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Is Wi-Fi Ruining College?
theodp writes "Over at Slate, Avi Zenilman has seen the real classroom of the future firsthand: Students use class time to read the Drudge Report, send e-mail, play Legend of Zelda, or update profiles on Facebook.com. But not to worry - replace laptops with crumpled notes, and the classroom of the future looks a lot like the classroom of the past." From the article: "... when Cornell University researchers outfitted classrooms with wireless Internet and monitored students' browsing habits, they concluded, 'Longer browsing sessions during class tend to lead to lower grades, but there's a hint that a greater number of browsing sessions during class may actually lead to higher grades.' It seems a bit of a stretch to impute a causal relationship, but it's certainly possible that the kind of brain that can handle multiple channels of information is also the kind of brain that earns A's."
Maybe it would be possible to allow access to a local intranet only through the wifi? It wouldnt eliminate any Legend of Zelda, but it might keep the surfing to minimum.
"You won't eat our meat, but you'll glue with our feet.." --Some cow
"Browsing Slashdot" is omitted.
Partly educational perhaps?
If you don't want to repeat the past, stop living in it.
so long browsing sessions drop grades (because the students are ignoring the professor)
and short but frequent sessions increase grades (because students are looking up wtf the teacher is talking about)
Seems pretty strightforward.
FTFA: "There are about 100 students in the Columbia University lecture I'm currently attending, and about 10 have laptops. (The lecture consists mostly of grad students in their late 20s, so the ratio is a bit low.) I can see four screens from here; only one person is actually taking notes. Another is looking at the registrar's Web site. The other two keep checking their e-mail."
So the real question is, would these same students pre-occupy themselves with something else if they didn't have their laptops open to browse? Its reasonable to conclude that they have a limited attention span as it is, so whether they're sending email, talking on an IM client, or checking out the hot blond two rows down, they weren't going to being paying attention in their English 101 lecture anyways.
The internet is a tool just like a notepad. I can sit and doodle all day in my notepad instead of taking notes if I wish to. Does that mean notepads are suddenly bad for studying?
The problem is peope abuse the tool to do other things, so they lose focus which ends up making them worse off in the long run.
Wifi is not the problem here, giving it to people who want to dick around is.
I like muppets.
Once the "point of information intake benefit" is reached, the continuance of information intake is detrimental to success because there's no time left for action. Since you're reading Slashdot, you like to take in information, but if you're just a lurker, you're not taking any action [at least not here] with the information you take in. The world pays, based on results that it sees, and a full brain looks the same as an empty one to the average employer or professor.
Saskboy's blog is good. 9 out of 10 dentists agree.
professor "You see, you must first find the limiting reagent, then..."
Me BOOM HEADSHOT "PWNAGE!!!!!"
professor "What in god's name was that?"
*raise my hand from the back of a crowded study hall* "Me pwning"
public class null extends java applet { System.out.print ("Tabula Rasa"); }
If everyone has a computer(in some labs, and in the future), a monitored chat room can help learning a ton. For example: The teacher says something obscure, and the students want to know what it is, they can chat among their peers instead of disturbing the lecture. If no one knows in the class, they can interrupt the teacher. All talking would be logged so the teacher can see who's abusing the system after class.
God spoke to me.
...where they use work time to read the Drudge Report, send e-mail, play Legend of Zelda, or update profiles on Facebook.com.
Wi-Fi wont ruin colleges, just the students in them. If a student chooses to surf in class, that is the students problem, not the schools. It will still take the same intelligence and smarts to get decent grades. Some students will be able to surf in class. Many others wont. I was able to skip hundreds of hours of lecture time and still got out with a degree.
quis custodiet ipsos custodes
I'm a student at Harvard Business School, where they have a fairly interesting solution for handling this problem. While every campus building has wireless access, all the access points in the classroom buildings require a web based log-in that checks your student ID versus your class schedule. If you're scheduled to be in class at that moment, you are denied wireless access to the internet (in any classroom building).
Draconian, perhaps, but very effective at keeping us focused in class.
I spent much of my high school calc class playing zTetris on my TI-86-- and so did half the class. :)
I had to stop bringing my laptop to class when I was finding that I spent more time on Slashdot and Facebook than I did paying attention. It did me OK in some easier classes last year (it kept me awake), but now my sophomore year, I can't handle the distractions. I find I pay attention better doodling than surfing the internet, because doodling is even more mindless than the internet (yes, it's possible).
-Tim
The casual relationship between multitasking and higher grades is no big news. People with ADD get bad grades... duh. Seriously, this is only one incidental aspect of a well known relationship. The real news will be when browsing/surfing is supporting or augmenting students in ways that were not predictable.
The really good part of information tools is that they allow us to multitask on our own time, not the time schedule of others. The article hardly lends any time to whether or not the students who are surfing in class know the material well already or not. The wide variety of subject matter knowledge held by the students determines their own personal need to listen intently or not. If they don't require it, multitasking is a good use of time, and students who can multitask well will make good grades whether there is Internet access or not, likewise, students who cannot multitask will not make as good of grades.
Multitasking in a school environment means that you don't have to shut off the parts of your thinking that are not fully focused on the matter at hand.... you may be in a poli-sci class, but your thinking is on a project that you are working on for another.
There are three kinds of lies... lies, damned lies, and statistics!
Support NYCountryLawyer RIAA vs People
In my one class where nearly everyone uses a laptop (that's IMGD 1000, part of the Interactive Media and Game Dev major) I've noticed that several of the students are browsing, even playing games during the lectures. Whenever I brought in my own laptop, I got sucked in myself; it was sometimes helpful to be able to bring up online articles relevant to class material, but I usually got completely sidetracked and lost the thread of discussion. I made a conscious effort to ditch the computer, and it's greatly improved my focus in-class, though I still get occasionally distracted by the fellow playing Lunar at the end of the row.
--- Bwah?
This just seems like another one of those IQ tests that college is all about. I watched people fail out because of games and such. When staying up all night playing Civ is a stronger motivation than studying then that's how it is. Same with the internet. If you're one of those people then maybe taking a couple years off to work might be what you need before you can take college seriously. You can save yourself a lot of money and heartache if you recognize that quickly.
for the best price on prewritten papers. Now if we can only break the monopoly the acredited colleges have, we could just get an online degree that's worth something without having to go to college at all. Hey! Maybe we can outsource going to college. Oh wait! We already have.
use class time to read the Drudge Report, send e-mail, play Legend of Zelda, or update profiles on Facebook.com
Thus preparing them for the corporate world?
"Teachers leave us kids alone
The reason we go to class is to put ourselves in a situation where there is nothing to do except learn. We go to the gym because that way we won't stop exercising after 10 min like we would at home.
All ways to fight our innate laziness.
If you're not there to learn, you won't.
I'm a gnu world man.
I teach and find laptop abuse to be an issue. The Slate article misses the real problem, which is not that the student checks out (the article correctly notes there are lots of ways to do this), but that others can see the laptop screen. Suddenly there is a group of five students giggling about something. I've had students complain about the distracting laptop usage of others.
I don't know what the right solution is, since I think that in theory it's fantastic for students to have a laptop to take notes, perform calculations, and look up related issues during class. But it's a real problem when the abusers distract a group of students. I suspect that shutting off internet access during class is the best practical solution.
If professors can get away with just giving the powerpoint enclosed with the textbook, we should be able to get away with going online.
Speaking as someone who works in college IT, I've heard from more than one colleague that the same faculty clamoring for wireless and technology in every classroom are the ones now clamoring for killswitches so that the students can't use it during their classes.
Awesome.
It's sort of like when we put projectors with laptop hookups in all of the classrooms in nice, integrated bunkers and then they decided that the laptops were too heavy to carry, and they wanted desktops permanently installed in there are well. Whee! I'll never understand why a professor can carry three different NPR tote bags chock full of paper, and the four pound iBook they've been issued is the breaking point.
