I bought a
relatively high end (at the time) gaming PC from ABS Computers (December
2004).
I spent $2600.00 on it.
I've glanced at the price of individual parts (at their parent company
which happens to be the geek shopping haven known as Newegg.com) and based on
my preliminary findings, yes I could indeed have gotten the
parts for less money than what I paid having them put in a PC they
built for me.
For example, I noticed my video
card (NVIDIA GeForce 6800 GT) was about $80.00 less at Newegg.
But here's the deal: Are you ready, willing and/or capable of building
your own PC?
I'm not. So, I'm willing to spend more to pay someone else to do it.
Heck, a year later, I ordered more RAM and extra hard drives from an
online retailer (not Newegg) and then took them and my PC to a local
shop for the installation.
I'm a software person, not a hardware person. I'll reformat your hard
drives and install two Linux distros, FreeBSD, Solaris, Windows XP and
and additional software for you, but don't ask me to pop the cover off
and do anything there. I'm all thumbs in that
department.
I am music to the ears of the online
PC retailers. There has to be a lot of people like me out there.
Linux users don't "have to use their trusty Apt-get function to get what they want" [installing Linux from scratch]
Most destroys offer a Graphical Installer which (based on my experience) is faster than installing Windows.
And it gives them an Office Suite, excellent Image Editor and umpteen other applications.
Windows doesn't come with all that. You have to acquire it separately (and much of it costs extra).
With a Linux distro you get all that upfront and if it's not enough THEN you apt-get install, yum install, etc..
By the time I've finished installing Windows and all the apps I want with it (Office, Image Editors, Utility Suites, Anti-Virus software, Disk Partitioner, Image Viewer, Compression software and so on...) 5 hours have elapsed.
I'm always amused at how Linux users love to tout how stable their OS is (especially compared to Windows).
When they compare it to Windows, it seems as if they are comparing to Windows 98 and not Windows XP.
I use both Linux and Windows and unlike a huge number of Linux users, I don't hate Windows and I don't hate Microsoft (although I do have issues with a lot of their business practices).
The fact is Windows just "works" out of the box (especially with Multimedia) as does Mac OSX.
But I digress.....
I honestly find Windows XP more stable than than any Linux distro I've used in recent years.
I'm not saying Linux is very unstable. But it's more unstable than many users want you to believe. Just like Windows XP is more stable than most Linux users will admit (or want you to believe).
Linux is great. I love it. I rarely use Windows at all, but it's still not as stable.
>Ubuntu and Fedora manage to be able to produce a stable
distribution (approximately) every 6 months.
To
release a distribution 18 months after the previous release is still a
long time, but compared to the time it took for Sarge to be released
it's extremely fast.
The problem with Debian
right now is.:
If you
install the current release you end up with a lot of outdated software
(at least as far as GNOME or KDE apps are concerned).
If
you install the testing release you wind up with (almost) the latest
software but if you want to upgrade package a, that relies on package c
and package c is not available because it's still stuck in unstable,
because the Commodore 64 version won't compile, then you're rather
stuck...
If you install Unstable (Sid) you do get
the latest and greatest however, you also get all the bugs.
Sometimes you can go for weeks without a hitch and then suddenly it
hits a buggy phase and you have problem after problem.
No,any
version of Debian isn't really suitable for newcomers.
I'm
sure Sarge is great as a server, but if you intend to run X then you're
gonna be stuck with apps from almost 2 years ago (unless of course you
use backports and that's a whole other story).
I
alternate between Debian Unstable and Ubuntu (depending on which is the
least annoying at a given time).
Well if you want to visit a website that utilizes Java, you need Java. If you want to install and run Java based applications (in my case Azureus and Jedit) you need Java.
I guess some people need Java and some don't.....
"So the 2.6.16 [kernel] effect is a mis-feature, even if a _normal_ app would never care. It just happened to bite the infection logic of your virus thing."
I agree. It seems like people who love to hate Microsoft have found yet something else to get their panties in a knot over.
I really think it's much ado about nothing.
Not to mention, I just checked "C:\WINDOWS\system32\drivers\etc\hosts" and I don't find anything out of the ordinary in it...
