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Cloak of Invisibility Coming Soon?

Chris writes "The idea of an "invisibility cloak" has made the leap from science fiction books to an international patent application. The "three dimensional cloaking process and apparatus" for concealing objects and people (WO 02/067196) employs photodetectors on the rear surface which are used to record the intensity and color of a source of illumination behind the object. Light emitters on the front surface then generate light beams that exactly mimic the same measured intensity, color and trajectory. The result is that an observer looking at the front of the object appears to see straight through it."

140 of 432 comments (clear)

  1. The biggest question of course... by kylus · · Score: 5, Funny

    ...what's the bonus to saving throws when wearing it? :)

    --
    --Kylus
    Idiot-proof something, and Life will build a better Idiot.
    1. Re:The biggest question of course... by oval_pants · · Score: 5, Funny


      +1 bonus
      -6000 dexterity for "wheelbarrow that you'll need to carry the batteries, fuel cells or magic moonbeams " post

    2. Re:The biggest question of course... by smead · · Score: 2, Insightful

      The really big question is will it cause you to embark on an epic quest to destroy it and ultimately lead you to having your finger bit off on the edge of a volcano, all while trying to avoid the temptation to use it?

    3. Re:The biggest question of course... by btellier · · Score: 2

      Well, it would effectively make the opponent blind, which I think would translate into a +3 bonus unless they had blind fighting.

    4. Re:The biggest question of course... by Dark+Lord+Seth · · Score: 2, Funny

      +2, +5 vs Trolls

  2. Practicality? by nuggz · · Score: 5, Insightful

    There are many angles crossing an object, although this may work for simple front to back (as the article states)
    I don't think it is that workable for all directions, or even more then a few.

    1. Re:Practicality? by N3WBI3 · · Score: 2, Insightful

      This would be pretty good camo though. you would see only a distortion from a distance. One could take this a step further and make polygon dectectors / projectors giving you sides. I know it would not be perfect but you just want to make youself hard to see in combat.

      --
    2. Re:Practicality? by lars_stefan_axelsson · · Score: 5, Insightful
      I don't think it is that workable for all directions, or even more then a few.

      Well, that depends on what you mean by workable.

      Just getting the hue and intensity right (and being able to vary those) will go a very long way. It's not for nothing that English fishermen weren't allowed to paint their hulls white in days of yore, or that Mountbatten had his fleet painted pink. (The sky is brigther than the ocean at dusk/night and hence a light hull blends in. And pink works better agains the redder skies of asian waters).

      The US Army even conducted trials with lamps on tanks to make them harder to spot as silouettes against the sky on a ridge line for example.

      Now, the light trick is unworkable for other reasons (you have to be quick on the switch) should you drive in front of a dark object. So if this process could be automated there's much to be gained.

      Now, of course if your main objection that this is far from a cloak of invisibility, that's for certain. But it could be quite useful camouflage.

      And kids remember the old adage "A running soldier in a camoflague uniform, looks just like a running soldier in a camoflague uniform." Camouflage is still very much a stationary art. I doubt that tricks like these would change that much.

      --
      Stefan Axelsson
    3. Re:Practicality? by WickedChicken · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Think of a hologram. Depending on your viewing angle the lightwaves bring out a different patten from the interference stored in the hologram. That is how holograms can make 3D images - because both of your eyes see two slightly different images and can calculate distance. I'm sure it wouldn't be too hard to convert a hologram to use LEDs so that depending on what angle you view you get a corresponding image.

      --
      "It's even worse if you're locked into a proprietary operating system." -http://www.wehavethewayout.com/scale.asp?rew=0
    4. Re:Practicality? by Jon+Abbott · · Score: 2

      I suppose the same could go for space ships -- paint one entirely black, and you've got an invisible ship. That would make docking rather hard, though...

    5. Re:Practicality? by Sawbones · · Score: 2, Interesting
      This color scheme is used on a certain tropical fish (though I forget it's name/species/location). It's shaded dark/black on the top and light on the bottom. Predators looking up will have a hard time locating it on the relatively bright background of the sky and predators from above won't be able to see it in the mirk below. I thought it was pretty cool when I first heard about it.


      Along the lines of the whole "only works from one direction" problem for this camo. If you're not going for total image replication but rather a general brightness and hue, it seems like you could have one basically strips of mixed photo sensors and emitters paired up to similar strips on exactly oposite sides of the object. It would be a much worse match from any given direction than the technique described, but it would match at least partially from all directions.

      --

      Ad in classifieds: Pandora's Box (no box) $5
    6. Re:Practicality? by TheOnlyCoolTim · · Score: 2

      It would only be invisible as long as it didn't go in front of any other spaceships, planets, moons, etc. near you or even in front of a few too many stars.

      It would still radiate in all sorts of other spectra anyway, and who's going to use visible light for spaceship detection?

      Tim

      --
      Omnia vestra castrorum habetur nobis.
    7. Re:Practicality? by fjordboy · · Score: 2

      Another example is lights underneath aircraft that mimic the sky...or painting the underside of aircraft blue. *shrug*

      Another project from a while ago that the navy had was a ship that actually produced mist and had lighting that matched the lighting around it...making it very, very difficult to see from the air, or the sea. (It was in popsci, so I doubt it ever came to be).

    8. Re:Practicality? by HiThere · · Score: 2

      Read your Lensman series again. You design the shape of the ship to be narrow, so that it can't be seen in the direction that it's pointed. You build it out of Titanium and Beryllium alloys so magnets won't notice it. You get rid of magnetic relays. etc.

      Occulusion isn't really anything to worry about in space. Distances being what they are, a ship would need to be REALLY big to be noticable. Of course, if you are sneaking up on something, you do need to worry about it, but the engines are more worrisome. So you need to sneak quite slowly, and with care for the exact direction that you approach from. (And you still don't worry about occulding another space ship. By the time you get *that* close, they'll find you if they're looking for you, so you pretend to be one of them.)

      --

      I think we've pushed this "anyone can grow up to be president" thing too far.
    9. Re:Practicality? by Xaoswolf · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Remember watching the movie "The Predator"? When the hunter sat in a tree, you couldn't see him unless you knew where to look, or already had three dots on your fore head. He was basicly invisible at that time. But when he moved, you got to see all the distortion and weird angles produced by his camoflage. That is basicly what this armor will produce, it will keep tanks hidden better than large cammo netting, snipers will be able to sit invisible for hours in almost plain sight.
      You just can't let them get too close or you're screwed.

    10. Re:Practicality? by spiro_killglance · · Score: 2
      To pick up the light and a hologram and display it
      again, the clock would have to have receptors
      and emitters smaller than the wavelength of
      the light. Plus they would have to acturately
      reproduce the light over all the optical wavelengths. (Infra red and radio would be
      good to if you don't want to be detected).
      This would require high nanotech.



      However do this at radio frequencies, especial
      a single known fixed radio frequency, for perfect
      radar stealth seems feasible, (but very
      expensive) with current electronics.

    11. Re:Practicality? by Dannon · · Score: 2

      "A running soldier in a camoflague uniform, looks just like a running soldier in a camoflague uniform."

      How very, very true. And, in the dark, stillness is the best camoflage of all.

      This brings to mind a memory of a childhood camping trip. Had a flashlight-tag-like game in the middle of the woods, where one person started out as 'it', and everyone else started out away from the campfire. The campfire circle was a 'safe' zone. Get tagged by an 'it' person, and you joined the 'it' crowd.

      Eventually there was only one person left untagged, and no one could find him, even though he was right under everyone's noses. Standing against a tree. And he wasn't even wearing dark clothing.

      Ah, memories....

      --
      Good judgment comes from experience.
      Experience comes from bad judgment.
    12. Re:Practicality? by Kintanon · · Score: 2

      Didn't the lensman solution use a Diesel engine for one of these things? Since it was completely undetectable as far as energy emissions went, and the person only needed to move a very very short distance with it?

      Kintanon

      --
      Check out JoshJitsu.info for Brazilian Ji
    13. Re:Practicality? by __aaahtg7394 · · Score: 2

      just come in on inertia... you don't have drag to worry about in space.

      or perhaps keep some tanks of supercooled gas (liquid, solid, whatever) and use that as propellant (slowly, as you said). if you use small enough amounts, it shouldn't be too visible as a cloud, and (if i remember my chemistry right), PV=nRT, where n and R are constants, so, as long as P is going down at the same rate that V is going up (ie: you're jetting it out quick enough), T should stay nice and relatively constant, not emitting too much IR.

      and i thought taking chemistry was an absolute waste of time. pssh (no pun intended)

    14. Re:Practicality? by Kintanon · · Score: 2

      Even if it only reduces the visibility of an object by 30% it will be incredibly useful for military vehicles. I don't know if it would be more, or less useful than current camo techniques, but I'm sure it will have some great uses once it is further refined.