--saint
The last 12 grads I interviewed were all top ranked grads from "great" universities. In terms of business sense, they were morons.
One even thought he was smarter than I was, and said so. $100K in debt, 5 years lost?
I've seen what my younger brother and older cousin got from college: unemployment and bad attitudes.
Not the Universities nor the Professors problem...
If I were teaching, I would tell everyone that I get 'paid' and the school gets your money whether or not you pass or fail. Grow up, this is college. Look to your left and look to your right, next semester either one or both of those individuals will no longer be here.
In order to pass this course, you will need to do all of the assignments on the syllabus and turn them in on time. You will need to attend all the lectures and read the assigned reading. You will need to spend time studying and researching your own answers and you will need to participate in class discussions. You will get out of this course what you put into it.
Now we have some very cool technical toys to share and use in this course but it's up to you to not let them get in the way of learning. So go ahead, surf away and play stupid games, chat with your friends, take a nap on the bean bag chairs, etc. But if you fail this class, it's your own darn fault. If your parents are paying your way, then you will have to explain to them why you failed. There is no such thing as a parent teacher conference in the real world!
The Cornell researchers studied browsing habits in classes by giving students school-owned laptops that were known to track their browsing habits. Would people browse normally under those conditions? Also, the students being studied were probably not technophiles -- otherwise they would have their own laptopts, and not likely participate in the study. Technophiles in general have very different computer usage profiles than the general population. In my experience, it seems we are much more better at multitasking, and are better able to use computers while simultaneously interacting with the rest of the world. It looks like this study did not actually investigate how *current* laptop use by students who own them affects performance. Instead, they investigated how the *addition* of a school-owned, monitored laptop to a non-techy student's repertoire changes their performance.
I am a geek attorney, but not your geek attorney unless you've already retained me. This is not legal advice.
I can relate somewhat to what the writer of the article is trying to say. The computer in the classroom (especially with internet access) is just a distraction. In my experience with my own laptop, it's often true. If I have the laptop out then I'm usually not paying all that much attention to the professor. When he's talking about ip packet fragmenting, I'm playing Earthbound, or just browsing the web. Here's the trick though, I'm not doing this in classes where I actually want to pay attention. My networks class for example, is an example of a class where I don't want to pay attention. The professor will go on and on about something not related to the course materials for the day, and I've had a fair amount of networking experience in high-school that whatever concepts he throws out I understand immediately, so the rest of the lecture ends up being pointless. In contrast, in my Senior project class we go over things that are new to me and are useful to me in a format I don't fall asleep right away. And it's not like the computer and internet in the classroom are just a distraction. I have used it to look up facts and extra information about the lecture before.
So is wifi ruining college? No more than any other service provided on campus. I can still shut down the laptop and not pay attention to the professor the old fashioned way, like reading a book, or sleeping. A boring professor is a boring professor whether there's wifi or not. It's my choice to use it knowing the consequences of my actions may lead to lower grades, and as long as I'm not disturbing or otherwise interfering with my classmates who actually want to pay attention, I don't see the problem.
From my own expereince, every single person that brings a laptop to programming lectures is either talking on AIM, surfing Facebook, or playing a game. This really shouldn't come as a surprise to anyone - the internet is more fun than doing work or paying attention. http://img511.imageshack.us/img511/5505/dilemia0ps .gif
I am a viral sig. Please copy me and help me spread. Thank you.
Tech has a good solution to this problem too: they let you do whatever you want, but if you don't understand the material they fail you and kick you out. It's effective at keeping us focused (enough) in class, and also isn't draconian.
"[Regarding the 'cloud,'] ownership was what made America different than Russia." -- Woz
What is the difference between students reading the paper, doing the crossword, or sleeping during class (ie, what went on when I was in school) versus Internet use during class? Both scenarios just represent students not paying attention. In general, students who don't pay attention get lower grades.
(S(SKK)(SKK))(S(SKK)(SKK))
As a CS student in college, YES people talk on AIM, YES people Torrent, YES people watch movies, and YES people do sit in the front row and play WoW. This happens all the time and HELL, I do it once in a while too. But it is also useful. Downloading the most resent lectures. Taking notes. Talking with other people in the class. Is it a distraction? Yes, but there is no way to stop that. If you take away wi-fi there will still be people playing Doom 3 and watching movies.
~ Mooga
Same here, except one of the reasons they do it, is so other classmates can't IM you answers when you are being called on. Law schools use the socratic method, not lectures. Actually, it is up to the professor if you are allowed on the internet or not during class.
It takes intelligence and smarts to get decent grades? All I noticed was lots of studying stuff (the bad way: the way you forget it a few weeks after the test). Perhaps we should fix our education system so people actually learn something before we blame students for not paying attention.
Linux is not Windows
http://dictionary.reference.com/search?q=your
http://dictionary.reference.com/search?q=you're
You should at least master the basics before going on to higher education.
In my class there are about 7-8 people that bring laptops in. Most of them play games and do nothing to do with the class; however there are a couple of us, including myself, that do actual school work. I mostly take notes, follow along with my own slides, or google the topics that the teacher is talking about. The best thing about this is that if there is a lecture that is absolutely boring or covers things I aready know I can work on labs. This is a great time saver for me because I don't end up wasting time listening to useless lectures.
I've been toting my laptop off and on since high school, and until a few years into college I was one of the only people in my class to be doing this.
In high school, I used it to take notes; I can type quite a bit faster than I can write, and they come out looking a bit more organized and legible than they otherwise would have. Also, having a computer for some reason would help me stay focused; I was practically raised on computers, and you might say it is sort of a comfort thing. Whatever it was, it helped me study.
In college, things became more interested. I started off taking primarily computer science courses. I taught myself to program when I was younger, and this process involves a great deal of fiddling around with new concepts in order to fully grasp them. I would sit in class during the lecture compiling away, doing examples that the instructor was giving me and seeing how I could push the envelope. On one occasion I was even able to correct my instructor on the usage of particular syntax.
Being the kind of person that learns scientifically (I like to observe the process and alter test conditions to evaluate the results), a computer is a very nifty tool for giving me the means to gasp the material during the lecture. While my original methods did not employ the use of wifi, having connectivity would be useful in case I needed to look up or download something on the fly; I would just have to be disciplined enough to turn off my instant messenger and mail client so that I don't get too distracted.
Usually I am opposed to computers in the classroom because of such things as funding and underemployment (of the machines themselves), but when the computers are owned by the students themselves, then I'm able to see more benefits (if you're going to pay a grand for a gadget, you're going to learn how to use it). Whether the computer ultimately helps or hinders your classroom experience depends on how good of a student you are, and typically good/bad students get the grades they deserve with or without wifi-enabled computers.
I'm a TA for two of the GIS classes this semester. Considering the nature of the course relies on having a computer, the class is held in the computer lab. Students are often checking their email or browsing the web. Some of them are distracted for the whole lecture. Some students don't need a laptop (or even a computer) to be distracted in class.
As an instructor, I generally discourage students from using laptops for notes. I teach philosophy, so it is generally more important to be listening and occassionally jotting down notes than it is taking dictation about an endless series of facts. (YMMV in other fields.) Students that bring laptops (and who do listen) tend to have gotten lots of bits of fact but generally have no clue how to use them to create integrated knowledge.
Of course, I also encourage my students *NOT* to come to class if they aren't going to pay attention---whether that means sleeping, reading the paper, texting friends, etc. Actually, if I catch that sort of behavior, I ask them to leave. They get no credit for coming to class, so either they find a way to be motivated or do whatever else they prefer.
