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I had no interest in trying to support a Windows PeeCee from 800 miles away, so I spent the bucks on the [overpriced] touchpad. I think it was worth it, because the damn thing just works, day after day, and I don't have to worry about Outlook viruses, IE security holes, or *shudder* Windows Update.

I was one of the first people to buy one of these. I had been waiting since November 1999 for someone to come to market with a net appliance that would work for my mom. ThinkNIC? No. Audrey? No. MSN Companion? Dear God, no. IMac? Sorry, I don't know anything about Mac's, so I wouldn't be able to support her.

I paid $650 for one of these as soon as it came out (it's way cheaper now, see below). The AOL-only factor is actually a positive for me, because it's great for old-lady types like my mom (and probably yours). No porn SPAM, no three hour calls trying to explain to my mom what a VBS script virus is, no Comet-cursor privacy crap.

AOL and Gateway are marketing this as a second terminal for your household, but it works great as the only terminal. Built-in modem.

The whole thing is just really well designed and rock solid. Well, it's rock solid and fully featured now after a few more months of software upgrades. Hell, the thing upgrades itself! Back in March, AOL/Gateway/Midori released an OS upgrade that downloaded itself (24 MB, ugh) and installed itself. She just let it chug for an hour and it was done.

I'm 800 miles away and have better things to do than provide phone support to my mom.

My only complaint is that it's a little slow.

And now, if you try hard, you can buy one for $200, and even hack it into a pure linux/windoze box if you're so inclined. Come on in guys, the water's fine.

This unit is being discussed quite heavily at
http://www.kenseglerdesigns.com/cgi-bin/UltraBoard /UltraBoard.pl.

Check in for discussions on hacking these, and other, internet appliances and related electronic toys.

Here is someone who spent some time on the issue.

link

Bruce Perens, the man who got his nose all bent outta shape over Corel's violation had the reaction of "so what". But given the strong tie of Bruce to the embedded linux end of things....the only defender of the GPL is RMS. Everyone else is looking out for thier pocketbook.

If the GPL isn't legally enforceable, there really isn't any point to it.

More like the will to enforce it.

As this post points out:
http://www.kenseglerdesigns.com/cgi-bin/UltraBoard /UltraBoard.pl?Action=ShowPost&Board=vwgeneral&Pos t=58&Idle=0&Sort=0&Order=Descend&Page=5&Session=

I recently got a virign webplayer (http://www.virginconnectme.com/). It runs Linux as it's operating system.
2.2 Webplayer Software License. Subject to the provisions of this Agreement, we grant to you a limited, non-exclusive, personal, non-transferable license to use and display the Webplayer Software in object code form only, solely as part of and as necessary to use the Webplayer and the Virginconnect Services. Except for the license granted to you above, we (or our licensors) retain all right, title and interest, including all intellectual property rights, in and to the Webplayer Software. You may not attempt(or authorize any attempt) to defeat, obstruct or block any or all of the Webplayer Software functionality, or to decompile, reverse engineer or disassemble the Webplayer or the Webplayer Software.

I guess when you have big lawyers (Virgin) and no will to enforce the GPL (unless it's someone you feel you can bully) GPL violations will go unanswered. Oh, and be sure to only report the 'victories', while patting yourselfs on the back about how wonderful the GPL is. I'm sure this story will be filled with hype about how great the GPL is, and how powerful the 'rights' of the GPL are. Yet, a clear violation - the Virgin Webplayer - and no action.

more instructions (kind of duplicates the earlier offerings but different source)

a great messageboard of all topics webplayer

Slashdot's last article on the webplayer

If you feel left out, because the co-op is out of WebPlayers, check out ebay which has some WebPlayers for sale. Some of them are even less than the $110 offered by the co-op.

I'm planning on taking my WebPlayer apart, not reprogramming it. If you're into that as well, check out this page.

Thalia

This bulletin board is dedicated to hacking the webplayer and other appliances. I am going to try to put a laptop HD in mine in a few weeks and then use it as an MP3 player for the car...

