These deals are not made on a per-server or per-desktop pricing. Everybody knew the price tag for MS contract - NZ$50 mil. over two years, which gave right to schools to use unlimited number of Windows computers (server and desktop) and limited (I don't know to which exact number) number of MS Office installs. For MOE this was peanuts, for MS - fuck all, in money terms. However, MOE and schools were free from bootleg software headaches for two years and MS extended their lock-in a little bit longer.
Now, they claim the same licensing cost for Novell solution but I reckon everybody is getting better deal out of it - Novell makes a buck, MOE looks cool, schools are getting good software and more importantly support, thing that Microsoft always includes in cost but never actually provides.
In short, my not too wild guess is: price is $50 mil / 2 years, the only difference between vendors is that Novell guys are happy to do some work, too.
I am running (at home) 4 PCs/laptops and one server (various versions of RH/FC), behind completelly open firewall on a static IP address for over 18 months. None of the machines ever got hacked into, spyware and viruses (virii?) do not exist at my place. I don't pay for OS, apps, anti-virus, excess data. I don't fear running up2date from cron because I know it will never brake anything, unlike windowsupdate. Son's PC has wine for windows games and he's happy. Gimp is more than enough for my daughter who is into that kind of stuff. MPlayer nicely embeds itself into Firefox and plays all sorts of media. I do drag'n'drop CD burning and printing, camera - no problems, scanner and printer, too. Openoffice reads everyhting I receive and all-around computing experience in my house is improved since it's windows-free so much, that even my wife uses computer for few hours a day. That's mom'n'dad environment for you.
Now, I also do Linux admin for living. Do you need an explanation on how much time and money has it saved us on server AND desktop side?
People often confuse fine art and esthetics. Eye-pleasing look at a beautiful building or bridge does not necessary mean that one is looking at the work of art. It is very fine line between the two but still the line.
Of all human activities not considered art by definition, my vote for the closest match goes to cooking.
Well, for my organisation it is much cheaper. After all discounts we get from both sides, we'll spend about $3,500.00 over 3 years for RHE licences. Quote I got from MS was in a range of $50,000 over 3 years (server/desktop OS/CALs, SQL/CALs, Exchange/CALs, Office). That's a no-brainer. We are lucky not to depend on any particular apps written for windows, which makes our life much easier, though. Once ISVs start realising that people actually want to move from very expensive Windows environments and finally make native Linux ports of their apps, you'll be able to see plenty of Win-->Lin switch statistics.
This is definitelly NOT TRUE anymore. Are you saying that Chicago Mercantile Exchange was after cutting costs and they never needed reliable, just cheap system. That's just one of the examples.
Oh, chill out. These are villagers, fishermen - that's what they do. It's not like they can quickly get to supermarket around the corner and get a pack of crumbed fillets.
Delly might mean that this restaurant is Michael Dell's new venture, you never know. However, you should have been shocked even more by that web page:
Once you step into our doors, we're confident that you won't ever want to leave. From Greek Entrees to Specialty Pizzas, Deli Sandwiches to Vegetarian Delights, we'll have whatever it takes to fulfill even the pickiest appetites.
I totally agree. From personal experience though - it is very hard to convince management assembled of bean counters not to outsource.
My company did just that and they were stupid enough to sign a contract that doesn't include any service level agreements, just blank statements of the type that company such-and-such will provide this and this and that. When? Nobody knows - as long as they do it on the last day of contract (2 years) they're good.
What did we get? Hosted email server that is down several times a week, unstable VPN, 30 something servers still waiting replacement, lack of central backup facility, more promises and IT dept decreased to 2 people treated like shit (1 of which is me).
New GM seems to have brains, so he's started pressing very hard and looks like he's going to manage to get out of contract. Once he does that, IT dept. will shrink further because the day the contract is terminated and IT services brought back in house I shall resign with great satisfaction of being right from the beginning and the opportunity to rub few big noses.
So, my advice to Ask/. inquiry is DO NOT DO IT! Find couple of people who are competent and who care - you'll be surprised how much good work and cost saving can be made by just two guys like that.
That just happens to be the disro (as a collection of open-source software made everywhere) I'm using. I didn't compare Microsoft and Red Hat Inc and their products, rather MS and open source community as a whole.
So, you believe that the limited adoption of Desktop Linux, OpenOffice, and even Firefox is entirely due to FUD?
Not entirely, there's a fair bit of locking into proprietary code/formats and sanctioned (for years and years) monopolistic practices.
