... yours truly, slashdot? Yes, perl. And Amazon.com, perl too. Show me PHP websites of this magnitude...
and Haskell is being used to _implement_ the Perl 6 compiler for the same reason Python or Ruby interpreters are writter in C. Except, of course, Haskell is a lot higher level than C and more secure, meaning the current size of the project is just short of 4K lines. and no side-effects... ^_^
then why the hell is M$ so desperate to dismiss Linux in that stupid Get the facts marketing campaign?
if it wasn't bothering them, they wouldn't even mention it. they're aknowledging its a real competitor and a threat to their business model
driving the adoption of new techs
on
Pornified
·
· Score: 5, Funny
yeah, sure, wasn't it for tons of popups suddenly opening up and showing some rather grotesque cumshot scenes in front of your momma, popup blocking wouldn't catch up.
What they'll be delivering, as far as i understand it, is a custom application designed around some Mozilla technologies, mainly XPCOM but perhaps also using the XUL engine for UI.
they're not delivering a custom browser or browser content. it's a custom app making good use of Mozilla techs.
"and other kinds of data our customers are increasingly putting in documents"
like, say, an Excel spreadsheet or a PP presentation? yeah, they've been doing this for years: making it easy for people to dump any shit into their document formats so that you'll have to run their products to view them. what's the big news?
guess being xml doesn't matter when it includes lots of links to external proprietary stuff or content which shouldn't really be in a _textual_ document.
couldn't agree more! i don't want multiplayer Metroid Prime or multiplayer Metal Gear tag team madness or something.
i want to feel like a lone hero in my quest to save the world.
MMORPGs completely break any adventurous mood. they just feel like a graphical irc with the same morons acting as ( stupid ) NPCs and talking about their everyday useless lifes.
"Explain to me why, why in this case, Linux, in its greatest magnificient userfriendliness, doesn't surpass Windows usage when it comes to pops and moms computer?"
because mom and pops PCs don't come home from shop preloaded with Linux?
Having used many development tools like Emacs, VIM, SciTe, kate, Eclipse, Visual Studio.Net and Delphi, i gotta say Delphi is the best IDE i've used hands down.
Simplicity and high productivity is the key here.
You don't have tons of floating dialogues, icons, buttons and drop-downs poluting your interface just for no other reason than to show off and make you feel like your investment was well worth it
No, just the right form designer, object inspector and class hierarchies, along with the project manager. Less bloat and complexity, more productivity...
"ASP.NET is lightyears ahead of anything python simply because it gets compiled into machine code"
Machine code, yes. Only it is machine code ( bytecode ) for the CLR (.NET's VM runtime ). Am i wrong or isn't it just when that bytecode gets loaded and handled to a JIT ( just-in-time ) compiler that it gets actually compiled to native machine code?
BTW, i worked about a year on a system upgraded from ASP ( interpreted VBScript ) to ASP.NET ( bytecode compiled C# ). We wrote it from scratch, and only used the same DB stored procedures the original system also used. Well, guess what, smarty?! Performance sucked big time! The simple, interpreted ASP application was faster and less bloated.
BTW, you know such a high-traffic as/. runs Perl, don't you?
"before it's executed and runs "closer to the iron" (and therefore blows the doors off anything interpreted)"
"An alternative operating system to Windows is as simple as buying a Mac or installing Linux."
except Macs are not as cheap as PCs ( about to change, perhaps ) and no end-user ever installs their OS: they buy a computer and it'd better come fully functional. and you know which OS comes with a computer, don't you?
"MS desktop search does not spy on you and send your local search results back to google for processing!"
they don't need to. they own your desktop by default. they do whatever they want, whenever they see fit. btw, your OS has a serial number, did you know that?
"I'm doing fine just listening to my old CDs all day."
too bad they'll keep pumping out more crazy storage formats so that you buy your entire collection again, this time with DRM included, or risk being just a dinosaur like your grand-grandpa and his gramophone...
... it felt a lot like writing a toolkit like GTK from scratch, and then developing the app proper. well, guess what? i'm sure the next time it'll take a lot less time, since now you have a framework already.
nothing prevents some such AJAX frameworks, both commercial and open-source, to become widely available in the days to come...
Generalizing: it doesn't matter how bad a language is, as long as it has a robust, large and varied user library covering everything you can imagine under the sun. This is because people either don't have the time, desire or technical knowledge to implement such functionality by themselves. They are just client programmers.
look at C ( almost every native libs written in it ). look at Java ( enourmous user library ). look at Perl ( CPAN ). look at VB, damnit ( simple access to almost all Windows services )!
I'm not saying Perl is as bad as those other examples, but its true shining aspect, aside its many convenient syntatic sugars, is CPAN, indeed.
except Perl is all but KISS. TIMTOWTDI is its approach to problem solving. and its big, mixed barroque syntax, although can lead to very compact code, is all but KISS as well.
