In fact, once they're shown the basics of how there are no drive letters and how things are just off of/
Stop right there. I know a lot of people who have a basic knowledge would not understand that. These are the people who want a computer to work, but don't want to call someone when they want to chagne something. ie they know how to run an installer and install it on C: drive.
The whole Linux directory system means you have to learn about mounting drives etc. These are not that simple concepts.
Double click on an installer and it will just work... rarely happens on Linux.
I know lots of peopel woh need training on unix systems, but pretty much the majority of people can jump on a Windows box and get on the internet etc.
This was done by Hal Bertram who is now at MPC.
He presented it as a Stupid RAT trick at last year's Siggraph. Hopefully his notes will get up at http://www.renderman.org/RMR/Examples/srt2003/inde x.html
at some point.
I think he basically dumped out the positions of all the grids that prman makes and then loaded this into his renderer. I am guessing he just used the processing power of the card to push out Tiff files although I guess this would involve some OpenGL at some point.
Simon
Do you know how much licnesing costs are for Maya PER YEAR? (over US$1000 on top of the initial US$7000 price tag). The one off cost of Redhat is tiny in comparison and guarentees stability for 5 years. That's a realyl good deal!
On the renderfarm is more of an issue, but as long as Fedora is supported by PRman and Mtor it shouldn't be a problem. It only really needs patching for stability/driver/speed issues. Security isn't an issue as it's behind a firewall and there is only the OS on the hard disk.
Funny. I always find it the other way around. Admittedly my only experience is really with Amazon. The UK version often has less books on offer, at higher prices and longer delivery times. It's often been simpler for me to buy at the US store in US dollars and wait the extra 5 days than buy it here.
With Control+C and Control+V (and X for cut and Z for undo) at least it's consistant!
With Linux every single program wants it's own way of doing stuff! Try cutting and pasting in emacs... then try it in vi... then in something else...arghh. Some Linux programs even (shock horror!) use control C and V as well!
Plus he seemed to imply that you could copy and paste things other than text using select then middle mouse button. I don't think I've ever been able to copy and paste images or a spreadsheet table and preserve everything this way. Is there something I am missing??
Yes but most of these are extremely adaptable. Maya is the defacto standard because of the power of MEL (pretty awful language, but powerful) and it's C++ API which is very well written and gives you a lot of access.
RenderMan is the ultimate in adaptable most of the time. Writing your own shaders is extremely useful, or C DSO's if you need to.
Shake has the ability to write macros and also has a fairly decent API I have heard.
Plus all the above can use text based file formats which opens them up to serious abuse with Perl/Python/standard unix tools.
I would hardly call that being locked in!! (Discreet and Adobe being the notable exceptions).
Usually you don't need absolute source level code. You wouldn't know how to maintain it and most compaines release bug fixes often. ILM is the only place that has source access to RenderMan outside Pixar and I don't think they use it that often.
Several places have prioritory renderers/animation tools but then you get the problem that you are screwed if your programmers leave/retire/get hit by a bus. Fewer companies are doing this.
Linux is only taking off because it is very similar to IRIX and it's easy to port onto new hardware. OSX is gaining some ground now too - especially as it is a lot newer and supports PhotoShop etc.
Simon
Actually I'm all for banning cell phones and PDA's in cinemas. There is nothing worse than some prat jabbering away on their phone. Different issue though.
Word of mouth is still the best marketing, and all you need for it to work is a decent plot!
OK maybe Microsoft won't be around, maybe even Linux won't. It's impossible to make long term predictions sucessfully. For the short term though these are the skills in demand.
When it comes to current Office tools I doubt there are many fundamental differences between them which are not very transferable so why not learn Microsoft first and potentially be able to dive straight in? Heck they even might have it at home, saving time learning new things.
If situations change then so should the education system. It's all part of life long learning. I'd have hoped that educators would have reviewed their policies in less than 14 years intervals!
Except if this article was about a school switching entirely over to Linux then we wouldn't get this sort of comment.
Slashdot is obviously very bias to start with, but most people in education are not growing up to be computer techies and will be using Windows with Office. Forcing an open source philosphy down someone's throat is not going to help them if it won't be any use later.
And how many businesses do get a few unix boxes just to avoid uniformity? No they use them because they are productive.
Uniformity mean maintaining one set of support contracts, one set of software, one set of patches for when things go wrong and there are less obscure bugs (there may still be bugs;) getting machines to talk to each other.
And saying that you can only do video editting on a Mac in this day and age is simply not true. Only publishing remains a bastion of Apple and that's because it's what they are used to. (the usual argument given against Windows).
We're some of them ex-SGI? They got burned with Microsoft on Farenheit - the link between OpenGL and DirectX (I think....) that never happened.
It would definitely explain their watertight contracts.
And there are reasons there are 4 documents about it. OOP shouldn't be as hard as Perl makes it out to be.
Personally I try to pretend Perl doesn't have objects and even references, because trying to use the things is a complete nightmare. This is also the point you should switch to something better designed for the task - such as Python.
ISn't @ISA the biggest hack possible??
Slashdot Mirror
In fact, once they're shown the basics of how there are no drive letters and how things are just off of /
Stop right there. I know a lot of people who have a basic knowledge would not understand that. These are the people who want a computer to work, but don't want to call someone when they want to chagne something. ie they know how to run an installer and install it on C: drive.
