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Master of Orion III
gimpy writes "Alan Emrich is a gaming veteran's veteran. He's done it all, from boardgames to card games, from computer games to pen and paper role-playing. Now, he's working as designer and lead writer on a title that has strategy fans drooling: Master of Orion [?] III. SharkyGames recently had a chance to sit down with Alan and get the inside scoop on what's happening with MOO3." The website for the game is available as well. I cannot count the sheer number hours spent playing MOO/MOO2 - hopefully this can live up the legacy of those games.
Sure being able to run C&C/Red Alert under WINE is cool, but what I'm really looking for are the classics. I prefer the originals since I never did get around to playing the sequels.
So, does anyone know if wine can run the orignal Microprose classics such as MOO, CIV and XCOM?
-cmh
Hi. Just a quick comment on ground combat in a 4x game. Segasoft wrote a great one back in 1996. The game had just one combat system, but it allowed stacks to attack and move in space or on the ground depending on their movement types. It was rather good. It looks, and feels, like CIV2 using hexagon maps (and a gothic/apocaliptic theeme). Essentialy, you play one of 5 feudal lords trying to re-build a civilisation. Other than the other 4, there's a technophobic church who'd send inquisitors armed with flame throwers to zorch your research labs (and destroy your tech if the labs are gone) and a tradeing league who give the game a time limit (buy too much stuff from them and they become too powerful...) Not to mention all the independent rebels and nobles who rule cities on your starting planet and the planets around you. There's also the
+ of+The+Fading+Suns
_ suns_review/article.html
e =83148&add=EMPEFS.IR
Anyways, the combat system.
Infantry was cheap but ineffective against tanks. Power armor was much more expensive than infantry but could stand it's own against heavy armor. Shuttle-lander type craft could move small numbers of troups anywhere on a planet. And general spacecraft would hawl your troops from star system to star system but be useless on the ground.
The diplomacy model is something which has yet to be seen again. Elegant and very detailed.
The game has since been patched to version 1.4 (about a year and a half after the game was developed too!). Many custom packs have been writen for the game, favorite of mine being NOVA which adds new units and alters the AI of the opponents. Most of the game's data files are in text or in plain readable gifs, so you can tweek it as you like (like civ2 I guess).
General info on the game is available at: http://www.theunderdogs.org/game.php?name=Emperor
A review is at:
http://www.pcme.com/strategy_vault/emperor_fading
And you can buy it at:
http://www.cdmag.com/cgi-bin/order.cbi_home?sourc
Though, I got it for 10$ in a discount bin years ago.
I just wish Galactic Bloodshed would come back. Like MOO, I've heard (having never played MOO), but online and multiplayer, wierd text interface requiring a client, and better. Hmm.
(currently testing something about signatures here)
I don't know about "Master of Magic", but Mail-Order Monsters rocked... :P
And it was one of the few (if not only?) games that I played over ftp :) e-mail be damned.
I dispute that MOO2 was the king of X4 games.
Galactic Civilizations 2 was MUCH better!
(Note: GalCiv 2 was an OS/2 only game released
before Master of Orion original)
But please pass along my compliments for one of the best top level AIs I've played against. My only complaint is that it always went aggressive by the endgame - it gets brutal. I'd love to play against an AI one day that relies on the philosophy of "talk softly but carry a big stick."
And they did a pretty damn good job on the game overall, especially considering how the original Pax set a high bar for them to hurdle, if you ignore its instability. IMHO it still sets the standard for galactic-scale empire games. MOO2 came close; Spaceward Ho! was too easy to master.
I can see the fnords!
This is off topic, but I thought I'd mention it...
.com startup). They're awesome guys. Unfortunately, I haven't actually played the game (they now think it sorta sucks, and don't play networked games of it anymore).
I worked with most of the Pax Imperia team this summer (they're no longer working on games...it's a startup that I'm not going to name so they don't get slashdotted...they only have a beta product atm...note I didn't say a
Oh, and yes, Eminent Domain was released for Windows.
My plan is to pimp before they realize I'm a jackass. Hit 'em hard and fast.
The real-time aspect is the thing that concerns me the most. I've tried to like RTS games, really, most recently Homeworld. They always degenerate into a mad frenzy of panning, rescaling and clicking, however. Good tactics go right out the window. Time pressure is a good play motivator, sure, but the player interface is usually so abysmal that us old fogies don't have time to execute any tactical disipline. The only game that came close was X-Com Apocolypse, and even it was not nearly as fun as the turn-based UFO.
