The solution is not to cripple the game for only people with Creative cards, but to equally modify the way that the game engine draws shadows for everybody to avoid Creative's patent on the specific shadowing method
I agree 100%. I was telling the original poster that crippling the game was a bad idea, which is what I thought he was saying Carmack should do. Re-reading it, I wasn't as clear as I thought I was. and if I had been aware Creative makes video, I'd have put a bit less unintentional fog into the mix.
My statement about people who can't afford new hardware only applies in the sense that intentionally crippling the game just when a Creative card is detected would hurt the users who can't afford a new one right now. Sorry about the cornfusion; I never meant to disrupt the legitimate portion of the discussion.
btw, I like the nick. Knowing what it stands for, I like it better. Don't let the q3 reference dissuade you from keeping it.;)
The suggestion was to have the game deliberately sandbag the performance if it detected a card made by Creative. I assumed the original poster meant sound cards not knowing CL makes video cards (I only found one on their site, doesn't look very impressive), so I guess I misunderstood completely. I guess it pays to RTEA. (entire)
btw, is your nick a q3 reference? I have to confess I still play it.
From the hardware guide:
"What we noticed immediately is that DOOM 3 looks incredible even at 640x480! " and
"Looking at the image, it's surprising just how good Low Quality looks."
My hopes weren't very high, but I'm relieved to see this. Now I know my TNT2 card will do just fine.
But seriously, their test on a minimal system yielded encouraging results:
"Our system was composed of a 1.5GHz Pentium 4, 512MB of Corsair RAM, and a GeForce 4 MX 440 video card"
You make a good point. But the grandparent suggested a spiteful cap on framerate if a Creative card was detected. There's a big part of me that thinks he should anyway. Creative sucks for this, and even more because the SB Live card I have is temperamental, but I can't afford a new card right now. I know I'm not the average Doom 3 customer, but if Carmack did add a "grudge fsck" limit like that, I'd be w/o Doom3 for a while. And what about the guy who bought a brand new box last Christmas for all the latest games, and it has a CL soundcard? Not everyone can justify spending on new hardware every time a new game (even as long awaited as this one) is released.
Creative needs to be told "this sucks," and when I have more cash, I'll vote on another sound card then, but for now I suppose I fit into the category of user Carmack was thinking of when he backed down on "taking a stand."
Sorry to be so behind on this. Only found the thread through metamod.
So wouldn't you think music publishers would be happy that the licensed stations are playing in stores where a lot of people walk in and out?
The catch is, publishers don't make a dime more if the radio is blaring through every possible radio within broadcast range than they do if the deejay's mom is the only human listening. The local advertisers pay the radio station--not the publishers--for airtime. In fact, the publishers are probably NOT happy about it, since they are less likely to sell a record that you already feel like you hear everywhere you go.
The fee for playing a radio broadcast in your business is paid to the radio station as well, just like a bar that has televisions tuned to a football game or pay-per-view boxing match. The original broadcast is meant for private viewing, that's why they read the copyright notice somewhere during every NFL game. It can easily be argued that the advertising is now reaching more potential customers, but the broadcast is being used by a third party business to draw more money into the bar. If a bar owner makes $50 extra with the radio, I see no problem with giving the station $5.
To tangent a bit more, Lars Ulrich was right when he said radio isn't free. I saw him at a press conference during the entire Napster thing (I think he's an ass and Metallica handled it very poorly) where someone asked a question that ended in "...but radio is free?" He disagreed, but the footage I saw cut before he gave his explanation. Radio is free only from the perspective that you don't pay the radio station money. To use an old pun in a serious context, you pay attention. That was the only thing I heard him say that made any sense. And I'm a musician too. It's a good thing this is three days old, because Napster is still good for spawning a huge debate.
I heard a statement regarding TV once that really clicked, and it applies to broadcast radio as well:
Television doesn't exist to bring programs to the viewer; it exists to bring client base to the advertisers.
It's truer than we want to admit. Music isn't free when you get it over the airwaves, because you listen to all the crap in between.
You're right about the music industry corporate greed tho.
No doubt this'll lose (it'd almost be fun to say 'loose') me the spot on the friends list
Nah, but if it had become a dubious matter, the 'loose' joke would have tipped it for me anyway (see below).
I've never been that good at grammar/linguistics, but kinda enjoy the topic anyway and know how to use a reference book when/if I need to - so when someone hits one of my posts with a grammar flame, I can't resist responding in kind.
