You don't work for a school system do you. My initial post was probably a bit cheeky, but in the end be comforted by the knowledge that everything is really very above board and that I'm doing this because my curriculum calls for me to do certain things that the general population of student would not need to to do. You're technically correct but your advice is practically useless.
You know, this could be the most ideal time in history to start a publishing company. If you assume (rightly) that most of the current publishing houses are going to restrict use of the scanned books to the point of uselessness thus minimizing the opportunity for Google to indirectly sell some treeware then it stands to reason that a new company that isn't being lead by dinosaurs could seriously take advantage of the opportunity to sell much more treeware just by letting Google have at it.
The riaa and mpaa never did seem to get it, and it seems like the publishing companies are going to miss it too which is really good news for a start up.... how much for a printing press operation these days?
Dude I understand your point completely but please lay off the religious attacks okay? If you're trying to be funny then please be funny when the topic is religion, intelligent design or something. I don't mean to vent on you but between Intelligent Design and Microsoft Patent Buffaws I'm really getting burned out on it.
Ha ha... those folks have been at there job a long long time. It's typical government employment. I overheard one of them claim to still be using gopher the other day. Personally I think that, like most spawn of Evil they are immortal, and I should probably try exorcism first.
In the US, or at least the school district I teach in there is tremendous resistance to anything that isn't blessed by the Gods of Redmond. I teach with Ubuntu in the classroom and I am forever getting snide remarks about it. They've even asked me not to put the machines on the network for what they claim are security reasons as if they actually don't want any secure machines on the lan or something. I put the machines behind a router and have safely hidden my enclave of FLOSS goodness. The problem I have with homogeneous networks is that the kids I'm teaching now will probably never see one in real life because in real life there is a mix of *nix and Windows out there and they need those integration skills badly. If anyone knows a way to convince lifetime IT employees at a school district of anything please let me know because these guys and gals are stuck in 1997 and they aren't willing to let it go.
that seeks to maintain the position of power. Politicians are always the quintessential example aren't they? Republicans in office seek to hold power just as the Democrats will do. In 1991 MS was hardly the dominant empire they are today and when the next Great Thing (tm) comes along they will do what previous entrenched powers have done. They sue. I say we get an amendment to some bill that changes our National Anthem's last line to "or the land of the free and the home of the litigious and overly patented". It doesn't rhyme.
and along with it were other entertaining geek oriented articles such as:
"iPhone battery will last.023% longer than equivalent Nokia N95 battery" "Vista successfully installed printer driver" "Scientists in Norway discover that the sun rises each and every Tuesday." "iPhone cures herpes." "$company is forming a patent pact with Microsoft" "iPhone violates 221 Microsoft patents" "In Soviet Russia iPhone orders Calamari FOR you" "1337 H4XZ0R creates a beowulf cluster of iPhones running Ubuntu using his Wii Wifi"
You're exactly correct. They are so closely related (the clickwrap and EULA) that a scenario where this ruling also applies to certain operating systems is not out of the question. IANAL
Destroy it for Corp use? You might be onto something but I have a different take.
Corporations that are using Linux are generally already using vendor supplied OSes such as RHEL. I suspect that MS is more concerned about Linux in the consumer market right now than the Enterprise and here is why. Vista is not an upgrade option for many of the PCs that are still quite new, and the anti-piracy measures in Vista are sincere enough that casual copying won't happen either. This leaves Joe Six-Pack (free as in beer) little option when he turns to his 17 year old neighbor for advice. Now, the free versions that are out there aren't as polished and may not have corporate support attached. The OEMs (read Dell and maybe more) are likely only to consider versions of Linux that also are corporately polished or at least appear to be so (read Ubuntu).
MS knows that at least for the next few years few if any enterprise customers are willing to try Linux on their workstations but I don't believe that MS is as confident when it comes to the consumer space. Dell already offers about $80 discounts for Ubuntu.
