Hey, I'm a big fan of XFS but I have had file system corruption using it. Postgres up and died while the system was hitting the disk pretty hard. All the processes accessing the data directory up and stalled.
It was pretty bad, xfs_repair worked fine but I had a lot of orphaned pgsql files in lost+found. I've since recompiled my kernel with the hella old egcs version they recommended (had to compile and patch that myself, too, since debian doesn't have it anymore).
It's been working fine with the new kernel, but any time that server hiccups I'm scared to death it's going to get corrupt again....
"I perhaps overstate my ineptitude, but you would be smart in never hiring me to do an install!:) Yellow Dog installs just fine, but there are numerous spots that can be hang-ups and makes Linux unusable for the average person."
No arguement here. And your point about custom options causes some of this mess. But that's why you have uber geeks like me fix it for the users. What blissful nirvana their lives must be.:-)
"All I get is the machine constantly flashing the text loging inteface, but I can't login because it keeps "resetting". I've fsck'ed it and all that, but it still doesn't work and I have no idea how to fix it."
Well, this isn't usually a forum for tech support, but I'd be glad to help if I can. X is failing to start, so you are going to need to login as root (the flashing will stop after a couple of tries to start X).
If you execute `tail/var/log/XFree86.0.log` it'll most likely tell you why it can't start. Probably a video card or font problem. If it says something like "Can't find fixed font," then try `/etc/init.d/xfs start`.
You may think this is horrible that you have to do this to fix your box, but I've seen the Windows safe mode more times than I care to recall.:-) It's a nice point-and-click interface that's supposed to help you fix things, but it usually fails to do anything powerful enough to be very useful.
I do have an OS X iBook. After trying to get Debian installed, and failing (funny enough) because there's no XFree driver for my radeon mobility card, I actually had to boot into OS 9's install disk to repartition the drive. Had it been a Linux box it would have been nothing to drop to a terminal and fix things for myself... OS X just died during that process.... But it did look good sitting there doing nothing.:-)
Anyway, my point: the terminal and configurability may scare users but it's still important...
"The problem is that your example is purely anecdotal."
I don't have access to a large pool of users to survey.:-)
"Without an O'Reilly book and some gumption, I can't get Linux to install right all the time, even in a nice distro format like Yellow Dog! One wrong click and I have to start all over! And not to mention that somtimes, nice features such as the GUI login just stop working (which is where I am at right now with it!)"
Like the other poster said, that's just sad. I'm sorry, but how do you get through any installs?
Look, I was talking about a corporate user, one of those fabled "enterprise" desktops we hear so much about. She would never have to ever install... anything. Her drive would be one big partition, the OS something dd'ed from a generic install box. Because you can't get through a Linux install only means I'd never hire you, not that Linux can't be a success on the coporate desktop.:-)
My users have all been trained to find things on their desktop. (In fact, if a program's not there, they call the helpdesk guy to "install" it...) All I do is get their software together and put a link on the desktop.
But to get back to the point, configurability is important to me so I can customise everything on the box for my users. On the desktop, configurability is important for the all-so-important, breathless call "I don't like how X works!"
> The Linux "collective" needs to start making Linux less configurable (yes I said LESS) for the average user. The average user just doesn't care about all the configurability of Linux... heck, I'm a slightly above average user and I don't care!!! When the learning curve is less steep for Linux, or when somebody offers a distro (Lycoris?) that has less of a learning curve (a sort of Linux Home edition), then Linux will make some major inroads into the home.
Hell no!:-)
Let me tell you, there's an older lady at my company who'll be retiring in a couple of days. I once mentioned Linux while I was working on her computer and she bubbled right up. Seems that she once used KDE at another company... and loved it.
Now, she doesn't know the first thing about her computer. She's one of those users that needs help to install a comet cursor, but she did love Linux because she could change everything about it. (She happens to be quite fond of changing themes and backgrounds.)
>Also, even the most effective software testers are no match against users when it comes to discovering loopholes and sources of problems in software interfaces!
Not for me to argue about users finding bugs and all, but I've taken all that I've learned about OS software development and applied it to my internal project, which I've been hacking away at for the last eight months.