      Kintanon

      --
      Check out JoshJitsu.info for Brazilian Ji
    15. Re:Practicality? by overunderunderdone · · Score: 2

      Well it still wouldn't be "invisibility". In your example of a sphere imagine it in a real life situation. You are standing in front of a line of trees (from my POV), blue sky above, purplish/blue mountains in the distance behind you to the left and yellowish green grass below you. When I look at you I will see the tree's in the direct center of the sphere as advertised. BUT I will also see at an oblique angle a glimpse of the purplish blue mountains at the RIGHT and a glimpse of the green grass at the top and worse bright blue sky at the lower edge of the sphere (or much worse the blindingly bright sun - so much for going undetected)

      Still a pretty cool trick probably decent cammo in that the constantly changing image would break up the outline. Still you would sure as hell know something was there, though it would probably "hurt your eyes" the way an op-art poster does.

    16. Re:Practicality? by MoneyT · · Score: 2

      By the time they got too close to the sniper, they'd be dead.

      --
      T Money
      World Domination with a plastic spoon since 1984
    17. Re:Practicality? by Kintanon · · Score: 2

      Ahhh yeah! I was thinking there must have been another component to it. I really enjoyed the weird tech from those books...

      Kintanon

      --
      Check out JoshJitsu.info for Brazilian Ji
    18. Re:Practicality? by CitizenjaQ · · Score: 2, Funny
      This color scheme is used on a certain tropical fish (though I forget it's name/species/location). It's shaded dark/black on the top and light on the bottom.

      That would be the "penguin" species of tropical fish, I believe.

    19. Re:Practicality? by pmancini · · Score: 2

      I once was in what the British call a "Gilley" (spelling) Suit. This is your basic battledress with camo pattern along with a netting with artificial leaves. The leaves were simply strips from an anti-radar cover. Running around in this set up did rather draw the eye. However, when I went to ground in the forest I disappeared. A Marine veteran with 15 years experience saw me go down 20 feet from his position. 10 seconds later he communicated he had no idea where I was.

      You don't have to have perfect camo for it to be effective. Break up shapes, blend in with the local color and you are ready to roll. The problem with the suit mentioned above was, what happens when I move out of the forest and into an urban environment? Obviously I would be a lot easier to spot than someone in just regular dark clothing. A well camouflaged man who is a poor shot will probably survive longer than the poorly concealed expert sniper.

      A system like this could be useful, depending on how it generates color and how well it minimizes shine. Nothing gets the attention more than something shiney. That is why snipers often camoflage their weapons as well.

    20. Re:Practicality? by jonadab · · Score: 2

      I'm afraid it's not that simple. The light striking your structure
      (whatever it is) won't all be coming in perpendicular to the surface.

      I'll let that sink in...

      Besides measuring wavelengths and intensities, you have to measure
      the _direction_ of every incoming bit of light and, without a delay
      that would be perceptible, send it to the appropriate point it would
      have reached if you weren't there and send it on its way aimed in
      the correct direction.

      Further, all that gets you is a neat parlor trick. If you want to
      hide from people who know you might have a cloaking device (say, for
      military use), it gets harder. You have to account for polarity, or
      else all the other guy has to do is shine polarised light all around
      and use polarised sunglasses, and if you didn't reproduce the correct
      polarity, you'll glow. And as someone else has said you need to
      account for all wavelengths, not just visible light.

      --
      Cut that out, or I will ship you to Norilsk in a box.
    21. Re:Practicality? by budgenator · · Score: 2

      Just getting the hue and intensity right (and being able to vary those) will go a very long way actualy getting the hue and intensity right will be all but impossible on a battlefield. The Modern battlefield is just bristling with detectors and the human eye is one the easiest to fool, it only sees visible light, NODS Night Obsevation devices sees mainly reds and near infrared, Thermal vision devices of course sees very small temperature variations. And oppsoed to the eyes limited ability to see, the Human mind is one of the best pattern recognitions devices. a few LED's in red green and blue may be able to fool my naked eyes, especialy if you're very still, through in millimeterwave detectors, two or three different frequencies of radar and a multi-spectral scan is going to make you look like a searchlight at night.

      --
      Apocalypse Cancelled, Sorry, No Ticket Refunds
    22. Re:Practicality? by mgv · · Score: 2

      There are many angles crossing an object, although this may work for simple front to back (as the article states)

      Of course, the low tech way of doing this from a few directions is to use 4 large prisms to bend the light around yourself:

      _/''\_

      Which works alot better than a bunch of LEDs and would probably work for infrared and UV as well.

      My 2c worth.

      Michael

      --
      There is no cryptographic solution to the problem where the intended receiver and the attacker are the same entity.
    23. Re:Practicality? by armb · · Score: 2

      > I once was in what the British call a "Gilley" (spelling) Suit.

      I've always seen it as ghillie, but http://www.m-w.com says "variant of gillie".
      In this context it's "2. chiefly Scottish & Irish : a fishing and hunting guide"

      Basic idea is to disguise the outline of the body. Often enhanced with real local vegetation.

      --
      rant
    24. Re:Practicality? by pmancini · · Score: 2
      Thanks for the correction! It allowed me to find a website with a useful photo gallery:

      www.ghilliesuits.com

  3. Looking behind it by SWroclawski · · Score: 4, Insightful

    The problem with this device as it's designed so far is that it only works when looking straight at the object.

    In addition, I have serious questions about the resolution of the device (how many sensors and how many light emitters). Will the person look "pixelated" and or will there be some other problem.

    Lastly, such a device is not useful in combat situations as many soldiers in such a ground war situation will be outfitted with infr-red detectors, which will probably be able to detect the human behind the suit.

    Good idea but has a lot of practical problems (we haven't even discussed the power source).

    1. Re:Looking behind it by tunah · · Score: 2
      The problem with this device as it's designed so far is that it only works when looking straight at the object.

      Yeah, I tested a prototype of this, and the biggest problem was people spotting me while looking in the opposite direction.

      --
      Free Java games for your phone: Tontie, Sokoban
  4. Flaw by alnapp · · Score: 5, Funny

    I suspect that the squeaking of the wheelbarrow that you'll need to carry the batteries, fuel cells or magic moonbeams that'll be needed to power this thing will render any invisibility firly useless.

    But I still want one, go figure

  5. Far more useful by anthonyclark · · Score: 4, Funny


    I'll be more impressed when a Cloak of Charisma is released; hellloooo, laydeez|boyz!


    (and no, those new cargo pants you just bought from Gap do not count).

    --
    ----- Documentation is worth it just to be able to answer all your mail with 'RTFM' - Alan Cox.
    1. Re:Far more useful by orthogonal · · Score: 2

      I'll be more impressed when a Cloak of Charisma is released; hellloooo, laydeez|boyz!

      Or in Bangkok, hello lady-boys!

      Which reminds me, the Cloak of Charisma already exists: it's called a money-clip full of fifties.

    2. Re:Far more useful by HiThere · · Score: 2

      Help me live longer! And you too! Use your spare CPU cycles to run folding@home [stanford.edu]

      So I went to the site to consider participation. I didn't look too hard, but I couldn't find a single thing that indicated that they would release the data into public domain, or that they wouldn't patent things to make it unusable by those who couldn't afford their rates.

      I may be cynical, but this looks to me like another scam where they ask the public to donate, and then they take all the benefits.

      There are reasons why I support the GPL, and this appears to be an example of why I feel it should be extended into other realms. It used to be called academic respectability, but somehow that got lost as soon a money became available. Your tax dollars at work, privitizing IP!

      --

      I think we've pushed this "anyone can grow up to be president" thing too far.
    3. Re:Far more useful by orthogonal · · Score: 2
      Your point is well-taken. Making the results of work I freely donate freely available is also very important to me. From the FAQ, which admittedly could be easier to find:


      Who "owns" the results? What will happen to them?