If you can get this right, real-time without a god-damned frustrating interface, you'll revolutionize the industry and get all the girls. Until then the rest of us will keep re-playing MOO and MOM.
(Why do MOO 3 instead of a MOM 2? MOM was soooo much better than MOO.)
Kind Regards,
Kind Regards,
Bruce
Counterpoints:
XCom3 ship combat was not terribly complicated. You just pointed your swarm at the invaders and hoped too many buildings wouldn't get blown up in the process. Trying to control individual ships was futile.
Sucessful strategic and tactical level combat: MOM
MOM had a decent strategic level (move this stack here) and a decent tactical level (rangers shoot arrows, retreat). Tactics at the unit level made a huge difference in MOM. Horsebowmen ruled!
Kind Regards,
Kind Regards,
Bruce
will MOO3 be balanced, or will there be an obvious 'easy' race to play like 1 & 2?
According to their FAQ, it won't be turn based anymore... But will give you enought time to plan and prepare/manage your attacks.
Mario.
Star control, I'm glad I'm not the only one who disliked the third version. The second one was really nice and easy to play. I don't like games that have control systems that I don't ever feel like I can get fully proficient at because I don't have enough hands. This was the descent vs doom mentality too. I thoroughly enjoyed having 1 mouse and one hand allow me to make all the possible moves. With Descent I felt like I needed foot pedals to get the thing to roll, dive and slide sideways. I'm deathly afraid that War Craft three will have a control system more like Myth than WC2. I didn't like the myth controls because making a fighter group do the right thing always seemed to take 5 clicks and 2 key presses.
You can only order it online, I believe, but you're supporting a small independent game publisher, Shrapnel Games, by doing so. It's an amazingly good game for shareware.
Nah, I just lick the CD to get the flavor of the game.
i know you guys mean well, but after 20 minutes of seaching on the web and reading all of these news messages... i still have no clue about where to start if I want to play.
i can find MOO3 utilities, media, maps, etc... all kinds of stuff , except NOBODY says where and how I get it...
please help... i guess i am ignorant.
jon
-- Betting on the survival of the media industry is a serious risk. I advise investing elsewhere.
Why havn't I heard of this game? I want someone to take this question seriously and attempt to answer, "Why hasn't yeti heard of this game?"
if you can be creative lithovore?
There have been a few MoM wannabes but no game has come close to it. I prefer MoM to Alpha Centauri. A MoM remake would be one of the few "remakes" I think I'd actually get excited about.
Age of Wonders was utter crap, man. Was that really supposed to be a honest-to-god sequel?
I couldn't answer one way or the other, save to say that I remember playing it for the first time and going, "Wow, they ripped of M:TG!"
Who knows how long it'd been out, though.
A couple of other people have mentioned it, but I just want to plug my all-time favorite game, Master of Magic, or MOM.
Hell yes. I still have that game. The disks wore out a long time ago, but I have disk images :)
As you might expect by the title, it's a fantasy-based game, which borrows heavily from the Magic:The Gathering style of magic system (Chaos, Life, Death, Nature, and Sorcery magics).
One nit to pick, this was pre-M:TG, wasn't it?
-- Bill "Houdini" Weiss
When one of my friends first got MOO, I was still stuck with an 8088/cga/640k/21mb machine - so, unlike other excellent games like F-19, which I could still run on my machine, I had to borrow (steal) 9 1.44 mb floppies, compress it using LHARC (remember that?) and commence a nomadic existence wandering from one friend's house to another - until they kicked me out, that is. I still know the names of the .lbx files by heart.
;)
If anyone wants MOO, email me. If anyone wants MOO2, email me, and I'll tell you where you can get it
Can't wait for MOO 3.
>While we're talking about sci-fi strat games,
You might as well throw in a proper xcom sequel as well. Altough I still have hope for The Dreamland Chronicles...
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XCOM3 tried to have detailed ground combat and detailed space ship combat. IMO, it wasn't successful.
MOO1/2 were great games. They had detailed ship combat and very simple ground combat.
XCOM1/2 was a great game. It had detailed ground combat and very simple ship combat.
I don't think it works well when games try to have two different "phases" of gameplay that are relatively isolated. Look at Star Wars Rebellion for example.
