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Enigma Machine Stolen

bullgod writes "The BBC is reporting this story about the theft of one of the remaining three Enigma machines. Bummer! Presumably stolen to order -- I doubt you could fence one of these. Lets hope it's found & returned soon." You might also want to check out the Enigma displayed at the National Cryptologic Museum, run by the same folks who deny bringing you Echelon.

42 of 126 comments (clear)

  1. Re:Theft by troc · · Score: 2

    For an interesting fictional account of the Enigma etc, try Bruce Sterling's Cryptonomicon (or however it's spelled) - was reviewed on here a while back.

    Bloody good read

    Troc

    --
    Troc's dubious podcast and blog: http://www.trocnet.net
  2. Re:Theft by troc · · Score: 2

    Yeah, that'll be it. Ooops :)

    troc

    --
    Troc's dubious podcast and blog: http://www.trocnet.net
  3. Cultural Theft... by szyzyg · · Score: 2

    You know - I've love one of these....

    I live in Armagh where there have been a couple of 'cultural' thefts recently - an Original Copy of 'Gullivers Travels' with handwritten notes by the author is probably the most famous. We're worried about this at the observatory where we have some really unique items - like the first anemometer, Earnshaw's first clock, and even the first copy fo the NGC catalogue.....

    Still it's a shame that the really important historical artifacts related to the enigma were all destroyed in the name of secrecy. The Mechanical 'bombs' used for cracking and the collossus computers.... It's tragic that the UK had secretly built 10 electronic computers before the ENIAC grabbed headlines across the world, but they were all destroyed....

    So... who are the real cultural thieves?

  4. A Rolling Stone... by kzinti · · Score: 2

    What I found most interesting about the article is the tidbit near the end about Mick Jagger owning an Enigma machine (of a different type than the one stolen). He may gather no moss, but antique crypto equipment is another matter.

    --Jim

  5. __German__ Enigma by Ex+Machina · · Score: 2

    A lot of people have failed to recognize that this was a German Enigma, not one of the machines used by Turing and Friends at Bletchley Park to crack the codes.

    I know who took them.The flying robots with the "Powered by Windows 2000" REALLY gave it away. Bill and friends took it over the weekend and paid the (foolish) thieves in MSFT shares, which stand to loose much of their value right away on Monday (thanks Judge Jackson!).

    " Not only was that goal achieved, but the story of Station X is being turned into a £90m Hollywood blockbuster starring Harvey Keitel and Jon Bon Jovi. " - Who is playing Turing? Anyone have a link to more info?

  6. Press Release by Ex+Machina · · Score: 2

    2 April 2000 ENIGMA MACHINE STOLEN FROM BLETCHLEY PARK Yesterday afternoon, an Enigma three rotor cypher machine was stolen from the mansion at Bletchley Park, home of the world war 2 codebreakers and birthplace of the communications revolution. The machine, whose value is difficult to assess, appears to have been taken from a display case while the Park was open to visitors. It was used during the war to protect German secret messages. Enigma machines exchange hands for cash values starting at several thousand pounds. Trust Director Christine Large said, "This is a selfish act, calculated to deprive the visitors and students at Bletchley Park of the chance to enjoy and appreciate a unique piece of history. The Trust will be deeply grateful for any information that may lead to the return of the machine." Meanwhile, leading national security firm Polaris Telemetry, which has agreed to sponsor the installation and management of a comprehensive, high tech security system at Bletchley Park, is speeding up its plans to complete the work. Within the week, the first phase of the 'MicroLan' network on the Park will be in operation. All sensitive information and equipment will be asset-tagged. There will be infra red labelling and television monitoring both on the site and at the Polaris Telemetry control centre. For information: Christine Large - 07971 193546 / 020 7737 7220

  7. Re:German for eternity? by Detritus · · Score: 2
    As for America's involvement, it managed to get half the ships sunk on the east coast because the US government was too big headed to acknowledge intelligence from Bletchley about a fleet of u-boats heading across the Atlanic.

