Heh, I had actually noticed that, and I must say, it's a logical extension that I like the idea of. Hopefully it helps some of those ad-hoc groups that don't see their partners often enough, and end up leaving everything to the last minute, or having contribution 'issues'.:)
I'm just in the last week of finishing my Computer Science degree at RMIT university, Melbourne Australia.
I was generally quite surprised, but pretty much every subject we do, from the initial programming subjects, to the actual 'software engineering' intro subjects stress design processes. We end up doing UML diagrams, and planning, etc, as much as possible. We also get some introduction to development tools as well.
For instance, in second year, there were sections on the marking guide referring to our use of CVS for code versioning, etc for two projects we did in consecutive subjects, along with having to submit the usual requirements and design documents, plus test plans, etc.
That said, our course tends to avoid the use of many of the development tools (you won't run into VC++ or VS.net or whatnot, unless you do a subject specifically centered around it), except for Eclipse, which they've started teaching to the newbies for some reason (much to the annoyance of the old guard.:) )
It's definently possible. Make sure the 'Cool-n-Quiet' junk is enabled in the bios on any recent AMDx2 system, and install powernowd or something similar under linux.
My cpu speeds idle at around 1GHz, and then spring back up to 2.4GHz when under load, then slowly drop back to 1GHz when not in use. Independently, I might add.
Of course, but he asked if there was anything better. You may as well assume my post is a vote in favour of LXR. It certainly helped me a lot while i was wading through the kernel source, and it does support non-kernel sourcecode in more than just C nowadays.
LXR's claim to fame is that it started out being a cross-referenced browser for the linux kernel source code, but since it was released, the newer versions has moved towards becoming more of a general source browser. (might need to use cvs, don't know if a proper release was made)
It does neat tricks like processing source code, building function/variable/header/etc line references for usage, definition, declaration etc, and cramming them into a db for retreival. It can also handle interfacing with CVS to pull source code directly from a CVS server, which is interesting. Also handles full text searching too, if you get glimpse or whatever.
Of course, the interface to LXR is a web browser, which makes it less than ideal if you consider that it isn't integrated into an IDE, but for the purpose of tracing/searching large amounts of code, it's still pretty useful.
Let's not forget that openssh can very easily be setup to only allow a particular key to execute a particular command.
Of course, this only adds a layer of obfuscation and effort into an attacker's attack plan, but it's a fairly simple trick to vastly reduce the issues here.
Didn't Sys-con sack Maureen O'Gara (sp?) after she printed a tissue of lies about PJ from groklaw with a bunch of irrelevent accusations and misinformation?
Sorry, wasn't trying to imply that it *was* Sequel.
That's just how I keep hearing suits refer to MS's SQL server. I do recall that there really was a product called "Sequel" but I do admit that I had no idea it was pre-SQL.
So let me get this straight, you intend to spend the rest of your life compiling software yourself, fiddling with flags, in order to POTENTIALLY gain 1% -> 10% (and I find the figure of 10% both ludicrous and without any basis in fact, particularly given previous benchmarks.)?
You do realise that, since you claim to be backlogged, in the short term the backlog is going to drastically increase since you'll be wasting time and resources compiling stuff, right? That's one hell of a gamble.
Besides, if you're running a server farm to do sensitive processing, do you really want some USE flag potentially screwing over your ability to debug your application? That's what things like -fomit-frame-pointers, or whatever it is, does in order to reduce ram usage.
I really REALLY doubt that recompiling an entire operating system for 'better performance' is going to make anything like the differences the ultimate parent has raised, unless your bottleneck comes from the floating-point performance of bash or something:). I'd be more inclined to get some benchmarks of the application doing the processing, and looking at ways to increase throughput by reducing the effort in the common path and removing blocking system calls, etc. No compile-time flag is going to do that magically for you, that happens WAAAAY further up when it's being developed.
Watching some kawaii CGI robot prance around on a big screen is not really all that awsome
If you're talking about marvin, you do realise that was actually a midget in a suit, not CG, right? Played by an actor named Warwick Davis. He did a fantastic job at it as well.
Oh, and I'm pretty sure he wasn't CGI either. He didn't look much like a webserver.:)
(I know, I know, some people use CGI as computer-generated imagery, but it's funny. laugh)
You're taking my comment out of context completely.