Since 1995, Windows and Linux desktops were never on a level playing field. Yet, try to compare level of innovation and improvement between Win95 --> XP on one and RH 2.1 --> Fedora 4 on the other side. It is staggering to see how much more efficient loosely-knit community is than mammoth-like corporation. This comparison clearly shows which group had got priorities right (quality) and which one hadn't ($$$). It'll bite their fat ass in not so distant future.
it remains to be seen if a loosely-knit open source project can match a concerted development effort from Microsoft
Thus far, the only concentrated effort from Microsoft that somewhat slowed open-source product addoption was the effort of their FUD Department with a generous help from few well known sattelites. They simply cannot win on a merrit of quality because their products lack quality.
Slashdot Mirror
Not to mention 5 more as a judge. I wonder why was she waiting that long.
Brain wouldn't hurt, either.
No, not really. You obviously doesn't speak Broken English.
...says Anonymous Coward...
Now, they claim the same licensing cost for Novell solution but I reckon everybody is getting better deal out of it - Novell makes a buck, MOE looks cool, schools are getting good software and more importantly support, thing that Microsoft always includes in cost but never actually provides.
In short, my not too wild guess is: price is $50 mil / 2 years, the only difference between vendors is that Novell guys are happy to do some work, too.
Now, I also do Linux admin for living. Do you need an explanation on how much time and money has it saved us on server AND desktop side?
No, you are not.
Of all human activities not considered art by definition, my vote for the closest match goes to cooking.
Well, for my organisation it is much cheaper. After all discounts we get from both sides, we'll spend about $3,500.00 over 3 years for RHE licences. Quote I got from MS was in a range of $50,000 over 3 years (server/desktop OS/CALs, SQL/CALs, Exchange/CALs, Office). That's a no-brainer. We are lucky not to depend on any particular apps written for windows, which makes our life much easier, though. Once ISVs start realising that people actually want to move from very expensive Windows environments and finally make native Linux ports of their apps, you'll be able to see plenty of Win-->Lin switch statistics.
This is definitelly NOT TRUE anymore. Are you saying that Chicago Mercantile Exchange was after cutting costs and they never needed reliable, just cheap system. That's just one of the examples.
Well, I'll give 100% of my present salary if I can have it replaced with 1% of Bill Gates' net worth. Thank you very much.
Oh, chill out. These are villagers, fishermen - that's what they do. It's not like they can quickly get to supermarket around the corner and get a pack of crumbed fillets.
Once you step into our doors, we're confident that you won't ever want to leave. From Greek Entrees to Specialty Pizzas, Deli Sandwiches to Vegetarian Delights, we'll have whatever it takes to fulfill even the pickiest appetites.
We server beer and wine
Bad.
You are not required to do any web surfing if you connect unpatched Windows box to the Internet. It will get infected, very quickly too.
Apparently, infection. To get the First Post you must be on the machine that runs some other OS.
Since you forgot to claim 1st post, I hope you'll at least get a mug, as a consolation prize.
See subject.
Considering 'Insightful' moderation, you must be growing pair of wings by now.
Nope. echo HWAACITGLT >> general_lexicon
My company did just that and they were stupid enough to sign a contract that doesn't include any service level agreements, just blank statements of the type that company such-and-such will provide this and this and that. When? Nobody knows - as long as they do it on the last day of contract (2 years) they're good.
What did we get? Hosted email server that is down several times a week, unstable VPN, 30 something servers still waiting replacement, lack of central backup facility, more promises and IT dept decreased to 2 people treated like shit (1 of which is me).
New GM seems to have brains, so he's started pressing very hard and looks like he's going to manage to get out of contract. Once he does that, IT dept. will shrink further because the day the contract is terminated and IT services brought back in house I shall resign with great satisfaction of being right from the beginning and the opportunity to rub few big noses.
So, my advice to Ask /. inquiry is DO NOT DO IT! Find couple of people who are competent and who care - you'll be surprised how much good work and cost saving can be made by just two guys like that.
That is partly correct. However, most improvements to those products happened only after they've been released to world.
That just happens to be the disro (as a collection of open-source software made everywhere) I'm using. I didn't compare Microsoft and Red Hat Inc and their products, rather MS and open source community as a whole.
Not entirely, there's a fair bit of locking into proprietary code/formats and sanctioned (for years and years) monopolistic practices.
Since 1995, Windows and Linux desktops were never on a level playing field. Yet, try to compare level of innovation and improvement between Win95 --> XP on one and RH 2.1 --> Fedora 4 on the other side. It is staggering to see how much more efficient loosely-knit community is than mammoth-like corporation. This comparison clearly shows which group had got priorities right (quality) and which one hadn't ($$$). It'll bite their fat ass in not so distant future.
Thus far, the only concentrated effort from Microsoft that somewhat slowed open-source product addoption was the effort of their FUD Department with a generous help from few well known sattelites. They simply cannot win on a merrit of quality because their products lack quality.
No. Haven't you heard that it's been excluded from Longhorn?