"Every decent man is ashamed of the government he lives under." - H.L. Mencken
No, often times taking notes actually gets in the way. For some people it is much more important to spend the time they would be writing notes by actually paying attention more -- especially when the professor just uses what is in the book. Thus, often times you can just use the book as your notes and worry about comprehension while in class, not in the time afterwards. That is truly efficient use of time.
What does this do to P2P user tracking. Are campuses as good at identifying Wi-Fi P2P users to the RIAA as they are dorm room wired users?
"It's the height of ridiculousness to say for those 9 lines you get hundreds of millions."
My school has campus wide wifi as well as power and ethernet jacks in most of the rooms. About half the rooms are combination lab/classrooms where every seat has a computer in front of it. Most teachers seem to realize that computers will be used for games and generally do not seem to care as long as the people playing the games are not bothering other students. I can recall well a discussion in my Sociology class a couple of semesters ago. I was participating in the class discussion fully- answering questions, asking questions, making counter points, etc. I was also playing Sonic the Hedgehog on my laptop. At one point in the discussion the professor asked me what I was doing on the computer, and I honestly replied "Playing Sonic professor". She didn't seem to be all that upset replied simply "Well, if your going to during class move to the back, it's distracting the people behind you- they're watching you play instead of paying attention to class."
There are a lot of times during class I find that splitting my attention between a game of Sonic or Tetris or Frozen Bubble allows me to keep half a mind on the game, and half a mind on the lecture, whereas otherwise my mind may wonder completely.
Even with the distraction of games, email, web browsing, etc. that is present, I do find that I tend to learn more and be more productive having access to the internet during class. There are often times that a professor will refer to something and I can get more information by doing a google search or looking it up in wikipedia.
Famous Last Words: "hmm...wikipedia says it's edible"
I'm a Cornell University student, and I use my Powerbook during many of my long lecture classes to browse, as well as take notes. I'm in the film program, and most of my classes tend to be 2-3 hours long, and occasionally my brain needs something to think about besides the relatively dry theoretical content that's discussed.
I've noticed that when class discussions get interesting, heated, or something other than monotone, and I have an interest in actively participating, I close my laptop and listen more attentively. But in most cases, I can handle both the text and the lecture "data stream" concurrently. If anything, giving my mind something to do other than passively receive content. I also find myself looking up sites related to what we're discussing, if its actually interesting. Strange as it seems, sometimes dividing my attention actually lets me focus on stuff I'm less interested in.
I realize that to a certain extent, I'm probably hurting myself by tuning out "less interesting" material. But, at the same time, before I had my laptop, I took notes in spiral notebooks and they'd often be punctuated by long stretches of doodles where the lecture became to dry to hold my attention by itself. I was a 3.5-ish student before I got my laptop, and I'm still a 3.5-ish student today.
Kegs are wireless - how can WiFi mess that up?
--
make install -not war
From the article: In any event, even when multitaskers can't keep track of the professor, it probably doesn't matter much. In lectures at large universities, especially in the humanities and social sciences, class time is usually taken up by the broad outlines of the subject. The real learning occurs when we bear down and pore over the hundreds of pages assigned every week....
As someone who has been through graduate school, and taught there, and have a spouse and siblings doing the same, I'll say this: the major problem is that CLASS IS USUALLY A WASTE OF STUDENT'S TIME. Most professors/instructors blather on about stuff that is not terribly important, then assign a truckload of readings and exercises to complete outside the class. You could get this much more cheaply from do-it-yourself books... because many educations are becoming do-it-yourself anyway.
I make a point in my classes (multimedia programming, graphic design, color theory, etc.) of lecturing with interesting examples, enough to illustrate the subject matter for the week, but after that the kids can go -- even if I've used only half the class time or less. I stay in the classroom the entire allotted class time so that students are free to stay to ask questions or have studio time or whatever.
$nice = $webHosting + $domainNames + $sslCerts
I didn't know you can play Legend of Zelda online. That's what I've been keeping the N64 around for. See what I've missed by not going to college lately.
"It's the height of ridiculousness to say for those 9 lines you get hundreds of millions."
... that it isn't the WiFi, that students are just innately lazy. I agree with that too. But why do people need WiFi for LECTURE NOTES?
This happens at high schools, as well. I knew many capable individuals at my laptop-based High School in a suburb of Dallas, Texas that failed classes merely because they had internet access whenever they pleased.
Hell, my best friend presented asdf.com as his final exam project and got an 85 for it.
At my university, the WiFi network is only in certain building. It's noticably absent from buildings with lecture halls. Let's be honest with ourselves though. People who fuck off, are always going to fuck off. The exclusion of a WiFi network -- which is rather useful to some -- isn't going to change this.
If WiFi was unavailable, we'd just see an annoying increase in the use of cell phones. I for one would rather hear the clicks of trackpads, than the jabbering of cellphone users.
The kind of brain that can handle multiple channels of information is called "female". This so it can remained focussed on finding fruit, roots and mushrooms, comminicating with the social group, watching for danger and keeping an eye on the baby hanging off the left nipple.
The other kind of brain is designed to focus intently on one task: To determine its changing position in space, deduce its future actions, then kill it and drag it home to the first type of brain who can then add "cook the zebra" to its list of tasks while the first type dedicates itself to back-slapping and farting.
The relevance to earning As or not depends on what the A is given for. Men tend to be better at finding a solution that solves a complicated problem. Women tend to be better at cavassing a range of solutions and presenting their relative merits with relatively bias. The best results are found when both types of brain work together. Of course, the link from genitals to brain-type is no less perfect that the link from genitals to sexual preference.
Norman Cook's Ode to Sl
Don't blame the technology, blame the person (ab)using the technology. They know what they're supposed to be doing in class. They know that they're paying to be there. They're choosing to use the technology versus paying attention. A little self-discipline goes a long way.
When I was a lad, working at the shoe factory at 12, I didn't have none of them fancy "educations". We had to work hard, and maybe at the end of the year, Mr. Jones would give us an extra tuppence for Christ's Mass. I worked my way up the corporate chain, first as senior tongue stitcher, then journeyman heeler, all the way up to lace inspector, and I did it though hard work, gumption, pluck, and sheer moxie.
This youth of today expects their fancy degrees and book learning to get them a big shot job in the city without the perserverance and elbow grease we old-timers had to invest. Why, just t'other fortnight, this young whippersnapper came strutting into the factory like Little Lord Fauntleroy, looking for a job. When I asked him if he was willing to dedicate his life to the High God of Shoes, to prostrate himself before the Terrible Majesty of Zapato, He Who Shods Man, I swear a slight look of unbelief crossed his naive visage as he politely excused himself and fled the factory, no doubt to go read another book on how to be mighty smart but ignorant of the ways of the world. Pfeh! Run ofta yer Ivory Tower, you Harvard dandy!
For my part, the internet has always been first one big reference library, and everything else second. I can guarantee one thing - the "A" students sure as HELL aren't the ones visiting drudgereport.com!
It's also certainly possible that the kind of brain that THINKS it can handle multiple channels of information is also the kind of brain that can't.
Since none of them have your full attention, doing four things all at once makes the odds pretty good that all you're doing is screwing up four things at once.
Of course, I expect plenty of people here are going to tell me they're experts in this regard... much like the "90% of all drivers think they're above average" statistic.
Any sect, cult, or religion will legislate its creed into law if it acquires the political power to do so.
What do you think of something like this monitor filter? Maybe make it required for students who wish to use their laptops. Seems like most of the time, the laptop users would prefer this anyway; I know on the few occasions I've had a laptop in a lecture setting (conferences, not schools, but basically the same thing) the laptop wasn't distracting, but the ability of other people to read my screen made me uncomfortable, even though I was doing innocuous things.
It's rare that you're presented with a knob whose only two positions are Make History and Flee Your Glorious Destiny.
Me thinks this is a publicity stunt for facebook. Recruit more loosers.
"It will still take the same intelligence and smarts to get decent grades."
