Slashdot Mirror
Princess Mononoke Released On DVD
Christopher Cashell writes: "The critically acclaimed Anime film by Hayao Miyazaki and Ghibli studios, Princess Mononoke, has been released on DVD. The DVD release was initially delayed due to the public outcry when it was discovered that the original Japanese dialogue wouldn't be included. In this case, the effort from people writing Miramax paid off, as this release does include Japanese language tracks. This movie was reviewed on Slashdot when released in theaters. More information on Princess Mononoke can also be found here."
and on AnimeFu (fwiw, that is Kurt The Pope & I's anime review site, check it out if you're curious). My copy hasn't arrived yet (Express.com fails me once again. When they stopped being DVDExpress, their UI went to poop, and now I have to wait weeks for titles.) but I hear they really did this disc up right; they've even got Gaimen's subtitles or Miyazaki's original script subtitles. I'm excited to see this disc. And hear Gillian Anderson again. I got to see the movie in an old local artsy theater. What a great movie.
Strom Riders ... wasn't that hot I thought. Great disappointment after the great wu xia films of the 80s and early 90s. It really did look like the director was substituting computer graphics effects for good, tight choreography.
I'm eagerly looking forward to Crouching Tiger though :)
One day, I am going to die and rot. My possessions won't mean shit, then. Whether I enjoyed Blade Runner played off my personal copy on DVD, or off a licensed copy, or streaming off a broadband network, my corpse won't care. I don't care now. Ownership doesn't make my dick hard. The experience does.
In rich societies, we worry about shit like this because we have the leisure time to indulge our own selfishness and neurosis. Tell a Hindi who makes $25 monthly that you are pissed because you can't copy your DVD and he will punch you in the face (at least, he should).
Manufactured crisis and problems shouldn't get this much attention on Slashdot, or anywhere else, for that matter. I'm not anti-materialist, or a communist, but it makes me sad to see so many spoiled little wankers wetting themselves over what is, ultimately, inconsequential bullshit. Maybe it fills some deep need in their lives. Maybe we all need to feel victimized occasionally. I don't know; but it sure is fucking pathetic.
Neopets - the best free game on the Int
But I seriously doubt the effectiveness of a boycott. If all the anime fans boycott the Mononoke DVD, will that block the DeCSS lawsuits? No, but it will probably convince Disney to import more Power Rangers next time instead of more Miyazaki-san.
Disney isn't a monolith; it's made up of various groups. The part of Disney that decided to import Mononoke and release it on DVD should be rewarded. I'm not happy with any part of Disney that sends money or lawyers to the MPAA to attack DeCSS, but it's hard to punish them by refusing to buy Mononoke on DVD.
If you would like to own this but you feel bad about supporting MPAA even indirectly, may I suggest that you send a contribution to the EFF when you buy a DVD. Feel free even to send a letter to Disney telling them you did this.
Princess Mononoke on DVD with a clean transfer and Japanese language and two English subtitles tracks? Yep, I'm gonna buy that.
steveha
lf(1): it's like ls(1) but sorts filenames by extension, tersely
To get back on topic, I'll add that I'm glad to see that Disney/Miramax didn't quite succeed in screwing this one up all the way, and I hope to see a not-quite-completely-butchered DVD release of 'Laputa' (my favorite) in the near future.
And another thing. When the BBC showed Akira, they did their own well-written subtitles. But when I got the subtitled video version several years later (not from the BBC), it was pandering to the US market with Big Dumb Words For Big Dumb People and completely ruined the film.
Does my bum look big in this?
Damn, this brought back some trippy memories :p
...
Totoro was the first full-length anime that I saw, my 6th-grade nihongo no sensei showed it to the class, I vowed to watch it again if I ever picked up crack and/or acid
I think it scarred me for life.
About Mononoke though, great movie, better in japanese than in english, the local artsy theatre showed it in _both_ languages, how leet is that? ^_^
I don't understand everybodys obsession with the japanese language track. Princess Mononoke was hard enough to follow in Japanese even if you know the language, why struggle to read subtitles and try to understand the language. I understand that some English dubs suck big time, but which is better understanding the story, or asthetics???
I also totally disagree that watching Mononoke in Japanese is a way to learn about contemporary Japanese culture. The culture portrayed in Mononoke is a mishmash of Japanese time periods and a number of other things added. Anyone who thinks that Mononoke is an accurate picture of Japanese culture of anytime is gravly mistaken.
I'm not against the Japanese dub being included, don't get me wrong I just don't understand why its so important. So please tell me why.
I will never buy a DVD with CSS. If that means I'll never be able to watch another movie for the rest of my life, so be it.
it wouldn't be anime anymore if that existed ;) thanks for making me laugh, though!
Thanks, that's exactly the movie I was thinking of.
The mother dies of 3rd degree burns after their town is firebombed and the father is a casualty of war. There is a scene where they see the Hiroshima blast from afar, but they're not directly involved.
But yes, it's on the short list of Most Depressing Movies Ever
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Ah, you know it as "Hotaru no Haka". So sad... Poor Seita & Setsuko! ;_;
karma is for the weak >)
Think about this. You are, quite literally, whining over the fact that comebody dared to dub .... a cartoon. A fucking cartoon. It is stupid enough to whine about subtitles vs. dubbing when the context is a film with actual actors, where there is a variety of nuance to the performance which might be lost in translation. To do the same thing over a cartoon, worse, a specific style of cartoon which erases facial details and animates to the crudest, jerkiest standard possible, is purely asinine. Or do you think that the little flat people provide all the voices themselves?