In all of these deals it appears that MS is willing to spend $ to get the deals pushed through. A company in a superior negotiating position rarely offers to make a deal like this profitable to the supposed infringer yet that is exactly what MS is doing. I believe that MS is moving to prevent OEMs from pushing into consumer space without Microsoft getting at least a portion of the action. Vista isn't exactly perceived the way '95 was and they know it. They also know that Linux is rapidly approaching usability standards that would equate with Windows 98 (no flame here please it's the truth). Since pirating Vista is difficult they want to make sure that any increase in sales direct to consumers will at least toss a few dollars in Microsofts direction. This continued strategy from MS strikes me as a strategy born of panic and worry not a strategy born of superior technical or legal position. This battle isn't for the business desktop it's for the consumer desktop and this whole business desktop argument is smoke and mirrors.
The reason Apple is opening up to third party developers is that Apple does want to retain whatever control they can over the platform. The iPhone will be opened up anyway whether it's some very skilled h4x70r or a professional is the only difference. By releasing a dev kit (they'll all but have to) they can retain a modicum of control over what is developed and how it will be deployed. This isn't to say that there won't be hacks available but at least whatever useful programs are written will be part of the Apple marketplace and not something from the evil tubes that they had no input or control over.
I heartily disagree. The "experts" or at least the vocal media attracting ones also claim that CO2 is causal in climate change and factually it isn't. CO2 increases as a result of warming temps it does not cause warming temps. Dollars to donuts that those "experts" want to make a point and will sometimes do so at the cost of the truth. I willingly acknowledge that the other side of the argument will also do this. When it comes to media science trust no one.
Europe as a whole has a declining population. Typically a nation has to have a birth rate of 2.1 children per woman in order to sustain it's population. Europe's number of births per woman in 2004 was 1.45 while the United States has actually managed an average of 2.09 births per woman.
I wouldn't readily accept that policy alone accounts for differences in a regions rate of pollution as much as there are gradually fewer and fewer people that are engaging in pollution causing activities. I'm not discounting the influence of policy but I would like to suggest that any analysis of the situation should take into account declining population.... especially in the middle and upper classes of the region.
This article http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sub-replacement_ferti lity should suffice for anyone wanting more information.
It's been well acknowledged here that Vista sales are roughly only equal to XP over the same time measured. OEMs were already standardized on 1GB (not low end of the market) of ram prior to Vista and Vista does run adequately on a GB of ram. What did they think would happen? Most of the PC market has been riding the MS/PC roller coaster long enough to have a feel for the time to buy and will likely hold on to XP until mainstream support has ended.
The only company that hasn't barfed all over my sugar coated Linux puffs is fscking Dairy Queen. I'm beginning to think it's us - the guys with Tux toys on our desks... err I heard... WE are the people that just seem to like to find fault and complain. Who cares if Novell shares documentation or toilet paper with Microsoft. I just want to enjoy compiling drivers again for X because of the eleventh kernel update this week. Why do I have to be bombarded with yet another theoretical bad news story about my beloved OS? I'm going to stick my head in the sand now and not worry if Microsoft understands how to run Suse virtually or whatever, hell I hope they learn something about how to run virtual hardware because Virtual PC sucks.
Palm is appealing to the TX / Lifedrive owner with this thing far more than they would appeal to the Treo owner. People that own smartphones own them because they want a PHONE that is hybridized with PDA features. People that own the traditional PDA's own them because they really do not want to carry a laptop and see their phone as just that, a phone. I'm in the latter group with my TX in hand. I carry a laptop when I need to get anything more than basic work done, but I use the TX for light office file work and for email. So having turned on my fanboy tag I have to admit that I watched the webcast of the rollout and I'm looking forward to trying one of these out. The screen of the TX is the only thing that has kept me from replacing my laptop and now the problem might finally be addressed Dataviz products do better with Office formats than MS Mobile does IMHO, and if the utility, look, and feel, are well executed I'm sold on the idea!
Who is making much ado about anything? I want an alternative. I'm getting that alternative. IBM PC's had less than one percent of the overall computing market at one time (http://arstechnica.com/articles/culture/total-sha re.ars/4). Who cares what companies offer similar products to what Dell will offer. I said I'd buy one and I will. I was arguing against the troll mod because I thought it was unfair. I hope I see that mod when I get the next metamod link.
