Duke Nukem II ran fine, as did Tie Fighter. But Tie Fighter looked so much better, with the graphics options on, on my friends 386DX 40MHz...bastard could run Quake, too!
Jason: What led to Google's decision to use Linux? When did that start?
Sergey: Well, Larry Page and I were in the Stanford PhD program in Computer Science. And we developed Google there. The way the computer science program worked is there was a hodgepodge of computer equipment lying around, and we would grab whatever scraps we could. We had all kinds of computers: HPs, Suns, Alphas and Intel's running Linux. So, we gained a lot of experience with all of those platforms.
When we started Google, we had to make the decision of what we wanted to use. Of course we chose Linux, because it is the most cost effective solution.
PCs are not only much cheaper these days, but we can also get them very quickly, because they're such a commodity item. That's an incredible benefit. We just installed another 1,000 computers and we got that done in a few weeks. That's really hard to do with any other kind of workstation. I think that's an advantage that people don't entirely realize.
Jason: Did you view it as being better, or was cost the main reason?
Sergey: It was better in some ways. Certainly for our purposes, we felt the support was better. For example, the actual kernel authors will respond to problems pretty quickly. They are especially responsive to Google nowadays, since we're so widely used. We can have a 15 minute turnaround. You can't really beat that for support.
That was an important factor, but frankly, the cost was a bigger issue. PCs are so cheap, which is very important. Sun's Solaris is probably more stable than Linux on PCs. It's hard to determine the blame, whether it's the hardware or the operating system. But, it's a minor difference.
Jason: Then, does all of your support come from newsgroups or do you actually pay for it through Red Hat?
Sergey: We have an operations team of about ten people, which helps a lot. And other than that we check newsgroups and e-mail the authors of the code. Usually, if it's a problem we can't figure out, we go straight to the authors.
Jason: Is Linux used on desktops at Google?
Sergey: It depends. Engineering mostly runs Linux. Business development/marketing runs Windows. Actually, I use Linux with VMWare running Windows. Some people have two computers, particularly some people in engineering who do UI development and need to test things out on Windows platforms. I find it better to just use VmWare and have one computer.
Jason: In a technical sense, what does Linux lack? What does it not provide?
Sergey: The 64-bit file system, which I know they are working on. It's slowly coming around. I think there are still occasionally some stability issues. I'm not saying Linux is unique in that respect, but you definitely want to have reliability. There are some issues dealing with higher memory systems. If you get to 2GB, and you try to push it past that, we encounter various problems. I know we've had some trouble with the network stack when we really push it hard. In terms of having lost most connections from lots of different machines.
And from another...
How is Linux used at the Google Projects? Why was Linux choose to improve Google search engine?
Sergey Brin: Actually, we currently run over 6,000 RedHat servers.
Linux is used everywhere...on the 6,000+ servers themselves, as well as desktop machines for all of our technical employees. We chose Linux because if offers us the price for performance ratio. It's so nice to be able to customize any part of the operating system that we like, at anytime. We have a large degree of in-house Linux expertise, too.
Most of our administrative tools were developed in-house, as well.
I downloaded them from a WildCat! BBS, on a 2400bps modem. Thank god for Y-Modem Batch, or whatever it was.
It took me all night. I woke up in the morning, installed it. Typed cd, ls, vi. I wrote a C program (was just leaving Pascal), and waited 7 minutes for the damn thing to compile. I re-installed DOS, and went back to playing Duke Nukem, Tie Fighter, and Prince of Persia.
People don't buy many small computers just because they will run Linux (the geek population just isn't that large). People do, however, blow large chunks of cash on big machines just to run Linux. Mom-and-Pop can almost always undercut IBM on prices for small machines, and geeks are thrifty. You don't have to sell many million dollar machines to justify being involved in Linux development.
I think they should have given us a better answer than this. IBM should hire 10 guys like me, pay them $25 an hour, UPS them some equipment, and let them hack ThinkPads all day from home. I use a lot of Dell laptops, most of their machines work great under Linux.
How do other companies handle their Linux+laptops? Or don't they?
Alerting the sys admin that the user in accounting has been opening their PC?
I remember when I worked at Best Buy, people would come in, with their WARRANTY VOID tape broken on their Packard Bells, and there's no way we could prove they opened their machine up and fucked it up....
They started to raise rates. They started giving lower quality of service, in both uptime, and stability. They wanted to charge $5.95 a month for modem rental. No more servers. No more static ip addresses. Blocking certain ports.
What did I do?
Turned it back in. $39.95 I have no problem paying, but $67.95, for crap?
Slashdot Mirror
What about that commerical where they say "Like to play with stuff?"
Finally, unless you are going for a Dell [dell.com] please go to a computer store and browse.
I'm bringing my Linux CD's with me when I go to Best Buy, to make sure the modem, video card, and NIC work under RedHat.
If you are going to use Linux, check out a quick google search first to see people's impressions of the compatibility.
That's a good idea. Simply ask IRC channels, chat rooms, web-based message boards, newsgroups...it's easy to buy a Laptop that SUCKS.
IBM makes their money on big iron servers, they always have. They don't make money on desktops, etc.
1024k of RAM
386SX 16MHz
Duke Nukem II ran fine, as did Tie Fighter. But Tie Fighter looked so much better, with the graphics options on, on my friends 386DX 40MHz...bastard could run Quake, too!
Right here on Slashdot!
Who would have thought?
From one interview...
Jason: What led to Google's decision to use Linux? When did that start?
Sergey: Well, Larry Page and I were in the Stanford PhD program in Computer Science. And we developed Google there. The way the computer science program worked is there was a hodgepodge of computer equipment lying around, and we would grab whatever scraps we could. We had all kinds of computers: HPs, Suns, Alphas and Intel's running Linux. So, we gained a lot of experience with all of those platforms.
