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Microsoft and LG Electronics Sign Linux Covenant
rs232 wrote with a PC World link discussing another alliance between Microsoft and a vendor via Linux. The vendor this time around is electronics maker LG, and marks the fifth company to license unspecified patents relating to Linux or Linux devices from the OS giant. "'This agreement is focused only on exchange of patent rights,' said David Kaefer, general manager of IP licensing at Microsoft. 'The open-source elements of the deal do utilize a covenant model similar to the Xandros and Novell deals, but this deal is most similar to recent agreements with Samsung and Fuji Xerox.' Those deals were signed this year in April and March, respectively. Both covered general access to intellectual property contained in patent portfolios and included protection for customers using Linux-based software."
they might as well just start folding their money into paper airplanes and throw em into Redmond
Be prepared to see more and more of this sort of thing.
Embrace, extend and extinguish
When will the USDOJ step in and put a stop to this? Probably never.
Goodbye GNU/Linux. I loved you, while you lasted.
Why do I keep seeing headlines about companies signing patent deals with a company who said that Linux infringes on exactly 225 of their patents, but doesn't know which ones? Why are companies signing patent deals with a company to protect them from patents without knowing what they are? This is sounding like SCO -vs- IBM 2.0, but even more bizarre. What the heck is going on?
When Microsoft came for Novel,
I remained silent;
I did not use OpenSUSE.
When they locked Xandros into a deal,
I remained silent;
I did not use their software either.
When they came for LG Electronics,
I did not speak out;
As I did not think it meant anything.
And finally when the suits came for Ubuntu,
there was no one left to speak out.
Embrace, Extend, Destroy.
From TFA: As part of the deal, Microsoft will have access to LG patents that cover computer architecture utilized in game consoles and other products and will license other LG patents that are owned by system integrator MicroConnect Group, which is based in Manchester, England.
So Microsoft 'owns' LG now, and what does LG get? A lot of hot air, it seems to me.
-- Cheers!
What on Earth are you doing on Slashdot?
Maybe software pirates as a whole should get MS to sign a deal with them to not sue over distribution of pirated software and to provide protection to those they serve it too.
Though there is no apparent way to be sure, I would presume that these companies have access to more information than the general public. Otherwise, it would not make sense that so many (and probably more soon) would enter into this kind of a agreement with MS. Either that, or the agreement was discussed and possibly agreed upon in some form before this invisible-patent-waving became an issue.
After all, how many billion dollars did MS spend to make Windows XP and Vista the best operating systems this universe has ever seen? And some people thought they could just go and steal everything without having Microsoft fight back?
235 patents.
I say again: 235 patents.
Considering how rock solid Windows has been since Windows 2000, and that Linux is still a little flaky, I'm guessing the kernel developers didn't have access to the stability patents by Microsoft.
Well, I'm really only surprised that LG didnt just license Windows instead and be rid of all the issues at once.
Linux violates 235 Microsoft patents.
Power has been the same from ancient Rome to Jesse Jackson to the Mafia - They leverage power, make certain demands, stated either subtly or outright, and you either pay their tributes and taxes or something bad happens to you.
try { do() || do_not(); } catch (JediException err) { yoda(err); }
go read the deals themselves. Ignore the headlines and read the friggin deals.
Novel pays MSFT $100 odd million. MSFT pays novel $240 million.
Novell nets $140 million dollars, and MSFT literally spews FUD, when MSFT did the paying.
Xandros and LG are just cashing in on the deal. Not for Linux's sake but for free money from MSFT.
i thought once I was found, but it was only a dream.
Hi! I think you're on the wrong site. I believe you are looking for digg.
My blog
WTF is Linuzzz?
General Relativity: Space-time tells matter where to go; Matter tells space-time what shape to be.
Appended to the end of comments you post. 120 chars.
Update it's desktop?! It's already better than what M$ has to offer!
Plus it's more flexible, with all the desktops available.
You can have a skinny light weight desktop like XFCE, or a heavy feature rich one like KDE
or GNOME with the Beyrl Window manager which rivals Vista's Aero.
Shameless plug alert: Game server control panel
They're not the Nazis.
You cheapen the deaths of the millions murdered by the Nazis by equating, however approximately, the patent deals struck by a software company with the deportation of people to death camps.
Fuck you.
Their plasma panels are running linux. Will they have to kiss microsoft's ass too?
Down with software religiosity, damn it!