      Unlike other distributed computing projects, Folding@home is run by an academic institution (specifically the Pande Group, at Stanford University's Chemistry Department), which is a non-profit institution dedicated to science research and education. We will not sell the data or make any money off of it.

      Moreover, we will make the data available for others to use. In particular, the results from Folding@home will be made available on several levels. Most importantly, analysis of the simulations will be submitted to scientific journals for publication, and these journal articles will be posted on the web page after publication. Next, after publication of these scientific articles which analyze the data, the raw data of the folding runs will be available for everyone, including other researchers, here on this web site.

  6. Been done by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Funny

    Most readers of Slashdot already have one of these. Problem is, it only works on women.

  7. Shadows by suso · · Score: 2

    The only problem is, you're going to see some weird shadowing around the cloaked object and be able to tell that it's there. I can't believe that I'm actually replying to this post.

  8. I can see it already by Wind_Walker · · Score: 4, Funny
    Person who thinks he's invisible: You can't see me!!!

    Naked Woman: Actually, I can see a shimmery shape, because you're slightly off-center to me.

    PWTHI: Wait, wait, you're not in the right place. Move to the left.

    NW: Ok. Now you're even MORE shimmery

    PWTHI: No, no, MY left, not your left

    NW: Oh, sorry. There, the shimmering went away.

    PWTHI: Ha ha ha ha!!!! I can see you naked!!

    NW: Sir, this is a strip club. It's not exactly difficult.

  9. Here's an even better application by Brento · · Score: 4, Funny

    Instead of making me invisible, I just want it to make me look thinner. Shave off my side edges by painting the background over my sides, and voila, I've lost 20 pounds.

    --
    What's your damage, Heather?
    1. Re:Here's an even better application by BoBaBrain · · Score: 2

      There already is a garment which does something like that for guys like us.

      It's called a "tracksuit".

      --
      I am a Karma Library.
    2. Re:Here's an even better application by jred · · Score: 2

      Or a girdle...

      --

      jred
      I'm not a mechanic but I play one in my garage...
  10. An interesting concept... by altgrr · · Score: 3, Informative

    This has been done before using fibre optics, I believe, so that you would effectively see through the person because they wore an outfit consisting of thin fibre optic wires routeing light straight through them. This was on TV once, although I don't know whether it was the actual suit being shown or merely some special effects to show what it _could_ look like. Either way, it looked obvious that there was someone there - anything longer than a brief glance would be time enough to tell.

    --


    Like car accidents, most hardware problems are due to driver error.
    1. Re:An interesting concept... by Idarubicin · · Score: 2
      This has been done before using fibre optics, I believe, so that you would effectively see through the person because they wore an outfit consisting of thin fibre optic wires routeing light straight through them.

      It's a thought, but again, you're stuck with something that only really works from one or two directions--and then, it works badly. Anybody who's worked in laser optics knows it's bloody difficult to get light to couple efficiently into a fibre, and that's working with collimated laser light.

      You might be able to "see through" someone, but the image you'd get would be quite dim, unless you amplify somewhere in the middle. This is--difficult. (Understatement.)

      I suppose this is a great idea, if you only have one person to hide from, and you always face them, and you have access to a lot of little detectors and light sources.

      --
      ~Idarubicin
  11. Wow, it sounds exactly like... by ActiveSX · · Score: 2, Funny

    ...Metal Gear Solid! Honestly, I think the bandana would be more fun to have, but I'd settle for invisibility, even if a cardboard box works most of the time.

  12. old camoflage technique by Alien54 · · Score: 3, Informative
    I recall this as similar to an old WWII camoflage technique, to make the apparent brightness of an object match the bacjground.

    I believe in WWII some submarine hunter aircraft had spotlights on the front to make the apparent brightness of the dark aircraft match the sky. Killed more subs that way.

    this technique worked really well for large objects if they were a good distance away, like for a tank of the horizon or an aircraft in the sky. awful for close up work.

    I recall a good article on this someplace on the web, but to find it now on short notice .....

    --
    "It is a greater offense to steal men's labor, than their clothes"
    1. Re:old camoflage technique by ckedge · · Score: 2

      Roger that. They're still experimenting with it I believe.

      Saw some clip on TV once of a modern British Army truck whose side was covered in spotlights sitting at the crest of a hill. A few km away they showed what it looked like before and after turning on the lights. The truck just disappeared against the sky.

      I'm guessing that there are all sorts of other problems. IE: it only works when you're siloetted against the sky, and against a dark hill it spots you out!, so it's probably not as useful on a ground vehicle as it seems.

      Now, laying down a bright sheet of photo-luminescent plastic or super bright white LEDs on a slow moving low flying military drone, that might be a cool idea to increase it's survivability. It's always silouetted against the sky. The only problem there is power consumption. Even an overcast sky is hundreds of watts per square meter of light.

  13. Re:Prior Art? by kalidasa · · Score: 2

    Can't the fact that the idea has been around for a long time, in both sci-fi books, movie and games mean this has "prior art".

    Uh, no. I am not a patent lawyer, but I believe prior art means someone actually has to have built such a thing, not just dreamed it up.

  14. Huh? by Hard_Code · · Score: 5, Funny

    What, no pictures?

    --

    It's 10 PM. Do you know if you're un-American?
    1. Re:Huh? by Jondor · · Score: 2

      If you look better, at the site, in the white area..

      --
      Nobody expects the spanish inquisition!
    2. Re:Huh? by Hard_Code · · Score: 2

      Did I miss something in the article...are these two articles related somehow? Is MIT behind this invisibility thing??

      --

      It's 10 PM. Do you know if you're un-American?
  15. Close one by The+Pim · · Score: 3, Funny

    Whew!... just imagine if this technology had been developed before our ability to uncloak terrorist networks.

    --

    The evaluation of an action as 'practical' . . . depends on what it is that one wishes to practice.
  16. I can see it ... no pun intended. by Scholasticus · · Score: 2, Insightful

    I can see this happening, with a lot more refinement. You'd need gobs of processing power, hosts of tiny photodetectors and projectors, and a very small but reliable and long-lasting power supply (as somebody else already noted). With today's tech, this idea is pretty useless. The engineering obstacles could be overcome in the future. On the other hand, it would be pretty easy to come up with effective countermeasures. Wouldn't this thing radiate like hell in the infrared?

  17. You're not an engineer, are you? by p3d0 · · Score: 3, Interesting
    Have some imagination!
    • For looking straight at the object: just coat the whole thing in emitters and detectors. That's not a big fundamental problem. You don't want light reflecting off the object anyway; might as well have detectors that absorb it.
    • The resolution problem can be addressed simply by increasing the resolution until it's small enough not to be noticable. Regardless, even at low resolution, it's better than normal camouflage, isn't it? (Ever seen Predator?)
    • The infrared problem can be solved the same way the visible light problem is solved. Just have IR detectors and emitters. You can even to a variety of frequencies (just as with visible light) to fool various enemy equipment.
    To me, a big problem would be to counter an active detection system that shines light on the object and looks for reflections. The emitters will be subject to a design trade-off between emission and absorption, and it might be hard to find a technology that does both well enough.
    --
    Patrick Doyle
    I mod down every jackass who puts his moderation policy in his sig. Oh, wait a sec....
    1. Re:You're not an engineer, are you? by SWroclawski · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Everything is solveable.

      The idea in the patent is old. So we only care about the implemtnation, and the implementation looks full of problems.

      When it's better and practical- then we should care.

    2. Re:You're not an engineer, are you? by MoneyT · · Score: 2

      But the IR detectors used for locating the individual are using light. Not visable light but they are using light. And as we all know light is a wave, and when waves interect with other waves, they can be distorted. Perhaps it is possible to distort the IR waves enough to remain undetected.

      --
      T Money
      World Domination with a plastic spoon since 1984
  18. Re:moving "eyes" can pick it up? by trix_e · · Score: 4, Insightful

    My completely uneducated guess is that the object will appear a lot like those "magic eyes" pictures that were all the rage a few years ago...

    i.e. when you move from side to side (or up/down) the object will shift at a slightly different rate than the background, and your senses will detect something. you may not be able to tell what it is, but something will feel "off". I'm sure at greater distances the effect will be less, and therefore the technique will be more useful.

    Reminds me of Predator, and the way that it shimmered when it moved. My guess is that they used the same thought when they made that movie.

    Very cool.

    --
    No man is an island, but Gary is a city in Indiana.
  19. Another limitation by volpe · · Score: 2


    I don't think it is that workable for all directions, or even more then a few.