You did it well.
You can admit when someone makes a good point (too rare on/.).
You make good points yourself.
It was fun.
You're clearly not giving yourself enough credit on the grammar thing. Even so,
I'm interested in a ton of things I absolutely suck at doing.
I'm a hopeless idealist, strangely (ironically?) crossed with a healthy dose of cynicism, and I appreciate people actually being human instead of elitist "c4n y00 f33R m3 n0|/\|? 600d!" dickheads.
Thanks again for the debate. Hope exiting the closet doesn't get you any offtopic mods.
Heh. I only saw the extra "n" at first and thought it was a typo. I've only been there once, and it was Orlando, so I doubt that counts in your context. In other words, I'm lost. Is that "karry-okey" as opposed to "kara okeh?" I've got such a hodge podge of varied pronunciations here where I live that I'm rarely surprised by hearing something said differently.
It's ironic that I am such a pedant, considering where I live.;)
"even dictionaries... sometimes have such bad definitions"
I thought about checking several, but my post was already too long, and I knew I wouldn't be able to resist including anything I might find in their discrepancies.
was just having fun too.
This was cool... Touche'
Too bad you post anonymously; I'd add you to my friends list. Anyway, thanks for the chuckles. And for the thought-"provoking.";)
I wasn't trying to be overly pedantic; I've re-read my post and regret its harshness. In reacting, I expanded my reply to include a more common and less correct use of "irony." For that, I apologize to ron_ivi. The sort of misuse I had in mind is more like:
We went on vacation, and ironically, it rained the whole time. or
Dad didn't see the irony in getting a flat tire on the way to work. My above post would be more appropriate if it had been in reply to a similar statement.
However, there is still no irony in the original grandparent. He made an interesting observation and shared it with us; he deserved his mod up. But irony was mentioned where there was none.
I liked your reference to "irony-strong will" (really), but you admittedly
"picked the dictionary whose definition gave [you] the most slack".
This is precisely the problem.
Ironic is a great word, and I would hate to see it trashed by the disparaging trend of "Well, enough people have misunderstood the definition or pronunciation of this word, so we may as well expand it to include what the uninformed masses believe, so that more of us can be correct." that has snowballed more and more of our words. A couple examples of what I mean:
The term biweekly originally meant "every other week," and not "twice per week." Many people ignored that we are already equipped with a handy way of expressing the latter concept, known as "SEMI-weekly". We exclusively use "semicircle" when talking about half a circle, and we say "semi-coherent" when we mean "partially intelligible," so why "bi-[time period]?"
We had a word with a clear, efficient meaning, but now when someone wants to have bimonthly meetings, we're forced into checking context to determine whether the speaker actually meant two or only.5 times per month, and in written form, it's rarely clear.
The reason this happened is beyond me; I'd never tell anyone I'm bi-finished mowing the lawn, or that I had to let my bi-eaten lunch get cold when my toddler fell down the stairs.
(From dictionary.com--the dictionary whose name is easiest to remember) the most common pronunciation of Celtic has assumed the "s" sound many basketball fans in the Boston area assume to be the correct way to say it.
The Boston Keltics?
Closer to home for most of us geeks, the pronunciation of route has abandoned the root pronunciation with which it started. The carpenter's tool called a "router" is a tool that "routs," meaning "to dig." The word that refers to an electronic networking device for establishing a communication path between computers has assumed the pronunciation of the word for the woodworker's tool. The way we say it would suggest that a network router will dig a hole when we need one.
The prevalence of the incorrect method is so complete that I've never heard anyone use it correctly. So everyone says "raowter" (or however you choose to spell it phonetically). I can't say "router" properly because it sounds stupid (yes, I'll admit that).
The wrong way is collectively perceived as the right way, and those who resist the change give up or are overpowered. The change becomes official. It is effectively conceded, "that's wrong, but enough people believe it, so now I guess it's right." It's this lazy way of "P.C.-ing" the language so no one gets their feelings hurt that gets the snowball rolling. Communication breaks as the meaning is diluted.
Sometimes it only results in a silly dispute on
/., but there can be serious consequences for this sort of miscommunication. Talking about the phrase 'post traumatic stress disorder' from a soapbox, Georg
It's disturbing to see how many people have an incorrect definition of the word irony following them everywhere. George Carlin put it in a very humorous way which I won't bastardize by attempting to paraphrase here. I believe it was in his book, Brain Droppings.