It's time to realise that Abble's products are the biggest abomination these days. Just say NO to the dumb iAbble way!!
It's kinda like the girls we slashdotters chase after - no matter how hard we try they're NEVER going to embrace us. Sure, we might get mixed signals from a couple but it's nothing serious.
Why chase girls? Why chase anyone?
If I am expected to have someone in my life who will encourage me in my persuits, console me in my failures, entertain me in my boredom, and get me off....why shouldn't that person be me? I mean, after all, I *can* do all of those things myself, and it is a whole lot cheaper that way.
What's that about letting the sex drive dominate one's most important decisions? Sounds to me like slavery to an addiction. I require more freedom than that.
If you self-actualize by raising children then I can see the need for "chasing" potential mates. Beyond that, who needs relationships?
Can anyone explain WTF is really going on? I mean it seems like every day in recent days M$ is buying another Linux vendor. When and don't quote me, but didn't they say a year or years back perhaps that Linux was not a threat? But what does "embracing" Linux say (I say that loosely as I don't know their intentions) about M$ when they were not threatened nor interested in Linux but dropping all this cold hard cash? To me it just sounds like they are doing the old saying, "If you can't beat em ... join em" How long until M$ claims full IP on Linux? This is scary shit if you ask me. I for one DON'T welcome these Evil Empire Overloads. No you can't have your cake and eat it too!!! Or maybe they can?
-- Brought to you by Carl's JR
frankly I would rather joe average get to know about Linux by doing his own research rather than being spoon fed by Microsoft. In fact, it wouldnt surprise me if all Joe average got from this was that Microsoft is the innovator and Linux is the one behind... it just makes me cringe
Sigs are too short to say anything truly profound so read the above post instead.
Novell have a lot to answer for.
TWW
"Encyclopedia" is to "Wikipedia" what "Library" is to "Some people at a bus stop"
We need a moderation for -1: Bad URLs...
...a company who said that Linux infringes on exactly 225 of their patents, but doesn't know which ones? I don't get it either. If I were MS, I'd unveil the list (and 225 seems a ridiculously low number). Their "we wouldn't be able to handle the tsunami of responses" excuse doesn't seem to make any sense at all... Why are companies signing patent deals with a company to protect them from patents without knowing what they are? 1. MS pays them. 2. They get publicity. 3. PHBs buy their stuff more, since it's "protected".That it's patents are worth something when it has to PAY everyone to license them ? Isn't the point to COLLECT money for your patents ? I know they have a long term plan and more money than god, but I don't believe this will pay off in the future. I think by the time this deal, and the others like it even start to recoup M$'s investment, there will be some form of patent reform, that will make these deals useless.
And you should add: with a lot of incompatibility. Not everything is about choices. There is NOT an absolute "best" or "better". You should say that in some things some of those desktops have gotten better. What is great for some people is a bleah for others. OSX zaealots may think that having a unique top menu is a great thing and blah blah while some studies done in Stanford university say that this is actually a big no-no in usability. So there is NO "best" or better... Down with OS religion and prejudices!
It's time to realise that Abble's products are the biggest abomination these days. Just say NO to the dumb iAbble way!!
Before I get my qwerty in a knot over this, am I not correct in pointing out these covenants and agreements apply only to companies who deal with the U.S.A., while doing business in said state?
Last time I checked, I live elsewhere, my current distro is E.U. based, and my probable future distro is based in the Isle of Man, so why should I care about Americans shooting themselves in the foot?
In B.C., our fascism is green.
Good thing you believe in company religion.
These agreements give Microsoft a little legal clout in the short term, but if they mean that LG and other companies feel safe using Linux now, that's a big problem for Microsoft: even if Microsoft actually had valid patents that impact Linux, they run out in an average of a decade, and any Windows customer they have lost to Linux by then is a problem for them.
In fact, these agreements are so obviously bad for Microsoft that I really wonder when the other shoe will drop.
Microsoft is basically signing reciprocal agreements with all of these companies saying that MS won't sue them for patent violation and vice versa.
Is this basically giving Microsoft free access to everyone else's patent portfolio? It's not like they've specifically enumerated which patents are at issue here. So if these companies are signing something which says "I promise never to sue MS for patent infringement", and furthering the belief that open source must be in violation, aren't MS getting a tremendous advantage and leverage over the rest of the industry?
Man I wish the USDOJ hadn't dropped the ball on anti-trust proceedings.
Lost at C:>. Found at C.
Looks to me that what MS is doing here is borderline illegal.
