If you are on a slope then you just can't move along y axis, unless you jump up and down, but if you jump you are not on the slope anymore. A "vertical slope" is undefined.
Oops. I honestly don't have an answer, because whether it's "required" (by law) or not depends on the trademark holders. They might allow it in certain cases.
In my opinion though, unless the repackaged program had some quality guarantee (in the form of contract/etc like others suggested) from the trademark holders, I wouldn't want to use it under the exact same brand. Either they change the name completely (obviously undesirable), give it a generic name (e.g. Web Browser, average users don't know the difference), or tag it with the distribution name (e.g. Ubuntu-Firefox, still searchable).
I know it's tough to keep both sides happy, so feel free to pick yours.
There are always tradeoffs. And depends on your definition of user, things can be different. Say I'm a Linux newbie and my only familiar "program" is Fedora; this Pink Box Linux happens to feature Fedora. I try it out and it destroys all my valuable files, do you think I'll touch Fedora again? Now this is a lose/lose situation to both the Red Hat and me the user.
How exactly is the borked version a demonstration of USER js? Can USERS load scripts into webpages? Why did they release the binary but not the js file if it's really USER js? If this is comparable to greasemonkey, I can say XUL is user js too!
And may be I'm ignorant, which "several IE shells" had adblocking "long before AdBlock"? Links?
Think of it the other way, say you are Red Hat, trademarked Fedora and OhSoEvil, and I redistribute your code as Pink Box, but I made some mistakes and/or intentionally screw up, add keyloggers and phone home. Do you like me distributing them as Fedora and OhSoEvil, with About Box saying "this is Fedora and OhSoEvil"? Don't you want to prevent this from happening?
Yes the people are free to pick a different brand name, and it's the obvious choice since BitTorrent is trademarked. But it doesn't change the fact that it's also necessary for the original author/organization to protect their branding/reputation. And what sort of mess would really really be created? Would Mozilla actually go out and sue everyone? I don't think so. It's only a mean to protect themselves from misuse. It's like holding a patient doesn't necessary mean a company will primarily use it for lawsuits, but rather protect itself from other lawsuits.
Come on why are you trying to mix things up? Being free as in speech software doesn't grant you the right to grab the name and use it as yours. It's the SOURCE that's free, not the BRANDING, and that's what GP was pointing out.
Is it really that hard to understand the consequence if (IF) Gator/Claria brand their adware-rich browser Firefox? And do you really think Mozilla has all the resources to verify all the individual "Firefox" browsers out there are not malicious?
Yes, definitely most. And did you see the new features in 1.5. It's like the Firefox devs went to Opera's site, read through their features, and copied them right over!
Yeah and you can say the same thing the other way around, because anyone can check out Firefox and bugzilla to see what they are working on in advance!
There is a web dev toolbar for Opera, but what do users care? Opera had RSS before Firefox. A debugger is not "innovative". It doesn't help the web experience either. And it is not a Firefox first either, sorry.
Oh yeah since average users don't care, why mention them right? Why mention Opera is 1-2 MB smaller download than Firefox, when average users have DSL and Gigs of space? And why mention web standards, since average users don't care?
And does Opera have *live* RSS feeds before? Oh yeah they are similar, and I can say that IE has tabbed interface from Windows taskbar too! Opera doesn't have tabbed browsing first either, sorry. (It's NetCaptor)
GreaseMonkey is a ripoff of Opera's User JS. AdBlock has been done to death in other browsers too. ColorZilla? A color picker? Hehe, well... No, that's not innovative either. I had a panel for that in Opera ages ago:)
Opera User js borrowed from GreaseMonkey, not the other way around! Adblock is the first usable way to block ads from within the browser, without relying on proxy where you have no easy way to find out if things get accidentally blocked. Done to death? Oh yea since Firefox has it, and other browsers copied it, you can simply ignore it; while at the same time, the Opera fans can reiterate how Firefox borrows Tabs from Opera, even though Tabs has been done to death as well.
If the average users don;t even know where to change the homepage, how would you expect them to find out all the functionality of of Firefox even it's provided by default?
I don't think having to download the.net runtime/include in installer is considered "small" and "easy" to install. And IIRC, win2000 and up come with vb6 runtime
I believe what he is saying is, even with sudo, you don't need to type password everytime; a sudoed session will last like a minute. While this may be convenient, in comparison, Vista (from what he described) will prompt for password for every application.
you forgot that flashgot is the most downloaded extension on mozilla update site, meaning many many people don't want firefox to handle ftp and possible other protocols other than http/s
unless firefox 2/up has better ftp resume/multi-threaded/separate proxy/etc, otherwise it's just not on par with standalone ftp clients
last time I checked (10 seconds ago) evolution can't access calendar and global address list, and can't autocomplete email address even from "personal contact"
haven't used outlook/express before, I can't say which one is buggier in the latest versions; I just know that evolution fails quite often (like "sent items"/"draft" defaults would magically be empty; filters can't change status to read/junk; sometimes stop responding from hibernation; etc) and I still have to live with it...
You can use Explorer to open ftp sites and do drag and drop. Not sure about open/save dialogs though, and certain won't work with ssh and a lot other protocols.
Slashdot Mirror
Even my 845 will run Warcraft 3. I just miss those that require T&L
If you are on a slope then you just can't move along y axis, unless you jump up and down, but if you jump you are not on the slope anymore. A "vertical slope" is undefined.
I'm kind of proud of that; if Microsoft fails, you have a rescue system with Linux and Opera.