See EBay, or just stroll in to Target and plunk down $299. It's a fine X terminal running Jailbait, or check out the Linux Terminal Server Project if you don't want to put a disk on it but do want more than what JailBait provides. Or check out the bboard ; ; at http://www.linux-hacker.net for details on everything necessary to turn an I-Opener into a standard Linux machine.

See http://www.linux-hacker.net and read the I-Appliance Discussion Forum BBS . You can use an SMC 10/100 or similar USB Ethernet adapter (be careful, not all work).

Fellow Virgin WebPlayer owners (in case you got one -- I do!), here's the news you've been waiting for. As reported on The Register, and found in the new WebPlayer FAQ's, you do not have to return your webplayer and you do not have to pay anything for it. Pretty nifty, especially if we can figure out how to hack it. Read up more on this message board.

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I have one of these things. And, it's really funny too because I already packed mine up and was planning on sending it back to them - then I got the email telling me that they were being discontinued. So, lucky for me now I don't have to pay shipping back to them! Actually I'm hoping they'll let us keep the damn thing and just forget about it. Is it really worth spending the time on? I took mine apart soon after I got it. It has an M-Systems Disk On Chip 2000 64Mb flash memory card with embedded Linux. I have found a site from an EE where he talks about hacking it - check it out here. It's got an open IDE connector but the question was always the BIOS. Nobody has ever successfully removed the DiskOnChip and gotten the iBrow (aka "Webplayer") to boot. Apparently the BIOS has a password that noone has been able to hack yet. The message boards over on the Linux-hacker site have a section dedicated to the Virgin Webplayer. But, as far as I know the project has advanced very far. When I took it apart, the only thing I reall wanted out of it was the Samsung flat panel LCD screen. Oh well.. we'll see what happens

Just found THIS

Click on "Virgin Webplayer"

And then on " It looks like Linux...invoke the GPL? "

Could it be that it runs linux after all ??

--
Why pay for drugs when you can get Linux for free ?

• CPU is mounted on the motherboard. You're not going to be upgrading this thing.
• There is a single SODIMM socket on the bottom of the motherboard. It comes with a 64MB CAS2 SODIMM module.
• There is an intact IDE header, marked CN12.
• There's also a CN13, which is marked as the FDD connect, but isn't populated.
• CN11 isn't populated either; it's marked as the CF Card Conn (Compact Flash).
• CN5 is also unpopulated, marked as the IRDA connector.
• The most interesting connector is CN16, marked as the MINI PCI connector. I wonder if there are any mini-ethernet device available. Maybe even a wireless product.
• CN6 is a com port header, in addition to BC15, which is the modem connector. It has the same style modem as the I-O (size & location of the connectors).
• CN19 is unpopulated, and marked as the VGA connector.
• The BIOS chip is also an SST 39F020, the same as an I-O.
• I've removed the DOC and the CMOS battery to try and get into the BIOS. No luck. It still keeps asking for the password.

There is more discussion over at www.kenseglerdesigns.com. Down near the bottom is a Virgin Webplayer discussion I can't link to because of /. inserting spaces in long links. And of course lots more info on hacking other Net Appliances www.linux-hacker.net.

I don't see how these loss leaders are going to make it until they begin to at least clear the manufacturing cost of the machine. Netpliance learned the hard way but at least they're still in business, sort of. And since their unit is now sold close to cost the restrictive TOS is a thing of the past. But the WebSurfer people bit the dust, now Virgin is pulling their project...

I think people really do want cheap internet terminals. But these companies are selling to the wrong crowd. Net Terminals should be going up at local businesses in little kiosks. Our public librarys running wasteful NT machines should go back to diskless stations. Our cities could be full of access that offered the same promotional capabilities. From there, you could sell home users a system that was at least used in their community rather than a dead product that's useless without the service.

Check out the BBS here. This started as a I-opener hacking site, but has evolved into a more general internet appliance, etc. hacking site. Recomend it to everyone.

>The only reason there exist any alternatives to closed, proprietary software

Last time *I* checked, the BSD software license is free and open, and was in existance before the RMS concieved GPL.

>he is such a stubborn, uncompromising bastard.
Methinks that is the point of the AC in question....there is bound to be infringements.

An example:
on a GPL violation/and a lack of action.

Here's an udpate for everyone on the Virgin Webplayer
/ Merinata GPL violation.