Jebus Christmas, this is the dumbest fucking obsession in the whole "geek" pantheon. Far worse than Star Trek. The only people stupider than the anime obsessives are the fucking neopagans, and that's saying something.
-- the most controversial site on the Web
well now, I happened to be at suncoast browsing for just the right x-mas gift when I caught sight of this lonely copy of Princess Mononoke in the anime dvd section.
:)
REALLY! it just called out to me
perfect timing for a release, it was worth the wait!
zerodvyd
Maybe it's because I saw it in Japanese, but I didn't get it at all. If you want to see something interesting, go watch My Neighbor Totoro.
There's another movie that I liked too, about a boy and his sister who lost their parents in the Hiroshima blast and ran away to live in a small cave. It's a real tear-jerker.
Lauren
Anime? exciting....right...I want some more linux stories! i don't understand this anime stuff! /me heads over to animefu.com to understand it more.
The anti-salmon
But who can deny that the greatest anime of all time is, in fact, Rurouni Kenshin?
"And real life has warts and smelly feet" -- Paul Jaquays, id Software
I still remember seeing that in a theatre near here...the walls were almost falling in...and the popcorn tasted like styrofoam...but it was a good movie...
I am !amused.
This is the craziest anime mud i've ever seen. It's got princess mononoke scenes and everything. Just click Here
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Don't buy it, don't go see their crap in theaters, don't watch their TV networks, don't give them your own money and time only to let it be used against you!
-Isaac
I am not a lawyer, and this is not legal advice. For Entertainment Purposes Only.
Do all releases of the dvd have the japanese track? I saw it at Best Buy tonight before reading the /. story and didn't buy it because the 'special features' section on the back said "French Language Track" or something similar, but made no mention of a japanese track or subtitleing..
It also mentioned something called a "Featurette", can anyone explain to me what exactly that is?
See Sig append. Append Sig, append. Good Sig.
I somehow got my hands on a copy of the movie on Sunday, three days before the official release and have watched it twice so far, once with the English dub and once with the Japanese dialog and subtitles.
On the one hand, the literal English translation of the subtitled version is better than the spoken English version. It "sounds" more Japanese and is truer to the spirit of the film. The English dialog, tailored for a mainstream audience and to match the lip movements of the characters, seems hokey and forced in comparison.
On the other hand, if you are unfamiliar with the movie, reading subtitles interferes with viewing the great cinematography. The film is very pretty, and it's a shame to be reading when you should be enjoying the scenery.
Bottom line: the Japanese language version is much better, but first time viewers might want to view the English language version so they can follow the movie and see the stunning visuals more easily.
Also, for an excellent review of the film (from an animator), check out Don't Miss Miyazaki's Epic (contains some spoilers).
If you have South Park: Bigger, Longer, & Uncut on DVD, play it... Select "French" from your language menu... This is a PERFECT example of the evils of dubbing... The kids' voices don't even match (sounding instead like nasal Frenchmen trying to sound like kids, instead of pitch modulation being used to alter the voice)...
If you still can't figure it out, just listen to Asses of Fire's Unclefucker song, and get a good giggle...
Just because you can mod me down, doesn't mean you're right. Shoes for industry!
There's a lot of talk in this article about how buying a DVD is supporting the MPAA/DVD-CCA mess, and that as such you should boycott DVDs. I agree entirely with this sentiment, but not with the action taken. Don't let their stupidity take something you enjoy out of your life-- you can buy DVDs and still feel all warm and fuzzy by doing the following:
1. Make sure you've got the tools to do whatever you want (legally) with your DVDs. DeCSS, speed ripper, a region-free drive, etc...
2. Buy used DVDs whenever possible. Most movies I want to buy have been available for long enough that there are 10,000 copies of them on ebay for next-to-nothing. Used DVDs pay no additional "a$$hole tax" to the MPAA.
3. If you really want to get a new DVD (in my case, I ordered Mononoke in advance), make a matching donation to the EFF. Do this everytime. If the movie costs $25, send $25 to the EFF. This way, while the movie studio is making a bit of profit from the movie, the EFF is getting the full amount to use in their fight. (Thanks to the slashdot poster who suggested this many months ago-- I think it's an outstanding idea!!)
It was only shown for one night in a cinema here, and was sold out weeks ahead. I was told that it was shown for less than ten sessions in all of Australia - shown at film festivals over the duration of the Olympics.
The only way to see it here will be on DVD, but not legally, because of region locking. The distributors are likely to hold off in this region for a few years, since there hasn't been a cinema release.
Only the big movies are on DVD in this region.
It's possible to get a machine without the locking, but if the distribution system was fixed there wouldn't be a need for the region locking in the first place.
I got mine... I got it from buy.com. They tried to deliver it on the 16th, but apparently I wasn't home :-( So now it's stuck in my leasing office and they close at 6:00PM everyday and I don't get home early enough from work... *sigh* But it's here!!! Wheeeeeeeeeee!
I may not be the most fluent speaker in the world, but I'm learning, and it is nice to be able to get a japanese-speaking movie that will play in my DVD player so I can get a little practice.
You are also rather rude for no discernable reason other than that you don't seem to like anime much. Not a problem-- there are a number of things I don't like as well.
My recommendation is to not buy anime. For the rest of us, though, having a choice is good. Do you like having a choice between operating systems? Me too. Choice bewteen types of movies? Same here. Choice as to what language I can watch them in? Apparently, you're not concerned-- but why shouldn't there be a choice for the Japanese speakers among us anyway?
Watashi-wa nihongo no gakuse desu, yo?