I really like turn-based games. I wish play by email was more popular. I know there are some other games, like Stars! and older BBS stuff that would do one turn a day or something and a game would last about a year.
You can spend a lifetime designing the perfect game, porting it to last weeks release of technology every week, and making sure you can push the resolution capabilities of any monitor. Let's just hope that this doesnt take as long as Tribes 2 (which must be pretty damn good considering how long they've spent on it)
I am !amused.
I hope you also have a laptop with you when you are traveling :)
--
The real Captain Avatar is a fictional character, so I suppose he doesn't mind if I impersonate him.
Amen to that! I get so sick of RTS games ... the
'instant reaction' aspect of RTS isn't really
appropriate for a galaxy-spanning conquest game,
anyway. ("Admiral Gawerfasd, I want you to launch ... no wait, Udfaf IV is under attack! I must take command there. Now ... oops, I forgot to order the construction of those new dreadnoughts. Great Ga-LAX-y! Just how is one person supposed to run an Empire all by themselves anyway??")
Has anyone tried the new version of Reach For The Stars from SSG? The 80s version was a classic, and one of the original 4X games ... I haven't tried the new version, wondered if it was any good.
--
The real Captain Avatar is a fictional character, so I suppose he doesn't mind if I impersonate him.
One of the best parts of SE IV is its configurability. That'd be nice to see in MOO3.
Of course it was turn based multi-player (suck!) Otherwise it was a blast...
Well, the thing I'm most worried is that the new MOO 3 will be too much realtime in combat; I and probably quite a few old grumpy gamers from the 80's love turn-based games. ;)
Everyone who makes generalizations should be shot.
THis is a game that I would truly love to see. I was positively addicted to the original and was always surprised that a sequel was never made.
I'd like a MOM2 too; the original was (and still is; thank god it works on NT;) a damn fine game. Oh the joy of getting Malleus up the levels and enjoying the artificer pick by making him some nice items, then just sending him to nuke entire armies of the enemy by himself... ;) Some company, please get rights for a sequel!
Everyone who makes generalizations should be shot.
The designers of Stars! are making a new one. Stars! Supernova Genesis sounds even better.
I won't buy MOO. I'll wait for Stars!
That was one boring corporate speak interview...from the sounds of it, this will fail. I want it to succeed, but from the sounds of the high level corporate speak, I doubt it.
Galactic Bloodshed deserves at least a mention when you discuss turn-based space strategy.
It's loads of fun and addicting. Although, it necessitated you being near a DEC terminal at odd hours. I risked my job playing this game.
Such is the infinite Grace of Popeye.
Yah! Hmmm?
"A few great minds are enough to endow humanity with monstrous power, but a few great hearts are not enough to make us w
I can't wait for this to come out... I remember when my friend got his shiny new 486/66 and invited me over.... I went over, and we started playing the original MOO, and we didn't stop for about 16 hours... then 16 hours the next day, and so on.... ;)
MOO is definitely one of the best games of all time... right up there with X-COM. ;)
At least someone in the game industry thinks the same way I do. If there is one more quake clone that doesnt add any good gameplay (The DS9 game) or another warcraft game I will just not buy it I suppose. Unfortuneatly I cant do anything else and am not pathetic enough to shoot myself over a game ;)
Pithy, yet ultimately meaningless, phrase expressed with gusto!
Yup. My favorite twist was when I'd cede over every one of my systems but the capital to that puny enemy, and then go through the now enemy systems, blowing them all away with half a dozen Death Stars. Great fun...
--
Dyolf Knip
THis is a game that I would truly love to see. I was positively addicted to the original and was always surprised that a sequel was never made. I enjoyed it more than any incarnation of civilization in fact.
$_='while(read+STDIN,$_,2048){$a=29;$b=73;$c=142;
Nope. It was pre the twinkifying of M:tG, but I believe MOM came out around the time of M:tG 3rd Edition. Yes, I am an acronym bastage :)
Take a left turn at sanity and go three miles past chaos
Ehehehe BRE and all those games? At least back then you could take several turns without waiting... ie. you got, say, 5 turns a day, and then the next day you had 5, etc.. much better than having to wait after _every_ turn...
those were the days tho...