I did not say, or intend to insinuate, that motorola should not be releasing the source to the kernel they use in their phones. They should be adhering to the GPL, for legal reasons at least, if not to be good community citizens.
But for the average developer who wants to target more than just the cluster of motorola linux phones, the SDK that provides the java development environment for their phones will do the trick, and give them a wider user base. What's more, it's just as easy to get this SDK as it is for the rest of their phones.
Now, if the phone is actually more like a PDA, even then, I'd doubt that the linux source is necessary, so much as just the development headers and utilities in order to build applications that can run upon it.
I really doubt there's a large enough demand for the actual source to the kernel itself that it's killing development on the platform. After all, people have been developing applications on solaris without seeing the kernel in anything but unlinked modules and a linked kernel image for years.
That said, I still stress that motorola should be releasing the linux source. I just don't see difficulties in getting it as an impediment to development on the platform.
I definently have to call bullshit, at least based on what's in the summary in this article.
The Motorola SDK for their mobile phones is available right now, both the linux and non-linux varieties of phones.
This article is discussing, of course, the availability of the linux source code itself, not the SDK. You do not need the linux source code in order to develop applications for their linux-based mobile phones, and to be perfectly honest, having to jump through hoops to get the kernel source really isn't that big a deal, since getting the SDK is as simple as signing up at www.motocoders.com
If he gets Apple, then I'm calling iRiver for the damage they've done to my hearing.
And you'd probably have no case. In europe, Iriver comply with regulations to prevent the player from causing hearing damage (volume limiting), and I'm pretty sure they have the warnings in the documentation that warn against excessive usage.
The person who's taking the action against apple is doing it because of inadequate warnings on the devices. Iriver have these warnings (at least for my model, the H140) in their manuals, and thus, have made the appropriate effort to educate people (not iriver's fault if people don't read a manual that tells you to read it first:) )
The GPLv2 states, and I quote: "c) If the modified program normally reads commands interactively when run, you must cause it, when started running for such interactive use in the most ordinary way, to print or display an announcement including an appropriate copyright notice and a notice that there is no warranty"
Unfortunately, there seems to be a notion in some camps that this means that you need to AGREE to the GPL in order to use it, when the entire statement is just informative.
That said, it's also a quick and easy way to inform a user of their rights when they use a GPL'ed application, ie, they can obtain the source code, etc etc, and they probably should acknowledge the lack of warranty at some point.
And, of course, the far more fun variant is the "pissed off worker's revenge", where they use
sudo chmod u+s/bin/sh/bin/sh and then proceeds to remove the entries in the logs that talk about them running 'sudo', making a copy of the setuid/bin/sh, and restoring the permissions.
Not so helpful if syslog is logging to an external server or a line printer, but people need to analyse logs for that to stand out, and if you've given them carte-blanche sudo chmod access, they could bury it in a sea of normal looking chmod's, and then it becomes needle-in-haystack-like
On one hand, we've got a product that's exploded with features in the past few years, vs a product that's gotten better, but not by a lot.
Eclipse has matured extremely quickly into not only a base for building IDE tools, but as a base for building complete applications (rich client applications), and an excellent community has formed, with both opensource and closed source/commercial plugins available from a variety of locations.
OpenOffice has grown to be effectively a cut down, free, version of Sun's StarOffice, with features that get left out due to Sun's policy on making sure that the commercial StarOffice contains more features and has more QA. This appears to be in an effort to maintain control over the *Office codebase.
At first glance, it's hard to tell why the differences exist. Both were commercial products, that were opensourced. Both are still maintained by a central company's policy. Both have benefitted from patches from the community. Yet only one is what I'd call a successful opensource product.
I think it's fairly safe to say that Sun has a poor mindset when it comes to opensource software. I'd be completely unsurprised if OpenSolaris falls straight down the same tube. I don't see how anyone can draw the conclusion that opensourcing a commercial product will fail. It still comes down to the processes in place.
"...to ensure that children have access to violent and or filthy materials? Do you think that it's GOOD that kids should be seeing this sort of trash?"
Obviously, you don't believe YOUR children shouldn't. Doesn't mean everyone should automatically agree with you.
The reason this is being fought tooth and nail is because it's a stepping stone to greater losses of the so-called freedoms you americans face (note, author of this post not american)
"As a parent and a grandfather, I would not want my kids partaking in this sort of degenerate filth. It's garbage."