Good Perl programs can be considered KISS, as long as who are reading them are aware of common Perl idioms and its large non-KISS syntax.
i said "modern, multi-paradigm, very higher-level language", not a "severely patched M$ offering for a very old, simple and basic language for beginners", not unlike PHP btw.
"find that even if it takes a bit longer to code, you will get better results out of C/C++/ObjC."
"Inevitably, as higher level languages are written in C, you're almost always going to find that you get better performance out of a comparable C app."
ah! the "slow performance" argument, easily refutable by noticing that most performance bottlenecks in systems come external factors like file system, DBMSs, network etc; and also that most libraries for such languages are just ( mostly thin ) wrappers for native libs.
"As for scripting, PHP is pretty good now. It used to be trashy, but version 4 and 5 are very nice, easy to work with, and reasonably fast."
it really isn't: it's still a mess of a language with no support for modularization other than OO classes or relying on shallow naming conventions for functions in the global namespace.
"Python's not my cup of tea (little too much like Java for me, and I really don't like my "language" to include a library for everything; I can find my own and include them or write my own). Ruby would be interesting to learn, but
"I doubt if I'd ever use it for anything."
you won't. remember the mantra: "right tool for the right job"
"don't really mind if the language dies in the next ten years, Ruby or Python will work for you. Meanwhile my C app will be maintainable by the newest upstarts to the oldest of the oldies"
FUD. plain and simple. your C app from 10 years ago most likely depends heavily on external 3rd -party libraries that may be hard or impossible to either find or make them work today.
Python, Ruby and company are open-source projects with already more than 10 years old and are likely to stay.
it's not like i'm advocating ruby for any task whatsoever. i was just pointing out it was stupid to complain about learning a new language or tool. my example was ruby because the man cited RoR.
i could go with other languages like Python, OCaml, Scheme, Perl and many others, all with far better support for higher level programming, OO and modularization than that PHP crap.
how about learning a modern, multi-paradigm, very higher-level language for rapidly developing business apps like Ruby rather than an ancient portable assembly to build infrastructure like C?
may i suggest you leave the parens matching to a decent text editor? indenting your lisp code in pretty-printing style would help you get past the very handy parenthesized syntax as well...
Slashdot Mirror
... yours truly, slashdot? Yes, perl. And Amazon.com, perl too. Show me PHP websites of this magnitude...
and Haskell is being used to _implement_ the Perl 6 compiler for the same reason Python or Ruby interpreters are writter in C. Except, of course, Haskell is a lot higher level than C and more secure, meaning the current size of the project is just short of 4K lines. and no side-effects... ^_^
"Welcome to the (our DRM) future!"
- MPAA, RIAA, Disney, M$ and associates
then why the hell is M$ so desperate to dismiss Linux in that stupid Get the facts marketing campaign?
if it wasn't bothering them, they wouldn't even mention it. they're aknowledging its a real competitor and a threat to their business model
yeah, sure, wasn't it for tons of popups suddenly opening up and showing some rather grotesque cumshot scenes in front of your momma, popup blocking wouldn't catch up.
yay for pr0n as a new techs driving force!
What they'll be delivering, as far as i understand it, is a custom application designed around some Mozilla technologies, mainly XPCOM but perhaps also using the XUL engine for UI.
they're not delivering a custom browser or browser content. it's a custom app making good use of Mozilla techs.
"and other kinds of data our customers are increasingly putting in documents"
like, say, an Excel spreadsheet or a PP presentation? yeah, they've been doing this for years: making it easy for people to dump any shit into their document formats so that you'll have to run their products to view them. what's the big news?
guess being xml doesn't matter when it includes lots of links to external proprietary stuff or content which shouldn't really be in a _textual_ document.
couldn't agree more! i don't want multiplayer Metroid Prime or multiplayer Metal Gear tag team madness or something.
i want to feel like a lone hero in my quest to save the world.
MMORPGs completely break any adventurous mood. they just feel like a graphical irc with the same morons acting as ( stupid ) NPCs and talking about their everyday useless lifes.
"Explain to me why, why in this case, Linux, in its greatest magnificient userfriendliness, doesn't surpass Windows usage when it comes to pops and moms computer?"
because mom and pops PCs don't come home from shop preloaded with Linux?
i'm sticking with emacs, thank you.
and to think it was once labeled "Eight Megabytes And Constantly Swapping". good times...
he's right.
... i see you never used Borland Delphi.
Having used many development tools like Emacs, VIM, SciTe, kate, Eclipse, Visual Studio.Net and Delphi, i gotta say Delphi is the best IDE i've used hands down.
Simplicity and high productivity is the key here.
You don't have tons of floating dialogues, icons, buttons and drop-downs poluting your interface just for no other reason than to show off and make you feel like your investment was well worth it
No, just the right form designer, object inspector and class hierarchies, along with the project manager. Less bloat and complexity, more productivity...
KISS.
"how come their employees don't have public blogs like all those at MS?"
because they don't need such artificial marketing for their good products...