Re:But will they be cheaper?
on
Dell Linux Details
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· Score: 2, Interesting
Sorry that you were modded troll. I don't think that you're trolling at all. Dell doesn't expect more than one percent yet they are still doing it. There once was a time when MS or Novell had "1%", there was a time when Commodore owned the home computer market. If Dell uses wisdom, and savvy here they stand a chance of being at the forefront of an emerging market instead of being the dude kicking the dead horse. Dell won't have to support Ubuntu if the community does it, and having used Ubuntu's forum and launchpad, I can tell you first hand that the quality of support there is often higher than I've seen on Technet and it certainly is easier to read.
Dell I suspect is looking for exactly "1%" not looking for a market crusher. Wal-Mart failed because most anyone that buys a computer from Wal-Mart is the type of person that answers "Windows" when you ask them what kind of computer they have. Wal-Mart was a marketing mistake because they do not actually market products they market prices.
Codec schmodec. Anyone buying Feisty preloaded already knows what to do right now. This will not be true forever but it is true now. I wouldn't blame Dell for not buying the licenses. First they have no idea whether or not those laptops will sell and second they are trusting the community to show them the way. When they sell laptops they will invest but not so much in the initial offering. I just want working hardware out of the box. I'll take care of the codecs, and besides when CNR is integrated codecs will not be an issue and they will be legal.
Come on guys & gals, let's not throw the baby out with the bathwater.
Re:But will they be cheaper?
on
Dell Linux Details
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· Score: 5, Insightful
I'm suffering from Multiple Personality Disorder on the idea that the Linux laptop should be cheaper. On one hand it is financially cheaper for Dell to offer the machines without Windows. On the other hand Dell is probably offering more of a value to most people by vetting the hardware against the software before delivery.
Some of us have had the joy of getting wireless or sound working over the course of a week. Heaven help anyone trying to get power management on a laptop working well. I'm typing this on a 30 day old Acer and what power management I have working is a gross and inelegant hack. I jumped on ideastorm like a couple of other people did and said my peace. Having done that I intend to sell this laptop on craigslist, and buy a Dell preloaded with Feisty and I will pay the difference if I need to. I have the sneaking suspicion that most of the posts on ideastorm are "me too" posts or kids wanting to feel 1337. I hope I'm wrong. I hope that most of the posters are willing to put their money where their mouth is. I believe that having Dell add the value of making a good laptop with a great (and hardware vetted) OS will be worth what they ask. I feel a little naive for suggesting that Linux folks should trust Dell but Dell just might actually price their laptop fairly and I for one will pay for easy Feisty goodness. Look at System76, they sell Ubuntu preloaded and I can promise that they will never be the lower cost option.
Bicycle and a generator? This might work if you are stranded on an uncharted desert isle with a professor to set things up and a couple of hot actresses to make innovative dishes from coconuts. That one hundred dollar pc would turn into a six hundred dollar pc really quick when you add a new Schwinn bike and a generator to it and without the Professor around to fix things when they broke how long would they last?
If Hilf has a point it isn't a very sharp one and it is strategically poor for MS to adopt his mindset. There are no fewer hobby developers involved than there have been, and I'd not hesitate to guess that there may be more of them now than the pre-corporate Linux community offered. What I believe is misplaced is his insistence that FOSS is dead because of corporate contribution to FOSS. His argument is substantively the same as saying that because some companies contribute to charities for the poor that charity itself is dead. There are companies that actually hire people to direct charitable giving, heck even MS has Barbara Dingfield to direct their community affairs! They just don't get it. I really want to admire a company that has created more wealth than any in the history of the world but when they spout of crud like Hilf and the aforementioned 235 patents and do it without offering one single shred of evidence I just can't bring myself to do it. SC... errr Microsoft is just silly.