By your reasoning, so's most of shakespear's work.. oh. so that's written on paper, so that's okay? Right, double-standard much? May as well burn every library and start again with fresh culture.
"And don't get all excited. I'm an atheist so I'm not some religious right wing zealot.."
*blink* so that means you're just a right wing zealot? You don't have to be religious to be a moral crusader, it just seems to be common.
"I'm an adult and I know what's bad for kids. I've raised two kids myself, they are adults now and I'm happy to say I think they turned out pretty good and I had strict rules on this sort of thing in my home. I absolutely forbid MTV and such trash under my roof and it was NOT a problem, as a matter of fact my son came home from college last year and told me that he was glad that I had forbidden MTV type trash in the home.."
A sample of two is not a valid experiment. Come back and talk to me when you've raised about 30-thousand children, AND when you have a valid cross-section of lifestyles, living areas, etc. Your experiment is also loaded with bias. Read http://www.badscience.net/ for examples of bias in experiments.
Millions of children grow up with video games, MTV, books, porn, the internet, and none of them turn out to be serial killers, gang members, murderers, rapists, drug users, etc.
Some kids who have no contact with any of the above media still commit crimes of these nature, hell, they were committing these crimes before the media existed at all!
Statistically speaking, the fact that there's an intersection at some point between violent crimes and these types of media is just a proof that both exist in a random selection of people!
ash
PS, I find it entertaingly co-incidental (aka, an alanis-morriset style ironicism) that i was asked to reproduce the word 'gunned' to verify my humanity.
Slashdot Mirror
Heh, I had actually noticed that, and I must say, it's a logical extension that I like the idea of. Hopefully it helps some of those ad-hoc groups that don't see their partners often enough, and end up leaving everything to the last minute, or having contribution 'issues'. :)
ash
I'm just in the last week of finishing my Computer Science degree at RMIT university, Melbourne Australia.
:) )
I was generally quite surprised, but pretty much every subject we do, from the initial programming subjects, to the actual 'software engineering' intro subjects stress design processes. We end up doing UML diagrams, and planning, etc, as much as possible. We also get some introduction to development tools as well.
For instance, in second year, there were sections on the marking guide referring to our use of CVS for code versioning, etc for two projects we did in consecutive subjects, along with having to submit the usual requirements and design documents, plus test plans, etc.
That said, our course tends to avoid the use of many of the development tools (you won't run into VC++ or VS.net or whatnot, unless you do a subject specifically centered around it), except for Eclipse, which they've started teaching to the newbies for some reason (much to the annoyance of the old guard.
ash
In all fairness to the guy, he probably just did something similar to this Joel on Software article.
Of course, because it's impossible to lie about who you are on the net.
It's definently possible. Make sure the 'Cool-n-Quiet' junk is enabled in the bios on any recent AMDx2 system, and install powernowd or something similar under linux.
My cpu speeds idle at around 1GHz, and then spring back up to 2.4GHz when under load, then slowly drop back to 1GHz when not in use. Independently, I might add.
pff. please. everyone knows the solution to global warming is just really big ice cubes.
Of course, but he asked if there was anything better. You may as well assume my post is a vote in favour of LXR.
It certainly helped me a lot while i was wading through the kernel source, and it does support non-kernel sourcecode in more than just C nowadays.
ash
I've always considered stuff like LXR (linux cross reference) to be good for this kind of thing.
LXR's claim to fame is that it started out being a cross-referenced browser for the linux kernel source code, but since it was released, the newer versions has moved towards becoming more of a general source browser. (might need to use cvs, don't know if a proper release was made)
It does neat tricks like processing source code, building function/variable/header/etc line references for usage, definition, declaration etc, and cramming them into a db for retreival. It can also handle interfacing with CVS to pull source code directly from a CVS server, which is interesting. Also handles full text searching too, if you get glimpse or whatever.
Of course, the interface to LXR is a web browser, which makes it less than ideal if you consider that it isn't integrated into an IDE, but for the purpose of tracing/searching large amounts of code, it's still pretty useful.
ash
Correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't this similar to how DeCSS got started (the programmers making a mistake in the code, that is).
I seem to recall it was reverse engineering Xing's dvd player libraries that resulted in the release of a DVD decryption key.
Let's not forget that openssh can very easily be setup to only allow a particular key to execute a particular command.