I still think Nausicaa is a MUCH better flick. Mononoke is great. I watched it many times in the theater and have the DVD in hand, but I still find myself drifting back to watch Nausicaa on an old crappy fansub I bought years ago.
Nausicaa is being released on DVD in Japan around 9/2001, but that will not do much good here. But on the bright side, they don't get Mononoke on DVD until 11/2002.^_^
Is it just me, but do most anime fans (all the ones I know) seem to treat the medium as nigh-unto a religion? Suggest that Mononoke Hime was not that great a movie, and one is liable to be lynched. Hey, anime making it in the mass market stream -fantastic, I'm all for it. But this movie is simply not the greatest thing since sliced bread, and I see the relative lack of critical discernment in the anime-literati as a BAD THING (tm) for its widespread acceptance. I saw Mononoke Hime in the original Japanese (w/subtitles) on the big screen. But the movie itself, while having stunning visuals, was IMVHO a letdown.
-Styopa
Many anime fans really hate the poor-quality dubs that came over to the States. I much prefer subtitled anime, as even though I cannot understand what is being said (except for a word or two here and there) the inflections of the voices are far superior to the translations. Additionally, the "kewaii" little girl characters simply don't work with English voices, under any circumstances.
Why yes, I AM a rocket scientist!
Disney didn't even manage to break even on the theatrical release. They spent about four million dollars on the English version, and only made about 1.2 million (at last check) on the release. They're already around 2.8 million in the hole already. Buying the DVD won't stop the millions they lost on the production of the English soundtrack to this movie.
Besides, this one time the fan community actually got Disney to do what it wanted. The Japanese track was requested, along with better translated Japanese subtitles, and here it is. If you don't buy it, you're telling Disney to flat-out-ignore us.
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Keep NOSPAM to reply
I, for one, am VERY happy that slashdot mentioned this... I've been waiting for it to come out for a *very* long time, and I had no idea of the whole back story.
;) And there's a lot of us nerds out there that have been waiting for a chance to get this DVD. ^_^
And let me say that I'm VERY proud of the Mouse for listening to its customers... most Anime fans are NOT easily pleased, but the review seems to be extremely favorable.
Is this the MOST appropriate thing on slashdot? Well, probably not, but if you'll notice, it's "news for nerds" not "news for Linux users".
Oh, and before I forget, this is a REALLY GOOD movie... so if you don't understand what the fuss is all about, go rent it...
Is that Japanese for "bonus"?
"And like that
First of all, the movie industry makes the majority of their money off of after-theatre sales. (meaning videos, DVDs, and product tie-ins)
A pocket-change loss of less than $3 million isn't going to even touch them.
Secondly, the point was about taking a stand. It's simply a matter of taking a stand against DVDs with CSS, regional coding, and the MPAA all entrenched in them.
Of course, if you want to make a stand, you should refuse to buy the DVD, and then WRITE (on paper!) Disney & co., letting them know WHY you're not buying something they've done a very good job of. (and also that if they quit this stupidity, you'd support them)
Remember DIVX.
"People who do stupid things with hazardous materials often die." -- Jim Davidson on alt.folklore.urban
[pedanchikku]
kawaii
[/pedanchikku]
I agree about original language being better. I always buy subtitled editions when available. Occasionally a good dub comes out. Armitage III Poly Matrix is good, I've seen several of the original Armitage videos in Japanese so I do have a basis for comparison. However, Ranma for example is at best an acceptable dub, and don't even get me started on how badly DIC fucked up Sailor Moon, even ignoring their most senseless censorship. Its also good sometimes to watch in a foreign language you don't understand w/o subtitles. A couple of my hentai are from Japan(VHS) and I've seen the vast majority of Sailor Moon, some of Ranma, some of Key the Metal Idol, Nausicaa of the Valley of the Wind(don't get me started on how badly they raped the manga- good manga shitty anime). You'd be surprised how much you understand. Its like you understand what they say without understanding any of the words. Add in a tiny knowledge of common pleasantries in that language and the series FAQ so you know whos who... even something you've never seen a version of in your native language can be cool.
"For Christ's sake. None of you speak Japanese, so why do you want a Japanese soundtrack? In fact, how do you even know you've got a Japanese soundtrack?" I don't speak a lick of french, italian, spanish or german but, like most people, I know when it's being spoken. Also, many of us do read and speak Japanese. I'm sure you knew and understood that when you made this post. Though, posing ludicrous asseretions in the form of questions often does an excellent job of diverting attention from your baseless argument. "Think about this. You are, quite literally, whining over the fact that comebody dared to dub .... a cartoon. A fucking cartoon."
Mononoke is not a cartoon. It is an animated film. Please see your local dictionary for clarification.
"It is stupid enough to whine about subtitles vs. dubbing when the context is a film with actual actors, where there is a variety of nuance to the performance which might be lost in translation."
As stated above, this is a film. An animated film which was originally voiced with as much emotion and nuance as any hollywood production.
"To do the same thing over a cartoon, worse, a specific style of cartoon which erases facial details and animates to the crudest, jerkiest standard possible, is purely asinine."
It's plain to see that you are basing your opinions on the preconceived notion of "a cartoon" rather than the actual subject matter...
Princess Mononoke.
Cartoons are crude by definition whereas Mononoke and anime in general are anything but.
As pure fps go most anime would rank quite low but animation is an illusion and anime happens to be an exceptionally efficient illusion. Of course, Mononoke isn't most anime.
Mononoke employs very delicate and intentional motion blurring, distoration or exaggeration to illicit a sense of intense motion in few frames. The same film employs a wonderfully complex scene in which countless vines, stems and buds of all kinds sprout from the ground then bend twist and intertwine with each other at 24-30 fps.