I saw a standup comic who gave several good examples of irony after a few minutes' criticism directed at Alanis Morrissette. The one I recall best is,
Irony is naming an airport after the president who fired all the air traffic controllers.
Argh, I don't know which is worse, not having mod points when you want 'em, or having them while knowing you can't mod up a deserving post because you've already posted in the same discussion.
The fact that it's taken over forty-five minutes for no one to find this as hysterical as I do frightens me. Is my definition of humor so warped that I'm your only victim being brought to tears?
As a consolation (hopefully), welcome to my friends list.
Slashdot Mirror
While that may be true, it's pretty similar to saying something like this:
(didn't know Clinton was that old, did you?)And best of all, it stays crunchy in milk!
Fritz Pisot!
Not sure where the author of the original article shops for groceries, but
He.
has.
one.
BIGASS.
can of tuna.
A .22 semi-auto.
Only $833345 per month
nice.
BTW, this guy should know, and his post includes a couple things that really support my argument.
Heh. yeah. I actually still have my Riva in my 4th generation "trickle down" machine.
I agree 100%. I was telling the original poster that crippling the game was a bad idea, which is what I thought he was saying Carmack should do. Re-reading it, I wasn't as clear as I thought I was. and if I had been aware Creative makes video, I'd have put a bit less unintentional fog into the mix.
My statement about people who can't afford new hardware only applies in the sense that intentionally crippling the game just when a Creative card is detected would hurt the users who can't afford a new one right now. Sorry about the cornfusion; I never meant to disrupt the legitimate portion of the discussion.
btw, I like the nick. Knowing what it stands for, I like it better. Don't let the q3 reference dissuade you from keeping it. ;)
Not to mention a million dollars wasted shipping them all separately
/me hits newegg instead of working...
True. Very (sadly, painfuly) true.
True, but what I said about people who can't afford new hardware getting hosed still applies.
The suggestion was to have the game deliberately sandbag the performance if it detected a card made by Creative. I assumed the original poster meant sound cards not knowing CL makes video cards (I only found one on their site, doesn't look very impressive), so I guess I misunderstood completely. I guess it pays to RTEA.
(entire)
btw, is your nick a q3 reference? I have to confess I still play it.
Don't we have a mod for "+1, Efficiently Sidesteps Sarcasm?"
No WAY, man! My TNT card has never let me down yet! Wagons Ho! still looks as great as it did in '95!
"What we noticed immediately is that DOOM 3 looks incredible even at 640x480! "
and
"Looking at the image, it's surprising just how good Low Quality looks."
My hopes weren't very high, but I'm relieved to see this. Now I know my TNT2 card will do just fine.
But seriously, their test on a minimal system yielded encouraging results:
"Our system was composed of a 1.5GHz Pentium 4, 512MB of Corsair RAM, and a GeForce 4 MX 440 video card"
fp?
Creative needs to be told "this sucks," and when I have more cash, I'll vote on another sound card then, but for now I suppose I fit into the category of user Carmack was thinking of when he backed down on "taking a stand."
So wouldn't you think music publishers would be happy that the licensed stations are playing in stores where a lot of people walk in and out?
The catch is, publishers don't make a dime more if the radio is blaring through every possible radio within broadcast range than they do if the deejay's mom is the only human listening. The local advertisers pay the radio station--not the publishers--for airtime. In fact, the publishers are probably NOT happy about it, since they are less likely to sell a record that you already feel like you hear everywhere you go.
The fee for playing a radio broadcast in your business is paid to the radio station as well, just like a bar that has televisions tuned to a football game or pay-per-view boxing match. The original broadcast is meant for private viewing, that's why they read the copyright notice somewhere during every NFL game. It can easily be argued that the advertising is now reaching more potential customers, but the broadcast is being used by a third party business to draw more money into the bar. If a bar owner makes $50 extra with the radio, I see no problem with giving the station $5.
To tangent a bit more, Lars Ulrich was right when he said radio isn't free. I saw him at a press conference during the entire Napster thing (I think he's an ass and Metallica handled it very poorly) where someone asked a question that ended in "...but radio is free?" He disagreed, but the footage I saw cut before he gave his explanation. Radio is free only from the perspective that you don't pay the radio station money. To use an old pun in a serious context, you pay attention. That was the only thing I heard him say that made any sense. And I'm a musician too. It's a good thing this is three days old, because Napster is still good for spawning a huge debate.
