If this whole book of revelations was born in the imagination of John, than it is pointless and should be burned in the fire of history. But if this book was really the result of a vision that John had, than this book is highly relevant.
For me I take this book as the result of a vision. Therefore I take it as very important. But it should not be used as a cheap and quick argument.
This book is not about the mark. This book deals at first with the churches. Something like the president talking about the state of the nation. The one speaking in the book tries to bring his nation, the churches, back on the road. Many churches have lost their way, their first love, their focus on Jesus and the focus on their duties. They forgot their very reason for existance. Take a look at the first chapters of the revelations, read what "the angel has to tell to the churches".
And the one speaking in this book shows the readers the future. As a warning and as a guiding light for what will inevitable come.
There will come a time when one person standing at the top of a worldwide spanning ruling government will have unlimitted power. Earthly power and divine powers. He will be the clearly identified, unquestioned emperor of the whole known world.
And he will call himself god. He will perform miracles. Healing the sick, raising the dead. He will _prove_ his godly nature by these miracles.
And people will follow him. They will make a clear, conscious decission to follow him. To bind themselves to him. And these people will receive the mark of him. With his sign engraved.
And the ones wearing the mark will be the only ones who have the right to participat in the society and economy. They will be the only ones who can buy and sell.
So they clearly, willingly, knowingly sell themselve to him in exchange for living the life that he offers them.
It is not and by no means possible to take the mark of the beast unknowingly and unwillingly. Therefore this whole question whether or not a certain technology will be the mark of the beast leads nowhere. It just distracts. Its a pointless, useless question. Which you can not answer. It is neither provable nor disprovable. It just gives you the feeling that something it is wrong. Without knowing _what_ is wrong. Like this "If you have nothing to hide" argument. It gnaws in the back of your mind.
This question somehow implies that it is possible to take the mark of the beast unwillingly. And unknowingly. You find a certain technology like a rfid chip useful, implant a gps chip to yourself and to your children so you always know where they are just to find out a couple of weeks later that you sold yourself to the devil.
Oh yeah, he really must be. Showing people their limits before the have to realize it on their own is so dick-like.
Just think about it for a single second longer and you will understand _why_ God did it this way and _why_ this wasn't even remotely bad.
And by the way, this god is _not_ pressed into a religion. People make religions to press God into their ideology. God doesn't care about religions. He cares about people.
This is one of the strangest answers I've read in a long long time.
If he did _not_ ask while not knowing how to do his job might justify to tell him to quit.
But it is not justified to tell this to a person who seeks knowledge. He asks a community of people where at least some of them have a decent knowledge of computers. And I guess/. is not the only addressee for his questions.
I wished more people would ask instead of hiding their incompetence behind a wall of arrogance and ignorance.
Great. This guy who said "power is only in the barrel of a gun" lived this sentence to the fullest. He was responsible for the death of about 60 Million of his own people. You propagate that for Amerika?
I belong to Jesus the Christ myself. And I have to admit there are some really valid points in your post (besides homosexuality and over-population. Resources would be enough if equally devided among all).
Believing in Christ is different from claiming to be a christian.
Currently on/. there is some real ugly rant going on against christians. And I really don't like that to much. But I guess that the religious right wings in your country are not helping much to ease the situation.
What is hard to tell people is that religion and christianity are absolutely contradicting each other. And it seems that the religious ones are stretching out their hands to take over the US. Almost all times the religious ones take over it ends up in a desaster.
Christianity on the other side is something absolutely different. It has to do with, well, being a christian. A saved one who knows his saviour. A person who respects others, is selfless and takes the word of god in the first place for letting it change _himself_ (in opposite to using it as a weapon against others).
Back to on-topic: a lot of the time datings for organic materials have just recently shown to be fake. Take the time to google for "Reiner Protsch", a german anthropoligist from the university of frankfurt, who dated some of the oldest organic artifacts. He was long time considered something like a guru when it came to dating bones and stuff. But almost all of these datings were faked. So the "scientific" approach to these findings seem at least somewhat biased.
"Buildings channel wind energy, while windmills more-or-less absorb it. Buildings alter the flow of wind, have you ever noticed the wind tunnel effect near some buildings? Sure buildings will absorb some of the wind's kinetic energy, but that is through frictional shear and is relatively small."
This is not quite right. The frictional energy is only one part of the equation. And a rather small one. A much more important force here is surface pressure. Windmills convert them into usable energy while buildings just "route" that energy into the bottom. Arguing that "buildings will absorb some of the wind's kinetic energy" is like sayingt that a barrage is almos incapable of holding back the water.
