I saw this MST3k blooper once where Tom called out "Cray" instead of "Crow". Still in character, And with false modesty, Crow replied with "Well that's very nice of you, Tom. I'm really more of a PC though."
"Wow, they just patented telephones, VOIP, MMORPGs, etc... Sheesh, shouldn't something like this be a LITTLE obvious?"
*Sigh* no. They did not patent telephones and VOIP. The context is games here, and patents are VERY context sensisitive.
BTW, obvious has nothing to do with it. VOIP is not so easy. Consider how little horsepower the N64 had and that most of it went towards the game, and you may see what I mean. Solving the problem is what patents are about, not obviousness. Otherwise I'd patent matter transportation.
"No you don't, that's just it. POV-Ray is incredibly light-weight on your machine. It works by processing plain text files, which have scene definitions written in a pseudo-code language. If you have a machine that is sucky, it will just take that much longer to process your final image. "
I haven't used POV Ray so take what I'm saying with a grain of salt, but I think the idea is that you're supposed to use a GUI that creates that text file for you. I doubt the samples of art in their gallery were created by mathematical geniuses.
"I NEED the great computer to win the make great work to win the contest."
Hehe. You wouldn't believe how many times I've heard people blame their computer's speed for their art sucking. Guess they never saw the Last Starfighter.
"Personally I hope that the RIAA is successful in shutting down music file swapping."
No, you don't. It's the only competition the RIAA has. Until they lose their oligopoly status, I'd rather the civil disobedience continue. Heck, I wish the RIAA were actally suffering losses at the hands of music trading, sadly that just isn't happening.
At least we can thank Napster for making iTunes happen.
"The first point is that there is a lot of 3D done in maya under linux."
Sort of. It's used in studios a lot. That's not the same as saying that all those artists run Linux at home, which is coincidently where PLE would mostly be run.
" The other point is that maya ple is a response to max equivalent edition and not an effort to develop a new user base."
It's not to develop a new user base? Untrue. If you're an aspiring artist, you're not going to be able to drop thousands of dollars on something like Maya just to figure out if it's what you want to do. Your only practical resort is to use pirated versions of the software. The companies aren't big on this sort of thing, so they make the learning version to alleviate demand for their warez. It is very much a 'broaden user base' tool. It isn't very practical as much else considering the watermarking that is involved.
"Your point about cost is of course part of the situation but is not worth much if you don't put it in perspective with those 2 others."
No, sorry, you haven't defeated my point at all.
"So i guess you werent that realistic in your comment either."
Wrong. I'm very active in the 3D art community. There's been little to no mention of the lack of a Linux version of PLE. The simple reason is few people are even running Linux at home. There's barely any excitement over Lightwave getting ported to Linux. It falls under a 'would be nice' type of thing, but most of those people are thinking about render farm units that are $300 cheaper sans Windows. Don't need a PLE of either app for that.
"Keeping an interface similar allows for an easier migration of people who've been using Windows for years (office people). Thus, less training is needed and the migration costs are lower."
Lower than going through all the BS it takes to install these things? I don't think so.
"If they come up with something totally new, they get slammed for a steep learning curve. Reviewers go on tirades and whitepapers are written about how the TCO is too high because of the training necessary, etc."
These are very valid 'bitches'. You're not helping anybody by trying to play them down. Complex software and needlessly complex software are to very different things. Most of Linux and related software very neatly falls into the needlessly complex category, and there will ALWAYS be bitching about it until the community actually gets their act together and does something about it.
"JPL engineers have tried to correct the problem by renaming the interesting rock to 'Red Hat Linux 8.0'. They have no response from the catatonic rover as of yet."
Sadly, a phone call to Redhat surprisingly turned unhelpful when they suddenly announced they were no longer going to support 8.
"One interesting point to note is that, if it were possible to transport a person via this process, the trip would appear to be instantaneous. Although travel would occur at the speed of light, no time would appear to pass for the traveller. Cool."
Duplicate stories on Slashdot would be a wonderful benefit to these heroic travelers!
"Yea, right, like if maya was never used on linux."
Didn't say it wasn't. You should read the part of my post that talked about the number of people and the cost effectiveness etc.
I don't know why it's such a sore concept around here that Linux doesn't enjoy that many individual 3D artists. It's not because Linux sucks it's because we need other tools like Photoshop and After Effects. Gimp and Cinepaint are a start, but they're nowhere near as broad in terms of capability. If you're a generalist 3D artist, using Linux is like replacing your toolbox with a Leatherman.
