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Version Fatigue
An anonymous reader writes "An article in TechCentralStation introduces a useful new term: "version fatigue," which describes what happens when you get tired of learning new ways to do the same old thing with each release of software. This is something that tech designers seem insensitive to, but that drives users crazy. Maybe it's because tech designers are more anxious to be creative than to produce things that users like?"
It's still similar to when I was using it in...1992 at college.
But...Linux distributions seem to mutate each point release
Engineers are just the new artists on the block.
FP?
-flamesplash
"Not knowing when the dawn will come, I open every door." - Emily Dickinson
It seems that the UI of most Unix software (the shell, Emacs, even X) has changed much less over the last 20 years than DOS/Windows, and is still changing more slowly now. Is this an explanation for why Unix users typically learn more of the intricate features of their software? Or does the causation run the other way round - because all the obscure Emacs keybindings are so well known by its users (and developers), they can't be changed?
-- Ed Avis ed@membled.com
Hey, we are all just a bit high so we all see it as though it's all in italics, but it's just a figment of our imagination...
-- Tino Didriksen / Project JJ
Except for Open Source Software, versions don't get upgraded so often. But since hardly anyone (1%) are using OSS, it doesn't really make a difference now, does it?
hahaha. *sigh*
Meanwhile, I'm still looking for hardware to load Debian 2.2 onto.
I have been pwned because my
has over 15million lines of code and gets you on the internet 15% faster... (Kabooom)... F'n Windows 98!
look at what MS has done over the past 5 years with database access libraries.
We have had ODBC, Jet (various versions), SqlLib, RDO (various versions), ADO (many many versions). ODBCDirect, and now ADO.NET.
All do the same thing...Open the database, Get The data, close the database, and move on.
It is ridiculous.
I'm still working on a clever footer.
Nothing makes me happier than a slashdot front page that is pure italics. It looks great in Linux, because there's none of that nasty blurry anti-aliasing to get in the way!
Seriously, though, this article is a load of hooey. "Fatigue?" Please. It is an inconvenience at most. Is anyone complaining because their new Toyota doesn't have to be cranked before driving? Yes, interfaces and feature sets change over time. If you don't want the change, don't upgrade.
UI designers are by and large working for you, not against you. They're the ones who gave us context menus, tabbed browsing, keyboard accelerators, and every other Good Thing (tm) to come out of Redmond. This whining will get you nowhere.
Karma: Good (despite my invention of the Karma: sig)
Seriously. My expereince with users and clients is that they don't actually know what they want. They want something changed one day, then when you change it, they want it back the way it was. They change requirements on you in the middle of your development cycle, and can't make up their minds on anything.
But on the other hand, don't fix stuff that's not necessarily broke. If you come up with a better way, make sure it's extremely intuitive - because remember, users are stupid.
I think that this is a case where version fatigue simply introduces a slower and more annoying way of doing the same thing the same way.
This isn't a very useful new term - it's not even a new idea. Fact is that there is a central paradox in the world of commercial software - truly successful stuff doesn't sell. Or rather, it sells once, fixes all the user's problems, and you can't sell him anything else.
Without trying to be too cynical, this is a very obvious reason for the re-release of old apps with very minor changes to the previous version. How many NEW features of your latest word processor/IDE (delete as appropriate) do you really use? Chances are very few.
The re-release cycle is a real problem for consumer oriented companies. In a technical/business backend server market (like telecomms or banking) the problem is even worse - shift an app, which will run for ten years trouble free and provide full functionality, once and you may have destroyed your job! Who needs you once that ships?
Nah. Market forces dictate that broken or incomplete software will be much more dominant in the commercial marketplace.
Maybe it's because tech designers are more anxious to be creative than to produce things that users like?"
No, every user wants something else in the new release, and whatever subset of wishes you choose to implement, the other users are going to be disappointed.
Be wary of any facts that confirm your opinion.
Designers always are under the impression that "bleeding edge" is the most enticing way to go, and assume that is what the consumer desires. Usually, however this is not the case, people want a stable, easy to use interface.
It's time we let this little tidbit be known. Quit fixing things that aren't broken!
I am the evil aardvark!
But he still knows that this guy couldn't get laid to save his life.
I have been pwned because my
Adobe is aweful for this. I dread every photoshop release, I just no they're going to do something complicated and pointless to the interface.
The problem is, interface design is still an art and not a science. What little research that has gone into interfaces has gone completely unnoticed by the industry at large. I suppose there isn't vocal demand for improvement, so it won't happen.
In Capitalist America, bank robs you!
Working extensively with a designer/creative director/art director/etc. has definitely shown me that "version fatigue" is worth paying attention to. Particularly with applications like Adobe Photoshop. I try to stay on top of the new versions and the new features provided by said versions, but whenever I try to get a designer to upgrade, the resistance is magnificent. Changed command keys, different menu hierarchies, basically, different ways to do common things. I have a designer still using Photoshop 5.5 because its the last version she doesn't mind the interface for. Same goes for Illustrator - the "features" added between 8 and 9 (not to mention 10) kept this designer on 8 for over a year after 9 was released.
... but maybe I'm wrong? I dunno.
What I've learned is that when your work (and productivity) depends on a particular flow and interaction with your applications, even the smallest changes can significantly impact that and result in a very sour attitude towards new releases of software.
Now, what's the solution? I keep saying that there's no way for Adobe to add new features w/o incrementally changing the way you interact with the application
On the one hand, the article claims that people don't need to spend a lot of time learning things, because they're so intuitive. And that often people don't do more than scratch the surface. On the other, it bemoans changes in the operation of new revisions of software.
I can't think of any good examples of commodity software whose surface, elementary functions have changed in any massive way across revisions. The cosmetic look-and-feel changes, certainly -- but you can *still* click on that "B" button to get your text bolded, etc.
Besides, if users aren't spending the time in getting to learn the more esoteric functions, doesn't it make some sense to try to reimplement those functions in a fashion that renders their use more intuitive? Even if it's at the expense of the (apparently few) people who have spent the time learning how to use them?
I understand the frustration -- but, well, you can always *not upgrade* if what you have works for you.
I sometimes wonder what goes through the mind of the developers when they change a perfectly good working peice of software, and make it one that is harder to use.
Xaotik Designs
...why good operating systems have strong user interface guidelines. Apple is a notable example, its what makes them so easy to use. every joe blow windows programmer thinks he can revolutionize the UI, which makes running windows so god damn frustrating.
I want 2D games back.
Don't underestimate the effect of trying to make users feel like the 130 dollars they paid for the upgrade was well spent -- by completely reorganizing menus and features they certainly make you feel like you got something new.
:-)
At one point in my career I had three different versions of Word on three different machines. It was hilarious dealing with the different versions and how many differences there were, only to find out that, feature wise, they were almost identical.
I really hope the OpenOffice guys have a modicum of self control on this issue now that I've switched over to that office suite
"Version Fatigue" sounds like a politically correct term for whiny complainers. Bug fixes are a good thing. If Apache finds a bug in their HTTPD, I want them to fix it now instead of waiting because they feel they might hurt my feelings...
I know much of the time any changes in GUI design is driven by either complaints or changes in tools available. New GUI widgets are being developed at a phenominal rate. To the developer it's almost irresistable to not use somthing that seems to simplify a task.
On the other hand, between my wife and my mom I've had plenty of experience with the frustation users feel at radical changes. For instance the new option in MS Office Apps that default hides infrequently used Menu options and toolbar icons. It took me almost an hour to tell my mom over the phone how to get her right-justify button back.
There is hope though, if Adobe keeps patenting obvious GUI interface concepts we'll all be back to command line programs and the point will be moot.
"God fights on the side with the best artillery." - Napoleon, Marshal of France - speaking truth to power
> This is something that tech designers seem insensitive to, but that drives users crazy.
...
This doesn't sound like the techies I know. I've worked in the computer biz for three decades, and as long as I can remember, there has been a standard excuse for not upgrading to the latest release: "I've learned to use the old one. It's working fine for me. I've got work to do, and I don't want to waste time learning to use the latest version. Maybe when I find I need some of the new features, I'll consider upgrading."
This has always been a fact of life in the "tech" sector, to the frustration of the Customer Support people who are always dealing with people who are 30 revs behind. You don't hear about it much because techies don't make a fuss over it. We just quietly listen to the hype for the latest versions, and we ignore it, unless we hear something that we think will be useful enough to justify the time lost in an upgrade.
There are some linux systems that have been running continuously for around a decade now, without any upgrades at all
Those who do study history are doomed to stand helplessly by while everyone else repeats it.
Well maybe there not searching on google because there to busy
or setting up internet sites
All you've shown is search patterns.
Maybe the OSS changes less or has better help/forums than commercial software, so there's less need to search on google to solve your problems?
thank God the internet isn't a human right.
....have virgin fatigue
love is just extroverted narcissism
Seriously, 50% of his articles are hardly worth reading (this one), 25% have useless/annoying/inflamatory commentary, leaving at best 25% useful/quality slashdot articles (I think I am actually being very generous in these numbers).
"Convert people to Linux"? Who the fuck wants to do that? This isn't fundie Sunday School, dumbass, it's Tooltime. Get the right fucking tool for the right fucking job. Jackass.
On the other hand, I still know of people who would still be on Windows 3.1 and word 5.0 if they were not forced to "upgrade" for one reason or another.
heck, even look at webpages. With the new privacy statement implemetations in IE 6.0 people coding in basic HTML will tend to be locked out because the browser will generate an ominous error message about a lack of a privacy policy. The Current implementations of P3P are a legal minefield, so much so that at least one person has advocated dis-avowing p3p altogether, just for your corporate safety.