    Not only that, but you'd have to look at it from a pre-determined distance in order for the rendered view-angle to be appropriate.

  20. Better applications by Twylite · · Score: 5, Insightful

    The article very definately uses the words "detect" (light behind) and "generate" (image in front). This implies it is not some passthrough technology (fiber, etc), but an electronic record and recreation.

    If this "clock" could live up to its claims, there are three (possibly more) far more interesting applications that must be considered:

    • Holographic photography: the photoreceptors on the back can apparently sense the intensity, colour and trajectory. They can also do this without a lens. Impressive.
    • Holographic projection / 3D TV: the light emitters on the front can recreate the image behind the object. In order to do this with enough accuracy to clock an object, they have to recreate the trajectory of the light; failing this they have a 2D image which will be noticable as soon as the viewer moves.
    • Realistic looking TV: apart from the 2D/3D problem, TV just doesn't look real because it is poor at depecting matt textures. A glowing, glossy area within your field of vision would certainly attract your attention, even if it fitted into the background.

    Given that researchers would be coining it from more down-to-earth inventions like these, I can't really see that the technology - as described - exists or is being developed.

    --
    i-name =twylite [http://public.xdi.org/=twylite], see idcommons.net
    1. Re:Better applications by HiThere · · Score: 2

      Doing the detection without a lens is easy. Just use a fly's eye approach. A detector at the bottom of an opaque cylinder with the top off (or even a simple lens at the top). If the background was relatively stable, you could use a rotating filter, but it might be better to use triple the number of detectors, and parcel them out in triads, with each cylinder having a filter at the top for R, G, or G. (Sort of the opposite of a tv screen.)

      As to the resolution... nobody's said just how good it is. How good it would need to be would depend on it's intended purpose.

      --

      I think we've pushed this "anyone can grow up to be president" thing too far.
    2. Re:Better applications by hoggoth · · Score: 2

      > If this "clock" could live up to its claims...
      > to clock an object...

      Why can't you write "cloak". Try it... Cl-oooooooooooo-ak. Try it again.

      --
      - For the complete works of Shakespeare: cat /dev/random (may take some time)
  21. Walnut-sized Nuclear Reactor by baldass_newbie · · Score: 2

    I always thought one of the coolest gadgets mentioned in Sci-Fi was the 'reactor' for the personal shield generator in the Foundation Trilogy.
    It was the size of a walnut. Of course, it didn't last very long, but a walnut-sized reactor would still be pretty cool (albeit very unlikely.)

    --
    The opposite of progress is congress
    1. Re:Walnut-sized Nuclear Reactor by snake_dad · · Score: 2

      The ones that didn't last very long were specially crafted, so they could be used as bribes on non-Foundation planets. Don't spread FUD on good old Foundation Technology! :)

      --
      karma capped .sig seeking available Slashdot poster for long-term relationship.
    2. Re:Walnut-sized Nuclear Reactor by HiThere · · Score: 2

      We make them smaller than that! (Of course, they don't produce much power. We use them to ionize the air in smoke alarms. Americium powered, if I recall correctly.)

      We could probably make them the size of a zippo and get real power out of them, but you probably wouldn't want to carry it around with you... that size doesn't include the shielding. And I'm not sure how much power it would produce, my guess is enough for a transistor radio.

      Additionally, some of the nano-tech machinery being invented is nuclear powered. At that size they don't require enough power to be dangerous. (Again, it's lack of shielding that makes it workable.)

      --

      I think we've pushed this "anyone can grow up to be president" thing too far.
  22. Good camoflage though ... by Titusdot+Groan · · Score: 3, Insightful
    Because of angles of viewing etc. this wouldn't make you invisible -- this would be great camoflage though -- you'd match the color and light of the background almost perfectly.

    The most important part of camoflage is making recognizable features hard to see -- hands, faces, etc -- things our visual system is hardwired to pickup out of the background. This invisibility cloak would do that.

    I imagine it looking like the Alien in that Arnold movie, hard to see unless it's moving and then the distortions give it away.

    Of course is this a really old idea -- heck it a similiar idea was in comics in the 1970s (some super heros club house had this kind of device to hide it from view).

  23. What no Screen Shots? by jellomizer · · Score: 2

    I was hoping to see the cloak in action. :-)

    --
    If something is so important that you feel the need to post it on the internet... It probably isn't that important.
  24. Re:Prior Art? by p3d0 · · Score: 2
    Of course it should be patentable. Just because it has been mentioned in fiction doesn't mean anything. Would you deny patents on warp engines or teleportation devices?

    Now, if there were a work of sci-fi that described how to implement this device in detail, then that might be prior art.

    --
    Patrick Doyle
    I mod down every jackass who puts his moderation policy in his sig. Oh, wait a sec....
  25. Re:Prior Art? by Alranor · · Score: 2, Insightful

    Again, IANAL, but I don't think it needs to have been built, just described accurately enough that it's not a new insight for the person actually building it

    IIRC nobody could patent geostationary satellites when they were first built because a certain well known sci-fi author had described the concepts previously.

    Or I could be talking crap, that happens too.

  26. I'll believe it... by yelims · · Score: 5, Funny

    ...when I see it.

    Sorry, it had to be said.

  27. Perfect bad patent by RichMan · · Score: 5, Insightful

    This is a pretty near perfect example of a bad patent.
    1) the idea is pretty obvious (as well as many references in common SF literature)
    2) the actual implementation with current tech will be pretty miserable. Put big bright light behind object, make object shine big bright light at viewer. Viewer is blinded by both and as object is indistinquishable the technique is easily demonstrated to the patent requirement level.
    3) it serves as a patent stake. Further research into a better/improved technology will have to deal with this patent.

    This is a near perfect bad patent that grants the patent holder a big stake in the ground for actually showing very little. And any future work that will actually improve the technique is going to have to deal with the patent.

    1. Re:Perfect bad patent by Sebastopol · · Score: 2


      Doesn't the inventor at least have to have a prototype or some way of building it for it to get a patent?

      --
      https://www.accountkiller.com/removal-requested
  28. Viewable Angle? by Junior+J.+Junior+III · · Score: 2

    This is interesting, but will be of rather limited usefulness if the viewable angle is not very wide.

    --
    You see? You see? Your stupid minds! Stupid! Stupid!
  29. Doesn't seem possible. by mborysow · · Score: 3, Interesting

    Even if this intended to be just one way. You'd have to have very little light coming from the direction of the intended person to be "blinded." This would assume that this cloak will absorb *all* (up to a point that's observable) the light that would have reflected off of it and to the observer. Well, perfect black body's just don't exist. There'll always be likely to have a reflection come off of this thing.

    That's just the beginning, I don't think we're anywhere near having what's essentially an instantly recorded and rebroadcast super high resolution wrappable screen. The way, though I could be mistaken, that most light sources are created even in high definition display devices, will allow for scattering, so the image you would see where the person should be would be blurry. You'd have to get pretty close to duplicating every photon. Not nearly so accurately of course since the human eye isn't so good, but still.

    Anyway, I'm just stupid. /me wanders away.

  30. Depth perception by Myco · · Score: 3, Interesting

    Many have already pointed out the most obvious problem -- any angle other than straight on is going to wreck the effect. But let's not forget that a human with two functional, open eyes never views an object from just one angle (unless one eye's view of the object is obstructed -- geez, picky...). Ah, the miracle of depth perception. I don't think this method is nearly sophisticated enough to compensate for all the subtle clues we get from our binocular vision. Nice try, though. I mean, I think that everyone who's considered the possibility of invisibility has come up with a scheme like this. It's nice to see it coming closer to reality, but we all know that at this stage it's too limited except for perhaps certain special circumstances. But yeah, I want one too.

  31. Still More Limitations by swb · · Score: 5, Insightful

    It also doesn't do much for your heat signiture. Since so much military surveillance is done with IR, you'd think that the extra heat generated by the thing being cloacked and the cloaking mechanism that it'd glow like a light bulb under IR.

    1. Re:Still More Limitations by Steve+Cox · · Score: 2

      Whereas is glows like millions of little light bulbs in visible light :)

      Steve.

    2. Re:Still More Limitations by swb · · Score: 2

      I think you mean thermal imaging. Infrared really has nothing to do with heat as far as detection goes, just light spectrums.

      Radiated heat is infrared, isn't it?

