You made a common mistake. You made the mistake of correlating popularity to quality.
Java has been hyped enough that people have been forced to use it by their bosses. This necessitated the creation of many different libraries for different purposes.
"I want our cellphones to use Java, I've heard Java is good." says the PHB.
Face it, if quality was the only deciding factor in programming language support then Lisp would already have dominated and wiped out other languages long ago. Java was hyped into star-dom. End of story.
Re:Lisp not accessible?
on
Beyond Java
·
· Score: 2, Informative
Without the Lisp syntax, macros aren't even possible. Or at least the implementation of macros becomes exponentially harder. Macros are really one of the fundamental Lisp features that make it so powerful.
Another funny thing that most people don't realize (I know I didn't) is that Lisp is HIGHLY object oriented, more so than Java (not sure about Smalltalk/Ruby though). Lisp can be used in nearly the same way as other object oriented languages. It's just not a requirement.
What's funny is that at face value one gets the impression that Lisp is trying to be everything to everybody, but in fact Lisp isn't everything. It just gives programmers the ablility to make it everything:) "A programmable programming language" it is.
Re:Lisp not accessible?
on
Beyond Java
·
· Score: 1
Oops, it should be like this:
"Of course, one can't forgot the quote from Eric Raymond's 'How To Become A Hacker': LISP is worth learning for a different reason -- the profound enlightenment experience you will have when you finally get it. That experience will make you a better programmer for the rest of your days, even if you never actually use LISP itself a lot.
I especially like these quotes from the blurbs section of the PCL website:"
Don't want people to confuse my words with Eric's.
Lisp not accessible?
on
Beyond Java
·
· Score: 4, Informative
Lisp isn't accessible? Is that because of the parens or some other reason? If it's the parens, then obviously people are too superficial to look past the syntax (which is minimalistic to say the least). I've coded (and continue to code) in PHP, which has C-like syntax. When I first saw Lisp it was a bit different, but that's all it was: different. In fact, because there is so little syntax to worry about it makes the language even MORE accessible than C-like languages.
I've been reading Practical Common Lisp, and I have to say I love Lisp so far. I'm down to the practical examples and continue to enjoy the experience of reading, learning and coding lisp. It's certainly an excellent book and it shows, since it is a finalist in the Jolt awards.
Paul Graham is a big advocate of Lisp. He made big bucks selling is 3 year-old company to Yahoo, a company that was built off of software coded in Lisp.
Of course, one can't forgot the quote from Eric Raymond's 'How To Become A Hacker': LISP is worth learning for a different reason -- the profound enlightenment experience you will have when you finally get it. That experience will make you a better programmer for the rest of your days, even if you never actually use LISP itself a lot.
I especially like these quotes from the blurbs section of the PCL website:
"This book shows the power of Lisp not only in the areas that it has traditionally been noted for--such as developing a complete unit test framework in only 26 lines of code--but also in new areas such as parsing binary MP3 files, building a web application for browsing a collection of songs, and streaming audio over the web. Many readers will be surprised that Lisp allows you to do all this with conciseness similar to scripting languages such as Python, efficiency similar to C++, and unparalleled flexibility in designing your own language extensions." --Peter Norvig, Director of Search Quality, Google Inc; author of Paradigms of Artificial Intelligence Programming: Case Studies in Common Lisp
"Please don't assume Common Lisp is only useful for Databases, Unit Test Frameworks, Spam Filters, ID3 Parsers, Web Programming, Shoutcast Servers, HTML Generation Interpreters, and HTML Generation Compilers just because these are the only things happened to be implemented in the book Practical Common Lisp.--Tobias C. Rittweiler, Lisp Programmer
Lisp was once in the same position C, C++ and now Java were/is in. It was one of those languages you had to know if you were going to get a job in programming. The only reason why it isn't still in that position is because it was ahead of its time. It was once thought to be slow, but Lisp compilers can compile to machine code and run as fast or even faster than C/C++. Lisp gives you the flexibility to code quickly to get features working and it also allows you to go back and optimize your code to perform at C levels.
