Before I mention anything, I want to make one thing clear, I'm using the Canadian terminology for college.
The easiest, and potientially incorrect, thing for me to do is assume you are using the American definition, hence, I am having trouble detecting if you make a distinction between a full-blown University, or some technical school. Meaning that what I am about to say may not address your statements. If my assumption that you are refering to a University degree is incorrect, then I apologize for raising an issue with what you have said.
It is not, nor should it ever be, a professor's job to prepare people for the workplace. It is their job to prepare people like themselves going into academia professionally.
Especially in CS, where the academics are the last bastion of professionals that believe that computing is an end in itself, and not some mere tool that is just an ends to a mean.
Your statement of "Let's face facts" is correct, you understand the outcome of such an education but not the motivation behind it.
I know this doesn't answer the original poster's question, but I think that if people aren't really interested in a subject, and only a pay check, then they shouldn't be studying it, followed by spending 40-45 years working in it.
The colour coding implies that colour x means safe. What happens when the ability to display colour x is compromised?
I can imagine the average user now: "Well, the site is green after all, so it must be safe."
Having computers make judgements is a serious problem in general, but especially in security situations. I know the best method of showing the user everything that is known and letting them make a decision for themselves doesn't work very well in the field. But I think this is the kind of feature that has the potential to be a disaster in waiting.
As someone who went to a school that was being converted from catholic to secular, I will say that some will resent what they were taught when they are older.
Others, will just accept it, and think nothing is out of the ordinary. When they have kids, they will expect the same things to be taught to them, "the same way its always been."
So, don't worry, the scientific minds you care about will learn the truth eventually.
That being said, it would be better if we didn't have to de-poision them in the first place. I know if I had a kid who came home talking about ID as science, I would regale them of Flying Spaghetti Monster stories, then point them back in the direction of the classroom to tell everyone else. Then again, I would probably make a terrible parent.
Maybe flying spaghetti monster will be the key in curing children with ID. Hence, they need it in children's book form.
"Because gamers censoring CSI is in no way different from lawyers censoring GTA."
Thats actually a really good point.
But we all know not to take television seriously, I mean, a writer would claim that you could hack 1024-bit encrypted RSA in 10 seconds to make sure the plot kept going.
The news makes it sound like "hackers" are at fault for all the ills of the computing world, when really most are just script kiddies exploiting cheap flaws in badly written software.
I've also heard that medical doctors and lawyers can't watch shows about their professions, and if watching the media's opinion of IT is any indication, I'd be inclined to believe it.
When we need to remind people to RTFA, what makes you think they can read between the lines?
(FTA: "This essay is a joke! I apologise if anyone took this literally. Canadians think it gauche to label jokes with a:-). People paid no attention when I harped about how to write __maintainable code. I found people were more receptive hearing all the goofy things people often do to muck it up. Checking for unmaintainable design patterns is a rapid way to defend against malicious or inadvertent sloppiness.")
(RBTL: Chaotic Spyder (896445), website: http://www.olivers.ca/, therefore is assumably Canadian (.ca) When someone says "OOps, I see you're Canadian. Well, nobody's perfect:-)" "I see" usually implies they have some insight.)
FTA: "Use acronyms to keep the code terse. Real men never define acronyms; they understand them genetically." - To explain my use of RBTL
I think they are trying to mold them after typical award shows too much...
I mean, best actor makes sense in movies. An actor's performance is cruical to the success of the movie. You know, having the right facial expressions, having body language befitting the situation and having speaking their dialogue correctly.
In a video game 2/3 of those are done by developers.
Now, directors/designers I can give a little more credit to. But a sucessful game is a challenging or fun one. Not one with tons of voice overs.
Then again, what can they really do, have a best developer award show? "And the coder with the fewest bugs is..."
Even if it is a few years down the road, if damage is done to a computer then sony might still be in trouble.
How well does a public recall mitigate resposibility for second-hand owners who bought the product after a recall work? Assuming that a case has been attempted in the past.
You know, for a second the optimist in me hoped that because of all this sony might be forced to go the other way and denounce all attempts to restrict content through a customer's hardware.
Then the pragmatist in me woke up, realized that the average customer has a 20 minute memory and even if they heard about the hubris of sony, they wouldn't understand/care. Nothing will change except that people on places like/. will avoid sony and inform their friends/relatives not to buy it.
But I am pleased about the general response on/. that sony has been added to the list of evil. Does anyone here care to promise that during the hype caused by the release of the PS3 that they will be reminding everyone of this event?
As a side note, does anyone know where I can get a list of products that have sony equipment in them?
Record labels reverse engineering / hacking the protection methods of the iPod.
