Take a look at what was done for putting Linux on the IOpener. It had a 16MB Sandisk (looked like ide0) so you booted from FLASH. Very useful with web-email or IMAP. Since the power button just suspended the machine, you only lost your RAM(browser bookmarks,etc) when you unplugged the device.
This is really just one step closer to what the Linux-IOpener projects were doing. Only on mainstream systems.
The IOpener had a 16MB Flash/Sandisk on it and by loading Linux (http://jailbait.sourceforge.net) on it you had Linux booting without a harddisk(kinda).
Think about it, the BIOS gets left behind rather quickly with todays OS's. IBM, Compaq, etc needed to put special keyboard buttons to get around Microsofts license requirments. With THIS BIOS, they could have alot easier time of adding features. It's Linux after all.
How many times have you booted you home PC just to get email or surf for a little while? By brother got sick of the waste and bought a DalasSemi Tini computer(fits on a SIM card) and now he put's his Palm IIIxe on the cradle and get's email.
As it was mentioned, soon most home uses won't have to even boot their harddisk based OS.
It appears that they are targetting information appliances and other "embedded" uses for computers. I see this as being the first mainstream use of making the "dumb box" alot smarter.
I'm already running a network-aware Linux box off of a floppy (no HD), have Linux on my PDA, and Linux on 3 IOpeners, among other places. With something like aptget (or whatever that network installation feature of Debian is called) one could have a bootable machine and have it dynamically get "features" on demain.
The BIOS is already flashable today so it looks like tomorrow we'll have a much smarter box BEFORE that proprietary OS from Redmond gets booted.
Something like this could open the publics eyes as to how small and powerful Linux can be. Where do YOU want to go TOMORROW?;)
I'm aware of the "We wand OpenGL dead" line Microsoft has. OS/2 shipped with OpenGL way back in 1994 (OS/2 v3.0) and NT got it to. It was around that time that MSFT started their own 3D stuff. They only did DirectX because IBM had DIVE and showed Doom running full speed in a window on OS/2. All this was just like you said, OpenGL is not a Windows-only technology and MSFT does not own the API's. IE, they can't use them to keep the competitions applications a rev or two behind theirs.
I think it was AutoDesk bought into Microsofts "write to Win32 and have Windows AND UNIX" way back when. Bristal,Mainsoft and a couple of others were allowed to licences MSFT code to enable Win32/MFC to run compile and run on UNIX. After a few big CAD companies ported from UNIX to MFC, Microsoft pulled the rug out from under the companies providing the underlying runtimes. I think Mainsoft was the only one left standing. Their sole existance is because then needed to show in court that Bristol wasn't being targetted. Only thing was, Microsoft charged MainSoft tons for their Windows source license but turned around and paid them big bucks to port IE to Solaris and HP(?).
They are smart bastards but not technically, only business-wise. The world finally caught on that a networked computer must be peer2peer capable, secure, and robust(not crash daily). Microsoft windows is such a pig that it imploads under any reasonable load.
BTW, I think AutoDesk realized the mud they are in and started porting a bunch of stuff to JAVA. Then Microsoft pulled the JAVA rug out from under them too (requires them to install the JVM now). JAVA may not be best for all apps but it's much easier going from Java to say Qt than MFC to ANYTHING.
Looks like there's quite a self-imposed ceiling on these CAD companies and if they want to exist in 5 years, they had better get off of MFC soon. IMHO.
MFC... You're right, they ain't going anywhere but MS windows. They'll go down with them after all, I've NEVER seen Microsoft fight something as bad as they're fighting Linux. And it isn't because they didn't invent it, it's because they can't control it. Thanks for the heads-up on that other CAD companies tie to MFC.
I would think that SolidWorks would be REALLY looking at Linux now that this news is out. After all, if the Pro/E people are looking for a better cost solution isn't that what SoldWorks marketing strategy is?
They'll be on Linux in no time. IMHO.
There is VariCAD for lighter weight CAD work now. 2D and 3D.
VariCAD is the best I came across for CAD on Linux. It's got 3D and can import/export Autocad files along with exporting IGES files from it's own 3D file format.
Leagues less functional than Pro/E but the price is VERY good. I think it's around $300 now.