Re:yes yes, but to the important question allready
on
Alias Releases Maya PLE 6
·
· Score: 5, Interesting
"Then Blender has to do, for 'US'... I guess...."
Blender != Maya. If you're just interested in tinkering with it, then that's a fine solution. If you're actually interested in developing a career, then you're far better off just dual booting into Windows and running Maya PLE. Frankly, the OS doesn't matter a whole hell of a lot when doing this stuff for a living. It's the wrong place to cross your arms and say "It's Linux or nothin!"
"download 3D Studio Max and get the keygen from astalivista.box.sk (search for 3D Studio Max). Done and done, with full character studio too."
That's kind of like learning Java so you can be a C programmer. There's some overlap, but if it's a career you're aiming for, it's not the most direct route.
Just as a side note, if ya go about it that way and join some of the common art forums like CGTalk, don't bring up piracy. They are overy sensitive to the topic despite the fact that nearly every 3D artist out there has a cracker to thank. Bringing up keygens in those places is like saying something nice about Microsoft here.
"When last I contacted them they refused to believe you might want to learn their product on Linux and thus if you want Maya on Linux be prepared to shell out the $$..."
Refused to believe one would want to learn on Linux, or wasn't convinced enough people were running exclusively Linux for it to be cost effective to make PLE available?
I know it's fun to aim our pitchforks at people for not supporting Linux, but be realistic.
> What, you don't have to install a new version of Windows to get the LatestAndGreatest worms and viruses?
What, you ran out of steam on the original discussion so now you're after a second round? Musta got ya more wound up than I realized. Linux shills are funny.
"but buying eight or ten games would bring my investment up to the price of a decent (not top-of-the-line, bought in parts) computer, which I would greatly prefer."
" We all know gnu/linux is still a niche phenomenon on Desktops, and 1% of all people accessing Google is _millions_ of people. That's pretty a damn respectable figure in my book."
Assuming:
a.) It's not a rounding error. (Like a chart will read 0%....)
b.) It's not a category like "everything else".
C.) It's actually counting machines vs. hits.
Since I can't load TFA I appreciate corrections. In a general sense, though, 2% is a hell of a lot more amazing than 1%.
"I can't see the advantage of using a palm over using a small notebook (12" ibook or powerbook for example) - espiecally for browsing using Wifi cards as shown here. A compacted and hard to read screen compared to a full internet browser. Surely the space it takes up is made up for in usability nowdays."
Nobody said it was for everybody. Frankly, though, you'd have a lot easier time seeing it if you were trying to find it. Laptops just can't go everywhere. They don't 'instant on'. Their battery life is HORRIBLE compared to a Palm or PocketPC. The form factor itself is a huge nuisance. Even with something as small as a Powerbook, those things feel like they're just WAITING to jump out of your lap.
There are times where it'd be handy to have a small handheld unit to grab the latest news headlines. During commercials, for example. You're not going to drag your laptop out for that. WIth the Palm, though, you hit 'on' and click a bookmark. Quick check of email? No problem. Heck, even log on and get your instant messages. Piece of cake. Maybe I won't do hard core research on it, but I have times where I don't want to get up and go to my desk just to get a bit of info off the net. It's an entertainment device. Nothing wrong with that.
I ended up just getting a Tablet PC. I miss the instant on etc, but it does boot quickly, has long battery life, and the slate mode with a stylus is much easier on the lap when there's no typing to do. If I didn't get this, I'd be using a PDA instead, and quite happy about it. Sure it's limited. BFD, it's still small and couch-surfable.
Again, it's not for everybody, but come on, how come some of these possibilities didn't cross your mind?
"...what's left of DKC is a competent enough platformer, but not something deserving of the buzz it got."
No, that's not really true. People get over graphics pretty quick. If the game was only mediochre, it would have died a quick death instead of being held at the highest bar.
Slashdot Mirror
"...then maybe they should MAKE SOME."
They're pouring tons of $$$ into R&D so that when they do that, you aren't paying a monthly fee. Believe me, they are making some.
"OTOH they just said that "Hey we can man make an add-on for the N64 that does all these magic tricks" but they never did it."
They did build it. It's called the 64DD. It doesn't have to be released to market to be patentable. All they have to do is have a working prototype.