--- # Copyright (c) 1993-1999 Microsoft Corp. # # This is a sample HOSTS file used by Microsoft TCP/IP for Windows. # # This file contains the mappings of IP addresses to host names. Each # entry should be kept on an individual line. The IP address should # be placed in the first column followed by the corresponding host name. # The IP address and the host name should be separated by at least one # space. # # Additionally, comments (such as these) may be inserted on individual # lines or following the machine name denoted by a '#' symbol. # # For example: # # 102.54.94.97 rhino.acme.com # source server # 38.25.63.10 x.acme.com # x client host
127.0.0.1 localhost
---
Strange coincidence that I happen to be in Windows (XP Pro) when I came across this article. I'm usually in Linux (Debian Sid).
You make some good points, but just how long should Microsoft and PC makers hold on to "legacy hardware"?
Seriously? Forever? When do they stop? Who makes new hardware these days that connects to a serial port?
I spent $2500.00 on a brand new PC 15 months ago, with all the latest technology. AMD Athlon 64 3500+ CPU. ASUS A8V Motherboard and so on. I was downright shocked to find it had a parallel and serial port! I have absolutely no use for them. I've not needed either in years. That's why God invented USB.....
I thought they wasted good space there. Instead why not double the number of USB and Firewire ports.
Seriously. How long does "legacy hardware" have to be supported? 10 years? 20 years?
Define a "matter of time"? Let's assume Microsoft was still where it was a year ago, with no plans for future releases of IE, except for Vista.
I figure it would still be several years before there was any kind of real impact (like say a drop to 50% market share). Again, most people just don't care and/or don't want to be bothered with downloading and installing (and learning) an alternative.
But now that IE 7 is coming out (and it does have significant improvements) that market share drop is going to slow even more.
I wish this weren't the case, but I can't imagine it being any other way.
It shouldn't take 2-6 months. Fedora Core 5 and Ubuntu 6.04 (6.06?) will be out in the near future (FC5 on Monday, 20 March 2005) and both will have GNOME 2.14. Debian Sid should have it shortly. I can't speak for Mandriva, SUSE or anyone else though....
Only if your careless or ignorant. Search for a popular song on any P2P network and you'll find umpteen files with the same song on them. The difference often being different bitrates. For example, I just did a search on a popular song and find bitrates ranging from 96 to 192 Kb/s.
"People keep bringing this up, but I never understand it. In what
distro does
one actually experience dependency hell these days? Using RPM on FC
without using it through yum would be just as wise as using dpkg on
Ubuntu without using it through apt. I don't know about Mandriva or
Suse, but I'd be guessing that that's what urpmi and yast do. Portage
certainly handles it well on Gentoo."
Right before I wrote this I attempted to install GNUStep in Debian Sid.
# apt-get install gnustep
Reading package lists... Done
Building dependency tree... Done
Some packages could not be installed. This may mean that you have
requested an impossible situation or if you are using the unstable
distribution that some required packages have not yet been created
or been moved out of Incoming.
Since you only requested a single operation it is extremely likely that
the package is simply not installable and a bug report against
that package should be filed.
The following information may help to resolve the situation:
The following packages have unmet dependencies.
gnustep: Depends: gnumail.app but it is not going to be
installed
Depends: viewpdf.app but it is not going to be installed
E: Broken packages
That looks like dependency hell to me. No dpkg APT, as in
apt-get.
I've had this kind of thing happen on Debian, Ubuntu and on SUSE (And on Fedora a
few years back with YUM or APT).
I suspect the die-hard AOL users would in fact, keep AOL once switching to broadband. Why? Because they were never smart enough to have switched from AOL to a traditoinal dialup ISP.
AOL has just enough exclusive content to keep a lot of people coming back for more.
The last time I looked (about a year ago) they had dozens of forums that were filled with posts. Obviously those folks prefer those forums to having to search the Internets(TM) for similar forums elsewhere.
Heck AOL dumped Usenet and that didn't seem to cause a mass exodus.
AOL is the only remaining survivor of the "Online Services" and there are enough people out there who feel they need that sort of thing they they will stick with AOL, regardless.
You need to get out more. My first encounter with aMSN was actually with the Windows version (3 or 4 years ago). I've since used the Linux version as well (although that was some time ago).
I generally prefer Gaim or Kopete, but I may take another look at aMSN now.
Slashdot Mirror
I bought a relatively high end (at the time) gaming PC from ABS Computers (December 2004).