Look what happened with Intel brought out a optimized 32bit CPU(PentiumPro). The brand-new 16bit Windows 95 came out and flopped when run on the PPro. The tried Titanicium and it's not doing too well either. This time it's not all because standard OS's aren't advanced enough to run on it. It's huge, expensive, runs very hot, and requires all new software to run on it. Kinda does sound like the PPro. At least real 32bit OS's like Linux and OS/2 ran great on the PPro(I didn't forget about the 100,000 NT machines that were out there at the time of the PPro release).
Gawd, I wish the PREP or even the CHIRP machines took over...... Oh well, it looks like x86 is going to be around for another decade. Win-AMD has be worried though. I've not seen them quoted recenlty without mentioning Microsoft Windows and that's a "partner" who'll slice you head off if they just feel like it. Dangerous move AMD, very dangerous.
I think you are correct but also don't forget that by promoting fuel-cell technology over existing gasoline-electric hybrids, George Dubya's oil buddies don't lose any money while they figure out how to control the hydrogen stations you mention.
I think a Smart Company will develop a fuel cell power and heating plant for the home and tie that in with electric cars charged via the fuel cell. The home can still stay on the grid if they needed an extra boost every now an then.
This isn't too unlike Bill Gates putting a WiFi card in a flatpanel computer and acting like David Copperfield by walking around with it like it's magic. That capability has been built into X11 for over 10 years but it's big news when Bill finally figures out how to do it....
You are correct, this is really no big deal but it won't get on the front of eWeek either.
by the way, it must have been cool enough for you to click thru to the forum..... If you don't think a story is interesting, why not skip it?
That sounds about right. Dubinsky killed Visor sales and in one quarter Handspring went from just over 20% of the PalmOS market to below 15%. She screwed with their money flow by announcing the end of the Visor/PDA line. With the Treo not doing so well (47,000 shipped and only 13,000 sold) they NEED to build on the PDA lineup again. Had they just built Bluetooth into the 90 it would have all made sense but the current Treo 90 doesn't fit their "PLAN", or at least the one they are telling their investors.
Personally, I think they will be lucky of they make it to this time next year. Dubinsky shot both of Handsprings feet off and now they are running on bloody stubs.... Dumb move. I think the Treo is dumb too since a Bluetooth phone (no display) would be cheap and work well with a Bluetooth PDA (color or B/W). IMHO
You don't seem to know much about this. PalmSource is moving to OS5 which is ARM based but they want everyone to keep writing software for the 68k. OS5 will have mappings from the 68k to the ARM native OS5. They say the apps will run more than 2x faster on the ARM than on the current DragonBalls.
This means there is no reason to expect there being an immediate fork in the application development cycle for PalmOS apps. And all those apps will run on QPose (or atleast most will).
There's a phrase used in American history which mentions the first shot of the American Revolution was "the shot heard around the world".
The Microsoft audit policy might just be known as "the backfire heard around the world". With Linux stability, usefulness, and capabilities where they are today, there's not much stopping most public school systems from switching all their classrooms and labs to Linux. Maybe they'll need one or two with Wine or even a WinFrame system or two but it'll still be cheaper running Linux and "look ma, no more audit threats"
BANG! What a backfire.:) We just need the press to pick this up.... Dan Gilmour, CNN, USAToday, etc where are you?
That's because most people blindly get computers running Windows and this is a fact of life for them. Look at how the iPaq is even designed. It's got the reset button on the front and the whole pen tip fits in the large hole. Palm puts theirs on the back and you disassemble the pen to push it (not needed THAT often). The Sharp Zaurus with the Linux OS has the reset button inside the battery compartment on the back (again, resetting isn't THAT common).
Rebooting/resetting MS Windows is SOP. I thought that line about the Any-Key was funny while MS Windows users will think, "that's handy".;/
I too wonder exactly what this is best used for though I do wish I had one with Bluetooth. Since it seems the CDROM is in the keyboard system this would make for a great eBook/How-To reader. Think how nice it would be to take the display off your laptop and use that for reading documentation.
The fact that many PDA users want keyboards for data entry, it seems the large touch screen section itself may have only niche usefulness. You have to admit that they pack a ton in a nicely designed package.