Here's some things that'll help: - Enforce a strict release schedule. If there's a bug, find a work-around. Because it's internal or small-scale software it's tempting to go ahead and fix the problem, but you'll only through yourself into more trouble by releasing essentially untested code out the door.
- Involve users at every stage of the development process you can. That way, there'll be no suprises when release time comes, and no manager/PHB saying, "Well, it doesn't cover X, so I'm not going to use it."
- Learn to say no, and get your boss to understand the importance. You're in charge of the project. Many times users ask for things that just don't make logical sense or are not feasable to do. You know better than they do, so... "No."
"OS 9, despite having less eye candy than OS X, was architecturally better for the home user in just about every way than OS X"
Heh. Granted we're talking about home users here, who don't require five nines availability, but one of the major barriers to the Mac's acceptance has always been its crashiness.
Cooperative multitasking was a mistake when they built the first Mac, and it's was a mistake all the way up to OS 9.
It is a little misleading. The power options there are what most people probably look for, but what they don't mention is there is a "details" button that grows the entire window larger to fit the disk and sleep options you speak of....
No way this will work. For normal traffic, yes. But it'll cause problems with several different vpn solutions. You don't want to be stuck helping almost a hundred different admins debug why app X suddenly stopped working.
"I'm going to let you in on a dirty little secret I'm a Republican. You can flame me for this later. But being a Republican, I believe in the independence of the people from the government, and extend this independence for corporations as well. I believe in a fair, and open marketplace free of monopolies...."
Forgive me, but you sound more libertarian than you do Republican. Your party is in the process of implementing one of the largest increases in government size in recent memory (federalizing airport security). Our new Republican President broke records during the election for fund raising, including a cozy relationship with a now shamefully defunct energy trading company. Your party, while you may believe they want the people's freedom from big government, is trampling some of our basic rights with the PATRIOT act and illegally holding prisoners without trials, or even accusations.
When I think of the Republican party, I think big government and their often uncomfortably close relationship with corporations. You believe in freedom from the government.... I'm not trying to flame you, I just think you might want to reexamine whether your party has the same goals as you seem to have.
Simple advice, kept short: keep your eyes on your goals, always work towards them, and be patient.
You're young, and you'll get into the field soon enough. But let's face it, lots of tech people are taking jobs at Best Buy in order to pay the rent. You can curse your parents for having you too late to enjoy the dotcom boom.:-)
Nobody is going to pay you what you're worth, so you're looking to gain experience. (Real experience, not setting up your friend's filesharing server. I mean something the PHBs will respect.)
Also, take advantage of the fact that you still live with your parents (hopefully:-). Later in life, you'll have to take jobs that won't teach you anything because you have to by the wife a huge SUV to haul the kids to soccer practice. Look for the sort of job that will give you experience and further your skills and take it, no matter how degrading you think the pay is.
"Mistake number 1. He and his partner getting separated."
Stupid. But, understandable if you've ever done it. Over the noise of the machine, it's very unlikely that you'll hear your best friend run into a tree, much less notice he's gone.
"Mistake number 2. Not being skilled/equipped enough to navigate once lost."
Wrestlers aren't known for their intelligence.:-)
"Mistake number 4. Falling in the river. Don't ask me how he managed that one."
From the sound of it, the combined weight of him and the snowmobile cracked the ice. He was swerving all over the river bed trying to get himself out. He panicked. Mistake 4.5.
"He can dig a snow trench (if he didn't have a snow shovel in the snow mobile, he's a moron who deserves to die in an avalanche) or find shelter in a tree-well."
From a different article, it sounds like this is what he did. Once he realized he was in Real Big Trouble (tm), he did stop and look for shelter.
The reason I think the jacket could have done this guy good:
The rescuers were just 200 yards away from him that same night. But hypothermia had already set in and he couldn't move enough to respond. I'm guessing that means a body core temperature of 75-80 degrees.
Now, had he an external source of heat -- a fire, the jacket, or even just some spare clothes -- he wouldn't have even had to spend the night.
"For more severe hypothermia, it will be necessary to warm the victim. Certainly if you are in a group, someone else can warm you up. If you are solo, your best bet will be to prevent that situation from ever occurring. And I doubt that anyone soloing would want to carry the extra weight for an emergency battery-powered heat-you-up blanket."