I thought that the students were essentially graded on a curve, i.e. a fixed number of people per grade. So if everyone but you goofs off entirely, you can still get top honours despite being mediocre.
Besides, having internet is class is reasonable - most people now have it at work, and learning how to pay attention despite all the potential distraction can't hurt. I'm still not very good at it...
I quit!
Just because some people use the internet to look at stupid stuff, shouldnt mean you should eliminate the nternet for people who actually use it to research stuff for the class or for other classes.
I think removing wifi is as stupid as removing the library to prevent people from stealing books. If a student is too stupid to use their tools to succeed then they shouldnt be in college to anyway. Wifi is just a tool, just like a notebook, a library, or a teacher giving a lecture, all tools to help you get a degree.
(I know teachers are persons but their role is to help you get your degree)
Removing a tool makes it harder to get a degree. Just like removing the internet makes us dumber, removing books makes is less educated, removing wifi also is stupid. If people surf less they'll just find something else to do other than study.
"Longer browsing sessions during class tend to lead to lower grades, but there's a hint that a greater number of browsing sessions during class may actually lead to higher grades."
This guy sound like the Alan Greenspan of education!
Either a student decideds to pay attention or he/she doesn't. I don't see how it's much different from doodeling or daydreaming. I feel that college students are old enough to decide for themselves how important their education is.
Dont make me waste time and money in bullshit classes (many of which I COULD HAVE tested out of if someone woulda cared enough to tell me we could as an incoming freshman...) and I will not surf.
I dont surf in my Unix administration class because I AM LEARNING something that is also INTERESTING!
It's not the teachers job to force students to learn, or limit the ability of students who use the technology to learn faster. When you get rid of the internet, students who use the internet to actually research what you are talking about suffer, you end up hurting the students who are bright enough to use the technology properly. You also hurt the technology industry, as sales of laptops and wifi equipment will go down if you attack the main users and buyers of it. It is always wrong to punish the minority due to the stupidity of the majority. This means if the majority is ruining your class by not studying, give them F's, but don't hold others back with your solutions.
I think access to information and communications should be increased on campus as much as possible so students who actually know how to use the technology can use it. If a student wants to play games and goof off in class, theres a grading system to handle those students.
Actually, I think that bad professors and a strange view on what "education" means is going to ruin schools and universities just as much, if not more than the students.
I did a survey around the campus for a paper on the topic of 'mobile computing' (the colleges name for forced laptop rentals and wireless everywhere ). My survey found that the people who had the best gpa were the ones who wouldn't use their laptop during class, closely followed by those who did to talk to fellow class mates during the lecture. Those with the worst gpa said they spent most of their time on solitare.
To me it seemed like the best idea would be to put the laptops away, keep the ineternet there if its needed and keep the class open to discussion.
Right now, my college computer is a G5 PowerMac, so it stays in my dorm, and I use paper to take notes. But back when I had an iBook, I was using it to take notes in the harder classes, and to surf web sites in the less challenging classes. If I already know the material (and am just taking the class to fill credits), then I tend to not pay attention in lectures, but do well on exams. However, if the class is difficult enough, I do pay attention and take notes, so that I can do well. See the relationship there? In addition, my attitude towards the class is the same as what I see in the professor. The one who shows up late is considered a joke to me, and I just surf (either Internet or daydreaming) during his lectures. The one who is very punctual and organized gets my full attention.
I've never heard of the state paying off college loans. Please direct me ot this free state paid college system so I can get a free degree!
If the state pays, the state benefits, the state would not pay for college unless the state needs to hire a new set of lawyers, doctors, technicians, and scientists. If anyone should pay for education it should be the state, education is a matter of national security, and if we can pay for police to protect us physically, and pay for a big military to protect us physically, shouldnt we protect our jobs and our economy?
Even if we decide that economic security is a bad idea, its not like we have universal college education right now, and even if we did, you'd have more talented individuals if you let them figure out how to use the technology to be productive than to limit technology while the rest of the world uses it.
Frequently, professors in my classes forget minor details (what an acronmyn stands for, a specific date, etc.) and ask students to Google it for them.
One of my professors usually responds to the correction by putting on his best Scooby-Do villan impression and says, "and I would've gotten away with it, too, if it weren't for those meddling kids with Google!"
That said, it can certainly be a distraction, but it's really a matter of self-control.
You can't make blanket statements like this about laptops and grades..
Some classes require lots of focus and attention.. think of math. Professor is spending most of the time doing proofs, examples, etc. You can't goof off on Slashdot at the same time the Prof. is doing an example of something and understand what he is doing.
Other classes just present casual bits of information that can easily be summarized as the professor goes along.. this is like a humanities class, for example. I just jot down details I think are important while I sit around and read Slashdot or whatever. Yes, and truthfully, I don't pay as much attention because I don't find it interesting in the first place. I'm not going remember a single thing I learn here by the time next semester rolls around.
I will also note that I have ADD (perhaps computers are the cause, or perhaps my ADD causes my obsession with computers). If I dont bring a laptop, I will have no source of distraction. My mind will tend to wander quite a bit and I'll just never be able to have any concentration whatsoever (this is why I tend to do poorly on tests in general, because I lose focus rapidly - something no one understands or believes). At least with a laptop, I can sort of satisfy my desire to be distracted for brief periods of time while not totally losing focus of what I need to learn from class. In this sense, laptops are a godsend for me.
Lord High Crapflooder The Right Honourable Vlad Craig Esther McDavenpherson III
Destroyer of Mercatur.Net
Sure, it could be useful having an extra source of reference, but I can always write down terms and concepts to be looked for later.
Ideally, the device that would most benefit me in class would be electronic paper: a 16 color device, thinner, lighter, and with much better battery life than current Tablet PCs, with both a stylus and a keyboard (I personally would prefer physical and on-screen, but on-screen alone would work too). Its primary use would be to take down and organize notes, but I could imagine it having a syncable scheduler too.
Actually, I can't even do (non-programming) homework with a computer around; it's just too damn tempting to not work.
I started law school this fall; it differs from undergrad in that nearly everyone has a laptop and uses it to take notes. In my entering class, I think perhaps 6 or 7 students don't have a laptop. As an engineer and a techie in general, I find it terrific to have. I type much, much faster than I can write with a pen, and have FindLaw/Westlaw/Lexis-Nexis, state codes & regulations, the U.C.C., etc, all right at my fingertips for reference during class.
:-) You reap what you sow.
What amazes me are the people who chat on aim the whole class, or browse facebook, or play MMORPGs (seriously). Even if you're a freakin' genius and don't need to listen to the professor and class discussion, it's distracting and just plain rude. The corolary, of course, is that it's natural selection in action
[As an aside, I actually find law school fun and, while not easy, certainly not hard. It is a feeling shared by the other handful of hard-science and engineering grads. We're basically used to the workload, if not the type of work . (No worries Slashdot-crowd, I'm not in it for the money and I'd sooner commit seppuku than work for the likes of the **AA.) ]
A preposition is a terrible thing to end a sentence with.
Our school issues students laptops, and has WiFi throughout *most* of the campus. Newer rooms have Ethernet ports for wired use as well.
I don't think we need to treat the Internet differently from bringing, say, a book or magazine to class. If I bring my textbook to class, and use it to follow along with the professor, it's helpful. If I bring the textbook for another class and study in downtime during class, it's only me that's losing out. If I bring Playboy to class, it'd be a distraction to others, and then we have a problem.
We give professors a means of turning network access off, but few professors do. I applaud this: I've used the Internet for a lot of constructive stuff during class. Looking up related material, getting the document we were supposed to print out and bring to class, etc.
Yes, sometimes I'll notice classmates chatting on AIM or doing other stuff of no adademic value, but they're only hurting themselves. I really don't think schools have any need to try to regulate usage in classrooms.