Version fatigue comes in when the new bells and whistles do not obviously justify the changes needed in work habits, and do not expand the core functionality in a useful and meaningful way.
there are only so many ways to re-invent the wheel.
Microsoft, for example, has got itself on a treadmill, because it has to come out with a new version, regardless of worth, every several years. This has irritated me so much that I hope they trip on the treadmill, fall, and do serious damage to themselves.
"It is a greater offense to steal men's labor, than their clothes"
I know it's usefull, but I somehow feel tired of geting the same example of how to print "hello world" every time you want to learn a new programming language...
I see Apache 2.0 as an achievement in this regard. When I was researching the new 2.0 branch I was expecting a new mind-bending config that'll destroy most of the work I had done over the years in standardizing my Apache builds; not so.
I can't say the same for every other software package out there, including almost every new major release of RedHat.
Luck favors the prepared, darling.
Programmers hate this too. You take something that's an old hat that can be done really well, and then you come up with a new way to do it that isn't really good. We do like BETTER stuff though, but rarely is it better.
*** Rant On ***
As a programmer I can speak to the software end of this conundrum involving "version fatigue." In the companies I've worked for, the programmers are the lifeblood of the enterprise, but often treated as little more than throwaways (albeit usually relatively well-paid). And, software projects/products rarely have a clear definition - so their development is a moving target. So programmers cannot define what they should build - because they lack any control (other than to drive from the backseat) - and no one else can definitively tell them.
What does this have to do with versions you say? Well, for software that actually gets out the door (the minority of projects to be honest), it's almost never *right*; in addition, it has a bevy of unnecessary features, which made it in due to an unclear vision of what the result should be. Therefore another version is needed to "get it right", of course the unclear vision remains so some improvement is made, maybe features are cut (a rarity), and some new unnecessary features are added, and others changed (but not for the better and sometimes for the worse).
A good book on this topic is Alan Cooper's "The Inmates are Running the Asylum" Amazon. It focuses on User Interface Design, which at the end of the day really means developing the disciplines and indentifying the user(s) to actually define what should be done before it's done!
*** Rant Off ***
I love my 4-year old Palm and there just isn't anything that's so new or improved in the new versions that I absolutely must have.
But that's not to say that I wouldn't take a new M515 color Palm or Sharp Zaurus (this is a test to see my my boyfriend really does look for and read my comments).
But software is not a traditional gift. "Here, Honey, I bought you the new release of Mandrake for your birthday." What a happy thought.
My experience with developers is that they don't do any QA to make sure their shit works. I have yet to see any OS that is intuitive in any way, shape, or form. Developers are so brain dead that they immediately take a different idea (like the Start bar) and copy it all over, giving up any hope for interface improvement (hello KDE, Gnome).
Don't get me started on incompatibilities, broken libraries, corrupt DLLs, false advertising, and instability. Just remember, developers are stupid. Don't trust your computer with anything.
-Dean
Especially when you are doing a software engineering project for clientele that you don't even know. In trying to establish a UI or base set of commands that seem the most user-friendly, the project designers are going out on a limb and using their own predispositions towards what they consider "easy".
Revisions and subsequent "version fatigue" results when they find out that, no, their intuitions were wrong, the users hate it/can't catch on easily enough, etc. The fact that it is even considered "fatigue" is that the concept of TIMTOWTDI is only applicable to the coder, not the user. They are stuck with what is sold to them, but in a move of consideration and a hope that the software can be more friendly, there is a revision. Different, must be relearned, but hopefully easier to use than the current product.
The biggest issue with this is that beta-testing is not done incremental, but comprehensively, in so many cases. The final result is that the overall amount of bugs that can be reported tend to dwarf "ease of use" issues, which are left to later revisions and version patches. Sad, but overwhelmingly the status quo.
Never attribute to Hanlon that which can be adequately attributed to Heinlein.
I think that it all comes down to the "this is more intuitive" myth.
Someone said that "the only intuitive interface is the nipple, after that everything else is learned".
Yes, there are things that really are the result of bad UI design, but most of the changes companies do to ther GUIs is because someone new comes and says "that is not intuitive", and not because it is bad UI design.
Hey, if it was hard to code it should be hard to use. Oh wait, maybe that was in reference to documentation.
-- Thou hast strayed far from the path of the Avatar.
I don't know who this AC is, but my friends and I are very much aware of the consequences of constantly changing the way you do things.
Our focus was on development, specifically why MS developers seem to have arrested development at about the level of 2 years of real experience. This isn't a slam against them - this was so widespread that we knew it had to be environmental.
We eventually figured out that the problem was Microsoft's constant reinvention of the wheel. We focused on the GUI, and compared the fact that we had been using the same libraries for a decade (Xlib for low-level routines, Motif for lists, menus, etc.), while in the same time MS Windows had released something like 4 separate, and incompatible, graphics libraries.
This mean that while we were able to build on our prior experience - and more importantly build on other organization's experiences as we brought in new employees with fresh ideas - the MS shops were constantly struggling to "stay in place" and there was essentially no institutional memory.
To be honest, I think much of the problems with MS Windows applications can be traced to this. After 10+ years of Unix experience, most people have been bitten by a fair number of "it could never happen" errors, and they instinctively take care to avoid a repeat. A MS Windows developer has probably seen as many errors, but how do you map the solution for a library three generations ago to the current one?
For every complex problem there is an answer that is clear, simple, and wrong. -- H L Mencken
I wouldn't say that it is tech designers being too anxious to be creative. I would say it is probably a lack of creativity on the developers part. I mean, yes there comes a point where you might need to write new code to do the same old thing. Cuz the old way of doing it is just outdated. But if you are creative you would find a way to do the old thing and some cool new thing all at once. All in all, I'm glad someone has finally coined a phrase to identify Microsoft's Software Development Process.
The Uber
http://www.tulg.org/
http://devurandom.livejournal.com/
Actually, when the first example in an introductionary book on a programming language isn't hello world, I usually throw it away. Some things are just sacred.
Only exception is "Introduction to Functional Programming using Haskell" by Richard Bird, which starts with the expression "42". I can live with that.
Be wary of any facts that confirm your opinion.
I get this when I connect with OPERA.
If you are using Opera 6.0 (or later) for your browser, the error may be related to your browser's configuration. Click here for a description of an Opera browser configuration parameter that may correct the misconfiguration.
The link says
503A-OPERA: Server Error When Visiting Site
The information in this article applies to:
- Opera Browsers (versions 6.0 and later)
SYMPTOMS
When attempting to view a website the following error appears in Opera Browsers:
Server Error
This server has encountered an internal error which prevents it from fulfilling your request. The most likely cause is a misconfiguration. Please ask the administrator to look for messages in the server's error log.
WORKAROUND
Close all Opera browser sessions
Locate the file opera.ini (Windows machines, usually can be found in \program files\opera\) or opera5.ini (Linux machines)
Locate the [Adv User Prefs] section in opera.ini or opera5.ini; if the section does not exist create it.
Add a new line: Http Accept Charset=* within the [Adv User Prefs] section.
Save opera.ini or opera5.ini
Restart your Opera browser.
WTF?
It's all about anxiety. And it's not only software -- this is one thing that happens with technology in general (link to non-tech site):
http://www.hsuyun.org/Dharma/zbohy/Literature/e
check that guys picture. i ALWAYS thought that bill had to be an evil twin.
How many times have we heard "the only reason I have a windows box is to play games." uttered by some zealot that has no real appreciation of unix other than it isn't MS, or it is just some sort of badge.
On the other hand, I have, for a long time, uttered the mantra: "I don't play games on computers, to me, the computer is the game."
The intricicies of the OS, all the nooks and crannies, even obvious commands that I have never used before, and trip over just give me thrills daily.
*nix is the game, and always has been. That is why *nix geeks tend to be more in tune with their OS and computers in general.
"I can't give you a brain, so I'll give you a diploma" - The Great Oz (blatently stolen sig)
In the summer of 1988 or '89, my boss ploped a BSD derived workstation in my cube and said, "I hear you've been picking up C. Congratulations. You get to help me port to Unix." Everything I learned and figured out on that day (and since) has and remains, if not useful, at least valid.
Compare and contrast this with the VP of the same company telling/asking me, "I just heard someone's using this Windows thing with . Can you figure out what kinda' problems they're having?" How much of what I did has remained useful? Let alone valid. (besides the obvious of it being the wrong way to do just about everything).
that the title of this story was verizon fatigue... and I had a glimmer of hope that there was a professional diagnosis for being driven insane by their "can you hear me now? good..." adds.
dmarien
Rant mode: On.
This is pure intellectual laziness. What is wrong with being in a "learning mode?" We do it our entire lives! Why should someone want to actually stop learning?
I've noticed a very disturbing trend lately. It could just be my perceptions, but it still gives me cause for concern. Many people (both general consumers and professionals in business) don't want to bother learning anything. They want to tackle complex tasks that could never be done before, but insist on not having to learn the tools to do it. I see it here at work with people who insist on holding on desperately to suboptimal programming tools when others would tackle the job more effectively. I even see it in my own family: I once got a call from my mother, while she was on vacation, asking how to access the voicemail for her cell phone. She called me at work, in the middle of the day, simply because she had never bothered reading the instructions from her service provider! (I taught her the meaning of RTFM that day.)