Of course, this only adds a layer of obfuscation and effort into an attacker's attack plan, but it's a fairly simple trick to vastly reduce the issues here.
ash
Uh.
Didn't Sys-con sack Maureen O'Gara (sp?) after she printed a tissue of lies about PJ from groklaw with a bunch of irrelevent accusations and misinformation?
Thought i remembered the article. Here at groklaw
Sorry, wasn't trying to imply that it *was* Sequel.
That's just how I keep hearing suits refer to MS's SQL server. I do recall that there really was a product called "Sequel" but I do admit that I had no idea it was pre-SQL.
Well, can't be worse than SQL server.
I hear that one as Sequel-server from suits on a regular basis.
All I can think of is "sequel to what?"
ash
I thought he wore the mask because deep down, he wanted to be a black guy?
Maybe I've just watched chasing amy too many times
ash
Except possibly Debtors prison :)
So let me get this straight, you intend to spend the rest of your life compiling software yourself, fiddling with flags, in order to POTENTIALLY gain 1% -> 10% (and I find the figure of 10% both ludicrous and without any basis in fact, particularly given previous benchmarks.)?
:).
You do realise that, since you claim to be backlogged, in the short term the backlog is going to drastically increase since you'll be wasting time and resources compiling stuff, right? That's one hell of a gamble.
Besides, if you're running a server farm to do sensitive processing, do you really want some USE flag potentially screwing over your ability to debug your application? That's what things like -fomit-frame-pointers, or whatever it is, does in order to reduce ram usage.
I really REALLY doubt that recompiling an entire operating system for 'better performance' is going to make anything like the differences the ultimate parent has raised, unless your bottleneck comes from the floating-point performance of bash or something
I'd be more inclined to get some benchmarks of the application doing the processing, and looking at ways to increase throughput by reducing the effort in the common path and removing blocking system calls, etc. No compile-time flag is going to do that magically for you, that happens WAAAAY further up when it's being developed.
ash
I'm thinking Super Mario 64 myself.
:)
Some of those water world levels had you swimming down to find treasure chests that'd open up with a nice creak. Had giant clams too
ash
Watching some kawaii CGI robot prance around on a big screen is not really all that awsome
:)
If you're talking about marvin, you do realise that was actually a midget in a suit, not CG, right? Played by an actor named Warwick Davis. He did a fantastic job at it as well.
Oh, and I'm pretty sure he wasn't CGI either. He didn't look much like a webserver.
(I know, I know, some people use CGI as computer-generated imagery, but it's funny. laugh)
ash
You're taking my comment out of context completely.
I did not say, or intend to insinuate, that motorola should not be releasing the source to the kernel they use in their phones. They should be adhering to the GPL, for legal reasons at least, if not to be good community citizens.
But for the average developer who wants to target more than just the cluster of motorola linux phones, the SDK that provides the java development environment for their phones will do the trick, and give them a wider user base.
What's more, it's just as easy to get this SDK as it is for the rest of their phones.
Now, if the phone is actually more like a PDA, even then, I'd doubt that the linux source is necessary, so much as just the development headers and utilities in order to build applications that can run upon it.
I really doubt there's a large enough demand for the actual source to the kernel itself that it's killing development on the platform. After all, people have been developing applications on solaris without seeing the kernel in anything but unlinked modules and a linked kernel image for years.
That said, I still stress that motorola should be releasing the linux source. I just don't see difficulties in getting it as an impediment to development on the platform.
ash
I definently have to call bullshit, at least based on what's in the summary in this article.
The Motorola SDK for their mobile phones is available right now, both the linux and non-linux varieties of phones.
This article is discussing, of course, the availability of the linux source code itself, not the SDK. You do not need the linux source code in order to develop applications for their linux-based mobile phones, and to be perfectly honest, having to jump through hoops to get the kernel source really isn't that big a deal, since getting the SDK is as simple as signing up at www.motocoders.com
ash
If he gets Apple, then I'm calling iRiver for the damage they've done to my hearing.
:) )
And you'd probably have no case. In europe, Iriver comply with regulations to prevent the player from causing hearing damage (volume limiting), and I'm pretty sure they have the warnings in the documentation that warn against excessive usage.
The person who's taking the action against apple is doing it because of inadequate warnings on the devices.
Iriver have these warnings (at least for my model, the H140) in their manuals, and thus, have made the appropriate effort to educate people (not iriver's fault if people don't read a manual that tells you to read it first
ash
Aah, it's an interesting problem.