I loved the Any-Button description: When you get a Windows blue screen telling you to hit any-key to continue, just push the Any-Key..... If they are buying their MS Windows XP license from Microsoft, that line will be gone very soon....To bad there's no Linux option listed.
At Palm Source, Handera was loaning out 330's with the Symbol 802.11 CF cards. When asked about purchasing one, they said they were thinking about selling the "used" ones for $300. He said it was $150 off the combined price soooo. Since the 330 was going for $299, that's pretty much $150 for the Symbol CF. On the Zaurus forums it's been noted that the Sybmol card is one of the best at power management.
If you're not going for the Zaurus, I'd go for the Handera. Look at it this way, you can get a folding keyboard for $40 (new) and many other Palm III/VII based peripherals work. You said you have a Palm VII right?
If you don't get rid of that Palm VII, you'll want to get THIS in-cradle charging kit for it. It's a must have for the Palm VII series. IMHO.
Competition would be great in the gaming/console market. I only hope Microsoft's anti-competition nature don't "pull a Netscape" on the PS2 and/or GameCube.
IMHO, they should not be allowed to buy gaming companies and not be allowed exclusive deals with gaming developers. There are many other things they should not be allowed to do because they are a monopoly at the OS level and should only be allowed to compete and not kill competition.
I just don't think they've EVER actually competed. It's always been that they put everything into preventing competition....
If what you say is true, this year will be an interesting one for Sony and Nintendo...
And Microsofts deep pockets allows them to keep losing money. Do you think they've made any money on WinCE yet? Remember they PAID AT&T to use WinCE in settop boxes to a tune of $5 billion and that was only one deal. The iPaq has only sold 2 million units total.
My issue with the previous posting is that Microsoft uses the monopoly money from MS Windows to fund all these other Window-ized ventures when they should have failed a long time ago. Again, the market is NOT deciding what's going on. Cash is.
By the way, I'm told the games on Xbox look good but don't play very well. The ads show the pretty ones and people don't like them when they get to playing them. PS2 and GameCube have more playable games. Again, Microsoft needs to buy out the PS2 and GameCube developers to make Xbox work.
$40 billion in cash might allow them to do this but I doubt Sony and Nintendo will stand still. IMO.
Microsoft has not done well at all in anything that they have NOT been able to leverage the Windows monopoly. The Xbox will be the same though they could pre-install MS Office and effectively start attacking their OEM's with the Xbox-PC.
Their growth rate is stalling (Linux eats large chunks of server sales) and they are spreading tenticles out all over to find another place to control. Like I said before, they have a VERY bad record outside of the Windows monopoly. IMHO.
That's right, Microsoft can afford to lose money. They are still losing money on WinCE( PocketPC2002 ) but they NEED to have that sector or MS Windows on the desktop will start losing too.
Remember, all roads lead to Windows.
I still laugh at how Microsoft paid AT&T $5 billion to use WinCE but couldn't get their TV software going so AT&T took the money and went elsewhere.
Of course $40 billion in cash lets them do this time and time again. This will hurt Sony's profits for sure.
bull. Internet Explorer was originally licensed by Spyglass. It was the Mosaic source code. Spyglass got paid for every copy sold and when Microsoft started giving it away and refused to pay Spyglass (because the wen't "selling" it) then Spyglass pulled out their contract and requested an audit of Microsofts books.
IE was not always free. It was used as a hammer to kill Netscape.
The difference here is that Microsoft can only reduce the cost of the console and can't give it away ( no precedence ). They could bundle a bunch of games and essentially give the console away but the games would have to be darn good and from what I hear, they look good but play badly.
Thanks for info, I'll check it out. Casio really doesn't get much press compared to HP and Compaq. Now that they are merging, it'll make their pocket pc's numbers stand out more but it's still small compared to PalmOS vendors. Casio must have a tiny market though it says nothing of the product.
I've heard that but not experienced it myself. I run atleast one notch down in "Front" light intensity. Because it is a frontlight and not a backlight, we must keep it turned on. When I know I'll be outside using the Z, I knock it down another notch (50%).
I'm also wondering if charging or battery hiccups aren't causing some to have very short charge life.
yup, that's one reason why I went with the Zaurus. It too has the CF slot builtin but also has a SD/MMC slot as well. The slide-out keyboard and Linux were the final hooks that got me to buy the Zaurus.