Actually, I agree 100%. Tried to set up a modem game in MOO2 a couple of years ago, but that's NOOO good. Takes forever just to set up, then the game doesn't progress until everyone finishes their turn. When in single player, many turns are just "end turn" repeatedly to get a new tech, or to arrive at a new place. In multiplayer, that's just no good. You just want to click through a couple turns at the start, but some guy's busy micromanaging his indivdual peons.
It is so horrible, and if you tend to play the long-game (research, rinse, repeat) then you're screwed.
you're both wrong ....
!!!!MASTERS OF MAGIC!!!!
i liked getting an army of those
red fire-breathing ducks that always hung
out at the volcanoes and trampling all my
enemies
that and the immortal-mega-halfling slingers
were cool too
Detailed ground combat ... what i wouldn't do to be
able to run strategic ground combat
missions (like you do in MOM)
moving your troops around on the planet's
city scape and all that ... YA!!!
man-o-man
well, Infogrames recent purchase of Hasbro Interactive(Hasbro owns Microprose) maybe we can talk them into it
Now thats why i love not living with my girlfriend, I won't get caught. :)
But she might start wondering why i haven't called in three weeks, and my employess will probably start wondering why i haven't shown up in a month.
oh well screw em' all I'll have moo3 to play !
if you want "No More Hiroshimas" then I say "You First. No More Pearl Harbors."
I disagree, Masters of Orion (or any other turn
based strategy empire-building game similar
to it) can be very fun multiplayer with the
following things:
A LAN
A TV
A VCR or DVD Player
Booze
Let me explain further... say you have (for the
sake of arguement, for some out there this
will be purely hypothetical) four friends
with computers.
So, you get these people to bring said computers
with them, and booze, too (unless you have the
cash to provide it, in which case, I'm your pal
too)... you set the PCs up so they can view the
television, you start said game, you put in a movie
and you play both the game and the movie. Those
who finish their turns, watch the movie, talk,
whatever, whilst the slow people finish up.
I've done this before with Alpha Centauri, and it
was pretty fun... though you can't do it every
weekend it is a good way to spend pass some time!
-Llah
~- Llah -~
I love the Ho! Still play it when I've got a few minutes to kill. It even still beats me with the Diabolical computer players.
Do not touch -Willie
I wonder if "Starfleet Orion" on the
old Commodore PET was the ancient
progenitor of this?
--
BT
NNNN
Tracy Johnson
Justin Thyme Productions
Sponsors Empire on the WEB at:
http://198.190.228.6/
Tracy Johnson
Old fashioned text games hosted below:
http://empire.openmpe.com/
BT
For Macintosh, anyhow, (though I think there was a little Windows port) one of the absolute hands-down best space strategy games would have to have been Spaceward Ho! A classic theme, with a weird cowboy twist. Yahhh!
--hongpong.com
That old game is still around? And people actually play it? I remember playing it, the only reason to play was the combat...it was an exact ripoff of "Starfire", a great old game. I totally dug this game for a while because of the "Starfire" combat. The rest of the game was the pits, it was hard to move your units around, managing planets was tedious, you know, the usual stuff.
That short animation you saw when you conquered the galaxy was awesome. Simple, VGA graphics but effective reward after playing through a gruelling galactic war.
Anyone else remember STARLORD? It was this feudal type strategy game set in an immense galaxy where you had to gather a number of vassals, advance in rank and eventually challenge the emperor. It was great, except that for some strange reason it was basically impossible to lose (!) Now, this was a warez thing (I was a teenager at the time) so I don't know if there was something wrong with it, but the actual game mechanics were brilliant.
remake? I'd be content with a version that I could run without special DOS memory management.
A bunch of us used to hang out in Bob's room and play MOM for hours on end. A favorite unit was the Invisible Flying Battleship. All was well, until one of us figured out that what we really had just invented was the B-2 Bomber! For a little while that day, we all became Republicans...
We are too soon old, and too late smart.
MOO1 was the best (liked it much better than 2). I know, I know... people loved the Psilons and the Mecklars.. but the Darlocks were the coolest race to play Maybe I'm just a sneaky guy (matter of fact, I've got more sneak in my little finger than most people have in their entire body) but the I loved sitting back, building and developing with everybody else's tech... wait... this sounds like Open Source.. Woo Hoo! an analogy!
Even if a man chops off your hand with a sword, you still have two nice, sharp bones to stick in his eyes.