True, anime rarely puts a focus on facial expressions. Emotions are more often expressed through the eyes or voice.
"Or do you think that the little flat people provide all the voices themselves?"
Huh?
"For Christ's sake. None of you speak Japanese, so why do you want a Japanese soundtrack? In fact, how do you even know you've got a Japanese soundtrack?"
.... a cartoon. A fucking cartoon."
I don't speak a lick of french, italian, spanish or german but, like most people, I know when it's being spoken. Also, many of us do read and speak Japanese.
I'm sure you knew and understood that when you made this post. Though, posing ludicrous asseretions in the form of questions often does an excellent job of diverting attention from your baseless argument.
"Think about this. You are, quite literally, whining over the fact that comebody dared to dub
Mononoke is not a cartoon. It is an animated film. Please see your local dictionary for clarification.
"It is stupid enough to whine about subtitles vs. dubbing when the context is a film with actual actors, where there is a variety of nuance to the performance which might be lost in translation."
As stated above, this is a film. An animated film which was originally voiced with as much emotion and nuance as any hollywood production.
"To do the same thing over a cartoon, worse, a specific style of cartoon which erases facial details and animates to the crudest, jerkiest standard possible, is purely asinine."
It's plain to see that you are basing your opinions on the preconceived notion of "a cartoon" rather than the actual subject matter... Princess Mononoke.
Cartoons are crude by definition whereas Mononoke and anime in general are anything but. As pure fps go most anime would rank quite low but animation is an illusion and anime happens to be an exceptionally efficient illusion. Of course, Mononoke isn't most anime.
Mononoke employs very delicate and intentional motion blurring, distoration or exaggeration to illicit a sense of intense motion in few frames. The same film employs a wonderfully complex scene in which countless vines, stems and buds of all kinds sprout from the ground then bend twist and intertwine with each other at 24-30 fps.
True, anime rarely puts a focus on facial expressions. Emotions are more often expressed through the eyes or voice.
"Or do you think that the little flat people provide all the voices themselves?"
Huh?
Watashi-wa nihongo no gakuse desu, yo?
nande '?' tsuketa, no? Are wa shitsumon ja nai, deshoo.
Odoroiteru Santa-san
Cool! I managed to get a little walking nekobus... that thing is so creepy.
...."
Speaking of creepy:
"HOW ARE YOU GENTLEMEN!!
ALL YOUR BASE ARE BELONG TO US. YOU ARE ON THE WAY TO DESTRUCTION. YOU HAVE NO CHANCE TO SURVIVE MAKE YOUR TIME. HA HA HA HA
You're going to stop watching movies, possibly for the rest of your life, to spite CSS. Not to spite the DVD format, but CSS.
In other words, you are letting CSS control your viewing habits. You are letting the DVD industry take away something from you that you love: watching movies.
The irony here is so thick, I'm practically choking on it. CSS is supposed to control viewing habits, and you are letting it work! If you really want to protest CSS, you will encourage your friends to crack it. You will lobby Congress and the Senate to overturn CSS-friendly legislation. You will make copies of DVD's, encode them as 3ivx, and write them to CDROM's.
But quit watching DVD movies? Let them control my viewing habits? Why? Why take away something I love to do? Why cut my nose to spite my face?
"And like that
i've talked with a few people who have seen the japanese version (import), but have not seen the US version (it didn't come to any theaters around my area). they've talked about the fact that since this is a Disney release (not Miramax), then it might be edited for content. my friends mention one scene that involves a sword, blood, and a disembodied head.
so, to anyone who has seen both versions, is the US release the same? or watered down for the kiddies (well, as watered down as PG-13 gets anyways)?
You're perfectly free to not buy the DVD, but think about it. Never in my life have I seen a big corporation listen to its fans like this before... sure, they might have thought they were gonna lose money if they didn't listen, but they went against their business instincts to not give the customer what they want. I believe that deserves some merit.
Second, it looks like they actually did a good job on this. Companies tend to like to crap out on Anime DVD jobs; pretty much the only decent Anime you can get is from companies that specialize in Anime. Also, Mononoke Hime is a dang good movie. The fact that they even brought it to America in the first place is worth of credit.
So, while you have some good reasons to buy the move, I have some good reasons to buy the movie. As a longtime Final Fantasy and RPG fan, I appreciate it when a company finally listens to their customers (HOW many times were we promised FFV?! >_<)
Evil? Maybe. Monopolistic? Possibly. But my "purchacing vote" goes for listening to us when we complained, even if that isn't "the Slashdot way".
Mainly because Japanese voice actors can actually act. The Japanese version of Mononoke was performed by some of the best voice actors in the industry. The title character in the English version was performed by someone who had never voice-acted before. I could hear the difference, and I can't even understand the Japanese tracks.
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NetInfo connection failed for server 127.0.0.1/local
Darn, maybe I shouldn't have bought at Best Buy.
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NetInfo connection failed for server 127.0.0.1/local
A group of kids are playing a new sport they just invented. They are proud of the game for its innovation and its depth, they know it is revolutionary. They have been playing and enjoying it for some time when another child walks catiously up to the group.
"Can I play?" He asks the group, smelling some popularity to be gained. He isn't interested in developing the game further or teaching more kids to play it for the sake of the game; no, he is interested in it because he thinks he can become popular by playing it. So by extending the game he can become even more popular. The group knows this, but realize that not everyone is interested in the game just for the game, so they let him play.
"Sure" One kids says, and the group agrees. They teach him the rules and how to play and soon they are all playing.