I spent $2600.00 on it. I've glanced at the price of individual parts (at their parent company which happens to be the geek shopping haven known as Newegg.com) and based on my preliminary findings, yes I could indeed have gotten the parts for less money than what I paid having them put in a PC they built for me.
For example, I noticed my video card (NVIDIA GeForce 6800 GT) was about $80.00 less at Newegg. But here's the deal: Are you ready, willing and/or capable of building your own PC? I'm not. So, I'm willing to spend more to pay someone else to do it. Heck, a year later, I ordered more RAM and extra hard drives from an online retailer (not Newegg) and then took them and my PC to a local shop for the installation. I'm a software person, not a hardware person. I'll reformat your hard drives and install two Linux distros, FreeBSD, Solaris, Windows XP and and additional software for you, but don't ask me to pop the cover off and do anything there.
I'm all thumbs in that department.
I am music to the ears of the online PC retailers. There has to be a lot of people like me out there.
Linux users don't "have to use their trusty Apt-get function to get what they want" [installing Linux from scratch]
Most destroys offer a Graphical Installer which (based on my experience) is faster than installing Windows.
And it gives them an Office Suite, excellent Image Editor and umpteen other applications.
Windows doesn't come with all that. You have to acquire it separately (and much of it costs extra).
With a Linux distro you get all that upfront and if it's not enough THEN you apt-get install, yum install, etc..
By the time I've finished installing Windows and all the apps I want with it (Office, Image Editors, Utility Suites, Anti-Virus software, Disk Partitioner, Image Viewer, Compression software and so on...) 5 hours have elapsed.
The equivalent in Linux? Two hours tops.
Rox annoys me. I don't know why but I just can't get used to it.
Franky the best GTK2 file manager is Gnome Commander (only recently GTK2).
But I still prefer Konqueror or Krusader to anything GTK.
I'm always amused at how Linux users love to tout how stable their OS is (especially compared to Windows).
When they compare it to Windows, it seems as if they are comparing to Windows 98 and not Windows XP.
I use both Linux and Windows and unlike a huge number of Linux users, I don't hate Windows and I don't hate Microsoft (although I do have issues with a lot of their business practices).
The fact is Windows just "works" out of the box (especially with Multimedia) as does Mac OSX.
But I digress.....
I honestly find Windows XP more stable than than any Linux distro I've used in recent years.
I'm not saying Linux is very unstable. But it's more unstable than many users want you to believe. Just like Windows XP is more stable than most Linux users will admit (or want you to believe).
Linux is great. I love it. I rarely use Windows at all, but it's still not as stable.
It's the geek in me that keeps me using Linux.
It's always amusing what slips by the editors, isn't it?
To release a distribution 18 months after the previous release is still a long time, but compared to the time it took for Sarge to be released it's extremely fast.
The problem with Debian right now is.:
No,any version of Debian isn't really suitable for newcomers.
I'm sure Sarge is great as a server, but if you intend to run X then you're gonna be stuck with apps from almost 2 years ago (unless of course you use backports and that's a whole other story).
I alternate between Debian Unstable and Ubuntu (depending on which is the least annoying at a given time).
Well if you want to visit a website that utilizes Java, you need Java.
If you want to install and run Java based applications (in my case Azureus and Jedit) you need Java.
I guess some people need Java and some don't.....
I bought a very nice computer from a company who is now offering water cooling on some of their models.
If I were buying now, I'd forgo that option. All I can think of is "water, electricity and electrical components don't mix".
Obviously they are designed not to leak, but I'm not that trusting.
"So the 2.6.16 [kernel] effect is a mis-feature, even if a _normal_ app would never care. It just happened to bite the infection logic of your virus thing."
I agree. It seems like people who love to hate Microsoft have found yet something else to get their panties in a knot over.
I really think it's much ado about nothing.
Not to mention, I just checked "C:\WINDOWS\system32\drivers\etc\hosts" and I don't find anything out of the ordinary in it...
---
# Copyright (c) 1993-1999 Microsoft Corp.
#
# This is a sample HOSTS file used by Microsoft TCP/IP for Windows.
#
# This file contains the mappings of IP addresses to host names. Each
# entry should be kept on an individual line. The IP address should
# be placed in the first column followed by the corresponding host name.
# The IP address and the host name should be separated by at least one
# space.
#
# Additionally, comments (such as these) may be inserted on individual
# lines or following the machine name denoted by a '#' symbol.
#
# For example:
#
# 102.54.94.97 rhino.acme.com # source server
# 38.25.63.10 x.acme.com # x client host
127.0.0.1 localhost
---
Strange coincidence that I happen to be in Windows (XP Pro) when I came across this article. I'm usually in Linux (Debian Sid).