This is in response to my original posting to the
Linux kernel mailing list; I'm including that post
here:

>I've read through months of archives, trying to find
a
>good place to report this, but have not been able to
>find anything.
>
>Where is a good place to report GPL violations
>concerning the Linux Kernel?
>
>I recently got a virign webplayer
>(http://www.virginconnectme.com/). It runs Linux as
>it's operating system. There's no mention of Linux or
>the GPL in the license that is included in the
manual.
>In fact the license in the manual concerning the
>"Software" is rather restrictive. And there's no
>mention of how to obtain the source for the kernel.
>
>The people who sell the machine to virgin, is Merinta
>(http://www.merinta.com/). You can verify that the
>machines virgin use are running linux
>(http://www.merinta.com/news/release000411.html).
>Merinta, from what I understand from posts by
>(presumedly) employees of Boundless (their mother
>corporation) have many GPL violations according to:
>http://www.kenseglerdesigns.com/cgi-bin/UltraBoar d/UltraBoard.pl?Action=ShowPost&Board=vwg eneral&Post=17&Idle=0&Sort=0&Order=Descend&Page=0& Session=
I like the idea of all these new Internet devices
>coming out, running Linux. But it worries me that
>they'll all ignore the GPL as they go. Making it more
>difficult for fututre improvements in the kernel
code.
>
>
>
>I'm not on the Linux kernel mailing list. So please
CC
>me directly at jelwell@yahoo.com.
>
>Thanks,
>Joseph Elwell.

In my investigation to determine whether Virgin's
Webplayer, manufactured by Merinta, I've documented
the section of the License Agreement that deals with
the Software installed; that ships with the Virgin
Webplayer.

Section 2.2 of the member agreements reads as follows:

2.2 Webplayer Software License. Subject to the
provisions of this Agreement, we grant to you a
limited, non-exclusive, personal, non-transferable
license to use and display the Webplayer Software in
object code form only, solely as part of and as
necessary to use the Webplayer and the Virginconnect
Services. Except for the license granted to you above,
we (or our licensors) retain all right, title and
interest, including all intellectual property rights,
in and to the Webplayer Software. You may not attemp
(or authorize any attempt) to defeat, obstruct or
block any or all of the Webplayer Software
functionality, or to decompile, reverse engineer or
disassemble the Webplayer or the Webplayer Software.

Below is a listing of the filesystem that is currently
(roughly 7/28/2000); some sections I've not filled in
due the immensity of the files listed in those (and
subdirectories of those). If someone asks me nicely
-with reason - I'll fill those sections in:

Some highlights of the filesystem (which make me
believe they're also running a GNU system (which
wasn't mentioned on their press release - but is of
course heavily implied when they say the machine runs
the "Linux operating system".):
/usr/lib/libg++.so.2.7.2
/usr/lib/libg++.so.2.7.2.8
/usr/lib/libstdc++.so.2.7.2
/usr/lib/libstdc++.so.2.7.2.8

I usually hang out on the I-Appliance BBS since the I-Opener hack craze. After hearing about the :Cue :Cat, I got one from RatShack, threw out the software and wrote my own decoder in VB. It features editable translation tables, automatic copy to clipboard, no privacy invasion, and fully unoptimized 16-bit code. I mostly wrote it out of boredom. It was also totally written on a hacked Netpliance I-Opener; that should provide a nice warm fuzzy feeling. It's available for download here: http://members.aol.com/amdinside/catcra ck.exe Yep, AOL - I found a use for that account that I never use, posting files. Every freedrive/free web space place seems to bring up a million advertisments on file downloads.

From the Netpliance I-Opener hacking board: Great GPS implementation has both Win and Linux stuff in it.

This may be more to the point: GPS for Linux on the same board. Mentions Mayko, which is what I will be trying on my vehicle-mounted I-Opener, but on FreeBSD. Not exactly trip planning software, but covers the navigation portion of your question.

Visit DC2600

From the Netpliance I-Opener hacking board: Great GPS implementation has both Win and Linux stuff in it.

This may be more to the point: GPS for Linux on the same board. Mentions Mayko, which is what I will be trying on my vehicle-mounted I-Opener, but on FreeBSD. Not exactly trip planning software, but covers the navigation portion of your question.