This happens for a bit until the game is huge and still growing. The originators of the game are estatic, when one of the non-originators gets hurt saying "I don't like how this game is played, I'm changing the rules"
"No!" The originators protest, but the complaintant obtains a adult supervisor.
"Now kids, if people get hurt you shouldn't play the game like that; here, change the rules to this" The adult says, wagging their finger.
The originators are saddened and protest in vain, "But its our game, if they don't like it, they don't have to play!"
The adult says "You have to listen to me!"
The originators are perplexed and ask why.
The adult responds "Because... you do!"
So trends like this continue, the game being changed by new comers who really have no right to change the game. And the complaintants changed the rules, and became popular, and they lived happily ever after...
So children, does this remind you of any current situation? Yes, you in the back... Yes! that's right, it reminds me of the internet, DVD technology, MP3 tech., etc. too.
That is how I percieve things, it is full of holes and isn't really a complete thought, and of course I could be wrong. But I can't understand how the Disney and other groups give themselves the right to change the rules! If you're getting ripped off or whatever, then don't play the game.
just my opinion,
minus
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minusthink [Code poet or super hero? (you decide)]
"when life gets complicated, I like to take a nap in a tree and wait for dinner" - Hobbes.
They're the same. There are a couple of "gory" shots, but they're very short either way. It's not watered down at all. The only differences are some of the translation, but the visuals and soundtrack are identical; no cut scenes or anything. The translation differences are small enough to ignore, and mostly involve cultural changes.
Miyazaki's Nausicaa of the Valley of Wind was released in an "Americanized" version that truly was terrible compared to the original, having nearly a third of the movie cut, and words not even vaguely close to the original story. However, Disney will be redoing and rereleasing it (the original Americanized version wasn't done by Disney). I hope they do as good a job as they did with Princess Mononoke.
Hey, you don't know me. It's all about the law. In fact, I just moved across the country to gain residency in California for the express purpose of applying to law school (much easier to get into the *excellent* law schools at Berkeley and UCLA as a resident), specifically because this shit pisses me off. I've written more letters than I can remember to my representatives and senators, going back to when the DMCA was still Orrin Hatch's baby and not yet law of the land.
The struggle is not futile - it just has to be taken to the people. I know Disney doesn't miss my money alone, but I can't attack them with one hand and feed them with the other (if that makes sense).
-Isaac
I am not a lawyer, and this is not legal advice. For Entertainment Purposes Only.
Miramax is owned by Disney, and is used to release stuff that would sully the Disney name. Kinda like Hollywood Records; serves the same purpose for Disney for music.
Vintage computer games and RPG books available. Email me if you're interested.
You do have some points. Maybe I was reading too much into some bits, like when he kills the boar thing and gets a nasty death curse. I was getting this "Oh, he raised his hand in violence so now he's going to be punished." Maybe it's just the whole Boulder CO hippie vibe getting to me. And the movie just screamed "Why can't we all just get along?" at several points, which is so Dharma and Greg it's not even funny. Of course, I have a very low hippie tolerance too, and was highly suspecious that Disney mangled the film in the translation. *shrug*
I'm trying to teach myself to set people on fire with my mind... Is it hot in here?
If you like the more pastel, gentle anime style of Mononoke, check out Totoro, by the same director. it's a childrens movie, but the art is amazing. Has a nice story, too.
Actually, the original Japanese voice actors for Mononoke Hime didn't do much anything else. (except Shimamoto Sumi - voice of Toki - who had a bunch of other minor roles) They were good, but you can't say they are "some of the best voice actors in the industry." The American voice acting was surprisingly very good (except Clair Dane - San). They were done by REAL actors instead of some random bum(s) off the street. I am not trying to say that American dub is better than Japanese dialogue. I am just saying that the Japanese voice acting isn't one of the best. And the American dub is pretty good. (There is a reason why, in Japan, they re-released Mononoke Hime with American voice acting with Japanese subtitles.)
Bad, bad english habit (yo always makes me think "you know?", but of course, isn't a question). No japanese points for me today. :( Did I muck up anything else?
:)
I have quite a ways to go, but I'm working on it.
Somebody set up us the bomb !!
-- Dr. Eldarion --
No one even considers using big Hollywood stars to dub over foreign movies like Il Postino when they're released in the US. Why are animated films so much different?
For anyone who didn't know this already: dialogue isn't normally "dubbed into" an animated movie. The original voice track is recorded before the cels are drawn. The animators then fit their work to the actors' voices. Because of this, the voice cast plays a big role in defining the characters and the feel of the movie.
In dubbed translations, this is no longer the case. The writers have to compromise between accurate translation and good lip-synch. The actors can't just act naturally; they also have to pay attention to the exact motions of their already-animated characters. And even if they compromise everything to make the new dialogue fit the original animation, the lip-synch still won't be as good.
Reversing the favored animation process makes a big difference in the finished product, especially in a movie like Mononoke Hime, in which the original writing and acting was truly top-notch.
The capsule for those who don't wish to click through: great DVD, great features (which other anime translators could learn from), great movie.
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Editor Emeritus and Senior Writer, TeleRead.org
I saw about 30 of these at Costco yesterday if anyone wants them.
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Perhaps the other movie you mentioned is the Miyazaki film "Grave of the Fireflies"? But, if my memory serves me right, the kids lost their parents in a firebombing. Though I can't be sure... haven't seen it in a while. Anyway, all Miyazaki films seem to be good (totoro, mononoke, grave of the fireflies, laputa, kiki's delivery service, etc., etc.)