Why? What will this matter? Joe will think that Torvalds invented the system! When in reality he just CLONED an existing system? And the true is that Linuzzz today is NOT AT ALL "pure"! Lots of cash is injected everyday by IBM, Sun, Google , MS and houndred of companies! THE ERA OF THE PURE LINUZZZ IS OVERR!!!!!
It's time to realise that Abble's products are the biggest abomination these days. Just say NO to the dumb iAbble way!!
What does you make think that? Oh I see... My ideas don't fit politically correctness here in this little insignificant /. world. Well for your info. I don't believe in Open Source religion. Don't believe in Company religion either. Software is just software above any ideologies. Use it as a tool and get the better thing out of it. Do it for good. You will be happy. And wiser. I work for a univerity and in my free time I develope freeware (a very succesfully one BTW). My freeware is not better that the university owned one. The commercial is not better than mine. They are different. And equal. They are just bytes in the end.
It's time to realise that Abble's products are the biggest abomination these days. Just say NO to the dumb iAbble way!!
Unfortunately, a lot of the stuff from Redmond does contain a lot of legal problems that can cause severe long-term damage to those who use them. As for .net/Mono, I prefer Python myself but if you really want to use Mono I guess you can. Though I guess preferring to use things I can always rely on to be open and free is "software religiousity" to you...
Please, for the good of Humanity, vote Obama.
Except this time they're doing it directly, rather than through their shill:
http://lwn.net/Articles/73592/
Wow. It's still 2006 back where you are?
Slagborr
Can you tell us all exactly where the root of the incompatibility is please? Are the OSS developers hiding APIs, file system structures, protocol structures etc.? (please go easy on me developers, haven't done anything but bash scripting forever and a day). I'll answer that for you, no, the whole thing is Open (anyone can view the source code). Wheras with Microsoft (don't want to offend you with the M$), they hide and obfuscate everything they can to keep rivals from working with them, then threaten to sue anything that tries to (the exceptions in the Novell agreement). So, who is not playing nice and creating incompatibility with others?
I got nuthin
.net and silverlight (2 examples from the top of my head) is great technology that can't be ignored and having it ported and fully integrated with Linuzzz is a great options. I guess you didn't read the link to the Mono Project? And Silverlight is already described by M$ as being "cross-platform and cross-browser". What more do you want?! Some purists like you won't be "contaminated" with anything from Redmond, but non-religious people will be glad with this. It's not about the Microsoft software. It's about M$ patent bullies trying desperately to destroy free software. Please don't reply back until you understand what FOSS is about, and why we're against what M$ is doing. The art of debate is knowing your opponent's points better than they do.Appended to the end of comments you post. 120 chars.
Please, for the good of Humanity, vote Obama.
The probable patents which M$ is discussing are those to which it was on a project basis for Hardware/Software/OS infrastructure.
Usually these are things like USB/FireWire/Wireless technology.
What we need to create is a list of M$ Active Patents and those pending approval. With the list the patents can be classified for analysis.
Also remember current software patents apply to USA and Japan. If there are other countries then they also will have to be removed from direct distribution of the offending Software. Example of this was the selling of encryption. That is if Ubunutu is managed out of South Africa then it does not need to worry or just sells for free in Patent based countries. Alternative is just states that the distro should not be mirrored in those countries.
I don't want protection! I have used Linux for years without it, and I see no reason to start asking for it now. Microsoft can come after me or anyone else using Linux for any number of patent infringements, and I can re-write the code. Cut it out. Cite prior art. Find a workaround. That is power that I have as a user, thanks entirely to Open Source, and I certainly don't need any sort of protection other than the freedom to modify my own code to protect me from microsoft and their frivolous patent claims.
So you think Apple open the source to their OSX for the competition? Or Adobe opens the source for Photoshop for Corel to copy it? Or Cocal Cola opens the recept of their drink for pepsiCo? This is COMMERCIAL software. And yes, sometimes OS software is great and in some case better than closed source. In other cases the oposite is true. And in many cases... just use the best tool... or the tool you like more. I use Windows Commander as my shell. Closed source. I don't care. I use SVN as my code versioning software. Don't care. I use RAR as my fav. compression format. Don't care about 7z. Software is just software. The "freedom" of using OS tools only is an ilussion.
It's time to realise that Abble's products are the biggest abomination these days. Just say NO to the dumb iAbble way!!