I understand that many products can be difficult to use, especially software. It takes effort to learn these products, and effort to use them. However, very often we barely have the technology working. How can you expect it to be easy to use as well? Automobiles, television sets, and radios are all products that many now consider fairly easy to use. Now ask the question: How long did it take for them to get to be so simple? Some of these products have been continually developed and refined for over a century. Now consider how long VCRs, camcorders, and software products have been around. By comparison, these are all fresh out of the R&D lab!
People need to realize that complex tasks can't generally be simplified overnight. It takes time to find the solution to the problems at hand, and even more time to refine the solution such that it is both effective and efficient (i.e. it requires a minimum of effort to use.) All of the complaining does nothing but add to the noise.
Rant mode: Off.
Thanks for reading.-kjz
has to be Corel. Everytime they put out a new version of Corel Draw you have to relearn where everything is. The worst is the preferences forms. They change the screens for settings every single version!!!
Here's a conversation i had with a "User" about a half a year ago.. it was very eye-opening, appalling, shocking, but.. dead on this topic.
.. i've used them all, and they've done nothing for me. what i think is that win95 will eventually win the OS wars, and we'll be using win95 forever, not this other junk. who wants to relearn everything in 98 or 2k, anyway? bah, nobody."
"Yeah, ya know all these win98, win2k,
and this guy was a fairly competent user, but he just didn't care to have to learn all the new m$ magic that was added each version of windows.
users want computers to be like toasters. you buy a toaster once in '82, and it'll last you until about '97 before it explodes some fateful day when you try to toast a blueberry bagel.
facts are, (in my guess) someday, when computers get a bit faster, software a bit more stable, users are going to get fed up entirely with all this upgrading junk, and just buy something and plug their new "toaster" (computer), in and leave it running in the corner of their house for 15 years straight before they toss it for a new one.
now, M$ will never offer this to users, it'll kill their business model (no money for 15 years!!) -- but linux could do something like this (particularily if "minor patches" were auto-applied.) but anyway, whatever.
think toasters. if the linux desktop can be like a toaster, and linux desktop apps can be like a toaster, we may be onto something.
whatever.
First, I think the article is spot-on. Gods, I'm tired of adapting to so-called upgrades. I rarely upgrade things unless there's a reason, but there are times you're left with no choice (say, a company-wide decision).
The other side of this thats ignored is the programmers. A lot of us are NOT trying to ram out Spectacleware, we'd like to talk to the users, like to go "slow and steady" and don't get the options. We don't often get the chance to make that decision, however, because someone wants something out the door pronto.
Version fatigue? I'd say its being suffered on both sides because the people making the decisions don't care about users or programmers.
"The Sage treasures Unity and measures all things by it" - Lao Tzu
You CAN'T be seen as doing the same thing in the same way as somebody else. That's illegal.
When the menus and options get shifted around from release to release, that's a bit of self-interested protectionism due to people taking out other patents that suddenly make the way you USED to do it illegal.
It comes down to the USPO making money for corporate lawyers who seem to come from Mars or someplace and obviously don't use any of the products. (C'mon they lawyers, they don't need the stinkin' products, unless its a computerized enema bag... Oh, sorry. That's where they get their personalities from.)
The user, the guy that's actually paying for the is the LAST one to get considered.
MSBPodcast.com The opinions expressed here are my own. If you don't like 'em... Think up your own stuff.
I don't see new features as a compelling reason to upgrade software you currently own. I think most home users upgrade their office suite to match whatever version they happen to be running at work. The corporate IT upgrades to maintain compatibility with clients and partners. People would be less likely to upgrade if the new product maintained backwards compatability with the versions they already had. I think that that is part of the reason that new features (that will never be used by 99% of the users) are added. It gives the vendor a chance to break, or impair the backwards compatibility all in the name of 'innovation'.
Maybe it is because we don't get paid unless people buy a new version, and people don't buy new versions unless there is some change. Bug fixes are often hard to notice (and really ought to be free anyway).
One of the main reasons this happens is as a result of focus group testing and other usability testing on the current version.
If you take the current version of most software and do some usability testing with new users, you'll probably find that there are things that could be done better.
But when you make those changes, to please the new users, you're messing with the users who already know how the thing works.
Microsoft Visual C++ is a perfect example. With each new version they move things around - but they have "compatibility" modes for people who liked the old way. Even with the newest Visual Studio.NET you can still pick the old VC 2.x keyboard layout and use it.
That's a pretty good solution, as long as your app is customizable enough that you can use the customization to emulate the previous version...
The only real problem with this solution is that it makes it so nobody else can use your customized version. If I go over to my co-workers desk to try to fix a bug, I can never remember what hotkey to hit to get it to compile..
(Maybe the solution to this particular problem is to make it easy to set a "guest" profile that temporarily overrides the current profile).
Windows is a huge victim of this problem too - the whole redesigned Start menu in XP annoys most existing users, but new users (users new to computers, what few there are - I helped a friend "get online" and got to watch this) seem to like it..
- Steve
At allow the interface to be customized per user. Ok, we haven't gotten to the stage yet were we can change how the drop-down menus appear or what order they are in, but I believe that day will come.
The government's moral compass is controlled by GPS.
In times of crises, they alter it to suit their needs.
Remond? Aren't they the same people who gave us multi-row tabs, despite much of the UI design community calling them stupid for doing so? Ditto for talking paper clips, and zillions of tiny toolbar buttons with indistinguishable icons, and window-in-window MDI? This isn't the same Redmond that basically ignored these criticisms for years and perpetuated these ill-conceived designs.
You're probably talking about a different Redmond. I've often heard of Cupertino described as the Redmond of California. Maybe that's it.
Ergonomica Auctorita Illico!
I know it's what I asked for, but it's not what I want.
"On a long enough timeline, the survival rate for everyone drops to zero."
Even though I'm a subscriber to some shareware I haven't upgraded much of that in years, either, simply because it does what I need, I don't see serious problems, so don't change what works (if it ain't broke, don't fix it.)
I imagine this is creating some serious inertia against upgrading to yet another version of Windows, Office, or other Microsoft Pork, which is why they (Microsoft) have been so involved in other strategies to get their lucre.
A feeling of having made the same mistake before: Deja Foobar
If only it were that simple. Sometimes you have to upgrade:
bash$ kill -9 <pid>
Joke apart, it is true that the UI of Unix is so mature now, that people who can grasp it manage to do some real work.
As far as windows go, I'm faced with the fatigue dilemma more and more often these days. For events I am organising, I have to produce posters, presentations, etc. There are tons of cool products out there which can do a lot better than MS Word for publishing, like XPress, Illustrator, Windows Draw, etc., yet what I am still using... MS Word. I just can't be bothered to RTFM every time I am trying new software and the interface is hardly ever the same.
The other day I was desperate to find a program I knew how to use to do some digital imaging, because my main Linux machine died a few days ago (broken motherboard+PSU) and I haven't hasd time to fix yet. So I rushed to find a win32 port of the gimp, which I installed and it runs hapilly :) Feels almost like home..!
At least it doesn't have to sell itself on the point that dumber people can run it :-)
It seems to use C++ exceptions internally for FLOW CONTROL!
As soon as you use it, your debug output window will be trashed with tons of diagnostics DURING NORMAL OPERATION!
Usually because everything else around it changes.
The lesson: use plain text, don't dig in the latest thing (ie ignore the cover of MSDN magazine!)
Now are YOU going to be a cry baby or are you just going to shut up and drive the car?
Don't like the way we moved the steering wheel around from last year's model? Don't buy the new model.
That's whay your argument sounds like if you get your nose off the screen and take a breath.
Now, do you still think it makes sense?
MSBPodcast.com The opinions expressed here are my own. If you don't like 'em... Think up your own stuff.
What about the pile of protocols being stacked over each other but doing nothing more than was possible with TCP. Especially all that XML based stuff!
A few years ago I was visiting the software development group of a leading supermarket company in the UK (we're talking big here). I was there to advise them on some OO development, how to go about requirements management that sort of thing.
During a break I saw a couple of people I knew from a previous visit and went over to chat with them. They told me they were going to be in over the weekend installing a new system (I hasten to add I hadn't been involved in any way with it).
-"Oh", I said, "you're going to be busy then."
-"Yes", they replied, "but the users are going to hate us."
-"Why is that? Don't they like the system?"
-"They don't know they're getting a new system. When they come in on monday they'll log-in and find the new system up and running."
-"Oh."
-"We know they're going to hate it."
-"Why's that ?"
-"We did the same thing to them 2 years ago and they hated it then. In fact they've only just gotten used to that system."
i haven't felt comfortable w/ the flash interface since version 3 or 4. dreamweaver morphs quite a bit as well, and i won't get into all the other programs. new features to make work quicker & a whole new interface that knocks your productivity down for a few weeks.
- tensions in our lives that are attacking our minds, unite themselves together to make our consciousness blind - op'ivy
If you don't want the change, don't upgrade.
That's a nice bit of advice.... if you aren't subjected to mandatum from higher-ups who decide unilaterally to upgrade.
Complaining because of the new Toyota? Try finding your mid-size automatic company car replaced by a SUV with a stick because the boss likes the shiny chrome bumpers.
Mod Karma -1: I sed bad wurds. If I cep my mouf shut, I wud be at riyses.