You know, if they find a way around the iPod's protection, what would make them think that any of it works in the first place? I think they are drinking DRM kool-aid as well as smoking something.
It isn't about comfort. It is about looking professional!
And, according to the profession I'm in, jeans and t-shirts are appropriate. It is called "culture", we have one, and, like all cultures it should be respected. (I am joking about this)
If you really want to be in a culture that not only encourages but rewards being (as many in western society would call it) well dressed that is fine, have fun at your glorified dog show that you call a career.
If I was required to dress differently for the sake of being professional by stereotypical standards, I'm coming in with a lab coat, reflecting the "scientist" part of my title.
"Create a product. If it's copied easily, find a way to make yours better."
That's how I feel about the issue as far as software is concerned.
But, what if your creation can be reverse engineered somewhat easily, and adding new properties is difficult?
Don't get me wrong, I don't like the idea of not being able to do something because someone did it first (especially when it happened decades before I was born and therefore I didn't have a chance to make it). But I still think some, limited, form of protection is needed.
Maybe an easier solution would be to channel people into the type of education that suits them.
If academics don't suit a person, teach them a trade. Wouldn't this make students and teachers happier? (other than the teachers who would lose their jobs in a few years because fewer students are learning academics)
Well, I think the problem is a combination of the two points you made.
The highest trained are undercut by those with a lesser education.
This is probably because of what you said. Higher education isn't valued and treated the same as a lesser education, because the lesser education is easier, more people qualify to do it.
So it isn't that we need less bachelors per se. It is that we either need to respect university education more, or have less people with a lower education.
I never thought of that... I suppose I remembered my high school days of problem sets and tests. And assumed the work would be the same quantity, just different quality.
I think teachers should be paid more in general, not just the top ones.
Slashdot Mirror
The easiest, and potientially incorrect, thing for me to do is assume you are using the American definition, hence, I am having trouble detecting if you make a distinction between a full-blown University, or some technical school. Meaning that what I am about to say may not address your statements. If my assumption that you are refering to a University degree is incorrect, then I apologize for raising an issue with what you have said.
It is not, nor should it ever be, a professor's job to prepare people for the workplace. It is their job to prepare people like themselves going into academia professionally.
Especially in CS, where the academics are the last bastion of professionals that believe that computing is an end in itself, and not some mere tool that is just an ends to a mean.
Your statement of "Let's face facts" is correct, you understand the outcome of such an education but not the motivation behind it.
I know this doesn't answer the original poster's question, but I think that if people aren't really interested in a subject, and only a pay check, then they shouldn't be studying it, followed by spending 40-45 years working in it.
"Barenaked on a Stick" describes what it'd be after I formatted it.
I think you're on to something bigger there.
The colour coding implies that colour x means safe. What happens when the ability to display colour x is compromised?
I can imagine the average user now:
"Well, the site is green after all, so it must be safe."
Having computers make judgements is a serious problem in general, but especially in security situations. I know the best method of showing the user everything that is known and letting them make a decision for themselves doesn't work very well in the field. But I think this is the kind of feature that has the potential to be a disaster in waiting.
As someone who went to a school that was being converted from catholic to secular, I will say that some will resent what they were taught when they are older.
Others, will just accept it, and think nothing is out of the ordinary. When they have kids, they will expect the same things to be taught to them, "the same way its always been."
So, don't worry, the scientific minds you care about will learn the truth eventually.
That being said, it would be better if we didn't have to de-poision them in the first place. I know if I had a kid who came home talking about ID as science, I would regale them of Flying Spaghetti Monster stories, then point them back in the direction of the classroom to tell everyone else. Then again, I would probably make a terrible parent.
Maybe flying spaghetti monster will be the key in curing children with ID. Hence, they need it in children's book form.
shh, they could be reading this, and that is exactly the kind of sentiment that can get you 90 days in jail.
"Because gamers censoring CSI is in no way different from lawyers censoring GTA."
Thats actually a really good point.
But we all know not to take television seriously, I mean, a writer would claim that you could hack 1024-bit encrypted RSA in 10 seconds to make sure the plot kept going.
The news makes it sound like "hackers" are at fault for all the ills of the computing world, when really most are just script kiddies exploiting cheap flaws in badly written software.
I've also heard that medical doctors and lawyers can't watch shows about their professions, and if watching the media's opinion of IT is any indication, I'd be inclined to believe it.
In soviet future... system calls calls system.
That didn't go very well...
When we need to remind people to RTFA, what makes you think they can read between the lines?
:-). People paid no attention when I harped about how to write __maintainable code. I found people were more receptive hearing all the goofy things people often do to muck it up. Checking for unmaintainable design patterns is a rapid way to defend against malicious or inadvertent sloppiness.")