    3. Re:Still More Limitations by mmol_6453 · · Score: 2

      As a probationary firefighter, I've seen it used to search a home for (whatever caused the smoke detector to go off without showing flame). You can see a hotspot clear as day, even through that sheet of concrete some people use to shield their walls from the furnace.

      I can't imagine anything less is going to stop the IR.

      Now, if someone would be bright enough to invent a polymer that blocked IR, you could build blankets, sleeping bags and uniforms out of the stuff. Soldiers could sleep out in the open, and wouldn't be visible by satellite, at night.

      --
      What's this Submit thingy do?
    4. Re:Still More Limitations by MikeTheYak · · Score: 2

      Blocking IR is the easy part. The problem is that your blocking substance would eventually heat up, and then would itself start emitting IR. Waste heat is a problem with no known easy solution because of the laws of thermodynamics. A human body generates heat, and that heat energy has to go somewhere. Generally it gets emitted as IR.

      What you'd need is not so much an IR blocker (though it would have to do that as well), but something that can absorb a lot of heat without changing temperature much. You can't actually get around the fact that a garment made of such a substance would eventually heat up to something close to human body temperature, but you can at least delay the effect. To the best of my knowledge, we're nowhere near being able to do this with current technology.

    5. Re:Still More Limitations by _ph1ux_ · · Score: 2

      as we all know from watching commando - all you have to do to hide your heat signature is cover yourself in mud.

    6. Re:Still More Limitations by swb · · Score: 2

      Polar bears! I saw a teevee special about the polar bears near Hudson Bay and they viewed polar bears through some heat-detecting camera and the polar bear insulation was so good that they barely showed up.

    7. Re: Still More Limitations by _ph1ux_ · · Score: 2

      HEH. OOPS ;P

    8. Re:Still More Limitations by mmol_6453 · · Score: 2

      To absorb a lot of heat, with current technology, an object would have to be dense, like a iron skillet. Then you have to find a way to cool it quickly, without shattering it.

      Or you could use heat-regulated chemical coldpacks. Though somewhat bulky, they'd be able to take care of it. More than a little dangerous if they malfunction in cold weather, though. "malfunction" meaning "run unchecked"

      Heck, you could use those electric heat sinks that behave as electrically-powered heat pumps. Surround a ten-pound cast-iron(or other dense thermal conductor) ball with it, run a water-based transport (like water cooling) mesh over the person and around the thermal ball. Apply power one way to absorb height. Apply power the other way to release it.

      The larger

      --
      What's this Submit thingy do?
    9. Re:Still More Limitations by budgenator · · Score: 2

      Radiated heat is infrared, isn't it?
      basicaly true but when the millitary say infrared, they are talking about blackbody radiation in the 1000 -500 K area and slightly cooler, when they say thermal they mean 500 - 200 K (tank exhaust temp down through body temperature) blackbody radiation. Yes that means if the ambiant air temp is 70 degrees you'll look like you are glowing in thermal sights, if the air temp is 99 degrees you are invisible and the air temp is 120 you look dark.

      --
      Apocalypse Cancelled, Sorry, No Ticket Refunds
    10. Re:Still More Limitations by cosyne · · Score: 2

      It also doesn't do much for your heat signiture. Since so much military surveillance is done with IR, you'd think that the extra heat generated by the thing being cloacked and the cloaking mechanism that it'd glow like a light bulb under IR.

      So your concern is that although this thing will take on the appearance of the background in the human visible spectrum (approx 380(blue) to 780(red) nanometers), it will not resemble the background radiation at other wavelengths. Not a trivial problem, but not impossible. As long as the cloaking system has the same sensory capabilites as the entity it's hiding from, it knows what appearance to present.
      Generating more radiation is seldom a problem. Reducing radiation is harder, especially in the longwave IR (heat) section of the spectrum, which seems to be at issue here. Generally, you can block eletromagnetic radiatiton, but the energy goes to heat. If you want to hide a heat signature, you could do it with the appropriate combination of thermally massive shields, active and/or very good thermal control systems, and something to do with the excess heat. You could try to radiate it in another direction, but the beam would probably be visible to a thermal camera. You might be able to store it if you have a thermos full of butt-ass cold. I'd probably use a flask of liquid nitrogen to absorb the heat, and then release a nitrogen stream at ambient temp. (This could in theory be detected as well, but nitrogen is the majority of the atmosphere, so it's probably hard to detect as long as you get the temp right.
      Once you block the heat that you and your cloaking device emit, you can then use you radiation emitters (leds, OLEDs, incandescents, whathaveyou) to emit the right intensities in the right wavelengts as your background. How you get the direction of the light rigth for all obsevrers is beyond me, but that's why it's not my patent. (If you just want to hide from one observer, you basically just get a tv and a camera, hold the tv between you and the observer, and the camera colinear with all three of you (observer, tv, you).)

      ok. now then, for the rest of this discussion. Where to start? How bout polar bears, 'cause they kick azz.
      Polar bears are supposedly (google it yourself) so well insulated that if you use a thermal camera from an airplane, all you see is footprints because the only points where they leak enough heat to differ from ambient temp is the pads of their feet.

      Next: The em spectrum. As i said, humans (most of you, anyways) see from about 380nm to 780nm. Shorter wavelength, higher energy photons are ultraviolet (above violet, hence the sunburn) and so on up to X and gamma rays. Longer wavelength photons are infrared (lower energy, below red) and microwaves and radio and such. Current topic: IR. Near IR (close to visible) is from like 800nm up to around 1100 (depending on who you ask). This is what you tend to get from IRLEDs. Think remote controls, sony camcorder night vision, and other stuff you can see with a black and white camera with no IR filter. (You can't see much further 'cause silicon starts being transparent around 1050nm).
      And then there's far IR, more in the 3000 to 8000 nm range, AKA heat. (to see this look into vidicon tubes or thermistor sensors by hamamatsu or indigo). This is even lower energy than near IR. Its everywhere you look, if you could see it, cause everything radiates in this range according to its temp. The spectrum being continuous (as spetcra generally are), if you take something at body temp it will radiate in this range, and if you heat it up enough it will start radiating in near IR and then red (AKA glowing) and then up to white if you get it hot enough.

      Military night vision. Don't know too much about that, but if it's not heat-based you can basically use really sensitive equipment for detecting ambient light (huge lenses and high-gain CCDs) or use near IR illumination (most of your commerical 'night vision' systems).

      Tree huggers and radiation. It's the high energy radiation from i.e. nuclear plants (isotope decay is a good source of gamma radiation) that a lot of people worry about. Granted, there are those who worry about microwave radiotion from ovens and cordelss phones (and probably 802.11 if you told them it was microwave), but their mistake is not understanding the EM spectrum and thinking that all radiation is dangerous, not just high energy radiation. (and yes, i could be wrong and low energy radiation could be really harmful too. but i'm still not buying any kind of cellphone shield).

      IR going through contrete walls. No. The wall will absorb heat, heat up, and then radiate at a higher energy than the other walls, but the energy is not going through like visible light through glass.

      IR blocking polymers. Mylar.

      Thermoelectric heat transfer. Peltier junctions. about %10 efficient. if you dont mind expending a lot of energy to cool your chip and have a good place to dump the heat, they rock. They dont get read of heat, they just move it, so unless you have somewhere to move it to, they wont hide you from a thermal camera.

      Ok, think that's about it. Hopefully this clears some stuff up.

    11. Re:Still More Limitations by mmol_6453 · · Score: 2

      Not to mention dangerous.

      But, hey, I'm probably not the only one who turns his pillow over three or four times a night because it's cooler on the other side.

      --
      What's this Submit thingy do?
  32. Geez. by Gannoc · · Score: 3, Funny
    Wouldn't it be easier just to drill a hole into the girl's locker room?

    I mean, its not as high tech, but its a lot cheaper.

  33. Re:Prior Art? by BigJimSlade · · Score: 2

    "...not just dreamed it up."

    Isn't that what a patent is, just an idea that has been "dreamed up"? :)

  34. Amazing! by CrosseyedPainless · · Score: 2

    "The idea of an "invisibility cloak" has made the leap from science fiction books to an international patent application.

    <sarcasm>
    That's supposed to be a leap? Somebody hasn't been keeping up with patents lately....
    </sarcasm>

  35. Panthers Modern, anyone? by Ride-My-Rocket · · Score: 2

    Ever since I read William Gibson's "Neuromancer" for the first time, invisibility has always been synonymous with the Panthers Modern's mimetic polycarbon suits. The graphic novel only served to burn this image into my mind even more by giving form to how it would look / work / be used.

