There are some problems with Camino, though, such as Camino having slower release cycles and always being behind the Firefox team. Camino is not behind. You can download Camino nightlies just like you can download FF nightlies. Both are based on the same code. The Camino guys just have higher quality standards. IMHO Camino alpha releases are often so good that they could be called final releases.
So, diverting efforts towards the Camino fork Camino is no fork.
the core issue which is too many unaddressed Mac Firefox bugs. We want a better Firefox, not a neglected Firefox, for OS X. You won't get it. Live with it. Windows is the top priority for the Mozilla Corp. guys. The one guy hired by MoCo to work on FF for Mac is currently not working to improve the Mac experience. No, he's working on not sucking even more. Gecko/Mozilla Plattform 1.9 will use Cairo which up to the latest FF3 alpha works really really bad on Mac OS X. If you think that FF2 has issues on Mac, you should try that alpha release. It's horrible on Mac. You get Aqua buttons but that's about it. I know, it's an alpha and alphas are allowed to suck, but right now the current builds of FF3 don't even display many italic fonts. Think about it: The FF Mac guy works almost exclusively to fix Cario bugs on OSX. He's not working on Keychain integration and so on. So for the final release we can be lucky if FF3 won't have MORE bugs on OSX than FF2. You can expect that italics will work again, that arabic text will work again, but actual improvements in the Mac departement compared to FF2? I highly doubt it.
Curent Trunk buids of Firefox (and other Gecko browsers) are getting real close. Here's a screenshot: http://www.flickr.com/photos/11294384@N00/93741157 /. This one was taken with Camino, but Firefox' rendering should look just like this.
Maybe it's because Zonk needs help in math? --> 1000000 (DS in UK) + 2500000 (DS in rest of EU) = 1000000 (DS in whole EU) or: --> 1 = 25 (1 country [UK] = whole EU [25 countries])
PS: It's likely that in this case "Europe" means way more than just the EU, but in terms of economics it's not always clear if Swizerland, Norway, etc are included.
But a Mactel Powerbook makes no sense without pro applications.
Indeed. And that's why I think that Apple will have almost its entire software lineup incl. Final Cut Studio and Aperture shipping as Universal Binary from day one.
Well, maybe Apache does not have these, but other OSS web servers have. Eg if I understand the feature list correctly Roxen WebServer does have at least hot-swappable modules.
I'm not the person you replied to, but I'll respond anyway. Firefox is my default browser (I'm on Mac). Firefox takes a while to launch, if launched the first time. FF creates creates the profile directory, registers its chromes and so on. After that, FF usually starts fast - not so fast as Safari, but still fast. Only if FF has been updated to a newer version or an extension has been installed, FF may act in a simmilar way as after a fresh install (but only once).
I'm not so sure about that. OK, it's not scientific, but in surverys I saw about the favourite browser on the Mac (done on "regular" Mac websites, not geeky/techy pages) showed that about 30-40% use prefer a Gecko browser (mainly Firefox or Camino) and only about 60% use a WebKit browser (especially Safari, of course). While the bundled Safari browser is dominant on Mac, Gecko browsers like Firefox do have a significant install base. Maybe it has something to do with Jaguar support. Safari on Jaguar is no longer supported by Apple (and never been supported very well), but Gecko browsers support Jaguar. IMO Win2000 and Jaguar share a simmilar role. Both systems are still used, but don't get official browser updates by the OS venor. Thus the only way to get a recent browser on these plattforms is to use an alternative, which is mostly Firefox.
The LGPL says *NOTHING* about CVS logs or anything the KDE devs were complaining about. If Apple was doing only the minimum stated in the license, they would just offer the sources on a CD and ask you to pay the shipping cost when you want the sources.
Oh please. These fees are also required for iTunes' Import feature and in many cases for decoding (depends on the licensing scheme). If this was the reason for QT Pro, it would be required to buy a Pro license for QT just to play anything.
The whole QT Pro thing is just flawed. The QT Player should be what it once was: Just a good player. If Apple whants a QT Editor, they should bundle it with iMovie or something.
Funny, you need to buy QT Pro in order to play videos full screen, but OTOH Apple releases iTunes 4.8 with *fullscreen* video support for free. The same is true (since a long time) for audio encoding: Need QT Pro for the "Export" feature in QT, but the "Import" feature in iTunes is free.