The whole story is at Nausicaa Net
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NetInfo connection failed for server 127.0.0.1/local
Pheer me, for I have a kodama stuffed animal. -- Dr. Eldarion --
Um... it _is_ a Miramax release. I haven't seen the original Japanese version, but according to anime sites I've seen it's not been edited at all. There are indeed scenes of decapitation, severed limbs, etc.
Condemnations from shitty service aside, the way express.com screwed over LowTax over SA biased me against them. I work right next to chinatown so I don't need their service anyways. I'd link to it but since the redesign nothing is where it's supposed to be.
"Me Ted"
BOSTON SUCKS!
Actually, one of the the major reasons I liked Mononoke is that it wasn't just Fern Gully with lots of blood and gore attached... if you'll notice, the movie didn't say "Forest Good, Humans Bad". Lady Eboshi wasn't a villian; the Forest God was more of a villian than she was... <SPOILER>the real villain is that guy in the hecka-cool geta sandals.</SPOILER>
So, being a former "nature freak" in Elementary school, then coming to my senses later and realizing that hardcore, Earth First-style environmentalism is a crock of crap (we'll be fine as long as we make a good effort to conserve stuff) - I voted for Republicans and Libertarians on my first ballot last month - I can give this movie two "balanced thumbs up". The movie doesn't say either humans OR nature is evil, they just get caught in a pointless, stupid war.
Liberal, Conservative, Libertarian, or Autoritarian... well, all of those except Authoritarian, we can all agree that fighting wars for no reason is a Bad Thing(TM). That, really, is the lesson of Princess Mononoke.
Mercy buckets. My phonetic Japanese is beyond horrible. : ) Or should I say ^_^
Why yes, I AM a rocket scientist!
IIRC, ever since the hatchet job done on Nausicaa was made known to Studio Ghibli, they have refused to license their productions without a guarantee that there would be no re-editing of the material.
For much more concrete information, it would be worth having a browse at the comprehensive Miyazaki Hayao fan website.
For the record, my copy of Princess Mononoke from express.com arrived - not shipped, but arrived - today. Express.com did have severe delivery problems on anime for a while but has been much improved in the last month or so.
OT: Be sure to check out the Lain lunch box. It is the entire four disc Lain set in an actual lunch box case (you do get the keepcases for each individual disc inside). The lunch box itself kicks ass. The only problem: The keep case for ones of my discs is empty and I have to return it!
No, no...Neil's little-known brother worked on it with him. One Gaiman, two Gaimen. Simple, really.
This question has been beat to death, and there is without a doubt that not one nanosecond of film has been edited for US release. Remember that the Miyazaki/Disney deal required that Miyazaki approve any cuts. And after the slaughtering of Nausicaa Miyzaki is adamant about having his films edited overseas.
I generally like anything by Miyazaki, but I need to point out several things about this disc. (First one to buy it on release day at the local Borders)
Just because the Mouse did this release does not mean that they slaughtered this movie. I couldn't be happier with the video quality, which is one of the best transfers I've seen for an anime. All the colors stay at their right levels, including all of Miyazaki's breath taking forest scenery.
Both audio tracks came off well, even though I'll personally only be watching this in Japanese w/ English subtitles, hey, it has both captions and good literal translation subtitles!
Go out and buy it today. You won't regret it, even if you aren't an anime fan.
and use the head-rattle as a sample, too :>
after seeing it again, i'm still impressed with the realism in the anatomy of the beasts...
Nihongo no wakarimasu s/\bno\b/ga/; Regex Santa
And I have a copy! Happy solstice! Woohoo! This movie rocks.
[Insert obligatory rant about 'the editorial quality of slashdot blah blah blah' here]
Princess Mononoke wasn't a preachy Ferngully-style eco-sermon. It was precisely the opposite. Miyazaki had the good sense to show how the different sides of the conflict each had legit and justifiable reasons for fighting for their different and conflicting causes.
Who is the villain in Mononoke? I'm not convinced there is one.
Your other point about the fluidity of the animation is absurd. How can well crafted handiwork possibly detract from the piece it is part of? To paraphrase what I think you're saying, Kubrick's movies suck, because they have great lighting. It is not 'obviously' taking away from the story to do a good job. Rather, it is a feast to the eyes to see well done animation. The quality of both character and special effects animation in this film is absolutely fantastic - consistently kept at 12fps.
Perhaps you are saying that Mononoke is technically inferior to TV-grade anime's 8,4 and sometimes 2 frames per second, with the wnole slew of cost-saving stick-on mouths in fixed-chin faces and endless looped or held perspectives on budget cookie cutter backgrounds? I honestly don't comprehend your perspective.
I hate to be the one to say this, but it was released yesterday. Unfortunately I haven't been able to watch it yet because it's a Christmas present for my girlfriend.
--Dave
Y'all have got to realize every corporation has its bean counters and its creative people. The creative people are the ones who decided to bring this wonderful film to the US, and hire accomplished actors to do the voices, and had at least some say in bringing in the Japanese & subtitles. Then you've got the bean-counting MBA bastards that would fuck their own mothers in the liver if it reduced their ebitda/cost per unit/whatever the fuck. Now, the folks who listened to us and changed the disc deserve us buying this disc in DROVES or they'll never get any control away from the MBA bastards. If you hate CSS, the MPAA etc, WRITE YOUR FUCKING CONGRESSMAN and the editor of your local paper instead of bitching on internet sites. Politicians don't give a rat's ass about losers bitching anonymously on web sites. They care about who gets them elected, and that means money. Push for election reform and we'll get rid of CSS and all the anti-napstering and so on. End of speech.
O~ Him that studies revenge keeps his own wounds green. -- Francis Bacon
Maybe that says something about bodybuilders, or, at least, the bodybuilders in question.