    It was more complicated than that. Adm. King was slow to institute a convoy system and he didn't like the Brits. The Royal Navy also had to relearn the lessons of World War I u-boat warfare the hard way. There have been several good books written on Operation Drumbeat/Paukenschlag that cover this in detail.

    --
    Mea navis aericumbens anguillis abundat
  8. Re:The *real* story of the Enigma [correction] by orpheus · · Score: 2
    Oy Vey!

    I hate it when people cite this book without even getting the name of the main character right!

    The author of the book is William SteVenson
    The main character is William StePHenson

    It always makes me worry about how carefully they read the book. When I read it (as a teenager, back in the 70's), the coincidence in names struck me immediately -- it's kind of hard to miss, no?

    __________

    --

    If you can go to bed, knowing you did a valuable thing today, you're very lucky. If you can't... it's not bedtime

  9. Historical accuracy of "Intrepid" by orpheus · · Score: 2
    I know it's bad form to reply to your own post, but I wanted to make two posts, one based on facts I verified before posting (with my +1, since the error could lead people to believe 'Intrepid' was an autobiography, and needed to be corrected) and one based on opinions and slightly faded which don't warrant a (+1) Alas, this is the only way /. will let me post the second part.

    When I read the book, I was amazed by the ease and success with which this man moved between widely disparate fields. While this was common for the great polymaths of past centuries and was probably still possible in England in the mid 20th century (when social contacts were everything -- though they're still pretty bloody important today, in almost any nation) I felt a surge of envy at the 'good old days' for polymaths

    But it really did strain credulity that this man knocked Baron von Richthoven out of the sky (Sir Stephenson was an ace, but with, I'm told, 8 kills not 26), helped develop a television system at Bell Labs, was key in developing an Allied jet engine (which didn't fit my recollection of jet engine history), pushed critical military technologies through (like the Spitfire), and kept a full plate of intelligence credits, any one of which would hav earned him a place in history on both sides of the Atlantic.

    Clearly he was a major player in Anglo-US intelligence, but a lot of historians dismissed the book as 'historical fiction', and cited very specific objections.

    In fairness, I have been told by a friend who keeps up on such things that records declassified in the 80's and 90's offer some justification for some (but not all) of the book's claims. I say "some justification" because the facts still don't quite jibe, but many of the new revelations were surprising enough that they are strong points in the book's favor.

    It's fascinating reading, and gets many obscure details exactly right, but it's far from a history text (biographies seldom lack 'spin') and can still be accused of getting significant events quite seriously wrong.

    I loved the book, but I was disturbed to hear the original poster claim that reading it mean he probably had his facts straight. The history of debate on this book makes it an unlikely contender for *that* comment


    __________

    --

    If you can go to bed, knowing you did a valuable thing today, you're very lucky. If you can't... it's not bedtime

  10. Play with an enigma machine! by tlhIngan · · Score: 2
    Here's a java implementation of an enigma machine. I believe it emulates the deficiencies of the machine as well (sometimes a rotor will increment twice in a certain position). Also contains some information about it.

  11. U-571 by MatriXOracle · · Score: 2

    The "Hollywood Blockbuster" mentioned at the article is U-571, which looks like it's gonna be pretty cool. Doesn't it seem awfully coincidental that an enigma machine is stolen a mere 3 weeks before a movie about stealing an enigma machine opens? Hmmmm..... (play X-Files music here)

  12. Bad news by chazR · · Score: 2

    I can only assume that this machine was stolen to order. They are of limited usefulness for cryptographic purposes these days.

    I think it's very sad. This is one of only three Enigma machines left. It was used by the Abwehr (SS), so it a particularly well-engineered machine. It's hard to imagine who would want one. The Bletchley museum was opened recently after a huge amount of work, largely by volunteers.

    If any good can come from this, it may draw attention once again to the astonishing work done at Bletchley Park. As part of their efforts to break the Enigma cipher, they built some of the earliest electronic computers (some would say *the* first electronic computer)

    Check here for more information.