What about people stuck doing tech support (myself included)? It's not any fun trying to figure out where the settings went every time a customer upgrades to a new version of something. Common settings should have common menus, regardless of what version you have. It's always a pain in the ass when a customer goes out and upgrades to the latest version of M$ Office and they can't figure out where the mail server settings went in Outlook. Since the company I work for prides itself in our customer service, we try to help customers out when they call, even though we don't officially support Outlook. Each version of Outlook has slightly different menus. I'm sure this is great for places that charge for support, but it's only a drain on the resources for ISPs and other places that provide free support.
I think M$ should change their slogan to, "Where did my menu settings go today?"
Corel made a completely new interface with each version, which is why their product died out.
Oh, and adaptive menus that constantly change on a user, adding confusion and blowing away the motor muscle memory that has been acquired for each of the menu items. This is one of the stupidest things ever done in an interface and has been very severely criticized by the UI design community.
I should have remembered to add this "feature" to the original post. My bad.
Ergonomica Auctorita Illico!
No, sorry, the article is wrong.
What is the 10%-90% rule? Basically: 90% of your users only use 10% of your features.
Which seems to lead directly to version fatigue - what are all these features doing here that nobody needs?
Unfortunately, the 10% that gets used is different for each user - making ALL of your software package necessary. A single user might object, but on the whole, a lot more users will be happy with the product, yet using only 10% of it.
please refer to the BOFH. users are sheep and must be treated as such. adobe has it right. the user must FEAR each release!
In fact, as a 'tech' person, I switch versions and machines more often then your average Joe.
.emacs file, and have gotten quite adept at fiddling with window manager parameters in short order to get focus-follows-mouse, and that's about all the config I care to do. It'll just get blown away tommorow, why bother?
My Linux friends are often amazed at how uncool my Linux desktops are, or my emacs config files are, or a whole slew of other things. The reason for that is that I am f'in sick of having to completely reconfigure the system every time I upgrade, or hop machines (which is almost always an upgrade or a downgrade; otherwise I could at least carry my config), or change software packages.
I switched which machine was doing my email processing last week, and I just wanted to copy the config across from one to the other. No dice; one ran exim3, the other ran exim4, which has a whole new, completely incompatible config file. The conversion script was wholly unhelpful for my config, so I had to do it by hand.
If versions weren't changing so often, or if it were easier in general to carry configurations around even across versions (an impossible task in general), I'd be much more likely to actually configure things. As it is, I carry around a *small*
Granted, I'm more violent to my systems then your average user, even more then your average Linux user, but it's still exasperating.
People, it's not a mark of manliness that your program requires text file twiddling to configure. Give me an easy, easy, easy method of at least setting the the basic parameters. Like Mozilla: The basic parameters are in the config box, but there's a lot of obscure ones you need to hit the prefs.js directly. That's fine with me.
And don't even get me started on re-re-re-re-re-re-learning keyboard shortcuts.
--this is a great article and I hope the pro coders and business nerds here take note. Want to know WHY there's a slump in computer and software sales? People just don't want to keep forking over cash when the old stuff they have is still doing the job! It's really that simple. Most people and business applications are actually better off standardizing on something that works for them, then milking that for as long as possible. this means YEARS, not "months". people just don't want latest 'build" ever other week. It costs too much time and money for what it does. If you have something that needs latest "build" every other week, you will after awhile say "fuggit, I ain't doing this anymore". Not all but MOST people think this way. MOST people aren't /.'ers, they have a different mindset. Especially business, where the costs are astronomical sometimes.
Here's the problem. They have an IT department. these guys need something to do or they get laid off or fired. they've done their jobs, and gee whizz, the website is up, the LAN and WAN is working, the drones know where to find stuff on the desktop, it's working. Whoops! No actual real world need to upgrade at this point. The IT dept turns into maytag repairmen. It starts to look a little expensive upstream. Enter "new and improved" soft and hardware. Well, this "trick" will work a few times, but eventually even the dullest bgosses are gonna get hip.
The companies that supply these IT departments need something to do, or they have to go get other jobs. So-o-o-o, an endless stream of "new and improved" beta software and new incompatable hardware that "forces" upgrades when they really aren't needed. The backlash is spreading. Step out into the sunlight and look around. Even lame bosses and their bean counters are starting to say "no" to any upgrading. The drone cubicleoids honestly don't need the new turbo_althintel_6000 chip to accomplish their business. Their word processors still work, the spreadsheets are getting spread. Their graphics are getting pixelated and layered.
Acme widgets needs to concentrate on widget building and selling, not on talking about producing acme widgets, which is what the bulk of business computing is, it's "talking" about doing the business, not actually "doing" the business. Applying NEWER BIGGER FASTER videogame mindset to real world tasks is not exactly a realistic way to go about "business". It's not about how fancy internal memos look or how fast internal memos can get wifi-ed around to the janitor pool. See? Yes, a lot of that stuff is "cute" but people are starting to notice "cute" is costing way, way, way too much money and time and headaches.
Yes, I know,thinking like this here is sacralege. Oh well.
The IT world in general is running out of excuses- and they ARE excuses at least to a large extent- to force people into upgrading, and they AREN'T, by the millions. And on the home desktop-where's the need? Really? Games? Yes, a certain sub section of humanity becomes so addicted they neglect other things (hint, politics, hygiene), but most people aren't addicted to games and don't need the latest bleeding edge nitrogen cooled overclocked 4 dimensional video card. Our economy is really starting to suck in case you haven't noticed, and forcing people to buy what are in effect just buggier and even less compatable versions of the hardware and software they already have is not the answer, hence, the real world money figures that are coming out.
People got burnt by the y2k fiasco (which in large part was self induced) and by the dotcom boom, then by the slew of virii over the last few years and are saying "enough" we don't want anymore "innovation"-at least to a very large extent. and they sure don't want to keep handing over tons of real green to another "stock" gamble for "innovated-hardpute_v.s_8.9beta.com" anytime soon.
Not trolling, just a friendly reminder that most people and businesses are not as concerned with beta ware as nerds are, so don't be surprised if they don't want to hand you money for "new and improved" when it never is. New-yes. Improved- this isn't debateable, in a lot of cases it really isn't, it's CHANGED atmost, a lot of the times it just causes more grief, or isn't worth the cash asked for the tiny incremental "improvements" once there's work-arounds in place for whatever was "wrong" with a version or three ago.
Vicious circle- new bloatoffice 2000 runs slower than bloatoffice 1999, so you "need" new althontel 2.0 chips? Why, just to type up the same orders? Well, OK if it's 100$, but when this means 100,000$?? Say what? And even switching to "open_beta_forever_*nix_source" will actually cost 50,000$?? NEITHER option is as practical as sticking to what you have and using it. In a lot of cases, anyway.
No need, the artifical "create-a-need" will continue to turn people off.
Possible solution-stop thinking of full time coding as a full time job, because you ARE being replaced by overseas incredibly cheap coders, this trend will continue, and people just aren't as furious to upgrade all the time, and hardware companies can concentrate on waiting to release "improvements" until they 1-really ARE improvements and 2- go through beta testing in house. If that means getting another job to supplement what they are doing-so what? Join the rest of the world, "we" in a lot of cases are having to struggle to make money now and "upgrading" is really a waste of resources we don't have in such an abundance as 3 or 4 years ago.
Sorry if this isn't as clear as it could be, just putting something out to the professional or giving-amateur IT industry from a consumers perspective. I own lotsa boxen. Guess what? A lot of them are quite functional running old software on even older hardware-they don't NEED to be replaced! I'm on a 200 mghz box right now, running a newer nix distro. This version sucks, the previous version was actually faster. I am seriously thinking of going back, but I just don't want to bother much anymore loading or reloading patches and fixes. I'll probably stick with this until the patches slow down, then that's it, I got more things to do than apply patches. My business requires little in the way of new and improved 'computing", what is there still works fine. This hardware is perfectly acceptable to surf on and accomplish my tasks. I don't videogame, whoops, that's 75% of the "need" for constant upgrading. If any robots attack me, I have a 12 gauge handy. heh, and a box of wrenches.
I have a few older vehicles-tons of miles on them. Guess what? They still crank and fireup and get me from A to B, I see no need to drop serious folding green on the latest detroit, tokyo or stuttgart steel for some sort os status deal when the older stuff is still doing the job and is paid off. Minor annoyances like a new starter or whatever once in awhile is more than offset by not having to make whopper monthly payments on new auto-hardware and more expensive auto soft-insurance-ware. See?
Millions of private people and businesses are the same way. Yes, I know a lot aren't, but I bet there's a lot of IT guys here who will testify they are getting told NO from the head office on "upgrading" anything these days.
On a related note, MIT Tech Review is running a related article on Why Software is So Bad.
Notable Quote from Story:
They also pushed the new version by sacrificing backward compatibility.
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.Net has completely changed the language, effectively killing Visual Basic.i sual+basic+.ne t+killed&hl=en&lr=&ie=UTF8&oe=UTF8&selm=3a50cbe9.7 644234%40news.clara.net&rnum=6
Every Access version prior to 2000 used DAO (Data Access Objects). In the Visual Basic Library References, DAO was checked.
In Access 2000, they pushed ADO (Active Data Objects), which many have said is more complex and slower. They removed the Library Reference to DAO and sneaked in the Reference to ADO! To make matters worse they duplicated the variable type "recordset" in ADO and DAO, which renders useless almost all Visual Basic Code that worked with a table.