I think you're somewhat comparing Apples and Oranges.
For one thing, Ubuntu has had both a LiveCD and a regular Install CD from the beginning (or at least since the "Hoary Hedgehog" release).
Knoppix only has a LiveCD release (although you can install from it, but I've personally found it's a mess to update afterwards).
Ubuntu's goal has been simplicity. Knoppix throws in everything but the kitchen sink and is targeted at power users.
Ubuntu is (supposedly) "Linux for Human Beings" (as their slogan states).
Both Ubuntu and Knoppix are excellent, but for different reasons.
for me to continue to despise Wal-Mart.
You make some good points, but just how long should Microsoft and PC makers hold on to "legacy hardware"?
Seriously? Forever? When do they stop? Who makes new hardware these days that connects to a serial port?
I spent $2500.00 on a brand new PC 15 months ago, with all the latest technology. AMD Athlon 64 3500+ CPU. ASUS A8V Motherboard and so on. I was downright shocked to find it had a parallel and serial port! I have absolutely no use for them. I've not needed either in years. That's why God invented USB.....
I thought they wasted good space there. Instead why not double the number of USB and Firewire ports.
Seriously. How long does "legacy hardware" have to be supported? 10 years? 20 years?
Define a "matter of time"? Let's assume Microsoft was still where it was a year ago, with no plans for future releases of IE, except for Vista.
I figure it would still be several years before there was any kind of real impact (like say a drop to 50% market share). Again, most people just don't care and/or don't want to be bothered with downloading and installing (and learning) an alternative.
But now that IE 7 is coming out (and it does have significant improvements) that market share drop is going to slow even more.
I wish this weren't the case, but I can't imagine it being any other way.
It shouldn't take 2-6 months. Fedora Core 5 and Ubuntu 6.04 (6.06?) will be out in the near future (FC5 on Monday, 20 March 2005) and both will have GNOME 2.14. Debian Sid should have it shortly. I can't speak for Mandriva, SUSE or anyone else though....
Only if your careless or ignorant. Search for a popular song on any P2P network and you'll find umpteen files with the same song on them. The difference often being different bitrates. For example, I just did a search on a popular song and find bitrates ranging from 96 to 192 Kb/s.
I'd never accept anything under 160.
How can a browser with an overwhelming majority of market share be dead?
Inferior? Yes
Crap? Yes.
Dead? Not even close.
As long as the majority of computer users are clueless and/or don't care, that won't change.
Right before I wrote this I attempted to install GNUStep in Debian Sid.
That looks like dependency hell to me. No dpkg APT, as in apt-get.
I've had this kind of thing happen on Debian, Ubuntu and on SUSE (And on Fedora a few years back with YUM or APT).
I suspect the die-hard AOL users would in fact, keep AOL once switching to broadband. Why? Because they were never smart enough to have switched from AOL to a traditoinal dialup ISP.
AOL has just enough exclusive content to keep a lot of people coming back for more.
The last time I looked (about a year ago) they had dozens of forums that were filled with posts. Obviously those folks prefer those forums to having to search the Internets(TM) for similar forums elsewhere.
Heck AOL dumped Usenet and that didn't seem to cause a mass exodus.
AOL is the only remaining survivor of the "Online Services" and there are enough people out there who feel they need that sort of thing they they will stick with AOL, regardless.
I've come acroee quite a few people online via various Linux-related mailng lists, who who only have Dialup. They're indeed still out there.
I myself had to "downgrade' for several months when I had no income.
That process is more complicated than you indicate. It's not worth the effort to bother with more more than once.
And I've heard that after having done it 3 times they don't offer you any more free time.
I can't imagine why AIM would keep people tied to AOL. I've been using AIM for years and I don't have AOL....
Cool. So then, someone gave you tickets to this lame concert?
What else is new? AIM has been doing this for years.
You need to get out more. My first encounter with aMSN was actually with the Windows version (3 or 4 years ago). I've since used the Linux version as well (although that was some time ago).
I generally prefer Gaim or Kopete, but I may take another look at aMSN now.