Man, I can't wait for MoOIII. I really look forward to unfairly comparing it to its predecessor, bitching about how it's not like before, and pining endlessly for playing the original on my 386. I'm chomping at the bit to carp about "graphics at the expense of gameplay" and carp at the fact that it's dumbed down for kids... not like in my generation, where you had to be a Rhodes scholar just to figure out how to play!
I'm stoked.
I read that the combat system from the first two games will be replaced by a real time one. What mad fiend has conspired to do this?
> Creative, +2 research, +1 Production -20% down the middle... the standard Custom race.
:-)
...
/exactally/ the same every time. Got real tedious.
;-)
What are you TALKING about? It's ALL about the Creative, Charismatic, Subterranean, and hits to spy, ground, and food or reproduction to make room for the Telepathic later.
> But I personally am hoping for:
>
I'd like to append some kind of control over the automation (ie, of build order), and/or build lists you can save. That was the one thing that I wished for in MoO2. I play the expand and conquer way (like Zerg in SC, or Borg in ST), and by the time I'd finished researching the basic stuff (as opposed to hyper-advanced), my build order for a new planet was
Heh, scroll bars would also be nice -- for the ship components, of course.
-Jason-
Oh man, was Master of Magic a great game! You can still find it abandonware some places. I would like to see a MoM sequel more than a MOO sequel; I didn't like either MOO or MOO2 as much as MoM. While we're talking about sci-fi strat games, I wouldn't mind seeing something as good as StarCon2, either.
It's more like Master of Magic than Master of Orion...
I'm having trouble...
It's more like Master of Magic with its melee combat than Civ.
Dancin Santa
The only complaint I ever had about MOO2 was that the endgame AI (most technologies found, most of the galaxy discovered, etc.) was piss poor. I hated spending 2-3 hours building a good civilization, and then sweeping through the galaxy unopposed because the computer is too stupid to realize that plasma cannons are way better than death rays (which, on a side note, can bite my ass.)
My request to the game developers: make the AI better. Make it kick my ass without it having more race points or faster manufacturing. Make it play better than me. Then, I will love you forever.
I think that I think, therefore I think that I am. I think. . .
Custom Meklars baby! Unified (+100% production & food) +2 Production +10 Ground Combat Low G Rich HomeWorld (more prod) -20 down the middle Out produce them! Build then dump to science, over and over. A Titan-a-turn is VERY nice! Cyb
It was released in 1994 (I'm picky maybe, but I KNEW it was earlier than 95) and is available:
2 &page=15
for purchase at http://www.spun.com/games/browse-date.jsp?platid=
and for download at http://www.gamingdepot.com/Masterorion.htm
I don't know what this says about the gameplay or about the design, but if the writer of the history is working on it, it'll be good.
I deleted every old copy of MOO and MOOII I had and burned the CDs they were backed up on. Hopefully I can keep from buying this one, too, unless they still let you blast planets into rubble. Commence orbital bombardment!
I must agree, even the MooIII site has been up for more than 6 months and there was ~3 months of dropped hints and speculation flying around the place before then. *shrug* Next thing you know someone will cotten on that Peter Molyneaux is making a new game ...
But still, hey, it IS one of the best series ever made. /me hops on the reminiscing bandwagon and fires up a low grav, aquatic, underground, large planet, telepathic, low money, low spies, omniscient race ..
VR: The way OF the future VR: The way TO the future
I heard that the MOO series was good, but I got sucked into StarCon 2 at the time I learned about the games. Then sucked into Civ and Alpha Centauri, so I never really got to play it. What's the idea behind it? I got the impression it was kinda like Civ.
Maybe this game series can put MOO2 behind itself. I hope this game lives up to the orginal.
The main game is still turn-based. Space combat is real-time, though.
Bill Fisher, President, Quicksilver Software, Inc.
Ship design and the technology system will be very cool and detailed. We've started discussing some aspects and will definitely be talking more about this in the coming months.
The galaxy map is in full 3D, with "realistic" stars and planets based on a rather deep amount of astronomical research that we've done.
Bill Fisher, President, Quicksilver Software, Inc.
that the status of a Linux version is "unknown at this time". Send them e-mail; let 'em know.
--
--
Sarcastic? Perhaps.
True, nonetheless. I still play Nethack to this day - it's the ultimate surviving example of game design over graphics.