I agree with you, but I was thinking of the gold-medal winning wrestler who just recently found himself in a survival situation.
You can read about it here: http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f ile=/ne ws/archive/2002/02/19/state1322EST7807.DTL
He didn't have extra clothes or survival gear packed into his snowmobile. (Which would have saved his toes.)
The least he could have done is wear this coat on the trip. Assuming it still works after it's gotten wet, that is.:-)
"- Batteries work very bad/not at all in cold conditions, you world have to keep the entire resupply of batteries inside the jacket."
Well, the battery would be right next to the core of your body, so presumably they would be warm enough to heat the jacket. (And in turn, heat themselves.)
"Cotton still works very well from -15 deg C"
You've got to be kidding. Do you have any idea how many soldiers and weekend warriors would die in the wilderness if you sent them out wearing cotton?
Cotton soaks up water. That means if you sweat at all, they'll find the body sometime in the spring.
"Having tried that once, it was not very pleasant."
Well, I don't know about the submitter either, but $500 for a good coat is well worth the price.
Just think if emergency situations -- fall in a puddle of water while separated from the group? Just turn on the coat! If you carry another battery and use the heat sparingly, it could easily save your life....
(Of course, REI must have been thinking the same thing when they dropped some poor guy in the snow.:-)
Slashdot Mirror
Hey, just install Debian if you don't like OSX...
Oh yeah, they also did the Palm V. That thing has a great feel in your hand. Can't say much good about the software, but the hardware is nice...
They rock. :-)
Hey, I'm a big fan of XFS but I have had file system corruption using it. Postgres up and died while the system was hitting the disk pretty hard. All the processes accessing the data directory up and stalled.
It was pretty bad, xfs_repair worked fine but I had a lot of orphaned pgsql files in lost+found. I've since recompiled my kernel with the hella old egcs version they recommended (had to compile and patch that myself, too, since debian doesn't have it anymore).
It's been working fine with the new kernel, but any time that server hiccups I'm scared to death it's going to get corrupt again....
"I perhaps overstate my ineptitude, but you would be smart in never hiring me to do an install! :) Yellow Dog installs just fine, but there are numerous spots that can be hang-ups and makes Linux unusable for the average person."
:-)
/var/log/XFree86.0.log` it'll most likely tell you why it can't start. Probably a video card or font problem. If it says something like "Can't find fixed font," then try `/etc/init.d/xfs start`.
:-) It's a nice point-and-click interface that's supposed to help you fix things, but it usually fails to do anything powerful enough to be very useful.
:-)
No arguement here. And your point about custom options causes some of this mess. But that's why you have uber geeks like me fix it for the users. What blissful nirvana their lives must be.
"All I get is the machine constantly flashing the text loging inteface, but I can't login because it keeps "resetting". I've fsck'ed it and all that, but it still doesn't work and I have no idea how to fix it."
Well, this isn't usually a forum for tech support, but I'd be glad to help if I can. X is failing to start, so you are going to need to login as root (the flashing will stop after a couple of tries to start X).
If you execute `tail
You may think this is horrible that you have to do this to fix your box, but I've seen the Windows safe mode more times than I care to recall.
I do have an OS X iBook. After trying to get Debian installed, and failing (funny enough) because there's no XFree driver for my radeon mobility card, I actually had to boot into OS 9's install disk to repartition the drive. Had it been a Linux box it would have been nothing to drop to a terminal and fix things for myself... OS X just died during that process.... But it did look good sitting there doing nothing.
Anyway, my point: the terminal and configurability may scare users but it's still important...
"The problem is that your example is purely anecdotal."
:-)
:-)
I don't have access to a large pool of users to survey.
"Without an O'Reilly book and some gumption, I can't get Linux to install right all the time, even in a nice distro format like Yellow Dog! One wrong click and I have to start all over! And not to mention that somtimes, nice features such as the GUI login just stop working (which is where I am at right now with it!)"
Like the other poster said, that's just sad. I'm sorry, but how do you get through any installs?
Look, I was talking about a corporate user, one of those fabled "enterprise" desktops we hear so much about. She would never have to ever install... anything. Her drive would be one big partition, the OS something dd'ed from a generic install box. Because you can't get through a Linux install only means I'd never hire you, not that Linux can't be a success on the coporate desktop.