M$ employees blogs are such a worthless piece of advertising...
"ASP.NET is lightyears ahead of anything python simply because it gets compiled into machine code"
.NET's VM runtime ). Am i wrong or isn't it just when that bytecode gets loaded and handled to a JIT ( just-in-time ) compiler that it gets actually compiled to native machine code?
/. runs Perl, don't you?
Machine code, yes. Only it is machine code ( bytecode ) for the CLR (
BTW, i worked about a year on a system upgraded from ASP ( interpreted VBScript ) to ASP.NET ( bytecode compiled C# ). We wrote it from scratch, and only used the same DB stored procedures the original system also used. Well, guess what, smarty?! Performance sucked big time! The simple, interpreted ASP application was faster and less bloated.
BTW, you know such a high-traffic as
"before it's executed and runs "closer to the iron" (and therefore blows the doors off anything interpreted)"
yea, my ass it is.
"An alternative operating system to Windows is as simple as buying a Mac or installing Linux."
except Macs are not as cheap as PCs ( about to change, perhaps ) and no end-user ever installs their OS: they buy a computer and it'd better come fully functional. and you know which OS comes with a computer, don't you?
now ask yourself: why?
"MS desktop search does not spy on you and send your local search results back to google for processing!"
they don't need to. they own your desktop by default. they do whatever they want, whenever they see fit. btw, your OS has a serial number, did you know that?
"I'm doing fine just listening to my old CDs all day."
too bad they'll keep pumping out more crazy storage formats so that you buy your entire collection again, this time with DRM included, or risk being just a dinosaur like your grand-grandpa and his gramophone...
... it felt a lot like writing a toolkit like GTK from scratch, and then developing the app proper. well, guess what? i'm sure the next time it'll take a lot less time, since now you have a framework already.
nothing prevents some such AJAX frameworks, both commercial and open-source, to become widely available in the days to come...
Generalizing: it doesn't matter how bad a language is, as long as it has a robust, large and varied user library covering everything you can imagine under the sun. This is because people either don't have the time, desire or technical knowledge to implement such functionality by themselves. They are just client programmers.
look at C ( almost every native libs written in it ). look at Java ( enourmous user library ). look at Perl ( CPAN ). look at VB, damnit ( simple access to almost all Windows services )!
I'm not saying Perl is as bad as those other examples, but its true shining aspect, aside its many convenient syntatic sugars, is CPAN, indeed.
except Perl is all but KISS. TIMTOWTDI is its approach to problem solving. and its big, mixed barroque syntax, although can lead to very compact code, is all but KISS as well.
Good Perl programs can be considered KISS, as long as who are reading them are aware of common Perl idioms and its large non-KISS syntax.
i said "modern, multi-paradigm, very higher-level language", not a "severely patched M$ offering for a very old, simple and basic language for beginners", not unlike PHP btw.
"find that even if it takes a bit longer to code, you will get better results out of C/C++/ObjC."
"Inevitably, as higher level languages are written in C, you're almost always going to find that you get better performance out of a comparable C app."
ah! the "slow performance" argument, easily refutable by noticing that most performance bottlenecks in systems come external factors like file system, DBMSs, network etc; and also that most libraries for such languages are just ( mostly thin ) wrappers for native libs.
"As for scripting, PHP is pretty good now. It used to be trashy, but version 4 and 5 are very nice, easy to work with, and reasonably fast."
it really isn't: it's still a mess of a language with no support for modularization other than OO classes or relying on shallow naming conventions for functions in the global namespace.
"Python's not my cup of tea (little too much like Java for me, and I really don't like my "language" to include a library for everything; I can find my own and include them or write my own). Ruby would be interesting to learn, but
"I doubt if I'd ever use it for anything."
you won't. remember the mantra: "right tool for the right job"
"don't really mind if the language dies in the next ten years, Ruby or Python will work for you. Meanwhile my C app will be maintainable by the newest upstarts to the oldest of the oldies"
FUD. plain and simple. your C app from 10 years ago most likely depends heavily on external 3rd -party libraries that may be hard or impossible to either find or make them work today.
Python, Ruby and company are open-source projects with already more than 10 years old and are likely to stay.
yep, definetely a Borland brew.
it's not like i'm advocating ruby for any task whatsoever. i was just pointing out it was stupid to complain about learning a new language or tool. my example was ruby because the man cited RoR.
i could go with other languages like Python, OCaml, Scheme, Perl and many others, all with far better support for higher level programming, OO and modularization than that PHP crap.
how about learning a modern, multi-paradigm, very higher-level language for rapidly developing business apps like Ruby rather than an ancient portable assembly to build infrastructure like C?
"I don't want to learn a new language"
how about learning a true language like Ruby rather than continue with a subpar Perl reject like PHP?
"I spent a lot of time..."
may i suggest you leave the parens matching to a decent text editor? indenting your lisp code in pretty-printing style would help you get past the very handy parenthesized syntax as well...