When we started Google, we had to make the decision of what we wanted to use. Of course we chose Linux, because it is the most cost effective solution.
PCs are not only much cheaper these days, but we can also get them very quickly, because they're such a commodity item. That's an incredible benefit. We just installed another 1,000 computers and we got that done in a few weeks. That's really hard to do with any other kind of workstation. I think that's an advantage that people don't entirely realize.
Jason: Did you view it as being better, or was cost the main reason?
Sergey: It was better in some ways. Certainly for our purposes, we felt the support was better. For example, the actual kernel authors will respond to problems pretty quickly. They are especially responsive to Google nowadays, since we're so widely used. We can have a 15 minute turnaround. You can't really beat that for support.
That was an important factor, but frankly, the cost was a bigger issue. PCs are so cheap, which is very important. Sun's Solaris is probably more stable than Linux on PCs. It's hard to determine the blame, whether it's the hardware or the operating system. But, it's a minor difference.
Jason: Then, does all of your support come from newsgroups or do you actually pay for it through Red Hat?
Sergey: We have an operations team of about ten people, which helps a lot. And other than that we check newsgroups and e-mail the authors of the code. Usually, if it's a problem we can't figure out, we go straight to the authors.
Jason: Is Linux used on desktops at Google?
Sergey: It depends. Engineering mostly runs Linux. Business development/marketing runs Windows. Actually, I use Linux with VMWare running Windows. Some people have two computers, particularly some people in engineering who do UI development and need to test things out on Windows platforms. I find it better to just use VmWare and have one computer.
Jason: In a technical sense, what does Linux lack? What does it not provide?
Sergey: The 64-bit file system, which I know they are working on. It's slowly coming around. I think there are still occasionally some stability issues. I'm not saying Linux is unique in that respect, but you definitely want to have reliability. There are some issues dealing with higher memory systems. If you get to 2GB, and you try to push it past that, we encounter various problems. I know we've had some trouble with the network stack when we really push it hard. In terms of having lost most connections from lots of different machines.
And from another...
How is Linux used at the Google Projects? Why was Linux choose to improve Google search engine?
Sergey Brin: Actually, we currently run over 6,000 RedHat servers.
Linux is used everywhere...on the 6,000+ servers themselves, as well as desktop machines for all of our technical employees. We chose Linux because if offers us the price for performance ratio. It's so nice to be able to customize any part of the operating system that we like, at anytime. We have a large degree of in-house Linux expertise, too.
Most of our administrative tools were developed in-house, as well.
This guy uses AOL?
If you lay fiber in your subdivision, you're going to have a faster network than AOL themselves!
Laying fiber isn't cheap, neither is the switching etc equipment...
These guys make batteries that don't leak gas.
But, the idea of car batteries flying around a hospital doesn't sit quite well with me.
It's still similar to when I was using it in...1992 at college.
But...Linux distributions seem to mutate each point release
Al-Qaeda!
Delete that post!
Bin Laden's cronies are all Slashdot Trolls!
I'll print it out on the 75PPM Copier we have.
Then, I'll take a step over to our binding machine. It uses glue, not those plastic combs.
I downloaded them from a WildCat! BBS, on a 2400bps modem. Thank god for Y-Modem Batch, or whatever it was.
It took me all night. I woke up in the morning, installed it. Typed cd, ls, vi. I wrote a C program (was just leaving Pascal), and waited 7 minutes for the damn thing to compile. I re-installed DOS, and went back to playing Duke Nukem, Tie Fighter, and Prince of Persia.
You're kidding, right?
They'll compromise a real weak server/app, and then hit the rest of your network up
Here's more info on dongles
http://linux20368.dn.net/crackz/Dongles.htm
I've had fairly good luck with Sony laptops also. Toshiba's have been so-so
People don't buy many small computers just because they will run Linux (the geek population just isn't that large). People do, however, blow large chunks of cash on big machines just to run Linux. Mom-and-Pop can almost always undercut IBM on prices for small machines, and geeks are thrifty. You don't have to sell many million dollar machines to justify being involved in Linux development.
I think they should have given us a better answer than this. IBM should hire 10 guys like me, pay them $25 an hour, UPS them some equipment, and let them hack ThinkPads all day from home. I use a lot of Dell laptops, most of their machines work great under Linux.
How do other companies handle their Linux+laptops? Or don't they?
Remember, these people couldn't even promote THIER OWN operating system
Does this tape interface to you computer?
Alerting the sys admin that the user in accounting has been opening their PC?
I remember when I worked at Best Buy, people would come in, with their WARRANTY VOID tape broken on their Packard Bells, and there's no way we could prove they opened their machine up and fucked it up....
Compaq, Dell, IBM...they all tell you when someone's opened the case, removed memory, added hard drives, etc etc....
C'mon!
Keeping the Pirates at Bay:
Implementing Crack Protection for Spyro: Year of the Dragon
So you're saying you don't want to buy it?
Aren't these the same clowns who were in on DIVX, which failed?
I'm a former Best Buy employee, so maybe I'm biased. Personally, I just don't like shopping anywhere with salespeople who work on commission.
It looks like it's finally on schedule for its projected June 21 release.
Looks like they are doing a good job in creating a Microsoft-like UI
I worked at a school district that had one of these setup, for the same purpose.
Zerver
It had a CDROM so you could 'rip' CD's right from the tower.
They started to raise rates. They started giving lower quality of service, in both uptime, and stability. They wanted to charge $5.95 a month for modem rental. No more servers. No more static ip addresses. Blocking certain ports.
What did I do?
Turned it back in. $39.95 I have no problem paying, but $67.95, for crap?
No thanks