Slashdot Mirror

The machine's designers must not be able to explain how their original code led to this new program.

If I'm not mistaken, this has already happened when evolutionary algorithms were applied to hardware design: some slides. The author of the program has no idea how the resulting circuit worked.

The European Computer Driving License may be helpful here. See http://www.bcs.org/server.php?show=nav.5829 for a syllabus.

Each discipline has it's own professional body who are permitted to issue the certification, and guess what? The BCS (British Computer Society) are one of those bodies, and can award CEng status to suitably qualified people.

And let me guess, less than 1% of the programmers actually have CEng status? The arguement was never about programmers not being engineers, it was that every idiot sitting infront of a computer these days calls themselves an engineer. Heck the guy who came to install my airconditioning had "Airconditioning Engineer written on his card." The way he acted though he may as well have been a trade apprentice.

I always think it's hysterical when American engineers get so up in arms about "mere" programmers daring to call themselves engineers. In the UK, the status of Chartered Engineer is given to trained, professional engineers in many disciplines. Each discipline has it's own professional body who are permitted to issue the certification, and guess what? The BCS (British Computer Society) are one of those bodies, and can award CEng status to suitably qualified people. There's no mention of having to understand Newtonian Mechanics as a prerequisite...

The ECDL: Its been thought of already.

And its as much use as a chocolate teapot!

You know, technically there are more recent Fortran specs. Fortran gets hauled out in the form of FORTRAN77 every time someone wants to talk trash about an old language. However, just like C or C++ or Java, the language has evolved. Fortran 2003 has objects, a pretty cool module system and basic thread support.

So what you're saying is that language features do affect scalability? Well, that was precisely my point.

You know, technically there are more recent Fortran specs. Fortran gets hauled out in the form of FORTRAN77 every time someone wants to talk trash about an old language. However, just like C or C++ or Java, the language has evolved. Fortran 2003 has objects, a pretty cool module system and basic thread support. Fortran 2008 will have explicit support for splitting data over multiple cores (co-arrays). I don't know much about COBOL, except that some of the largest codebases in the world are written in COBOL.

yeah, strangely just before this I was reading that the year-old HP mini 2133 is the only HP laptop in the UK which uses Linux ...at least you'll be able to get one that looks like a handbag though...

i seriously doubt that an email which can be easily changed in a file can be used as the sole grounds for pressing charges. It ma however bolster a case where a user has been tracked by IP and the files have his email too.

In New Zealand there are Guilt Upon Accusation laws that punish before any trial, and now in the UK they are pushing for Guilt Upon Accusation laws.

So this isn't a major point really, I just mean to respond to the idea that it will get to the stage of pressing charges before punishment.

Tim Berners Lee now thinks he got it wrong; he now believes that URIs should have had the form http:com/example/blah/, rather than http://blah.example.com/.

However, it's pretty much always a support service. Therefore you should expect that you'll end up on call. Personally I don't like that part, but can't deny the extra pay is nice.

It's also a field where experience is what really really matters. Which means it can be tough to break into. Certifications and degrees are nice, but it's my '5 years in the industry' which opens doors, not the other bits of paper.

However as a starting point in 'building your career', I will suggest you look at:

• ITIL - IT infrastructure library. It's something that put me off initally, as it look a bit too much like icky-yuck processes and procedures. However, I've run into a _lot_ of companies that are starting to 'buy in' to the model. That wouldn't convince me, though. What did, is it's actually a fairly good way of 'doing IT'. Not the only way by any means, but one worth looking at, if only because then you have a basis for comparison.
• SAGE Systems Administrators guild, a subdivision of Usenix.
• BCS British Computer Society
• The Practice of System and Network Administration (Paperback) - A personal favourite, this is a brilliant book, because it covers the _theory_ of systems admin.

As far as I can tell, your bits of paper serve to help you secure an interview. But the field's .... well sufficiently complicated and convoluted that your ability to learn, research and innovate are far more important. As is your ability to show you can do this.

Seriously, until IT has its own professional body that REQUIRES IT workers to be qualified/certificed in the same way as other professionals, its a career to steer clear of.

If you're in the UK, investigate the Institute of Engineering and Technology or the British Computer Society (the latter is more applicable to IT in the traditional sense of the term).

/me looks at Computing degree certificate hanging on wall....

It says there I'm an Engineer, in fact it says I'm a "Master of Engineering, First Class". But I don't design circuits and know little about electronics. In fact, if you're in the UK you can get full Chartered Engineer status (CEng) from the BCS - and that's as Engineery as it's possible to get.

http://www.bcs.org/server.php?show=nav.5829

European Computer Driving License. ECDL. I know quite a number of students at the 17-18 age group have gone for these in the UK, and a number of companies are supporting staff getting them - it at least signifies that someone has proved themselves capable of understanding the use of a computer to a basic extent.

It sounds like you should take a course in Project Management, and get a handle on how people handle budgeting and resource issues for projects, large and small.

If you're in the UK, the British Computer Society (BCS) offers some qualifications in this area.

I wonder if the BCS is trying to do little more than draw attention to itself in order to prop up its sagging relevance.

I liked/agreed with their assessment of the issue - but disagree with the conclusion. My reading of it (summery) is "computer science students are dwindling, because it's hard - well tough - it's what we're going to teach them like it or not"

There is no doubt that CS students are dwindling. My query is - does it matter? don't get me wrong - we NEED CompSci students. They have a place. But we also need grunts to maintain the infrastructure of business and industry. These people are NOT comp-sci graduates.

IT is a commodity in businesses (i'd find a reference to an article but got a bub to go grab and look after). the IT infrastructure is vital to businesses. CS people design - not maintain. I wonder where we're getting the maintainers from.

It was an article about a report, not the report itself. If you want details then go to the link specified in the article: The Grand Challenges report.

here in the UK the BCS in conjunction with the Engineering Council do accreditation for Chartered Engineer (CEng) status, and the new Chartered IT Professional (CITP) too.

Neither cover all important points and both have problems, but they are a good start. In particular neither are very clear when two requirements contradict. For example from the BCS Code of Conduct:
3. You shall have regard to the legitimate rights of third parties.
may contradict
4. You shall ensure that within your professional field/s you have knowledge and understanding of relevant legislation, regulations and standards, and that you comply with such requirements.
In some cases where DMCA or EUCD apply.

Despite these problems, the various documents are certainly worth a look:

• BCS Code of Conduct
• BCS Code of Practice
• ACM Code of Ethics and Professional Conduct

Neither cover all important points and both have problems, but they are a good start. In particular neither are very clear when two requirements contradict. For example from the BCS Code of Conduct:
3. You shall have regard to the legitimate rights of third parties.
may contradict
4. You shall ensure that within your professional field/s you have knowledge and understanding of relevant legislation, regulations and standards, and that you comply with such requirements.
In some cases where DMCA or EUCD apply.

Despite these problems, the various documents are certainly worth a look:

• BCS Code of Conduct
• BCS Code of Practice
• ACM Code of Ethics and Professional Conduct

Neither cover all important points and both have problems, but they are a good start. In particular neither are very clear when two requirements contradict. For example from the BCS Code of Conduct:
3. You shall have regard to the legitimate rights of third parties.
may contradict
4. You shall ensure that within your professional field/s you have knowledge and understanding of relevant legislation, regulations and standards, and that you comply with such requirements.
In some cases where DMCA or EUCD apply.

Despite these problems, the various documents are certainly worth a look:

• BCS Code of Conduct
• BCS Code of Practice
• ACM Code of Ethics and Professional Conduct