Wind absolutely doesn't care what is inside the building it presses against. An uneducated guess of me is that you could take quite a couple of windmills to come close to the amount of energy that a skyscraper drags out of wind.
not centuries of scientific development that led to modern medicine No, definitely not. More than once the doctors told us that they didn't know what to do anymore. Scientific development shure had it's place. But nevertheless it wasn't enough. The doctors themselve told us afterwards, that they didn't belive our son would make it. They themselve called it a miracle.
And doubtless, some of those parents whose babies have died were more religious than you and prayed more often. Might be true and I don't question it. My parents had a 4 year old doughter which died at leukemia. And they definitely prayed a lot. So what shall I say? My wife and I saw a couple of children die during that time. Again, what shall I say? The only thing I can say is about my experiences with what happened to my son.
When my son was born last year, he looked the same. 25th week of pregnancy, 720gramm weight at birth, soon dropped down to 540gramm (had lots of water in his body). He really looked like that little baby in the picture. I literally could cover him with my hand.
After 5 month of beeing in the hospital we were allowed to take him home. He now is 7.5kilos and is completely fine besides one eye on which he has -8 dioptrin.
You've got no idea what a difference it is when you can pray to god! We have more than once seen our son be more dead than alive and the only thing that helped him as praying.
Any scientist that tells you something is "true" has a mountain of evidence to back him or her up
No. The correct version of this is: Any scientist that tells you something is "true" should have a mountain of evidence to back him or her up. And they definitly should not have a lobby in her back that forces them to share a believe. More often than not the "evidence" behind a this "true" thing is money, fame and glory.
btw: This statement from me is as unprove as your statement.
Re:Protoscience and psuedoscience
on
The Unknown Newton
·
· Score: 2, Interesting
There are a couple of strange views in what you say. At first you seem to believe that people honestly know more nowadays than what they knew a couple of hundred years ago. If that was true, shouldn't it at least lead a little bit into a society which
-doesn't try to kill itself
-takes care for others
-knows about it's environment
-knows how to deal with it properly
-knows about its limitations
-knows how to deal with them properly
?
The only problem of the time that newton lived in was that people unaudited believed whatever was told to them by the ones being in power (which was back then the people calling themselves the church). They believed really strange things.
Nowadays we're much advanced. We believe in what the guys in charge tell us. We believe every single word of crap coming out of the mouth of a scientist without checking it. We believe in evolution just because it fits our system of believe. Quantum theory, big bang and so on and so on. Without checking it. Just because "quantum" sounds so cool, so scientific, so just-shut-the-fuck-up-you-moron-i-know-better. We believe in what the doctors tell us. Take that little pill and everything will be fine. We believe psycoligists. We are so advanced we just believe in everything what we want to believe.
And you call that advanced? I would call it degenerated. Because we still haven't learned whom to believe. We still haven't learned that believing is more than just repeating. We still haven't learned to go to the very one who can tell me who I am and to check if what he says is right and proves right.
And yes, I believe in God, in Jesus, and in the bible. And yes, you still have to prove one single thing to be wrong of what God did and says or Jesus did and say or what the bible says. And don't come up with the stuff that the church or the priest of your confidence said. Prove it by your own prove.
[...] have a love child named ManWoman. Which will be the central[...]
Maybe this will be the first usable manpage for explaining women....
---Was it the sheep climbing onto the altar, or the cattle lowing to be slain, or the Son of God hanging dead and bloodied on a cross that told me this was a world condemned, but loved and bought with blood.
... is how much faith and trust many people put into what is called science.
I guess that most theories were not made to find the reasons behind a certain thing but were made to proove a certain believe. At the beginning was not a question without an answer but there was an answer without a question. And most times the reason behind the answer was: "There is no god".
It is like the gartner group coming up with the results of a survey which was paid by Microsoft. You probably know the outcome. Microsoft is better than *n[ui]x. And if you love Microsoft, you believe the results of the survey. If you're an Open Source enthusiast, you rebut the results. On which side you stand is defined by what you want to believe.
And now, try to find _real__proofs_ for your favoured where-do-we-come-from theorie. You'll be amazed how much unproven theories there are and how much power people invest to defend these theories instead of trying to proove/disproove them.