I can see the fnords!
Ahh, to be able to do some Cruel Brutal Damage again! I miss the days.
Anyone else like to go for the "massive overkill" victory where you kept the last race cooped up on a small, ultra poor planet until you maxxed all the technology levels and started pumping out stacks of 32000 ultra large ships just bristling with miniaturized weapons?
I'm surprised the planet survived.
I also hope they don't try to get too fancy with it and abandon the addictive simplicity involved. I dread the thought of them turning MOO3 into something like Star Control 3. Ugh. That would suck.
Frighteningly, MOO2 is still in my CD pouch of games I always take when I travel. Even if I'm tired of all the others, I know I can pull that out an be amused.
Interesting to see if they're going to end up taking this into account - wonder if it meshed well with their plans.
Granted the makers of MOO3 also cried when real time combat was discussed. The rational was that since there would be hundreds of ships in a battle moving them all individually would be way too painstaking.
They plan to do it different from current real time battle, ie not who can click the fastest. Will be interesting to see what they come up with.
It's turtles all the way down.
- Masters Of Orion
- Battle At Antares
- Wrath Of Orion's Founders
(For the coffee deprived: think acronym).Or maybe 'More Everlasting Orion Wars'
Makes me wonder how you would describe the graphics of any of its prior incarnations :)
The OP is correct that Shrapnel Games is only distributing SEIV through snailmail (this is not a downloadable game, it requires a CD in the drive to play).
Malfador Machinations is the development team behind the Space Empires series -- the best thing about SEIV is the community (to which the developers actively belong). The game itself is a patch or two away from meeting the expectations of those who have played SEIII, imho. The documentation is many, many more "patches" away from being worthwhile :)
The OP linked to the Shrapnel Games homepage -- those interested in the actual product might be interested in the actual product page.
What I really liked about the MOO games was that the races all played differently and had real character. You had the spying Darloks and the intelligent Mentars etc. Too many games think that more == better. Space Empires IV, Stars! etc. all throw a gazillion similiar races and planets into a lifeless galaxy. You just don't care if your generic neighbour gets wiped out, but if the Elerians are getting their asses kicked by the Silicoid, I'll surely join their campaign. It's like Alpha Centauri versus Call to Power, a couple of very different factions or 50+ nations all alike.
;)
Another amazing aspect of MOO was how the game scaled. In the beginning you managed your single home system and maybe a few neighbouring systems. Building the colony improvements in the right order was very important as it gave you a boost over the other nations early on in the game. As the game progressed you could give over colonies for the computer to manage and concentrate on drawing up the big war campaign strategies, managing fleets and the border colonies while the core of the empire churned out science and new ships. And as your fleet of 50+ Doom Stars (2 stellar converters each, and time-warp faciliator) orbit the last alien planet, you can't help but smile
There's no way I can get addicted to a MOO sequel and stay and school at the same time.
And I *certainly* know which one will get higher priority.
Judge Pag, the Learned, Impartial, and Very Relaxed
Formidable, but their mincemeat up against a stack of fortified slingers or longbowman. That's another thing I loved about the game: no one killer strategy. Would have made some kick-ass multiplayer.
Probably not many are still reading this thread, but I'll post it anyway. Gamefaqs.com has a MOM message board that a few of us have been haunting in recent weeks. The posting has dropped to a minimum as of late, but if anyone out there's still listening and interested, stop on by, and do your part to revitalize the board!
Here's The Link!
That's why you start sending emails to them and Loki. If they get enough requests and they'll do it. It's not necessarily their fault they don't have any skilled Linux programmers.
"The words of the prophets are written on the Slashdot walls."
Good luck Alan Emrich - the gaming world is watching, and we've been playing FPSs while waiting for number 3...
Damn you! Damn you to hell!
(Calms down, sighs, submits - puts down homework, digs through box of CDs, pulls out MOM, grade in English 252 takes a nosedive)
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Antarans Return Fire?
Dancin Santa
Although some features like voices do not work, the MOO series has been pretty good.
It's more like Master of Magic than Master of Orion, IMHO.
Dancin Santa
On the other hand, Eidos is rumored to have given funding to another Romero project.
Given a reasonably level playing field, who would win a fight between a bear and a shark?
Actually, the new game has features meant to deal with this specifically. From the faq:
--
Since its written in Java, it works under Linux (and developed for the most part under Linux.)