I saw this MST3k blooper once where Tom called out "Cray" instead of "Crow". Still in character, And with false modesty, Crow replied with "Well that's very nice of you, Tom. I'm really more of a PC though."
(Not a verbatim quote.)
"Wow, they just patented telephones, VOIP, MMORPGs, etc... Sheesh, shouldn't something like this be a LITTLE obvious?"
*Sigh* no. They did not patent telephones and VOIP. The context is games here, and patents are VERY context sensisitive.
BTW, obvious has nothing to do with it. VOIP is not so easy. Consider how little horsepower the N64 had and that most of it went towards the game, and you may see what I mean. Solving the problem is what patents are about, not obviousness. Otherwise I'd patent matter transportation.
That's a nice image, man. And I'm a 3D artist, so hopefully you won't take that as a hollow compliment. :)
"A red and white checkered ball next to a Roman arch with a background of stormclouds. It's going to kick arse."
Make sure to use chrome and marble textures!
"No you don't, that's just it. POV-Ray is incredibly light-weight on your machine. It works by processing plain text files, which have scene definitions written in a pseudo-code language. If you have a machine that is sucky, it will just take that much longer to process your final image. "
I haven't used POV Ray so take what I'm saying with a grain of salt, but I think the idea is that you're supposed to use a GUI that creates that text file for you. I doubt the samples of art in their gallery were created by mathematical geniuses.
"I NEED the great computer to win the make great work to win the contest."
Hehe. You wouldn't believe how many times I've heard people blame their computer's speed for their art sucking. Guess they never saw the Last Starfighter.
"Personally I hope that the RIAA is successful in shutting down music file swapping."
No, you don't. It's the only competition the RIAA has. Until they lose their oligopoly status, I'd rather the civil disobedience continue. Heck, I wish the RIAA were actally suffering losses at the hands of music trading, sadly that just isn't happening.
At least we can thank Napster for making iTunes happen.
Hmm yeah I see what you're saying. You got some strong points I needta chew on.
Wish I had something more insightful to say, but I figured it's worth a karma hit to let you know I'm listening to what you said.
"The first point is that there is a lot of 3D done in maya under linux."
Sort of. It's used in studios a lot. That's not the same as saying that all those artists run Linux at home, which is coincidently where PLE would mostly be run.
" The other point is that maya ple is a response to max equivalent edition and not an effort to develop a new user base."
It's not to develop a new user base? Untrue. If you're an aspiring artist, you're not going to be able to drop thousands of dollars on something like Maya just to figure out if it's what you want to do. Your only practical resort is to use pirated versions of the software. The companies aren't big on this sort of thing, so they make the learning version to alleviate demand for their warez. It is very much a 'broaden user base' tool. It isn't very practical as much else considering the watermarking that is involved.
"Your point about cost is of course part of the situation but is not worth much if you don't put it in perspective with those 2 others."
No, sorry, you haven't defeated my point at all.
"So i guess you werent that realistic in your comment either."
Wrong. I'm very active in the 3D art community. There's been little to no mention of the lack of a Linux version of PLE. The simple reason is few people are even running Linux at home. There's barely any excitement over Lightwave getting ported to Linux. It falls under a 'would be nice' type of thing, but most of those people are thinking about render farm units that are $300 cheaper sans Windows. Don't need a PLE of either app for that.
"Keeping an interface similar allows for an easier migration of people who've been using Windows for years (office people). Thus, less training is needed and the migration costs are lower."
Lower than going through all the BS it takes to install these things? I don't think so.
"If they come up with something totally new, they get slammed for a steep learning curve. Reviewers go on tirades and whitepapers are written about how the TCO is too high because of the training necessary, etc."
These are very valid 'bitches'. You're not helping anybody by trying to play them down. Complex software and needlessly complex software are to very different things. Most of Linux and related software very neatly falls into the needlessly complex category, and there will ALWAYS be bitching about it until the community actually gets their act together and does something about it.
"JPL engineers have tried to correct the problem by renaming the interesting rock to 'Red Hat Linux 8.0'. They have no response from the catatonic rover as of yet."
Sadly, a phone call to Redhat surprisingly turned unhelpful when they suddenly announced they were no longer going to support 8.
"One interesting point to note is that, if it were possible to transport a person via this process, the trip would appear to be instantaneous. Although travel would occur at the speed of light, no time would appear to pass for the traveller. Cool."
Duplicate stories on Slashdot would be a wonderful benefit to these heroic travelers!
"Yea, right, like if maya was never used on linux."