If you used the phrase "Dim x as recordset", you had to do one of the following:
- Uncheck ADO and Check DAO (Forcing it to use the older version)
- OR Check Both ADO and DAO, then search all code and replace every "Recordset" with "DAO.Recordset"
- OR Leave ADO Checked and DAO Unchecked, then search all code and rewrite every line that opened a table.
It's already bad enough that Access Databases start misbehaving when it's shared by too many people or live tables exceed 80,000 records, or the database exceeds 1.9 Gigabytes. At this point you're already thinking about scaling up to SQL server, Oracle, or my SQL.
In addition to that, more and more features are added while the "little Jet engine that could" becomes more and more critical to the operations of an organization.
Does Microsoft think that Access programmers have nothing better to do than get interrupted by every department that has upgraded to Access 2k? How hard would it have been to tell the upgrade wizard to automatically link to the DAO Library and automatically replace every "recordset" with "DAO.Recordset". You might think that it means more money for a consultant but all it does is accelerate the time to burnout. They're getting harder to find every day.
See:
http://groups.google.com/groups?hl=en
http://groups.google.com/group
I've also heard that Microsoft's Visual Basic strategy towards
See:
http://groups.google.com/groups?q=v
It's no wonder that companies are switching to open source. Anyone's patience will wear thin after having to jump every time that Microsoft tells them to.
Software "leasing" is a lot more common
in the industry than you realize.
Most commercial UNIXes as well as other "enterprise" level software (databases, specialized APIs, runtime licenses, etc.) that does not need to be upgraded every 3 months is usually under "maintenance" for 100K+/year.
This is a pain to deal with sometimes (esp. with node-locked licenses) but the big companies manage to handle it transparently. I hope the idea never hits it big on the consumer market.
(XP is a disturbing path towards that trend).
It's much worse than that.
It's more like the developers are saying"we thought that the gas pedal would look so much cooler on the left, but then we had nowhere to put the brake so we just stuck it on the right. Please try not to get into any situations where you have to suddently avoid hitting children until you unlearn your 15 years of trained reflexes."
Ergonomica Auctorita Illico!
I know people who learned to use AOL and feel it's too hard to use a different browser. Their loss..
I, for one, agree. The longer people keep the same system and the same software, the better they learn it.
I don't buy this stuff about how unix is hard and other stuff is easy... I remember LOTS of yuppie boomers who learned old wordperfect just fine.. and that's certainly not wysiwig. Obscure keypresses, hidden markup codes, they understood it all.. and some were really good at it.
The problem is when things change rapidly. Totally.
Emacs keybindings aren't changed because there is no reason to change them. Nobody wants to re-write all that lisp.
I believe that percentage (%) is far from one-percent, but is 0.025 % ... as in cockroach-spit.
But none of these keybindingds (I'm referring more to the shell here) or things that have changed have been very fundamental. Adding color to the shell, or extra keybindings, or re-mapping the backspace key are overly large changes to a system.
Nobody is saying a system can't evolve and change... but it's when a new version of something comes out every year and LOTS OF STUFF is just moved around or different that people get really upset. When the old things they want to do just no longer work.
One of the problems with "learning" about new software and appliances these days is that the documentation usually sucks.
When the market was smaller and consisted mainly of technically astute people, documentation tended to summarize ALL of the menu items and shortcut keys, and then describe in complete detail any automation or scripting capabilities.
And this documentation would be provided in the form of a printed manual no less, one that you could actually take with you and read at your leisure instead of when you are sitting in front of the machine trying to get your work done.
Now we get giant pictograms which are targeted at a technically illiterate audience and which describe only the most surface level tasks. The deeper level documentation is usually provided only in electronic format, and often hidden behind some kind of inane help browser system geared more towards "Ask me a question and I'll answer it for you" than it is towards reading from beginning to end.
I don't believe that software has grown so complex that it is impractical to completely document its function, as long as we bring the target level of the audience up. Honestly, since most users aren't bothering to read the documentation anyway, target it towards the ones who will read it and make tech support money off the rest.
Things were better when it was assumed (and could be reasonably expected) that the end user had fairly high level of familiarity with their systems and how they operated. While I would acknowledge that today the end user doesn't possess these traits, the person providing systems support for them does (or should). Please give us our documentation back.
3.11 : Open Programs Folder -> File Manager -> Click on Windows
95 : Start -> Programs -> Windows Explorer -> Click on Windows
98 : Start -> Programs -> Windows Explorer -> Click on Windows -> Tell it to show the files
XP : Start -> Spend Five minutes confused by garish colors and icons before finding My Computer -> Click on Windows
Until the Operating Systems get to the point you can do simple tasks the same way through versions, tthe applications sure aren't going to adopt that philosophy.
Tim
---
Fear the Penguin!
software developers, people who only ever use vi or Emacs should shut up when the discussion comes 'round to GUI design principles or software usability.
They have no [expletive deleted] idea what the problems are because THEIR software has been stable for decades.
Using "make" or a shell does NOT make a coder into a user. It does not provide the programmer with any perspective into "user-land."
That's why most Linux GUI stuff sucks, can't copy/paste across applications, doesn't follow guidelines and is so ideosyncratic you just want to strangle the coder.
Being a domain expert is fine if you're working in that domain. But coders are supposed to be experts working in their OWN domain: CODING.
I wouldn't want to look at or use code produced by a domain expert (it'll be correct but it'll probably be buggy, unstructured, unmaintainable perform like a resource pig.)
By the same token, I wouldn't trust code that has been produced by a software God but has not been verified for correctness by a domain expert (it may be sweet and run like blazes but I can't trust that it actually solves the problem its supposed to.)
MSBPodcast.com The opinions expressed here are my own. If you don't like 'em... Think up your own stuff.
you may agree or disagree with his article but why do some people make negative personal remarks about the author? especially ones which are not very insightful to say the least. to get back to the topics though. Try to enjoy newer and newer versions of LabVIEW, Statistica, SPSS, SPlus, Mathematica, MATLAB, Igor PRO and so on and so one on an endless list when all you want to do is some basic experiment ...
Neuroprosthesis News
Photoshop keeps getting better and better. I've considered it to be the only program out of beta since version 5, and every subsequent release does more, better than I would have believed possible. This isn't a plug. Hope others agree that the improvements have been substantive, and the UI has grown more intuitive with each upgrade.
Limewire! Not my favorite Gnutella client but certainly one of the easiest to use. (ironically I don't like it because it isn't as "powerful" as other clients)
The cool thing about Limewire is that even though the technology behind it has grown and they have been working hard behind the scenes - the software is virtually the same since I first used it.
KISS, Knights In... I mean keep it simple silly.
Of course though there are users out there like me who want to be able to play with all those cool options.
Fuck this "version fatigue". There should be a least two applications for each task - there can be a niche market for those apps that don't change and there should be that market for people that can read at the PC!*
* I've noticed lately that perfectly literate people can't read when they sit in front of a PC. Tell them to click "Ok" and suddenly they can't read, is this where 'computer literate' comes from?
Get your Unix fortune now!
Also, there is a great place for the bad UI design at The Interface Hall Of Shame.
this is somthng that graphic apps are notorious for.... just look at apps like 3D Studio Max.... it takes almost 3 months and a new book to re-learn the interface each time they release a new version.
The Code Ninja is swift with his tool, precise in his delivery, and deadly accurate in his execution.
Like when you get sick of those assholes telling you yer line isn't good enough for DSL. (Well shit, if I owned that piece of copper, it'd be fibre!)
Server Error
This server has encountered an internal error which prevents it from fulfilling your request. The most likely cause is a misconfiguration. Please ask the administrator to look for messages in the server's error log.
If you are using Opera 6.0 (or later) for your browser, the error may be related to your browser's configuration. Click here for a description of an Opera browser configuration parameter that may correct the misconfiguration.
Then a link which tells me to edit a Charset parameter in my browser's .ini file.
Does anyone know what this is about?
I think the philosophy is:
:] "and again and again.... "
1. "If we re-decorate the product we can sell it to you again" [: snickering greedily
2. "If we re-decorate the product enough, the consumer wont realize that they are using the same product."
3. "If we really botch up the product, or get sued for forcing hardware mfgrs. to include it with their equipment, we can just discontinue it and start over."
This is not fair to the consumer but makes sense money-wise. ugh..
X
I swear they give me a new version daily, not to mention program patches and everything else. Sometimes its frustrating as all hell!
________________________________________________
has my dot com money gone?
oh where oh where can it be??
1999 - come back!
i beg you.
surely slashdot can do something about this?
Heh heh... This Dilbert Cartoon (http://www.dilbertzone.com/comics/dilbert/archive / ilbert-20020611.html) explains it all.
Me and my boss were just cussing and discussing this very topic.... Especially how our favorite software giant that everybody loves to hate, changes up all the config settings locations in each new version of their operating system just to make everything different, not because it accomplishes anything of value, except to invalidate all their worthless "certified professionals & engineers", forcing those poor saps to have to re-purchase all their certifications all over again.
That's the best peice of software design advice I've ever received. It came up during a discussion of windows 95, back when that was new, when we noticed that you can still click on the upper left corner of a windows app and get the window menu, or double-click there and close a window, just like you've been able to since windows 3. Really - try it!
Unfortunately, that's about the only prominent example of MS following that advice. After years of working on windows NT 4, for instance, I finally convinced myself to leap to win2k because the amount of supported hardware was just so much better. And I had NO idea how to administrate my machine! Just trying to partition my drives was a huge hassle; I used to be able to open up the disk management node in the control panel and now... well, I found it; it's in "administrative tools -> computer management."