  13. Must be loads of Enigma's still around by LucVdB · · Score: 2

    According to the Deutsches Museum Enigma Page (in English), between 100,000 and 200,000 Enigma machines were built during World War II.
    The Polish were breaking Enigma ciphers as early as December 1932 and January 1933, as mentioned in passing here - in fact it was Polish dissidents that delivered an Enigma to Bletchley Park.
    This page has some recent Enigma selling prices in case you want to start saving up for one (prices start around $15000).
    I wonder what's so special about the stolen one, and why there's only three of that type remaining...

  14. It seems more like a prank by DanaL · · Score: 2

    Given the fact that there are only three of these things in the world, it probably won't be sold over the internet. Gee...there's an Enigma machine on Ebay, it wonder if it is the stolen one?

    My guess it that it was meant to be a prank, or someone who on a whim thought, "That will look cool in my flat!" and grabbed it. My fear now would be that since such a big deal was made about the theft, the thief will try to destroy the evidence, rather than return it.

    Dana

  15. Re:20 whole or partial?? by Mr.+Protocol · · Score: 2

    Gee, what part of "whole or partial" didn't you understand?

  16. Theft by Datafage · · Score: 2
    This is among the worst types of theft: cultural theft. This is so because it is not theft from one or a few people, but from much of the world, similar to the American habit of destroying foreign culture and replacing it with our own (yes, I come from the USA and I say this). I hope that not only they find the thief, but that the punishment is quite severe. After all, there can be no serious attempt to justify a light sentence based on thieving to live or being unaware of committing a crime.

    -----------------------

    --

    Nicotine free Amish .sig.

    1. Re:Theft by HowIsMyDriving? · · Score: 2

      IIRC the Enigma was invented in the Netherlands for use by corperations in 1919. Then a German bought the rights and improved the disign and called it the Enigma.
      Before the War, Some the Poles got a hold of 3 stolen machines from the German army and started their own codebreaking in 1938. Before Poland was invaded, the Crypto team from Poland smuggled all the stuff out to England and helped the British at Bleachly Park. (Sp?)
      There are manyt good books about the History of the Enigma. Also NOVA and the History channel both have good programs on it if you live in the US.

      --
      Welcome to the Entropy Bar, may I take your order?
    2. Re:Theft by Millennium · · Score: 3

      This is among the worst types of theft: cultural theft.

      Perhaps, but then the question becomes: whose culture? The machine was stolen from Britain, but the machine is German in origin. The machine was already stolen property when it was taken. Depending on who stole it, then your logic might even justify this theft as merely taking it back from the real thieves.

      This is so because it is not theft from one or a few people, but from much of the world...

      Point here. But that machine is still, I sumbit, more of a historical artifact than a cultural one.

      similar to the American habit of destroying foreign culture and replacing it with our own (yes, I come from the USA and I say this).

      OK, I want to hear a defense of this point. Are you traing to say that American culture has no right to exist? Or that it is somehow inferior to others? The way I see it, American culture has exactly as much a right to exist as any other culture; no more, true, but certainly no less either. If you're going to try and say which culture is superior and which isn't (and you certainly sound as though you are doing this), then I wonder where the hell you get off thinking you're in any position to do that. I know I'm not, and I very much doubt anyone here on Slashdot is, because guess what: no one is in that position. Least of all those who are so egotistical they actually think they are.

      After all, there can be no serious attempt to justify a light sentence based on thieving to live or being unaware of committing a crime.

      Strange; last I checked ignorance of the law is generally considered an extremely weak defense, and certainly wouldn't work in this case.

  17. Re:enigma warez ftp sitez by billstewart · · Score: 2
    The standard international crypto FTP sites have them:

    http://www.funet.fi/ftp/pub/crypt/

    ftp://ftp.ox.ac.uk/pub/crypto/misc/

    --

    Bill Stewart
    New Fast-Compression-only CPR http://preview.tinyurl.com/dy575ks
  18. eBay? by shabble · · Score: 2
    It is feared the thieves may try to sell the machine on the internet.
    The author of the book Station X, Michael Smith, called it a "devastating blow", but said he did not believe the machine had been stolen to order.
    Hmm - wonder if they're gonna start looking at eBay?
  19. Re:Enigma cracked? by Crixus · · Score: 2
    Best as I recall (I've got a book on Bletchley Park round here somewhere....) the std Enigma used 5 wheels, while the Naval one used 6

    The standard Enigma machine used 3 rotors, but came with a selection of 5 to choose from.