Visit DC2600

Then, I start to think about the I-Opener. A modem. No ethernet.

I-Opener has one USB port (contrary to a false rumour, you can add another if you like surface mount soldering). The USB can be adapted to ethernet if you like. The caviat here is that Netpliance does not support any of the above, even thought the hardware does (kinda).

You can check the latest progress on I-Opener hacking here, including the processor upgrades up to K6-III 333 AFK (it is an OEM chip, Fry's has tham all).

The point is well taken that it does not seem like the manufacturers want to enable this capability, even if it is sitting there waiting to be activated. Kinda disappointing.

Visit DC2600

With 8 meg ROM and 2 meg RAM, how can you add your own 'stuff' to the box, other than data.

If they want to support the Open Source market, they have to have something to sync *TO*. And, at this time there are MANY different things to sync to.

One thing that has NOT been pressed is the GPL in the embedded market. Here is an example of an embedded GPL box where no source has been released. To date, no action on getting the source.

It would be nice to think the GPL/Linux will protect developers who choose to develop for Unix-based PDA's, but without access to source, you run the risk of being Steve'd...just like the Newton developers did.

you can probably save even more money with this:

WebPal
Goto linux-hacker and on his BBS you will see a category called WebPal. This is a $69 ARM computer that hooks up to your television. Currently, we're trying to install linux on it. It's very linux-able and I'm sure I'll have it working in another week or two. I plan to use it as a file server, but it has much potential as a router/firewall too.

--

The moral of the story is: Circuit City will not, in all likelyhood, EVER call you to tell you that your machines are in. I'm amazed that in my case they had the "courtesy" to make what they thought was a preemptive service call.

As a side note, I personally feel that Kalin Harvey's article is right on the mark. While I refuse to become personally outraged by the behavior of many of Slashdot's denziens towards Netpliance (not to mention the unforgivable and completely unintelligent arrogance of many of the regulars on Ken Segler's iOpener BBS), I firmly disagree with the thought that Netpliance is "screwing the hacker/open source community". They've got a specific business model (a very good one IMHO) and it specifically doesn't include providing the world's cheapest X terminals to self-righteous geeks. I've never seen a community more quick to cry "Fuck the bozos! Why isn't the Man doing something about this?!?" when a free lunch turns out to be less than the golden goose with the singing harp thrown in for good measure. The only faults I find with Netpliance's behavior are a lack of foresight ("Do not underestimate the power of the Dark Geek") and a willingness to act rashly out of corporate panic (epoxy? clipping IDE header pins? Retroactive service contracts? PLEASE.). However, many of Netpliance's critics suffer the same general failures.

I count myself lucky to have gotten an iOpener at all, and would gladly have tipped my hat in salute to Netpliance had they successfully prevented me from causing them to loose another ~$200.

Some files are mirrored and more info is coming here:
http://www.geocities.com/d1v3rs1ty/

Some files are mirrored and more info is coming here:
http://www.geocities.com/d1v3rs1ty/

According to this guy CompUSA's cost on these is only $25. I wonder what that actual cost of producing
these suckers is.

As someone who has had an I-Opener on order since the last slashdot article, I am dissapointed that Netpliance has taken up such a hostile attitude towards the hackers who are essentially developing other Netpliance product lines. I've been watching an I-Opener message board and there are people doing marvelous things with hackable (and some non-hackable) I-Os. A popular use is to mount the device in a car and use it as a GPS, MP3 player and/or digital dashboard. The "hackers" (term used loosely, no flame por favor) are going out of their way by a long-shot to modify these devices for general use, sometimes costing hundreds of Altarian dollars.

I believe that if Netpliance offered a slightly more expensive general-use I-Opener they would be astounded at the uses the community will come up with, and the ingenuity of the geeks they're trying so hard to thwart may become a key ally in the company's longevity

Would that be a C-to-B business model?

Looks like a few others had the same problem.

Now the question remains, why am I bothering to reply to lame ass AC's anyways, as usually when they post anonymously, they don't know shit.

im working on my fifth right now, internet access in every room! check out my buddies link for a full set of diagrams