Which is fine, but it was somewhere else for so LONG. Would it REALLY have hurt to leave a link to that program from its old place? And the sad thing is, MS isn't really the worst offender. I'm thoroughly confused every time I get a new version of KDE; in some ways, I'd be just peachy on using KDE 1 just because I remember how to configure it so well (and I would, except that the mail client sucks prior to version 2.2).
In all, I think there needs to be a good deal more attention paid to interface design before the FIRST release. Because, for better or worse, the first interface you give someone is the one they're going to expect from your product. If it sucks, you're just going to be pressured to maintain a sucky interface, or frustrate your customers when you discard what they're familiar with.
It gets really bad when version fatigue collides with creeping featurism. I think this is the case with Microsoft Office. With each new release the change how you access the old functions and and in a few more (useless) functions. When will the hurting stop?
FoundNews.com - get paid to blog.,
With Software bloated beyond all sanity and every thinkable feature built in, the only way vendors can seperate themselves from he pack is by issueing usability. :-(.
;;-).
The major improvements in the recent Micros~1 Office and in the new Macromedia Dreamteam release-cycle are usability improvements.
Good, no wait, lets say: successfull software companies know how important it is to keep a certain amount of usability consistency, also, not only, but also because they want to seperate themselves from others. That's the reason why I'm having such a hard time switching from Freehand to Corel Draw
My opinion is that version fatique only realy happens with crappy software or users who aren't really up to using it the right way. Any software vendor changing the behaviour only for the sake of changing the behaviour and being able to put a new version number on the box regularly have their salenumbers blow up in their face. Exceptions are, of course, marketing monsters like Mickeysoft, that, within certain bounds, really don't need to give a damn.
Then again: With the computer invading every day live more and more, the industry needs an updated common user access standard (cuas) covering all those countless new features. Maybe even the OSS community would have a look at it then
We suffer more in our imagination than in reality. - Seneca
The reason why interfaces keep changing is so that software publishers can sell the same software twice. Users won't "upgrade" to a new version if it doesn't look any different than the old version.
Free software though doesn't need to sell itself. Free software is made to solve a problem, not make money. Big difference. Changing an interface between versions only makes a problem worse, since it's harder for the user to use the software. Instead free software is changed each version to help better solve the problem it was designed for. Just another reason to trust Free and OSS more.
Outdoor digital photography, mostly in New Engl
new features, new layouts, changed ways of doing things.. If your files are backwards-compatable, why not your interface?
Why not just have an option: "Look and act exactly like the last version. And don't fuck up as much."?
-- 'The' Lord and Master Bitman On High, Master Of All
...this "version fatigue". I hope it gets as widely adopted as "vaporware" did. Version fatigue is an excellent way to describe that part of so many new releases of older products that are nothing more than moving the chrome around on the sheet metal, and have nothing to do with the underlying chassis and powertrain.
Sometimes one pithy identification of a problem is enough to cause radical changes for the better. Version fatigue might be a very powerful addition to the lexicon.
As soon as I read this story I immediately thought "Photoshop". With every version (the exception perhaps being 7, which I am really liking) they change around the key commands for things that have always existed, especially the pencil and paintcan. They also love to move stuff around in their menus, and change the key shortcuts for those, too. I don't think it even has to do with complex new features -- just some kind of randomized user study where they decide that it really makes more sense for the pencil to be 'b' instead of 'y', or for crop to be under 'image' instead of 'edit'.
I'm ok with changing the basic interaction with the software (type tool, choosing brushes, etc.) if they want to introduce new features, but changing the key commands for tools and operations that have already been there is totally insane!!
If you change your design around so much, you might not have done a good design in the first place. So, you met the deadline, but the design was inadequate. What do you do? You rush for the next deadline, trying to redesign the interface a bit as you go, making it smoother.
Iterate sufficient times, and what you get is version fatigue.
If you had spent enough time in the design phase, possibly with some prototyping, you might have escaped a bit of all these changes.
That said, if you look at Microsoft Word, I would argue that the version fatigue is not that great. Type at the keyboard, change the fonts with the dropdowns, and hit the printer icon. The floppy icon for saving. The looks are slightly changed, but almost everything is done in the same way as before (which is why I'm relatively happy with Word97). Gimme a good reason to get Word XP! If you can, I bet I wouldn't get version fatigue, since the fundamental functionality is relatively stable.
Changing the interface when the interface is flawed is an unpopular but necessary task. Changing the interface for the sake of changing the interface is a PR nightmare.
Stop the brainwash
I have never had this problem with moving from one Macromedia product to another. The nice thing about Macormeida is that all of their software allows you to customize keyboard shortcuts. Not only that, but the new version always includes the keyboard map for the old version.
They have also been very good about keeping their menu structure generally the same. Some things might colapse into a submenu, but they are still under the same main menu as they were before.
The world moves for love. It kneels before it in awe.
Perhaps software engineers should read a good book about ui design before they leave college. Software for Use by Constantine comes to mind.
managers...why god invented purgatory
Probably it's because so many "tech designers" were never taught a sustainable design process; they just worked out their own methods by trial and (all too often) error. See Gall's _Systemantics_ for characterization of the typical result. There's a pervasive attitude that nothing useful can be learned from those who have gone before, and that's simply wrong (as is understood in nearly every other discipline).
Some surprising things to keep in mind:
o Large systems are *qualitatively* different from small systems.
o The result of design is not code; it is documentation. The code should implement what the documentation describes.
o Code says nothing about what the design was *intended* to do; it only describes what the end product actually does. Code is necessary but not sufficient for understanding a product.
o Users will find novel uses for your code, so it's best to actually talk to some of them before getting serious about any design decisions -- in fact, even before deciding to do the project.
Everybody knew ^S^D^E^X left/right/up/down and the ^K file commands. It flowed as naturally to the fingers as vi commands do today :-)
I cannot imagine what possessed them to change all the keybindings - but it killed the product stone dead.
Cheers, Andy! [ showing his age ]
Andy Rabagliati
Adobe might be bad but Macromedia is worse. Take a look at Flash. Flash 4 had one interface, Flash 5 had a completely different interface, not to mention different ways of doing things, then comes Flash 6(MX) They completely revamped the interface yet again.
Perahps now that they have a common interface between all their products they will stop doing this to us.
So is this where I stick a witty comment?
Every new version of software released should have its interface customizable in such a way that one can easily choose to interact with the new version in the same way as the old version.
New features should be made available to the user at their discretion.
I really would like a new version of software to look exactly liek an old version, but as I progress and want to use the new features I can add them on eat a time and select their hotkeys and what not on the fly.
This one deserves being modded up to funny.
A52dec was rewritten 3 times, resulting in the same thing every time. Ignored rewrite #2 and just merged with rewrite #3. Going to abandon it for the next 2 rewrites and merge with the 6th rewrite.
I'd say most of us here are a big part of the problem.
g es/dilbert2060948020611.gif
http://www.drabble.com/comics/dilbert/archive/ima
Operator, give me the number for 911!
Either, there's a hell of a lot of windows uses looking at Linux.
or
There's a hell of a lot of Linux uses searching from a windows box because there boxen has bwoken.
It all depends upon what you marketing department want people to think.
thank God the internet isn't a human right.
Maybe it's because tech designers are more anxious to be creative than to produce things that users like?"
Yeah, right. Users are just plain exhausted by all the new functionality they get. The criticism, certainly not entirely unfounded, that arbitrary and capricious changes make life difficult, will never cost any company anywhere a sale. Never. The only customers aggrieved are already their customer, and if the customer is disinclined toward change or learning new ways to do things, would NEVER BE INCLINED TO ADOPT AN ENTIRELY NEW AND DIFFERENT product by a competitor.
On the other hand, avoiding changes to the status quo and avoiding inclusion of new and modern features (many of which include adopting new GUI standards imposed by OS manufacturers) will eventually assure the demise of a product, as the product gets branded old and obsolete, and gradually the competitors overwhelm us with competitive upgrades and the like -- soon, we are the stranger to the next generation of sedentary users. Yes, of course, we will retain a handful of those who like things "as they were," and they will be the last to leave us. However, they weren't going to buy the new upgrade anyway.
In short, OF COURSE, we shouldn't make stupid and arbitrary changes -- but tech designers who make sound, decent and forward-moving changes will ALWAYS be closer to the heart of the consuming public, even though a few old farts will grump from time to time (until they learn the new stuff).
Version exhaustion? Nothing a good cup of coffee and a manual couldn't cure.
OK. Imagine if Toyota modified the peddle/gear shift/steering wheel layout every model year.
Then imagine that there was no standard for these across car manufacturers.
Hardware designers seem more willing to standardize on a single format (the DVD-R/DVD-RAM/DVD-RW/DVD+RW wars not withstanding) than do programmers.
The problem, I think, is that programmers have the "not invented here" attitude, and are constantly re-inventing the wheel.
-Luke
I mean, there's still plenty of n'Sync and Britney Spears fans!
Why can't a button be just a button, and why do skins seem to automatically mean bitmaps pasted over buttons?
-jhp
/. -- the Free Republic of technology.
I think most people are in the mode where they will tell companies about problems they are having with the software, but rarely will tell a company what they like. Or if they do tell, it's after they already got the new release and complain that such-and-such feature is missing and how they really loved using it in the last version.