    Naval enigma used 4 rotors with 8 (IIRC) to choose from.

    --
    Ignore Alien Orders
  20. Re:But it has the keyboard from Hell by Crixus · · Score: 2
    I've had the chance to try an Enigma machine; a speaker for EE380 at Stanford brought one by last year. It's the keyboard machine from Hell; key travel is about an inch and takes over a pound of pressure. The pressure on the keys advances the wheels, and since the wheels have 52 wiper contacts each, they're hard to rotate.

    I used a 3-rotor machine at the NSA's crypto museum in VA and didn't find it difficult. Perhaps the NSA's machine is better maintained.

    --
    Ignore Alien Orders
  21. Re:The *real* story of the Enigma by dingbat_hp · · Score: 2

    So, there you are, the real history of the ENIGMA

    Why is it, that whenever you see that sort of phrase, you just know it's going to be wrong ?

    The Colossii weren't for solving Enigma, nor did Stevenson solve it single-handed (neither did Welchman either, despite his book). Bletchley Park didn't touch Purple and certainly didn't know about Pearl Harbour. The Polish Enigma work and the invention of the Bombe pre-dated Heydrich.

    If you're going to claim accuracy in a posting like this, then at least get the facts right. After all, there's enough authorative information out on the Net to do it easily (and Bletchley's own site is a good start).

    I was one of BTS '82 at Horwood House / Bletchley Park - any other BTS out there ?

  22. This is a strange crime... by alexhmit01 · · Score: 2

    This is rather bizarre. With only three machines, this will have no value to any legitamet collector. I question the purpose of this crime. Conceivably, someone just walked off with it, but you would think that robbing a guarded museum would be difficult and require SOME sort of planning.

    This is obviosly the work of a mobster. Some bigwig in organized crime with a private museum. Law abiding wealthy people wouldn't take the risk, so it is obviously a crime lord who wants it.

    It probably wasn't really guarded. Either the guard swiped it, or somebody took it while a guard was asleep. They probably figured it was valuable, and didn't realize that there were only three. Assuming that hundreds were made, they probably figured that it would net a small fortune on the black market to people that would sell it to collectors... Start checking nearby pawn shops.

    The part that bothers me about this crime is the mention of the Internet. With absolutely no evidence to back this up, they blame technology for creating a market for stolen items. As a result, they will motivate technophobes to blame technology and increase regulations... despite technology playing no role in this...

    Alex

  23. Prized Abacus Stolen by The_Messenger · · Score: 2
    Prized Abacus Stolen
    from the bead-it-just-bead-it dept.

    A break-in at the Museum of Old and Useless Stuff at Cambridge last night resulted in the theft of a priceless Intel Abacus, dating from the fiteenth century. This particular abacus belonged to Intel's first line of 64-bead Abacuses, which changed the mathematics world forever, by providing unparalleled performance gains in both adding and subtracting. Until the University is able to buy the abacus back on E-bay, the professors will have to research their physics theories using the even more ancient Fingers'N'Toes technology.

    Professor Hawking, unable to move his fingers or toes, will have his nurse jack him off into a paper cup until the abacus is returned.

    In related news...

    Enigma Machine Stolen
    from the man-timothy-must be bored-dept.

    The BBC is reporting the theft of one of the remaining three Enigma machines. A CIA spokesman is quoted as saying, "We could break the cyphertext with a $5.99 pocket calculator. Britain may have lost a priceless museum piece, but the theif has gained a handy footrest. Oh, and this press release doesn't exist."

    --

    --
    I like to watch.