The GPLv2 states, and I quote:
"c) If the modified program normally reads commands interactively when run, you must cause it, when started running for such interactive use in the most ordinary way, to print or display an announcement including an appropriate copyright notice and a notice that there is no warranty"
Unfortunately, there seems to be a notion in some camps that this means that you need to AGREE to the GPL in order to use it, when the entire statement is just informative.
That said, it's also a quick and easy way to inform a user of their rights when they use a GPL'ed application, ie, they can obtain the source code, etc etc, and they probably should acknowledge the lack of warranty at some point.
ash
And, of course, the far more fun variant is the "pissed off worker's revenge", where they use
/bin/sh /bin/sh /bin/sh, and restoring the permissions.
sudo chmod u+s
and then proceeds to remove the entries in the logs that talk about them running 'sudo', making a copy of the setuid
Not so helpful if syslog is logging to an external server or a line printer, but people need to analyse logs for that to stand out, and if you've given them carte-blanche sudo chmod access, they could bury it in a sea of normal looking chmod's, and then it becomes needle-in-haystack-like
ash
It's interesting you should mention this.
I'd personally have contrasted Eclipse (IBM http://www.eclipse.org/) to OpenOffice.Org (Sun http://www.openoffice.org/) in that kind of article.
On one hand, we've got a product that's exploded with features in the past few years, vs a product that's gotten better, but not by a lot.
Eclipse has matured extremely quickly into not only a base for building IDE tools, but as a base for building complete applications (rich client applications), and an excellent community has formed, with both opensource and closed source/commercial plugins available from a variety of locations.
OpenOffice has grown to be effectively a cut down, free, version of Sun's StarOffice, with features that get left out due to Sun's policy on making sure that the commercial StarOffice contains more features and has more QA. This appears to be in an effort to maintain control over the *Office codebase.
At first glance, it's hard to tell why the differences exist. Both were commercial products, that were opensourced. Both are still maintained by a central company's policy. Both have benefitted from patches from the community. Yet only one is what I'd call a successful opensource product.
I think it's fairly safe to say that Sun has a poor mindset when it comes to opensource software. I'd be completely unsurprised if OpenSolaris falls straight down the same tube. I don't see how anyone can draw the conclusion that opensourcing a commercial product will fail. It still comes down to the processes in place.
ash
"...to ensure that children have access to violent and or filthy materials?
Do you think that it's GOOD that kids should be seeing this sort of trash?"
Obviously, you don't believe YOUR children shouldn't. Doesn't mean everyone should automatically agree with you.
The reason this is being fought tooth and nail is because it's a stepping stone to greater losses of the so-called freedoms you americans face (note, author of this post not american)
"As a parent and a grandfather, I would not want my kids partaking in this sort of degenerate filth. It's garbage."
By your reasoning, so's most of shakespear's work.. oh. so that's written on paper, so that's okay? Right, double-standard much? May as well burn every library and start again with fresh culture.
"And don't get all excited. I'm an atheist so I'm not some religious right wing zealot.."
*blink* so that means you're just a right wing zealot? You don't have to be religious to be a moral crusader, it just seems to be common.
"I'm an adult and I know what's bad for kids. I've raised two kids myself, they are adults now and I'm happy to say I think they turned out pretty good and I had strict rules on this sort of thing in my home. I absolutely forbid MTV and such trash under my roof and it was NOT a problem, as a matter of fact my son came home from college last year and told me that he was glad that I had forbidden MTV type trash in the home.."
A sample of two is not a valid experiment. Come back and talk to me when you've raised about 30-thousand children, AND when you have a valid cross-section of lifestyles, living areas, etc. Your experiment is also loaded with bias. Read http://www.badscience.net/ for examples of bias in experiments.
Millions of children grow up with video games, MTV, books, porn, the internet, and none of them turn out to be serial killers, gang members, murderers, rapists, drug users, etc.
Some kids who have no contact with any of the above media still commit crimes of these nature, hell, they were committing these crimes before the media existed at all!
Statistically speaking, the fact that there's an intersection at some point between violent crimes and these types of media is just a proof that both exist in a random selection of people!
ash
PS, I find it entertaingly co-incidental (aka, an alanis-morriset style ironicism) that i was asked to reproduce the word 'gunned' to verify my humanity.