Modules already provide away for the distributions to cater to virtually any hardware setup without losing performance for being the "jack of all trades." At any given time, no driver is loaded that doesn't need to be. A desktop kernel might need to support ten different sound cards. If it had any sense, it would build them as modules...but wait! Distros already build all the drivers as modules.
If compiling a kernel is too hard for you, then I think Gentoo is as well.
I think that the "make menuconfig" system should better explain about kernel modules. I had a deuce of a time figuring out what key to press to get the LNE100TX ethernet card enabled, but once I found out, it was just one key.
Every single selection in the "make menuconfig" system is invoked with a keypress...and almost every single help section includes a blurb about modules and where to go for information.
I've read your other posts. You don't care about Bayesian filters. You don't speak Python or Ruby. You're a fraud.
Scary thought: WMD@Iraq Scarier thought: WMD@Home
The idea is that if enough people become aware of how bad software patents are, they can use their right as consumers to choose, and make an impression on the companies who are trying to win their favor.
Democracy works a lot better when people educate themselves about things, and I think that the parent was just trying to "spread the word," so to speak.
Companies are out to make money--good. They provide jobs and health plans and backyards. It's nice. Sometimes, companies are going to try and use their power to screw the little guy. Some want the Government to stop them, but then the government will only do the same thing. So it's up to the little guy to get off his ass and read a little bit.
Come on guys, be honest. Was that staged?
Uhh, I kinda do.
Wait...
This is a case where both parties are sinking cash into big government programs that are wasting taxpayers dollars. We need strong businesses and individuals to come forward and work towards a bigger goal than funneling tax tollars through beaurocratic super-networks.
Well, on the other hand we do have a strong libertarian minded audience. The Patriot Act gives the government power to strip citizenship based on the Attourney General's whims, and hold secret trials where one can't face the accuser. Honestly, a healthy bit of skepticism is important, and if the government signs a law that sucks, I at least am concerned with any kind of technology that can be used in scary ways given the fact that this kind of McCarthyism actually is going on.
Let's see if we can dump some of that massive defense budget and sink that cash into a more active space program. Let's see if we can get to the moon. We already know we can blow up the world pretty good. We don't need to prove that we can, and if the situation actually arose where we needed to unleash our arsenal, then the world would be screwed anyways.
I bet I sound like a naive, idealistic fool...sue me.
Yeah, and also on that line, maybe if politicians earned more money they would stop smuggling drugs in and laundering profits through Swiss bank accounts.
And yes, I am being hypocritical.
I was really waiting for a Gentoo zealot to pop out and say "all I have to do in Gentoo is type 'emerge update' and my whole excellent portage system is updated! Yay!"
At any rate, the amount of resources needed to maintain usability are nothing compared to huge networks of threaded jobs.
Hey, he brought it upon himself.
One of the biggest problems new users face expecting Linux to be "faster" than Windows, and booting up for the first time to a slow and klunky desktop with either Gnome or KDE. When things get real slow, having the mouse and keyboard unresponsive make the system feel really rough and unpolished. The more I think about this one the more I think 2.6 will start the next generation of distributions that are finally going to feel like an operating system as opposed to a midnight hack session.
There is nothing "loose" about Microsoft's market share. They want to tighten it if anything; why would they want to lose it?
The whole thing has been a rewrite, now they move on to the actual window manager and not the underpinnings and people think they've started a rewrite.
Truth is, there is way more to enlightenment than the actual window manager code.
And a whole lot of independence...
Suse joining in is much more intersting to me...after all, SuSE and SCO were partners in {UnitedLinux} crime!
I am not a GNU or Linux zealot (though I use "GNU/Linux"). I have no problem calling my system "Linux"--after all, it is just a name. However, the thread is about something else. We all fortunate enough to have access to a bunch of free operating systems (in both senses of the word free), and we're sort of asking who should we give credit/thanks to?
You made two points in your original post, one of which I addressed. Your first is that other parts of the "operating system" are just as important as those branded GNU and as such deserve at least as much credit as GNU (I suspect that you thought I was an advocate of saying "GNU/Linux" because of this). Your second is that operating systems aren't only defined by software itself, but by the license, and having a GPL-based distro will inherently lead people to view and understand the GNU projects goals. I sort of agree with this, but didn't discuss it (hence I won't here).
Anyways, back to your first point, your hardware analogy was a bit off. 3000 people can be running RedHat on 3000 different hardware configurations. They don't need to give credit to their hardware vendors or Best Buy for their setup because they paid for it--we give credit to OSS/FSF projects because we a) didn't pay for them b) didn't pay for our bandwidth usage on their end, and c) have the rights listed in the licenses in the software itself, which in the case of the GPL is pretty generous.
And your point is?
The GNU tools are more important to the operating system than the others (besides Linux). Read my orignal post that you just blasted for my reasons.
Your desktop environment is just as important to you as the GNU tools, but those tools are fundamental to the desktop environment itself. You start with a kernel (Linux), build a toolchain with a c library and a command interpreter (GNU), then add a desktop. GNU does much more than that, but take a look at how to install linux by hand and you'll see that GNU is more than just proframs, it's a whole platform that you have to build off of to get a desktop. Linux+GNU=OS. Muy muy importante.
After reiser4, what filesystems are actually decent competition for it? It'd be nice for OSS to claim not only the best web server (apache), best kernel, and best filesystem.
If you run a homogenous GNOME or KDE setup, you get a much more unified system, and things are even simpler than Windows.
Once each desktop gets enough software for its respected platform, or different platforms get unified, expect big changes in the perceived difficulty of Linux.
Leave it up to distros to throw in all the software plus the kitchen sink and bundle it without thought of interpolation.
I was being wit{ty,less}. I meant that laws that make it more costly to do business should be scrutnized more, since when it gets to be too expensive to set up shop here, companies like Levi's, etc. will all leave (as many have already done).
Methinks they're just saber rattling.
Actually, laws aren't always written for corporate profits. And some that are, are a good thing. Healthy corporations = healthy economy. If you continue to demonize them, then you'd better not pout when our economy erupts when they move overseas because they're not welcome here.