I think nobody has the right to decide who receives help and who doesn't. Everybody should receive the maximum possible amount of help available. My baby son was born about 9 month ago. Instead of staying 40 weeks in his mothers womb he was delivered after 25 weeks. In the beginning he had about 720gramm and very soon dropped down to 540 gramm. That's not really much. And it changed my idea of what a baby is. I could cover 80% of his body with a single hand. After a couple of surgerys he now is OK. He now weights about 5,5 kilos. Right now my wife is feeding him. The complete medical treatment did cost about 300.000 Euro. Was it worth that? There's no doubt about this. And if God hadn't personally taken care of my son, joschah would be dead. Money should never have the equal weight of the live of a person. Society should never take itself the right to judge about the life of persons. Right now we put more money into killing people, developing weapons, exploring space etc than into developing treatments for the real problems humanity has. There is much to do, much to pray.
Ilan, you people (endusers / moaner) have ignored participation for years. Some of you have literally been the poster boy for arrogance and indifference towards the endless efforts of the debian people to provide you with usable, consistant software that let's you get stuff done with a minimum of fuss. 7 years later, you still think that you have the _right_to_demand_ something like a graphical installer from people who (most of them) simply work in their spare time to bring debian to you. Do end-users provided with those kind of values really need to be so ignorant and egomaniac?
If end-users using debian replace their Windows with debian-software, then they have earned an obligation to enhance that software by participating on the debian project. No on is forced to use Debian. IMO if end users don't stop taking without giving they doen deserve a place on slashdot to post those useless rants.
I believe in the concept of Open Source, and I will not stand idly by while those in the End users community moan and critisice when they easily could help make things better.
Since when is taking something you don't own not theft? Does it really matter if the owner still has its own copy? You take something wich is for sale without paying! Last time I've checked this is called theft.
Sine mid june I'm father of a premature infant which lies in intensive care in a hospital. At each incubator there is a terminal which keeps track of monitoring informations, medical treatment, vital functions and stuff like that. These systems are running on win nt 4. One of the central monitoring and alertsystems -which gives an overview of the vital functions of all infants and broadcasts alerts- runs on windows nt4. Just imagine if these systems got infected... There are os'es which have proven to be rockstable, like qnx. Why don't they use'em?
Slashdot Mirror
If this whole book of revelations was born in the imagination of John, than it is pointless and should be burned in the fire of history. But if this book was really the result of a vision that John had, than this book is highly relevant.
For me I take this book as the result of a vision. Therefore I take it as very important. But it should not be used as a cheap and quick argument.
This book is not about the mark. This book deals at first with the churches. Something like the president talking about the state of the nation. The one speaking in the book tries to bring his nation, the churches, back on the road. Many churches have lost their way, their first love, their focus on Jesus and the focus on their duties. They forgot their very reason for existance. Take a look at the first chapters of the revelations, read what "the angel has to tell to the churches".
And the one speaking in this book shows the readers the future. As a warning and as a guiding light for what will inevitable come.
There will come a time when one person standing at the top of a worldwide spanning ruling government will have unlimitted power. Earthly power and divine powers. He will be the clearly identified, unquestioned emperor of the whole known world.
And he will call himself god. He will perform miracles. Healing the sick, raising the dead. He will _prove_ his godly nature by these miracles.
And people will follow him. They will make a clear, conscious decission to follow him. To bind themselves to him. And these people will receive the mark of him. With his sign engraved.
And the ones wearing the mark will be the only ones who have the right to participat in the society and economy. They will be the only ones who can buy and sell.
So they clearly, willingly, knowingly sell themselve to him in exchange for living the life that he offers them.
It is not and by no means possible to take the mark of the beast unknowingly and unwillingly. Therefore this whole question whether or not a certain technology will be the mark of the beast leads nowhere. It just distracts. Its a pointless, useless question. Which you can not answer. It is neither provable nor disprovable. It just gives you the feeling that something it is wrong. Without knowing _what_ is wrong. Like this "If you have nothing to hide" argument. It gnaws in the back of your mind.
This question somehow implies that it is possible to take the mark of the beast unwillingly. And unknowingly. You find a certain technology like a rfid chip useful, implant a gps chip to yourself and to your children so you always know where they are just to find out a couple of weeks later that you sold yourself to the devil.
No, this is not possible.
Maybe he delivers fast and good in your lifetime, but after your death you will find out that you forgot to ask him for his interest rate.
Sir, but what do you need a radio station attached to your teeth for?
Oh yeah, he really must be. Showing people their limits before the have to realize it on their own is so dick-like.
Just think about it for a single second longer and you will understand _why_ God did it this way and _why_ this wasn't even remotely bad.
And by the way, this god is _not_ pressed into a religion. People make religions to press God into their ideology. God doesn't care about religions. He cares about people.
You can easily find its master when all you have to fuel the spitfire is a couple of fish...
This is one of the strangest answers I've read in a long long time.
/. is not the only addressee for his questions.