The whole Linux directory system means you have to learn about mounting drives etc. These are not that simple concepts.
Double click on an installer and it will just work... rarely happens on Linux.
I know lots of peopel woh need training on unix systems, but pretty much the majority of people can jump on a Windows box and get on the internet etc.
Simon
This was done by Hal Bertram who is now at MPC. He presented it as a Stupid RAT trick at last year's Siggraph. Hopefully his notes will get up at http://www.renderman.org/RMR/Examples/srt2003/inde x.html
at some point.
I think he basically dumped out the positions of all the grids that prman makes and then loaded this into his renderer. I am guessing he just used the processing power of the card to push out Tiff files although I guess this would involve some OpenGL at some point.
Simon
Actually Alias recently split from SGI.e s/2004 0211_alias_in_acquisition_talks.shtml
http://www.alias.com/eng/press/press_releas
"Yes we can!"
Do you know how much licnesing costs are for Maya PER YEAR? (over US$1000 on top of the initial US$7000 price tag). The one off cost of Redhat is tiny in comparison and guarentees stability for 5 years. That's a realyl good deal!
On the renderfarm is more of an issue, but as long as Fedora is supported by PRman and Mtor it shouldn't be a problem. It only really needs patching for stability/driver/speed issues. Security isn't an issue as it's behind a firewall and there is only the OS on the hard disk.
Simon
Funny. I always find it the other way around. Admittedly my only experience is really with Amazon. The UK version often has less books on offer, at higher prices and longer delivery times. It's often been simpler for me to buy at the US store in US dollars and wait the extra 5 days than buy it here.
With Control+C and Control+V (and X for cut and Z for undo) at least it's consistant! With Linux every single program wants it's own way of doing stuff! Try cutting and pasting in emacs... then try it in vi... then in something else...arghh. Some Linux programs even (shock horror!) use control C and V as well! Plus he seemed to imply that you could copy and paste things other than text using select then middle mouse button. I don't think I've ever been able to copy and paste images or a spreadsheet table and preserve everything this way. Is there something I am missing??
Yes but most of these are extremely adaptable. Maya is the defacto standard because of the power of MEL (pretty awful language, but powerful) and it's C++ API which is very well written and gives you a lot of access. RenderMan is the ultimate in adaptable most of the time. Writing your own shaders is extremely useful, or C DSO's if you need to. Shake has the ability to write macros and also has a fairly decent API I have heard. Plus all the above can use text based file formats which opens them up to serious abuse with Perl/Python/standard unix tools. I would hardly call that being locked in!! (Discreet and Adobe being the notable exceptions). Usually you don't need absolute source level code. You wouldn't know how to maintain it and most compaines release bug fixes often. ILM is the only place that has source access to RenderMan outside Pixar and I don't think they use it that often. Several places have prioritory renderers/animation tools but then you get the problem that you are screwed if your programmers leave/retire/get hit by a bus. Fewer companies are doing this. Linux is only taking off because it is very similar to IRIX and it's easy to port onto new hardware. OSX is gaining some ground now too - especially as it is a lot newer and supports PhotoShop etc. Simon
there is a reason it is called "Forever"....
Actually I'm all for banning cell phones and PDA's in cinemas. There is nothing worse than some prat jabbering away on their phone. Different issue though. Word of mouth is still the best marketing, and all you need for it to work is a decent plot!
carefully?
OK maybe Microsoft won't be around, maybe even Linux won't. It's impossible to make long term predictions sucessfully. For the short term though these are the skills in demand. When it comes to current Office tools I doubt there are many fundamental differences between them which are not very transferable so why not learn Microsoft first and potentially be able to dive straight in? Heck they even might have it at home, saving time learning new things. If situations change then so should the education system. It's all part of life long learning. I'd have hoped that educators would have reviewed their policies in less than 14 years intervals!
Except if this article was about a school switching entirely over to Linux then we wouldn't get this sort of comment. Slashdot is obviously very bias to start with, but most people in education are not growing up to be computer techies and will be using Windows with Office. Forcing an open source philosphy down someone's throat is not going to help them if it won't be any use later. And how many businesses do get a few unix boxes just to avoid uniformity? No they use them because they are productive. Uniformity mean maintaining one set of support contracts, one set of software, one set of patches for when things go wrong and there are less obscure bugs (there may still be bugs ;) getting machines to talk to each other.
And saying that you can only do video editting on a Mac in this day and age is simply not true. Only publishing remains a bastion of Apple and that's because it's what they are used to. (the usual argument given against Windows).
We're some of them ex-SGI? They got burned with Microsoft on Farenheit - the link between OpenGL and DirectX (I think....) that never happened. It would definitely explain their watertight contracts.
So instead of being smelly you'll be green!
And there are reasons there are 4 documents about it. OOP shouldn't be as hard as Perl makes it out to be. Personally I try to pretend Perl doesn't have objects and even references, because trying to use the things is a complete nightmare. This is also the point you should switch to something better designed for the task - such as Python. ISn't @ISA the biggest hack possible??
yes. Also look up stocaistic sampling and you'll find his name mentioned several times.
It's also missing IRIX. Why is this never mentioned. I think it is system V based isn't it?