Oops. I honestly don't have an answer, because whether it's "required" (by law) or not depends on the trademark holders. They might allow it in certain cases.
In my opinion though, unless the repackaged program had some quality guarantee (in the form of contract/etc like others suggested) from the trademark holders, I wouldn't want to use it under the exact same brand. Either they change the name completely (obviously undesirable), give it a generic name (e.g. Web Browser, average users don't know the difference), or tag it with the distribution name (e.g. Ubuntu-Firefox, still searchable).
I know it's tough to keep both sides happy, so feel free to pick yours.
There are always tradeoffs.
And depends on your definition of user, things can be different. Say I'm a Linux newbie and my only familiar "program" is Fedora; this Pink Box Linux happens to feature Fedora. I try it out and it destroys all my valuable files, do you think I'll touch Fedora again? Now this is a lose/lose situation to both the Red Hat and me the user.
How exactly is the borked version a demonstration of USER js? Can USERS load scripts into webpages? Why did they release the binary but not the js file if it's really USER js? If this is comparable to greasemonkey, I can say XUL is user js too!
And may be I'm ignorant, which "several IE shells" had adblocking "long before AdBlock"? Links?
Think of it the other way, say you are Red Hat, trademarked Fedora and OhSoEvil, and I redistribute your code as Pink Box, but I made some mistakes and/or intentionally screw up, add keyloggers and phone home. Do you like me distributing them as Fedora and OhSoEvil, with About Box saying "this is Fedora and OhSoEvil"? Don't you want to prevent this from happening?
2. You could setup your mail client to download all the messages and delete them on server
Yes the people are free to pick a different brand name, and it's the obvious choice since BitTorrent is trademarked.
But it doesn't change the fact that it's also necessary for the original author/organization to protect their branding/reputation.
And what sort of mess would really really be created? Would Mozilla actually go out and sue everyone? I don't think so. It's only a mean to protect themselves from misuse. It's like holding a patient doesn't necessary mean a company will primarily use it for lawsuits, but rather protect itself from other lawsuits.
Come on why are you trying to mix things up? Being free as in speech software doesn't grant you the right to grab the name and use it as yours. It's the SOURCE that's free, not the BRANDING, and that's what GP was pointing out.
Is it really that hard to understand the consequence if (IF) Gator/Claria brand their adware-rich browser Firefox? And do you really think Mozilla has all the resources to verify all the individual "Firefox" browsers out there are not malicious?
Yes, definitely most. And did you see the new features in 1.5. It's like the Firefox devs went to Opera's site, read through their features, and copied them right over!
:)
Yeah and you can say the same thing the other way around, because anyone can check out Firefox and bugzilla to see what they are working on in advance!
There is a web dev toolbar for Opera, but what do users care? Opera had RSS before Firefox. A debugger is not "innovative". It doesn't help the web experience either. And it is not a Firefox first either, sorry.
Oh yeah since average users don't care, why mention them right? Why mention Opera is 1-2 MB smaller download than Firefox, when average users have DSL and Gigs of space? And why mention web standards, since average users don't care?
And does Opera have *live* RSS feeds before? Oh yeah they are similar, and I can say that IE has tabbed interface from Windows taskbar too! Opera doesn't have tabbed browsing first either, sorry. (It's NetCaptor)
GreaseMonkey is a ripoff of Opera's User JS. AdBlock has been done to death in other browsers too. ColorZilla? A color picker? Hehe, well... No, that's not innovative either. I had a panel for that in Opera ages ago
Opera User js borrowed from GreaseMonkey, not the other way around! Adblock is the first usable way to block ads from within the browser, without relying on proxy where you have no easy way to find out if things get accidentally blocked. Done to death? Oh yea since Firefox has it, and other browsers copied it, you can simply ignore it; while at the same time, the Opera fans can reiterate how Firefox borrows Tabs from Opera, even though Tabs has been done to death as well.
If the average users don;t even know where to change the homepage, how would you expect them to find out all the functionality of of Firefox even it's provided by default?
I don't think having to download the .net runtime/include in installer is considered "small" and "easy" to install.
And IIRC, win2000 and up come with vb6 runtime
Did you not realize that the so-called google os screenshots you have seen are nothing more than an ugly xp theme?
And I thought they are talking about security "by default"?
I believe what he is saying is, even with sudo, you don't need to type password everytime; a sudoed session will last like a minute. While this may be convenient, in comparison, Vista (from what he described) will prompt for password for every application.
I prefer these names instead...
you forgot that flashgot is the most downloaded extension on mozilla update site, meaning many many people don't want firefox to handle ftp and possible other protocols other than http/s
unless firefox 2/up has better ftp resume/multi-threaded/separate proxy/etc, otherwise it's just not on par with standalone ftp clients
Embedded signature? How do they match that to a... receipt?
Sealed? How about reuse?
I don't think many /.ers would understand your situation
no I don't; but I do have 2-3 windows saved up...
PCWorld Dups Firefox Best Product of 2005?
last time I checked (10 seconds ago) evolution can't access calendar and global address list, and can't autocomplete email address even from "personal contact"
haven't used outlook/express before, I can't say which one is buggier in the latest versions; I just know that evolution fails quite often (like "sent items"/"draft" defaults would magically be empty; filters can't change status to read/junk; sometimes stop responding from hibernation; etc) and I still have to live with it...
( Read More... | of 2 comments | science.slashdot.org )
You can use Explorer to open ftp sites and do drag and drop. Not sure about open/save dialogs though, and certain won't work with ssh and a lot other protocols.