:-)" "I see" usually implies they have some insight.)
(FTA: "This essay is a joke! I apologise if anyone took this literally. Canadians think it gauche to label jokes with a
(RBTL: Chaotic Spyder (896445), website: http://www.olivers.ca/, therefore is assumably Canadian (.ca)
When someone says "OOps, I see you're Canadian. Well, nobody's perfect
FTA: "Use acronyms to keep the code terse. Real men never define acronyms; they understand them genetically." - To explain my use of RBTL
Read this biased page for some commentary.
I think they are trying to mold them after typical award shows too much...
I mean, best actor makes sense in movies. An actor's performance is cruical to the success of the movie. You know, having the right facial expressions, having body language befitting the situation and having speaking their dialogue correctly.
In a video game 2/3 of those are done by developers.
Now, directors/designers I can give a little more credit to. But a sucessful game is a challenging or fun one. Not one with tons of voice overs.
Then again, what can they really do, have a best developer award show? "And the coder with the fewest bugs is..."
"I suspect that shutting off internet access during class is the best practical solution."
/. and checking email they'll be playing single player games (with flashy graphics)
Naw, then instead of reading mostly plain pages like
If I had to lecture, I would ban laptops outright. Just stare at them until their neighbours, who take the class seriously, would poke them.
New stuff? Amen to that...
I for one welcome our new light-blue site of doom overlords.
Furthermore, they want to stay out of trouble.
Even if it is a few years down the road, if damage is done to a computer then sony might still be in trouble.
How well does a public recall mitigate resposibility for second-hand owners who bought the product after a recall work? Assuming that a case has been attempted in the past.
You know, for a second the optimist in me hoped that because of all this sony might be forced to go the other way and denounce all attempts to restrict content through a customer's hardware.
/. will avoid sony and inform their friends/relatives not to buy it.
/. that sony has been added to the list of evil. Does anyone here care to promise that during the hype caused by the release of the PS3 that they will be reminding everyone of this event?
Then the pragmatist in me woke up, realized that the average customer has a 20 minute memory and even if they heard about the hubris of sony, they wouldn't understand/care. Nothing will change except that people on places like
But I am pleased about the general response on
As a side note, does anyone know where I can get a list of products that have sony equipment in them?
Record labels reverse engineering / hacking the protection methods of the iPod.
You know, if they find a way around the iPod's protection, what would make them think that any of it works in the first place? I think they are drinking DRM kool-aid as well as smoking something.
I just used assembly on an ARM processor at work, does that count?
"Take me out to lunch when the mail server crashes and I get everything back up and running in record time, yet again."
Why would a manager take you out to lunch when it is your fault the mail server crashed in the first place?
Joking aside, could you give a link for that attrition stat? It is relevant to something I'm writing at the moment.
It isn't about comfort. It is about looking professional!
And, according to the profession I'm in, jeans and t-shirts are appropriate. It is called "culture", we have one, and, like all cultures it should be respected. (I am joking about this)
If you really want to be in a culture that not only encourages but rewards being (as many in western society would call it) well dressed that is fine, have fun at your glorified dog show that you call a career.
If I was required to dress differently for the sake of being professional by stereotypical standards, I'm coming in with a lab coat, reflecting the "scientist" part of my title.
"Create a product. If it's copied easily, find a way to make yours better."
That's how I feel about the issue as far as software is concerned.
But, what if your creation can be reverse engineered somewhat easily, and adding new properties is difficult?
Don't get me wrong, I don't like the idea of not being able to do something because someone did it first (especially when it happened decades before I was born and therefore I didn't have a chance to make it). But I still think some, limited, form of protection is needed.
Copyright threats against linux are still alive and strong, right?
We wouldn't want the OSDL to spread such FUD among SCO investors!
Actually, I meant "we" as referring to western society.
I probably should have used a more specific term...
I'd agree with you if we lived in a technocracy. But the best people don't always get the best jobs.
Of course, I don't know how teachers get promoted.
Maybe an easier solution would be to channel people into the type of education that suits them.
If academics don't suit a person, teach them a trade. Wouldn't this make students and teachers happier? (other than the teachers who would lose their jobs in a few years because fewer students are learning academics)
Well, I think the problem is a combination of the two points you made.
The highest trained are undercut by those with a lesser education.
This is probably because of what you said. Higher education isn't valued and treated the same as a lesser education, because the lesser education is easier, more people qualify to do it.
So it isn't that we need less bachelors per se. It is that we either need to respect university education more, or have less people with a lower education.
I never thought of that... I suppose I remembered my high school days of problem sets and tests. And assumed the work would be the same quantity, just different quality.
I think teachers should be paid more in general, not just the top ones.