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suwain_2
Something else that troubles me about this, and also about higher education. Most of us going to school are in one way or another, PAYING for our education. Money comes out of our pockets (either directly, as in my case, or most often in the form of a loan, as was my case - yes there are scholarships, but I don't know anyone personally who can afford their entire tuition, fees, and books to be paid by scholarship...) and then goes into the school's pockets to be used for paying professors, heat and light, as well as services the students want to have.
You, the student, are a consumer. If the class is too boring, try a different section. If you surf in class, that's your choice. I despise the idea of kicking out people from a classroom when they paid for the seat in the first place. What they choose to do with it is their buisness, and what I choose to do with it is mine. My school offers wi-fi throughout the campus (it's a small community college) and I don't usually use it during class (but it's a great tool to have between classes, and in those odd moments you need to look something up, it's handy to have wikipedia right at hand) but everyone else's student fees helped pay for the network, so to take it away from them not only seems draconian, but undemocratic and uncapitalist.
I don't know about Wi-Fi, but the RWJ Foundation is certainly making a go at it. Taking away my bookstore shotglasses. sheesh.
In that classroom of the future link you can see those silver 10 dollar Ikea chairs. They are the most uncomfortable fucking chairs ever made!
Wilkl always find a distraction, atleast with wifi and a laptop, they are not disrupting everyone around them. And for the Zelda part, i find playing some kind of game helps me listen better. I use my hands ands eyes to play, and focus my ears on listening. Made alot of teachers feel foolish with my t-82 and tetris lol
I am a student at Cornell University who frequently surfs the web during class, I don't ever remember giving my consent to have my grades compared to my browsing time...
It's not *amusing*, cocksucker. It's fucking demented. Asshole.
I remember when I was in college, all we could do to waste time was to get drunk and stoned.
Havoc Video
I find it sort of funny when someone tries to take notes on a laptop in classes I am in. First of all I should explain that I am a physics major at a university with a tiny physics department (6 undergrad honours students are in the same year as I).
In any case I had a second year class called modern physics. It is basically a relativity and introductory QM survey course which alot of majors require their students to take (this means it has about 40 people in it). In any case, on the first day one guy walks in with a laptop and starts setting up. When the prof walked in he took one look at the guy with the laptop and started laughing because he knew that it would be impossible to take notes on a laptop.
Lo and behold the laptop geek dropped the class after he failed the first midterm miserably. His notes were likely terrible
That being said, I think that the only place a laptop could be usefull is well out of the sciences (except perhaps computer science, although I would stick with a pencil and paper)
History will be kind to me, for I intend to write it - Sir Winston Churchill
Collages seem to be businesses. Making money and producing thinking people are not related. The highest paid 'teachers' at many schools teach ball handling skills. Depending on the class, one could at least learn something with internet access in the class. I have an idea. Put Wi-Fi in Intelligent Design classrooms.
Most students show a clear link between browsing and lower grades. Who would of thought not paying attention would cause bad grades? ;)
But maybe, just maybe some student might get a marginally better grade...maybe.
Create a wifi connection that connects to the library computers, online class information, notes, thats all great and I can see a benefit. Don't allow them to connect to the internet to goof off. It will only lower there grades, and in turn reflect badly on the college.
Yes a relize it would mean create a network that doesn't connect to the internet.
The Kruger Dunning explains most post on
"but it's certainly possible that the kind of brain that can handle multiple channels of information is also the kind of brain that earns A's."
/. (and wider tech) crowd - everyone likes to think they multitask well. But frankly, people who try to multitask just do a half-*ssed job on everything. This has been my first hand observation, but more recently it has been shown by researchers to be true.
This is a pretty common belief, especially among the
#DeleteChrome
How many of you are in a college lecture right now, posting through Wi-Fi on your laptop?
I don't reply to ACs
If it keeps their mouth's shut in my classes I am all for it. I don't care what you do, just shut the hell up and don't distract my teaching or the other students
At least in the physical sciences, 2/3 of the audience have their laptops open and are busy at work finishing up their own presentations, sending email, and doing any number of other random things. I've never seen a classroom with anywhere *near* the density of laptops being used for tasks other than note taking that happens in a conference full of professors, post-docs, and senior grad students.
It seems to me the reason is simple: a lot of what speakers say isn't useful, even in the case of good speakers and voluntary audience. Even when it *is* useful, the rate at which information is presented is usually an order of magnitude slower than the rate at which the audience can absorb it, with huge gaps of dead time between important statements. So, at lectures people spend an hour sitting in their seats in order to catch a minute or two of really useful information.
As someone who hasn't taken a course without lots of equations and diagrams in a long time, I've never had an excuse to bring a laptop to class. Instead, I have to spend all that dead time thinking about other things on my own without the benefit of a technological distraction.
The problem with laptops in the classroom is that it hurts the feelings of lecturers, who are forced to confront the fact that most of their audience isn't paying attention to most of what they say most of the time.
it increase the number for dropouts,a nd lowers the average GPA of the graduate. That will reflect poorly on the school.
The Kruger Dunning explains most post on
Law schools are also incredibly terrible at educating their students. Law students learn in spite of the so-called "socratic method", not because of it.
fuck you.
Simply use text to speech and or audio recording and take a nap!
So how is wi-fi ruining college? If you goof off all the time during class, you'll fail. And if you don't fail, that means the college is shitty in the first place. If you just go to lecture to surf the internet, why do you even go anyway? Ruining indeed.
"When the atomic bomb goes off there's devastation...but when the atomic bong goes off there's celebraaaaation!"
"Curse your sudden, but inevitable betrayal!"
The best reason to get people together in the same room is if they're going to interact. Otherwise, it's television, reading, or writing, which technology can provide anywhere. Even real-time interaction is technology-provided, but not to the level a serious education requires for most students.
If your classtime is so non-interactive that students can drift so far off topic on the web that they're not listening to the class, then why are you having a class meeting at all?
If i was gonna do that, I would just not waste my time and skip class and sleep in.
One of my grandchildren attends university in California. He was telling me that one of his friends always brought a laptop to one of their Biology classes. My grandson and some of his other friends were particularly annoyed with their friend who'd always be playing games or watching DVDs.
One of my grandson's friends ended up recording a soundfile that said "PENIS PENIS COCK PENIS PENIS VAGINA CUNT ANUS BUTTFUCK", and other sayings like that. They ended up putting it on their friend's laptop, and waited for a lecture when he left the class to go to the washroom. Once he was gone they turned up the volume, started looping that soundfile, and waited until their friend got back and sat down. As soon as he did, they pulled out the headphones, blaring out the audio.
I think he said that the professor flipped, and told the kid to get out of his class. They had a meeting later on, and my grandson's friend was told never to bring the laptop to class again.
Cyric Zndovzny at your service.
I'm a CS student at CMU. In my experience, most of the students who use their laptops during lectures (or alternatively don't attend class) are the brilliant ones who understand the material straight from the book and do well on tests anyway. Those who can't afford to not pay attention in class by surfing the internet or playing games simply don't. For example, a few weeks ago a friend of mine who programs and reads slashdot during matrix algebra lectures and never takes notes got 100 on an exam while I, after taking notes and studying every night for about a week, got a 97. In my calc class, another person I know who writes blog entries in every single lecture scored 99 on the latest exam.
As long as students understand the material (and show it by doing well on tests and assignments), I don't see any problem with having internet access in classrooms. Provided that students are held accountable for their learning through exam grades (it's easier to cheat on assignments, so they don't always demonstrate mastery), there's really not much that can "ruin college" as far as learning goes.
The most obnoxious/distracting thing I've seen anyone do on a laptop in class is play stepmania and make lots of noise with their keyboards. But even then, anyone can easily ask them to stop or move to another seat.
Ah, but in America's Community Colleges the Tax Payers are covering 90% of the costs of going to school.