  24. Re:Enigma cracked? by Animats · · Score: 2
    • There's an out of print book, "Modern Machine Cryptography", which contains BASIC programs for cracking Enigma and Purple. Early '80s.
    • The submarine-capture story is real. The sub was the U-505, it was captured by a task group commanded by Adm. Daniel F. Gallery (who wrote a great story about it) and the sub itself is parked on land alongside the Museum of Science and Industry in Chicago, where it can be toured.
  25. Re:Enigma cracked? by Signail11 · · Score: 2

    I have _The Story of Magic_ and the information is not nearly enough to implement a realistic attack on PURPLE. An appropiate analogy would be Feynman's "Six Easy Pieces" versus something like "The Large Scale Structure of Space-Time" by Ellis, Hawking or Misner, Thorne, Wheeler's "Gravitation." You would be able to handwave a description of gtr with the first one, but you wouldn't be able to anything quantitative. Likewise, _The Story of Magic_ leaves out the all-critical details about the reconstruction of the V->V and C->C tables.

  26. 20 whole or partial?? by www.sorehands.com · · Score: 2
    Well, 20 partial machines won't do much good. Like having the all, but the one key McDonald's game piece for the $1,000,000 prize.

  27. Enigma cracked? by Ace905 · · Score: 2

    I found it strange the article mentions that "ever more complicated" versions of the Enigma were cracked - including the "naval" version.

    My understanding of the Enigma, was that the Naval version was so incredibly hard to crack, a German U-Boat had to be disabled and boarded so the Naval version could be stolen and reverse engineered.

    --

    Ace
    1. Re:Enigma cracked? by craw · · Score: 3
      FWIW, there may be some new info about JN-25 coming out (the Naval code is not to be confused with the diplomatic code). This is based on a recently published article that appeared in Proceedings of the US Naval Institute. JN-25 was based on substituting a word with a five digit number based on some code book. For instance, Yankee=35493, scumbag=12345, hacker=31335. The operator then sequentially "added" a random number that was looked up in another additive code book. It was not a true addition as the number were not carried over (6+9=5, not 15). Each code book consisted of about 30K entries.

      The code was broken because of two main reasons. First the coders tended to use the similar portions of the available additive numbers. Additionally, several words were repeated; for instance, numbers. Given enough intercept message traffic, patterns would then appear. For instance, hey look, the same number.

      Eventually, some repeating key words (actually five digit numbers) were identified, as well as some of the additive sequence numbers. These numbers were relative values. For instance, all the code words could start at zero, while all the additive numbers started at 1000. Or all the code words started at 1000, while all the additive numbers started at zero.

      The major breakthrough came when someone remembered that the Japanese had used an old four digit code that represented numbers in a know sequence. For instance, 0=0000, 1=0102, 2=0204 etc... Someone then realized that one deciphered code word was 13343, another was 13445, 13547, etc... Woops. As the article states, within a day, all numbers from 0-999 was known. Given this info, it made it easier to decipher the additive code.

      The second important item that you may have noticed is that the coded numbers are all divisible by three. Checksum error. After that, all applicable additive sequence had to yield a series of code words (5 digit numbers) that were divisible by three.
      BTW, the author of this article also found out (from the recently release classified docs) that JN-25 was not broken on Dec 7, 1941. Not even close. There was some indication that 10-15% of JN-25 transmissions were decoded. The problem was that this meant:

      xx dude xx xx xx xx xx xx first xx xx xx xx xx xx xx post xx xx xx petrified xx xx xx xx xx xx Hemos.

      Of course, the non-numerical coded number still had to be converted to their equivalent Japanese words.

    2. Re:Enigma cracked? by Signail11 · · Score: 5

      The Enigma was only used for short-term tactical communications. The Army and Air Force version used 3 wheels, while the later naval versions used 4 wheels. All of the Enigma cryptosystems shared certain traits that made them especially amenable to a type of cryptanalysis known as the Index of Coincidence method (a letter could never be encrypted to its plaintext equivalent). There was never any real need to capture a naval Enigma, although if this occured, it would certainly have been a great help. Later German innovations, such as the plugboard and better keying techniques, made it more difficult for British cryptanalysts to break Enigma messages in useful durations of time. While there are indeed more than 3 extant Enigma machines, I believe that the article refers to 3 of a specific type and manufacture.