    Too cool. They should hand these out to Delta Force and snipers once they've been refined a few times over. Then they'll really be something to be afraid of -- living, heavily armed ghosts.

  36. Nope by DahGhostfacedFiddlah · · Score: 2, Insightful

    The Mona Lisa blocks light on the wall behind it. You'd see a black patch on the wall, because there'd be no light. To get this to work, you'd have to mimic light going in both directions, so that the lights in the room would "pass through" the cloak and hit the wall behind it, then bounce off and "pass through" the cloak again.

    1. Re:Nope by sallen · · Score: 3, Informative
      The Mona Lisa blocks light on the wall behind it. You'd see a black patch on the wall, because there'd be no light. To get this to work, you'd have to mimic light going in both directions, so that the lights in the room would "pass through" the cloak and hit the wall behind it, then bounce off and "pass through" the cloak again.


      I don't see it being patented, as the thought of an image being, essentially, transfered from what is behind something to in front of an object has been discussed for eon's (or at least years). The process, however, is a lot more difficult than at least mentioned in the small news clip. You're right about blocking light behind it, in relation to the Mona Lisa.
      But I believe there's a third item which comes into play. For us to see something, there are three variables involved. The source (and intensity) of the light, the object itself (and how it reflects the light) and our eyes, upon which the light falls, for us to see the image. The 'image' or the object we all see, varies to a degree based upon there we stand. To 'cloak' simply using the process mentioned cannot overcome the fact that we all observe the object differently if we're each standing in a different place, and that doesn't seem to be taken into consideration. The simpliest part of the viewers position (though there are many), is the part of depth perception. If we're three feet from the wall behind the object, and two feet from the Mona Lisa, then 'cloaking' the Mona Lisa has a 'wall', a portion which is displaced from the real one, 'appear' other than in the same plane as the real wall. Part will look further away then the part of the wall that is closer (the cloaked Mona Lisa), because the light will be generated/reflected from a different distance from the 'real' wall. One MIGHT be able to compensate that difference by altering the output and seemingly making the object, but hues/density, etc, seem elsewhere... exactly where the real wall is located. But that works one person standing in exactly the same spot for which the compensation is calculated. A person 10 degrees offset sees a different perception...I don't see how one compensates for that.

      If the object is an extreme distance where depth perception is essentially nil or in a dim setting there depth is also less acute, then it is more 'believed' by the viewer. Otherwise, as long as one has two eyes, I see a problem.

    2. Re:Nope by Toraz+Chryx · · Score: 2

      Yeah, but given the choice between being 100% visible on the battlefield and having a Predator style camoflauge, I'll go with the Pred tech thankyouvery much :)

  37. And this is a good thing? by Guppy06 · · Score: 2

    I look at this and I can't help but think of the ol' Cloak of Darkness out of Wizards & Warriors.

    Thou hath wasted thy fucking time

    1. Re:And this is a good thing? by Decimal · · Score: 2

      Yeah. Thought the same thing when I saw the title. Now I'll have the sound of Treasure Chest Gems raking up stuck in my head for the rest of the week.

      Blee-dee blee-dee blee-dee blee-dee blee-dee...

      Thanks, Slashdot!

      --

      Remember "Bring 'em on"? *sigh
  38. Patent Office Link by euphline · · Score: 2
    I had troubles getting a good link that works, but... here's the best shot:

    Username: guest Password:guest

    It doesn't have much, but there is a pretty picture!

    -jbn

  39. Hopefully... by l1gunman · · Score: 2, Funny

    ...they'll also discover the cure for "Quicksilver Madness" before this goes operational.

  40. Re:Prior Art? by mbourgon · · Score: 2

    Shadowrun mentions this, in some detail. IIRC, it involves a lattice of fiber that redirects light around you.

    And it doesn't have to be in detail - Heinlein patented the waterbag. Okay, bad example - trivial to implement, tough to invent.

    --
    "Sometimes a woman is a kind of religion, she can save your soul & set you free from all your sins" - Bad Examples
  41. US PTO by euphline · · Score: 2
    Here's a more detailed account from the US PTO.

    -jbn

  42. It's called gambling by yerricde · · Score: 2

    when someone else in the future figures out how to make a bona-fide cloaking device (complete with that awesome Romulan warbird cloaking sound), he'll charge them a licensing fee for their design because he already patented the basic idea.

    In that case, it's called gambling. Patents last 20 years after filing in most jurisdictions because the late Sonny "Treehugger" Bono never managed to touch patents. Thus, Ray Alden is making a bet that a cloaking device will be developed within the next twenty years.

    what if it's only, say, 10% functional? Not at all useful

    Except for a well-done camouflage suit, where a little goes a long way.

    --
    Will I retire or break 10K?
  43. Perfectly symmetrical soldier by clickety6 · · Score: 2

    I wonder how he intends to get round nthe fact that the back of a soldier is nothing like the front of a soldier and the clothing needs to be flexible and will change shape, so you can't just link sensors one to one. Unless the camoflauge outfit is shaped like a rigid barrel, you not only need to know what's behidn you, but you also need to know the exact shape and position of the "cloak". How is that done?

    --
    ----------------------------------- My Other Sig Is Hilarious -----------------------------------
  44. I made one of these. Now I can't find it! by Bubblesculpter · · Score: 2, Funny


    I made one of these before...

    ...Now I can't find it.

    --
    www.Beyond7.com Insane modern art water sculpture.
  45. An effective countermeasure... by CommieLib · · Score: 2

    Would be to flood an area with high intensity light. The re-emitters will be strongly limited in how much light they can throw out, and what you would see would be a moving dark spot (still looking like the ground beneath him) against a light background.

    --
    If your bitterest enemies are people who hack the heads off civilians, then I would say you're doing something right.
  46. Jack London's "The Shadow and the Flash" by dpbsmith · · Score: 5, Interesting

    ...is an amusing century-old story about competitive brothers who devise two different methods of achieving invisibility. It's online here.

    In his fictional story, both methods have problems. The problems are more than fictional, since one of the methods relies on the nonsense supposition that since black is the absence of light, the only reason you can see something that's black is that the black isn't PERFECTLY black, and that if you could achieve perfect blackness you could achieve invisibility.

    However, the method described in the parent article here is equally flawed, since it would work only for an observer placed in a specific view location. One wonders how the equipment is supposed to locate the observer; if there are several observers, how does it decide which of them should be prevented from seeing the object?

    The method bears a close resemblance to Hollywood special effects processes (glass shots, matte shots, etc.) Special effects processes are notorious for having visible edge effects if not done carefully, and I'm sure this would be true of the proposed method as well.

    In "The Shadow and the Flash," one invisibility cloak could be detected by a sensation of darkness and depression whenever the concealed individual was nearby; the other suffered from occasional rainbow flashes due to mismatches in the index of refraction. I'm sure that the proposed method would have similar problems.

  47. smoke and mirrors.. by Suppafly · · Score: 2

    So basically its a very complicated method of using the old smoke and mirrors affect that magicians have employed for years?

  48. Re:Practicality? Comoflage by Peter+Harris · · Score: 2
    One principle of comoflage is that you don't have to be invisible. People just have to not actualy notice your presence.


    So in fact you would be better off being in plain sight, looking like someone/thing normal and harmless.Since that can be done very cheaply and without fancy technology, I think it will remain the preferred method of infiltration.

    Or use both: A delivery guy with a cardboard box and clipboard can walk past while guards surround the guy in the suspicious skin-tight chameleon suit.
    --

    -- What do you need?
    -- Gnus. Lots of Gnus.
  49. Can they fire phasers while cloaked? by goatwarrior · · Score: 2, Funny

    We won't be ahead of the Klingons until we can fire phasers while cloaked.

  50. Re:It's only a patent??? by Tenebrious1 · · Score: 3, Insightful

    Only a patent

    Haven't you been reading any other articles lately? Only a patent? You mean like Amazon's "one click" patent? Like BT's patent of hyperlinks? Compuserve GIFS? A laser pointer as an exercise device for a cat? The patent on a swing?

    No, it's not a new idea. The military has been playing with it for years. Deep sea fish do it naturally with bioluminesence. If they get a working model, then ok, give them a patent. But I'd hate to see another ridiculous patent granted on an idea that's been around for decades.