Didn't say it wasn't. You should read the part of my post that talked about the number of people and the cost effectiveness etc.
I don't know why it's such a sore concept around here that Linux doesn't enjoy that many individual 3D artists. It's not because Linux sucks it's because we need other tools like Photoshop and After Effects. Gimp and Cinepaint are a start, but they're nowhere near as broad in terms of capability. If you're a generalist 3D artist, using Linux is like replacing your toolbox with a Leatherman.
"Then Blender has to do, for 'US' ... I guess ...."
Blender != Maya. If you're just interested in tinkering with it, then that's a fine solution. If you're actually interested in developing a career, then you're far better off just dual booting into Windows and running Maya PLE. Frankly, the OS doesn't matter a whole hell of a lot when doing this stuff for a living. It's the wrong place to cross your arms and say "It's Linux or nothin!"
"download 3D Studio Max and get the keygen from astalivista.box.sk (search for 3D Studio Max). Done and done, with full character studio too."
That's kind of like learning Java so you can be a C programmer. There's some overlap, but if it's a career you're aiming for, it's not the most direct route.
Just as a side note, if ya go about it that way and join some of the common art forums like CGTalk, don't bring up piracy. They are overy sensitive to the topic despite the fact that nearly every 3D artist out there has a cracker to thank. Bringing up keygens in those places is like saying something nice about Microsoft here.
"When last I contacted them they refused to believe you might want to learn their product on Linux and thus if you want Maya on Linux be prepared to shell out the $$..."
Refused to believe one would want to learn on Linux, or wasn't convinced enough people were running exclusively Linux for it to be cost effective to make PLE available?
I know it's fun to aim our pitchforks at people for not supporting Linux, but be realistic.
> What, you don't have to install a new version of Windows to get the LatestAndGreatest worms and viruses?
What, you ran out of steam on the original discussion so now you're after a second round? Musta got ya more wound up than I realized. Linux shills are funny.
"but buying eight or ten games would bring my investment up to the price of a decent (not top-of-the-line, bought in parts) computer, which I would greatly prefer."
So what'd you post that comment with, a TI-85?
" We all know gnu/linux is still a niche phenomenon on Desktops, and 1% of all people accessing Google is _millions_ of people. That's pretty a damn respectable figure in my book."
Assuming:
a.) It's not a rounding error. (Like a chart will read 0%....)
b.) It's not a category like "everything else".
C.) It's actually counting machines vs. hits.
Since I can't load TFA I appreciate corrections. In a general sense, though, 2% is a hell of a lot more amazing than 1%.
"Palm's are great for keeping track of names, apointments, general information and taking notes while on the run."... and bathroom reading.
"I can't see the advantage of using a palm over using a small notebook (12" ibook or powerbook for example) - espiecally for browsing using Wifi cards as shown here. A compacted and hard to read screen compared to a full internet browser. Surely the space it takes up is made up for in usability nowdays."
Nobody said it was for everybody. Frankly, though, you'd have a lot easier time seeing it if you were trying to find it. Laptops just can't go everywhere. They don't 'instant on'. Their battery life is HORRIBLE compared to a Palm or PocketPC. The form factor itself is a huge nuisance. Even with something as small as a Powerbook, those things feel like they're just WAITING to jump out of your lap.
There are times where it'd be handy to have a small handheld unit to grab the latest news headlines. During commercials, for example. You're not going to drag your laptop out for that. WIth the Palm, though, you hit 'on' and click a bookmark. Quick check of email? No problem. Heck, even log on and get your instant messages. Piece of cake. Maybe I won't do hard core research on it, but I have times where I don't want to get up and go to my desk just to get a bit of info off the net. It's an entertainment device. Nothing wrong with that.
I ended up just getting a Tablet PC. I miss the instant on etc, but it does boot quickly, has long battery life, and the slate mode with a stylus is much easier on the lap when there's no typing to do. If I didn't get this, I'd be using a PDA instead, and quite happy about it. Sure it's limited. BFD, it's still small and couch-surfable.
Again, it's not for everybody, but come on, how come some of these possibilities didn't cross your mind?
" ...what's left of DKC is a competent enough platformer, but not something deserving of the buzz it got."
No, that's not really true. People get over graphics pretty quick. If the game was only mediochre, it would have died a quick death instead of being held at the highest bar.
"What did people DO with their longer battery life?"
They don't have to regularly stop their game because the battery died.