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You don't work for a school system do you. My initial post was probably a bit cheeky, but in the end be comforted by the knowledge that everything is really very above board and that I'm doing this because my curriculum calls for me to do certain things that the general population of student would not need to to do. You're technically correct but your advice is practically useless.
You know, this could be the most ideal time in history to start a publishing company. If you assume (rightly) that most of the current publishing houses are going to restrict use of the scanned books to the point of uselessness thus minimizing the opportunity for Google to indirectly sell some treeware then it stands to reason that a new company that isn't being lead by dinosaurs could seriously take advantage of the opportunity to sell much more treeware just by letting Google have at it.
The riaa and mpaa never did seem to get it, and it seems like the publishing companies are going to miss it too which is really good news for a start up.... how much for a printing press operation these days?
Dude I understand your point completely but please lay off the religious attacks okay? If you're trying to be funny then please be funny when the topic is religion, intelligent design or something. I don't mean to vent on you but between Intelligent Design and Microsoft Patent Buffaws I'm really getting burned out on it.
Ha ha... those folks have been at there job a long long time. It's typical government employment. I overheard one of them claim to still be using gopher the other day. Personally I think that, like most spawn of Evil they are immortal, and I should probably try exorcism first.
In the US, or at least the school district I teach in there is tremendous resistance to anything that isn't blessed by the Gods of Redmond. I teach with Ubuntu in the classroom and I am forever getting snide remarks about it. They've even asked me not to put the machines on the network for what they claim are security reasons as if they actually don't want any secure machines on the lan or something. I put the machines behind a router and have safely hidden my enclave of FLOSS goodness. The problem I have with homogeneous networks is that the kids I'm teaching now will probably never see one in real life because in real life there is a mix of *nix and Windows out there and they need those integration skills badly. If anyone knows a way to convince lifetime IT employees at a school district of anything please let me know because these guys and gals are stuck in 1997 and they aren't willing to let it go.
that seeks to maintain the position of power. Politicians are always the quintessential example aren't they? Republicans in office seek to hold power just as the Democrats will do. In 1991 MS was hardly the dominant empire they are today and when the next Great Thing (tm) comes along they will do what previous entrenched powers have done. They sue. I say we get an amendment to some bill that changes our National Anthem's last line to "or the land of the free and the home of the litigious and overly patented". It doesn't rhyme.
and along with it were other entertaining geek oriented articles such as:
.023% longer than equivalent Nokia N95 battery"
"iPhone battery will last
"Vista successfully installed printer driver"
"Scientists in Norway discover that the sun rises each and every Tuesday."
"iPhone cures herpes."
"$company is forming a patent pact with Microsoft"
"iPhone violates 221 Microsoft patents"
"In Soviet Russia iPhone orders Calamari FOR you"
"1337 H4XZ0R creates a beowulf cluster of iPhones running Ubuntu using his Wii Wifi"
Slow news night.
You're exactly correct. They are so closely related (the clickwrap and EULA) that a scenario where this ruling also applies to certain operating systems is not out of the question. IANAL
Destroy it for Corp use? You might be onto something but I have a different take.
Corporations that are using Linux are generally already using vendor supplied OSes such as RHEL. I suspect that MS is more concerned about Linux in the consumer market right now than the Enterprise and here is why. Vista is not an upgrade option for many of the PCs that are still quite new, and the anti-piracy measures in Vista are sincere enough that casual copying won't happen either. This leaves Joe Six-Pack (free as in beer) little option when he turns to his 17 year old neighbor for advice. Now, the free versions that are out there aren't as polished and may not have corporate support attached. The OEMs (read Dell and maybe more) are likely only to consider versions of Linux that also are corporately polished or at least appear to be so (read Ubuntu).
MS knows that at least for the next few years few if any enterprise customers are willing to try Linux on their workstations but I don't believe that MS is as confident when it comes to the consumer space. Dell already offers about $80 discounts for Ubuntu.