I like Apple, but IMHO the guy, who's responsible for the QT Player frontend (not the QT backend, which is cool), is quite stupid.
What's next? iTunes 5.0 with video encoding support?
No, the bug is only fixed in Gecko 1.8. I'm sorry, but Thunderbird 1.0.2 will not render Slashdot correctly. (Neither will any other app based on Gecko 1.7.x)
Apple is required to release the sources of WebCore unter LGPL. If Apple wants to maintain compatibility with older apps that use WebCore (and I guess Apple wants this), it should be possible to compile the sources under Panther.
More apps that have never been bundled with gnome as official apps: abiword, gnumeric, gnome-db, balsa, xmms, gaim, gimp, inkscape, gthumb, openoffice, gqview..
Some of these apps are listed under http://www.gnome.org/gnome-office/. IMO that makes them "official". In the past the GNOME-Office hompepage listed a lot more apps as parts of GNOME-Office (The GIMP was one of them). Now they cut the number down to three apps.
Since GNOME changes its default applications every couple of releases (Galeon --> Epiphany and so on) I think GNOME is doing a good job in spreading many different applications for each task.;-D
Slashdot Mirror
The Camino guys just have higher quality standards. IMHO Camino alpha releases are often so good that they could be called final releases. So, diverting efforts towards the Camino fork Camino is no fork. the core issue which is too many unaddressed Mac Firefox bugs. We want a better Firefox, not a neglected Firefox, for OS X. You won't get it. Live with it. Windows is the top priority for the Mozilla Corp. guys.
The one guy hired by MoCo to work on FF for Mac is currently not working to improve the Mac experience. No, he's working on not sucking even more.
Gecko/Mozilla Plattform 1.9 will use Cairo which up to the latest FF3 alpha works really really bad on Mac OS X. If you think that FF2 has issues on Mac, you should try that alpha release. It's horrible on Mac. You get Aqua buttons but that's about it. I know, it's an alpha and alphas are allowed to suck, but right now the current builds of FF3 don't even display many italic fonts. Think about it: The FF Mac guy works almost exclusively to fix Cario bugs on OSX. He's not working on Keychain integration and so on.
So for the final release we can be lucky if FF3 won't have MORE bugs on OSX than FF2. You can expect that italics will work again, that arabic text will work again, but actual improvements in the Mac departement compared to FF2? I highly doubt it.
iCab 3 passes the test. See http://vric.free.fr/mac/iCab/iCab3b/ (includes other browser's screenshots as well).
7 /. This one was taken with Camino, but Firefox' rendering should look just like this.
Curent Trunk buids of Firefox (and other Gecko browsers) are getting real close. Here's a screenshot: http://www.flickr.com/photos/11294384@N00/9374115
> How is this listed in the Math category?
Maybe it's because Zonk needs help in math?
--> 1000000 (DS in UK) + 2500000 (DS in rest of EU) = 1000000 (DS in whole EU)
or:
--> 1 = 25 (1 country [UK] = whole EU [25 countries])
PS: It's likely that in this case "Europe" means way more than just the EU, but in terms of economics it's not always clear if Swizerland, Norway, etc are included.
Nintendo is #1, if you include portable cosoles.
But a Mactel Powerbook makes no sense without pro applications.
Indeed. And that's why I think that Apple will have almost its entire software lineup incl. Final Cut Studio and Aperture shipping as Universal Binary from day one.
Well, maybe Apache does not have these, but other OSS web servers have. Eg if I understand the feature list correctly Roxen WebServer does have at least hot-swappable modules.
I'm not the person you replied to, but I'll respond anyway.
Firefox is my default browser (I'm on Mac). Firefox takes a while to launch, if launched the first time. FF creates creates the profile directory, registers its chromes and so on. After that, FF usually starts fast - not so fast as Safari, but still fast. Only if FF has been updated to a newer version or an extension has been installed, FF may act in a simmilar way as after a fresh install (but only once).