Can Quicksilver find a combination of these three that produces some synergy, without having to improve on all of the above games? A lot of it can be done with the application of aesthetic sense, common sense and attention to detail, but it sounds like they have a real challenge in the AI area.
I had one of the first copies of MOO2 out of the carton at my local game store, and I loved it. But I quickly mastered it. Pax Imperia II for the Mac became my new galactic empire game, and I've yet to master the most difficult settings. So there's yet another comparison MOO3 must win...
Best of luck for them - I admit I'm anxious to see what they turn out...
I can see the fnords!
You're asking for two types of game in one, here. Do you really want to be in the middle of empire management, and then spend two hours in a Starcraft-esque tactical battle? Not only will it totally bloat the game, but they'd have to reinvent a wheel that's already got tough competition, and it would ruin the continuity of the overall game.
If they could just smooth the edges off of the MOO2 fleet combat mechanics, I'd be happy. I had a lot of fun going to war in MOO2.
One of the few problems I had in this area was that a lot of the combats were totally unbalanced. Tech levels could vary so much that often, one or the other combatant was totally outmatched. This can be fun when you're the one on top, but it's still nowhere near as fun as a good contest between equally matched opponents.
More Ship types/mods
I would add that they need custom starship design. If you haven't seen Pax Imperia: Eminent Domain yet (was it released for Windows?) take a look at it, especially the research and custom ship designs. The original Pax had even MORE detail in its system and ship design screens, but that was abandoned due to the dubious excuse of it was too complex. Some people loved it.
3-dimetional glaxy map and space combat
Oh yeah. If they could pull that off, it would be a hit even if other parts of it sucked.
That things stay turn based.
I'd generally agree, but when things were slow, I'd want the option to let the clock run while I manage the economy, production, etc... Games like this can sometimes be long periods of tedium interrupted by crises.
I can see the fnords!
I also still play Master of Magic on occasion. You've just got to love a game that allows so many interesting combinations. Flying, invisible, spell-locked warships are a particularly deadly combination, because they're almost unstoppable.
There is a petition for a Master of Magic sequel here. This game is just crying out for a sequel. I would absolutely love to see what a Flame Strike would look like with today's graphics capabilities.
--
The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing. - Edmund Burke
Anybody else remember Spaceward Ho! ?
MSK
I love Moo2, but the networking capability was so lame. I remember playing the game on a few P2s on 100 Megabit switched networks.
I figured, well, the game took some time on P166s with modems, so it'll fly now... nope...
They game was mad fun, but waitting to sync was maddening.
Alex
I'm going to lose my job, my girlfriend, my dog...
So go get a country CD, and play it backwards. You get your job back, your girl back, your dog comes back to life...
Three dits, four dits, two dits, dah!
Radio, radio, rah rah rah!
Also, I submitted the same story last Tuesday and it was rejected! I take this as a personal insult!
[Before flaming, please re-read this post as parody. Thank you.]
TheFrood
If you say "I'll probably get modded down for this..." then I will mod you down.
Thank you, now I feel real old. :(
:)
I might have to adopt your tactic though, so my wife doesn't catch me.
"The words of the prophets are written on the Slashdot walls."
Who needs anymore damn games flooding the market. Nethack is all I need. That game has it all, it takes skill, immagination, smarts, and fearlessness. Yes you must be fearless to play this game for hours and hours with your hand constantly clicking on the hjkl keys... hlhlhhjjjhhllhhjjlhlhjjjjljj... yes, carpal tunnel be damned. RSI HA! I laugh in your face. Hour after hour,click click click cold numbness, click click click.. sharp shooting pain...click click click
Ah yes, nethack, the one true game.
Yours,
Bob
All the best,
--Bob
A game worth mentioning in any discussion of Masters of Orion is Space Empires IV. It's only distributed online (to my knowledge), so you won't see it in any stores. It's not for those who like big luxurious cut scenes and beautiful graphics. The graphics are merely functional.
However, if you're interested in the strategy side of things, it's got a lot going for it.
Why are you letting these clowns ruin our country?
I'm not big on purchasing games, but MOO I and II are definately ones I've loved. In fact, its kind of strange this came up, because I loaded the original MOO onto my PC a few days ago, and I've been readdicted! Playing the Psilons is so much fun, using my repulsor beams along with my tri-focus weapons at 3x range. It was produced in 1995 I believe, and it STILL draws my attention. Excellent strategy game.