My users have all been trained to find things on their desktop. (In fact, if a program's not there, they call the helpdesk guy to "install" it...) All I do is get their software together and put a link on the desktop.
But to get back to the point, configurability is important to me so I can customise everything on the box for my users. On the desktop, configurability is important for the all-so-important, breathless call "I don't like how X works!"
> The Linux "collective" needs to start making Linux less configurable (yes I said LESS) for the average user. The average user just doesn't care about all the configurability of Linux... heck, I'm a slightly above average user and I don't care!!! When the learning curve is less steep for Linux, or when somebody offers a distro (Lycoris?) that has less of a learning curve (a sort of Linux Home edition), then Linux will make some major inroads into the home.
:-)
Hell no!
Let me tell you, there's an older lady at my company who'll be retiring in a couple of days. I once mentioned Linux while I was working on her computer and she bubbled right up. Seems that she once used KDE at another company... and loved it.
Now, she doesn't know the first thing about her computer. She's one of those users that needs help to install a comet cursor, but she did love Linux because she could change everything about it. (She happens to be quite fond of changing themes and backgrounds.)
Alpha was dropped during the service pack releases. The basic 4.0 came with alpha support....
>Also, even the most effective software testers are no match against users when it comes to discovering loopholes and sources of problems in software interfaces!
Not for me to argue about users finding bugs and all, but I've taken all that I've learned about OS software development and applied it to my internal project, which I've been hacking away at for the last eight months.
Here's some things that'll help:
- Enforce a strict release schedule. If there's a bug, find a work-around. Because it's internal or small-scale software it's tempting to go ahead and fix the problem, but you'll only through yourself into more trouble by releasing essentially untested code out the door.
- Involve users at every stage of the development process you can. That way, there'll be no suprises when release time comes, and no manager/PHB saying, "Well, it doesn't cover X, so I'm not going to use it."
- Learn to say no, and get your boss to understand the importance. You're in charge of the project. Many times users ask for things that just don't make logical sense or are not feasable to do. You know better than they do, so... "No."
"OS 9, despite having less eye candy than OS X, was architecturally better for the home user in just about every way than OS X"
Heh. Granted we're talking about home users here, who don't require five nines availability, but one of the major barriers to the Mac's acceptance has always been its crashiness.
Cooperative multitasking was a mistake when they built the first Mac, and it's was a mistake all the way up to OS 9.
It is a little misleading. The power options there are what most people probably look for, but what they don't mention is there is a "details" button that grows the entire window larger to fit the disk and sleep options you speak of....
No way this will work. For normal traffic, yes. But it'll cause problems with several different vpn solutions. You don't want to be stuck helping almost a hundred different admins debug why app X suddenly stopped working.
:-)
I've tried it.
"I'm going to let you in on a dirty little secret I'm a Republican. You can flame me for this later. But being a Republican, I believe in the independence of the people from the government, and extend this independence for corporations as well. I believe in a fair, and open marketplace free of monopolies...."
Forgive me, but you sound more libertarian than you do Republican. Your party is in the process of implementing one of the largest increases in government size in recent memory (federalizing airport security). Our new Republican President broke records during the election for fund raising, including a cozy relationship with a now shamefully defunct energy trading company. Your party, while you may believe they want the people's freedom from big government, is trampling some of our basic rights with the PATRIOT act and illegally holding prisoners without trials, or even accusations.
When I think of the Republican party, I think big government and their often uncomfortably close relationship with corporations. You believe in freedom from the government.... I'm not trying to flame you, I just think you might want to reexamine whether your party has the same goals as you seem to have.
that explains it! god forgot to flush!
printf("Hello World\n");
:-)
Yeah, I know. I don't know why, but I was a little annoyed that "Economist" thought IE was the only browser with Goggle shortcuts....
And if you use Galeon (yeah, let the flames come), you don't have to download the Google Bar, it's already in the bookmarks toolbar.
For the curious: right-click, new tab the google bookmark opens a dialog. Searching on cookies does the same damn thing.
almost correct, gdict says:
One who worships false gods; an idolater; a heathen; one who
is neither a Christian, a Mohammedan, nor a Jew.