    --
    -- If god wanted me to have a sig, he'd have given me a sense of humor.
  51. Non-military applications... by Hallow · · Score: 3, Interesting

    How about a house with sensors on the outside walls, and the projectors on the inside?

    It would be like being outside, except the outside couldn't see or get in. And I'm sure it probably wouldn't transmit uva/uvb, so no sunburn. Imagine, no more sky windows. The ceiling could be the sky, complete with clouds. (Of course you could control the briteness, turn it off/on, etc.)

    This could even replace windows in buildings you'd want more secured or where glass is a structural liability.

    1. Re:Non-military applications... by Rogerborg · · Score: 2
      • How about a house with sensors on the outside walls, and the projectors on the inside?

      Whoa there, let's not give Herr Ashcroft ideas. Imagine the sensors on the inside and the projectors on the outside. After all, only the guilty have something to hide, right?

      --
      If you were blocking sigs, you wouldn't have to read this.
  52. Worthy of a patent? by Andy+Smith · · Score: 2

    I remember talking about invisibility with friends after seeing the original Predator film.

    The concept of light readers on one side of an object and light emitters on the other was an idea that was quickly proposed (by me) and then rejected (by me and others) because (a) it's too much of a "brute force" technique and not particularly scientific, (b) the required resolution to be 100% effective would be so high as to make it practically impossible, (c) it wouldn't stand up to any reasonable human scrutiny, never mind computer analysis, and (d) it would only work with fixed-shape objects, not people or animals, because any change in shape of the enshrouded object would produce distortion in the 'invisibility'. (Presumably this was the logic behind the shimmering effect of the alien in Predator?)

    So I hope this patent application isn't successful unless it is *solely* for the implementation, not the idea. If they're trying to patent the idea then I want to claim prior art by at least ten years, even if we didn't get past the discussion stage.

    And if I ever try to patent the idea then I expect Jim and John Thomas to take their turn at claiming prior art, and they should win. And I'm sure there were others before them.

  53. Re:It's only a patent by Lussarn · · Score: 2

    The hardest problem to solve is that one pixel would not have the same color depening on where you stand watching it.

  54. when I was 6 years old... by reverse+flow+reactor · · Score: 2

    when I was 6 years old, I thought that could be done by adding a bunch of mirrors to redirect light around the person wearing the cloak. Kind of like a lot of periscopes or fibre optics. There are lots of problems with this idea, namely the bulkiness of the mirrors and such, but I was 6 when I thought of it.

    I guess this is my declaration of my idea. Fee free to reference this as prior art when someone tries to patent an invisibility cloack through the use of mirrors.

    If someone can patent something that I thought of when I was 6, then either (a) something is wrong with the patent office, or (b) I should be filing a lot more patents.

    --

    The significant problems we face cannot be solved by the same level of thinking that created them. -Einstein

  55. Wow. They've re-invented the digital camera. by bons · · Score: 2

    Photo reception on one end. Light emission on the other.

    Was this not obvious to anyone a decade ago?

  56. I much rather have... by GutterBunny · · Score: 3, Funny

    ...a productivity cloak.

    Imagine it. You're having a lousy day at the office. Got nothing done, but read email. Your boss comes storming in asking for a report that's 2 months overdue. You simply throw on your productivity cloak and (walla!) your screen shows a nearly completed report, while you appear confident it'll be done soon.

    --
    managers...why god invented purgatory
  57. mimic powerful light sources nigh-impossible by fudgefactor7 · · Score: 2, Interesting

    The article explains that the photoreceptors and emitter array would copy what's behind the wielder and blast it forward. Great, but what if the object behind you is super luminous or moving very rapidly. I doubt the photoemitters could keep up with, say, the sun. Heck, they might not even be able to render Quake 3 at a decent frame rate. Not to mention the power requirements...(read any of the the "wheelbarrel" comments made by others.) Also, this idea has been thought up before. Prior Art being a concern, I (personally) would reject his patent claim.

  58. Nothing new :) by MrIcee · · Score: 2
    Finally, someone did one of these. Great. I had this idea many many many years ago - though slightly different.

    In my version fiber optic was carefully woven so that each strands start point was directly opposite it's exit point on all sides of the object.

    The device they've generated uses a similar approach but probably works much better because instead of using a passive fiber optic system, it replicates the light. Probably much easier to build and walk in - though undoubtly hotter and power hungry.

    If you think about what something like this would look like... it would resemble the alien from the movie Predator. Why? Because of refraction issues. Specifically - in the fabric you will be bringing the light that is behind you, to in front of you, while the light that is flowing around you will pass through more air. The result will be that the refractive index of the reproduced light will be missing about 5 inches of air, thus it will shimmer slightly like a heat wave.

    I actually came up with 3 methods of invisibility... here they are:

    1) Fiber optic suit, just described.

    2) This one is great for holloween... get a tiny tiny color digital camera on a chip, a jean jacket, and a tiny LCD color TV. Put a hole through the back of the jean jacket and mount the camera inside so that it sees out the back of your jacket. Mount the LCD panel on the front of the jacket, preferable behind a similar sized hole you cut in the material so that it hides all but the LCD screen itself... turn it on, and it should look like you have a Terminator 2 style bullet hole going right through your body.

    3) Drugs :) In the 60's thorough 80's wonderful experiments were done to determine how the eye sees. Our eyes see by constantly twiching very very quickly. The twitch causes the cells in our eyes to move in and out of what they are looking at. Cells that are looking at edges with contract will thus cycle in and out of contrast and trigger - so we see the edges. Researches took two approaches... first, they placed a red square on a white card and using photosensors, watched the twich of the eyes and moved the red square in sequence with the twitches. This means that the eye could not see the edges since it kept them in the same position with the twitch... the result? The red square immediatly became invisible (the user only saw white) because of over saturation of the cells and no edge visible. The second method was to induce a drug that caused the rapid movement of the eyes to be suppressed... once administered - as long as the head is still your basically blind. An interesting theory on cats (though I don't believe proven yet) is that they don't have the natural twitch and use this for hunting. Sitting very still, anything that moves is instantly very very visible while the rest is virtually invisible. Additional speculation is that purring is a natural mechanism for producing a twitch in the animal as well.

    Whatever... invisibility is fun ;))

  59. Re:moving "eyes" can pick it up? by happyclam · · Score: 3, Funny
    Reminds me of Predator, and the way that it shimmered when it moved. My guess is that they used the same thought when they made that movie.

    More likely, they were just thinking that a truly invisible creature didn't make for very scary film footage.

    --
    He looked at me and said, "Kid, we don't like your kind, and we're gonna send your fingerprints off to Washington."
  60. Tall guy sitting in front of you..... by 3seas · · Score: 5, Funny

    Now that they have solved the tall guy sitting in front of you in the movie theater .... Now they just need to solve the jerk sitting behind you kicking your seat.

  61. old technology... by LuxFX · · Score: 2, Interesting

    I've already got one of those on my digital camera.

    It's neat, when I turn on the screen on the back, it's like the middle of the camera is invisible and I can see right through it!

    --
    Punctanym: alternate spelling of words using punctuation or numerals in place of some or all of its letters; see 'leet'
  62. However exactly this thing WAS described ... by Ungrounded+Lightning · · Score: 3, Interesting

    In his fictional story, both methods have problems. The problems are more than fictional, since one of the methods relies on the nonsense supposition that since black is the absence of light, the only reason you can see something that's black is that the black isn't PERFECTLY black, and that if you could achieve perfect blackness you could achieve invisibility.

    And the other process was to make the subject transparent. Would work if possible but also impractical.

    But a "cloak" that either records the view on one side, small patch by small patch, and reconstructs it on the other side ditto, or actually pipes the light around and re-emits it, has been used repeatedly in science fiction since the Golden Age of Campbell's editorship of Astounding/Analog magazine.

    I THINK some of 'em even got the need for networking each "camera" to multiple "displays", to account for the virtual passage of light through the thickness of the cloaked space, though I don't recall any of 'em explicitly mentioning the need for the network connectivity to be dynamic, to account for a flexing body.

    (I'd dig through my collection to find a few samples but it would take a while. If you want to dig through yours, start with Randall Garret.)

    Now if somebody has come up with a particular WAY to pipe the light or its signal around that's worthy of a patent. But if they've just patented the idea of mimicing a transparency (light emission) or do what an octopus does (variable absorbtive color cells to mimic the surface behind), it's been described repeatedly.