I heard a statement regarding TV once that really clicked, and it applies to broadcast radio as well:
Television doesn't exist to bring programs to the viewer; it exists to bring client base to the advertisers.
It's truer than we want to admit. Music isn't free when you get it over the airwaves, because you listen to all the crap in between.
You're right about the music industry corporate greed tho.
'It was tempting to take a stand...but that would only have hurt the users...'
Nah, but if it had become a dubious matter, the 'loose' joke would have tipped it for me anyway (see below).
I've never been that good at grammar/linguistics, but kinda enjoy the topic anyway and know how to use a reference book when/if I need to - so when someone hits one of my posts with a grammar flame, I can't resist responding in kind.
- You did it well.
- You can admit when someone makes a good point (too rare on
/.).
- You make good points yourself.
- It was fun.
- You're clearly not giving yourself enough credit on the grammar thing. Even so,
- I'm interested in a ton of things I absolutely suck at doing.
- I'm a hopeless idealist, strangely (ironically?) crossed with a healthy dose of cynicism, and I appreciate people actually being human instead of elitist "c4n y00 f33R m3 n0|/\|? 600d!" dickheads.
Thanks again for the debate. Hope exiting the closet doesn't get you any offtopic mods.Heh. I only saw the extra "n" at first and thought it was a typo. I've only been there once, and it was Orlando, so I doubt that counts in your context. In other words, I'm lost. Is that "karry-okey" as opposed to "kara okeh?" I've got such a hodge podge of varied pronunciations here where I live that I'm rarely surprised by hearing something said differently.
It's ironic that I am such a pedant, considering where I live. ;)
Heh.
"even dictionaries ... sometimes have such bad definitions"
I thought about checking several, but my post was already too long, and I knew I wouldn't be able to resist including anything I might find in their discrepancies.
was just having fun too.
This was cool... Touche' ;)
Too bad you post anonymously; I'd add you to my friends list. Anyway, thanks for the chuckles. And for the thought-"provoking."
We went on vacation, and ironically, it rained the whole time.
or
Dad didn't see the irony in getting a flat tire on the way to work.
My above post would be more appropriate if it had been in reply to a similar statement.
However, there is still no irony in the original grandparent. He made an interesting observation and shared it with us; he deserved his mod up. But irony was mentioned where there was none.
I liked your reference to "irony-strong will" (really), but you admittedly
"picked the dictionary whose definition gave [you] the most slack".
This is precisely the problem.
Ironic is a great word, and I would hate to see it trashed by the disparaging trend of "Well, enough people have misunderstood the definition or pronunciation of this word, so we may as well expand it to include what the uninformed masses believe, so that more of us can be correct." that has snowballed more and more of our words. A couple examples of what I mean:
We had a word with a clear, efficient meaning, but now when someone wants to have bimonthly meetings, we're forced into checking context to determine whether the speaker actually meant two or only .5 times per month, and in written form, it's rarely clear.
The reason this happened is beyond me; I'd never tell anyone I'm bi-finished mowing the lawn, or that I had to let my bi-eaten lunch get cold when my toddler fell down the stairs.
The Boston Keltics?
The prevalence of the incorrect method is so complete that I've never heard anyone use it correctly. So everyone says "raowter" (or however you choose to spell it phonetically). I can't say "router" properly because it sounds stupid (yes, I'll admit that).
The wrong way is collectively perceived as the right way, and those who resist the change give up or are overpowered. The change becomes official. It is effectively conceded, "that's wrong, but enough people believe it, so now I guess it's right." It's this lazy way of "P.C.-ing" the language so no one gets their feelings hurt that gets the snowball rolling. Communication breaks as the meaning is diluted.
heheheh... forgot about that one. Thanks.
I saw a standup comic who gave several good examples of irony after a few minutes' criticism directed at Alanis Morrissette. The one I recall best is,
Irony is naming an airport after the president who fired all the air traffic controllers.
The fact that it's taken over forty-five minutes for no one to find this as hysterical as I do frightens me. Is my definition of humor so warped that I'm your only victim being brought to tears?
As a consolation (hopefully), welcome to my friends list.
This anti-drug medication is expected to be available to users within the next two years in the form of a nasal spray.
Is that poetry or what?