In all of these deals it appears that MS is willing to spend $ to get the deals pushed through. A company in a superior negotiating position rarely offers to make a deal like this profitable to the supposed infringer yet that is exactly what MS is doing. I believe that MS is moving to prevent OEMs from pushing into consumer space without Microsoft getting at least a portion of the action. Vista isn't exactly perceived the way '95 was and they know it. They also know that Linux is rapidly approaching usability standards that would equate with Windows 98 (no flame here please it's the truth). Since pirating Vista is difficult they want to make sure that any increase in sales direct to consumers will at least toss a few dollars in Microsofts direction. This continued strategy from MS strikes me as a strategy born of panic and worry not a strategy born of superior technical or legal position. This battle isn't for the business desktop it's for the consumer desktop and this whole business desktop argument is smoke and mirrors.
The reason Apple is opening up to third party developers is that Apple does want to retain whatever control they can over the platform. The iPhone will be opened up anyway whether it's some very skilled h4x70r or a professional is the only difference. By releasing a dev kit (they'll all but have to) they can retain a modicum of control over what is developed and how it will be deployed. This isn't to say that there won't be hacks available but at least whatever useful programs are written will be part of the Apple marketplace and not something from the evil tubes that they had no input or control over.
I heartily disagree. The "experts" or at least the vocal media attracting ones also claim that CO2 is causal in climate change and factually it isn't. CO2 increases as a result of warming temps it does not cause warming temps. Dollars to donuts that those "experts" want to make a point and will sometimes do so at the cost of the truth. I willingly acknowledge that the other side of the argument will also do this. When it comes to media science trust no one.
No charge if iPhone is in the first three sentences :-)
Europe as a whole has a declining population. Typically a nation has to have a birth rate of 2.1 children per woman in order to sustain it's population. Europe's number of births per woman in 2004 was 1.45 while the United States has actually managed an average of 2.09 births per woman.
i lity should suffice for anyone wanting more information.
I wouldn't readily accept that policy alone accounts for differences in a regions rate of pollution as much as there are gradually fewer and fewer people that are engaging in pollution causing activities. I'm not discounting the influence of policy but I would like to suggest that any analysis of the situation should take into account declining population.... especially in the middle and upper classes of the region.
This article http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sub-replacement_fert
It's been well acknowledged here that Vista sales are roughly only equal to XP over the same time measured. OEMs were already standardized on 1GB (not low end of the market) of ram prior to Vista and Vista does run adequately on a GB of ram. What did they think would happen? Most of the PC market has been riding the MS/PC roller coaster long enough to have a feel for the time to buy and will likely hold on to XP until mainstream support has ended.
Show of hands please... how many of you can't get up from your desk when your mom calls from upstairs now because you would feel "creepy"?
The only company that hasn't barfed all over my sugar coated Linux puffs is fscking Dairy Queen. I'm beginning to think it's us - the guys with Tux toys on our desks ... err I heard... WE are the people that just seem to like to find fault and complain. Who cares if Novell shares documentation or toilet paper with Microsoft. I just want to enjoy compiling drivers again for X because of the eleventh kernel update this week. Why do I have to be bombarded with yet another theoretical bad news story about my beloved OS? I'm going to stick my head in the sand now and not worry if Microsoft understands how to run Suse virtually or whatever, hell I hope they learn something about how to run virtual hardware because Virtual PC sucks.
Palm is appealing to the TX / Lifedrive owner with this thing far more than they would appeal to the Treo owner. People that own smartphones own them because they want a PHONE that is hybridized with PDA features. People that own the traditional PDA's own them because they really do not want to carry a laptop and see their phone as just that, a phone. I'm in the latter group with my TX in hand. I carry a laptop when I need to get anything more than basic work done, but I use the TX for light office file work and for email. So having turned on my fanboy tag I have to admit that I watched the webcast of the rollout and I'm looking forward to trying one of these out. The screen of the TX is the only thing that has kept me from replacing my laptop and now the problem might finally be addressed Dataviz products do better with Office formats than MS Mobile does IMHO, and if the utility, look, and feel, are well executed I'm sold on the idea!