If there are enough comments of this sort, the company may bring the feature back in the next release...of course, they will inevitably change something else that the user's can't live without, but that seems to be the way the cycle goes. The more people tell the companies what they like (be specific, not general like "Oh, Photoshop 8 is great"), the more likely these features will be kept for future releases.
OTOH, why do they reinvent the wheel? Two good reasons: (well, good being a judgement!)
You can't exactly set this problem solidly on the engineers shoulders. Management, investors, PHBs, and customers have driven things as much as engineering efforts have.
-- Mal: "Well they tell you: never hit a man with a closed fist. But it is, on occasion, hilarious."
There is also the opposite issue - when developers use latest and greatest versions of shared libraries and package management tools won't let an earlier version of library suffice - even if the api and/or functionality hasn't changed of the library routine used. This problem becomes acute if GNU/linux is going to become mainstream. If developers insist on using the largest version number (because its current) rather than the lowest that does the job, users have to upgrade
key elements of their more frequently. (Maybe individual functions should be version numbered, hmm... just a thought)
Actually, Office 2k and XP allow you to entirely rearrange your drop down menus, icons and toolbars. And it is easily done by draggng and dropping where you want the commands. You can even change the icon pictures if you are so inclined.
What's with the F's? Did I miss a meme?
Secession is the right of all sentient beings.
I've got to give credit to this fully to my old boss Mike Lewis. He used the phrase "Pavlov's upgrade" to describe the rush to update a new piece of software when the software maker rings the bell by releasing it. In this case, I think he was refering to MS Office2k.
But there it is: Pavlov's Upgrade
I've used it in talks and meetings and the point always gets across.
I liked this article. Wether the poster thought about it or not, new insights came to be because of it.
Windows upgrades annoyed me a lot in the past -- they're needed due to many factors: counter-measures to viruses, market monopolization, new product looks, company policies realignment etc. -- a few come from user request and many features don't come up because not enough users requested.
Linux upgrades also annoy me somewhat, but they're usually more meaningful (admittedly this may be because Linux is just beginning and grows faster than other systems).
It helps to maintain good partitioning in your disk, like "partition 1/linux A", "partition 2/linux B" and "partition 3/common area".
This way you can perform alternate upgrades to Linux A or Linux B, always keeping at least one system booting and a the never-touched common area for your personal things.
Seems to me that "upgrade fatigue" is the term that people have been using to discuss this phenomena for years.
The writer is introducing a gratutitous terminology change which has a similar effect to that complained about; but in the linguistic arena.
bah.
Damn it. Once a program is published, the user's interaction with it shouldn't change unless it's for a very good reason.
Programs should be designed extremely well before any coding takes place. What's the program's purpose? How will the user interact with this program? Those are probably the first two questions that should be asked in the design process. Anything that doesn't fulfill one of those two functions doesn't belong in the program, period.
Once the program is published and folks begin using it, the user interface should remain consistent through every revision, and should only change for a very good reason. For example, if a feature so important that 99% of the users will jump on it upon release, that's a valid excuse for making a small change to the user interface. However, unless such a high percentage of the users need the change as bad as I need a bottle of Negra Modelo, the user interface (including placement of items in menus, images on icons, accelerator keys and whatnot) should not change, because it only annoys the user and creates trouble.
For example, I visited a Lenscrafters store yesterday to have some new glasses made. I remember their old text-based computer system. It wasn't pretty, but damn it, those folks could enter your information in minutes and you'd be out of there. Instead, now they have a system based on Windows 2000. There are all kinds of fancy graphics, but because the interface is so different, nobody knew how to operate the damn thing. A huge crowd built up, waiting for receipts or for credit card purchases to go through or something. I was there from 12:00 to 2:00, just because there were so many people ahead of me, and all the employees were trying to figure out this stupid new system. In other words, before, a new employee would learn which buttons to push and it just worked. Now, it's all supposedly self explanatory and looks pretty, but they have to click through a zillion menus to put a simple item on your receipt. If it ain't broke, don't fix it.
Another example... My company used to ship a lot of stuff through Delta Dash. I remember how it used to take them a minute or two to serve each customer at their little reception area. Their computers had boring text-based interfaces. The lines moved quickly, people got their cargo shipped, and everybody was happy. Then, one day, the employees showed up to work, and lo and behold, there was a new computer system, based on some form of Windows. Suddenly, there were a bunch of pretty icons to click on, everything was moved around, and nobody received any instruction (probably because someone convinced management that Windows is so good, nobody needs instruction). So I had to wait at least an hour for them to serve about 5 people ahead of me. The guy started getting the hang of it when he served me. Since I do pay attention to things, though, I noticed that he continuously has to move his hands between the keyboard and the mouse, whereas before, there were keys on the keyboard for each operation, and it went smoothly. In the past, a new employee would learn which buttons did what, and it worked. Now, they have to click through a zillion pretty dialog boxes. If it ain't broke, don't fix it.
Honestly, if you get a new antenna for your television set, you don't expect your volume dial to relocate, or to turn into buttons or something. Why shouldn't this be true of software? My way of looking at it is this: If you have to move crap around with each new revision, you didn't design the damn thing properly in the first place, and you probably shouldn't be making interactive programs.
Oooooooooh well.
Nobody really has creative control. the big ticket flix usually suck as a result. It's not like anyone sets out to write a dumbass script, well except Troma, but hey. Compromise and politics just makes it that way. You have to look at the fringe as always where risk taking is possible.
You really touched the wound here. Congrats!
Usually people search for improvements in the technical area, but what good is a software engineer if the original idea is fouled up from the start?
"Version fatigue", IMHO, should be understood as "version dismay", since a reasoning user looks at a new version to be installed and asks herself: "What for?"
If the answer is "for the added benefits, fixes, better UI etc." then what follows is joy about the results to be harvested after a fruitful task.
OTOH, if you upgrade to get the same thing upside down, or even just to avoid some idiot kiddie throwing a stone at your front glass door -- well, frustration appears and the same task turns out annoying. You get tired even before you started.
Also, about you precisely nailing the problem: companies have a lot of hidden agendas. First, programmers are treated as replaceable because that's exactly what they are to them! Consider what happens to the circus owner if the lion devours the tamer: he must get another one!
Compare this to the Open Source scenario. Msr. Fourdan, for example, is worldwide known for his excellent XFCE, which me and my wife use. I'm indebted to him, yet he does his work without any agenda or interest.
Quickly changing versions also play a "strategy" role in that the more versions you put out, the busier you keep developers everywhere -- thereby keeping them form abandoning your product and turning to a competitor, ultimately. Very macchiavelic, indeed!
The biggest feature still missing from Linux UI is CUA standard support.
It's getting added very slowly.
I remember when Quicken 1999 became Quicken 2000 and the UI changed severely for the worse. Instead of allowing an unlimited number of accounts across the bottom of the window, with left-right scrolling, the program now permitted only a limited number accounts down the right-hand side with no scrolling. Open one more account than the limit and you get an error message. Ugh!! I downgraded back to Quicken 1999 and never bought another version.
Yes, Xlib is the same old Xlib. But from the standpoint of most USERS, who cares? Redhat has changed its desktop COMPLETELY a few times (fvwm, nextLevel, kde1, gnome/enlightenment, gnome/sawfish...), has changed
This produces severe hoseage for those of us who would prefer to upgrade their existing system to a new kernel, new gcc, new libc, etc. (all reasonable changes that should not affect the end-user experience) instead of reformatting and reinstalling with each upgrade.
taken! (by Davidleeroth) Thanks Bingo Foo!
Emacs keybindings aren't that obscure, you just need to know the systematics. Eg prefixes the Ctrl, Meta and Ctrl-x in that order simply affect smaller to larger entities, when appropriate.
And C-s for search isn't hard to remember as well as C-r for reverse search, C-t for transpose characters, M-t for transpose words and C-x C-t for transpose lines.
And once you know that file commands start with C-x it isn't hard to imagine that C-x C-s saves your buffer (under it's current name) while C-x C-w writes the buffer to a file (with a new name).
One more advantage is that emacs bindings are default in the readlin lib so that you can use them for command line editing in bash or use C-r to search backwards in the history buffer.
He saw some dirty arabs and fired. Too bad it was just some friendly kurds, BBC reporters and his fellow cowboys.
Trillian.
Supports ICQ, AIM, IRC, MSN and Yahoo. Does all the things you would expect (file transfer, etc.); has better icons (try the OS X skin or anything based on Odigo) and generally looks less clunky and less cluttered than any version of ICQ.
If you haven't tried it, you're missing out. Now you can talk to your one friend who insists on using AIM or Yahoo without having to load more programs...
You're absolutely right. Nonetheless, still with new features, fixes should be made available for free and *independently* from the upgrades, for those who don't want a new version.
That the software industry, and specially some monopolistic idiots, can get away with this is a real shame for some governments unable to promote fair business practices. And ultimately, this greatly contributes for the success of Open Source.
And I think bankruptcy is a well-deserved punishment for the voracious greed some monopolies display.
Perhaps its not so much a want to change things, but if they dont keep changing/adding/coding.. then they dont have any work.. thus no job..
I have always felt that way about most 'web-designers' they change things constantly JUST to have a job..
---- Booth was a patriot ----
The only potential issue here is that it's not a single-character option name.