Neither having the accent of Christians, nor the gait
of Christian, pagan, nor man. --Shak.
umm... the Open Source community pretty much *is* the users.
it's different when m$ chooses software for their users than when the users choose it themselves.
actually, that's how it's supposed to work.
turn off javascript.... the site looks fine.
Simple advice, kept short: keep your eyes on your goals, always work towards them, and be patient.
:-)
:-). Later in life, you'll have to take jobs that won't teach you anything because you have to by the wife a huge SUV to haul the kids to soccer practice. Look for the sort of job that will give you experience and further your skills and take it, no matter how degrading you think the pay is.
You're young, and you'll get into the field soon enough. But let's face it, lots of tech people are taking jobs at Best Buy in order to pay the rent. You can curse your parents for having you too late to enjoy the dotcom boom.
Nobody is going to pay you what you're worth, so you're looking to gain experience. (Real experience, not setting up your friend's filesharing server. I mean something the PHBs will respect.)
Also, take advantage of the fact that you still live with your parents (hopefully
"Mistake number 1. He and his partner getting
:-)
separated."
Stupid. But, understandable if you've ever done it. Over the noise of the machine, it's very unlikely that you'll hear your best friend run into a tree, much less notice he's gone.
"Mistake number 2. Not being skilled/equipped
enough to navigate once lost."
Wrestlers aren't known for their intelligence.
"Mistake number 4. Falling in the river.
Don't ask me how he managed that one."
From the sound of it, the combined weight of him and the snowmobile cracked the ice. He was swerving all over the river bed trying to get himself out. He panicked. Mistake 4.5.
"He can dig a snow trench (if he didn't have a snow shovel in the snow mobile, he's a moron who deserves to die in an avalanche)
or find shelter in a tree-well."
From a different article, it sounds like this is what he did. Once he realized he was in Real Big Trouble (tm), he did stop and look for shelter.
The reason I think the jacket could have done this guy good:
The rescuers were just 200 yards away from him that same night. But hypothermia had already set in and he couldn't move enough to respond. I'm guessing that means a body core temperature of 75-80 degrees.
Now, had he an external source of heat -- a fire, the jacket, or even just some spare clothes -- he wouldn't have even had to spend the night.
And it gets crazy cold in Wyoming....
"For more severe hypothermia, it will be
f ile=/ne ws/archive/2002/02/19/state1322EST7807.DTL
:-)
necessary to warm the victim. Certainly if
you are in a group, someone else can warm
you up. If you are solo, your best bet will
be to prevent that situation from ever
occurring. And I doubt that anyone soloing
would want to carry the extra weight for
an emergency battery-powered heat-you-up
blanket."
I agree with you, but I was thinking of the gold-medal winning wrestler who just recently found himself in a survival situation.
You can read about it here:
http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?
He didn't have extra clothes or survival gear packed into his snowmobile. (Which would have saved his toes.)
The least he could have done is wear this coat on the trip. Assuming it still works after it's gotten wet, that is.
"- Batteries work very bad/not at all in cold conditions, you world have to keep the entire resupply of batteries inside the jacket."
Well, the battery would be right next to the core of your body, so presumably they would be warm enough to heat the jacket. (And in turn, heat themselves.)
"Cotton still works very well from -15 deg C"
You've got to be kidding. Do you have any idea how many soldiers and weekend warriors would die in the wilderness if you sent them out wearing cotton?
Cotton soaks up water. That means if you sweat at all, they'll find the body sometime in the spring.
"Having tried that once, it was not very pleasant."
You didn't happen to be wearing cotton, were you?
:-)
Well, I don't know about the submitter either, but $500 for a good coat is well worth the price.
:-)
Just think if emergency situations -- fall in a puddle of water while separated from the group? Just turn on the coat! If you carry another battery and use the heat sparingly, it could easily save your life....
(Of course, REI must have been thinking the same thing when they dropped some poor guy in the snow.
So try Gnome.
I understand the KDE people are working on the speed issues, in the mean time, I think you'll be impressed.
Or, ther are always a bunch of window managers you can use -- enlightenment and windowmaker are some of my favorites.
Try 'em.