It'll be interesting to see if the HP iPaq gets builtin expansion and I applaud their Bluetooth support.
Slashdot Mirror
JAILBAIT for the Netpliance IOpener
LoB
This is really just one step closer to what the Linux-IOpener projects were doing. Only on mainstream systems.
:)
The IOpener had a 16MB Flash/Sandisk on it and by loading Linux (http://jailbait.sourceforge.net) on it you had Linux booting without a harddisk(kinda).
Think about it, the BIOS gets left behind rather quickly with todays OS's. IBM, Compaq, etc needed to put special keyboard buttons to get around Microsofts license requirments. With THIS BIOS, they could have alot easier time of adding features. It's Linux after all.
How many times have you booted you home PC just to get email or surf for a little while? By brother got sick of the waste and bought a DalasSemi Tini computer(fits on a SIM card) and now he put's his Palm IIIxe on the cradle and get's email.
As it was mentioned, soon most home uses won't have to even boot their harddisk based OS.
There's another ~1G of diskspace free.....
LoB
It appears that they are targetting information appliances and other "embedded" uses for computers. I see this as being the first mainstream use of making the "dumb box" alot smarter.
;)
I'm already running a network-aware Linux box off of a floppy (no HD), have Linux on my PDA, and Linux on 3 IOpeners, among other places. With something like aptget (or whatever that network installation feature of Debian is called) one could have a bootable machine and have it dynamically get "features" on demain.
The BIOS is already flashable today so it looks like tomorrow we'll have a much smarter box BEFORE that proprietary OS from Redmond gets booted.
Something like this could open the publics eyes as to how small and powerful Linux can be. Where do YOU want to go TOMORROW?
LoB
I'm aware of the "We wand OpenGL dead" line Microsoft has. OS/2 shipped with OpenGL way back in 1994 (OS/2 v3.0) and NT got it to. It was around that time that MSFT started their own 3D stuff. They only did DirectX because IBM had DIVE and showed Doom running full speed in a window on OS/2. All this was just like you said, OpenGL is not a Windows-only technology and MSFT does not own the API's. IE, they can't use them to keep the competitions applications a rev or two behind theirs.
I think it was AutoDesk bought into Microsofts "write to Win32 and have Windows AND UNIX" way back when. Bristal,Mainsoft and a couple of others were allowed to licences MSFT code to enable Win32/MFC to run compile and run on UNIX. After a few big CAD companies ported from UNIX to MFC, Microsoft pulled the rug out from under the companies providing the underlying runtimes. I think Mainsoft was the only one left standing. Their sole existance is because then needed to show in court that Bristol wasn't being targetted. Only thing was, Microsoft charged MainSoft tons for their Windows source license but turned around and paid them big bucks to port IE to Solaris and HP(?).
They are smart bastards but not technically, only business-wise. The world finally caught on that a networked computer must be peer2peer capable, secure, and robust(not crash daily). Microsoft windows is such a pig that it imploads under any reasonable load.
BTW, I think AutoDesk realized the mud they are in and started porting a bunch of stuff to JAVA. Then Microsoft pulled the JAVA rug out from under them too (requires them to install the JVM now). JAVA may not be best for all apps but it's much easier going from Java to say Qt than MFC to ANYTHING.
Looks like there's quite a self-imposed ceiling on these CAD companies and if they want to exist in 5 years, they had better get off of MFC soon. IMHO.
LoB
MFC... You're right, they ain't going anywhere but MS windows. They'll go down with them after all, I've NEVER seen Microsoft fight something as bad as they're fighting Linux. And it isn't because they didn't invent it, it's because they can't control it. Thanks for the heads-up on that other CAD companies tie to MFC.
LoB
I would think that SolidWorks would be REALLY looking at Linux now that this news is out. After all, if the Pro/E people are looking for a better cost solution isn't that what SoldWorks marketing strategy is?
They'll be on Linux in no time. IMHO.
There is VariCAD for lighter weight CAD work now. 2D and 3D.
LoB
Leagues less functional than Pro/E but the price is VERY good. I think it's around $300 now.
VariCad web site
This Pro/E announcement is awesome news though....