Remember folks, slashdot doesn't have a -1 "disagree" moderation!
I am currently finishing my first year of law school, and I can tell you that internet is definately a huge issue. We have a school policy against internet usage, and a number of students in family law in the spring got the hammer dropped on them for being in an AOL chat room. Between instant messanging and web browsing, I would definatley say that it affects peoples ability to pay attention. But, I personally think that the students who are using the internet to distract themselves are the same students that would have distracted themselves in some other way back in the day. The issue is big enough that it is basically the first thing they talk to you about with respect to class, and they repeat it like 50 times during "introduction to the profession" which happens just before you start school. One of the other major issues is that the classrooms have the exact number of seats for the number of students we have, so basically there is the potential to be distracting to OTHER students as well....
OH MY GOD STUDENTS ARE NOT PAYING ATTENTION IN CLASS! Seriously, the kids using laptops in class are just the kids who'd be skipping otherwise. The RIAA isn't losing money when I download an album because I wouldn't have bought it at that price anyway, and the teacher isn't losing students when they screw around on a laptop in class because they wouldn't have paid attention anyway.
As I have worked in the IT department in my college, it has been my experience that Wi-Fi in the classroom is of great benefit. You might wonder why, and the answer is as follows:
You don't just put Wi-Fi in a classroom and forget about it. You deploy it along with the right infrastructure and give the teacher the power to TURN IT OFF whenever he needs absolute attention to his/her class.
It is necessary to point out that the short quote mentions the "classrooms" only. And no I did not read TFA cause I don't need to and I don't want to. The thing is that as long as there is a tool to be used for good it is important to use it the right way to get where you want to go; or deploy it and implement it the right way so that the end users can get where they are "supposed to" in the time "when they are SUPPOSED TO". Damin it!!!
Double plus good on this one please...
Ohh.. wait!!!....
No, no!!! I mean Insightful....
Have a good one.
===== "Every head is a different world so don't invade mine you FREAK!" smartSAGA said
We were all handed "free" (laptop + support paid in tuition) laptops as freshmen complete with Wifi, and we were one of the first campuses to implement Wi-fi throughout campus. I've seen the pros and cons firsthand and still I think it's generally more positive than negative to have one in class, although self control is required if you bring it.
In the massive lecture halls with rather boring lectures, having a laptop was great because you could do other work or emails, and at random times type up the notes the professor is putting on the board (which you'll have to regurgitate in a few weeks). Yes, I also noticed the problem of games, etc. which would distract those surrounding one individual, but that was quite rare actually and only for a few of the worst professors.
I suspect some professors actually fear the power of Google. I had humanities professors, for instance, who could get away with saying absolute BS because no one could immediately check, and bringing up old news wouldn't be nearly as effective. However, I've cross-checked and verified what the prof says so s/he cannot get away with anything! It keeps a professor honest and class discussions interesting.
Other professors, especially in CS, are so ridiculously old-fashioned by writing notes on the board. Rarely are pictures involved and thus it seems like a total waste (while if they are, I understand why using the board or markers on a blank slide on overhead would be preferable). All this mental energy is spent on keeping up with their writing rather than thinking critically about the problem at hand. Some of my better professors would write on the board (or use overheads) but insist that we do NOT copy down their notes (as they will make the notes available). I find that much preferable, and combined with the power of the Internet to provide examples or other lecture notes, I can build my list of resources during the lecture itself.
My alma mater (Stevens Institute of Technology) had a reputation for having students who take many credits at a time, and so I've seen multitasking among a few that I found absolutely amazing (side work being done in class while at the same time catching the drift of the class dicussion for example). The other students would often drop (or fail) out or switch majors, which is fine by me! The WiFi, which wasn't always used but has become more and more prevalent, has greater potential for good than for bad for the students who are there to learn. The others would sit around in their dorm and skip class or play games on a laptop - it really didn't much matter. BTW, I did graduate in 4 years with high honors with BS and MS in Computer Science, so my high level of laptop use did seemed to work out fine. YMMV
This sig donated to Pater. Long live
When I took mathematical physics last year (with an excellent prof, btw) a substantial number of students had laptops out and we all were on IM chatting with each other about the lecture.
This actually made class smoother... the professor was interrupted less frequently with questions since the basic ones ("where did the gamma term come from?") were answered by other students.
It helped me learn and is less distracting for the prof than passing notes or whispering.
It's a researched phenomenon that students who doodle in class are activating a part of their brain that will help them learn more effectively. A trance state if you will. We had a teacher in high school who let students do this instead of screaming at them about being forward facing and perpetually alert. The results were those students did just as well or better then the fixed gaze mom and dad made me a pressure cooker kids. I don't believe the students that are reading or doing an intensive task are learning but playing zelda or something passive is certainly of no harm. Furthermore many of the 100 level courses in college consist of the professor reading the notes available outloud in class. Students minds move faster then this and instead look for the shortcut or best way to learn whats needed. Why hang on every word when its typed out in front of you, just listen for the anecdotes or elaborations.
I use laptop in my classes. And yes, it can be a distraction. I find myself checking my mail, reading comics, cnn, updating information on a portal I (with my friends) own. But most distractions do not come from the Internet, they come from what you already have on laptop. You read articles you have downloaded last night, you write documents for your other classes, you prepare your projects, you write your own materials (ie. personal web page or a blog entry to be uploaded later when finished, projects, programs, finish job tasks), try out new soutions (software), audit and configure your PC and do a lot more. So blocking Internet acces is not a good solution!
And blocking Internet access is bad for a number of other reasons as well. The first thing I do when I ge to class, I try to download the latest materials about the subject (and check the classes web page for updates). I also use the Internet to find materials relating to the subject (that can be very handy if you want to "take on" the tutor/presenter/lecturer ;)). Also finding alternate viewpoints to the materials can be helpful when trying to understand the lecturer or trying to confront him/her. Finding translations (from estonian to english or french or latin in my case) of terms is a challenge by itself. The downside is you understanding the amount of false information on wikipedia :p.
For people having trouble paying attention to class I have a suggestion. Try to make notes. Not handwritten (you won't be able to read those anyways - that is the reason why I started carrying my laptop to classes at first place), but make notes using Lotus Notes, Microsoft Word (or Excel), KWord, AbiWord or OpenOffice.org Write. If you are some kind of a Linux/Unix geek, you might even take notes in *TeX (which I wouldn't suggest to anyone else). It is especially useful if the class does not yet have an online conspect as then you will be the first to write one and it can be an opportunity to get credit or extra income.
I have seen most laptops in physics and economy classes, a bit less in computer science followed by law and then other social and real sciences and finally others. But I see the use of laptops increasing every week. I consider the use of laptops and Internet in classes more of a necessity than of distraction. It gives you much more opportunities than takes away. Ideally colleges and universities should be able to supply laptops to students in need as I can't see uncomputerised learning possible in ten years. E-learning, i-learning and learning from remote and independent is becoming more and more common. Classrooms are becoming more and more like (student) corporation rooms - places where people with similar interests can gather. It is even possible to graduate an university eithout actually ever visiting the university building (of the university you are to graduate) today. Why should we spend time for commuting between universty and home or university and work or university and cafe or ...? And why should we reserve certain times a week just to go and listen to one person talking if you could listen to the recording of his talk any time anywhere? We shouldn't!
Whatever, the more people that do worse- the better~! That way I am guaranteed a job. I can usually study more on my own laptop more efficiently and by myself than the retard up front. HOWEVER one thing that might get ruined is in-class discussions---because everyone is in their own little world.
Would having a TV in the classroom (with headphones on) have been appropriate back then? I think the excuse is that a laptop allows you to take notes----which is another reason why ALL INSTRUCTORS should make the notes available on the web. It is ridiculus to see how many retards are busy taking notes.