      The details of the high-level encryption systems (such as the Lorentz cipher machines between German operational command and the leadership) have not ever been declassified yet, although it is known that they too were broken by the Allies. To this day, the details of how the Japanese PURPLE machine was broken are not known either. Rotor machines were used by the Allies as well during WWII, and by most nations until probably the late 1950s. It has additionally been rumored that codebreaking agencies had discovered astonishingly general techniques for breaking messages encrypted with rotor machines.

  28. ACHTUNG! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3

    VAS IST DAS?!? EIN ENIGMA MACHINE HAST FALLEN INTO THE HANDS OF DER ALLIES!!! Schweinhunden!!! VE MUSHT GET IT BACK AT ONCE! IF HIMMLER HEARS OF ZIS VE ARE ALL DEAD MEN!!!!

    Hang on...what year is it again?
    Never mind. I just get these spells.

    Obergruppenfuhrer Jones

  29. I know where it is! by Vic · · Score: 3

    It's hooked up to one of the Distributed.net projects!

  30. Not jsut the first computer by szyzyg · · Score: 3

    From what I heard there were up to 10 electropnic computers operating at Bletchly park.... plus of course all the mechanical crckers.

    So the eniac wasn't even in the first 10 computers....

    Even better - it makes IBM's assertion that there was a worldwide market for at most 5 computers even more ludicrous since twice that many had already been built.

  31. Re:There are a LOT more than three Enigmas... by philj · · Score: 3

    There are only three enigmas of the same type as the one that was stolen.

  32. Java Enigma Machine by philj · · Score: 3

    Here is a cool applet that simulates an enigma machine.

    ... and this is how it works.

  33. The *real* story of the Enigma by GwaiJai · · Score: 3

    I used to get into arguments with self-professed experts about this all the time, and seeing as i've read the biography of the man that put the whole project together, almost singlehandedly, i was inclined to believe i had my facts straight.

    I haven't read the book for a long time, but A Man Called Intrepid is what it is, written by William Stevenson, about Sir William Stevenson, the master spy code-named Intrepid. Stevenson was a canadian, and served as Churchill's liason to the US during the US's neutrality and helped Bill Donovon, Roosevelt's main inteligence man, create the OSS (precursor to the CIA). Stevenson was behind everything the british did in the Secret War, trained all the spies, helped design most of their equipment. From Russia With Love actually gives some really good examples of this gear, and guess where Ian Flemming got all his inspiration? He was one of Intrepid's men.

    But, back to the Enigma. The British built Collosus, the 1st computer (yes, it predates ENIAC) at Bletchley to crack the Enigma, but very few people know that in august, 1939 an Enigma was smuggled out of Poland. The Czechs attacked a convoy that was being escorted by Heydrich. Intrepid had his agents blow up a typewriter and scatter the parts so the germans thought that the machine was destroyed. The allies paid dearly for that however, since Heydrich went on a killing spree untill he was assasinated by Intrepid's ppl.

    All transmissions that were intercepted by the Bletchly people were codename ULTRA. One of these ULTRA interceptions allowed the British to organize the evacuation at Dunkirk. Tonnes of equipment was lost on the beaches, but without that pre-warning, there's no way the British could have mobilized enough transport to get those men out. As it was, only the rear guard that were swarmed by the Germans were captured.

    Through ULTRA, the US knew about the planned attack on Pearl Harbour. This is a sorely contentious issue, and many contend that the Japanese attacked sooner than expected. However, the official reasons for tho coverup were to not reveal the source (PURPLE was the code that the Japanese used, basically similare to ENIGMA), and to serve as a match to stir the US to war.

    So, there you are, the real history of the ENIGMA. They remained secret until 1972, 10 years after the defection of Philby, a top BSC exec, and a deeply planted Russian spy. Philby was, ironically, in charge of anti-Soviet operations.
    A naval Enigma was found as well. A U-boat got torpedoed, and the crew thought it was sinking, and the crew hopped ship, figuring it went down. but the british (or americans, don't remember which) got a crew of 3 on, found it wasn't sinking that fast, so they sent a prize crew on and got the Enigma, charts etc, while the German crew were shipped off to a POW camp.