LoB
Look what happened with Intel brought out a optimized 32bit CPU(PentiumPro). The brand-new 16bit Windows 95 came out and flopped when run on the PPro. The tried Titanicium and it's not doing too well either. This time it's not all because standard OS's aren't advanced enough to run on it. It's huge, expensive, runs very hot, and requires all new software to run on it. Kinda does sound like the PPro. At least real 32bit OS's like Linux and OS/2 ran great on the PPro(I didn't forget about the 100,000 NT machines that were out there at the time of the PPro release).
Gawd, I wish the PREP or even the CHIRP machines took over...... Oh well, it looks like x86 is going to be around for another decade. Win-AMD has be worried though. I've not seen them quoted recenlty without mentioning Microsoft Windows and that's a "partner" who'll slice you head off if they just feel like it. Dangerous move AMD, very dangerous.
LoB
I think you are correct but also don't forget that by promoting fuel-cell technology over existing gasoline-electric hybrids, George Dubya's oil buddies don't lose any money while they figure out how to control the hydrogen stations you mention.
I think a Smart Company will develop a fuel cell power and heating plant for the home and tie that in with electric cars charged via the fuel cell. The home can still stay on the grid if they needed an extra boost every now an then.
LoB
This isn't too unlike Bill Gates putting a WiFi card in a flatpanel computer and acting like David Copperfield by walking around with it like it's magic. That capability has been built into X11 for over 10 years but it's big news when Bill finally figures out how to do it....
You are correct, this is really no big deal but it won't get on the front of eWeek either.
by the way, it must have been cool enough for you to click thru to the forum..... If you don't think a story is interesting, why not skip it?
LoB
That sounds about right. Dubinsky killed Visor sales and in one quarter Handspring went from just over 20% of the PalmOS market to below 15%. She screwed with their money flow by announcing the end of the Visor/PDA line. With the Treo not doing so well (47,000 shipped and only 13,000 sold) they NEED to build on the PDA lineup again. Had they just built Bluetooth into the 90 it would have all made sense but the current Treo 90 doesn't fit their "PLAN", or at least the one they are telling their investors.
Personally, I think they will be lucky of they make it to this time next year. Dubinsky shot both of Handsprings feet off and now they are running on bloody stubs.... Dumb move. I think the Treo is dumb too since a Bluetooth phone (no display) would be cheap and work well with a Bluetooth PDA (color or B/W). IMHO
LoB
You don't seem to know much about this. PalmSource is moving to OS5 which is ARM based but they want everyone to keep writing software for the 68k. OS5 will have mappings from the 68k to the ARM native OS5. They say the apps will run more than 2x faster on the ARM than on the current DragonBalls.
This means there is no reason to expect there being an immediate fork in the application development cycle for PalmOS apps. And all those apps will run on QPose (or atleast most will).
LoB
There's a phrase used in American history which mentions the first shot of the American Revolution was "the shot heard around the world".
:) We just need the press to pick this up.... Dan Gilmour, CNN, USAToday, etc where are you?
The Microsoft audit policy might just be known as "the backfire heard around the world". With Linux stability, usefulness, and capabilities where they are today, there's not much stopping most public school systems from switching all their classrooms and labs to Linux. Maybe they'll need one or two with Wine or even a WinFrame system or two but it'll still be cheaper running Linux and "look ma, no more audit threats"
BANG! What a backfire.
LoB
But they won't port to Linux and it supposedly doesn't run under Wine....
LoB
That's because most people blindly get computers running Windows and this is a fact of life for them. Look at how the iPaq is even designed. It's got the reset button on the front and the whole pen tip fits in the large hole. Palm puts theirs on the back and you disassemble the pen to push it (not needed THAT often). The Sharp Zaurus with the Linux OS has the reset button inside the battery compartment on the back (again, resetting isn't THAT common).
;/
Rebooting/resetting MS Windows is SOP. I thought that line about the Any-Key was funny while MS Windows users will think, "that's handy".
LoB
I too wonder exactly what this is best used for though I do wish I had one with Bluetooth. Since it seems the CDROM is in the keyboard system this would make for a great eBook/How-To reader. Think how nice it would be to take the display off your laptop and use that for reading documentation.
The fact that many PDA users want keyboards for data entry, it seems the large touch screen section itself may have only niche usefulness. You have to admit that they pack a ton in a nicely designed package.