I bought a Tablet PC to take notes on, and I'd credit it with raising my GPA by a full point.
I also use the wifi feature to pull up Wikipedia articles on information which we are talking about in class...professor mentions antipsychotic drugs, I can raise up an article on Haloperidol and show it to the person next to me who is asking what the hell the professor is talking about, etc.
It's a great resource, although I do have to actively fight off the temptation to play solitare/winmine/pinball/inkball/mshearts actively instead of listening to the lecture like I should.
Im a sophomore at a large university and I always bring my laptop to class. Most of the time, when I'm on the computer, I'm not taking notes, no one is. Probably fifty percent of people have computers. Several of my classes have random short papers to write in class, once or two a month. They are a decent part of your grade, so you don't want to miss more than one. That is the only reason I go to the class. I read the book and slides online and absorb the information there .... why I should I listen to it again in class? Like someone said in another post, there might be a few minutes of unredunant learning in an hour long class, I would fall asleep without a laptop. I do go to nearly all my classes, but I wouldn't without a computer.
You could be text messaging, sleeping, drawing, day dreaming, etc. ... It has nothing to do with the medium you choose, it is just the fact that you choose not to pay attention. The way I see it, I am paying thousands to go to school there. If I fail, I get kicked out. Thus I don't fail, I keep a high GPA, as long as I don't cheat no matter how I get the grades is up to me. If you have the intelligence (or time to study) to not listen to the professor, then more power to you, get that A and do no work, why not?
WiFi is great. I can take a shit and surf porn at the same time.
Take off every Sig.
In my view (as a college student), it's the teacher's obligation not to bore me, or at least to provide information that I could not easily look up in a book. If the information the teacher gives during class does not do at least one of these things, I don't think it's reasonable to expect me to pay attention. That is, if the marginal benefit of paying attention is less than the marginal cost, I don't see why I would.
On top of that, paying attention to boring lectures is just impossible. I wish more computer science classes allowed some kind of more interesting form of student-teacher interaction.
And I have great grades. It's nice if the professor is being boring, and instead of day dreaming you can go off and entertain yourself until they get back to the important stuff. Also, taking notes on a laptop helps me stayed more organized.
I play games or read the internet in class and do not cheat. I don't understand why you associate not paying attention with low grades or with cheating. Are people who are bored in class somehow less morally upright than those who do not?
So when the slack bastard (SB) who doesn't do homework asks a million questions, we all stop and answer them for him instead of paying attention to our lesson? What incentive would there be to answer SB when you might miss part of the lesson yourself in doing so? One thing I never did in college was blame a professor for my own ignorance. If you can't keep up on your own, go see the teaching assistant. It's usually a she, and she's usually cute in a geeky kinda way.
Personaly i dont use laptops in class , because 1:I don't want to and 2:I don't want to spend $1000+ to just look at the web and read my email.
I could instead:
Buy a new computer with top preformace.
Buy lot's of new stuff.
Invest in somthing and maybe earn more.
ETC
ETC
And onre more thing. If i sit in class and try to hear what's going on , or doing somthing i have to sit there and hear the "tatatatatata" on the STUPID laptop keyboard.
That's way beyond anyoing.
Maybe I am old, but if we talked on a class we got thrown out. no talkback ...
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.. todays youth :) I thought I was a rebel once...
...
X missed classes, you repeated a year. No laptops, only calculators (with no text memory on exams). Pen + paper.
In college it was worse but still, your phone rang, and you were out of your paid classroom with a good chance of failing your next test.
Failing tests resulted in a much harder exam from the whole year/months of material just to pass the year. Teachers were respected, of at least politely greeted.
Dunno, are US classrooms really as I see in your typical movie? Ring sounds everyone jumps out and runs away? I remember spending my whole breaks in calss with the teacher finishing the class, there was no jumping out and leaving BS.
Watching movies or writing email on a class ? I mean our teachers would ask you "and Mr Anderson what do you think of this" (refferring to the part you did not pay attention) and if you had no idea what was up you were screwed one way or an other
Ahm
On the technical side: I would allow users to log in to an Xterm over wifi, they could acces their stuff, and if you are not logged in, no laptop on the table....
If the teacher walks by and you have anything open other than your app that's needed for the class.... close laptop, and no use for the rest of the class..
I would go as far as installing a cam at the back of the class with pan/tilt/zoom to make sure no one is doing stuff they should not...
I mean if you spend a class watching a TV show why not just stay at home and not disturb the others with distraction
I might sound like a nerd to some, but I do not care really, I came from tough schools and at the end I am happy I did. (besides having to learn a bunch of completely stupid subjects at high school that was part of the government's requirements for all schools)
I don't keep notes. I find that by just paying attention (which I can't do as well while writing) I retain about 90%+ of the lecture. Besides, notes will just end up in a drawer somewhere and I'll end up studying from the textbook or not at all (actually going to all the classes and paying attention almost ensures a good final grade, for me at least).
Send email from the afterlife! Write your e-will at Dead Man's Switch.
I'm one of those people who always brings their laptop to class. The only classes that I don't take it to are math classes, or classes where it's not allowed (which is almost unheard of.) I even bring it to classes like Physics.
The main purpose is notes, but as the term goes on, it takes on a whole other secondary purpose: Giving me a reason to be there. Frankly, 75% of the professors I've had so far in college (I'm in my second half the junior year) are dull, read off slides, don't know what the hell they're talking about, or are incomprehensible. However, most don't tell me when tests/quizes/homework will be ahead of time, so I go to class to make sure I know. While in class, I either work ahead in the book, do homework, or browse the internet. I once played Half-Life during Chemistry.
There's no reason for me to do otherwise. Either the professors have such high curves that I don't actually need to learn the material to pass, the book gives me all the info I need so the professor is useless, or the professor is actually good and I am actually taking notes. The presence of my laptop generally has little to do with my overall grade, regardless if I use it to take notes or not, but the level of the professor has a profound effect.
Hmmmm. I can only speak from my personal experience, of course, so bear with me. I am going to a small, tier-4 lawschool for a variety of personal reasons/priorities. It's a good school. I have professors with terminal degrees from Harvard, Yale, and Columbia. I think they, like me, enjoy the more laid back, rural atmosphere and like to *teach*. That said, I don't know how a top-ranked program at a big school would differ. (I did get into a top school...and decided there was no way in hell I was going $150,000 in debt, among other things.)
As I said, there is certainly work involved, but I find it easy to keep up with most of the time. In fact, when I treat it as an 8-to-5 job, I find myself free most evenings and on the weekends. That is 45 hours/week after all. Right now's a little hectic with a trial in Civil Procedure, legal research/memoranda, filling out my outlines and preparing for finals, and so forth, but it isn't killing me. Just pace yourself and keep up.
On the other hand, some people are freaking out. Completely. The people who were psych majors, especially. Compared to the liberal arts, law is a pretty drastic increase in workload. You can't just blow off the reading and such, like they may have done in undergrad. I get a tremendous amount of insight out of the lectures, but without the reading beforehand, you might as well not go to class. And the lack of grade-feedback is a bit daunting. We had one midterm, in Property, just to prepare us for the format of the finals. I felt confident enough in what I had learned to just review my outline a bit beforehand and I did pretty damn well.
Mostly, I find it terribly amusing that I'm enjoying myself in law school, having prepared myself for the worst.
Oh, probably. I was a DM way back in the day too :-) I'm used to problem-solving as an engineer and I find my analytical skills invaluable in law. You need to be able to see the different facets of an argument and try to resolve a given case for both sides, and with varying fact patterns.
Consider U.C.C. 2-207. Probably one of the most ambiguous and argued about sections of the Uniform Commercial Code. I've read a couple of cases now where both sides cited it when they presented their case. Who made the offer? Who was accepting? Do both parties meet the definition of merchant? (Under the UCC, a person who has a specialized skill, such as a PhD in something, may meet the definition.) Lots of ways to turn it to your favor. ProCD v. Zeidenberg is a good case about 2-207, EULAs, copyright, and so forth. (I agree with the district court more than the later appellate decision though.)