Even if MS could kill commercial Linux, it will not be able to kill Linux. Linux survived quite some time without business. Yes, development will slow down, but there will be no way it will be killed. That's the big advantage of FOSS: When IBM stopped supporting OS/2, it basically was dead. If IBM stops supporting Linux, then it will still exist and continue to be developed.
The Tao of math: The numbers you can count are not the real numbers.
- Linux never claimed to not have its origins in UNIX. That's always been one of its selling points, actually.
- Cashflow into an idea or (in this case) a software platform is a Good Thing, if the software remains "free". You REALLY need to read the links I posted, and think about what other people here are saying, instead of firing off your WTF-cannons.
- Linuzzz does not sound like Linux, is not witty, and takes too long to type. I hope you don't work in marketing.
- For someone who isn't a "purist", you really seem to love M$, even if their solution isn't the best one... (incidentally, show me all the programs/sites in the world using Silverlight. Now show me all the sites in the world using LAMP. Oh, thanks.)
Have a friendly, non-FUD-filled day.Appended to the end of comments you post. 120 chars.
Linspire: Oh, they're coming! They're coming! Just like last time!
Debian: We've got to wait it out for reinforments.
Linspire: They killed Private Xandros and Assimilated General SUSE! We've next!
BOOOOOOOOM!
Debian: LG Electronics!
Linspire: They're gone...
Red Hat: (removes his hat)
Ubuntu: (plays a funeral tune on his bugle)
sounds a lot like a troll but I'll bite. Linus did invent Linux, it isnt merely a clone as you think, it is a completely seperate/distinct OS- in fact there isnt a single line of code from Unix/Minix in the kernel. as for Linux not being "pure" it doesnt matter if the work was paid to be done or not, the code is still free to use. It can still be shared as it was intended and just because IBM and others use the code for what they want and pay people to improve it doesnt mean it isnt still free to share. now Ballmer about your spelling ability, Linux is spelled L-i-n-u-x not linuzz
Sigs are too short to say anything truly profound so read the above post instead.
Can you do me a huge favor and not type another word on your keyboard without reading this: http://www.gnu.org/philosophy/free-sw.html? Thanks.
Appended to the end of comments you post. 120 chars.
And what's that? The Bible? MUST I agree with that? Sorry.
It's time to realise that Abble's products are the biggest abomination these days. Just say NO to the dumb iAbble way!!
...it contains the answers to the questions you asked, and the responses to the "arguments" you submitted. If you're unwilling to actually research an opposing viewpoint, then you really do deserve the litany of -1 Troll/Flamebait mods you have received.
Appended to the end of comments you post. 120 chars.
I'm sorry you must have missed my point. You were ranting about incompatibilities with open source software and I just asked who was making those incompatibilities. I don't care about your preferences in software, use what you like, I use what I like (or what my job makes me, hey, I gotta make a buck). So, answer my question, who creates the open source software incompatibility problem that you mentioned?
I got nuthin
http://digitaltippingpoint.com/wiki/index.php?tit
Well, many people wondered how you could make money off OSS, here is your example.
---- Booth was a patriot ----
That's right people MSFT is paying protection money to Linux vendors...
Your statement is very clever, but untrue.
Yes, microsoft is paying linux vendors. But history has shown that Microsoft has an end-game in mind that will harm everyone.
Got Trader Joe's? friendwich.com RSS feeds work now!
"They are just bytes in the end."
Mod +2 Unintentional irony.
The so called "exchange" (not the server) leads to heavy corruption cases against costumers and it focuses on the health of both enterprises and not the healt of science and technology advance.
Technology is not a democracy, it's a deterministc theocracy previous than 'God 1.0'
?
Software patents are a bad idea, as such I wouldn't devote time trying to code workarounds for otherwise
fine code. Just because the US legal system is fucked up and allow corporations to extort money from you because
they have some very abstract idea on a paper which vaguely describes what your code does.
I mean what a waste of work when it should be clear everyone that your patent laws must be changed.
Who says you can't make money off of Linux?
The great thing is, you don't actually have to sell someone anything. They'll just hand you money. One of the greatest swindles in history.
Kythe
MS is paying these companies money so that MS wont sue them for patent infringment? WTF?????? Either someone has lost it big time in Redmond or MS is actually scrambling so they dont get sued. Gee I wonder if Vista has some GPL'd code in it.
It looks like to me that Microsoft is trying to achieve the perception of legitimacy. The more companies they can get pay protection money, the more it gives the perception that there may be some real IP for which companies need to pay.