    I only take a drink on two occasions - when I'm thirsty and when I'm not.

    --

    I only take a drink on two occasions - when I'm thirsty and when I'm not.

    Brendan Behan
  34. mm enigma.... by cdlu · · Score: 3

    F 4 K J F E A K L C 7 K L 8 R C E A K C
    8 1 K 4 M B L F E 8 D F 4 C G A F 4 6 Z
    I F Y O U S T O L E T H E E N I G M A 0
    P L E A S E R E T U R N I T T O T H E G
    O V E R N M E N T A S S O O N A S P O S
    S I B B L E 0 E V E R W O N D E R W H Y
    I T T O O K T H E M S O L O N G T O B R
    E A K T H E E N I G M A C O D E 0 1 F G
    6 F C L D F R C S G E A C G C J X Z C 9
    H A C E K Z K 8 4 C S A K V C 4 9 0 0 0

  35. Cultural theft or destruction? by sumana · · Score: 3
    In the past, the cultures of indigenous peoples in Africa, Asia, Australia, South and North America -- maybe Europe, I don't know -- have been destroyed because of the actions of more technologically advanced groups. Some of the horror comes when, say, the rich white man keeps little tchotchkes from his trips that are actually the sacred relics of the culture that used to exist, before they became just like us. (And sometimes we forced them to assimilate, and sometimes economic/social/political forces made them, and maybe sometimes it was no one's fault.) I imagine that's what the person meant by "cultural theft."

    But it's also sad, to me, when a culture is gone. Just disappears, killed or murdered or died. Like the passenger pigeon, extinct. There goes a bit of wisdom, as somebody wrote in "Ishmael," that we'll never have again. A system of knowing, a chunk of wisdom about how to live in this world. We can never get that particular wisdom back.

    I'm Indian-American, and I KNOW that there is value in American culture and that there is value in Indian culture. I don't think Mohandas Gandhi was literal when he responded to the newspaperman --
    "What do you think of Western civilization?"
    Gandhi: "I think it would be a good idea."
    No, both have value -- more or less, I don't want to judge. But the Westerners have, as my ex-PoliSci TA says of the British, "that nasty little conquering habit." There are drives in certain cultures that make it difficult for them to coexist peacefully with other cultures. Might that destructiveness lower that culture's value? Maybe.

    Anyway, I think you misread the person's comment on the Western habit of destroying and replacing other cultures. Visit Bangalore, visit Paris, visit any city that has a proud history of its own. More people speak English, more people have "Western values" and dress and watch and listen and all that -- looking to the US. Or, at least, a global monoculture will be / is more influenced by Protestant individualism than by Hinduism. Maybe that's not so optimal for wisdom and balance.

    That's all.

    --
    Ceterum censeo Microsoftam esse delendam.
  36. There are a LOT more than three Enigmas... by Mr.+Protocol · · Score: 3

    This is just nuts. I saw at least three Enigmas when I was at the Bletchley Park museum of cryptography, and I read not too long ago of a cryptologist/collector here in California who has over twenty whole or partial Enigman machines. Who says there are only three???

  37. enigma warez by Netsnipe · · Score: 3

    Where can I download this Enigma thing?

    --
    -- "I can't tell the future, I just work there." -- The Doctor
  38. But it has the keyboard from Hell by Animats · · Score: 3
    I've had the chance to try an Enigma machine; a speaker for EE380 at Stanford brought one by last year. It's the keyboard machine from Hell; key travel is about an inch and takes over a pound of pressure. The pressure on the keys advances the wheels, and since the wheels have 52 wiper contacts each, they're hard to rotate. And the lamps (one for each letter of the alphabet) only light up when the keys are fully depressed, so you have to push, hold, and read a lamp before advancing. It usually took two people to operate, one to push the keys, and one to copy the output from the illuminated lamps.

    It's suprising the Germans fielded such a mechanical turkey, especially since they also used the minature Hagelin C-52, a pocket-sized all-mechanical crypto machine with a printer. Due to a dumb advancing mechanism, that little machine had weak cypher strength, but it could have been smartened up.