So I'd say yeah. If you're a pedant like me, you'll probably like learning the law. Just remember that 'black letter law' isn't sacrosanct. The real point is the reasoning behind it and the impetus/need that created the law in the first place.
Also, graduate school in general is different in that your classmates want to be there. The people who go on past undergrad tend to be more hardcore; the ones who aren't get weeded out quick enough. It's kinda neat to hear people walking by, arguing about points of law as much as they talk about "who's having a party that weekend." Nothing like an animated discussion with smart people about
A preposition is a terrible thing to end a sentence with.
no
The fact that people still spend hours a day listening to lecturers drone on about esoteric nonsense is a further indication of this. How is sitting in a cramped lecture hall and listening to a professor talk to 150 students any better than just reading the same material online at your own pace and with your own schedule? Why would they even imagine that students surfing the internet is the problem. The problem is that the classes themselves are boring and meaningless.
Go ahead and laugh at the state school kids who run the checkout counters for the Ivy League B-schoolers. Laugh all you want.
What the parent said about failing you and kicking you out? That's real. It happens. It's a tough place to get an engineering/compsci degree.
They may not be driving BMWs, but the boys (and the handful of girls) out of Atlanta earn their geek cards.
The US free market: two halves of a government-granted duopoly are free to set the market price.
I don't. But my area of study is molecular biology, and you can take it from me that you *never* see students in any of the lectures I've attended browsing on the internet or whatever. Not because they get frowned at; it's nobody else's problem. Quite simply, they will very quickly be left behind if they don't devote their attention to the subject at hand.
Maybe the situation is different in computer "science" classes (the quotation marks are not a jibe, they are simply a reflection that although I used to be a sysprog, I have been made to realise that computing is no more a science than macrame), but ultimately, you are only cheating yourself if you don't make best use of your class or lecture time.
It's soooooo booring when you have a "high IQ", you mostly sit there and wait for the idiot to say something important or different or maybe even exciting. All this waste of time just for some government approved piece of paper so you can go get a job?
It's just a way for the dumb people to keep really smart people from moving forward like they should.
I like the wifi, at least I ain't wasting my time and can sit there and write some cool stuff for P2P aps!
My reading is that: Long browsing sessions are probably associated with something completely unrelated to the class -- and a distraction from it. While many browsing sessions probably indicate that the student is looking up stuff related to what the instructor is talking about in the moment.
As a friend of mine once said: "It's not what you have, that matters -- it's knowing how to use it."
Free Software: Like love, it grows best when given away.
but I think you haven't grasped the concept of a university. These are students we are talking about, not prepubescent school pupils. Treating them as children will only make them behave like children. I'm not saying we should treat them as adults either, because that would by inference prevent us from considering them as "real" adults.
Let them be citizens, people, students. Prohibit out of fairness that which distracts others and steals the focus during lectures. Allow out of fairness those things that only hurt themselves. They haven't come for moral judgment.
Looking up case law and how it applies is generally more helpful than learning what happened in 1600s England common law about something that has nothing to do with the law of today. Also certain case books are outdated by the time you take the class. One of these classes are the intellectual property classes, so when the teacher lectures you, its actually more beneficial to ignore them and read slashdot. That's what I did in class. I didn't do very well gradewise, but I then again I didn't have to unlearn all the bad law that was taught to me.
In my grad school T/A school days, I had this problem. I had the easiest solution ever. No computers in the class. I can't imagine a lecture class where students are required to do something on a laptop, so nobody had one. Paper and pencil work just fine for taking notes.
People who think they know everything really piss off those of us that actually do.
The kids are paying for it.
The kids are wasting valuable time and money provided by their parents. The vast majority of kids have not earned the money being spent on their college "vacation". The kids earning and life experiences usually do not exceed summer stints at McDonalds. Their parents have spent the past 20 years earning and saving the money that is being spent on the auspice of educating their children and bettering their lives. As such a parent I am NOT paying for the ungrateful know-it-all morons to waste time surfing the net and using ever devolving shorthand "English" in instant message chat sessions. Something the call "texting". If they would pay attention in class, they may learn enough English to realize that the word text is not even a verb!
Furthermore, as the one paying the college and its professors, I expect then to provide value for my investment. I expect them to do their very best to make sure that the kids get the education that I am paying so dearly for. If this means turning off WiFi and "ruining the surfing/IM experience of thousands" then so be it. Boo hoo. Even if the kids don't want or appreciate the educationthey are supposed to be receiving just yet, I'm paying top dollar for their education and I expect the school to provide value for my money!
Ive been working with audio since I was 12; it is second nature to me.
My degree is in audio engineering and thus had some very basic courses to take.
Well, I would play Super Mario, Tetris, and a few others on my TI-86.
No sound, no one else could see the screen, no distraction.
One day my prof walked up to me in the hall and asked me not to come back to class "if I was just going to sit there with my head down".
Later on I figured out the guy was bi-polar and has serious emotional issues.
Libertas in infinitum
Why does doing other things have to be bad anyway? I can't tell you how many large CS Lectures that I've been to where I'll turn around an find half the class asleep, and some snoring. I mean, let's face it, a LOT of lectures are very very boring. There's a good chunk of us sleep deprived student who, without wireless, would be asleep, or zoned-out in class and oblivious to the lecture at hand anyway. At least now we look awake and at least hearing the sounds coming from the professor's mouths.
I am actually currently taking Geri Gay's Comm 440 class at Cornell University (the one that did the research that was cited) and she actually brought this up in class last Tuesday. She mentioned that in an experiement they had two sets of students--one set that took notes on paper and one set that "took notes" with a laptop. The group that used the laptop did indeed have internet access surf the net and whatever else, but when these two groups were quizzed on the lecture material at the end of class, they performed equally well, but the group with the laptop had a more enjoyable experience.
Enjoyability is a pretty big factor. I consider it a better use of my time to skip class (and do whatever else) then to attend boring lectures. But wifi allows me to turn the classroom into my room (Sort of), which actually increased my classroom attendence. Plus, there have been a number of classes where it helped to have wireless because I was able to look things up. And seriously, all those references that Professors tell us to look up if you're interested? If I wrote it down, I'd forget it by the time I get home anyway, at least I can look up things while the context is at hand.
Plus, think of the channels it could open up in teaching. I once had a physics class where their idea of interactive teaching was to have exercises in class and have people "vote" on multipe choice answers with a keypad in front of them. This was actually pretty effective, because more people did the exercise if they had to vote, and more people voted when it was anonymous. But the keypads were limiting since there were only 4 choices. Think of what wireless internet could do in that case. Frankly, I think it would also encourage more people to ask questions, considering the greatest problem with asking question in class is the possibility of looking stupid. Wireless would allow for anonymity.
Seriously, I don't see how wireless in the classroom is a bad thing. The guy playing Zelda in class would've zone out anyway. And the guys checking emails probably are getting as much out of lecture as they would've in the first place.
This isnt China. We shouldnt filter the internet.
Go watch the Family Guy if you're so in need of entertainment, and fail out like the other 40% of students who share your attitude.
You better watch out, there may be dogs about . .
I work in a high school with wireless and laptops, and it all depends on how the teacher lets the students use the laptops. We had parent-teacher conferences a few weeks ago, and on a pass around the room, I noticed that 75% of them were playing freecell or some flash/java game or listening to yahoo radio.
And certain teachers use the laptops to entertain the class, rather than to actually instruct. This is the real problem. You have educators at all levels who do not know how to effectively turn off technology in the classroom, or know when to use it.
Don't ping my cheese with your bandwidth!