Let's hope that we get the GPL 3 right and put an end to this nonsense.
It works like this:
"Hi! I'm from Microsoft!"
"Oh, hello there!"
"Would you like some money?"
"Geee, sure!"
"Fine, just sign right here."
Novell is also paying Microsoft and I think that the point is that Microsoft is claiming that Linux contains their IP. They want to make people believe that if they use free versions of Linux they could be sued.
If they can instill enough fear into corporate users they can force the users to only use versions of Linux for which Microsoft receives money. Despicable really.
I guess we'll just need to get used to this crap.
From now on, whenever Microsoft signs any agreement with anybody, there will be a Linux patent agreement included. Not because it makes any sense to have one, but because Microsoft wants to tell a consistent story. They know too well that corporate America will just fall in line like cattle, so MS is making sure that CIOs everywhere hear the same "lie", that Linux violates MS patents.
Yes, I'm calling it a lie until I see an actual list of patents. Half truths are lies.
What MS is really doing is covering their ass. Looking back, during the last years, MS has been paying again and again because someone claimed that MS violates their patents. While MS can afford that, it's definitely not funny to license MP3 patents from Frauenhofer and then get sued by Alcatel for the same technology. For that reason, MS is making patent swap deals to protect themselfs. (Maybe a litte FUD is good for their business, too)
Linux is not the main topic of the game... but they need the construct invented for Novell to get Linux vendors on board.
This is just business as usual with patents - big companies sign cross licensing / "non-aggression treaties" with each other so that they can bomb, err, sue smaller companies without the big companies feeling threatened. This is only interesting because it may include some specific wording that will run afoul of GPLv3.
-- The act of censorship is always worse than whatever is being censored. Always.
How long before the leaders of the FOSS movement take Microsoft to court to discover what patents the linux kernel infringes on (IANAL, so I don't know the legal term.)
"We the unwilling, lead by the unknowing, have been doing the hard with little for so long that we are ready do do the i
But then again, I might be biased. ;->
First they came for CP/M.
But I didn't speak up,
Because I didn't care about an operating system.
Then they came for WordPerfect.
But I didn't speak up,
Because their word processor was supposed to be so easy.
Then they came for Lotus 1-2-3.
But I didn't speak up,
Because their spreadsheet promised to be compatible.
Then they came for Netscape.
But I didn't speak up,
Because they gave me their web browser for free.
Then they came for the heart of our network.
But I didn't speak up,
Because their servers had such pretty buttons.
Then they came for me when I couldn't pay for an upgrade.
Bugs remained unfixed, security holes unplugged.
By that time there was no other option,
And no one was left to hear my voice.
"To those who are overly cautious, everything is impossible. "
...the most obvious and how a lot of high stakes business is done-bribery and blackmail. It doesn't take too many high level executives to make an important decision, does it? As long as it is couched in reasonable language-enough for the other suits and lawyers-it can pass, and no one is the wiser, they have ways of hiding payments or threats by now. I can't prove it, so I can't really allege it, but I bet there's something to it. this is a wealthy, powerful and proven crooked company we are talking about. Those sorts of people are capable of *anything* at all to increase profits or maintain profits. Heck, actual shooting wars have been started over lesser amounts of money than what MS makes.
In other words, I really doubt there are any huge numbers of decent patents involved, if any at all. That's just crap, the illusion to base their threats and extortion racket on. If they were actually real, they would have already used them, as in why wait? They gain nothing by waiting. but they gain a lot by constantly alluding to them and reminding other companies how big and bad they are-they beat the doj and the eu so far! It's like SCO, that's how these slimeballs operate, except unlike SCO, they have billions to throw at it as part of doing business, not just a few million. If it costs them a billion to make ten billion, they'll keep doing that *forever*.
The US government has to follow the law with respect to anti-trust. That doesn't mean that everything a monopolist company does that competitors (or FOSS advocates) don't like is automatically illegal. It isn't the "pressure" of being sued that is driving companies to sign these agreements, it's cold, hard cash. You know, that thing that the most Linux vendors find hard to come by since their "product" can be downloaded for free.
It's arrogant and disrespectful to assume that people disagree with you simply because they don't understand your position and if they would just read manifesto X, they would change their mind. I think it quite likely that most people reading Slashdot understand the GNU philosophy very well. Nevertheless, not everyone who understands it agrees with it.
Perhaps M$ is planning on releasing it's next OS as a Linux mutant? Or maybe they have already stolen or plan to steal lots of OSS code.