    An aside: One of the funnier throwaways in a fantasy novel (Too Many Magicians?) was the presentation at a magician's conference of a spell for making EVERYTHING BUT THE EYES invisible. The disadvantage of the previous spells was that they made the subject blind, because the light didn't interact with his eyes. It is easier to hide a floating pair of eyes than a whole body, and easier to be unnoticed if you aren't constantly bumping into things. B-)

    --
    Bantam Dominique roosters crow a four-note song. Once you've heard it as "Happy BIRTHday" you can't NOT hear it that way
  63. Easily defeated... by DevNova · · Score: 2, Funny

    As soon as someone wearing this walks in front of a painting or billboard or magazine rack...BAM!...you get them on copyright infrigement. No hope for you.

  64. Re:Completely agree by Kintanon · · Score: 2

    The idea I came up with a kid involved one way only invisibility using about 40 million of those little fiberoptic tubes you can get, and bending then around your body so that one end pointed behind you, and the other pointed in front of you. So people would just look right through you. It didn't work as a 'I'm walking through this crowd of people and they can't see me' invisibility, but it seemed like it would work great if you didn't move much (A sniper or something).

    Kintanon

    --
    Check out JoshJitsu.info for Brazilian Ji
  65. Heat, heat, heat by edremy · · Score: 2
    So do IR detection. Dumping heat has always been a big problem on spaceships (hint: space is a vacuum) If you're doing ship/ship combat you've probably got big engines, lots of computers, redundant life support and other energy generating/consuming devices. Your spectrum is going to be totally unlike a star, so even if you're end on and basically a point to the sight on the other ship, you won't be hard to find. (Hey look- what's this blackbody source without iron lines?)

    In my days as a tanker, I basically stopped using optical sights altogether. Thermal imaging is so much better it's scary- you really can see in the dark, through camo, etc. Even in fog/rain it's still better than optical.

    --
    "Seven Deadly Sins? I thought it was a to-do list!"
    1. Re:Heat, heat, heat by HiThere · · Score: 2

      That's one reason you design the ship like a needle. This lets you radiate heat from the sides instead of directly toward the object of interest. Perhaps you could use heat pumps to concentrate the heat in places where it's emission would be blocked (in the direction of interest) by some other part of the ship.

      O, yes, if we're going to get modern, then the ship should be built out of plastics and ceramics over most of it's shell, and only have metals in the places designed to be "safe" for the emission of heat. (But when the books were written, that wasn't an option.)

      --

      I think we've pushed this "anyone can grow up to be president" thing too far.
    2. Re:Heat, heat, heat by Moonshadow · · Score: 2

      How will that work in a vaccuum? If there's no medium for the heat to travel through, will it still show up?

      I'm relatively ignorant of the principles behind thermal imaging, but it seems that a lot of detection techniques used in an atmosphere would be useless in space, where there is no meduim for various energies to travel through.

    3. Re:Heat, heat, heat by susano_otter · · Score: 2
      Thermal imaging relies on emissions in the Infrared band, which is a subset of the Electromagnetic Spectrum. I'm pretty sure that nothing in the EM spectrum requires a medium for propagation. After all, visible light, UV rays, X-rays, and radio waves all travel through space just fine, don't they?

      Remind me again how you thought we were communicating with the various interplanetary probes we've sent out of our atmosphere.

      --

      Any sufficiently well-organized community is indistinguishable from Government.

  66. MHO and a related anime quote by MoneyT · · Score: 2

    Aren't you all so lucky, no only do you get to hear my opinion (as if you cared) bu tI get to pull out a related anime quote for extra karma points. Anyways...

    While it may not be perfect now, the idea and (if it exists) the current prototype are enough to generate interest and development. To use a computer related example, when Xerox developed the GUI at PARC, it was far from perfect. If the type of cynicism with which we look at things today existed then, the GUI might never have been developed any further. But someone (notably some Apple employees) saw potential and said that it could be developed and improved. And they were right.

    Now for my anime quote - from Ghost in the Shell:
    "If man realizes technology is within reach he achives it, like it's damn near instictive."

    --
    T Money
    World Domination with a plastic spoon since 1984
  67. umm...space blanket? by D-Fly · · Score: 2

    yup, a simple space blanket (you know, the little silver colored emergency blankets) makes a great thermal cloak.

    1 Stops almost all radiated heat.
    2 Obviously there is no convection if you are wrapped in a blanket.
    3 And conduction isnt much of a factor for thermo-imaging.

    --
    \
  68. had a similar idea by shd99004 · · Score: 2

    Had a similar idea, believe it or not. I was thinking about this kind of thing when to cloak aeroplanes... just never knew how it should work. Hopefully someone figured it out now.

    --
    Will work for bandwidth
  69. As predicted on /.! by RobertFisher · · Score: 2

    Interestingly enough, I predicted essentially this same technique during an earlier discussion on the nanotechnology nanotechnology defense initiative at MIT.

    A key example of how life imitates /. ;-)

    Bob

    --
    Science, like Nature, must also be tamed, with a view turned towards its preservation.
  70. Re:Holograms by tunesmith · · Score: 2

    An invisible hologram? How pointless is that?

    --
    skkkoooonnnggggkkk ptui
  71. I had one of those in school.. by Havokmon · · Score: 2
    Ok, so it was really a big plaid towel.. But when worn around the neck (quite like a cape), I was able to duck into a garage, squat among 'stuff', and throw the 'cape' over my head.

    I completely foiled my pursuer. (Who obviously was an idiot, but I digress.)

    --
    "I can't give you a brain, so I'll give you a diploma" - The Great Oz (blatently stolen sig)
  72. Can't imaging this working very well... by El · · Score: 2

    To be truly effective, wouldn't all the emitters have to be pointed directly at the observer, and all the detectors pointed exactly in the opposite direction? I don't think "cloak" is the right word for this; it obviously needs to be fixed, not flexible. Also, isn't there a lot of "prior art" on this in old SciFi stories?

    --

    "Freedom means freedom for everybody" -- Dick Cheney

  73. Re:Practicality? Comoflage by susano_otter · · Score: 2

    FWIW, The Bourne Identity (the book, not the movie), was 90% about exactly this kind of social engineering. The rest was mostly love story, mixed with occasional gunplay.

    --

    Any sufficiently well-organized community is indistinguishable from Government.

  74. mimicing light trajectory by cosyne · · Score: 2

    from the article
    The light emitters on the front surface then generate light beams that exactly mimic the same measured intensity, color and trajectory.

    So, the difference between this and what most people here seem to be talking about is that the light beams would come out in the right direction, meaning that you don't have to look at it straight on. You still might have perspective problems if you get close, but those will fade with distance.
    Now, if he can develop technology to detect, process, and appropriately reconstruct all the rays which would pass through an object were it invisible (basically a badass image based rendering system and really really bad ass display) then he probably deserves a pattent.

    A point on detection technology, though: if this is designed to hide from humans, it will only produce output colors from mixes of red, green, and blue. If you make a camera which sees in more colors (prev discussion on IR), it could detect the cloak. The cloak's emitters must be as advanced as the sensors it wants to avoid.

  75. No one mentioned obvious usage like... by aralin · · Score: 2
    • See through houses
    • Invisible protective wall above trenches
    • Front panels covering heavy machinery
    • Protection of historical centers of old cities from new age architecture uglyness.
    --
    If programs would be read like poetry, most programmers would be Vogons.
  76. Re:Practicality? Comoflage by shyster · · Score: 2
    So in fact you would be better off being in plain sight, looking like someone/thing normal and harmless.Since that can be done very cheaply and without fancy technology, I think it will remain the preferred method of infiltration.

    Unfortunately, tanks and B2 bombers really have trouble looking like "something normal and harmless". For that matter, so do platoons of soldiers with M-16s.

  77. Re:Practicality? Comoflage by Peter+Harris · · Score: 2
    Unfortunately, tanks and B2 bombers really have trouble looking like "something normal and harmless". For that matter, so do platoons of soldiers with M-16s


    Unfortunately for whom? What you say is right, but I was only discussing infiltration.

    Anyway, tanks and bombers are last century's way of getting what you want. Some dickheads haven't realised that yet *cough*dubya*cough*.

    --

    -- What do you need?
    -- Gnus. Lots of Gnus.