I loved the Any-Button description: When you get a Windows blue screen telling you to hit any-key to continue, just push the Any-Key..... If they are buying their MS Windows XP license from Microsoft, that line will be gone very soon....To bad there's no Linux option listed.
LoB
If you're not going for the Zaurus, I'd go for the Handera. Look at it this way, you can get a folding keyboard for $40 (new) and many other Palm III/VII based peripherals work. You said you have a Palm VII right?
If you don't get rid of that Palm VII, you'll want to get THIS in-cradle charging kit for it. It's a must have for the Palm VII series. IMHO.
Lob
Competition would be great in the gaming/console market. I only hope Microsoft's anti-competition nature don't "pull a Netscape" on the PS2 and/or GameCube.
IMHO, they should not be allowed to buy gaming companies and not be allowed exclusive deals with gaming developers. There are many other things they should not be allowed to do because they are a monopoly at the OS level and should only be allowed to compete and not kill competition.
I just don't think they've EVER actually competed. It's always been that they put everything into preventing competition....
If what you say is true, this year will be an interesting one for Sony and Nintendo...
LoB
And Microsofts deep pockets allows them to keep losing money. Do you think they've made any money on WinCE yet? Remember they PAID AT&T to use WinCE in settop boxes to a tune of $5 billion and that was only one deal. The iPaq has only sold 2 million units total.
My issue with the previous posting is that Microsoft uses the monopoly money from MS Windows to fund all these other Window-ized ventures when they should have failed a long time ago. Again, the market is NOT deciding what's going on. Cash is.
By the way, I'm told the games on Xbox look good but don't play very well. The ads show the pretty ones and people don't like them when they get to playing them. PS2 and GameCube have more playable games. Again, Microsoft needs to buy out the PS2 and GameCube developers to make Xbox work.
$40 billion in cash might allow them to do this but I doubt Sony and Nintendo will stand still.
IMO.
LoB
Microsoft has not done well at all in anything that they have NOT been able to leverage the Windows monopoly. The Xbox will be the same though they could pre-install MS Office and effectively start attacking their OEM's with the Xbox-PC.
Their growth rate is stalling (Linux eats large chunks of server sales) and they are spreading tenticles out all over to find another place to control. Like I said before, they have a VERY bad record outside of the Windows monopoly. IMHO.
LoB
That's right, Microsoft can afford to lose money. They are still losing money on WinCE( PocketPC2002 ) but they NEED to have that sector or MS Windows on the desktop will start losing too.
Remember, all roads lead to Windows.
I still laugh at how Microsoft paid AT&T $5 billion to use WinCE but couldn't get their TV software going so AT&T took the money and went elsewhere.
Of course $40 billion in cash lets them do this time and time again. This will hurt Sony's profits for sure.
IMHO
LoB
bull. Internet Explorer was originally licensed by Spyglass. It was the Mosaic source code. Spyglass got paid for every copy sold and when Microsoft started giving it away and refused to pay Spyglass (because the wen't "selling" it) then Spyglass pulled out their contract and requested an audit of Microsofts books.
IE was not always free. It was used as a hammer to kill Netscape.
The difference here is that Microsoft can only reduce the cost of the console and can't give it away ( no precedence ). They could bundle a bunch of games and essentially give the console away but the games would have to be darn good and from what I hear, they look good but play badly.
LoB
Thanks for info, I'll check it out. Casio really doesn't get much press compared to HP and Compaq. Now that they are merging, it'll make their pocket pc's numbers stand out more but it's still small compared to PalmOS vendors. Casio must have a tiny market though it says nothing of the product.
LoB
I've heard that but not experienced it myself. I run atleast one notch down in "Front" light intensity. Because it is a frontlight and not a backlight, we must keep it turned on. When I know I'll be outside using the Z, I knock it down another notch (50%).
I'm also wondering if charging or battery hiccups aren't causing some to have very short charge life.
LoB
yup, that's one reason why I went with the Zaurus. It too has the CF slot builtin but also has a SD/MMC slot as well. The slide-out keyboard and Linux were the final hooks that got me to buy the Zaurus.
It'll be interesting to see if the HP iPaq gets builtin expansion and I applaud their Bluetooth support.
LoB