Well, I'm never going to use Suse or Xandros again. If I can help it I'll avoid Novell software altogether. If Ubuntu ever signs it's life away, I'll be switching distros. ...eventually I might have to succumb to the Mac side of the force.
It would be good to start an online petition/boycott to show the Linux vendors that it's users will leave them if they sign these sorts of deals with the devil.
Linux isn't a company, so no hostile takeover can occur.
However, now that Linux has become commercialized, it's possible to take over those companies.
Microsoft is to software what Budweiser is to beer.
"Linuzzz does not sound like Linux ... you really seem to love M$"
I think "Linuzzz" has the same value as "M$". That is, none.
"Incidentally, show me all the programs/sites in the world using Silverlight. Now show me all the sites in the world using LAMP. Oh, thanks.)"
I make no predictions about how well adopted Silverlight will be vs. LAMP in the future, but SilverLight has been available how long - maybe two months. What was the installed base of Linux in it's first two months? You could at least pretend to be objective by waiting a year to pass judgment.
Hmmm... Is the Linux community going to be switching to GPLv3? I thought the Linus was against it. At least that was the article I read a long time ago.
When Novell and Microsoft came out and said they were making a deal, I didn't think much of it. SuSE wasn't my favorite distro and I figured they only made the deal in order to help grow market share. Then Microsoft comes out and announces they have suddenly discovered over 200 un-named patents and they start making deals with companies that could help grow the Open Source movement for the better. Microsoft may act like they are doing this for the sake of the companies and the consumers of those companies but anyone who is logical about things will realize that Microsoft is wanting to shut out this great Open Source movement. I have been predicting, along with the other users of Open Source software, that this movement will win in the end; however, I am starting to get scared. But I will say, Bring it on Bill Gates & Co. Steve
My next monitor won't be LG. You see, I'm quite satisfied with the product, but this latest act excludes you from the companies I'd want to support.
It is my money and I care who I give it to.
It takes a man to suffer ignorance and smile
Be yourself no matter what they say
How can I get Microsoft to pay me to keep Microsoft from suing me? Microsoft doesn't sue me most every day! It seems I am missing out on an opportunity, here...
I'm trying to teach myself to set people on fire with my mind... Is it hot in here?
Can we get a Extra 'Dumbass' Modifier for parent?
Does this signal the dawn of a new backronym for LG?
Linux is Gold
Error:
I'm surprised you used your Slashdot alias and not Anonymous Coward to post this message, as trolls and flamebaiters usually do the latter.
Perhaps all these deals are to give an aura of legitimacy to their patent claims, enabling them to spread FUD more effectively.
Perhaps they want to get enough people to continue Linux support under GPLv2.
Perhaps it's an attempt to tie Linux to some actual companies, which they can later undercut and drive out of business (which is how they've dealt with their traditional competitors until now, but which hasn't worked against open source.)
Honestly, I haven't been able to figure out what this is about.
It's not wasting time, I'm educating myself.
If you have paid for the right to use a patent then you cannot possibly infringe by definition.
Microsoft is buying rights to other people's patents because it makes a huge amount of stuff and there is a significant probability that they would otherwise infringe.
Other people want access to Microsoft because there is a significant chance that the stuff they build on top of Linux might infringe even if Linux does not.
Microsoft has a metric crapload of patents. The chance that Linux does not infringe at all is rather small. The real issue there is not infringement but what attempts they will or can make to enforce.
I don't think that the regulatory regime is going to be such that Microsoft can safely engage in SCO style tactics even if they wanted to.
Looking for an Information Security student project suggestion?
Try http://dotcrimeManifesto.com/
enough companies sign up with MS and then decide as a whole to apply patent rights against everyone else not a customer of one of the companies?
1) It was NOT meant to be a troll or flamebait
2) I don't care about karma. I can take it back in no time by writting no brainers like "That's why Linux will rule the desktop" or "MS copied Apple once more". Gaining karma on /. is a no brainer. Now, wasting it expressing my REAL opinions.... you see, that's an honor.
It's time to realise that Abble's products are the biggest abomination these days. Just say NO to the dumb iAbble way!!
...when a naked dude running down the astroturf during Superbowl with a flag that says "Show me the patents, Microsoft!" could alleviate all the fud?
C'mon people get creative here, pull off something insane and get your message heard, isn't that how it works for the poor man in the U.S.?
Free Money??!