Oh, while I'm on the subject of user interfaces, I gotta remember not to hit ^E to go to end of line in Mozilla. D'oh!:-)
...when you're writing a game...tweak the difficulty of "Easy" to something [your mother] can cope with. -- onion2k
Upgrade-itis is the continual sick feeling that the money (or time, since time = money) you're spending on software upgrades is not worth the very small degree of enhancement provided in the upgrade, but you have to upgrade anyway because either 1) everyone else is, 2) you're addicted to upgrading (obsessive-compulsive disorder possible here), or 3) the upgrade contains a fix for a bug that drives you crazy (of course, the new version will contain new bugs of its own).
Steve Magruder, Metro Foodist
cool edit and acid are fine examples of good UI design, but they have very specific uses as compared to cubase... the latter has the potential to emulate an entire control room full of outboard recording studio gear on a 19" monitor, so naturally it's going to be more difficult to grasp every feature. a milling machine is going to take more time to learn how to use effectively than a hole punch.
a more apt comparision might be between cubase and emagic's logic audio, where the average user would want to do roughly the same task in either environment, but learning to do it in logic seems to take people twice as long and cause much gnashing of teeth.
The reason developers/designers change things is generally because the old way sucked. Wordperfect was dramatically changed from all those shortcut keys into a GUI with menus, not to confused users, but to make it more intuitive. Yes, it sucks for those people that learned the old way. But generally UI changes are made so that new users can find things easier. Unix doesn't change much in this way because unix' main focus isn't to make life easy for new users. But in Windows, that is a primary focus of UI design. Make it simple and intuitive, becuase no one reads the manual anyway.
I've always assumed that this is because I'm getting old (at 25), but this article offered me some hope. (Not that I'm taking it all that seriously, but still.) The author notes that he and his brother, though different ages, have been exposed to technology for about the same absolute number of years, and are both experiencing version fatigue. The hypothesis this suggests is that version fatigue is a universal phenomenon that has been getting ready to happen ever since high-tech devices began working their way into our lives, and is now taking hold of everyone simultaneously.
I'm not sure if I believe this story, but it makes me feel less old.
I'd like to point out that I am not a nontechnical person, but that version fatigue has affected me as a programmer as well. A decade ago, I felt like I knew Turbo Pascal 5 inside and out. But then as I migrated from Pascal to C, DOS to Windows, Windows to Linux, C to Java, etc. I found I didn't really care to update my skills. (Of course, I didn't have to since I don't program for a living.) Now every time I want to write a shell script, the first thing I type is "man csh".
Perhaps I am pathetic, but it appears I am not alone.
JV
Not a score (0)! This is so _on_ topic for the following reasons:
... an artist.
/. where, frankly there, is more talk of anarchy then of being professional and acknowledging that maybe, sometimes, there have to be rules, guidelines, and _enforced_ standards.
a) It isn't that engineers are the new artists. It's that _software_ engineers seem to see themselves as "code artists". This is the problem with the field and why it wears the term "engineering" poorly.
b) There is still no true discipline or self-governance (the hallmark of a profession). Because it wears the moniker of "engineering" it gets grouped with the other engineeering disciplines. But it doesn't get treated like them. Ask any civil engineer how closely they are watched by their professional organizations. Until some form of discipline can be introduced you will get a product as inconsistent as you would expect from
But the future looks dim. The up and coming coders of the future are being weaned on the content of forums like
"Consensus" in science is _always_ a political construct.
that he logged his 10 years of Java experience on as well. ;)
I'm sure that the new methods are great, but it's increasingly becoming too much for a one-man-department to just "bill the time" anymore. It's difficult to support dozens of sites, each with dozens of databases in every Access version and architecture, and at the same time turn a profit for the boss, which usually requires taking new projects.
I found two certainties when writing Custom DB's:
1) The developer(s) become responsible for the business processes (however convoluted) that they implemented in the Database. You may not agree, but try telling the customer that their post-estimate specifications have increased the cost. Once deployed they will often imply that any features that conflict to their new specs are bugs that needs to be fixed. You could refuse to do the work if they can't pay but in many cases the database becomes a virtual paperweight until the work is done.
2) There is a limit of how many different custom databases a person will be able to make and support before they go crazy. One day all your sites will have an emergency at the same time, and those problems will be the undocumented ones that only google groups can solve. When you get there you'll have to decide if what you have forced yourself to remember is worth the pleasant memories you have forgotten.
Reporting is much easier.
Hopefully Google will eat thesem =3b993cc9.3218 4196%40news.charter.netK 7.1339%24 rY1.143064%40dfiatx1-snr1.gtei.net
6 44 234%40news.clara.neta 0.0202 050328.131ea0c3%40posting.google.com
DAO vs. ADO
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Subject: Re: OpenRecordset Compile Error; "Variable not Defined" (dbOpenSnapshot Highlighted)
http://groups.google.com/groups?sel
Subject: Re: Need a few pointers, please. DAO -> ADO, many others.
http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=tTS
Visual Basic
------------
Subject: Re: Why everyone hates VB?
http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=3a50cbe9.7
Subject: Re: VB is Almost Dead
http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=889cbb
What is the optimum design for a word processor? Does anyone know? Does being the god of all programmers mean you'll have special insight into how a program should work from a user's point of view? Actually being computer literate, let alone a computer god, puts you at an extreme disadvantage when it comes to DESIGNING a program that idiots are going to be using. You might be able to implement a particular design extremely well, but that doesn't mean you'll have any idea what the design should be in the first place. This is why there are so many bad programs out there, coders aren't users. It is also why these programs change so much without ever converging on the optimum interface or design, the people writing them don't know how to do anything but write the code.
If you want to create an outstanding application what you need to do is find people who work in the field that your application is supposed to be used in and ask THEM to design it for you. The less they know about computers the better. The imaginations of people who know nothing about computers are not stunted by an understanding of what is and is not possible. Because of this they'll suggest features and approaches that are much more likely to stretch the ability of a coder to implement them than anything that coder would come up with on his own. I can guarantee you that grammar checkers weren't the idea of anyone who wrote code for a living. They were the idea of someone who wrote type for a living.
These are the reasons why companies like Microsoft employ cognitive psychologists and make heavy use of focus groups to help them design their products. Say what you want about Windows as far as what goes on under the hood, you can't deny that the basic paradigm behind it's interface is superb. All running programs are always accessible from a task bar at the bottom. All applications are accessible through a heirarchial menu, and commonly used apps are available as quick start buttons on the taskbar. The windows themselves feature clear and concise buttons whose functions are immediately obvious. The basic design is so good that the two most powerful and popular Unix desktops, Gnome and KDE, both copy it to the hilt. This design was not thought up by some CLI speed freaks and code wizards who could write a 10,000 program that worked the first time, in assembly. It was the brainchild of people whose understanding of computers was rudimentary at best.
The key to designing great software is to get people who don't know anything about computers, because that is who your customers are going to be. Cater to these customers as much as you can and not only will your programs be very popular, but the problem of version fatigue will almost solve itself, assuming you can avoid feature creep.
Lee
Muslim community leaders warn of backlash from tomorrow morning's terrorist attack.
Geez, this is a real interesting discussion thread. I am so glad all you highly productive people found time to tear away from your well paid assignments to come here and contribute.
...is the usability concept not often understood by designers, that the Familiar design is usually a better choice than the Good design.
People like what they understand. They understand what they are used to. It feels comfortable, and they feel a power over something they know how to control. Conversely, things which a person haven't seen before are things they often don't understand, and hence don't like. Because of this, it's usually better to design interfaces the way other programs/previous versions worked, rather than trying to fix previous stupidness.
Case in point -- <select> boxes on Windows IE vs. Macintosh IE. On MacIE when you focus a select box and start typing, it chooses the closest match to what you have started to type. So if, for example, you have a pull down with state names in it and type "MISSO" it will choose "Missouri".
On WinIE each character you type starts you over at the first item starting with that letter. So typing "MISSO" will choose "Omaha"...which is ludicrous. You'd have to type "MMMM" on Windows to cycle from "Maine" to "Massachusetts" and so on, each time hoping the next one was correct.
So...WinIE is clearly the Dumb Way wrt keyboard access to selects.
BUT! BUT!
While it would be rather easy to do, it would NOT make sense to use a JS library to change the selects on your site to behave like MacIE. It would be a BETTER way to behave, but it it would be the WORSE choice. Because users of IEWin who use keyboard shortcuts are USED to this stupid behavior, and expect it to behave that way. A windows user attempting to select 'Massachusetts' will type "MM" and be baffled when it jumps to 'Montana' instead. Frustrated. Angry.
SO...to get back on topic...you have program designers revamping keyboard shortcuts so they make more sense...re-organizing menus to be more logical...re-grouping tools in a Better way...and in the process they piss off their loyal user base.
Repeat with me now -- Familiar is better than Better.
New users pay full price. Old users only pay upgrade fees... assuming they upgrade at all.
It's really not surprising that companies and programmers target new users more than existing users.
That doesn't actually make it right, or even economically a good idea, though. Having 200,000 users, and alienating them in order to get 2,000 more is really not good business sense, particularly if you lose the old users.
I believe shifting gears with my right hand is the natural way to do it, an English reader would think that the left hand is much more natural, an American reader probably doesn't even know what a gearshift is, let alone which hand to use it with...
QED?
free the mallocs!
Maybe software engineers need to program specialized defects into their software. For example, perhaps in 4 years, the software will put begin to put rust blotches on the screen that gets worse over time. The users will eventually say "hey, I have to buy new software, my screen is starting to rust!".
Or timed delayed bugs...
User: "My software is calculating wrong! It worked last week!"
Developer: "Oh your software is getting old, time to upgrade, or bring it into the shop for repair. Would you like an estimate?"