Now if you're talking rape, you're talking what the American dubbers did when they turned it into Warriors of the Wind. That's why it's taken this long for any Miyazaki stuff to make it over here at all.
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Editor Emeritus and Senior Writer, TeleRead.org
Don't let the cover throw you; this is no Fern Gully.
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Editor Emeritus and Senior Writer, TeleRead.org
I seem to recall hearing that Akihiro Miwa (Moro) is actually a reknowned character actor whose stock-in-trade is characters of questionable gender.
Yôji Matsuda (Ashitaka) was, among others, Asbel in Nausicaa, and in fact IMDB lists his first credit as being in 1974.
Yuriko Ishida (San) has been working since 1987, when she voiced a character in MADOX-01.
Most of the others have credits going back at least several years, and some into the 1960s or 50s. Nothing I've ever heard of, but at least it shows they've had plenty of work in their native land.
Well, if you can call playing the title character in Nausicaa, Clarice in Castle of Cagliostro, Tomomi and Mei's mother in Totoro, Ginrei in Giant Robo, and characters in various other well-known anime including Iczer One, Urusei Yatsura, and Ruroni Kenshin "a bunch of minor roles." I wouldn't. Well, they certainly seem to be frequently employed voice actors, at least. No arguments there. Well, I think think the quality level of the Japanese version is a matter of personal opinion. Since I don't actually speak Japanese, I don't know if I can judge that well. But it did use an experienced cast.Indeed there is--and that reason is that the Japanese seem to have an obsession with the English language; they think it's "cool" (or "kewl," as the case might be) to use it anywhere they can--even if it doesn't always make a lot of sense.
This is also why English dubs of films like Macross: Love, Do You Remember and Megazone 23 Part II were actually commisioned by the Japanese. I myself have a bootleg VHS copy of the Megazone, with Japanese subtitles all along the bottom.
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Editor Emeritus and Senior Writer, TeleRead.org
I figure after I bitch about Express I should post an alternate place. Tower Records
/. it... I'm gonna go to the store anyway! :P
Go ahead and
"Me Ted"
BOSTON SUCKS!
If you felt the movie was "environmental preaching", you did not understand it. One of the main points was that it avoided a simple "nature good, humans bad" morale: the humans who exploited nature were doing so to survive, and the agents of nature were resorting to violence too quickly. If the film had a morale, it was that one should not let one's own interests get in the way of good judgement.
The illegal we do immediately. The unconstitutional takes a little longer.
--Henry Kissinger
in which the kids and their mom have to flee from their firebombed house (in Utsunomiya, I think, near Osaka) to the countryside? I watched it in Japan years ago and would love to see it again, but I can't for the life of me remember what it was called. The visuals were exquisite.
sulli
RTFJ.
Four legs good, two legs better!
sulli
RTFJ.
doh... express.com has Disney listed as the copyright holder (which makes sense), but yep, if you look at the enlarged picture of the back, there is the miramax logo.
my friends told me it was a Disney release and got me all worked up over nothing. now they must be punished >0
I would even recommend Kiki's Delivery Service as yet another *excellent* Miyazaki flick. It came out on video about 1.5 years ago.
me? I'm just waiting for them to release the damn Miramax version of "Laputa, Castle In the Sky!"
Not only did I get to see the original English-dubbed version way back in like 1988 or 1989, but on the Kiki video there's a trailer for it. Where is it??!
Pope
Freedom is Slavery! Ignorance is Strength! Monopolies offer Choice!
It doesn't mean much now, it's built for the future.
I noticed one sitting on the shelf at the Camelot (or possibly Suncoast.. they're right next to each other) in the mall here a few days ago. Since I'm not an anime fan, I didn't pay any attention to it, and the only reason I noticed it at all was because someone mentions it here every few weeks. If you look around you might be able to find it too. Remember, there's such a thing as a brick-and-mortar retailer... you don't have to buy EVERYTHING off the web.
So now that CmdrTaco's into Anime, Slashdot news stories get even more shallow? Until Star Wars is released on DvD, I really don't care. I could understand if it was released in general, but how much of the Slashdot community really cares about one anime show's DvD release? Oh well...
"The universe seems neither benign nor hostile, merely indifferent." --Carl Sagan
Why is Star Wars on DVD any more (or less) relevant than Mononoke on DVD, or a review on The Emperor's Groove, or a review on Extreme Programming?
So if you want a vote... Me! I care!
Geek dating!
GPL Deconstructed
I haven't gotten my hands personally on the DVD (though I did see the movie in the theaters), but I plan too very soon. However, I have talked to two of my friends that have it and they say it is excellent. One of them commented "that dvd is the new reference for how anime dvds should be made" and he's a rabid anime fan so I'm inclined to go along with that.
Not in any attempt to be stupid, but who's voice did she cover? I haven't seen it in a while...
Actually, in most anime, the film actually is animated before the voices are recorded--just the opposite of how it is in the west. The Japanese don't have as much attachment to lipsynch. I don't know if Mononoke was done that way or not, but I do know that the animals' speech wasn't terribly lipsynched at all in either language. :)
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Editor Emeritus and Senior Writer, TeleRead.org
I think that a lot of the people who are boycotting are doing it just so they have an excuse to make a lot of noise and act all deprived, and rant at people who aren't. i.e., "suffering for their art." And other than that boycott, they aren't doing a damned thing to try and fight it.
There are more constructive ways. Use them.
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Editor Emeritus and Senior Writer, TeleRead.org
The general public does want DVDs. Twelve million, maybe thirteen or fourteen million, have already sold. It shows no signs of slowing down. Boycotts just aren't gonna do it.