Who is making much ado about anything? I want an alternative. I'm getting that alternative. IBM PC's had less than one percent of the overall computing market at one time (http://arstechnica.com/articles/culture/total-sha re.ars/4). Who cares what companies offer similar products to what Dell will offer. I said I'd buy one and I will. I was arguing against the troll mod because I thought it was unfair. I hope I see that mod when I get the next metamod link.
Sorry that you were modded troll. I don't think that you're trolling at all. Dell doesn't expect more than one percent yet they are still doing it. There once was a time when MS or Novell had "1%", there was a time when Commodore owned the home computer market. If Dell uses wisdom, and savvy here they stand a chance of being at the forefront of an emerging market instead of being the dude kicking the dead horse. Dell won't have to support Ubuntu if the community does it, and having used Ubuntu's forum and launchpad, I can tell you first hand that the quality of support there is often higher than I've seen on Technet and it certainly is easier to read.
Dell I suspect is looking for exactly "1%" not looking for a market crusher. Wal-Mart failed because most anyone that buys a computer from Wal-Mart is the type of person that answers "Windows" when you ask them what kind of computer they have. Wal-Mart was a marketing mistake because they do not actually market products they market prices.
Codec schmodec. Anyone buying Feisty preloaded already knows what to do right now. This will not be true forever but it is true now. I wouldn't blame Dell for not buying the licenses. First they have no idea whether or not those laptops will sell and second they are trusting the community to show them the way. When they sell laptops they will invest but not so much in the initial offering. I just want working hardware out of the box. I'll take care of the codecs, and besides when CNR is integrated codecs will not be an issue and they will be legal.
Come on guys & gals, let's not throw the baby out with the bathwater.
I'm suffering from Multiple Personality Disorder on the idea that the Linux laptop should be cheaper. On one hand it is financially cheaper for Dell to offer the machines without Windows. On the other hand Dell is probably offering more of a value to most people by vetting the hardware against the software before delivery.
Some of us have had the joy of getting wireless or sound working over the course of a week. Heaven help anyone trying to get power management on a laptop working well. I'm typing this on a 30 day old Acer and what power management I have working is a gross and inelegant hack. I jumped on ideastorm like a couple of other people did and said my peace. Having done that I intend to sell this laptop on craigslist, and buy a Dell preloaded with Feisty and I will pay the difference if I need to. I have the sneaking suspicion that most of the posts on ideastorm are "me too" posts or kids wanting to feel 1337. I hope I'm wrong. I hope that most of the posters are willing to put their money where their mouth is. I believe that having Dell add the value of making a good laptop with a great (and hardware vetted) OS will be worth what they ask. I feel a little naive for suggesting that Linux folks should trust Dell but Dell just might actually price their laptop fairly and I for one will pay for easy Feisty goodness. Look at System76, they sell Ubuntu preloaded and I can promise that they will never be the lower cost option.
Bicycle and a generator? This might work if you are stranded on an uncharted desert isle with a professor to set things up and a couple of hot actresses to make innovative dishes from coconuts. That one hundred dollar pc would turn into a six hundred dollar pc really quick when you add a new Schwinn bike and a generator to it and without the Professor around to fix things when they broke how long would they last?
and trying out my best Scottish accent... Computer..... Computer......
Has ANYONE gotten this to work on System 6 for the Mac yet?
of the profits.... I downloaded Feisty a month ago and I say that Microsoft should get 30% of what Canonical charged me for it.
If Hilf has a point it isn't a very sharp one and it is strategically poor for MS to adopt his mindset. There are no fewer hobby developers involved than there have been, and I'd not hesitate to guess that there may be more of them now than the pre-corporate Linux community offered. What I believe is misplaced is his insistence that FOSS is dead because of corporate contribution to FOSS. His argument is substantively the same as saying that because some companies contribute to charities for the poor that charity itself is dead. There are companies that actually hire people to direct charitable giving, heck even MS has Barbara Dingfield to direct their community affairs! They just don't get it. I really want to admire a company that has created more wealth than any in the history of the world but when they spout of crud like Hilf and the aforementioned 235 patents and do it without offering one single shred of evidence I just can't bring myself to do it. SC... errr Microsoft is just silly.