If he did _not_ ask while not knowing how to do his job might justify to tell him to quit.
But it is not justified to tell this to a person who seeks knowledge. He asks a community of people where at least some of them have a decent knowledge of computers. And I guess
I wished more people would ask instead of hiding their incompetence behind a wall of arrogance and ignorance.
Great. This guy who said "power is only in the barrel of a gun" lived this sentence to the fullest. He was responsible for the death of about 60 Million of his own people.
You propagate that for Amerika?
So now when the police raids your apartment to seize your computers and disk drives, you can just give them the finger...
I belong to Jesus the Christ myself. And I have to admit there are some really valid points in your post (besides homosexuality and over-population. Resources would be enough if equally devided among all).
Believing in Christ is different from claiming to be a christian.
The latter is where religion turns in.
Turn religion off.
Currently on /. there is some real ugly rant going on against christians. And I really don't like that to much. But I guess that the religious right wings in your country are not helping much to ease the situation.
What is hard to tell people is that religion and christianity are absolutely contradicting each other. And it seems that the religious ones are stretching out their hands to take over the US. Almost all times the religious ones take over it ends up in a desaster.
Christianity on the other side is something absolutely different. It has to do with, well, being a christian. A saved one who knows his saviour. A person who respects others, is selfless and takes the word of god in the first place for letting it change _himself_ (in opposite to using it as a weapon against others).
Back to on-topic: a lot of the time datings for organic materials have just recently shown to be fake. Take the time to google for "Reiner Protsch", a german anthropoligist from the university of frankfurt, who dated some of the oldest organic artifacts. He was long time considered something like a guru when it came to dating bones and stuff. But almost all of these datings were faked. So the "scientific" approach to these findings seem at least somewhat biased.
'xcuse me, dude, but since you refer to the bible, take a look at Ezekiel 27 and 28, which sounds extreeeemly like the submerge of ol' atlantis...
Plato said that atlantis' one-way-trip to the ground took place almost 9000years before his time. But this doesn't neccesarily need to be correct...
"Buildings channel wind energy, while windmills more-or-less absorb it. Buildings alter the flow of wind, have you ever noticed the wind tunnel effect near some buildings? Sure buildings will absorb some of the wind's kinetic energy, but that is through frictional shear and is relatively small."
This is not quite right. The frictional energy is only one part of the equation. And a rather small one. A much more important force here is surface pressure. Windmills convert them into usable energy while buildings just "route" that energy into the bottom.
Arguing that "buildings will absorb some of the wind's kinetic energy" is like sayingt that a barrage is almos incapable of holding back the water.
Wind absolutely doesn't care what is inside the building it presses against. An uneducated guess of me is that you could take quite a couple of windmills to come close to the amount of energy that a skyscraper drags out of wind.
not centuries of scientific development that led to modern medicine
No, definitely not. More than once the doctors told us that they didn't know what to do anymore. Scientific development shure had it's place. But nevertheless it wasn't enough. The doctors themselve told us afterwards, that they didn't belive our son would make it. They themselve called it a miracle.
And doubtless, some of those parents whose babies have died were more religious than you and prayed more often.
Might be true and I don't question it. My parents had a 4 year old doughter which died at leukemia. And they definitely prayed a lot. So what shall I say? My wife and I saw a couple of children die during that time. Again, what shall I say? The only thing I can say is about my experiences with what happened to my son.
When my son was born last year, he looked the same. 25th week of pregnancy, 720gramm weight at birth, soon dropped down to 540gramm (had lots of water in his body). He really looked like that little baby in the picture. I literally could cover him with my hand.
After 5 month of beeing in the hospital we were allowed to take him home. He now is 7.5kilos and is completely fine besides one eye on which he has -8 dioptrin.
You've got no idea what a difference it is when you can pray to god! We have more than once seen our son be more dead than alive and the only thing that helped him as praying.
Greetings
Gunnar
Any scientist that tells you something is "true" has a mountain of evidence to back him or her up
No. The correct version of this is: Any scientist that tells you something is "true" should have a mountain of evidence to back him or her up. And they definitly should not have a lobby in her back that forces them to share a believe. More often than not the "evidence" behind a this "true" thing is money, fame and glory. btw: This statement from me is as unprove as your statement.