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Editor Emeritus and Senior Writer, TeleRead.org
Crouching Tiger was great! I live in L.A., where it came out last Friday, and I saw it that night. It had great fights and an actual plot with actual acting. Michelle Yeoh was really good in it, I thought. And it had the coolest fight scenes I've ever seen.
Switch the . and the @ to email me.
Got my copy today, excellent. English and Japanese.......great story and transfer (letterbox!)
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It's either on the beat or off the beat, it's that easy.
I moderate therefore I rule!
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I'm not a big fan of anime, [perhaps only as a result of underexposure... but, I don't tend to watch movies at all in the first place... Given free time, I would rather read]
...but I must say, from briefly visiting the website of the film, it does appear to be heavily political. Quite pro-environmentalist, anti technologist [the evil poluters]. Is this accurate?
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the pen is mightier then the sword. the sword is mightier then the court. the court is mightier then the pen.
I think a major part of it is related to the mood/setting desired. Having the Japanese audio helps get that anime "feel" for many, in a similar way that various visual and audio styles in American movies set the mood, though somewhat different. For many, watching anime is more of an experience than just about whatching a good story well done. The Japanese audio helps with that. And most anime fans know enough Japanese (a small handful of words) to match the audio to the subtitle, but couldn't possibly follow without the subtitle. And besides, many of the english dubs suck, though Mononoke is supposedly fairly good (haven't seen it).
I first saw the feature in the theater when it was out in limited release earlier this year. I was awed and impressed by the complex story and the depth and richness of the beautiful animation.
Miyazaki deserves much praise for his unique artistic vision. Here's a guy who can tell and visualize fantastic stories and entertain kids and grownups both without pandering or patronizing. I'm not really a big fan of anime in general, but you absolutely don't need to be, to appreciate this beautiful movie, and several others by the same director. His comic books are equally expressive and intelligent.
I had never heard the japanese language version, but I didn't like the English dubbed voices. They seemed inappropriate. Billy Bob Thornton and the voice of San were both completely wrong for the movie. I'm glad that Miramax included the original japanese language track on this DVD, even if I don't yet understand a word they're saying - that's what the subtitles are for. :) (There's naturally also the English dub track on the disc.)
The proper way to enjoy a movie like the film maker intended is to hear the voices of the original actors. You get appropriate inflections of the voices, you get lipsync, and you give the screen actors the dignity of not having half their performance erased and dubbed over by anonymous local actors.
Remember the scene from European Vacation with the Griswalds in Paris, where they watch an american movie on TV dubbed to French? That's how I feel about dubbing in general.
My English and German is pretty decent for a non-native speaker of either language, and I picked up both initially by watching movies in those languages, with subtitles. The more I watched as I grew up, the more I learned. Kind of like language lessons and entertainment at the same time. :)
I'm very thankful that it is not customary in my country to dub movies. It seems awfully emberrassing to hear the lines of well known screen actors spoken by nobodies with totally wrong voices.
The most important point about choosing sub over dub, is that once you begin to understand the language of the movie, perhaps thanks to the subtitles, you also 'get' the words spoken unfiltered by the translator's subjective interpretation or clumsy attempts at converting humor and untranslatable cultural references to your own language.
The DVD format allows the inclusion of multiple language, video and subtitle tracks, so at this point there's really no excuse to release a foreign language film to an U.S. audience with only the dubbed version included, when you can let the viewer choose which version to watch.
As for the subtitles, there's two English tracks to choose from - a literal translation from the spoken Japanese, and Neil Gaiman's translation of the screenplay. They're not so subtly different, since Gaiman had to fit words in that meant the same, but could be spoken in English in the same time and rhythm of the faster multisyllabic Japanese. Sometimes meaning was lost in that translation.
The literal japanese track makes the most sense even if it's kind of stiff. It's nice that they provided both tracks .. it is unfortunately still not universal standard practice among DVD makers to provide an English language subtitle track on all movies - it's really helpful to the hearing impaired to have the subtitle track going on the screen, even if you speak the language and can hear most of the dialog. Whenever there's a word you missed, you can just read the subtitles. And sometimes for whatever reason you might want to watch a movie with the sound off and just go by the subtitles. The flexibility of DVD in this regard is great.
The 5.1 digital surround sound track has identical mix on the Japanese and English versions, and it sounds GREAT. The surround effects used to great effect in the forest scenes, are scary-realistic. Even on my modest system the sense of being in the middle of the forest with things brushing through the undergrowth, was very powerful. There's mesmerizing moments of deep silence followed by subtle sound effects accenting the fluid, immersive screen action.
The picture on the disc is of nice quality, great color, super sharp detail and no digital compression artifacts to see, even in dark scenes. The widescreen presentation is anamorphic, i.e. the full vertical NTSC resolution, all 550 lines or so, are used to contain the widescreen image on 16:9 TVs.
Other than these amenities, Miramax didn't spend too much time and money on this release. Simple static menus, for what they're worth, and no extras except for the US theatrical trailer and interviews with the voice actors of the English dubbed version. It's a little bit insulting that they only thought to provide these interviews as if Billy Bob Thornton as gravely miscasted voice actor is any kind of authority on this Miyazaki masterpiece. I would much rather know about the film makers and how the movie was made, stills and special effects and storyboards and so on. But there's nothing like that on the disc.
I rank the movie among my 10 favourites, but the Miramax DVD is nothing more than mediocre; about on par with the disappointing Blade Runner DVD.
*sigh* I know, I know, don't feed the trolls...