So don't make the mistake of thinking Lisp is simply a worthless, academic language. Just check out Practical Common Lisp and see for yourself!
Though I might be modded down or flamed to hell, I'd recommend looking at http://www.gigamonkeys.com/book/ and check out Common Lisp. I'm just getting into it after playing around with PHP, and I am very excited to be learning a language so powerful but so simple to use and look at. The tools for coding in Lisp might not be the greatest (Emacs is the only editor that can be realistically used to code in it at this point), if you've got the patience that it takes to be a good programmer, you can do it. From what I've heard, Lisp can be used for simple scripting or hardcore programming. I believe it.
If people didn't hack and crack things we wouldn't need high security and we could have higher security. It's like saying, "If not for thieves and rapists we wouldn't get these great locks on our doors." Bull, if we didn't have thieves and rapists we wouldn't need locks in the first place, and it wouldn't stop the good guys from getting in when needed.
When one installs a new module in Apache, one needs to restart the server for the install to take effect. That is, when I install PHP or PostgreSQL, I need to restart Apache before I can use either of them. This is something many Apache users dislike.
So that leaves the web browser. Putting aside the difficulty of convincing tons of people to visit your site that will hack their computer, yes this is a problem even on Macs. However, any sort of damage is mitigated by the fact that root access cannot be obtained without a password. Which means that access and/or damage would be limited at best.
I remember the CEO of Linspire saying the exact opposite, that user data is most important. If my internet connect was hijacked by a virus or worm, I would clean it up and be done with it. If I got someone deleting my files for fun, I'd be peeved. User data is most important.
Slashdot Mirror
When do we get to see diamond cpus?
You made a common mistake. You made the mistake of correlating popularity to quality.
Java has been hyped enough that people have been forced to use it by their bosses. This necessitated the creation of many different libraries for different purposes.
"I want our cellphones to use Java, I've heard Java is good." says the PHB.
Face it, if quality was the only deciding factor in programming language support then Lisp would already have dominated and wiped out other languages long ago. Java was hyped into star-dom. End of story.
Without the Lisp syntax, macros aren't even possible. Or at least the implementation of macros becomes exponentially harder. Macros are really one of the fundamental Lisp features that make it so powerful.
:) "A programmable programming language" it is.
Another funny thing that most people don't realize (I know I didn't) is that Lisp is HIGHLY object oriented, more so than Java (not sure about Smalltalk/Ruby though). Lisp can be used in nearly the same way as other object oriented languages. It's just not a requirement.
What's funny is that at face value one gets the impression that Lisp is trying to be everything to everybody, but in fact Lisp isn't everything. It just gives programmers the ablility to make it everything
Oops, it should be like this:
"Of course, one can't forgot the quote from Eric Raymond's 'How To Become A Hacker': LISP is worth learning for a different reason -- the profound enlightenment experience you will have when you finally get it. That experience will make you a better programmer for the rest of your days, even if you never actually use LISP itself a lot.
I especially like these quotes from the blurbs section of the PCL website:"
Don't want people to confuse my words with Eric's.
Lisp isn't accessible? Is that because of the parens or some other reason? If it's the parens, then obviously people are too superficial to look past the syntax (which is minimalistic to say the least). I've coded (and continue to code) in PHP, which has C-like syntax. When I first saw Lisp it was a bit different, but that's all it was: different. In fact, because there is so little syntax to worry about it makes the language even MORE accessible than C-like languages.
I've been reading Practical Common Lisp, and I have to say I love Lisp so far. I'm down to the practical examples and continue to enjoy the experience of reading, learning and coding lisp. It's certainly an excellent book and it shows, since it is a finalist in the Jolt awards.
Paul Graham is a big advocate of Lisp. He made big bucks selling is 3 year-old company to Yahoo, a company that was built off of software coded in Lisp.