Who gives away free money? Certainly, Microsoft would be last on a list of suspects.
No, money is easy for microsoft.
The real question is, why are these OS (and semi-OS) companies buying Microsofts' blabber.
So who wants to setup a blacklist of the growing number of companies signing these agreements?
Novell vs hardware manufacturers is complete different deal, whilst the issues might appear the same, patents, they are coming from a different direction.
M$ might be fearful that if it attempts low cost hardware with embedded Linux, that it will get sued by every body that believes they have a chance. So it is likely that M$ is trying to move more into the Linux market but because of past behaviour it knows it has many obstacles in it's path.
It is really much simpler than all this legal nonsense, dumping Ballmer would go a long way to convincing the community the M$ had 'started' to change.
Chaos - everything, everywhere, everywhen
Nice little electronics business you have there, LG. It'd be a shame if something were to HAPPEN to it, you know what I mean?
This is one of the places where the fact that the OS is really "GNU/Linux" becomes really obvious and relevant. All of the GNU code is going to be moved to GPLv3 - Bash, GCC, GNU libc, GNU tar, GNU binutils, etc. When that happens, any "Linux distribution" will include quite a bit of GPLv3 code. It's true that the kernel, Linux, probably won't use the new license - at least not any time soon - but the kernel's only a small part of the system.
-- The act of censorship is always worse than whatever is being censored. Always.
I didn't say he would change his mind. I said it addressed the issues he brought up. At no point did I say that reading the FSF or GNU pages would make him change; I only proposed that they answered the questions/issues he has. If he doesn't agree with the concept AFTER reading and understanding it, then that is of course his freewill choice.
Appended to the end of comments you post. 120 chars.
It was meant to be humorous, more than anything. The point of the statement was to address El Lobo's attitude that everything Microsoft creates must be a standard, and everything Linux creates must be a "clone", incompatible, unpopular piece of software. I could have easily replaced that with MS-IIS, .NET, etc...
Appended to the end of comments you post. 120 chars.
actually the 225 (or what was it) patents that microsoft claimed linux breaked, came from an independent study.
and they were _possible_ infringements.
and it was not only Linux, but the whole open source comunity.
O, and microsoft itself said it would be too expensive for them to search for patent infringements in every open source project.
still, if these deals provide linux-companies money and assure a kind of protetcion, it seems good...
LG have been one of the companies who slavishly follow the Microsoft line where computer hardware is concerned. They were one of the first companies to fab up for the Tablet PC and the one of the first to make UMPCs. Whatever it is that they've signed up for, it won't affect their relationship with Microsoft.
This is how you run a FUD campaign.
Microsoft has obviously been using SCO as the cannon fodder, watching where they went wrong and taking notes.
Your name is Jebediah, you live in a trailerpark with your dog Scooter, and you believe that when companies say they do good things for people, then it must mean they do good with the intention of doing good, not to line their pockets with ethical capital?
I want to know where else to shop.
boycott slashdot February 10th - 17th check out: altSlashdot.org
Duh. Microsoft is paying them, not vice-versa.
Microsoft has started handing out passes that let some people cross the Brooklyn Bridge.
The difference between Canada and the USA is that in Canada healthcare is a right and gun ownership is a privilege.
errm..as far as I know Microsoft saying "cross platform" means "it can run under older versions of Windows or IE too"
"we are all atheists about most of the gods that societies have ever believed in. Some of us just go one god further."
Just like the RIAA and/or MPAA.
Using the Freedom of Speech while I still have it.
...Vista is just another Linux distribution.
Buying Novell just sealed the deal for Microsoft to lay claim to any Linux IP.
The suits have already moved in on Linux, we just don't know it yet.
Hedghog
The chance that Linux does not infringe at all is rather small.
The chance that Linux infringes after said "infringements" are detailed with specificity, and subsequently coded around, is zero.
you had me at #!
I suspect Microsoft is trolling for patentable (or unpatentable) concepts related to Linux. If they find the concepts, then they will patent it. Perhaps Microsoft will claim they are patenting the concept on behalf of their "partner". Eventually, that "partner" will either be consumed by Microsoft or destroyed by Microsoft.
Perhaps Microsoft will arrange to conglomerate their Linux "partners" into one cohesive organization, I'll call it MicroLinuxSoft. Then, Microsoft can sue MicroLinuxSoft for patent infringement as well as copyright infringement because the protection and IP sharing contracts are similar to Microsoft's EULA, non-assignable and with Microsoft's newly implemented and patented non-transferrable stipulation.