- -doesn't try to kill itself
- -takes care for others
- -knows about it's environment
- -knows how to deal with it properly
- -knows about its limitations
- -knows how to deal with them properly
? The only problem of the time that newton lived in was that people unaudited believed whatever was told to them by the ones being in power (which was back then the people calling themselves the church). They believed really strange things.Nowadays we're much advanced. We believe in what the guys in charge tell us. We believe every single word of crap coming out of the mouth of a scientist without checking it. We believe in evolution just because it fits our system of believe. Quantum theory, big bang and so on and so on. Without checking it. Just because "quantum" sounds so cool, so scientific, so just-shut-the-fuck-up-you-moron-i-know-better. We believe in what the doctors tell us. Take that little pill and everything will be fine. We believe psycoligists. We are so advanced we just believe in everything what we want to believe. And you call that advanced? I would call it degenerated. Because we still haven't learned whom to believe. We still haven't learned that believing is more than just repeating. We still haven't learned to go to the very one who can tell me who I am and to check if what he says is right and proves right. And yes, I believe in God, in Jesus, and in the bible. And yes, you still have to prove one single thing to be wrong of what God did and says or Jesus did and say or what the bible says. And don't come up with the stuff that the church or the priest of your confidence said. Prove it by your own prove.
[...] have a love child named ManWoman. Which will be the central[...]
Maybe this will be the first usable manpage for explaining women....
---Was it the sheep climbing onto the altar, or the cattle lowing to be slain, or the Son of God hanging dead and bloodied on a cross that told me this was a world condemned, but loved and bought with blood.
... is how much faith and trust many people put into what is called science.
I guess that most theories were not made to find the reasons behind a certain thing but were made to proove a certain believe. At the beginning was not a question without an answer but there was an answer without a question. And most times the reason behind the answer was: "There is no god".
It is like the gartner group coming up with the results of a survey which was paid by Microsoft. You probably know the outcome. Microsoft is better than *n[ui]x. And if you love Microsoft, you believe the results of the survey. If you're an Open Source enthusiast, you rebut the results.
On which side you stand is defined by what you want to believe.
And now, try to find _real__proofs_ for your favoured where-do-we-come-from theorie. You'll be amazed how much unproven theories there are and how much power people invest to defend these theories instead of trying to proove/disproove them.
Strange enough.
I think nobody has the right to decide who receives help and who doesn't. Everybody should receive the maximum possible amount of help available.
My baby son was born about 9 month ago. Instead of staying 40 weeks in his mothers womb he was delivered after 25 weeks. In the beginning he had about 720gramm and very soon dropped down to 540 gramm. That's not really much. And it changed my idea of what a baby is. I could cover 80% of his body with a single hand.
After a couple of surgerys he now is OK. He now weights about 5,5 kilos. Right now my wife is feeding him.
The complete medical treatment did cost about 300.000 Euro. Was it worth that? There's no doubt about this.
And if God hadn't personally taken care of my son, joschah would be dead.
Money should never have the equal weight of the live of a person. Society should never take itself the right to judge about the life of persons.
Right now we put more money into killing people, developing weapons, exploring space etc than into developing treatments for the real problems humanity has.
There is much to do, much to pray.
Greetings,
Gunnar
because stat stuff is matter
(sorry, to obvious to be funny)
Ilan, you people (endusers / moaner) have ignored participation for years. Some of you have literally been the poster boy for arrogance and indifference towards the endless efforts of the debian people to provide you with usable, consistant software that let's you get stuff done with a minimum of fuss. 7 years later, you still think that you have the _right_to_demand_ something like a graphical installer from people who (most of them) simply work in their spare time to bring debian to you. Do end-users provided with those kind of values really need to be so ignorant and egomaniac?
If end-users using debian replace their Windows with debian-software, then they have earned an obligation to enhance that software by participating on the debian project. No on is forced to use Debian. IMO if end users don't stop taking without giving they doen deserve a place on slashdot to post those useless rants.
I believe in the concept of Open Source, and I will not stand idly by while those in the End users community moan and critisice when they easily could help make things better.
If the worm had stayed in bed, he'd still be alive.
(Don't know where I've got this from...)
Since when is taking something you don't own not theft?
Does it really matter if the owner still has its own copy? You take something wich is for sale without paying! Last time I've checked this is called theft.
____
Obey their products, obey their rules.
Sine mid june I'm father of a premature infant which lies in intensive care in a hospital.
At each incubator there is a terminal which keeps track of monitoring informations, medical treatment, vital functions and stuff like that. These systems are running on win nt 4.
One of the central monitoring and alertsystems -which gives an overview of the vital functions of all infants and broadcasts alerts- runs on windows nt4.
Just imagine if these systems got infected...
There are os'es which have proven to be rockstable, like qnx. Why don't they use'em?
That means that in a 90 minute movie you have 7.2 minutes where you don't see anything, just some black screen with music in the background?