Of course, one can't forgot the quote from Eric Raymond's 'How To Become A Hacker': LISP is worth learning for a different reason -- the profound enlightenment experience you will have when you finally get it. That experience will make you a better programmer for the rest of your days, even if you never actually use LISP itself a lot. I especially like these quotes from the blurbs section of the PCL website:
"This book shows the power of Lisp not only in the areas that it has traditionally been noted for--such as developing a complete unit test framework in only 26 lines of code--but also in new areas such as parsing binary MP3 files, building a web application for browsing a collection of songs, and streaming audio over the web. Many readers will be surprised that Lisp allows you to do all this with conciseness similar to scripting languages such as Python, efficiency similar to C++, and unparalleled flexibility in designing your own language extensions." --Peter Norvig, Director of Search Quality, Google Inc; author of Paradigms of Artificial Intelligence Programming: Case Studies in Common Lisp
"Please don't assume Common Lisp is only useful for Databases, Unit Test Frameworks, Spam Filters, ID3 Parsers, Web Programming, Shoutcast Servers, HTML Generation Interpreters, and HTML Generation Compilers just because these are the only things happened to be implemented in the book Practical Common Lisp.--Tobias C. Rittweiler, Lisp Programmer
Lisp was once in the same position C, C++ and now Java were/is in. It was one of those languages you had to know if you were going to get a job in programming. The only reason why it isn't still in that position is because it was ahead of its time. It was once thought to be slow, but Lisp compilers can compile to machine code and run as fast or even faster than C/C++. Lisp gives you the flexibility to code quickly to get features working and it also allows you to go back and optimize your code to perform at C levels.
So don't make the mistake of thinking Lisp is simply a worthless, academic language. Just check out Practical Common Lisp and see for yourself!
AS a female...
But...this...is...slash...dot...
*pop* (head explodes)
I think someone else agrees.
That looks really good! I think I'll start with that to get a hang of the language before moving onto PCL. Thanks a lot!
Though I might be modded down or flamed to hell, I'd recommend looking at http://www.gigamonkeys.com/book/ and check out Common Lisp. I'm just getting into it after playing around with PHP, and I am very excited to be learning a language so powerful but so simple to use and look at. The tools for coding in Lisp might not be the greatest (Emacs is the only editor that can be realistically used to code in it at this point), if you've got the patience that it takes to be a good programmer, you can do it. From what I've heard, Lisp can be used for simple scripting or hardcore programming. I believe it.
We'll see on Feb 1st then. If it is true, it will ROCK. If not, oh well.
Java and .NET are still catching up to Lisp, so meh :P
Lisp is actually seeing an upsurge in use recently. With books like this Lisp may rise like the Pheonix! It's definitely got this newbie interested :)
Strong Typing vs. Strong Testing From the man himself.
I wasn't aware that this particular router had this ability. I just bought one of these last week, version 4. What is so special about this router?
Meant to say, "we wouldn't need high security and we could have higher useability."
If people didn't hack and crack things we wouldn't need high security and we could have higher security. It's like saying, "If not for thieves and rapists we wouldn't get these great locks on our doors." Bull, if we didn't have thieves and rapists we wouldn't need locks in the first place, and it wouldn't stop the good guys from getting in when needed.
Pictures here.
When one installs a new module in Apache, one needs to restart the server for the install to take effect. That is, when I install PHP or PostgreSQL, I need to restart Apache before I can use either of them. This is something many Apache users dislike.
So that leaves the web browser. Putting aside the difficulty of convincing tons of people to visit your site that will hack their computer, yes this is a problem even on Macs. However, any sort of damage is mitigated by the fact that root access cannot be obtained without a password. Which means that access and/or damage would be limited at best.
I remember the CEO of Linspire saying the exact opposite, that user data is most important. If my internet connect was hijacked by a virus or worm, I would clean it up and be done with it. If I got someone deleting my files for fun, I'd be peeved. User data is most important.
What do you think podcasting is for?
Gah, I linked to this before, not sure why it didn't work. http://en.wikinews.org/wiki/450_sheep_leap_to_thei r_deaths_in_Turkey
Please, don't mention sheep.
It's a bit insenstive don't you think?
Probably is best not to make any comparisons between sheep and people...
Microsoft stalling best practices? No...
Oh, that's easy: the mouse only has one button. And magic.
Wikipedia even has pictures. Not for the faint of heart :P