I've already answared that post...
Microsoft can try all they want, we'll always have Debian.
Rethinking email
This will make my next cell phone choice easier by one.
Watching the comments on these articles about Microsoft makes me think of Peter Pan and the Lost Boys fighting Captain Hook; some of the comments are seriously that juvenile.
Sure, call me a troll, but maybe I'd like to see Microsoft stopped just as much as the rest of you. I'm just not sure how making comments that'd probably embarass a four year old on here really helps to do that.
First of all software patents do not apply elsewhere. MS is marginalizing itself outside the US, and if anything, will give movements campaigning for stopping patents in software a big boost.
In any case, there will be people that will continue working on GPLed software. It only takes 1 court action and MS house of cards would come down crumbling strepitously.
If the only way MS can live with FOSS is paying for the priviledge usin false pretenses, that is their choice (instead of innovating and competing based in merit, they are so incapable of that that even them recognize it and are stopping trying). But if they think people will stop developping and is scared from patent litigation, they would find out they are mistaken.
MS: it takes only one case in court and your patent game would be over.
IANAL but write like a drunk one.
http://blogs.sun.com/jonathan/entry/censoring_free _media_or_fighting
IANAL but write like a drunk one.
A moderation of "Redundant" means somebody must be agreeing with me by posting the same thing! Please show yourself my comrade in arms!
>>I hope the community stands up and absolutely smashes Microsoft
OMG, yes! I'm with you!
Together we shall crush the evil empire and that bad, bad Mr. Gates!
I will bring my pony!
NYPD is enforcing their right to do that, citing the warm relationship between Bill and the Mayor...
...it is committing bribery.
MSFT isn't trying too hard to sell license agreements to its unspecified patents because it would mean they'd have to specify which patents it believes are in conflict with Linux. Furthermore, I think the fact that MS is not getting any net revenue from these deals is an indicator of what they believe they are realistically worth (ie. so little that they have to pay people to take them). These patents are legal FUD-distribution-tools and have no significant merit beyond that.
These are all CROSS-licensing deals, and I'm sure they are loaded down with legalese to obfuscate their true intent. MSFT is enticing the likes of Novell, LG, Fuji with millions in cash and indemnification, but in return it is giving MSFT unfettered access to their own patents/technologies. More importantly, even if they retain ownership of their own patents, MSFT will have some degree of CONTROL over those patents too. In effect, MSFT is bribing these other companies in exchange for the ability to pull some corporate stings.
Here is a chilling example: Suppose LG is releasing a Linux-based smart-phone, and early signs are that it is such a killer device that they intend to release it world-wide and it stands to severely blunt market penetration for Windows smart-phones in the US. MSFT's "Linux interoperability team" is all over the device, as the agreement with LG entitles them to be, and identify a couple of possible patents that may apply to a GPL package used in the Linux OS of that device. MSFT says "we like your product LG, but you can't go violating the license agreements established by the authors of library 'X'--that's piracy and we can't abide by that". The copyright holders have stated will not change the license for LG (even GPL2 places limits on the ability to encumber the license with patent licensing fees and such). This is enough to scuttle the launch of the Linux phone for awhile.
MSFT would be happy at that point, but LG still wants to launch this phone, and now it has to re-invent the wheel to do so. Enter the crack "Linux interoperability team" from MSFT to save the day and help write a replacement library that is "unencumbered" (it might even be some kind of "shared source" terms, but not the nasty viral GPL). Now MSFT has some control over a Linux device, and has contaminated the embedded distro with a license under its terms. Even if it doesn't realise revenue directly from the LG product, it has now effectively locked out all but LG from creating a similar product using the critical GPLed code. Motorola, for example, might want to make a similar product, and now it will scared into dealing with MSFT to use the patented technology.
This gives MSFT a lot of power over those who've been bribed. All MSFT has to do to kill the above-mentioned GPLed library is to "generously" give away the right to use its patents so long as you use the MSFT-blessed code (or alternative code under a MSFT-blessed license). They are trying to set up to "embrace, extend and exterminate"
the Free software community. Bribery is a much more effective way to "embrace" someone than extortion.
What is this s**t? How long will Microsoft "grant" companies the "right" to distribute something Microsoft doesn't own and have nothing to do with?
It's like Carlsberg granting Goldstar rights to distribute it's own beer.
How the heck could this thing even be legal? These agreements are void!!