I'm not so sure about that. OK, it's not scientific, but in surverys I saw about the favourite browser on the Mac (done on "regular" Mac websites, not geeky/techy pages) showed that about 30-40% use prefer a Gecko browser (mainly Firefox or Camino) and only about 60% use a WebKit browser (especially Safari, of course).
While the bundled Safari browser is dominant on Mac, Gecko browsers like Firefox do have a significant install base. Maybe it has something to do with Jaguar support. Safari on Jaguar is no longer supported by Apple (and never been supported very well), but Gecko browsers support Jaguar. IMO Win2000 and Jaguar share a simmilar role. Both systems are still used, but don't get official browser updates by the OS venor. Thus the only way to get a recent browser on these plattforms is to use an alternative, which is mostly Firefox.
Java, Real, QuickTime, flash, etc, are all "mainstream" and none are built into MSIE.
MS did their own Java. It was bundled since IE4, got kicked with WinXP, was bundled again with WinXP-SP1 and was kicked out again with WinXP-SP1a.
MS once licensed the RealPlayer. IIRC it was during Win95 or Win98.
MS licensed QT (the file format). WMP can still play old (pre-Sorenson codec) QT movies.
MS have licensed Flash. It's bundled with every Windows release since Win98 or something.
Not all of these products are still bundled with Windows/IE, but they were in the past. It surely helped their adoption.
Or Nelson: "Ha, ha!"
The WikiMedia Foundation?
It's a WikiMedia tool under GPL.
The LGPL says *NOTHING* about CVS logs or anything the KDE devs were complaining about.
If Apple was doing only the minimum stated in the license, they would just offer the sources on a CD and ask you to pay the shipping cost when you want the sources.
Oh please. These fees are also required for iTunes' Import feature and in many cases for decoding (depends on the licensing scheme).
If this was the reason for QT Pro, it would be required to buy a Pro license for QT just to play anything.
The whole QT Pro thing is just flawed. The QT Player should be what it once was: Just a good player.
If Apple whants a QT Editor, they should bundle it with iMovie or something.
Funny, you need to buy QT Pro in order to play videos full screen, but OTOH Apple releases iTunes 4.8 with *fullscreen* video support for free.
The same is true (since a long time) for audio encoding: Need QT Pro for the "Export" feature in QT, but the "Import" feature in iTunes is free.
I like Apple, but IMHO the guy, who's responsible for the QT Player frontend (not the QT backend, which is cool), is quite stupid.
What's next? iTunes 5.0 with video encoding support?
the code is licensed under the BSD model
No, not really. It's licensed under APSL, which is (as far as I understand the license) very simmilar to the LGPL.
Wow, you got my (lame) joke... ;-)
BTW: Firefox 1.1 and Thunderbird 1.1 will be based on Gecko 1.8.
No, the bug is only fixed in Gecko 1.8.
I'm sorry, but Thunderbird 1.0.2 will not render Slashdot correctly. (Neither will any other app based on Gecko 1.7.x)
Will it be backported to Panther?
Apple is required to release the sources of WebCore unter LGPL. If Apple wants to maintain compatibility with older apps that use WebCore (and I guess Apple wants this), it should be possible to compile the sources under Panther.
Hm OK, but...
More apps that have never been bundled with gnome as official apps: abiword, gnumeric, gnome-db, balsa, xmms, gaim, gimp, inkscape, gthumb, openoffice, gqview..
Some of these apps are listed under http://www.gnome.org/gnome-office/. IMO that makes them "official". In the past the GNOME-Office hompepage listed a lot more apps as parts of GNOME-Office (The GIMP was one of them). Now they cut the number down to three apps.
Since GNOME changes its default applications every couple of releases (Galeon --> Epiphany and so on) I think GNOME is doing a good job in spreading many different applications for each task. ;-D
But three 3GHz PowerPC CPUs are not expensive? Oookaaayyy.....
IMO the same mistake as Nintendo did with GameCube's disks. Seems that a PowerPC CPU is not the only thing MS copies from Nintendo.
I mean that Firefox can be a base for "rich client"
:-)
Well, not Firefox, but XUL Runner
http://www.mirrordot.org/stories/8815ecf16d8124c37 5e3bff7e0ec2fea/index.html
Doesn't gcj destroy the point of Java? How plattforn independent is it once you compiled an app into native code?