I enjoyed MOO II because of the technology update, but also the new rules and stuff were a GOOD addition. Someone here KNOWS how to make a game, and KNOWS how to make sequels!
MOO was the game that got me into Strategy/Galactic Conquest games. I spend most of my off time in the military playing MOO2. My friends and I used to talk about what kind of features we'd add if we were on the dev team for MOO3.
Creative, +2 research, +1 Production -20% down the middle... the standard Custom race.
This is also the game that truly threw me into network gaming. I am glad that there is going to be a sequel and I am anxious to hear about added features. The "official site" is dismally slow right now (No doubt the impact of slashdot readers). But I personally am hoping for:
Detailed ground combat
More options for custom races
More races
More Ship types/mods
3-dimetional glaxy map and space combat
That things stay turn based.
In this age of RTS games I think we need new, good turn based strategy game. Something I haven't seen since Alpha Centauri.
______________________ There is no
Master of Orion (2) is one of my all time favourite games, and the undisputed king of X4 games. I still occasionally play MOO2, but the gameplay has unfournately become so routine that a campaign on the impossible skill level only takes an evening :(
:), let's hope the MOO team can do better. While they're at it they should try to find some middle ground between micro-managment and letting the computer manage everything.
I really hope they can manage to catch the original spirit of the games. The web site talks about random generated "plot lines". Imperium Galactica II, another X4 game, tried it and it didn't really work (plus the game was just lame, enless micromanagment and no ship customizing! Plus who's the genius to come up with "interesting" techs like Laser 1 and Laser 2? MOO is all about the cool ships/technologies, I want my stellar converters and spatial compressors and xentronium armor
When MOO2 was out I was in college! I had no girlfriend! I had a part time job! I could afford to spend 36 hours straight playing computer games!
I'm going to lose my job, my girlfriend, my dog...
Waltz, nymph, for quick jigs vex Bud.
I was making such progress on breaking my MOO addiction, and they have to start designing another one. They just don't want me to get my homework done, do they?
Bugrit! Millenium hand and shrimp!
We would spend so many countless hours playing that game, I'm afraid to pick up a copy of MOO3 when it comes out!
A couple of other people have mentioned it, but I just want to plug my all-time favorite game, Master of Magic, or MOM.
To say MOM was inspired by MOO is of course accurate, but it's also not doing MOM justice. Not exactly a "sequel", and more than just a knock-off, MOM had a level of strategy and depth of gameplay all it's own. As you might expect by the title, it's a fantasy-based game, which borrows heavily from the Magic:The Gathering style of magic system (Chaos, Life, Death, Nature, and Sorcery magics). The gameplay was also similar to MOO, in that you started with a home city (planet), and from there could build or capture other cities while battling enemy wizards. A unique twist in MOM was the addition of "nodes"; mana-generating squares that you had to capture, guard, and channel for more magical energy.
Unlike MOO, where exploration and combat was relegated mostly to ships, you had a variety of forces at your command in MOM. Normal units like pikeman, archers, and magicians could be trained. You could also summon up to 6 hero's, who not only had thier own unique skills and abilities (plus the ability to cast magic for some), but could wield powerful artifacts to increase thier strenght. In addition, you could summon monsters to do your bidding, things like drakes, fire giants, and the ever-popular wraiths.
Thanks to the sheer number of possibilities of starting pick combinations, combined with different strategies available for waging war, MOM had some incredible replay value. I still occasionally play MOM even today, and I still get a kick out of trying some new strategy or pick-combination once in a while.
Microprose made me their bitch for most of the 90's with MOM, along with titles like MOO, MOO2, Civ, Civ2, Colonization, and XCom 1&2. It's a damn shame that they never got around to making MOM2, and there are those of us still hopeful, though the possibility seems less likely every day. I mean damn: if they can churn out 3 MOO's, 3 Civ's, and 4 XCom titles, surely there's room in the world for MOM2?
Never ever play against another (real)person. It's worse then a game of monopoly. It's like one of those really long traffic lights where you can literaly feel yourself aging except it spans 3+ hours of turn-based madness. It can be even worse... the length of a multiplayer game is exponentially proportional to the skillz of the player. You've been warned!
"Me Ted"
BOSTON SUCKS!